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View Full Version : Will Harden trade turn into two 2013 lottery picks for the Thunder?



dsickich123
10-29-2012, 01:19 PM
I LOVE The Beard. But I do not think people are looking at the grander scheme of things when discussing the Harden trade.

I agree: In the short-term, the Thunder are worse.

But do me a favor, and look at this: Dismissing K-Mart, the Thunder still got a lottery pick (and one with high potential), PLUS two potential lottery picks next YEAR!

The thunder have received the first round picks from TORONTO and DALLAS in the 2013 draft! I think that we can all agree that Toronto is a lottery pick in an Eastern Conference that is even stronger than last year. But what about Dallas, I am curious who believes that Dallas will also miss the PLayoffs this season and be a lottery pick?

If so, consider this: The Thunder have Durant, Westbrook, and Ibaka in place for the long-term. They now have talented rookies in Perry Jones AND Jeremy Lamb. And possibly two potential lottery picks next year...DAAAANG!

Anyways, Wanted to post to see who believes this turns into two lottery picks for the 2013 draft?

OKC
10-29-2012, 01:23 PM
i believe the raptors pick would be 10-15 and the dallas pick 17-20

Im_in_Mia_bish
10-29-2012, 01:23 PM
dude. Dallas has collison, OJ mayo, brand, kaman, marion and dirk..

cmon man lol they obv will make the playoffs, thats not the lottery pick, toronto, is a toss up, ill assume that lowry wont make a diff and say that they are a lottery team..

Im_in_Mia_bish
10-29-2012, 01:23 PM
i believe the raptors pick would be 10-15 and the dallas pick 17-20

yup. my thoughts exactly.

torocan
10-29-2012, 01:27 PM
I LOVE The Beard. But I do not think people are looking at the grander scheme of things when discussing the Harden trade.

I agree: In the short-term, the Thunder are worse.

But do me a favor, and look at this: Dismissing K-Mart, the Thunder still got a lottery pick (and one with high potential), PLUS two potential lottery picks next YEAR!

The thunder have received the first round picks from TORONTO and DALLAS in the 2013 draft! I think that we can all agree that Toronto is a lottery pick in an Eastern Conference that is even stronger than last year. But what about Dallas, I am curious who believes that Dallas will also miss the PLayoffs this season and be a lottery pick?

If so, consider this: The Thunder have Durant, Westbrook, and Ibaka in place for the long-term. They now have talented rookies in Perry Jones AND Jeremy Lamb. And possibly two potential lottery picks next year...DAAAANG!

Anyways, Wanted to post to see who believes this turns into two lottery picks for the 2013 draft?

Let's see....

Dallas Pick

Top 20 protected. IF Dirk didn't have surgery, then OKC would most likely get the pick. However, Dallas is going to be off to a slow start with Dirk out for surgery for a month. They could easily be on the bubble or miss the playoffs entirely depending on how Dirk looks when he comes back. I wouldn't bet on this pick.

Toronto Pick

Top 4 protected AND Bottom 15-30 protected. Ok, so you're betting on the Raptors getting a pick between 5 and 14? Sorry to break it to you, but the Raptors are looking to be a very dangerous team this year. Last year they played very good defense in the second half of the year under Casey.

This year their team has improved, with their most dangerous assets being the triple threat PG combination of Lowry, Calderon AND John Lucas III. With Casey playing double PG lineups, they now have a Very dangerous scoring/playmaking mix and improved 3 point shooting.

Don't sleep on Toronto. I have them as my Dark horse team to sneak into the playoffs.

Charlotte Pick

2nd round pick, unprotected. Okay, OKC will get this one. They *might* be able to snag a good 2nd rounder since I expect Charlotte to be awful, MKG or not.

Summary

Don't expect too much out of the picks. They look better on paper than they probably will end up being. A few nice role players if you're lucky.

Sure, you can bet on a meltdown by Toronto, but I wouldn't.
And Dallas is a bit of a crapshoot.

Be happy with K-Mart and Lamb. Anything else is a bonus.

Swashcuff
10-29-2012, 01:30 PM
What are the protections on the picks?

Edit the guy above me answered my question. Yeah they were just as I thought.

Faabs89
10-29-2012, 01:34 PM
torocan, or anyone else, can you explain the pick protection? I'm not sure how it works

Htownballa1622
10-29-2012, 01:35 PM
Let's see....

