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View Full Version : How often has your opinion of LeBron changed over the years?



TyrionLannister
11-27-2012, 06:51 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8U65T2x2oxo

Watching this, with the way the media has advanced there has never been a more polarizing player than LeBron James.

How and how often has your original opinion of him differed throughout his career?

mikekhelxD
11-27-2012, 06:53 PM
Not much really. I don't let what he does off the court affects my opinion about what he does on the court.

He simply is getting better and better every year.

Zefflin
11-27-2012, 06:53 PM
A dozen literally, but like everyone else I'm at the don't care phase with him and pretty much everything else.

ManRam
11-27-2012, 06:56 PM
I hated LeBron when he first came into the league. First time I had been old enough to see, observe and hate unknown hype.

I had him on my fantasy team his Sophomore year, and it was love and reasonable admiration ever since. I always felt the off-the-court stuff was overblown, and really only clung onto by those who wanted to find reasons to slander him. Never bothered me.

So, once...

bucketss
11-27-2012, 06:59 PM
i hated lebron but thanks to the trolls who take things too far i decided theres no reason to hate on the greatness that is lebron james.

Bravo95
11-27-2012, 07:05 PM
Believed the hype from Day 1 really, that first HS game on ESPN, but after a while I wondered if he was one of those great talents destined to never truly get it done like T-Mac, etc. Then, that performance against Detroit happened...

Rndy
11-27-2012, 07:09 PM
Never changed really Thought he was a great player who like a lot of people in our 20's do stupid ****. I took the whole he can't perform in the playoffs with as much merit as the same people who said it about A -Rod. Great players are great players not always a big enough sample size to take a series and use it to build or destroy the player.

topdog
11-27-2012, 07:16 PM
Once. Last year in the playoffs when he showed his improvement in the post and took Miami to a title.

That said, I still hold the same opinion about how he came into the league with too much hype/fanfare and a different set of rules.

gaughan333
11-27-2012, 07:16 PM
thanks for posting this

Hawkeye15
11-27-2012, 07:17 PM
I was indifferent until this site, casual fans, and the media shat all over him for no reason, despite his level of play being as high as anyone. He is the best player I have seen since Jordan, and I started pulling for him 3 years ago, and now hope he runs off another 3 rings, a couple MVP's, and a couple Final's MVP's, and shoots up the all time rankings.

Just don't understand why so many don't understand they are watching the next all time great, and I mean top 3-4 ever great.

Gram
11-27-2012, 07:20 PM
I hated Cavs fans where I lived when he was in Cleveland, so I liked him more for leaving them and pissing them off (not the ones in Cleveland though).

I know a guy who always told me about LeBron back in 06 and kept telling me that Cavs would win the championship from 05-06 til 09-10. Kept making excuses every time they were eliminated in the playoffs. Told me my Pistons suck especially when LeBron torched them in the one game in 07. When LeBron left I laughed right in his face and told him he better start riding the Heat bandwagon this time. He hasn't talked to me since. :laugh2:

Teeboy1487
11-27-2012, 07:23 PM
I have no opinion of Lebron James. I don't hate him nor I go out my way to admire him. That's how I feel about most non Laker players. I agree with ManRam. "The Decision" crap was overblown. It was stupid, but it was entertaining to say the least. Honestly, I did not have one problem with him leaving Cleveland. I still don't get the outrage. I've always respected his game since he came into the league. He's the most versatile and physically gifted player I've seen in my lifetime. Still, he's not a Laker, so I don't care. I just respect him and his game.

THE MTL
11-27-2012, 07:25 PM
The only time my opinion of Lebron changes is when he is playing against my team. But besides that honestly, my opinion of him has never changed. I've always been a fan

Hawkeye15
11-27-2012, 07:25 PM
I have no opinion of Lebron James. I don't hate him nor I go out my way to admire him. That's how I feel about most non Laker players. I agree with ManRam. "The Decision" crap was overblown. It was stupid, but it was entertaining to say the least. Honestly, I did not have one problem with him leaving Cleveland. I still don't get the outrage. I've always respected his game since he came into the league. He's the most versatile and physically gifted player I've seen in my lifetime. Still, he's not a Laker, so I don't care. I just respect him and his game.

Never liked Kobe, but when he retires, I will know that I was witness to one of the all time greats, and I am grateful for that.

Im_in_Mia_bish
11-27-2012, 07:29 PM
Wow lol Wilbon was wrong majority of the time.

LoveMeOrHateMe
11-27-2012, 07:31 PM
Hasn't changed still don't like him but admit he's the best in the league right now, passed Kobe in 10'

Saad
11-27-2012, 07:46 PM
Hasn't changed still don't like him but admit he's the best in the league right now, passed Kobe in 10'

Oh gosh. I can already see the Kobe v Lebron posts coming :ohno:

Borough
11-27-2012, 07:46 PM
Always thought he was an amzing basketball player since he came into the league, he has been shown in negative light by the media sometimes but most pro athletes have an attitude, its never really changed he's always been a champ in my books

Bruno
11-27-2012, 07:51 PM
once. june 2012.

mngopher35
11-27-2012, 08:00 PM
Never really changed my mind on him at all. I have loved watching him play since he entered the league and its seemed obvious to me he could/would end up as an all time great. I think the only people who really changed their minds on him did it because of off the court issues. A few probably changed last year too when he played so bad vs dallas in the finals, but that's the only real time I can see his on court play changing someones opinion drastically.

Auggie
11-27-2012, 08:03 PM
once. june 2012.

I'd agree with this. I always thought Lebron was a great player, but seeing him be able to bring it home changed my view of him.

Avenged
11-27-2012, 08:04 PM
I liked Melo a lot more when they were drafted in 2003 (LOL @ the Pistons choosing Darko 2nd :p) but then after seeing what Lebron was doing I really started to root for the Cavs when they weren't playing the Lakers.

Then he went to Miami.. The rest is history. Don't really care about his success or failures in the league.

bigsams50
11-27-2012, 08:07 PM
I was indifferent until this site, casual fans, and the media shat all over him for no reason, despite his level of play being as high as anyone. He is the best player I have seen since Jordan, and I started pulling for him 3 years ago, and now hope he runs off another 3 rings, a couple MVP's, and a couple Final's MVP's, and shoots up the all time rankings.

Just don't understand why so many don't understand they are watching the next all time great, and I mean top 3-4 ever great.

Basically this. The man gets so much hate for no reason. Makes me want to root for the guy even more

Sactown
11-27-2012, 08:08 PM
I've liked him more and more throughout the years, he's really added a lot to his game throughout his career and you have to respect it

thekmp211
11-27-2012, 08:25 PM
it really hasn't. he made a really tasteless choice regarding his move to miami, but even then i really didn't see him as a villain.

i expected great things from him coming in, and he has delivered on almost all of my (and everyone elses) expectations. considering how infrequently that happens, you have to give him major props. and he still strikes me as a relatively decent guy.

Hawkeye15
11-27-2012, 08:28 PM
question for anyone who was annoyed or disgusted by all the Bron hype coming out of high school.

Has he not lived up to it?

netsgiantsyanks
11-27-2012, 08:28 PM
never changed.

LAKERMANIA
11-27-2012, 08:31 PM
At first I didn't really care much for Lebron

Hated him after "the decision"

But since last year's finals, I have grown to like him and I see how great of a player he is, and how much potential he still has to be come one of the all time greats.

TheSource
11-27-2012, 08:34 PM
I disliked him only because he was overhyped, and started to dislike him more when he made "The Decision," and went on about winning "not 5, not 6, not 7" rings...

IndiansFan337
11-27-2012, 08:36 PM
Not at all in terms of his talent and ability on the basketball court. My respect for him and his ego has changed dramatically though after his departure from Cleveland.

Sactown
11-27-2012, 08:38 PM
question for anyone who was annoyed or disgusted by all the Bron hype coming out of high school.

Has he not lived up to it?

ESPN hypes up someone every year, I heard constantly coming into UNC "Harrison Barnes is the next Kobe" and same with MKG going into Kentucky.

Now it's "Lillard being the next CP3" or John Wall with his explosiveness, they always have a way of killing every player.

But no matter the hype, when someone is in reach of top 5 all time they've lived up to the hype

3ballbomber
11-27-2012, 08:39 PM
Haven't liked him since 2003. He continued to act a fool since.......made 'the decision', teamed with Wade and my opinion of him got even worse. 1 Ship ain't gone change years of disapprovements.

Jarvo
11-27-2012, 08:39 PM
Wasn't a fan of him at all at first but knew he was damn good, Then when he left the Cavs and all this backlash came for no reason when he gave his all for years and getting bashed by everyone and theor 1st born I started to be a fan so he can shut people up.

Raps18-19 Champ
11-27-2012, 08:39 PM
Never.

The second I saw him play, I realized I was watching a future top 3 talent of all time.

LA_Raiders
11-27-2012, 09:18 PM
None, He is still the same *******

stawka
11-27-2012, 09:45 PM
Didn't like him at the start, ironically I liked Wade. As of the last 5 or so years, I can't stand Wade and I've loved LeBron. He's amazing to watch, a real student of the game who can do it all. I got to watch Jordan, Shaq, Kobe and now LeBron. I'm blessed in that regard

NYY 26 to 7
11-27-2012, 10:00 PM
Opinion hasn't changed he has always been great. It was fun to say he couldn't win it but everyone who said that had to know that eventually he would get one. He's too good. But still hate him his commercials and cheezy phony persona he puts on. I do think that it is hard for guys like him and ARod who have prob had people trying to mold them into some kind of robot since they were 12. I like ARod because he is a Yankee but I get why people don't like him. I think the media takes it out on him, as they do with LeBron because they are easy targets.

eibbor
11-27-2012, 10:05 PM
Anybody who gives Lebron ***** and doesn't think he did the best he could where he was and moved on is a moron... Period. This coming from a Pacer fan.

