PDA

View Full Version : LeBron James: 20,000 points, 5,000 assists: Youngest in history



NBA_Starter
01-17-2013, 03:53 AM
LeBron James has passed 20,000 points. James becomes the youngest player in history to cross this mark.

Also, he passed the 5,000 assists mark.

James currently has the second-highest PER of any other player to cross this mark, behind only #1 Michael Jordan. He's behind him by .6 points. He has the second-highest points career average of any player that has crossed this mark (behind #1 Michael Jordan again), and the second-highest assist average of any player behind Oscar Robertson. (He has the sixth-highest rebound average.)

Three MVPs, one Finals MVP, two Olympic gold medals, one scoring title, three conference championships, 20,000 points, 5,000 assists, 5,000 rebounds, 1,000 steals, 500 blocks. Best defender in the NBA on any given night. He is behind only Michael Jordan in consistent productivity.

AND he's only just turned 28 years old. He's just entering his true prime.

tredigs
01-17-2013, 04:04 AM
One of the GOAT's to be sure.

*Superman*
01-17-2013, 04:04 AM
Call him Steve-O.

Hellcrooner
01-17-2013, 04:06 AM
should end in the top 5-10 players just behind the oldies and over any player 90s on.

JJ_JKidd
01-17-2013, 04:06 AM
LeBron James has passed 20,000 points. James becomes the youngest player in history to cross this mark.

Also, he passed the 5,000 assists mark.

James currently has the second-highest PER of any other player to cross this mark, behind only #1 Michael Jordan. He's behind him by .6 points. He has the second-highest points career average of any player that has crossed this mark (behind #1 Michael Jordan again), and the second-highest assist average of any player behind Oscar Robertson. (He has the sixth-highest rebound average.)

Three MVPs, one Finals MVP, two Olympic gold medals, one scoring title, three conference championships, 20,000 points, 5,000 assists, 5,000 rebounds, 1,000 steals, 500 blocks. Best defender in the NBA on any given night. He is behind only Michael Jordan in consistent productivity.

AND he's only just turned 28 years old. He's just entering his true prime.

Congratulations! Remarkable feat!

UPRock
01-17-2013, 04:27 AM
Best in the NBA.

metsfan99999
01-17-2013, 04:40 AM
Lebron is absolutely absurd. The assists totals impress me as much as the points. He is 32 assists away from passing Walt Frazier, a top 10 all time point guard, on the all time assists list and Frazier played 100 more games than Lebron has so far in his career.

LakersIn5
01-17-2013, 05:07 AM
after its all said and done

top 5
mj
kaj
lebron
magic
wilt

naps
01-17-2013, 05:24 AM
Gunning for that #2 spot for sure! We are witnessing one of the finest performers in sports history. I am one lucky dude having to watch both Jordan and LeBron in their primes. 95% here can't say that :D

numba1CHANGsta
01-17-2013, 05:28 AM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

HowFit
01-17-2013, 05:40 AM
Congrats Lebron...

LakersIn5
01-17-2013, 05:41 AM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

im a kobe fan but an objective fan too. had lebron had someone as good as a prime shaq in cleveland he would have never left and when kobe got surrounded with crap he demanded a trade but the FO got him gasol to make the lakers a contender again but you cant say that to lebron, his best teamate in cleveland was ilgauskas. plus cleveland compared to l.a and chicago is just not fair.

Borough
01-17-2013, 05:46 AM
i really have to start watching some Heat games, this guy is a monster

JPS
01-17-2013, 07:17 AM
Awesome accomplishment is he the youngest ever and not the quickest to get to this point or both? Due to him entering the league so young and all.

fin_frenzy_84
01-17-2013, 08:03 AM
after its all said and done

top 5
mj
White Mamba
kaj
lebron
magic


Fixed

kntresistheheat
01-17-2013, 08:50 AM
I'm sorry, but MJ had pippen, and a great supporting cast. After that he got another HOF rebounding machine RODMAN. Don't tell me he never had superstars on his team. I lived in Chicago for 13 years and watched all of the Bulls game since 87. Don't get me started with Kobe, he had prime shaq, horry, ect.... Oh wait! A few other supstars joined them Malone and Payton but never won. Now, not taking anything away from them because those 2 guys in my mind are the 2 best players with lebron creeping right up.

Swashcuff
01-17-2013, 09:12 AM
I'm sorry, but MJ had pippen, and a great supporting cast. After that he got another HOF rebounding machine RODMAN. Don't tell me he never had superstars on his team. I lived in Chicago for 13 years and watched all of the Bulls game since 87. Don't get me started with Kobe, he had prime shaq, horry, ect.... Oh wait! A few other supstars joined them Malone and Payton but never won. Now, not taking anything away from them because those 2 guys in my mind are the 2 best players with lebron creeping right up.

Are you sure you're in the right thread because no one is telling you that.

LeBron is going to continue being the youngest ever to more than a fair share of accolades and it may stay that way for as long asany of us watch the game of basketball (with the age restrictions now).

bucketss
01-17-2013, 09:24 AM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

i don't know what him leaving has to do with anything i mean if he started his career in kobes situation hed be even better now. but seriously hes not better than those guys because those guys have more on their resumes plain and simple 11 championships between them lebron has catching up to do. 99% sure he will never surpass jordan i think thats obvious though.

koreancabbage
01-17-2013, 09:36 AM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

Kobe got traded to LAL.

