PDA

View Full Version : Who would have had the greatest career??



DreamShaker
11-02-2012, 06:40 PM
Injuries are a part of the game. Tragically, so are drugs, untimely deaths, and other factors that shorten and hinder NBA careers. Some people have been top-5 players in the NBA, considered sure-fire HOFers, and then had their careers cut short for various reasons. Even guys like Magic and Bird had things happen to shorten their careers or primes. But I'm going to focus on the guys that never reached that level. Out of these guys...who would you speculate would have had the greatest careers?

Greg Oden
Jay Williams
Len Bias
Yao Ming
Penny Hardaway
Grant Hill
Ralph Sampson
Jamal Mashburn
Drazen Petrovic
Tracy McGrady

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 06:49 PM
really tough question. I am going Penny here, but there can be a case made for a few others for sure. The guys who never played an NBA minute like Bias get no consideration from me.

b@llhog24
11-02-2012, 06:49 PM
Between Yao, Tmac and Penny.

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 06:51 PM
Between Yao, Tmac and Penny.

Hill is with them too. He was a top 15 all time player possibly before his feet took his game. The mere fact that he is still starting caliber at age 50 is amazing.

b@llhog24
11-02-2012, 06:54 PM
Hill is with them too. He was a top 15 all time player possibly before his feet took his game. The mere fact that he is still starting caliber at age 50 is amazing.

Not saying I disagree, just doesn't rub me the same way.

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 06:56 PM
Not saying I disagree, just doesn't rub me the same way.

I hear ya and that is why I voted Penny. It may have something to do with me being roughly 20 when he was killing it, but I LOVED his game, and just thought he was the next Magic, but with stronger scoring ability.

Supreme LA
11-02-2012, 06:56 PM
For me it's really between Yao and Grant Hill. Yao was amazingly skilled and Grant was a beast before his ankle injuries.

abe_froman
11-02-2012, 06:57 PM
hill.averaged something like 21/8/6 on 47% during his time in det.the guy was an all around beast during the first part of his career,followed by tmac and yao

he also made probably my fav sports commercial of all time to

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 06:58 PM
If I see anyone pick Mashburn, I am going to puke. He was the Michael Beasley of the NBA back then.

b@llhog24
11-02-2012, 07:00 PM
I hear ya and that is why I voted Penny. It may have something to do with me being roughly 20 when he was killing it, but I LOVED his game, and just thought he was the next Magic, but with stronger scoring ability.

This was it.

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 07:04 PM
This was it.

You know, I try and remember how emotionally swayed we were as young men when it comes to literally everything, sports included, when I am on this site. Most of the NBA forum is people from age 17-25, which is easily the age where athletes are idols, and bias is at its complete height.

You may be right. In my opinion, nobody can touch Jordan. I was 9 when he came in, 14-23 when he was dominating, so my emotional attachment to that era is something not easily replicated by modern day players. That being said, when you get into your 30's and the hormones are not taking over anymore, you become calmer, more rational, and put all the emotions aside when talking about your favorite players. Or at least you do a better job of it.

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 07:04 PM
Deep Thoughts, by Hawkeye

KnicksorBust
11-02-2012, 07:10 PM
Grant Hill. He was the total package. Only Hill could get seriously injured season after season and still come back and be a quality starting role player. That's how high skill level was before the injuries.

KnicksorBust
11-02-2012, 07:11 PM
Between Yao, Tmac and Penny.

Maybe it's just me but I feel like we basically saw Yao and Tmac at their best... maybe they lost a few years at the end but they had an extended prime. Orlando Penny is not a bad choice.

jayjay33
11-02-2012, 07:13 PM
It's really a tie... It's they were both healthy grant and mac on the same teams would have been all-time great.

Bravo95
11-02-2012, 07:15 PM
Tough call between Penny, Grant, and Yao.