TomahawkChop 10
11-27-2012, 10:27 PM
2003: Hey this guy looks pretty decent
2006: Holy crap he's good
2009: He can't seem to finish in the playoffs w/o more help. Moe and Jamison isn't cutting it.
Summer 2010: WOW! Who leaves his hometown team because he ain't good enough to get them a ring? What a jerk, I hope he never wins one.
2011: Haha! Go Mavs. Don't let him win one!
2012: Darn... RIP LeBron Ringless Jokes 2003-2012
Now: Ehhh... it's whatever, couldn't care less if he wins another or not, still leaning more towards not.

Just about sums it up. ESPN might have helped escalate my dislike for him with all the negative press, but none the less, he pulled a dick move leaving Cleveland like that.

LoveMeOrHateMe
11-27-2012, 10:27 PM
Anybody who gives Lebron ***** and doesn't think he did the best he could where he was and moved on is a moron... Period. This coming from a Pacer fan.

They don't hate him because he moved on they hate him because of the decision

DreamShaker
11-27-2012, 10:29 PM
I think he has improved, but always thought he was going to become an all-time great. I was frusteated when he didn't play inside as much as he could, but he's really got his game to a rarified level, to go along with his rarified talent. A pleasure to watch.

IversonIsKrazy
11-27-2012, 10:29 PM
It changed July 8th , 2010. **** LeBron.

TheSource
11-27-2012, 10:43 PM
I don't him for leaving Cleveland, I hate him for the way that he did it.

Bruno
11-27-2012, 10:44 PM
Didn't like him at the start, ironically I liked Wade. As of the last 5 or so years, I can't stand Wade and I've loved LeBron. He's amazing to watch, a real student of the game who can do it all. I got to watch Jordan, Shaq, Kobe and now LeBron. I'm blessed in that regard

well said.

Hawkeye15
11-27-2012, 10:46 PM
Didn't like him at the start, ironically I liked Wade. As of the last 5 or so years, I can't stand Wade and I've loved LeBron. He's amazing to watch, a real student of the game who can do it all. I got to watch Jordan, Shaq, Kobe and now LeBron. I'm blessed in that regard

bingo

Pittz
11-27-2012, 10:58 PM
Never. I have hated him since he came into the NBA.

I still recognize he's an incredible player, but I hate him, and wish him nothing but failure.

Tysons_Beard
11-27-2012, 11:19 PM
i hated lebron but thanks to the trolls who take things too far i decided theres no reason to hate on the greatness that is lebron james.

literally the exact thing i would of said

stawka
11-27-2012, 11:22 PM
Maybe we should have a poll with two options:

I hated LeBron, now I like him
I liked LeBron, now I hate him

It would be pretty interesting to see what the polls would say

b@llhog24
11-27-2012, 11:35 PM
i hated lebron but thanks to the trolls who take things too far i decided theres no reason to hate on the greatness that is lebron james.

ftw.

ee
11-28-2012, 12:15 AM
I'm a Nets fan and I hated Lebron when it first happen... The decision was a bad move.... But lately, I have to admit, it's just hard to stay mad at this guy.....probably with how the howard deal went down and with my team doing ok now change what I feel about lebron...

NBAfan4life
11-28-2012, 12:19 AM
I always respected his game and considered him to be an all time talent. I still root against him though so really nothing has changed. I'm that type of person though I have people I root for and root against. I cant really pin down how make each list because it is different every time.

Cracka2HI!
11-28-2012, 12:23 AM
Been a fan since he was in High School. His senior year and Melo's Fr year in college was the best time ever to watch amateur basketball of my lifetime.

JordansBulls
11-28-2012, 12:48 AM
Loved him from the get go, but now a bit indifferent because of the decision.

Matter.
11-28-2012, 12:50 AM
Hated him from the decision, but I know he is a talent, and he will be an all-time great, but since 2010, I have hated him with a passion... but it is a blessing to watch Lebron and Kobe do work in their prime.

LongIslandIcedZ
11-28-2012, 01:09 AM
Liked him when he came into the league

Disliked him after the decision

Got over that and now I have no problem with him, dont like or hate.

LongWayFromHome
11-28-2012, 02:11 AM
I thought he would take a while to develop. Then I thought he was awesome. When he took CLE to the finals beating DET I had so much fun watching him. Then I thought he was a tool. Now he's ok with me. He is a tool but what players aren't, right?

Phenomenonsense
11-28-2012, 02:26 AM
Hated him out of rivalry on the cavs, hated him for being overhyped. He got better and now I don't care.

SportsFanatic10
11-28-2012, 02:26 AM
such an amazing player but i disliked him for most of his career. once he put on the heat jersey that all changed however lol.

Tmath
11-28-2012, 02:33 AM
At first I was like: http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6vg9gFsIJ1r6hxat.gif

Then I was like: http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lthtlpNQuE1r4ghkoo1_500.gif

Now I'm like: http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mc9x07WPjI1qf16b2.gif

koberulesall
11-28-2012, 03:02 AM
lebron isnt a true franchise player the best players of ALL TIME are the ones that stuck it out with there team that drafted them and won a title for them THATS A NBA LEGEND just to name a few Kareem(Bucks) Magic(Lakers) Bird(Celtics) Jordan(Bulls) Kobe(Lakers) james(SUCKS)

SportsFanatic10
11-28-2012, 03:23 AM
lebron isnt a true franchise player the best players of ALL TIME are the ones that stuck it out with there team that drafted them and won a title for them THATS A NBA LEGEND just to name a few Kareem(Bucks) Magic(Lakers) Bird(Celtics) Jordan(Bulls) Kobe(Lakers) james(SUCKS)

lol dude that argument is so played out and weak. not every star gets drafted into a top notch franchise that can properly build around them. kobe would of left the lakers if they didn't pull off the gasol trade. time to look at things with some perspective, some players are drafted into a good situation and some aren't, that's just the way it is. lebron never got to play with a shaq or pippen or even a gasol etc, with the cavs. it's like comparing apples and oranges lol.

SteBO
11-28-2012, 10:37 AM
Never changed once. I saw quite a bit of his HS games, and was sold from the start. Then, he got drafted 1st overall in the 2003 draft and dropped around 27, 5, and 5 in his first ever NBA game against the Kings. I've always liked him as a player and a person even, regardless of all the hype he was given. He has lived up to it, and then exceeded it. It isn't easy to handle the pressure that was bestowed upon him since when he was 13 years of age, growing up without a father, and having to take care of his mother on his own. For that, I just can't help but respect him.

SteBO
11-28-2012, 10:39 AM
lebron isnt a true franchise player the best players of ALL TIME are the ones that stuck it out with there team that drafted them and won a title for them THATS A NBA LEGEND just to name a few Kareem(Bucks) Magic(Lakers) Bird(Celtics) Jordan(Bulls) Kobe(Lakers) james(SUCKS)
Don't people like you get tired of regurgitating the same nonsense over and over again?

whitemamba33
11-28-2012, 10:48 AM
Only once.

My original opinion was that he was a fantastic player. Someone who could dominate the games in many ways just like Jordan did. I had full confidence in his competitive spirit, and bought what he was selling when he promised to bring a championship to Cleveland. Bringing a championship to the Cleveland market would have been HUGE, and I believed he was the guy to do it.

Then he quit in Cleveland, and now it's impossible for me to ever see him the same way again. It's like Jordan said: he wasn't looking to play with Magic and Bird, he was looking to beat them.

(Please save all the "he had no help" garbage. They are just excuses and I won't entertain them. If you can win 60+ games you are a contender.)

JordansBulls
11-28-2012, 10:54 AM
lol dude that argument is so played out and weak. not every star gets drafted into a top notch franchise that can properly build around them. kobe would of left the lakers if they didn't pull off the gasol trade. time to look at things with some perspective, some players are drafted into a good situation and some aren't, that's just the way it is. lebron never got to play with a shaq or pippen or even a gasol etc, with the cavs. it's like comparing apples and oranges lol.

Lebron did get to play with Shaq and also Ben Wallace guys who won titles as the man.

LongIslandIcedZ
11-28-2012, 10:57 AM
Lebron did get to play with Shaq and also Ben Wallace guys who won titles as the man.

I dont get your argument, can you elaborate.

Neither Shaq nor Ben Wallace were even close to the players they were when they were "the man"

How can Lebron be penalized for that?

eternal slumber
11-28-2012, 11:02 AM
i really liked him a lot until THE DECISION happened. i know he was the real deal from the start.

i got to admit, he's one of the best i've ever laid my eyes on but i would never root for him but i respect him.

TheIlladelph16
11-28-2012, 12:31 PM
I dont get your argument, can you elaborate.

Neither Shaq nor Ben Wallace were even close to the players they were when they were "the man"

How can Lebron be penalized for that?

From my experience here, its better to just not engage that argument with JB. He values performance with HCA and playing with players who previously were the man even if they were shells of their former selves more than anyone. Its a non-winnable argument with him. I respect his opinion on a variety of topics, but the Lebron arguments he has are utter nonsense.