Noone is saying he is the GOAT. (not yet anyways) jumping the gun there a bit early LOL. I think we're all in consensus he is top 10 worthy when it's all said and done.

ManRam
01-17-2013, 09:37 AM
:clap:

It's a joy watching him.

I wasted too much of my time rooting against other superstars, and started the LeBron era hating him too. I'm glad I got over this, because I think he is unlike anything the game has ever seen...and to be robbed of enjoying that because I hate his greatness would be awful.

kntresistheheat
01-17-2013, 10:01 AM
Are you sure you're in the right thread because no one is telling you that.

LeBron is going to continue being the youngest ever to more than a fair share of accolades and it may stay that way for as long asany of us watch the game of basketball (with the age restrictions now).




Originally Posted by numba1CHANGsta
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever


Sorry, I thought I quoted him. :)

JasonJohnHorn
01-17-2013, 10:15 AM
after its all said and done

top 5
Stockton
kaj
lebron
magic
wilt

I fixed that for you ;-)

benzni
01-17-2013, 10:29 AM
incredible

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 10:41 AM
I fixed that for you ;-)

Yeah Stockton a guy who couldn't even finish in the top 5 in MVP voting while his teammate won 2 MVP's and yet he is supposed to be top 5 all time? Great real dude.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 10:41 AM
I'm sorry, but MJ had pippen, and a great supporting cast. After that he got another HOF rebounding machine RODMAN. Don't tell me he never had superstars on his team. I lived in Chicago for 13 years and watched all of the Bulls game since 87. Don't get me started with Kobe, he had prime shaq, horry, ect.... Oh wait! A few other supstars joined them Malone and Payton but never won. Now, not taking anything away from them because those 2 guys in my mind are the 2 best players with lebron creeping right up.

If you are going to say Rodman was a hall of famer when he came to Chicago at 35 and was 37 on the Bulls last title, then you gotta say the same for Ben Wallace in Cleveland who was 33 and Shaq who was 37 and the allstar game mvp the season before.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 10:43 AM
Anyway great accomplishment for Lebron. I wonder if he can get into the 30/10/10 club as well.

bucketss
01-17-2013, 10:49 AM
Yeah Stockton a guy who couldn't even finish in the top 5 in MVP voting while his teammate won 2 MVP's and yet he is supposed to be top 5 all time? Great real dude.

lmao.

ManRam
01-17-2013, 10:53 AM
Yeah Stockton a guy who couldn't even finish in the top 5 in MVP voting while his teammate won 2 MVP's and yet he is supposed to be top 5 all time? Great real dude.

Clearly sarcasm flies right over your head sometimes...

And JB, Rodman actually was playing well at that age...Ben Wallace and Shaq were about replacement level players. Shaq was almost a liability in the playoffs, hardly getting 20 minutes a game and getting benched during crucial moments. Ben Wallace was halfway decent, but again, he hardly played in the playoffs.

Rodman was logging 30+ minutes a game in the playoffs and producing at a much higher level.

So no, we don't "gotta" say the same for those two...they simply weren't as impacting of players.

It's foolish and careless to assume that players of the same age produce equally.

Rodman lead the LEAGUE reounding the three years he was in Chicago. He posted some amazing defensive stats as well (ranked very high in defensive rating). Shaq and Wallace hardly played 20-24 minutes a game and hardly ever did much.

Also, are you insinuating that Ben Wallace is a Hall of Famer? Because I'm not sure about that...

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 10:57 AM
Clearly sarcasm flies right over your head sometimes...

And JB, Rodman actually was playing well at that age...Ben Wallace and Shaq were about replacement level players. Shaq was almost a liability in the playoffs, hardly getting 20 minutes a game and getting benched during crucial moments. Ben Wallace was halfway decent, but again, he hardly played in the playoffs.

Rodman was logging 30+ minutes a game in the playoffs and producing at a much higher level.

So no, we don't "gotta" say the same for those two...they simply weren't as impacting of players.

It's foolish and careless to assume that players of the same age produce equally.

Rodman lead the LEAGUE reounding the three years he was in Chicago. He posted some amazing defensive stats as well (ranked very high in defensive rating). Shaq and Wallace hardly played 20-24 minutes a game and hardly ever did much.

Also, are you insinuating that Ben Wallace is a Hall of Famer? Because I'm not sure about that...

You missed the point. He said MJ got a Hall of Fame Rebounder in Rodman, that is the same thing that Lebron got in Ben Wallace. Also it was not like Shaq was bad, he was the allstar game mvp winner the season before and in the pivotal game 5 was the best player on the Cavs. But let's not get into this again.

ManRam
01-17-2013, 11:04 AM
You missed the point. He said MJ got a Hall of Fame Rebounder in Rodman, that is the same thing that Lebron got in Ben Wallace. Also it was not like Shaq was bad, he was the allstar game mvp winner the season before and in the pivotal game 5 was the best player on the Cavs. But let's not get into this again.

But for you to act like those players had equal impacts IS wrong. And that's what you do.

We can bicker about semantics, and how LeBron did have another "Hall of Famer" on his team...but that's not the point. That is just semantics. The reality is Rodman was infinitely more valuable and infinitely better at that junction of his career than Shaq and especially Wallace.

king4day
01-17-2013, 11:10 AM
Awesome accomplishment is he the youngest ever and not the quickest to get to this point or both? Due to him entering the league so young and all.

