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View Full Version : Most Underrated Player of all time (not currently in the league.)



Ebbs
10-22-2012, 08:12 PM
They cannot be currently playing basketball. Anyone you feel never got paid their due who has officially hung it up.

theheatles
10-22-2012, 08:21 PM
non all stars? this is broad lets narrow it down...

Im_in_Mia_bish
10-22-2012, 08:21 PM
My homer pic: Bob Mcadoo
My unbiased pick: Dominique Wilkins

Ebbs
10-22-2012, 08:21 PM
It can be an all star if you feel he was an all star that should have been noted more publicly as a superstar.

theheatles
10-22-2012, 08:27 PM
Mitch Richmond comes to mind as being underrated

Andrew32
10-22-2012, 08:27 PM
Shaq.

He should be in everyones Top 5.

Most people don't fully appreciate just how incredible his career was especially from a performance standpoint.

StarvingKnick22
10-22-2012, 08:28 PM
John ****ing Stockton. Better than Magic. But no one agrees. :mad:

Ebbs
10-22-2012, 08:30 PM
John ****ing Stockton. Better than Magic. But no one agrees. :mad:

I don't see it. Magic was just physically to gifted to fall behind Stockton. Magic and LeBron are physical phenoms.

KnicksorBust
10-22-2012, 08:30 PM
PG - Kevin Johnson
SG - Sam Jones
SF - Bobby Jones
PF - Kevin McHale
C - Moses Malone

Honorable Mentions: Bill Walton, Mark Aguirre, Marques Johnson, Mitch Richmond, Dennis Johnson

likemystylez
10-22-2012, 08:31 PM
LOl stockton is a hall of famer despite never winning a championship. Magic carried his team through the finals as a rookie. Not saying stockton wasnt an amazing player- but hes a hall of famer- everyone knew how good he was.

likemystylez
10-22-2012, 08:33 PM
PG - Kevin Johnson
SG - Sam Jones
SF - Bobby Jones
PF - Kevin McHale
C - Moses Malone

Honorable Mentions: Bill Walton, Mark Aguirre, Marques Johnson, Mitch Richmond, Dennis Johnson

I would add robert parish, derick coleman, and terry cummings to the list

Hawkeye15
10-22-2012, 08:36 PM
Moses

Chronz
10-22-2012, 08:37 PM
D-Rob

P Harvy
10-22-2012, 08:37 PM
Sam Cassel

Slimsim
10-22-2012, 08:39 PM
David Robinson

PatsSoxKnicks
10-22-2012, 08:50 PM
PG - Kevin Johnson
SG - Sam Jones
SF - Bobby Jones
PF - Kevin McHale
C - Moses Malone

Honorable Mentions: Bill Walton, Mark Aguirre, Marques Johnson, Mitch Richmond, Dennis Johnson

Love the list, though I think you need to find some place in there for the Admiral. Too many people remember him as Hakeem's ***** and so he gets underrated quite a bit imo

b@llhog24
10-22-2012, 08:55 PM
D-Rob

That guy.

bagwell368
10-22-2012, 08:57 PM
PG - Kevin Johnson
SG - Sam Jones
SF - Bobby Jones
PF - Kevin McHale
C - Moses Malone

Honorable Mentions: Bill Walton, Mark Aguirre, Marques Johnson, Mitch Richmond, Dennis Johnson

Looks like my list, although Walton was not underrated. His fame exceeds what he did in the NBA. I don't like Aguirre that much either - rest are great.

I could add Mo Cheeks, Moncrief, Schremph

I can't believe anyone voted for Coleman or Dominique

Hawkeye15
10-22-2012, 08:58 PM
Looks like my list, although Walton was not underrated. His fame exceeds what he did in the NBA. I don't like Aguirre that much either - rest are great.

I could add Mo Cheeks, Moncrief, Schremph

I can't believe anyone voted for Coleman or Dominique

Detlef is another great answer man. Toney as well.

JordansBulls
10-22-2012, 08:58 PM
I'd say David Robinson and Willis Reed. http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=635088

Hawkeye15
10-22-2012, 08:59 PM
man, forgot about D-Rob. I hated him with a passion, but he gets lost in the all timers discussion.

Fly
10-22-2012, 08:59 PM
David Robinson

Ebbs
10-22-2012, 09:00 PM
man, forgot about D-Rob. I hated him with a passion, but he gets lost in the all timers discussion.