My opinion on Lebron though never really changed throughout his career. I remember going to see him play when I was in middle school during his HS career and thinking "holy ***** this guy is going to be incredible." I honestly can understand why people do not like him as a person because of the decision, but to me that was so overblown that I found no issue with it. I was rooting for him to join Miami from the get go that offseason and to get the hell out of the dark abyss that is Cleveland sports, so I was happy with what came out of it.

JasonJohnHorn
11-28-2012, 01:10 PM
I opined that during his rookie season he showed potential to be the best player in the league. By the time the 05 season concluded I opined that he WAS the best player in the league. And when he went to MIA I opined that he was still the best, but that I didn't like him leaving his hometown Cavs to chase a ring in MIA. I have also opined that he is a wonderful role model off the court who does a lot of great charity work, even though I don't like the fact he left the Cavs high and dry and don't really want him to have success in Miami, but that's more because I think their way of building a team is bad for the parity of the league.

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 01:23 PM
I liked Lebron when he first came into league. I liked him when he killed the Pistons. I even rooted for him to beat the Spurs. I dont like him now because I think all he is is a stat stuffer. He has no real great moments in his career except beating the pistons and game 6 last year against the Celtics where he was absolutely ridiculous. I think he took the easy way out in Cleveland and I think his fans make to many excuses for him.

Hellcrooner
11-28-2012, 01:30 PM
Never.

he is the best player of his generation, like Mikan, Wilt, Kareem,Magic, Jordan, Duncan were before him.

It dissapointed me that he didnt have enough balls to go to NY or CHI to try to bring succes back for them.

But that doesnt change my point of view of him as a player.

sammyvine
11-28-2012, 03:42 PM
What i didn't like was the comment about ''you will go back to the same lives'' after he lost. I thought he came across really classless for such a superstar in the position he is.

mngopher35
11-28-2012, 04:16 PM
I liked Lebron when he first came into league. I liked him when he killed the Pistons. I even rooted for him to beat the Spurs. I dont like him now because I think all he is is a stat stuffer. He has no real great moments in his career except beating the pistons and game 6 last year against the Celtics where he was absolutely ridiculous. I think he took the easy way out in Cleveland and I think his fans make to many excuses for him.

Seriously? The best player in the league and you call him a stat stuffer? Those moments you listed were actually pretty great, not to mention pacer game 4 when they were down. Can you tell me those epic moment your boy kobe has had in the playoffs that were so much better than Lebrons? Also he still has more time to have more great playoff moments.

PleaseBeNice
11-28-2012, 04:31 PM
Knew he was good coming into the league...didn't care for him much though. Liked seeing his highlights in cleveland but didn't really care for him much. When people would debate who is better between him and Kobe I would quickly side with LeBron and defend the hell out of him. Ever since he switched to the Heat, I have been one of his biggest fans because the backlash he accrued in his departure was absolutely insane and not deserved, I mean he was a FREE AGENT for christs sake. Couldn't of been happier watching him win his ring last year, and he is now my favorite player in the league that is not on the Kings. I have a red cleveland, blue alternate cleveland, and white/black heat jersey of him now. Looking into purchasing the heat jersey with pink stripes also. We should all feel priviliged to be watching an ALL TIME GREAT play before us. Never has there been a player as good as LeBron with his skillset, size, speed, and athleticism

PleaseBeNice
11-28-2012, 04:33 PM
I liked Lebron when he first came into league. I liked him when he killed the Pistons. I even rooted for him to beat the Spurs. I dont like him now because I think all he is is a stat stuffer. He has no real great moments in his career except beating the pistons and game 6 last year against the Celtics where he was absolutely ridiculous. I think he took the easy way out in Cleveland and I think his fans make to many excuses for him. Stat stuffer? Why? HE CAN DO EVERYTHING EXCEPTIONALLY WELL. He's a stat stuffer because he makes things happen, and it's not like it's in garbage minutes either...

Chronz
11-28-2012, 04:34 PM
I dont get your argument, can you elaborate.

Neither Shaq nor Ben Wallace were even close to the players they were when they were "the man"

How can Lebron be penalized for that?

Dont bother bro. He will ignore injuries and context at all costs when it comes to this subject

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 04:53 PM
Seriously? The best player in the league and you call him a stat stuffer? Those moments you listed were actually pretty great, not to mention pacer game 4 when they were down. Can you tell me those epic moment your boy kobe has had in the playoffs that were so much better than Lebrons? Also he still has more time to have more great playoff moments.

My boy Kobe? :facepalm: You want to make this a Kobe Vs. Lebron thread like usual? I gave my opinion.

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 04:59 PM
And most of the people on this site are to young to have watched basketball in the 80's and early 90's. I know this because you people wouldnt be so ready to stroke off Lebron and call him "greatest thing you've ever laid your eyes on". lmao. Thats silly. He's a great player, but like i've always said, had Grant Hill not been injured, he would have been the closest thing to Jordan. Lebron is great, but when Wade was healthy, Wade was a much better Basketball player than Lebron.. BASKETBALL PLAYER. Lebron is just a physical specimine sort of like Shaq.

mngopher35
11-28-2012, 05:25 PM
My boy Kobe? :facepalm: You want to make this a Kobe Vs. Lebron thread like usual? I gave my opinion.

Yes, and all I ever see from you is bashing lebron and praising kobe in threads. You gave your opinion and I wanted a comparison and or some proof. Lebrons ONLY great playoff moments to you were celtics and detroit and yet you love kobe who arguably hasn't had as big of games in the playoffs. Your right we shouldn't make this a kobe/lebron thread but id love a pm explaining how those weren't pretty amazing playoff performances, comparing them to a top ten player of all times greatest moments (kobe).

SportsFanatic10
11-28-2012, 05:27 PM
Lebron did get to play with Shaq and also Ben Wallace guys who won titles as the man.

lmao you can't be serious! gtfo!

TheIlladelph16
11-28-2012, 05:47 PM
And most of the people on this site are to young to have watched basketball in the 80's and early 90's. I know this because you people wouldnt be so ready to stroke off Lebron and call him "greatest thing you've ever laid your eyes on". lmao. Thats silly. He's a great player, but like i've always said, had Grant Hill not been injured, he would have been the closest thing to Jordan. Lebron is great, but when Wade was healthy, Wade was a much better Basketball player than Lebron.. BASKETBALL PLAYER. Lebron is just a physical specimine sort of like Shaq.

I absolutely love both Grant Hill so I agree we missed out on him potentially being an all-timer because of injuries. Although I disagree with the Jordan comparison for both him and Lebron personally. It really is a shame how his career has turned out.

Lebron is a physical specimen who is also an incredibly talented basketball player ... Not sure why you think otherwise. Personally, I believe he is a better basketball player than Dwayne Wade ever was, who was exceptional in his own right. However, I'm open to being persuaded otherwise with some documented evidence of that.

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 05:58 PM
I absolutely love both Grant Hill so I agree we missed out on him potentially being an all-timer because of injuries. Although I disagree with the Jordan comparison for both him and Lebron personally. It really is a shame how his career has turned out.

Lebron is a physical specimen who is also an incredibly talented basketball player ... Not sure why you think otherwise. Personally, I believe he is a better basketball player than Dwayne Wade ever was, who was exceptional in his own right. However, I'm open to being persuaded otherwise with some documented evidence of that.

Good post man, good to see a poster who doesn't try and belittle or condescend someone who doesn't agree with them.

I wasn't trying to compare the game of the three players, just the dominance of them. Grant was amazing to watch and had no real physical advantages over any other player in the league, much like Jordan, He was just GOOD. I also think Lebron is a very talented player, but I think a lot of that has to do with how dominate physically he is, much like Shaq. And that's not a knock on Lebron at all. But the intangibles that I see in wade are just better. Just watching them play. I guess Wade's game looks a lot more smooth than Lebrons. Wade doesn't have the physical attributes that Lebron has and has to rely more on pure basketball skills. I obviously don't have any numbers to back that claim up, it's just what my eyes see.

DanG
11-28-2012, 06:01 PM
Years ago I hated him, but now I'm neutral

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:05 PM
Lebron did get to play with Shaq and also Ben Wallace guys who won titles as the man.

don't forget ilgauskas was a former all star and i think mo williams was on the year before. i don't even know why he left cleveland for miami when miami has only one player who has won as the man(wade) while cleveland had two:confused:

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:09 PM
Yes, and all I ever see from you is bashing lebron and praising kobe in threads. You gave your opinion and I wanted a comparison and or some proof. Lebrons ONLY great playoff moments to you were celtics and detroit and yet you love kobe who arguably hasn't had as big of games in the playoffs. Your right we shouldn't make this a kobe/lebron thread but id love a pm explaining how those weren't pretty amazing playoff performances, comparing them to a top ten player of all times greatest moments (kobe).

lol.. Kobe hasn't had any big playoff games? Are you 15?

PleaseBeNice
11-28-2012, 06:10 PM
Lebron did get to play with Shaq and also Ben Wallace guys who won titles as the man.

Excuse me? Ha.

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:10 PM
Good post man, good to see a poster who doesn't try and belittle or condescend someone who doesn't agree with them.