StarvingKnick22
11-02-2012, 07:19 PM
Lets face it T-Mac wouldnt have every taken the Rockets too far. My vote goes to Hardaway.

JordansBulls
11-02-2012, 07:20 PM
Penny/Hill/Tmac

alexander_37
11-02-2012, 07:23 PM
Tmac easily IMO. Bring Orlando Tmac to Houston that's scary.

Chronz
11-02-2012, 07:41 PM
Maybe it's just me but I feel like we basically saw Yao and Tmac at their best... maybe they lost a few years at the end but they had an extended prime. Orlando Penny is not a bad choice.

But they played their best at separate points in their careers

KnicksorBust
11-02-2012, 07:50 PM
But they played their best at separate points in their careers

Wouldn't that be a different question though? :confused:

Which duo would have had more success in their primes:

T-Mac/Yao
Ewing/King
VC/Bosh
etc.

Hawkeye15
11-02-2012, 07:51 PM
But they played their best at separate points in their careers

sure, but do they belong on a list with Penny, or Hill?

Lakers + Giants
11-02-2012, 07:52 PM
Grant Hill.

Raps18-19 Champ
11-02-2012, 07:54 PM
1. Grant Hill
2. Tracy McGrady
3. Yao Ming

jericho
11-02-2012, 09:07 PM
Wouldn't that be a different question though? :confused:

Which duo would have had more success in their primes:

T-Mac/Yao
Ewing/King
VC/Bosh
etc.

i think
hill/t-mac win it

i voted for tmac but this is a hard question to answer cuz hill was really good back in his pistons day b4 kobe there was hill as the talks of jordans successor

NBAfan4life
11-02-2012, 09:43 PM
I voted Hill, but I could of easily voted for Tmac or Penny. Yao doesn't get any love for me because even if he was healthy what would he of been top 20 center all time? Hill could of eventually been considered one of the greatest Sf to ever play.

DreamShaker
11-03-2012, 12:35 AM
Does anyone remember the interview where a hoping-to-return Penny was asked by John Thompson if he was a hypercondriac? Lol. I loved Penny, though. I thought him and Shaq would be the duo of the future. I was sad to see things go badly for him.

Swashcuff
11-03-2012, 12:40 AM
Between Penny and Hill for me. For basically the same reasoning as KoB and Hawk.

JasonJohnHorn
11-03-2012, 01:47 AM
This is interesting. I went with Grant Hill, only because I saw him reach his prime and he was such a great all-around player, and he had the right attitude. He would have been on a par with Magic and Bird had he stayed healthy.

Ralph Sampson would have been a good choice, but something tells me his game was already at its peak. Bias, it would have been nice to see him play in the NBA

As to the others. Petrovic I think reached his potential and I don't think he would have been elite. He was a cardboard cut out on defence to be frank, but he certainly would have been remembered as one of the best shooters of all time.

Yao, I think we saw him play at his max potential, and for me, he just wasn't dominant enough.

McGrady, I think also played to his max and I think his game was on the decline before his injuries started.

Greg Oden, when healthy, was very foul prone. I think he would have been a double-double guy who was a great post defender, but I don't think he would have even had a career as good as Mutumbo.

Jay Williams: This is tough. Obvioulsy his FG% was way too low... but he was a rookie. He had some real potential, but I don't think he would have ever been on the level of CP3 or Thomas.

Penny Hardaway: He is a legit answer here. He was a very special player. I think on a par with Grant Hill

Jamal Mashburn: He was on his way to being something special. Great all-around player too...

DreamShaker
11-03-2012, 02:43 AM
This is interesting. I went with Grant Hill, only because I saw him reach his prime and he was such a great all-around player, and he had the right attitude. He would have been on a par with Magic and Bird had he stayed healthy.

Ralph Sampson would have been a good choice, but something tells me his game was already at its peak. Bias, it would have been nice to see him play in the NBA

As to the other. Petrovic I think reached his potential and I don't think he would have been elite. He was a cardboard cut out on defence to be frank, but he certainly would have been remembered as one of the best shooters of all time.