I might put him over Dr.J but how much further up that list an he really go?

pd7631
10-22-2012, 09:01 PM
Chris Webber

He's the most skilled big man I've ever witnessed. He was an unbelievable passer, had range out to the 3pt line, and could rebound with the best of them. I can't remember if he made it onto the PSD top 50 list, but he definitely belongs there IMO, and if it not for his injuries, I think he would be a top 35 player given his talent.

PurpleJesus
10-22-2012, 10:31 PM
Chris Webber

He's the most skilled big man I've ever witnessed. He was an unbelievable passer, had range out to the 3pt line, and could rebound with the best of them. I can't remember if he made it onto the PSD top 50 list, but he definitely belongs there IMO, and if it not for his injuries, I think he would be a top 35 player given his talent.

Thats a very good answer. He put up KG type numbers for a long time, yet, he doesnt get the type of recognition KG does.

PurpleJesus
10-22-2012, 10:32 PM
I am going to have to go with Jesus Shuttlesworth.

Andrew32
10-22-2012, 10:50 PM
Agree with Robinson and Willis being underrated.
I'd also add Walt Frazier.

I don't think Webber was underrated.
If anything I think he was overrated.

Talented but more flash then actual substance.
Gasol >>> Webber

Gasol is underrated.

airforceones25
10-22-2012, 11:11 PM
Elgin Baylor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jfmoUT6lXs

Chronz
10-22-2012, 11:18 PM
That guy.

Should be ranked ahead of Russell in my book

BuddhaMONK
10-22-2012, 11:19 PM
Pippen

PurpleJesus
10-22-2012, 11:25 PM
Grant Hill...you really can't over emphasize how great he was pre injury.

We are talking Lebron James type numbers. Had Grant not gotten injured, he is in discussion as the best all around player ever. Him and McGrady would have been unbelievable together in Orlando...man, I get sad talking about what should have been with Grant Hill.

PrettyBoyJ
10-22-2012, 11:38 PM
Chris Webber

He's the most skilled big man I've ever witnessed. He was an unbelievable passer, had range out to the 3pt line, and could rebound with the best of them. I can't remember if he made it onto the PSD top 50 list, but he definitely belongs there IMO, and if it not for his injuries, I think he would be a top 35 player given his talent.

Thats who I thought of..

PurpleJesus
10-22-2012, 11:52 PM
Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53

cg_la00
10-22-2012, 11:55 PM
pistol pete maravich. the guy was amazing

YouCan'tBeatLA
10-22-2012, 11:58 PM
John ****ing Stockton. Better than Magic. But no one agrees. :mad:

How is underrated when he's considered the 2nd best PG by many people? Sorry, but he's not even close to being better than Magic.

b@llhog24
10-23-2012, 12:06 AM
Should be ranked ahead of Russell in my book

Easily. He's in my personal top ten around 9-10 (I normally go back and forth between him and Chuck).


Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53

Ray Allen
Reggie Miller

PurpleJesus
10-23-2012, 12:13 AM
Easily. He's in my personal top ten around 9-10 (I normally go back and forth between him and Chuck).



Ray Allen
Reggie Miller

Reggie Miller yes, Ray Allen no...at least the site I am looking at, which has Ray's TS at .579, and efg at .529

I am glad you mentioned Miller though, I think this might be my first time looking at those numbers for him, and they are incredible.

Ebbs
10-23-2012, 12:19 AM
Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=hornaje01&y1=2000&p2=millere01&y2=2005&p3=allenra02&y3=2012&p4=ellisda01&y4=2000&p5=drexlcl01&y5=1998&p6=gervige01&y6=1986

guys that kind of fit.

Miller has a better TS%, Dale Ellis has a better EFG%.

PurpleJesus
10-23-2012, 12:23 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=hornaje01&y1=2000&p2=millere01&y2=2005&p3=allenra02&y3=2012&p4=ellisda01&y4=2000&p5=drexlcl01&y5=1998&p6=gervige01&y6=1986

guys that kind of fit.

Miller has a better TS%, Dale Ellis has a better EFG%.

Its crazy that he belongs with that type of company, yet, he never really gets recognized for how great a shooter he was like all those other guys...and its not like he was so efficient because he didnt shoot much. This is a career 17 point per game scorer.