I wasn't trying to compare the game of the three players, just the dominance of them. Grant was amazing to watch and had no real physical advantages over any other player in the league, much like Jordan, He was just GOOD. I also think Lebron is a very talented player, but I think a lot of that has to do with how dominate physically he is, much like Shaq. And that's not a knock on Lebron at all. But the intangibles that I see in wade are just better. Just watching them play. I guess Wade's game looks a lot more smooth than Lebrons. Wade doesn't have the physical attributes that Lebron has and has to rely more on pure basketball skills. I obviously don't have any numbers to back that claim up, it's just what my eyes see.

jordan had no real physical advantages over anyone:laugh2::facepalm:

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:13 PM
don't forget ilgauskas was a former all star and i think mo williams was on the year before. i don't even know why he left cleveland for miami when miami has only one player who has won as the man(wade) while cleveland had two:confused:

This is what i mean and why people hate Lebron. So since he was unable to win with a team that had the best record in the league, coach of the year, sixth man of the year, MVP, etc, its everyone elses fault but Lebron? As soon as his fans stop trying to make excuses for him, the sooner people will stop hatin on him.

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:14 PM
jordan had no real physical advantages over anyone:laugh2::facepalm:

Care to elaborate besides a facepalm? Lebron is 6'8 270 and runs a 4'4. Now your turn to give me something on Jordan. And dont say he had "big hands"

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:16 PM
And most of the people on this site are to young to have watched basketball in the 80's and early 90's. I know this because you people wouldnt be so ready to stroke off Lebron and call him "greatest thing you've ever laid your eyes on". lmao. Thats silly. He's a great player, but like i've always said, had Grant Hill not been injured, he would have been the closest thing to Jordan. Lebron is great, but when Wade was healthy, Wade was a much better Basketball player than Lebron.. BASKETBALL PLAYER. Lebron is just a physical specimine sort of like Shaq.

i like how you act like ath. isn't apart of the game so i guess tj ford is MUCH better basketball player than dwight huh?? you make no sense. and i like how you just admitted pretty much lebron >> kobe.

stawka
11-28-2012, 06:19 PM
LeBron has played alongside Shaq, Big Z, Big Ben, Mo-Will and he couldn't win. I remember once, Shaq had HCA and Big Ben was "the man" while he won a series without HCA so that means that if he couldn't do it with Mo-Will as "the man", then HCA wasn't truly an advantage in this instance

Billups was "the man" at one point of his career and he plays on the clippers, and Mo-Will also played for them at one stage, and Kobe's former teammate also plays for them, and Kobe once had HCA with Shaq as "the man" on his team, and he lost to Billups and Big Ben without HCA

So therefore, Derrick Rose = GOAT

HCA bruh, COME AT ME!!

#JBlogicbruh

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:20 PM
Care to elaborate besides a facepalm? Lebron is 6'8 270 and runs a 4'4. Now your turn to give me something on Jordan. And dont say he had "big hands"

jordan is arguably more athletic than lebron, jordan ran a 4.3 and had a higher vertical than lebron.

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:21 PM
i like how you act like ath. isn't apart of the game so i guess tj ford is MUCH better basketball player than dwight huh?? you make no sense. and i like how you just admitted pretty much lebron >> kobe.

lol.. Fine, Lebron is better than Kobe.. But why are you telling me this? 5>> 1/2..

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:22 PM
jordan is arguably more athletic than lebron, jordan ran a 4.3 and had a higher vertical than lebron.

lmfao... :speechless: Jordan ran a 4.3???????

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:22 PM
lol.. Fine, Lebron is better than Kobe.. But why are you telling me this? 5>> 1/2..

if you're gonna give lebron 1/2 a ring than take away kobes two rigged rings in 2002 and 2010

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:24 PM
lmfao... :speechless: Jordan ran a 4.3???????

why the hell are you surprised this guy was a damn beast.

BALLER71
11-28-2012, 06:25 PM
Never changed really Thought he was a great player who like a lot of people in our 20's do stupid ****. I took the whole he can't perform in the playoffs with as much merit as the same people who said it about A -Rod. Great players are great players not always a big enough sample size to take a series and use it to build or destroy the player.

What has he done that "stupid people in their 20s" do?

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:26 PM
if you're gonna give lebron 1/2 a ring than take away kobes two rigged rings in 2002 and 2010

:facepalm:

JayMikeMittens
11-28-2012, 06:27 PM
-When he entered the league I thought "What is all the hype all about?"

-When he was in Cleveland I thought "haha he'll never win a ring!" & "He's a Chokester"

-When he had a ESPN Special Event to tell everybody he was going to Miami, I thought "What an Idiot!"

-When he lost to the Mavs, I thought "Yes, I hope he never wins a Ring"

-When he won last year, I thought "Damn, I'd rather have Durant win....but damn he was a beast!"

-When his Samsung commercial pops up at the barbershop, I think "Theres no way of saving your hair, just shave it off!"


So my opinion of Lebron has changed several times.

I respect his game.

bucketss
11-28-2012, 06:27 PM
:facepalm:

since both have been in the league lebron = 1 ring kobe = 2

u mad? you hear the foot steps??

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:29 PM
since both have been in the league lebron = 1 ring kobe = 2

u mad? you hear the foot steps??

lol.. I like that right there. We will see then. Hopefully they finally meet in the finals while Kobe is still good...

mngopher35
11-28-2012, 06:32 PM
lol.. Kobe hasn't had any big playoff games? Are you 15?

No but based of performance and situation Lebron arguably has had some better ones than kobe and yet you chose to call him out on it for some reason. Kobe has had great performances and so has Lebron so I dont get why you brought it up in the first place. What I want is to hear about all the great performances Kobe has had that were better than Lebrons vs detroit and game 6 vs boston?

mngopher35
11-28-2012, 06:34 PM
-When he entered the league I thought "What is all the hype all about?"

-When he was in Cleveland I thought "haha he'll never win a ring!" & "He's a Chokester"

-When he had a ESPN Special Event to tell everybody he was going to Miami, I thought "What an Idiot!"

-When he lost to the Mavs, I thought "Yes, I hope he never wins a Ring"

-When he won last year, I thought "Damn, I'd rather have Durant win....but damn he was a beast!"

-When his Samsung commercial pops up at the barbershop, I think "Theres no way of saving your hair, just shave it off!"

lol

nickdymez
11-28-2012, 06:36 PM
No but based of performance and situation Lebron arguably has had some better ones than kobe and yet you chose to call him out on it for some reason. Kobe has had great performances and so has Lebron so I dont get why you brought it up in the first place. What I want is to hear about all the great performances Kobe has had that were better than Lebrons vs detroit and game 6 vs boston?

I didnt bring up Kobe though. lmao :facepalm:

PleaseBeNice
11-28-2012, 06:37 PM
:facepalm:

thats all you have to show?

mngopher35
11-28-2012, 06:40 PM
I didnt bring up Kobe though. lmao :facepalm:

But hes a top 10 all time great, who I have seen you defend a lot . If Lebron is lacking in these great playoff moments shouldn't someone like that nearing the end of his career have a lot more? Can you name me them? Then I don't see how you can say Lebron is lacking in great playoff moments this point in his career...

SanAntonioSpurs23
11-28-2012, 10:11 PM
Ive dis-liked him before he even played a single NBA game. The hype that surround this guy annoyed me and really turned me off. The dancing around during games and of course "the decision" made me never want to root for the guy.

Lakers4ItAll
11-29-2012, 01:06 AM
at 1st I thought Lebron was overrated big time and always said what has he done??? I thought he was dumb to go to Miami and thought he should have went to the Knicks and been the King of New York. But after last season and watching him in the Olympics I can only admire how he plays the game and how good he really has become. Now I will never support the guy(unless he was a Laker) but I do like to watch him play the game.

Money_23
11-29-2012, 01:31 AM
aside from the whole fold under the pressure thing, not really. He's always been a top player in the league for the past several years.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 03:07 AM
But hes a top 10 all time great, who I have seen you defend a lot . If Lebron is lacking in these great playoff moments shouldn't someone like that nearing the end of his career have a lot more? Can you name me them? Then I don't see how you can say Lebron is lacking in great playoff moments this point in his career...

So your telling me Lebron has more great playoff games then Kobe? Kobe a 5 time champion who has been to the finals 7 times and only lost 2? Kobe Owned the spurs countless times. He owned the Kings countless times, he owned the Suns countless times. Im not just talking his stat line because Lebron clearly puts up better numbers than kobe. Im talking clutch situations, im talking completely deflating a teams hopes. Kobe does that. Lebron just runs full speed down the court and gets fouled or muscles his way to a layup.

Munkeysuit
11-29-2012, 03:46 AM
I am a huge fan of Lebron James, I am not going to sit here and say that I have been throughout his entire career from the get go though. I started becoming a fan after I watched him play in the famous game 5 of the Detroit series in 2007, after watching that game, I immediately had witnessed the talent everyone else was already buzzing about.
I am and was a bigger Miami Heat fan before this, so as you can imagine, I've watched the battles he and DWade had every time they played each other, but that game was the very first time I became a fan of Bron's.
With that being said, I am sure you guys can imagine that I have heard it all! all the scrutinizing criticism, all the harsh comments and all of the horrible nicknames, I have had to sit through them all and take it on the chin as a fan...but honestly? my opinion of his character, personality and athleticism never ever changed...just about the only thing that has changed in my mind, regarding Lebron James is that I am more proud of him for what he has accomplished in spite of all of the negativity, and how far his game has evolved in the process.

Munkeysuit
11-29-2012, 03:54 AM
So your telling me Lebron has more great playoff games then Kobe? Kobe a 5 time champion who has been to the finals 7 times and only lost 2? Kobe Owned the spurs countless times. He owned the Kings countless times, he owned the Suns countless times. Im not just talking his stat line because Lebron clearly puts up better numbers than kobe. Im talking clutch situations, im talking completely deflating a teams hopes. Kobe does that. Lebron just runs full speed down the court and gets fouled or muscles his way to a layup.