Yao, I think we saw him play at his max potential, and for me, he just wasn't dominant enough.

McGrady, I think also played to his max and I think he game was on the decline before his injuries starts.

Greg Oden, when healthy, was very foul prone. I think he would have been a double-double guy who was a great post defender, but I don't even think he would have even had a career as good as Mutumbo.

Jay Williams: This is tough. Obvioulsy his FG% was way too low... but he was a rookie. He had some real potential, but I don't think he would have ever been on the level of CP3 or Thomas.

Penny Hardaway: He is a legit answer here. He was a very special player. I think on a par with Grant Hill

Jamal Mashburn: He was on his way to being something special. Great all-around player too...

Great post. My memory is a little cloudy sometimes about the 97-01 seasons. I was at a weird place personally, I guess. But it seems so many guys who were young stars around that time ended up with interupted careers (Baker, Gugliotta were others).

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 02:54 AM
Grant Hill put up LBJ type numbers before injury.

topdog
11-03-2012, 03:47 AM
1. Hill: Looking at the player he is today after all he went through proves how great he was.
2. Bias: Lebron before Lebron. He dueled Jordan in NCAA and I'd imagine he'd have done the same in the NBA.
3. T-Mac: When I think of T-Mac; I think of Tyronne Lue, 40mpg, and 13 points in 1 minute.

Hellcrooner
11-03-2012, 03:52 AM
Sabonis.

A healthy sabonis would have been in the conversation for top 5 centers ever.

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 03:59 AM
Sabonis.

A healthy sabonis would have been in the conversation for top 5 centers ever.

Sabonis didnt enter the league soon enough. It wasnt his injuries that prevented his legacy, it was that he was 31 years old when he entered the league.

Hellcrooner
11-03-2012, 04:04 AM
Sabonis didnt enter the league soon enough. It wasnt his injuries that prevented his legacy, it was that he was 31 years old when he entered the league.


His injuries happened earlier, when he was still in europe trampling his career .


Btw, the reason why he took so long to join was because of the cold war and all the obstacles russia put to their players to go play abroad to a non communist countyr back in the day.

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 04:08 AM
His injuries happened earlier, when he was still in europe trampling his career .


Btw, the reason why he took so long to join was because of the cold war and all the obstacles russia put to their players to go play abroad to a non communist countyr back in the day.

A good story, still though, not the same story that is being discussed.

cbs9889
11-03-2012, 04:18 AM
i had to go with bias. i am the first person to say college doesn't mean anything but this guy had a freak body and athleticism for his time. not saying he was better than jordan in college but with the right coaching and opportunity i think he could have really been something

abe_froman
11-03-2012, 04:32 AM
Sabonis didnt enter the league soon enough. It wasnt his injuries that prevented his legacy, it was that he was 31 years old when he entered the league.

his body wasnt was it was,he had a series of injuries that made him half the man before coming into the league.so yes,injuries played a big part in him not fulfilling what he could have been(other being age).taking both into account and you really have to think what he could ave been

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 04:41 AM
his body wasnt was it was,he had a series of injuries that made him half the man before coming into the league.so yes,injuries played a big part in him not fulfilling what he could have been(other being age).taking both into account and you really have to think what he could ave been

true, but also true, is that he didnt enter the league until he was 31. His story is different than the others.

abe_froman
11-03-2012, 04:46 AM
true, but also true, is that he didnt enter the league until he was 31. His story is different than the others.

neither did len bias,the thread is only speculation on who could have had the greatest career if they got to have a full one.while different there's nothing that bars him from the discussion .hell if you want than think of his situation as what if he wasnt born into the ussr during the cold war and make that as why he never had a full career

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 04:48 AM
neither did len bias,the thread is only speculation on who could have had the greatest career if they got to have a full one.while different there's nothing that bars him from the discussion .hell if you want than think of his situation as what if he wasnt born into the ussr during the cold war and make that as why he never had a full career

Len Bias entered the league in his 30's?

abe_froman
11-03-2012, 04:51 AM
Len Bias entered the league in his 30's?

len bias didnt enter the league.this thread is more than just "cut short do injuries " ,read the op,the criteria is broader than that.so while sabonis is a different case as say a grant hill ,he's def in the conversation

so sabonis if he had a full career what would he have been?