TheSource
10-23-2012, 12:24 AM
Patrick Ewing? Not considered as great as he is probably because he was never able to get a championship.

shep33
10-23-2012, 12:39 AM
Mitch Richmond, Glen Rice, Mark Price, Chris Mullin... I really think Pippen is underrated as well

shep33
10-23-2012, 12:41 AM
Patrick Ewing and Chris Webber should be in there too.

Joe Dumars is anoher guy.

idrinkpepsi
10-23-2012, 12:50 AM
Webber.

Raph12
10-23-2012, 12:52 AM
My boy DRob... Dude is left off of most lists, but he was a complete beast in his prime.

The_Jamal
10-23-2012, 12:53 AM
Webb's a fantastic pick. He was right there talent wise with prime Dirk, KG, and Duncan, all widely considered top 5 PF's all time. Had he not gotten hurt in 03, 1. The Kings would have won a title and 2. He'd be talked about as a top 30 player of all time

b@llhog24
10-23-2012, 01:08 AM
Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53


Mitch Richmond, Glen Rice, Mark Price, Chris Mullin... I really think Pippen is underrated as well

Another guy.

Livefrom21Five
10-23-2012, 01:11 AM
Arvydas Sabonis

Ebbs
10-23-2012, 01:25 AM
Webb's a fantastic pick. He was right there talent wise with prime Dirk, KG, and Duncan, all widely considered top 5 PF's all time. Had he not gotten hurt in 03, 1. The Kings would have won a title and 2. He'd be talked about as a top 30 player of all time

Eh you're reaching a tad with hypotheticals. Although I agree he is a tad underrated he is clearly behind the top 5 PF's IMO.

Duncan 2 MVP's, 3 Finals MVP's: 9 all NBA first teams
Barkley 1 MVP: 5 all NBA first teams
Dirk 1 MVP, 1 Finals MVP: 4 all NBA first teams
Malone 2 MVP'S: 11 all NBA first teams
Garnett 1 MVP, 1 DPOY: 4 all NBA first teams

Webber (closest he came to MVP was 4th in 2001) 1 NBA all first team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=duncati01&y1=2012&p2=nowitdi01&y2=2012&p3=garneke01&y3=2012&p4=webbech01&y4=2008&p5=barklch01&y5=2000&p6=malonka01&y6=2004

WS/48: Barkley, Duncan, Dirk, Malone, KG, Webber
efg%: Barkley, Malone, Dirk, Duncan, KG, Webber
TS%: Barkley, Dirk, Malone, Duncan, KG, Webber

Although Webber played 200+ less games than the rest of them at this point he has half of the next closest guy in WS as well. 84-168.



Playoffs:
WS/48: Dirk, Duncan, Barkley, KG, Malone, Webber
efg%: Barkley, Duncan, Dirk, KG, Webber, Malone
TS%: Barkley, Dirk, Duncan, Malone, KG, Webber

You add in the fact that Duncan has multiple rings, KG won one as arguably the best player, and Dirk carried a team to a chip as an added factor.

Karl Malone, and Webber are the only two whose numbers don't improve in the post season as well.

After spending like 25 minutes thinking about this.

I rate them:

Duncan
Dirk
Barkley
Garnett
Malone
McHale
Pettit
Webber/P.Gasol/S.Kemp

ewing
10-23-2012, 01:27 AM
Ricky Pierce could flat score

ewing
10-23-2012, 01:29 AM
Detlef is another great answer man. Toney as well.


Detlef was actually the first guy i thought of

PocketKings
10-23-2012, 01:30 AM
Mark Madsen; he introduced the world to unprecedented dance moves that revolutionized the way dance would be seen on the television (where do you think all these dance shows came from -- > Mark Madsen) and is also a 2x champion. That is 2 more then Karl Malone, John Stockton, and Patrick Ewing have combined!
:speechless:

ewing
10-23-2012, 01:31 AM
Moses


You cant name a 3 time MVP. Seriously, i don't understand this thread.

ewing
10-23-2012, 01:43 AM
Anyone like Derek McKey? He was traded for Detlef.

Korman12
10-23-2012, 02:24 AM
Any Sixers fans say Andrew Toney?

Injuries destroyed what would have otherwise been a very stellar career.

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 04:06 AM
Marc Price

Alvin Robertson

Bobby Jones.

Kevin Mchale.

Nate Thurmond.

Thre you go a full starting five that would beat the crap out of the heat, the thunder and the lakers this year yet no one in psd would think it would happen.