Are you even watching Lebron James play? hahahahahhahahahaha, runs down the court and muscles his way to a lay up? is that all? hahahahahahahaha!
Kobe has been in more clutch situations than Lebron, I will give you that + the rings, but Lebron is by far the better player Kobe ever was.
Come on man, everyone who is a true sports fan knows the Mamba was hand delivered 3 of his rings by Shaquille Oneal, Kobe then failed to even win anything (even an MVP) for 6 years straight! then along comes another talented big man (Pau Gasol) and Kobe wins 2 more titles and his first MVP...let's face it, Kobe is an awesome player, one of the best ever, and probably the best Laker ever, I will even admit Kobe is even more clutch than Lebron! but Kobe was spoon fed all of his meaningful accolades (5 rings) and history proves it.

Baller1
11-29-2012, 04:05 AM
Mine hasn't wavered much at all. Been one of my favorite players for quite a while now.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 04:12 AM
Are you even watching Lebron James play? hahahahahhahahahaha, runs down the court and muscles his way to a lay up? is that all? hahahahahahahaha!
Kobe has been in more clutch situations than Lebron, I will give you that + the rings, but Lebron is by far the better player Kobe ever was.
Come on man, everyone who is a true sports fan knows the Mamba was hand delivered 3 of his rings by Shaquille Oneal, Kobe then failed to even win anything (even an MVP) for 6 years straight! then along comes another talented big man (Pau Gasol) and Kobe wins 2 more titles and his first MVP...let's face it, Kobe is an awesome player, one of the best ever, and probably the best Laker ever, I will even admit Kobe is even more clutch than Lebron! but Kobe was spoon fed all of his meaningful accolades (5 rings) and history proves it.

So you mean to tell me that Lebron running to Miami to play with 2 other superstar (One of which was already a finals MVP and top 3 player) isnt 1000X worst than Kobe staying on one team and winning it with Pau Gasol???? What?? Are you serious? Lebron didnt spoon feed himself a ring by running to another superstars team? Wow!:speechless:

seikou8
11-29-2012, 04:13 AM
So you mean to tell me that Lebron running to Miami to play with 2 other superstar (One of which was already a finals MVP and top 3 player) isnt 1000X worst than Kobe staying on one team and winning it with Pau Gasol???? What?? Are you serious? Lebron didnt spoon feed himself a ring by running to another superstars team? Wow!:speechless:

did you just chris bosh is superstar:laugh2:

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 04:15 AM
did you just chris bosh is superstar:laugh2:

Are you being serious?

Baller1
11-29-2012, 04:23 AM
did you just chris bosh is superstar:laugh2:

He was a franchise player in Toronto, the second best player on Miami this season, and now has a ring as one of the main guys.

Chris Bosh is a superstar.

seikou8
11-29-2012, 04:26 AM
He was a franchise player in Toronto, the second best player on Miami this season, and now has a ring as one of the main guys.

Chris Bosh is a superstar.

sorry when i think superstar i think top 7 players in the league a guy that my team to playoffs year in and year out.chris bosh is a star but no superstar.

Baller1
11-29-2012, 04:28 AM
sorry when i think superstar i think top 7 players in the league a guy that my team to playoffs year in and year out.chris bosh is a star but no superstar.

Well, I guess that just depends on our different interpretations of what a superstar is. Fair enough then..

amos1er
11-29-2012, 04:57 AM
sorry when i think superstar i think top 7 players in the league a guy that my team to playoffs year in and year out.chris bosh is a star but no superstar.

Are you really trying to argue that the definition of a superstar is limited to being a top 7 player???

amos1er
11-29-2012, 05:01 AM
So your telling me Lebron has more great playoff games then Kobe? Kobe a 5 time champion who has been to the finals 7 times and only lost 2? Kobe Owned the spurs countless times. He owned the Kings countless times, he owned the Suns countless times. Im not just talking his stat line because Lebron clearly puts up better numbers than kobe. Im talking clutch situations, im talking completely deflating a teams hopes. Kobe does that. Lebron just runs full speed down the court and gets fouled or muscles his way to a layup.

It's so funny to watch all these guys with Le'boners on here try to overrate James in every way possible. He wins only one championship with a superteam, the likes of which has never been seen before in NBA history, and there are actually people on here who want to put him in the top 10 of all time. Funny how these are the people who chastise Kobe for having Shaq for his first three titles. Even more hilarious, is how these very same people will not even admit that Kobe is a top ten player of all time. :facepalm:

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 05:22 AM
So your telling me Lebron has more great playoff games then Kobe? Kobe a 5 time champion who has been to the finals 7 times and only lost 2? Kobe Owned the spurs countless times. He owned the Kings countless times, he owned the Suns countless times. Im not just talking his stat line because Lebron clearly puts up better numbers than kobe. Im talking clutch situations, im talking completely deflating a teams hopes. Kobe does that. Lebron just runs full speed down the court and gets fouled or muscles his way to a layup.

You don't want to talk stats because Lebron's are better? Ok that's fine, we agree there. I think that they both have had great playoff performances and Lebron's best match (or at least are comparable) to Kobe's best. Lebron has had great performances vs the pistons, wizards, celtics, pacers now and he still has more prime left. Your the one who called him out on not having good playoff performance over the years, and I disagree. My point is that his best playoff performances already match up with a top 10 all time player so I don't get calling him out on them.

Can you name me specific games/performances so much better than Lebrons vs detroit and then game 6 vs celtics last year? How many? These games were very important in the series and very clutch moments by Lebron that deflated the other teams hopes/chances.

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 05:32 AM
No Kobe fan wants to debate stats between Bron and Kobe. They simply get backed into a corner, and scream "5 rings!".

Bruno
11-29-2012, 06:52 AM
He was a franchise player in Toronto, the second best player on Miami this season, and now has a ring as one of the main guys.

Chris Bosh is a superstar.

he's also been one of the best players in the NBA this year. convincingly top ten for 2013 thus far.

which shouldn't come as a surprise. He finished 4th in PER the year before he joined the Heat as the top dog in Toronto.

Bruno
11-29-2012, 06:55 AM
Mine hasn't wavered much at all. Been one of my favorite players for quite a while now.

how do you not have an inner dog against LBJ? he's your boys main competition, the only thing between KD being the best player in the NBA, and the reason the Thunder aren't champions. your respect for him is commendable considering who you root for, but you root for him to lose- right?

only root for him to lose against OKC type thing? i've accepted his greatness, but I still root against him without remorse.

R. Johnson#3
11-29-2012, 07:11 AM
I never had a problem with him until "The Decision" was aired.

Greedy22
11-29-2012, 07:12 AM
03-09 I loved him, 10-11 season I hated him for the way he left Cleveland, now back to loving him and watching him dominate night in and night out.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:00 AM
It's so funny to watch all these guys with Le'boners on here try to overrate James in every way possible. He wins only one championship with a superteam, the likes of which has never been seen before in NBA history, and there are actually people on here who want to put him in the top 10 of all time. Funny how these are the people who chastise Kobe for having Shaq for his first three titles. Even more hilarious, is how these very same people will not even admit that Kobe is a top ten player of all time. :facepalm:

really? did you notice if you add boshs and wades stats together from the finals it equals almost the same number shaq put up? bwhahhaha

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 11:20 AM
You don't want to talk stats because Lebron's are better? Ok that's fine, we agree there. I think that they both have had great playoff performances and Lebron's best match (or at least are comparable) to Kobe's best. Lebron has had great performances vs the pistons, wizards, celtics, pacers now and he still has more prime left. Your the one who called him out on not having good playoff performance over the years, and I disagree. My point is that his best playoff performances already match up with a top 10 all time player so I don't get calling him out on them.

Can you name me specific games/performances so much better than Lebrons vs detroit and then game 6 vs celtics last year? How many? These games were very important in the series and very clutch moments by Lebron that deflated the other teams hopes/chances.

I didnt say Lebron didnt have any good playoff games man.. lol.. I meant that he didnt have many great games that make people legends in this game... Jordans flu game, Magic starting game 7 as a rookie at center, etc. Thats all im saying. I know you Lebron guys try and go out your way to make Lebron look like some sort of greek god that has no flaws and can play 5 on 1 and win by 15, but sorry, he cant...

dh144498
11-29-2012, 11:24 AM
sorry when i think superstar i think top 7 players in the league a guy that my team to playoffs year in and year out.chris bosh is a star but no superstar.

never watched the NBA? Boshs was a superstar before he joined the Heat.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:26 AM
im a raptor fan... LOL@ anyone calling bosh a superstar:facepalm:

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:26 AM
i guess the word superstar has become loose these days

Money_23
11-29-2012, 11:44 AM
im a raptor fan... LOL@ anyone calling bosh a superstar:facepalm:

you are right. 24-11 on 52% is not a superstar.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 11:46 AM
i guess the word superstar has become loose these days

Lebron guys try and go out there way to make Lebron look better. So now Bosh isnt a superstar.. smh :facepalm:

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:50 AM
Lebron guys try and go out there way to make Lebron look better. So now Bosh isnt a superstar.. smh :facepalm:

kobephiles try to discredit lebron because they are paranoid hes about pass their hero. if bosh is a superstar than gasol and bynum are both superstars.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:53 AM
you are right. 24-11 on 52% is not a superstar.

if bosh is a superstar than so are guys aldridge,z-bo,m.gasol

SportsFanatic10
11-29-2012, 11:55 AM
if bosh is a superstar than so are guys aldridge,z-bo,m.gasol

yep. bosh is a very good player just like all those you mentioned, but i agree, i'd consider them stars not superstars like some are trying to say.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 11:58 AM
they do anything to make lebron look like a lesser player than they complain when he gets compliments. they're suppose to be laker fans why the hell do they care so much about lebron? only answer is THEY ARE PARANOID this same lebron was the same guy who forced them to cheer for the celtics in the playoffs THE CELTICS!