This is what I was thinking.
Just goes to show how special MJ really was.

ManRam
01-17-2013, 11:19 AM
Awesome accomplishment is he the youngest ever and not the quickest to get to this point or both? Due to him entering the league so young and all.

MJ got there in fewer games and seasons. Not sure how many, but he got there in his 9th season, and in probably just over 600 games. This is LeBron's 10th season and he's played in 726 games.

LeBron has gotten to 5,000 assists WAY faster than MJ though. MJ only finished with 5,633 career assists for his entire career.

HowFit
01-17-2013, 11:21 AM
i really have to start watching some Heat games, this guy is a monster

Same here...

smiddy012
01-17-2013, 11:22 AM
I'm sorry, but MJ had pippen, and a great supporting cast. After that he got another HOF rebounding machine RODMAN. Don't tell me he never had superstars on his team. I lived in Chicago for 13 years and watched all of the Bulls game since 87. Don't get me started with Kobe, he had prime shaq, horry, ect.... Oh wait! A few other supstars joined them Malone and Payton but never won. Now, not taking anything away from them because those 2 guys in my mind are the 2 best players with lebron creeping right up.

Rodman was never a superstar. And it took a few years for MJ to develop Pippen into one (who was never top 5 in the league). It's not like he left the Bulls to join Magic or Bird. Just saying, you're comparing apples and oranges.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 11:22 AM
But for you to act like those players had equal impacts IS wrong. And that's what you do.

We can bicker about semantics, and how LeBron did have another "Hall of Famer" on his team...but that's not the point. That is just semantics. The reality is Rodman was infinitely more valuable and infinitely better at that junction of his career than Shaq and especially Wallace.

They did.

Rodman had a 13.6, 13.9 and 12.4 PER on the Bulls as well as a .143, .148 and .131 WS/48

Ben Wallace had a 12.4, 12.2 and .138 WS/48 on the Cavs.

Rodman was 35-37 while Wallace was 33, 34 on the Cavs

ManRam
01-17-2013, 11:24 AM
They did.

Rodman had a 13.6, 13.9 and 12.4 PER on the Bulls as well as a .143, .148 and .131 WS/48

Ben Wallace had a 12.4, 12.2 and .138 WS/48 on the Cavs.

Rodman was 35-37 while Wallace was 33, 34 on the Cavs

Rodman also played heavy minutes, those other two did not.

Rodman also defended at a way higher level than those other two. Rodman was also the league's leading rebounder.

You honestly think Shaq and Wallace, in their Cleveland days, were as impacting as Rodman was during his Bulls days?

heyman321
01-17-2013, 11:31 AM
You missed the point. He said MJ got a Hall of Fame Rebounder in Rodman, that is the same thing that Lebron got in Ben Wallace. Also it was not like Shaq was bad, he was the allstar game mvp winner the season before and in the pivotal game 5 was the best player on the Cavs. But let's not get into this again.

Hahahaha. LOL. hahahahahhaha. HAHAHAHAHHAHA. OH MY GOD. Dude you should be a comedian full time, you make the best jokes.

HowFit
01-17-2013, 11:35 AM
MJ got there in fewer games and seasons. Not sure how many, but he got there in his 9th season, and in probably just over 600 games. This is LeBron's 10th season and he's played in 726 games.

LeBron has gotten to 5,000 assists WAY faster than MJ though. MJ only finished with 5,633 career assists for his entire career.

Yep...

nickdymez
01-17-2013, 11:39 AM
Congrats to Lebron! Will NEVER be the GOAT, and he will NEVER pass MJ. but an all time great indeed..

HouRealCoach
01-17-2013, 11:45 AM
Me personally don't think Jordan had the best supporting casts either. I also don't think any of those Cleveland teams (with Mike Brown coaching) were championship teams and they would have been lottery without LeBron.

LeBron is gunning for that #2 spot, because he will NOT catch Jordan.

ManRam
01-17-2013, 11:48 AM
Me personally don't think Jordan had the best supporting casts either. I also don't think any of those Cleveland teams (with Mike Brown coaching) were championship teams and they would have been lottery without LeBron.

LeBron is gunning for that #2 spot, because he will NOT catch Jordan.

Oh, I definitely agree with all of this. MJ's casts weren't all-time greats, but they were obviously great. LeBron's casts were full of players who did their part and played great defense, but he only played with a 20+ PER player twice in his career in Cleveland. They weren't championship caliber, but he almost made them look like that...something I don't think anyone else in the league at the time could have. To suggest they were equals is bit foolish, but whatever. That's history. LeBron can write his legacy based on what's in front of him.

I can't see how he tops Jordan in most people's eyes though. He might ultimately get close, but MJ is on an untouchable pedestal, and mostly deservedly so. LeBron probably won't pass Kobe in most people's eyes either, unless he wins a ton more rings.

nickdymez
01-17-2013, 11:59 AM
Oh, I definitely agree with all of this. MJ's casts weren't all-time greats, but they were obviously great. LeBron's casts were full of players who did their part and played great defense, but he only played with a 20+ PER player twice in his career in Cleveland. They weren't championship caliber, but he almost made them look like that...something I don't think anyone else in the league at the time could have. To suggest they were equals is bit foolish, but whatever. That's history. LeBron can write his legacy based on what's in front of him.