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 04:10 AM
Eh you're reaching a tad with hypotheticals. Although I agree he is a tad underrated he is clearly behind the top 5 PF's IMO.

Duncan 2 MVP's, 3 Finals MVP's: 9 all NBA first teams
Barkley 1 MVP: 5 all NBA first teams
Dirk 1 MVP, 1 Finals MVP: 4 all NBA first teams
Malone 2 MVP'S: 11 all NBA first teams
Garnett 1 MVP, 1 DPOY: 4 all NBA first teams

Webber (closest he came to MVP was 4th in 2001) 1 NBA all first team.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=duncati01&y1=2012&p2=nowitdi01&y2=2012&p3=garneke01&y3=2012&p4=webbech01&y4=2008&p5=barklch01&y5=2000&p6=malonka01&y6=2004

WS/48: Barkley, Duncan, Dirk, Malone, KG, Webber
efg%: Barkley, Malone, Dirk, Duncan, KG, Webber
TS%: Barkley, Dirk, Malone, Duncan, KG, Webber

Although Webber played 200+ less games than the rest of them at this point he has half of the next closest guy in WS as well. 84-168.



Playoffs:
WS/48: Dirk, Duncan, Barkley, KG, Malone, Webber
efg%: Barkley, Duncan, Dirk, KG, Webber, Malone
TS%: Barkley, Dirk, Duncan, Malone, KG, Webber

You add in the fact that Duncan has multiple rings, KG won one as arguably the best player, and Dirk carried a team to a chip as an added factor.

Karl Malone, and Webber are the only two whose numbers don't improve in the post season as well.

After spending like 25 minutes thinking about this.

I rate them:

Duncan
Dirk
Barkley
Garnett
Malone
McHale
Pettit
Webber/P.Gasol/S.Kemp
kemp had no game, just athleticism and flash, once body failed his game went to hell.
he does not belong in a top 10 pf list.
theres a good list of players that have more merits then him.

JNA17
10-23-2012, 05:11 AM
Hakeem, Jerry West.

Lake_Show2416
10-23-2012, 06:17 AM
Allen Iverson, surrounded by garbage his whole career, should have got 1 chip

Raidaz4Life
10-23-2012, 06:51 AM
Hakeem, Jerry West.

lol wasn't he leading the PSD greatest center of all time thread?


I was going to say Robinson but I guess everyone considers him underrated so I will go with Chris Mullin, George Gervin, Fat Lever and Adrian Dantley

JNA17
10-23-2012, 07:00 AM
lol wasn't he leading the PSD greatest center of all time thread?

PSD does not equal NBA fans general opinion though.

Chavacano
10-23-2012, 07:50 AM
Moses Eugene Malone.

basketfan4life
10-23-2012, 08:33 AM
Somehow, may not be the most underrated but Shaq is underrated to me.

BklynKnicks3
10-23-2012, 08:45 AM
penny hardaway the only person that outplayed jordan in most of their matchups and gets no credit for it

Chronz
10-23-2012, 09:26 AM
kemp had no game, just athleticism and flash, once body failed his game went to hell.
he does not belong in a top 10 pf list.
theres a good list of players that have more merits then him.

Kemp's body didn't fail him, he got himself fat. Theres a certain level of athleticism thats required to stay in the NBA, Kemp exceeded that level but managed to hang on.

Either way your not making an argument against someone by saying they were just athletic. And his dunks were flashy but his defense was brilliant, hes led some of the most underrated defensive units, like how many people know how dominant those Cavs (yes Cavs) were defensively? Then you get into his Seattle career, plenty of people have said, Kemp looked like the most talented player in the Finals and he showcased every bit of it.

I wish my favorite players had no game but were able to drop 20-10 in the Finals against one of the best teams ever constructed.


Any Sixers fans say Andrew Toney?

Injuries destroyed what would have otherwise been a very stellar career.

Good choice, what about Boston's answer to that guy?

Chronz
10-23-2012, 09:32 AM
Grant Hill...you really can't over emphasize how great he was pre injury.

We are talking Lebron James type numbers. Had Grant not gotten injured, he is in discussion as the best all around player ever. Him and McGrady would have been unbelievable together in Orlando...man, I get sad talking about what should have been with Grant Hill.

I love Grant Hill more than anyone but you're overrating him.

bagwell368
10-23-2012, 10:33 AM
pistol pete maravich. the guy was amazing

No way. He was brutal.