Dallas Pick

Top 20 protected. IF Dirk didn't have surgery, then OKC would most likely get the pick. However, Dallas is going to be off to a slow start with Dirk out for surgery for a month. They could easily be on the bubble or miss the playoffs entirely depending on how Dirk looks when he comes back. I wouldn't bet on this pick.

Toronto Pick

Top 4 protected AND Bottom 15-30 protected. Ok, so you're betting on the Raptors getting a pick between 5 and 14? Sorry to break it to you, but the Raptors are looking to be a very dangerous team this year. Last year they played very good defense in the second half of the year under Casey.

This year their team has improved, with their most dangerous assets being the triple threat PG combination of Lowry, Calderon AND John Lucas III. With Casey playing double PG lineups, they now have a Very dangerous scoring/playmaking mix and improved 3 point shooting.

Don't sleep on Toronto. I have them as my Dark horse team to sneak into the playoffs.

Charlotte Pick

2nd round pick, unprotected. Okay, OKC will get this one. They *might* be able to snag a good 2nd rounder since I expect Charlotte to be awful, MKG or not.

Summary

Don't expect too much out of the picks. They look better on paper than they probably will end up being. A few nice role players if you're lucky.

Sure, you can bet on a meltdown by Toronto, but I wouldn't.
And Dallas is a bit of a crapshoot.

Be happy with K-Mart and Lamb. Anything else is a bonus.

once again. :clap:

dhopisthename
10-29-2012, 01:42 PM
so in other words the mavs pick can't be in the lotto and the raptors pick has to be lotto. question is which year do the thunder get the picks

torocan
10-29-2012, 01:43 PM
torocan, or anyone else, can you explain the pick protection? I'm not sure how it works

Pick protection means that if the Pick falls inside of the protected range, then the team retains the pick.

So let's say I give you a top 3 protected pick, if the lottery balls are drawn and I get the #1 pick, I keep it. If I get the #4 pick it goes to you.

In other words, Dallas' pick only helps OKC if Dallas gets picks #21-30.

Twins Fanatic
10-29-2012, 01:43 PM
dude. Dallas has collison, OJ mayo, brand, kaman, marion and dirk..

cmon man lol they obv will make the playoffs, thats not the lottery pick, toronto, is a toss up, ill assume that lowry wont make a diff and say that they are a lottery team..

Welcome to the west my friend, too many strong teams; Dirk is going to be out for at least a month, Kaman has always had injury issues, OJ is way to inconsistent, Collison's best year was his rookie and the rest of that team is pretty old. Not saying they won't make it, but this team is going to have a tough time down the stretch.

Faabs89
10-29-2012, 01:46 PM
Pick protection means that if the Pick falls inside of the protected range, then the team retains the pick.

So let's say I give you a top 3 protected pick, if the lottery balls are drawn and I get the #1 pick, I keep it. If I get the #4 pick it goes to you.

In other words, Dallas' pick only helps OKC if Dallas gets picks #21-30.

Ok so the Raps are protected top 4 and 21-30 so if they fall in the 1-4 or 21-30 range raps still get their pick. But 5-20 goes to OKC? Correct?

Thegame187
10-29-2012, 01:48 PM
The toronto pick is nice in that it gives you a draft pick some time (but that may not be this season), the Dallas pick may never happen and if it does, it is 20+ so it aint amazing. The picks are more a bonus than anything else (the Toronto one being a better bonus). Martin and Lamb for a contract you couldn't afford can be seen as the best option your team had in this situation. You managed to keep a scorer SG, and also added a very nice rookie to a team coming back from the finals

torocan
10-29-2012, 01:50 PM
Ok so the Raps are protected top 4 and 21-30 so if they fall in the 1-4 or 21-30 range raps still get their pick. But 5-20 goes to OKC? Correct?

Incorrect.

Raptors are protected 1-4 AND 15-30.
Dallas is protected 1-20.

The best picks you can get from Toronto are 5-14.
The best picks you can get off Dallas are 21-30.

Faabs89
10-29-2012, 01:51 PM
ok, thank you sir!

Hawkeye15
10-29-2012, 02:28 PM
I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Toronto picks falls in that 10-14 area this season. The Dallas pick won't be had this year, even with Dirk, I had them hovering around 15-17. I honestly think they miss the playoffs this year, meaning they keep it.

jcbetson
10-29-2012, 02:42 PM
Also, dont forget that martin is an expiring contract. I am willing to bet that okc will move him at the deadline for a pick or an injury based need.