I can't see how he tops Jordan in most people's eyes though. He might ultimately get close, but MJ is on an untouchable pedestal, and mostly deservedly so. LeBron probably won't pass Kobe in most people's eyes either, unless he wins a ton more rings.

Lebron can pass Kobe if he is on a team that keeps great players (Rose, Howard, Durant, etc) from winning. He has to at least repeat if not 3peat. A couple times. So if he can repeat a couple times then i think he can pass Kobe. Along with the other accolades.

TheIlladelph16
01-17-2013, 12:00 PM
Congrats to the beast Lebron. If some people would just put all the hate aside for a moment, they could step back and just appreciate watching a player of this caliber play on a nightly basis. To me he is the best all-around player I have seen since Jordan retired the first time and that's something people should love watching. He won't ever catch Jordan, but he gunning for that Top 5 all-time spot.

kntresistheheat
01-17-2013, 12:01 PM
Rodman was never a superstar. And it took a few years for MJ to develop Pippen into one (who was never top 5 in the league). It's not like he left the Bulls to join Magic or Bird. Just saying, you're comparing apples and oranges.

WOW! I'm I the only one besides RAM that really seen that bulls team?

HouRealCoach
01-17-2013, 12:04 PM
Oh, I definitely agree with all of this. MJ's casts weren't all-time greats, but they were obviously great. LeBron's casts were full of players who did their part and played great defense, but he only played with a 20+ PER player twice in his career in Cleveland. They weren't championship caliber, but he almost made them look like that...something I don't think anyone else in the league at the time could have. To suggest they were equals is bit foolish, but whatever. That's history. LeBron can write his legacy based on what's in front of him.

I can't see how he tops Jordan in most people's eyes though. He might ultimately get close, but MJ is on an untouchable pedestal, and mostly deservedly so. LeBron probably won't pass Kobe in most people's eyes either, unless he wins a ton more rings.

Yeah Jordan will never be eclipsed by anyone walking earth right now. But LeBron & Kobe will always be a toss up because Kobe has 5 rings but LeBron's individual accomplishments are much more impressive but if LeBron gets 2 or 3 more then I think he will distance himself but I won't count Kobe out of getting his sixth because that could really widen the gap in most minds.

I remember in LeBron's sophmore season towards the end the race was getting tight for that last playoff spot and he told his coach that he would play the full game if needed and indeed that is what he did but he ended up losing a 42-40 tiebreaker to New Jersey. That there let me know he was a force to be reckoned with and would have a huge impact on this league. Since that moment his team has never been lower than a 4th seed and he's been a 1st or 2nd seed in 5 of the last 6 seasons

HouRealCoach
01-17-2013, 12:26 PM
WOW! I'm I the only one besides RAM that really seen that bulls team?

So you think Rodman was a superstar?

I don't agree with JB that Ben Wallace & Shaq were much help for LeBron because at the point in their careers they weren't.

But you gotta think, in the era Jordan came up it was a big man's game. Scoring guards weren't known to win championships. He had no big man to draw doubles and ran through the NBA like no other. 91 through 93, after Jordan & Pippen it was Grant, Cartwright, Paxson, Armstrong, etc. They are not that great. Now the 96-98 squads were better but he set the standard with those by going 72-10, 69-13, etc... His teams were damn good but no where near the best. & he never had superstarS, he had ONE.

Money_23
01-17-2013, 12:27 PM
Lebron will end up 1st or 2nd in the GOAT list when it's all said and done. He will hold alot of milestones and records.

the brave eagle
01-17-2013, 12:48 PM
def very impressive but wasn't the quickest to do so

Jumi
01-17-2013, 01:16 PM
So you think Rodman was a superstar?

I don't agree with JB that Ben Wallace & Shaq were much help for LeBron because at the point in their careers they weren't.

But you gotta think, in the era Jordan came up it was a big man's game. Scoring guards weren't known to win championships. He had no big man to draw doubles and ran through the NBA like no other. 91 through 93, after Jordan & Pippen it was Grant, Cartwright, Paxson, Armstrong, etc. They are not that great. Now the 96-98 squads were better but he set the standard with those by going 72-10, 69-13, etc... His teams were damn good but no where near the best. & he never had superstarS, he had ONE.

Dennis Rodman

1994/95 16.8 rpg
1995/1996 14.9 rpg
1996/1997 16.1 rpg
1997/1998 15.0 rpg

If that's not a star, then tell me what is??? The top guy this year is Howard at 12.6 rpg.

LeperMessiah
01-17-2013, 01:21 PM
Closing the gap for GOAT

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 01:23 PM
Dennis Rodman

1994/95 16.8 rpg
1995/1996 14.9 rpg
1996/1997 16.1 rpg
1997/1998 15.0 rpg

If that's not a star, then tell me what is??? The top guy this year is Howard at 12.6 rpg.
Can't be a star when you don't make the allstar team.

b@llhog24
01-17-2013, 01:28 PM
Can't be a star when you don't make the allstar team.

So Deron Williams was a star in 2010, but not one in 2009? :confused:

Also...


Rodman also played heavy minutes, those other two did not.