Swashcuff
10-23-2012, 10:55 AM
Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53

Yea you got Reggie as well but of all those guys none of them were as good on D as Hornacek. Very very underrated player on that end of the floor. He was small and nonathletic so many didn't pay attention to his commitment and intensity on that end of the floor but he could have guarded 1s and 2s quite effectively.

Bravo95
10-23-2012, 11:10 AM
Kinda feel like it's Hakeem.

Swashcuff
10-23-2012, 11:13 AM
I've seen one mention of Sidney Moncrief. One of the best defensive 2 guards to ever player the game and was hella efficient as well.

Another one not mentioned is Artis Gilmore. The most efficient scorer in the history of the game he was a anchor defensively but maybe a little too passive on the offensive end of the floor.

Gus Williams is another player who no one speaks of or respects for his contributions but he was a really good player in his day and despite not winning the FMVP in 79 (http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_1979_finals.html) he was a fire scoring machine for the Sonics and could have easily have won the FMVP award himself.

Of the guys already mentioned, D-Rob, Bobby Jones (possibly the G.O.A.T. defensive SF), Nate Thurmond, Mitch Richmond, Chris Webber and of course Andrew Toney. I guess for Toney his career was so short and he was blanketed by HOFers on his own team that he was overlooked as a result.

Swashcuff
10-23-2012, 11:20 AM
Mark Madsen; he introduced the world to unprecedented dance moves that revolutionized the way dance would be seen on the television (where do you think all these dance shows came from -- > Mark Madsen) and is also a 2x champion. That is 2 more then Karl Malone, John Stockton, and Patrick Ewing have combined!
:speechless:

PK is the most underrated poster in the history of historical history :worthy:

Swashcuff
10-23-2012, 11:23 AM
PSD does not equal NBA fans general opinion though.

Trust me I have been to quite a few other forums they rate Hakeem very highly on those as well. Hakeem is accurately rated IMO. I think in all honesty on PSD Russell is extremely underrated. More so than Hakeem.

Chronz
10-23-2012, 11:30 AM
pistol pete maravich. the guy was amazing

I missed this post but hes a guy who gets mentioned on both threads.

R. Johnson#3
10-23-2012, 11:40 AM
Charles Oakley

Nothing really to do with the numbers, although he did have some really good statistical years. But more to do with his presence on the floor. This guy was downright mean and physical.

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 11:47 AM
Reading the other thread, Stockton is being underated by people.

Stockton MADE Karls career, not the other way around.

Lucky.
10-23-2012, 11:47 AM
Chris Webber
Sidney Moncrief
Bobby Jones

Just to name a few underrated players.

Swashcuff
10-23-2012, 11:57 AM
Want a good gauge of who is under/overrated (and in some cases hated) take a look at Basketball Reference Elo Player Rating (http://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/ratings.cgi). It's the result of user voting so its not an official ranking by Basketball Reference.

Lucky.
10-23-2012, 12:00 PM
Jeff Hornacek is pretty dam under rated too. That guy just shot the **** out of the ball...for those who appreciate efficiency, I challenge you to find a SG who averaged over 30 minutes per game throughout their career, that had a better TS%, or eFG% than Jeff Hornacek...

Jeff Hornacek Ts % = .582
eFG% = .53

Drazen Petrovic

The two seasons he had with 30+ minutes he shot .587, .605 TS% and .555, .551 eFG%

But it was only 2 seasons :sigh:

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 12:05 PM
George Mikan
Vern Mikkelsen
Alex Groza
Dolph Schayes
Hal Greer
Lenny Wilkens
nate thurmond
Kc Jones
Gail Goodrich
Connie Hawkins
Lucius Allen
Phil Chenier
Norm Van Lier
Phil Smith
Downtown Fred
Earl Monroe
Artis Gilmore
Wes Unseld
Dan Issell
David Thompson
Orlando Woolrdige
Reggie Theus
Joe Dumars
John Long
Mark Aguirre
Billy Knight
D Schrempf
Rick Smits
Mark Price
Larry nance
Brad Daugherty
Ricky Pierce
Sidney Moncrief
Bob Lanier
Jack Sickma
Buck Williams
mike Gminski
Charles Oakley
Bernard King
Danny Ainge
Frank Bricowsky
Bobby Jones
George Mcginnis
Mo Cheeks
Kevin willis
Doc Rivers
Mookie Blaylock
Lou Hudson
Jeff Ruland
Mugsy Bogues
George Muresan
Xavier Mcdaniel
Nate Mcmillan
Eddie Johnson
Kiki Vandeweghe
Calvin Natt
Kevin Duckworth
terry porter
Fat Lever
Walter Davis
purvis Short
Hornackec
Stockton ( not everyone but some underate him)
Darrell Grifith
Thurl Bailey
Jeff Malone
TOm Chambers
Kevin Johnson
Alvan Adams
Adrian Dantley
Jamaal Wilkes
Norm Nixon
Mitch Kutchap
Randy Smith
Marques Johnson
World b Free ( iverson before Iverson)
Chris Mullin
Mitch Richmond
Wayman Tisdale
nate Archibald
Oscar robertson
Calvin Murphy
Rudy Tomjanovic
V Maxwell
Othis thorpe
Tree Rollins
Sean Elliiot
Alvin Robertson
Terry cummings
Rod Stickland
Dereck Harper
Rolando Blackman
Roy Tarpley
Sam Perkins