SportsFanatic10
11-29-2012, 11:59 AM
only superstars in the league imo are

lebron
durant
howard
paul
wade
dirk
kobe
rose
westbrook
love
williams
melo
rondo

thats off the top of my head but thats about it i'd say.

Money_23
11-29-2012, 11:59 AM
if bosh is a superstar than so are guys aldridge,z-bo,m.gasol

24-11 is superstar production. It seems to me you were talking about popularity. No one here is discussing popularity.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 12:02 PM
24-11 is superstar production. It seems to me you were talking about popularity. No one here is discussing popularity.

he put up 24-11 on bad team that missed the playoffs in a weak conf.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 12:02 PM
only superstars in the league imo are

lebron
durant
howard
paul
wade
dirk
kobe
rose
westbrook
love
williams
melo
rondo

thats off the top of my head but thats about it i'd say.

this minus melo.

Money_23
11-29-2012, 12:03 PM
he put up 24-11 on bad team that missed the playoffs in a weak conf.

but I thought winning games is a team effort. Why is 24-11 production not a superstar now that the team is losing? :rolleyes:

bucketss
11-29-2012, 12:10 PM
but I thought winning games is a team effort. Why is 24-11 production not a superstar now that the team is losing? :rolleyes:

watch the games he was stat padding the whole year when the trade deadline passed he faked injuries cause he knew he was going to sign with miami. hes a ***** **** em i don't want to talk about the *** anymore.

He115ing
11-29-2012, 12:41 PM
3 times:
1. As a Cavalier- "Lebron is the man!"
2. After the Decision- "Wow, what a douche!"
3. After championship- "damn, he is a douche but he is an amazing basketball player, also just go bald already, your hairline is not fooling anyone"

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 01:14 PM
kobephiles try to discredit lebron because they are paranoid hes about pass their hero. if bosh is a superstar than gasol and bynum are both superstars.

Bynum isnt a superstar, Pau is imo. Im not like you Leboners who try and make Kobe look like a created player on 2k.

And im more paranoid of Kevin Durant pasing kobe than Lebron

8kobe24
11-29-2012, 01:14 PM
Not once, I've always respected his "talents".

JordansBulls
11-29-2012, 01:15 PM
if bosh is a superstar than so are guys aldridge,z-bo,m.gasol

I don't think Aldridge, Zbo, M.Gasol would outproduce Lebron in the finals nor would they ever be top 4 for an entire season in PER or carry a franchise as the only allstar to the playoff multiple times as the man like Bosh has.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 01:19 PM
I don't think Aldridge, Zbo, M.Gasol would outproduce Lebron in the finals nor would they ever be top 4 for an entire season in PER or carry a franchise as the only allstar to the playoff multiple times as the man like Bosh has.

This

Baller1
11-29-2012, 01:54 PM
how do you not have an inner dog against LBJ? he's your boys main competition, the only thing between KD being the best player in the NBA, and the reason the Thunder aren't champions. your respect for him is commendable considering who you root for, but you root for him to lose- right?

only root for him to lose against OKC type thing? i've accepted his greatness, but I still root against him without remorse.

It's more of a root for him unless he's playing OKC type of thing. But at the same time, it doesn't bother me all that much when OKC loses anymore because I'm just waiting for the Sonics to be back. So while I look for the Thunder to be successful right now, it's mainly just because I want Durant to reach all-time greatness.

And I want Lebron to continue to do the same. And considering they'll be meeting in the Finals probably a few more times, it becomes a win-win for me.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 03:00 PM
I didnt say Lebron didnt have any good playoff games man.. lol.. I meant that he didnt have many great games that make people legends in this game... Jordans flu game, Magic starting game 7 as a rookie at center, etc. Thats all im saying. I know you Lebron guys try and go out your way to make Lebron look like some sort of greek god that has no flaws and can play 5 on 1 and win by 15, but sorry, he cant...

Thats my point though, those 2 games are already great playoff games. Can you answer my question about naming me Kobe's playoff performances better than those 2 games? My point is that I disagree with what your saying, Lebron already has a couple huge moments in the playoffs that match up to an all time great in Kobe. You keep saying his greatest playoff performances lack but do they really? If they do a top ten player all time like kobe would clearly have more dominating/important games in the playoffs, and I don't really see that.

RaiderLakersA's
11-29-2012, 03:06 PM
My opinion hasn't changed.

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 03:13 PM
Thats my point though, those 2 games are already great playoff games. Can you answer my question about naming me Kobe's playoff performances better than those 2 games? My point is that I disagree with what your saying, Lebron already has a couple huge moments in the playoffs that match up to an all time great in Kobe. You keep saying his greatest playoff performances lack but do they really? If they do a top ten player all time like kobe would clearly have more dominating/important games in the playoffs, and I don't really see that.

LeBron's playoff play in general isn't lacking when speaking of the most elite of all time. He simply had crap teammates his first 5 trips, failed once with his current cast, and then ran off a season better than anyone has since Jordan this past year.

But, you will continue to run into people who measure individuals with rings alone, while casting aside all the context.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 03:20 PM
Thats my point though, those 2 games are already great playoff games. Can you answer my question about naming me Kobe's playoff performances better than those 2 games? My point is that I disagree with what your saying, Lebron already has a couple huge moments in the playoffs that match up to an all time great in Kobe. You keep saying his greatest playoff performances lack but do they really? If they do a top ten player all time like kobe would clearly have more dominating/important games in the playoffs, and I don't really see that.

Again, I see your point and understand what your saying but im not interested in making this a tit for tat, Kobe v. Lebron thing. Im sure I can name some performances by Kobe that I believe to be great but I can almost guarentee you will dismiss them or say that Lebron's were better. Thats not a stab at you, but thats the direction of this conversation. Like I said, Lebron in game 6 of last years playoffs was one of the greatest things ive ever seen from a ball player. But it was because he single handedly put the team on his back, played selfish, and was dominate. He's put up great numbers in the playoffs no doubt, but i dont see him scoring the last 10 points for his team or something like that..

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 03:25 PM
LeBron's playoff play in general isn't lacking when speaking of the most elite of all time. He simply had crap teammates his first 5 trips, failed once with his current cast, and then ran off a season better than anyone has since Jordan this past year.

But, you will continue to run into people who measure individuals with rings alone, while casting aside all the context.

Again, making an excuse for a guy who was on a 60 win TEAM, that his TEAM was crappy is ridiculous. This is why people like me put weight in rings. Because yes, it is a team sport, but in certain situations you have to become dominate. You have to carry your team to victory. You cant always blame Lebrons teamates for him not winning. It shows a lack of leadership imo. Dirk has always had great teams that underperformed in the in the playoffs. Thats a leadership thing to me. Wade took the Heat on his back in 06' and made sure they didnt lose, thats greatness. Kobe nor Lebron has had anything close to what Wade did in the finals. Thats what im talking about. If you guys still dont get it then I cant really explain it any further.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 03:35 PM
LeBron's playoff play in general isn't lacking when speaking of the most elite of all time. He simply had crap teammates his first 5 trips, failed once with his current cast, and then ran off a season better than anyone has since Jordan this past year.

But, you will continue to run into people who measure individuals with rings alone, while casting aside all the context.

The bold gets really frustrating, usually have to just ignore people when that's all they are willing to talk about. In this case though he is questioning Lebron's best playoff performances as if they don't match up to great players. I just don't see that at all, as the detroit game 5 in 2007 and celtics game from last year were amazing performances. He wont answer me of which Kobe's performances are so much better though (I dont think there are any) so clearly his best performances aren't lacking at this point in his career.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 03:39 PM
The bold gets really frustrating, usually have to just ignore people when that's all they are willing to talk about. In this case though he is questioning Lebron's best playoff performances as if they don't match up to great players. I just don't see that at all, as the detroit game 5 in 2007 and celtics game from last year were amazing performances. He wont answer me of which Kobe's performances are so much better though (I dont think there are any) so clearly his best performances aren't lacking at this point in his career.

Come on man, im trying to have a decent convo with you and your just showing me why I cant on this site and type a lot of bs. We arent talking about Kobe, if i were a Hawks fan you wouldnt be asking me about Kobe. We are talking about Lebron.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 03:42 PM
Again, I see your point and understand what your saying but im not interested in making this a tit for tat, Kobe v. Lebron thing. Im sure I can name some performances by Kobe that I believe to be great but I can almost guarentee you will dismiss them or say that Lebron's were better. Thats not a stab at you, but thats the direction of this conversation. Like I said, Lebron in game 6 of last years playoffs was one of the greatest things ive ever seen from a ball player. But it was because he single handedly put the team on his back, played selfish, and was dominate. He's put up great numbers in the playoffs no doubt, but i dont see him scoring the last 10 points for his team or something like that..