Rodman also defended at a way higher level than those other two. Rodman was also the league's leading rebounder.

You honestly think Shaq and Wallace, in their Cleveland days, were as impacting as Rodman was during his Bulls days?

I think you forgot this :)

Sly Guy
01-17-2013, 01:41 PM
Impressive with his age, but I wouldn't put too much faith into his 'career' numbers yet. Players in their prime have those numbers skewed upward as the tail ends of their careers tend to be less productive. Also, James came into the league out of high school, which would allow him to pass these milestones more quickly. I still believe he'll likely be one of the best ever to play, but these 'end of his career' debates should wait until he's a little closer to the end.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 01:46 PM
So Deron Williams was a star in 2010, but not one in 2009? :confused:




Unless you think Troy Murphy was a star in 2009 because he was 2nd in rebounding as well or Marcus Camby in 2010 because he was 2nd.

b@llhog24
01-17-2013, 02:24 PM
Unless you think Troy Murphy was a star in 2009 because he was 2nd in rebounding as well or Marcus Camby in 2010 because he was 2nd.

Stop dodging. You said:


Can't be a star when you don't make the allstar team.

Vinylman
01-17-2013, 02:46 PM
Congrats to Bron Bron

I am actually more impressed with the assist total than the scoring...

mp3
01-17-2013, 02:50 PM
LBJ is greatest because he's the youngest to reach 20k but that stat is misleading. Jordan reached it in 9seasons lbj reached it in 10, kobe did it in 26,152 playing minutes as Lebron did it in 28,882, Wilt did it in 499 games, allen iverson did it in 713, Lebron did it in 726.

Swashcuff
01-17-2013, 02:56 PM
LBJ is greatest because he's the youngest to reach 20k but that stat is misleading. Jordan reached it in 9seasons lbj reached it in 10, kobe did it in 26,152 playing minutes as Lebron did it in 28,882, Wilt did it in 499 games, allen iverson did it in 713, Lebron did it in 726.

Its not misleading. He's the youngest to do it that's all :confused:

ManRam
01-17-2013, 03:05 PM
Stop dodging. You said:

JB is more full of hypocrisy and bending/changing arguments to "prove" his point than anyone I've perhaps ever encountered here. He's a smart guy, but his biases and motives cause him to bend the truth.

mp3
01-17-2013, 03:05 PM
Its not misleading. He's the youngest to do it that's all :confused:

yeah your right

Swashcuff
01-17-2013, 03:14 PM
JB is more full of hypocrisy and bending/changing arguments to "prove" his point than anyone I've perhaps ever encountered here. He's a smart guy, but his biases and motives cause him to bend the truth.

I used to think this but not anymore

Im_in_Mia_bish
01-17-2013, 03:25 PM
so chances of lebron getting to 30000 points, 10000 rebounds, and 10000 assists? (if healthy of course)

davids22
01-17-2013, 03:27 PM
God if JordansBulls brings up the ALL STAR GAME one more time, my sides are going to explode.

ACanadian
01-17-2013, 03:30 PM
I think he will be second best of all-time and the best SF in league history before he retires but won't have enough time to beat MJ's legacy

Marlin234
01-17-2013, 03:39 PM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

Who ever uses this "excuse" has no knowledge of the game. No one wins without help :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Marlin234
01-17-2013, 03:39 PM
Jordan won his first ring at 28?

Marlin234
01-17-2013, 03:40 PM
I think he will be second best of all-time and the best SF in league history before he retires but won't have enough time to beat MJ's legacy

Jordan won his first ring at 28?

Hawkeye15
01-17-2013, 03:43 PM
Kobe and MJ never left their teams to win a title with two other superstars, js :) so you guys relax on him being the goat, top 10 yeah but not the best ever

They didn't need to. Both had front offices that were capable of BRINGING them help....

Hawkeye15
01-17-2013, 03:48 PM
Me personally don't think Jordan had the best supporting casts either. I also don't think any of those Cleveland teams (with Mike Brown coaching) were championship teams and they would have been lottery without LeBron.

LeBron is gunning for that #2 spot, because he will NOT catch Jordan.

They went 55-27 without him the year he left, and were the #2 seed in the east. Not saying Jordan played with as stacked of a team as some other players over time, but to say his team, even without him, wasn't a playoff talented team, is ridiculous.

I would put him catching Jordan at maybe 2-3%. There is no margin for error going forward. So I figure he lands somewhere in the 2-4 spot.

Hawkeye15
01-17-2013, 03:49 PM
WOW! I'm I the only one besides RAM that really seen that bulls team?

grew up watching the Jordan Bulls, since he was drafted

ManRam
01-17-2013, 04:04 PM
WOW! I'm I the only one besides RAM that really seen that bulls team?

I'm really not that old!!!

My dad was a Bulls fan (kinda of a bandwagoner, he's a Magic fan too), and would allow me to stay up late whenever they had playoff games, but I was only 10 in 1998 for example. I have, however, seen every Finals game of his since I've moved to college...and since I actually developed an understanding of the game.