All this players get too few love, Less love than deserved or have direclty gone forgotten by psd people

Chronz
10-23-2012, 12:11 PM
Thats a pretty long list, is underrated the same as forgotten?

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 12:20 PM
sabonis
dan majerle
jayson williams
jamaal mashburn
marc eaton
sleepy floyd...

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 12:22 PM
Thats a pretty long list, is underrated the same as forgotten?

forgetting someone great, is = underating him.,

How many times do you see B Jones getting mentioned when you make a best deffenders all time list?

He should be in ANYONES top 5 list , so should Alvin Robertson and he doesnt get mentioned either.

Ask botu great rebounders? how many mentions to Thurmond?




im not sure if people woudl remember Eaton or Bol when talking bout best blockers.

Best pure scorers? rarely does anyone mention Dantley.

and so on and on.

Bravo95
10-23-2012, 12:30 PM
Mookie Blaylock
Top 3-5 PG from about '92-97, but I admit my bias.

KingPosey
10-23-2012, 12:37 PM
Mitch Richmond comes to mind as being underrated

God youre a Genius. I agree 1000000%

KingPosey
10-23-2012, 12:40 PM
I hate when people bring players up that are so old they couldnt have ever watched them play. How the **** would you know they are underrated lol? It also makes you look like you went to a website for your info when you have a laundry list of low to mid level semi obscure talent. Even if they are pretty good names to bring back.

KingPosey
10-23-2012, 12:45 PM
John ****ing Stockton. Better than Magic. But no one agrees. :mad:

I dont know about better, but i think their too different to compare. Stockton was so amazing and was automatic in every way at times.

KingPosey
10-23-2012, 12:49 PM
Love the list, though I think you need to find some place in there for the Admiral. Too many people remember him as Hakeem's ***** and so he gets underrated quite a bit imo

D Rob was one of my favorite players as a kid, and the Hakeem stuff all stems from the 6 games in the playoffs, because their head to heads in season play, D Rob might have been slightly better.

The Admiral hung 70+ on someone.

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 01:09 PM
I hate when people bring players up that are so old they couldnt have ever watched them play. How the **** would you know they are underrated lol? It also makes you look like you went to a website for your info when you have a laundry list of low to mid level semi obscure talent. Even if they are pretty good names to bring back.

have watched 75% of my list.
1985- on.

cg_la00
10-23-2012, 03:30 PM
George Mikan
Vern Mikkelsen
Alex Groza
Dolph Schayes
Hal Greer
Lenny Wilkens
nate thurmond
Kc Jones
Gail Goodrich
Connie Hawkins
Lucius Allen
Phil Chenier
Norm Van Lier
Phil Smith
Downtown Fred
Earl Monroe
Artis Gilmore
Wes Unseld
Dan Issell
David Thompson
Orlando Woolrdige
Reggie Theus
Joe Dumars
John Long
Mark Aguirre
Billy Knight
D Schrempf
Rick Smits
Mark Price
Larry nance
Brad Daugherty
Ricky Pierce
Sidney Moncrief
Bob Lanier
Jack Sickma
Buck Williams
mike Gminski
Charles Oakley
Bernard King
Danny Ainge
Frank Bricowsky
Bobby Jones
George Mcginnis
Mo Cheeks
Kevin willis
Doc Rivers
Mookie Blaylock
Lou Hudson
Jeff Ruland
Mugsy Bogues
George Muresan
Xavier Mcdaniel
Nate Mcmillan
Eddie Johnson
Kiki Vandeweghe
Calvin Natt
Kevin Duckworth
terry porter
Fat Lever
Walter Davis
purvis Short
Hornackec
Stockton ( not everyone but some underate him)
Darrell Grifith
Thurl Bailey
Jeff Malone
TOm Chambers
Kevin Johnson
Alvan Adams
Adrian Dantley
Jamaal Wilkes
Norm Nixon
Mitch Kutchap
Randy Smith
Marques Johnson
World b Free ( iverson before Iverson)
Chris Mullin
Mitch Richmond
Wayman Tisdale
nate Archibald
Oscar robertson
Calvin Murphy
Rudy Tomjanovic
V Maxwell
Othis thorpe
Tree Rollins
Sean Elliiot
Alvin Robertson
Terry cummings
Rod Stickland
Dereck Harper
Rolando Blackman
Roy Tarpley
Sam Perkins


