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View Full Version : Revisiting First-Take Debate: Austin Rivers



Chronz
12-06-2012, 05:04 PM
Ford vs SAS and Loudmouth

http://youtu.be/1S4rJSz8FaA

Did Chad Ford son those guys or should we give Rivers more time?

His stats are absolute dog ****, has anyone ever looked so awful to start his career and still become a journey man? Setting the bar low here

Celticsfan2007
12-06-2012, 05:21 PM
Austin Rivers should have stayed in school atleast another year. He was wildly inconsistent in his freshmen year at Duke.

His body isn't NBA ready. His skills aren't NBA ready. He should be in the D-League.

That being said, I expect alot out of Rivers next season, including potentially earning back his starting spot.

Max.This
12-06-2012, 05:22 PM
He is a tweener guard that doesn't have the passing ability to be a point guard nor the shooting ability of a shooting guard. He's not super athletic, but yet after every game all the superstars walk up to him to give him advice. If it wasn't for his last name he wouldn't even be a topic to discuss .

spreadeagle
12-06-2012, 05:26 PM
Bayless is such a Turd...

heyman321
12-06-2012, 05:27 PM
he's a bust

spreadeagle
12-06-2012, 05:28 PM
you can see in Fords face when Smith is talking he is thinking "god these two are idiots"

Hawkeye15
12-06-2012, 05:29 PM
holy ****, I had heard he was struggling, but looking at his numbers, that is embarrassing. He has played awful

LongIslandIcedZ
12-06-2012, 05:31 PM
Isnt he like 19?

spreadeagle
12-06-2012, 05:35 PM
Isnt he like 19?

even still.... 27 minutes a game 6 points a game, shooting 28 % shooting FT 66%

mike44
12-06-2012, 05:42 PM
Hes too small, not athletic enough and cant shoot well enough to play in the nba at this point. He should be on the bench watching/learning not playing 27 min a game (NO might not have any other options though).

LongIslandIcedZ
12-06-2012, 05:42 PM
even still.... 27 minutes a game 6 points a game, shooting 28 % shooting FT 66%

Oh its bad. Just think its a little too early to call the kid a bust.

*Superman*
12-06-2012, 05:45 PM
He's a cocky *** guy. Thought he was the **** in HS (I mean he kind of was, but still). He went on his facebook and said he was going to get 50pts versus my HS team. Ended up with like 25, but seriously who does that? At every level of play he has fallen of significantly.

But wow his stats are garbage.

topdog
12-06-2012, 05:45 PM
Not surprising that he's not doing well. Reminds me of Rashad McCants in a way who did win a national title at North Carolina, was picked in the lottery and now is in China.

Anyone else get the impression during that video that SAS and Skip would make good puppets on Sesame Street?

RipCity32
12-06-2012, 05:45 PM
hes looking like a bust and I remember all the analyst saying Detroit should have taken him and now look at Drummond looking like a beast.

2-ONE-5
12-06-2012, 05:48 PM
i dont gt why people say he isnt athletic, did u watch him at Duke? he was blowing by dudes with his crossover and was able to finish or at least get to the rim with relative ease most games. I havent seen him no NO yet since he was out the game they played the Sixers but i think he just needs to get stronger and work on his passing. He def has the tools to be at worst a Lou Williams type player i think.

2-ONE-5
12-06-2012, 05:49 PM
Not surprising that he's not doing well. Reminds me of Rashad McCants in a way who did win a national title at North Carolina, was picked in the lottery and now is in China.

Anyone else get the impression during that video that SAS and Skip would make good puppets on Sesame Street?

McCants situation is nothing like Rivers'. check out the article ESPN did on him a few years ago on why McCants get back in the league...

Gators123
12-06-2012, 05:54 PM
Hes trash. Chad Ford was right.

FOXHOUND
12-06-2012, 05:54 PM
I think it's too early to call him a bust, but clearly he is not ready for the NBA. He is mentally strong, which has been a hinderence to him so far as he should have went back to school and should have listened to Coach K a whole lot more than he did. Him getting knocked in his behind as he has is a really good wake up call for him, but I wouldn't expect him to go out softly into the night.

Still, I can't see his ceiling being that good. I didn't like that pick for the Hornets the night of the draft, and still think they should have chose otherwise. I don't buy the star potential like other people too. I see him falling somewhere between JJ Redick and Stephen Curry. Probably a career 6th man, but a good one.

valade16
12-06-2012, 05:56 PM
i dont gt why people say he isnt athletic, did u watch him at Duke? he was blowing by dudes with his crossover and was able to finish or at least get to the rim with relative ease most games. I havent seen him no NO yet since he was out the game they played the Sixers but i think he just needs to get stronger and work on his passing. He def has the tools to be at worst a Lou Williams type player i think.

Whatever he eventually becomes in the NBA, I believe that word will be part of the description...