I'm a big Jordan fan...he was my first favorite player (along with Shaq), I just don't hold him to the same pedestal as Jordans/Bulls fans that remain Bulls fans. Every kid my age loved MJ, I was no different...but I'm far from an expert on him.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 04:09 PM
Stop dodging. You said:

How can you be an allstar if you don't make the allstar team? It is one thing if you miss 3/4 of the season or something. Just like you can't be a straight "A" student if you get a "B" in one class.

davids22
01-17-2013, 04:11 PM
How can you be an allstar if you don't make the allstar team? It is one thing if you miss 3/4 of the season or something. Just like you can't be a straight "A" student if you get a "B" in one class.

http://static4.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/3997753+_84a98b08d1f4429ff7258cf468635655.jpg
My sides are in outer space

koreancabbage
01-17-2013, 04:52 PM
LBJ is greatest because he's the youngest to reach 20k but that stat is misleading. Jordan reached it in 9seasons lbj reached it in 10, kobe did it in 26,152 playing minutes as Lebron did it in 28,882, Wilt did it in 499 games, allen iverson did it in 713, Lebron did it in 726.

what is misleading? he's the youngest. he's like 7th in terms of games or something.

rockbottom2010
01-17-2013, 05:33 PM
he could be the first person to accomplish 30000-40000 pts and 100000 assts..........

b@llhog24
01-17-2013, 09:25 PM
How can you be an allstar if you don't make the allstar team? It is one thing if you miss 3/4 of the season or something. Just like you can't be a straight "A" student if you get a "B" in one class.

Except you said "star." In any event, the main point I'm tryin to drive home it that Dwill was a better player in 08 and 09 than he was in 010 and he wasn't an all-star in those years which goes to show that your logic (as always) is incredibly flawed.

JordansBulls
01-17-2013, 10:45 PM
Except you said "star." In any event, the main point I'm tryin to drive home it that Dwill was a better player in 08 and 09 than he was in 010 and he wasn't an all-star in those years which goes to show that your logic (as always) is incredibly flawed.
To be a star you have to make the allstar team.

Money_23
01-17-2013, 11:40 PM
so chances of lebron getting to 30000 points, 10000 rebounds, and 10000 assists? (if healthy of course)

I'd shat (in excitement) in my pants if he manages to do by the time he retires.

b@llhog24
01-18-2013, 12:38 AM
To be a star you have to make the allstar team.

Well seeing as Dwill was better in 08 and 09 than he was in 010 then I guess the word "star" coming from you, has no meaning.

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 12:49 AM
Well seeing as Dwill was better in 08 and 09 than he was in 010 then I guess the word "star" coming from you, has no meaning.

Deron was better in 2010 than he was in 2008 or 2009. He upset prime Melo that year with 2 starters out.

b@llhog24
01-18-2013, 12:57 AM
Deron was better in 2010 than he was in 2008 or 2009

He upset prime Melo that year with 2 starters out.

Let's cut out the middle man, was Deron Williams a "star" in 08 or 09?

Chronz
01-18-2013, 02:04 AM
To be a star you have to make the allstar team.

False.

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 02:17 AM
To be a star you have to make the allstar team.

really dude?

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 02:18 AM
really dude?
To be a straight "A" student you have to have all "A" right?

b@llhog24
01-18-2013, 02:20 AM
To be a straight "A" student you have to have all "A" right?

Not really the best comparison.

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 02:26 AM
To be a straight "A" student you have to have all "A" right?

how is that possibly a comparison to your argument? Players make, and don't make an all star team all the time. In fact, your *** uses Shaq, Z, Wallace, and anyone else's prior career to claim that LeBron had "ALL STAR CALIBER HELP", in years that they didn't sniff any of these awards.

JB, you have turned into the man of agenda. Move on now son.

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 02:28 AM
I was a straight A student in 7th grade. Therefore, when I am getting D's my junior year, I can still claim myself as an "A" student.

#jblogic

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 02:32 AM
how is that possibly a comparison to your argument? Players make, and don't make an all star team all the time. In fact, your *** uses Shaq, Z, Wallace, and anyone else's prior career to claim that LeBron had "ALL STAR CALIBER HELP", in years that they didn't sniff any of these awards.

JB, you have turned into the man of agenda. Move on now son.
Totally different because those guys were already Allstars. Deron was not an allstar until 2010.

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 02:32 AM
I was a straight A student in 7th grade. Therefore, when I am getting D's my junior year, I can still claim myself as an "A" student.

#jblogichow so? I already said to be a straight "A" student you need all "A" did I not?

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 02:35 AM
Totally different because those guys were already Allstars. Deron was not an allstar until 2010.

did the point sail straight over your head? You do realize that when players age, they actually regress, and aren't the players they once were? Rhetorical question.....

The examples you continue to pile drive on us, in regards to LeBron's help, are a joke. You pick players that are a shell of there former selves, with zip context, and attempt to shove it down our throats.

I get it. LeBron is entering the MJ argument. Therefore you must do anything possible to crap on him, as you have done Kobe the last number of years. It's getting old bud.

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 02:35 AM
how so? I already said to be a straight "A" student you need all "A" did I not?

wow

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 02:50 AM
did the point sail straight over your head? You do realize that when players age, they actually regress, and aren't the players they once were? Rhetorical question.....

The examples you continue to pile drive on us, in regards to LeBron's help, are a joke. You pick players that are a shell of there former selves, with zip context, and attempt to shove it down our throats.

I get it. LeBron is entering the MJ argument. Therefore you must do anything possible to crap on him, as you have done Kobe the last number of years. It's getting old bud.