Game 5 vs detroit 2007, he scored 29 of final 30 points for his team. Imo the best game for Kobe in the playoffs was vs the Kings in 01 and he had like 49 points. It was a great game no doubt and he killed it but that moment doesnt match up to a game 6 when your team could get eliminated or scoring 29-30. I just don't understand calling out LBJ's best playoff performances because they match up to or exceed most players.

Ebbs
11-29-2012, 03:45 PM
Since like that issue of slam way back when where they talked about him and Sebastain Telfair being the future of the NBA I have loved the guy. I thought he could have handled things better at various points in his career; but I have always supported him. I have also believed since like ay 1 he was the leagues best player.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 03:46 PM
Come on man, im trying to have a decent convo with you and your just showing me why I cant on this site and type a lot of bs. We arent talking about Kobe, if i were a Hawks fan you wouldnt be asking me about Kobe. We are talking about Lebron.

Alright, I'll stop bringing him up but I chose Kobe because its who I always see you defend. My point should be stronger to you if I can show you how an all-time great that you respect doesn't have much better performances. We could go other players like Duncan as well? I just think there are few players (magic, Jordan, Shaq) who have much more dominating performances.


EDIT: I just found an espn article ranking playoff performances. Its ESPN and for sure not an absolute truth or anything but Lebron cracks their top 10 performances twice. I'm not sure I really agree where each is at but there is no doubt these games match some of those other performances. http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2012/story/_/id/8068148/nba-playoffs-top-25-performances-ever

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 03:57 PM
The bold gets really frustrating, usually have to just ignore people when that's all they are willing to talk about. In this case though he is questioning Lebron's best playoff performances as if they don't match up to great players. I just don't see that at all, as the detroit game 5 in 2007 and celtics game from last year were amazing performances. He wont answer me of which Kobe's performances are so much better though (I dont think there are any) so clearly his best performances aren't lacking at this point in his career.

LeBron's playoff play, career wise, is individually stronger than Kobe's. There really isn't much of a debate regarding that. Fortunately for Kobe, he routinely had championship help on his roster, so he has far greater career moments, relative to team success.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 03:59 PM
LeBron's playoff play, career wise, is individually stronger than Kobe's. There really isn't much of a debate regarding that. Fortunately for Kobe, he routinely had championship help on his roster, so he has far greater career moments, relative to team success.

I hope your just talking about numbers

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 04:02 PM
Alright, I'll stop bringing him up but I chose Kobe because its who I always see you defend. My point should be stronger to you if I can show you how an all-time great that you respect doesn't have much better performances. We could go other players like Duncan as well? I just think there are few players (magic, Jordan, Shaq) who have much more dominating performances.


EDIT: I just found an espn article ranking playoff performances. Its ESPN and for sure not an absolute truth or anything but Lebron cracks their top 10 performances twice. I'm not sure I really agree where each is at but there is no doubt these games match some of those other performances. http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2012/story/_/id/8068148/nba-playoffs-top-25-performances-ever

Man on another note, you see how many times Jordan was in there? Thats just amazing to me. But i feel you on Lebron. And i hate to sound like a Kobe homer again, but what about the Denver series a few years ago when Kobe was just obliterating them. And the Phoenix series a couple years ago when Kobe destroyed them. And the countless times Kobe killed Bowen.. But I respect those Lebron games on there.

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 04:03 PM
Game 5 vs detroit 2007, he scored 29 of final 30 points for his team. Imo the best game for Kobe in the playoffs was vs the Kings in 01 and he had like 49 points. It was a great game no doubt and he killed it but that moment doesnt match up to a game 6 when your team could get eliminated or scoring 29-30. I just don't understand calling out LBJ's best playoff performances because they match up to or exceed most players.

well, since PSD is so short term memory, how about the elimination game against Boston this past year?

45-15-5, 19-26 from the field. Or maybe his triple double to close out the finals. Maybe the Detroit game where he scored 25 straight to close the game. Maybe game 4 against the Bulls in 10', when he went for 37-12-11.

I mean, to try and say LeBron hasn't had some epic games that match up to any of the top 10 players ever is laughable.

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 04:06 PM
well, since PSD is so short term memory, how about the elimination game against Boston this past year?

45-15-5, 19-26 from the field. Or maybe his triple double to close out the finals. Maybe the Detroit game where he scored 25 straight to close the game. Maybe game 4 against the Bulls in 10', when he went for 37-12-11.

I mean, to try and say LeBron hasn't had some epic games that match up to any of the top 10 players ever is laughable.

Dude i honestly dont think you read any of my posts and just automatically think im hating on Lebron and loving Kobe. I mentioned Celtic game 6 from last year and called it one of the greatest games ive ever seen.

TheIlladelph16
11-29-2012, 04:12 PM
Good post man, good to see a poster who doesn't try and belittle or condescend someone who doesn't agree with them.

I wasn't trying to compare the game of the three players, just the dominance of them. Grant was amazing to watch and had no real physical advantages over any other player in the league, much like Jordan, He was just GOOD. I also think Lebron is a very talented player, but I think a lot of that has to do with how dominate physically he is, much like Shaq. And that's not a knock on Lebron at all. But the intangibles that I see in wade are just better. Just watching them play. I guess Wade's game looks a lot more smooth than Lebrons. Wade doesn't have the physical attributes that Lebron has and has to rely more on pure basketball skills. I obviously don't have any numbers to back that claim up, it's just what my eyes see.

Sorry took me a while to get back to this thread, but I saw where it was going and kind of stepped out for a while haha. The Kobe v. Lebron thing just never ends well here.

I think the intangibles argument is debatable in terms of Wade vs. Lebron honestly. Both of them have phenomenal intangibles, so I find it difficult to decipher which one's are "better". To me, Wade may look smoother doing the things he does, but that is also a byproduct of the way Lebron is built. Lebron might be the most physically gifted athlete ever in the NBA, but when you are that big compared to a guy like Wade, doing the same things in the same manner are just naturally more difficult and will not look as smooth.

My biggest issue with your position on Lebron is your assertion that saying his teammates were crap is an excuse for why he was never able to get them over the top. Where you see an excuse, I see context. His best players he ever played with on Cleveland were an assortment of Big Z, Shaq, Jamison, and Mo Williams at different times. Those players were either simply role players or aging, past their prime guys who were not going to be a second man on a championship caliber team. Those 60+ wins were a direct result of having Lebron wreaking havoc all season (see: season after he left), but the playoffs are a totally different animal. The last 20 or so years have proven that you need more than one star or an incredibly deep team like the Pistons or Mavs to win it all. Teams like those two have been an exception to the rule, not a trend.

When you think about it, aren't all reasons for a season's result excuses? Doesn't the same apply vice versa?


Are you really trying to argue that the definition of a superstar is limited to being a top 7 player???

To me the term "Superstar" is thrown around entirely too often. Considering its a term that has no statistical backing and is applied at random, it loses meaning when you say players like Bosh are Superstars. To me, there are 3-5 Superstars in the NBA, with the other great players like Bosh just being stars. Really its an argument of semantics at a certain point.

Its like the debate whether or not Eli Manning is "Elite" in the NFL. Another word thrown around with no universal standard for what qualifies a player for that term. To me, Eli Manning IS the Elite debate. All QBs better than him are Elite and all QBs worse than him are not, which leaves him to debate about. My question is: Who is that player in the NBA? Who is the one player that is so firmly entrenched in that debate that he basically defines who is and who is not a Superstar.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 04:17 PM
Man on another note, you see how many times Jordan was in there? Thats just amazing to me. But i feel you on Lebron. And i hate to sound like a Kobe homer again, but what about the Denver series a few years ago when Kobe was just obliterating them. And the Phoenix series a couple years ago when Kobe destroyed them. And the countless times Kobe killed Bowen.. But I respect those Lebron games on there.

Jordan was just insane, so many amazing performances (I just counted and see him 8 times I think). 8/25 best playoff performances owned by one guy, pretty spectacular. Also my point was never to say Kobe isnt a great playoff performer, just show how spectacular those individual games were. Kobe has destroyed some teams throughout a series no doubt. I also remember a game vs denver where he almost scored 50 and maybe that one was better than the Sac game i mentioned? Not sure but the Sac one sticks out more in my mind.

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 04:26 PM
well, since PSD is so short term memory, how about the elimination game against Boston this past year?

45-15-5, 19-26 from the field. Or maybe his triple double to close out the finals. Maybe the Detroit game where he scored 25 straight to close the game. Maybe game 4 against the Bulls in 10', when he went for 37-12-11.

I mean, to try and say LeBron hasn't had some epic games that match up to any of the top 10 players ever is laughable.

That Boston game was insane to me just because of the ridiculous jumpers that were going in for him. I'm used to yelling NO when he just settles for long jumpers but that game he was on with every shot. Haha I actually already kinda forgot he ended the finals with a triple double.

Bruno
11-29-2012, 05:28 PM
It's more of a root for him unless he's playing OKC type of thing. But at the same time, it doesn't bother me all that much when OKC loses anymore because I'm just waiting for the Sonics to be back. So while I look for the Thunder to be successful right now, it's mainly just because I want Durant to reach all-time greatness.

And I want Lebron to continue to do the same. And considering they'll be meeting in the Finals probably a few more times, it becomes a win-win for me.

good stuff. i forget how complicated rooting for OKC is for you.

popo85
11-29-2012, 05:31 PM
Soon as i got league pass 08-09' it changed, got to see the best player in the game on a daily basis.