Oldmantrash
12-06-2012, 05:57 PM
Coach K was happy he went pro for a reason.

Guy was a chucker is college, ans still wasn't that good, if he wasn't Doc Rivers son, he would not have been drafted.IMO

Chronz
12-06-2012, 05:59 PM
I didn't realize he was so young, that narrows down the list of potential comparable players who have started this poorly as rookies.

FOXHOUND
12-06-2012, 06:05 PM
Coach K was happy he went pro for a reason.

Guy was a chucker is college, ans still wasn't that good, if he wasn't Doc Rivers son, he would not have been drafted.IMO

I think he would have still gotten drafted. I mean the guy wasn't an elite prospect going into the college because of the name on the back of his jersey. See: Jordan's kids.

He had an ugly year at Duke, and definitely needed more time to polish his game and mature more as a player, physically and as a person. His name may have helped him a few spots in the draft, but I don't see any team wasting a pick on someone purely on name.

dhopisthename
12-06-2012, 06:06 PM
this is why chad ford is a nba draft analysist and those two aren't.

topdog
12-06-2012, 06:25 PM
McCants situation is nothing like Rivers'. check out the article ESPN did on him a few years ago on why McCants get back in the league...

Yeah, he has a bad reputation but 1. what's to say the same thing won't happen with "ultra confident" (i.e. arrogant) Rivers? and 2. the point is that he fell out of the league in the first place.

Lakers + Giants
12-06-2012, 06:25 PM
Not gonna lie, I thought he was gonna be one of the biggest surprises of this draft. Looks like he has been surprising, but not in the way I expected, haha.

douglas
12-06-2012, 06:26 PM
Austin Rivers misses a lot of basketball shots. When he takes the basketball shots, I think that he wants to make them, but he doesn't make them.

seikou8
12-06-2012, 06:28 PM
Austin Rivers misses a lot of basketball shots. When he takes the basketball shots, I think that he wants to make them, but he doesn't make them.

time to retire it is not funny anymore

sammyvine
12-06-2012, 06:32 PM
i wonder how doc rivers feels

Sadds The Gr8
12-06-2012, 06:37 PM
I never thought hed be great but I expected similar #s to Kemba Walker lasst year...inefficient volume scorer. He's been god ****in awful

NoahH
12-06-2012, 06:52 PM
He's shooting 28% from the field and he's 0-5 in back to back games. Dude's a bust. Jonny Flynn anyone? Bad shooting, bad passing PG

bucketss
12-06-2012, 06:57 PM
aha i remember some people saying bryan colangelo should be fired for passing up a future "star bwhaha.

heyman321
12-06-2012, 07:00 PM
Austin Rivers misses a lot of basketball shots. When he takes the basketball shots, I think that he wants to make them, but he doesn't make them.

stfu

topdog
12-06-2012, 07:01 PM
aha i remember some people saying bryan colangelo should be fired for passing up a future "star bwhaha.

Honestly, I think people just want him fired :shrug:

He should have tried to trade up for Barnes though.

spreadeagle
12-06-2012, 07:03 PM
Honestly, I think people just want him fired :shrug:

He should have tried to trade up for Barnes though.

damn right he should of, although Barnes has not blown me away yet, we needed a SF a hell of a lot more then a backup SG

netsgiantsyanks
12-06-2012, 07:12 PM
should have stayed in college. you can't live off of your father's name forever.

29$JerZ
12-06-2012, 07:22 PM
Yikes


GP MPG FGM-FGA FG% 3PM-3PA 3P% FTM-FTA FT% RPG APG BLKPG STLPG PFPG TOPG PPG
2012-13 Regular Season 16 27.0 2.0-7.1 .283 0.6-1.8 .321 1.5-2.3 .667 2.3 3.0 0.2 0.8 2.1 1.5 6.1

J4KOP99
12-06-2012, 07:24 PM
As a big duke fan dont even get me started on this

Bishnoff
12-06-2012, 08:05 PM
He is a tweener guard that doesn't have the passing ability to be a point guard nor the shooting ability of a shooting guard. He's not super athletic, but yet after every game all the superstars walk up to him to give him advice. If it wasn't for his last name he wouldn't even be a topic to discuss .

Bolded +1

AIRMAR72
12-06-2012, 08:23 PM
give the guy 2more yrs to mature its too early to call him a bust

topdog
12-06-2012, 08:24 PM
damn right he should of, although Barnes has not blown me away yet, we needed a SF a hell of a lot more then a backup SG

Barnes has at least been solid and projects to be better than Ross (who I do like). Not to mention that it could have prevented the Landry Fields signing.

SlimKid
12-06-2012, 08:36 PM
Like others have noted, it's all about his last name, nothing more..