KnicksorBust
10-29-2012, 02:45 PM
Incorrect.

Raptors are protected 1-4 AND 15-30.
Dallas is protected 1-20.

The best picks you can get from Toronto are 5-14.
The best picks you can get off Dallas are 21-30.

Thank you for the clarification. Same to the original poster.

I've always been a huge proponent than NBA draft picks are overrated. Outside of the top 5 it's a crapshoot. The overwhelming majority of star players are at the top of the draft boards. Just look at the best players in the league right now. Durant-LeBron-Howard-Love. To receive one lottery pick that will be around pick number 9 could easily be a complete bust. Martin is gone in a year. Lot of heat on Jeremy Lamb if you ask me.

Im_in_Mia_bish
10-29-2012, 04:18 PM
Welcome to the west my friend, too many strong teams; Dirk is going to be out for at least a month, Kaman has always had injury issues, OJ is way to inconsistent, Collison's best year was his rookie and the rest of that team is pretty old. Not saying they won't make it, but this team is going to have a tough time down the stretch.

true true.. would be interesting to see the mavs play this coming season

Raps08-09 Champ
10-29-2012, 04:21 PM
Toronto misses, Dallas makes.

Giraffes Rule
10-29-2012, 05:14 PM
Don't think they get the Dallas pick, but aren't they guaranteed to get a lotto pick from Toronto eventually with the way it's set up?

JordansBulls
10-29-2012, 08:44 PM
dude. Dallas has collison, OJ mayo, brand, kaman, marion and dirk..

cmon man lol they obv will make the playoffs, thats not the lottery pick, toronto, is a toss up, ill assume that lowry wont make a diff and say that they are a lottery team..
Pretty much.

LTBaByyy
10-29-2012, 08:57 PM
Mavs will make the playoffs every year until Dirk retires

One of 2 teams to make the playoffs 11 straight year (Spurs being the other team)

JasonJohnHorn
10-30-2012, 09:17 AM
I may be underestimating Dallas, but I said two picks. There is no way that TO is going to make the playoffs this season, most especially in that division! Dallas may prove me wrong. I may be underestimating their offseason moves. But they have a lot of new pieces, and admittedly some good ones, I'm just not sure if they will gell soon enough. Dallas is lucky that Love and Rubio will be missing the beginning of the season, otherwise I'd have Minny taking their spot in the post season, but they will have soem ground to make up once they are healthy.

mightybosstone
10-30-2012, 09:57 AM
:facepalm: Nothing has frustrated me more in the last few days then reading people who are completely overrating these picks because they're ignorant about the pick protection. The OP clearly failed. /thread

king4day
10-30-2012, 10:34 AM
I had heard it's not supposed to be a deep draft this year so if that's the case, the picks may not mean much.
I think both Toronto and Dallas will fight for playoff spots. As long as Dirk returns healthy, they'll find a way to make the postseason. Toronto I didn't follow this preseason so I can't speak to them.

Vinylman
10-30-2012, 10:40 AM
why is this still open... the premise of this thread is moot

the dallas pick can't be a lottery as it is protected to 20

PSD... where mindless threads spread like an STD

todu82
10-30-2012, 10:41 AM
Zero picks. I think both teams make the playoffs.

dee279
10-30-2012, 10:56 AM
The toronto pick is nice in that it gives you a draft pick some time (but that may not be this season), the Dallas pick may never happen and if it does, it is 20+ so it aint amazing. The picks are more a bonus than anything else (the Toronto one being a better bonus). Martin and Lamb for a contract you couldn't afford can be seen as the best option your team had in this situation. You managed to keep a scorer SG, and also added a very nice rookie to a team coming back from the finals

Time to change that Rockets lineup.

dalton749
10-30-2012, 11:01 AM
op is completely ignorant to everything going on. no idea of the protections on the picks and thinks everyone can assume toronto wont make playoffs lol. toronto was in tank mode last year, played most of the year without bargnani(they had zero offence) yet still improved their d to 12th in the league. they got blown out a grand total of 6 times last year and kept every game close even against the best of teams. with the addition of lowry, fields, valanciunas, lucas, and ross they will improve dramatically on offence to the middle of the pack, while gaining much better defensive players as well. the only thing that may keep them out of playoffs is losing divisional games in a tough atlantic