The point flew completely over your head man. Deron had never made an allstar team until 2010. Which means that in 2008 nor 2009 was he a star player. That was the point I was making. Not like he made it prior to it or something.

Alayla
01-18-2013, 08:10 AM
LBJ is greatest because he's the youngest to reach 20k but that stat is misleading. Jordan reached it in 9seasons lbj reached it in 10, kobe did it in 26,152 playing minutes as Lebron did it in 28,882, Wilt did it in 499 games, allen iverson did it in 713, Lebron did it in 726.

Great post Brings context into the situation granted it doesnt change the fact LBJ was the youngest to do it.

Alayla
01-18-2013, 08:11 AM
The point flew completely over your head man. Deron had never made an allstar team until 2010. Which means that in 2008 nor 2009 was he a star player. That was the point I was making. Not like he made it prior to it or something.

............the allstar game is a joke dude was Iverson a star in 2010?

bucketss
01-18-2013, 09:36 AM
The point flew completely over your head man. Deron had never made an allstar team until 2010. Which means that in 2008 nor 2009 was he a star player. That was the point I was making. Not like he made it prior to it or something.

listen man you need to stop passing your opinions off as facts do you have any proof that only people who make allstar teams are "stars"?

MarkieMark48
01-18-2013, 10:43 AM
Anyone trying to compare Jordan's supporting cast of the Bulls era to Lebron's supporting cast, and to say the are even remotely close to being equal is nothing short of delusional.

After Jordan's first retirement the Bulls won 55 and 47 seven games and made the playoffs without him.
He came back and they won 203 games in 3 years(one being the best season ever) that's an average of over 67 wins per year, which is more than Cleveland's best year in the Lebron era. Cleveland won 172 in their best 3 year span.

And to say that Shaq or Ben Wallace's production in their cavalier days was equivalent to Rodman's in his bulls days is laughable.

Swashcuff
01-18-2013, 10:51 AM
JB if Andrew Bynum returns after the ASG averages 28 and 14 and lead Philly to the NBA Finals is he a star?

HouRealCoach
01-18-2013, 12:32 PM
Wow... Another classic JB thread

One day we have to do a "Kobe vs. Joe Johnson vs. MJ vs. Tyreke Evans" JB, DMF, Laker fans, CED will make guys spazz out against each other.. Could even throw LeBron in there lol j/k

Point blank, Shaq & Ben Wallace (especially) were no where near All Stars that year

Im_in_Mia_bish
01-18-2013, 03:31 PM
I'd shat (in excitement) in my pants if he manages to do by the time he retires.

yeah no doubt man. that would be insane.

Chronz
01-18-2013, 03:36 PM
Totally different because those guys were already Allstars. Deron was not an allstar until 2010.

So when Deron was making All-NBA teams (Which for your information is an award SUPERIOR TO BEING NAMED AN ALL-STAR AT THE HALFWAY POINT OF THE REGULAR SEASON), he still wasn't an All-Star because he had yet to obtain the inferior accolade?


What happened to you man? When did you decide to go down this futile road?

Chronz
01-18-2013, 03:38 PM
JB if Andrew Bynum returns after the ASG averages 28 and 14 and lead Philly to the NBA Finals is he a star?

According to his faulty(no surprise here) logic, Bynum could go beast, win Finals MVP and he still wouldn't be an All-Star until the following year when he made it.

Chronz
01-18-2013, 03:39 PM
The point flew completely over your head man. Deron had never made an allstar team until 2010. Which means that in 2008 nor 2009 was he a star player. That was the point I was making. Not like he made it prior to it or something.
So then can you stop saying Pippen wasn't an All-Star in 91 because he made it in 1990 as an inferior player.

JordansBulls
01-18-2013, 04:02 PM
What happened to you man? When did you decide to go down this futile road?

I have my moments. Just seems a great crowd is here now that agree with one another no matter what. I think it all started with Rose getting hated on by everyone and then everyone was praising Lebron on everything and I didn't feel that was correct. Not to mention you had a bunch of people who all of a sudden became life long fans of the Heat all of a sudden, etc.

Cano4prez
01-18-2013, 04:08 PM
wow

:laugh2: I lold

Big Zo
01-18-2013, 04:58 PM
I have my moments. Just seems a great crowd is here now that agree with one another no matter what. I think it all started with Rose getting hated on by everyone and then everyone was praising Lebron on everything and I didn't feel that was correct. Not to mention you had a bunch of people who all of a sudden became life long fans of the Heat all of a sudden, etc.

Your little school girl jealousy is cute. Lol

nickdymez
01-18-2013, 05:02 PM
Your little school girl jealousy is cute. Lol

Heat/Lebron fans seem to gang up on JB for some reason....

Sactown
01-18-2013, 05:03 PM
Heat/Lebron fans seem to gang up on JB for some reason....

Not true, JB post some ridiculous stuff about everything, just most commonly Lebron.

Hawkeye15
01-18-2013, 05:06 PM
Heat/Lebron fans seem to gang up on JB for some reason....

you do realize he does anything possible to discredit Kobe as well when there is any notion of an MJ comparison, right? He used to be a good poster, and then became the irrational protector of Jordan, and now the Bulls.

mrblisterdundee
01-18-2013, 10:38 PM
should end in the top 5-10 players just behind the oldies and over any player 90s on.