Blitzace137
12-06-2012, 08:46 PM
He's young, his body isn't NBA ready yet, let him develop a bit more before we call him a bust. Look at JJ. Redick everyone thought he was gonna be a bust but he tuned his game up to fit the NBA and is a solid player now. I'd give Rivers another 2-3 years before I call him a bust.

Kashmir13579
12-06-2012, 09:28 PM
Chronz, you watch first take? You're not the man i thought you were.

J4KOP99
12-06-2012, 10:15 PM
He's young, his body isn't NBA ready yet, let him develop a bit more before we call him a bust. Look at JJ. Redick everyone thought he was gonna be a bust but he tuned his game up to fit the NBA and is a solid player now. I'd give Rivers another 2-3 years before I call him a bust.

Redick stayed at Duke for 4 years working on his game. He knew what to work on when he got to the NBA.

Rivers stayed for 1 year and Duke and had serious trouble there. For whatever reason he decided to leave and go to the NBA. They don't just let you develop in the NBA like they would at college.

He made a big mistake.

EmbodyingCake
12-06-2012, 10:27 PM
stfu

e-thug.

Bravo95
12-06-2012, 10:30 PM
It's still kind of early, I thought he had a Monta Ellis/Lou Williams type of ceiling at best. Not a Duke fan by any means, but felt like they were a better team when Coach K just let him be the ballhandler and just let him do his thing instead of just floating around on the perimeter. Also, it would be tough for me to tell any kid who is a lotto/Top 10 pick to stay another year if I know he won't get anything out of it.

JasonJohnHorn
12-06-2012, 10:43 PM
I think this is an example of NBA nepotism. People see that sometimes the children of great players can play at the NBA level. We've seen brothers play at the NBA level in Wilkens, and Grant, and the Lopez brothers, Jon Barry and Brent Barry both did it and both were sired by an NBA great. We've even seen chilrden perhaps surpass their father's level of play in Jalen Rose and Stephen Curry, so it makes sense that a team would be interested in drafting the son of a great player like Doc, especially one that has also had the input of such a great coach.

That said, I don't watch college ball. When I look at the draft, I usually rely soley on stats which is NOT a good idea, but I don't even have time to watch all the NBA games I want, I'm not going to make time to watch much college. When I looked at Austin Rivers stats, I was unimpressed with his shooting percentages. 43% from the floor? I mean, his 3pt% was ok, but worst of all was his FT% as like 60-something percent? I mean, a great shooter is going to be able to hit >80% from the free throw line. I realize guys who play the post aren't always great shooters and therefore don't shoot well from the line, but your shooting guard HAS to be able to shoot, and if they can hit free throws at 80% or better, then there is a problem with their shooting, and since their primary job will be shooting, it's likely not a good idea to draft him.

And considering the fact that most college players see their percentages drop when they get to the NBA and need a couple of seasons to get where their career average will be, I would expect a drop in those already questionable percentages.


So yeah... my take on Austin Rivers was based primarly on his size and shooting percentage. In this case I was right, but obviosuly when all your are looking at is stat lines, you put yourself at a disadvantage.

I used this same method in deciding that Detroit should pick Klay Thompson instead of Knight, and it seemed to work out there as well. When it comes to shooting guards coming out of college, I look for two things: they gotta be at least 6'5, and they have to be able to shoot at least 45% from the floor and 80% from the ft line. Because being undesized and/or unable to shoot is going to make it VERY hard for them to succeed in the NBA.

That said, I am glad to see Flip be SO wrong about a player. number two over all? OMG!!!! This guy is SUCH an idiot... I actually hate listening to him... but since Chronz posted this I gave it a listen.

Heatcheck
12-06-2012, 10:48 PM
even still.... 27 minutes a game 6 points a game, shooting 28 % shooting FT 66%

exactly. you know who else was 19 when they came in the league? Kyrie Irvin, JR Smith, Melo, and about a third of this years first round.

And he talked all that **** coming in

John Walls Era
12-06-2012, 10:58 PM
damn right he should of, although Barnes has not blown me away yet, we needed a SF a hell of a lot more then a backup SG

Theres 3 potential great ones in the next 3 drafts. Early as hell to say that, but its projected that Shabazz, That Chicago Kid Parker I think and Andrew Wiggins will be franchise type players.

SteveNash
12-06-2012, 11:06 PM
Jamal Crawford was pretty bad, but he was being ruined by a crappy organization.

Heatcheck
12-06-2012, 11:15 PM
Jamal Crawford was pretty bad, but he was being ruined by a crappy organization.

you cant play well, if you don't play

thekmp211
12-06-2012, 11:26 PM
he is terrible.

nolafan33
12-07-2012, 12:13 AM
He isn't ready for the league yet, that much is evident.

But I'm not worried yet. Even last year at Duke he started off horribly and figured it out as the season went on. Hopefully that's the case here as well.