Baller1
11-29-2012, 05:33 PM
good stuff. i forget how complicated rooting for OKC is for you.

It's quite the inner-struggle, haha. At this point, I'd say I'm more of a Durant fan than an OKC fan... Too much of an NBA fan to not haw a team thought so, that's where rooting for OKC comes into play. Love the players, hate the team. So I settle for a middle ground.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 06:27 PM
I don't think Aldridge, Zbo, M.Gasol would outproduce Lebron in the finals nor would they ever be top 4 for an entire season in PER or carry a franchise as the only allstar to the playoff multiple times as the man like Bosh has.

of course they would anybody would have been able to out produce lebron that series he played like ****. didn't jason terry even play better?

also please im a die hard raptors fan don't bring that **** bosh didn't carry **** he gave us 3 playoff wins one season above .500 and than faked an injury after he found out he was going to miami.




Bynum isnt a superstar, Pau is imo. Im not like you Leboners who try and make Kobe look like a created player on 2k.



And im more paranoid of Kevin Durant pasing kobe than Lebron

neither of them are superstars lol your last sentence just confirms your paranoia.


#KingjamesSurpassesKobe

Money_23
11-29-2012, 06:33 PM
a "Raps fan" who happens to ride Lebron with one of the worst homerisms I've seen on this site.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 06:35 PM
you're funny bro should i bandwaggon the heat like you did the lakers huh kobe fan? lolz

Money_23
11-29-2012, 06:38 PM
you're funny bro should i bandwaggon the heat like you did the lakers huh kobe fan? lolz

Lebron's my favorite player right now but I don't run around d1ckriding him like you do. Cut the crap. I call it like it is without bias.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 06:43 PM
Lebron's my favorite player right now but I don't run around d1ckriding him like you do. Cut the crap. I call it like it is without bias.

our argument was just about bosh being a superstar or not why don't you go attack those saying lebron is overrated huh? nice try there kobe fan:rolleyes:

Money_23
11-29-2012, 06:50 PM
our argument was just about bosh being a superstar or not why don't you go attack those saying lebron is overrated huh? nice try there kobe fan:rolleyes:

1. I think we are already way past that discussion (2 pages ago) since you just went ape-***** calling out Bosh for faking injuries.
2. I didn't see anyone call him overrated.
3. Anyone can be overrated if people continue to give them credit for what they don't have
4. I'm still right about your d1ckriding. You are doing it. Prime example: calling someone a kobe fan because they don't agree with what you are saying in regards to Lebron. Notice how you didn't call me that when we had the Bosh conversation, but when I called you out on Lebron you immediately went that direction.

dh144498
11-29-2012, 06:53 PM
1. I think we are already way past that discussion (2 pages ago) since you just went ape-***** calling out Bosh for faking injuries.
2. I didn't see anyone call him overrated.
3. Anyone can be overrated if people continue to give them credit for what they don't have
4. I'm still right about your d1ckriding. You are doing it. Prime example: calling someone a kobe fan because they don't agree with what you are saying in regards to Lebron. Notice how you didn't call me that when we had the Bosh conversation, but when I called you out on Lebron you immediately went that direction.

LOL bucketss getting destroyed.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 06:55 PM
1. I think we are already way past that discussion (2 pages ago) since you just went ape-***** calling out Bosh for faking injuries.
2. I didn't see anyone call him overrated.
3. Anyone can be overrated if people continue to give them credit for what they don't have
4. I'm still right about your d1ckriding. You are doing it. Prime example: calling someone a kobe fan because they don't agree with what you are saying in regards to Lebron. Notice how you didn't call me that when we had the Bosh conversation, but when I called you out on Lebron you immediately went that direction.

bro i just went through your post don't say you're not a kobe fan because almost all your post are about defending him i went through all 5 pages of your posts.

tapajafri
11-29-2012, 06:57 PM
i really respect lebron for the way he handled everything. the decision may not have been the best choice, but i also think the media blew it way out of proportion. the way he's handled the criticism and bounced back is admirable

tapajafri
11-29-2012, 06:58 PM
jordan is arguably more athletic than lebron, jordan ran a 4.3 and had a higher vertical than lebron.

this is insane..... there's no way jordan is arguably more athletic than lebron


if you're gonna give lebron 1/2 a ring than take away kobes two rigged rings in 2002 and 2010

but this....this is true. good rebuttal.

bucketss
11-29-2012, 07:03 PM
this is insane..... there's no way jordan is arguably more athletic than lebron



but this....this is true. good rebuttal.

thats what i thought too than someone explained it to me i'll look for the website that explained it very well.

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 07:07 PM
That Boston game was insane to me just because of the ridiculous jumpers that were going in for him. I'm used to yelling NO when he just settles for long jumpers but that game he was on with every shot. Haha I actually already kinda forgot he ended the finals with a triple double.

Another interesting tidbit. How many times does LeBron's team win a series if he doesn't play lights out? Furthermore, how many games has LeBron's team won in the playoffs when he doesn't play well? The same can not be said of Kobe. The Lakers have won plenty of games where he was just not very good.

HouRealCoach
11-29-2012, 07:10 PM
I didnt say Lebron didnt have any good playoff games man.. lol.. I meant that he didnt have many great games that make people legends in this game... Jordans flu game, Magic starting game 7 as a rookie at center, etc. Thats all im saying. I know you Lebron guys try and go out your way to make Lebron look like some sort of greek god that has no flaws and can play 5 on 1 and win by 15, but sorry, he cant...

Kobe didn't have any moments to that degree lol

EDIT: Unless you count throwing that alley to Shaq in 2000 WCF

bucketss
11-29-2012, 07:13 PM
Kobe didn't have any of those moments lol

lol im telling you haha. last time he said iverson is better than wade even though wade has two rings because WADE NEVER LET A TEAM of NOBODIES TO THE FINALS. haha i couldn't stop laughing

HouRealCoach
11-29-2012, 07:24 PM
lol im telling you haha. last time he said iverson is better than wade even though wade has two rings because WADE NEVER LET A TEAM of NOBODIES TO THE FINALS. haha i couldn't stop laughing

Been there done that lol... They bring up that one year but never mention his years in Denver & Detroit or the year with C-Webb lol & LeBron has at least 3 games that will forever be remembered

PatriotsGirl
11-29-2012, 07:44 PM
I still love Lebron regardless, but I can see how a case can be made for Kobe. They're both fantastic players.

Jesse2272
11-29-2012, 07:48 PM
Another interesting tidbit. How many times does LeBron's team win a series if he doesn't play lights out? Furthermore, how many games has LeBron's team won in the playoffs when he doesn't play well? The same can not be said of Kobe. The Lakers have won plenty of games where he was just not very good.

This is straight for the llulz

you left it out there

Kobe hater :laugh:

Hawkeye15
11-29-2012, 07:50 PM
This is straight for the llulz

you left it out there

Kobe hater :laugh:

The Lakers won a finals when a young Kobe missed everything and went for 15 a night. He was given finals MVP after he shot 6-22.

These are facts. LeBron's team, even the Heat, are not winning unless he plays lights out. These are the negatives of not being drafted into a contender, and a great franchise, and then going to a team that is 3 strong and you are easily its best player.

Instead of llulz, why not try and prove my statement false?

Jesse2272
11-29-2012, 07:52 PM
The Lakers won a finals when a young Kobe missed everything and went for 15 a night. He was given finals MVP after he shot 6-22.

These are facts. LeBron's team, even the Heat, are not winning unless he plays lights out. These are the negatives of not being drafted into a contender, and a great franchise, and then going to a team that is 3 strong and you are easily its best player.

Instead of llulz, why not try and prove my statement false?

I wasnt trying my dude

your my favorite poster

just giving you ****

nickdymez
11-29-2012, 07:56 PM
The Lakers won a finals when a young Kobe missed everything and went for 15 a night. He was given finals MVP after he shot 6-22.

These are facts. LeBron's team, even the Heat, are not winning unless he plays lights out. These are the negatives of not being drafted into a contender, and a great franchise, and then going to a team that is 3 strong and you are easily its best player.

Instead of llulz, why not try and prove my statement false?

So since Kobe went 6-22 in game 7, the other games dont count? I see..

mngopher35
11-29-2012, 08:34 PM
Another interesting tidbit. How many times does LeBron's team win a series if he doesn't play lights out? Furthermore, how many games has LeBron's team won in the playoffs when he doesn't play well? The same can not be said of Kobe. The Lakers have won plenty of games where he was just not very good.

This is definitely something that I've noticed. It makes sense though because Kobe has been on more contending teams, which is why he also has more rings. Obviously because of this Lebron has meant more individually to his teams. It will be interesting to see how Miami in post season games he doesn't play great. Last year we didn't really get the chance to see and in 2011 they couldn't win vs dallas but he was really bad that series not just a couple of stinkers. I think it will probably stay pretty true though as Lebron does a lot for Mia (facilitate, score, defend, rebound)

tapajafri
11-29-2012, 09:00 PM
So since Kobe went 6-22 in game 7, the other games dont count? I see..

that one game shouldn't take away from his legacy or anything like that. however, gasol was more deserving of finals MVP that series. I know gasol struggled in some games just like kobe, but gasol was more valuable from a team standpoint that series. they worked the offense through him. He made great decisions at the high post, both scoring the ball and setting up open shooters like fisher and kobe. He was incredibly productive that series and was surprisingly really productive on the defense and glass. He took full advantage of Perkins injury in game 7 and played even bigger down the stretch.