It all depends on how many championships he wins. If he can alter his game with age and keep winning championships, he could be the greatest of all time. He's 28, so theoretically, he could catch Michael Jordan by his mid-30s.

nickdymez
01-19-2013, 12:19 AM
you do realize he does anything possible to discredit Kobe as well when there is any notion of an MJ comparison, right? He used to be a good poster, and then became the irrational protector of Jordan, and now the Bulls.

So? Does that mean im supposed to gang up on him too? I dont care what he says about Kobe. lmao. You guys kill me with this Kobe ****...

LAcowBOMBER
01-19-2013, 12:42 AM
I'm sorry, but MJ had pippen, and a great supporting cast. After that he got another HOF rebounding machine RODMAN. Don't tell me he never had superstars on his team. I lived in Chicago for 13 years and watched all of the Bulls game since 87. Don't get me started with Kobe, he had prime shaq, horry, ect.... Oh wait! A few other supstars joined them Malone and Payton but never won. Now, not taking anything away from them because those 2 guys in my mind are the 2 best players with lebron creeping right up.

Lol at you thinking Horry was anything more than a good role player who had a flair for making the big shot. Every player on that team had a few ceratain things they did well and Kobe and Shaq carried them all. Also Malone and Payton were superstars in name alone when they joined that team.

That being said, the level Lebron is playing at right now I think might be the best ever. Let's see if he can maintain and let's see how successful his teams in the future are, but skill-wise, what he is doing now is unreal. He makes the game look so easy.

ps. I really can't stand Lebron and have been a fan of Kobe since he came in the league

Lim
01-19-2013, 04:52 PM
lebron is absolutely amazing. it NEVER gets old watching that guy play. he will end up top 3 all time.

Vampirate
01-19-2013, 05:12 PM
All said and done, Lebron is gonna be one of those Magic, Nash, Dirk, Jordan type players that we'll never see again.

Maybe i'm pushing it with Dirk and Nash, but what those 2 offer is extremely rare.

HouRealCoach
01-19-2013, 06:19 PM
So? Does that mean im supposed to gang up on him too? I dont care what he says about Kobe. lmao. You guys kill me with this Kobe ****...

I'll remember this post next time you, LoveOrHateMe, Amos1er, Illusionz, & el hildago (I think) do exactly what I have bolded

nickdymez
01-19-2013, 07:26 PM
I'll remember this post next time you, LoveOrHateMe, Amos1er, Illusionz, & el hildago (I think) do exactly what I have bolded

Whats he have to do with anything?

Raps18-19 Champ
01-19-2013, 07:54 PM
Leave my best friend Nickdymez alone.

bucketss
01-19-2013, 08:01 PM
So? Does that mean im supposed to gang up on him too? I dont care what he says about Kobe. lmao. You guys kill me with this Kobe ****...

you and amo1ser do gang up andrew32 correct:eyebrow:

bucketss
01-19-2013, 08:02 PM
I'll remember this post next time you, LoveOrHateMe, Amos1er, Illusionz, & el hildago (I think) do exactly what I have bolded

nah el hidalgo is with us in the fight against kobephiles.

raiderfaninTX
01-19-2013, 09:43 PM
You missed the point. He said MJ got a Hall of Fame Rebounder in Rodman, that is the same thing that Lebron got in Ben Wallace. Also it was not like Shaq was bad, he was the allstar game mvp winner the season before and in the pivotal game 5 was the best player on the Cavs. But let's not get into this again.

:laugh2:

that may be the worst logic I have seen in the nba forum.

I am sad it was you that posted it :cry:

ManRam
01-19-2013, 09:49 PM
Haha.

"He was the All-Star Game MVP"

:laugh:

Come on, JB.

Hawkeye15
01-19-2013, 10:17 PM
So? Does that mean im supposed to gang up on him too? I dont care what he says about Kobe. lmao. You guys kill me with this Kobe ****...

no, you pointed out that Heat fans gang up on him, and you are saying this because of your hatred for LeBron. I am telling you, LeBron isn't the only one he lines up on. Your hero too bud. But I suppose you won't call him a kobe hater until it suits you.

HouRealCoach
01-20-2013, 12:26 AM
Whats he have to do with anything?

That's why it has (I think) by it & I know you saw it but like I said, YOU, Amos1er, Illusionz, & LoveOrHateMe do the exact thing you are accusing LeBron/Heat fans of doing...

& last, they are not actually Heat or LeBron fans they are just giving the man his props... I see a guy named SacTown who is a Kings fan, Andrew32 is a Knicks fan, & so am I. so you don't really have to say that.

bucketss
01-20-2013, 12:51 AM
That's why it has (I think) by it & I know you saw it but like I said, YOU, Amos1er, Illusionz, & LoveOrHateMe do the exact thing you are accusing LeBron/Heat fans of doing...

& last, they are not actually Heat or LeBron fans they are just giving the man his props... I see a guy named SacTown who is a Kings fan, Andrew32 is a Knicks fan, & so am I. so you don't really have to say that.

and im a raptors fan lol notice most of us aren't even heat fans but its mostly laker fans who make ******** claims on lebron.. one of them said last time lebron is a terrible shooter,and another one said he was on steroids because of stretch marks on his shoulder smh. they are so paranoid of lebron passing their boy its pathetic.