Raps_93
12-07-2012, 12:43 AM
i remember some raps fans that were pissed when we took ross instead of rivers. i still dont know why people even hyping him in the first place..was it because he had a game winning shot? or his dad is doc rivers? he has all the makings of a journeyman with potential to be a solid starter at best

jericho
12-07-2012, 12:47 AM
Lol I can't believe people are really trying to put down coach k there is reason he was chosen to coach team USA the veterans in the nba listen to him why couldn't a 19 or 18 wtvr his age was back then do the same it was rivers fault for not trying to learn from 1 of the best coaches in college

jericho
12-07-2012, 12:48 AM
i remember some raps fans that were pissed when we took ross instead of rivers. i still dont know why people even hyping him in the first place..was it because he had a game winning shot? or his dad is doc rivers? he has all the makings of a journeyman with potential to be a solid starter at best

I think is cuz of his dad. I don't see all the potential that people are talking bout on him

ewing
12-07-2012, 01:05 AM
Ford vs SAS and Loudmouth

http://youtu.be/1S4rJSz8FaA

Did Chad Ford son those guys or should we give Rivers more time?

His stats are absolute dog ****, has anyone ever looked so awful to start his career and still become a journey man? Setting the bar low here

I remeber Dirk looked like a bust. River came out too soon. He still has a lot of tools

DumDum
12-07-2012, 02:13 AM
Give the kid some time everyone likes to forget that jelly bean sat on the bench for 4 years before he got his real shot. I don't know what's the rush not like nola in a playoff chase. He can grow into his game. everyone expects greatness from day one when your dad played in the nba

The_Jamal
12-07-2012, 02:40 AM
Since when do we judge 19 year old rookies with a 18 game sample size under their belt? Rivers has been dog crap this season but by no means is this what he's going to be his whole career.

Have this discussion in another 2-3 years

Alayla
12-07-2012, 08:20 AM
Are you all really calling a 19 year old rookie a bust?....have fun with that :facepalm:

Gram
12-07-2012, 11:22 AM
I told you guys he'd suck.

nolafan33
12-07-2012, 11:40 AM
I think is cuz of his dad. I don't see all the potential that people are talking bout on him

He has the talent and tools. Even though he's struggling, and has no outside shot, he can still get to the rim at will. That's not something a lot of guys can do, especially at his age. He just needs to start converting. Check this out:


Every year there is a college player who was a scorer but also dominated the ball, forcing us to ask, Can he play point guard? This year we ask that about Rivers. He has all the skills to be a solid scorer, but he will likely have to do it as a point guard. He really struggled around the rim at the start of his career at Duke. I wrote about it previously, and at the time, Rivers was posting a PPP of 0.588 around the rim, which is very low, but by the end of the season, he got up to 1.138 on 54.5 percent shooting. He improved by finishing through contact and shying away from it less.

He capitalized on his ability to get to the rim by improving the small stuff jumping off of two feet, getting his shoulders square with the backboard, etc. which will serve him well in the NBA.

IndyRealist
12-07-2012, 01:35 PM
It's not surprising. He didn't put up good numbers in college, he's not that athletic, and he has a big ego. Why did people think he was going to do well?

Aleksandar
12-07-2012, 01:42 PM
I always thought he'd be bad.. Dunno why, just a feeling..

Vinny642
12-08-2012, 01:51 AM
Gove the dude some damn time, his passing is improved, his confidence has improved, the only things i'd like him to work on, is getting stronger, shooting practice, and closing out on defenders.

Chronz
12-08-2012, 01:58 AM
Good call on the Crawford comparison, Steve Nash. You son of a *****

Sactown
12-08-2012, 03:22 AM
I didn't realize how bad he was until I looked through his stats, lol dude has a TS% of 37% lol.

nolafan33
12-08-2012, 12:51 PM
He played well last night.

DoMeFavors
12-08-2012, 01:05 PM
Doc has nothing to worry about im sure his friend Patrick Ewing is also embrassed that his son only got in the NBA because of his last name and he sucks.

flea
12-08-2012, 01:35 PM
Rivers will be fine, the NBA caters to his style of play. Why else do you think Rose is anything other than a rich man's Kenny Anderson?

gaughan333
12-08-2012, 02:05 PM
He's young, his body isn't NBA ready yet, let him develop a bit more before we call him a bust. Look at JJ. Redick everyone thought he was gonna be a bust but he tuned his game up to fit the NBA and is a solid player now. I'd give Rivers another 2-3 years before I call him a bust.

Reddick also had 1 elite skill he could focus/count on. Rivers does not

gaughan333
12-08-2012, 02:18 PM
Rivers will be fine, the NBA caters to his style of play. Why else do you think Rose is anything other than a rich man's Kenny Anderson?

rose has(had) a level of athleticism that rivers does not

dalton749
12-08-2012, 03:04 PM
looking more like the raptors got the best sg at 8