Baller1
11-03-2012, 04:52 AM
I'm young so my vote might not mean as much, but I'll take T-Mac. He was scary ****ing good... Like top 10 all-time good.

jerellh528
11-03-2012, 04:54 AM
b roy lol

rockbottom2010
11-03-2012, 05:14 AM
i would say grant hill....he missed like 2 to 3 seasons...and probably penny

PurpleJesus
11-03-2012, 05:15 AM
Grant Hill should dominate this thread...seriously...LBJ type numbers pre injury.

rockbottom2010
11-03-2012, 05:17 AM
this is one player alot of ppl never heard of...he would been the next celtic legend...reggie lewis....he died of heart complications
http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=reggie_lewis

stawka
11-03-2012, 06:57 AM
I've gotta go with Hill, a close second is Penny and closely followed by Yao. A real shame because these 3 were ****ing special. I didn't get to see Sampson or DP to judge them

DreamShaker
11-03-2012, 07:19 AM
this is one player alot of ppl never heard of...he would been the next celtic legend...reggie lewis....he died of heart complications
http://www.nba.com/historical/playerfile/index.html?player=reggie_lewis

I forgot about him! Mannnn I hate seeing people die young, but can you imagine how the Celtics felt? Two promising kids going so tragically in such a short time span?

About Sabonis....that is another guy with a lot of "what ifs". I personally think neither one of them would be at a Hill/Penny/McGrady level, but they belong in the discussion.

Raidaz4Life
11-03-2012, 07:27 AM
I say Hill but its funny that just two days ago I was sitting around wondering how great J-Will could have been. I always forget he even existed half the time.

theheatles
11-03-2012, 08:45 AM
NBA is the land of giants and Yao was the biggest giant with unreal skill for his size

jericho
11-03-2012, 10:24 AM
Grant Hill put up LBJ type numbers before injury.

Or LBJ is putting grant hill type of numbers b4 the injury lol

monty77
11-03-2012, 11:01 AM
I'm nba fan since 1999 so there are players who I didn't know as Len Bias, Ralph Sampson and Drazen Petrovic.

The other players I would formed two groups: a) Players who show how good they were in the NBA: Yao Ming, Hardaway, Hill, Mashburn and McGrady; b) Players who fell before show his potential: Jay Williams and Greg Oden.

We can compare players who belong to the same group. For example, in A group there are players like Yao Ming, Penny Hardaway and Tracy McGrady who reach superstar rank and probably they would be endured this level some years more although I think that Yao would be lost speed before others.

In my opinion, Mashburn and Grant Hill were (Hill still) great players who could reach allstar rank but anyway get the superstar level.

Inside B group I include only two players. Jay Williams, picked in 2nd position by Bulls maybe would have reach Conley or Felton level, who also are high pick but aren't top 5 PG in the NBA.

However, everybody thought that Greg Oden was destined to be one of the best centers in the league, but you never know... Eddy Curry, Thabeet, Swift, Olowakandi, Fizer, so on are top 5 too, and none of them have reach the level of superstar.

Career averages if they had remained healthy:

Greg Oden: 15-20pts; 10-12 rbs
Jay Williams: 12-17pts; 7-9asis
Yao Ming: 20-25pts; 10-12rbs
Penny Hardaway: 25-30pts
Grant Hill: 18-22pts
Jamal Mashburn: 15-20pts
Tracy McGrady: 25-30pts