All this players get too few love, Less love than deserved or have direclty gone forgotten by psd people
i dont see pete maravich in there smh

Hellcrooner
10-23-2012, 03:38 PM
i dont see pete maravich in there smh

Cause maravich is OVER not UNDER rated.

DodgersFanKid55
10-23-2012, 03:46 PM
Vin Baker
Eddie Jones
Danny Manning
Gary Payton
horace Grant

airforceones25
10-23-2012, 03:50 PM
The lack of acknowledgement of Elgin Baylor is mind boggling to me. This guy is top 5 player ever if he wins one championship. IMO he carried the Lakers back then but people only seem to recognize Jerry West.

Raidaz4Life
10-23-2012, 06:06 PM
Trust me I have been to quite a few other forums they rate Hakeem very highly on those as well. Hakeem is accurately rated IMO. I think in all honesty on PSD Russell is extremely underrated. More so than Hakeem.

I think if you give Russell being underrated you HAVE to acknowledge than Ben Wallace is underrated. Russell gets mentioned all the time, but Ben Wallace is one of the only players besides Russell to lead a team to a championship solely based off of his defensive production. Not only that but he made the finals a second time as well which is pretty damn impressive for this age of basketball.

cg_la00
10-23-2012, 07:07 PM
Cause maravich is OVER not UNDER rated.

no way, hes underrated. i NEVER hear his name

abe_froman
10-23-2012, 07:10 PM
no way, hes underrated. i NEVER hear his name

thats the way it should be,but when his name is brought up its in glowing,overly high rated terms/rankings

cg_la00
10-23-2012, 07:22 PM
thats the way it should be,but when his name is brought up its in glowing,overly high rated terms/rankings

but he was soo good :( averaged over 40 points a game during college, played mostly his whole career without the three-point line (what couldve been), regarded as one of the best play makers of all time, and his career was ended shortly because of an injury :cry:

abe_froman
10-23-2012, 07:25 PM
but he was soo good :( averaged over 40 points a game during college, played mostly his whole career without the three-point line (what couldve been), regarded as one of the best play makers of all time, and his career was ended shortly because of an injury :cry:
college doesnt matter(though your right that he was a great college player),but he was a huge chucker,very inefficient,drunk/high most of the time,not really a leader,career loser.he had all the talent in the world and is among the top could have been's...if only he had a better head

cg_la00
10-23-2012, 07:27 PM
college doesnt matter(though your right that he was),but he was a huge chucker,very inefficient,drunk/high most of the time,not really a leader,career loser.he had all the talent in the world and is among the top could have been's...if only he had a better head

ill agree with you on that

KnicksorBust
10-23-2012, 07:31 PM
The lack of acknowledgement of Elgin Baylor is mind boggling to me. This guy is top 5 player ever if he wins one championship. IMO he carried the Lakers back then but people only seem to recognize Jerry West.

Yeah he's the only 0x MVP and 0x NBA Champion that is a top 5 player of all-time. :rolleyes:

JasonJohnHorn
10-23-2012, 07:35 PM
Darrell Walker. Guy was an amazing defender.

tht_one_guy
10-24-2012, 06:31 AM
Nick Van Exel, Rik Smits, David Robinson, Joe Dumars

Swashcuff
10-24-2012, 11:49 AM
I think if you give Russell being underrated you HAVE to acknowledge than Ben Wallace is underrated. Russell gets mentioned all the time, but Ben Wallace is one of the only players besides Russell to lead a team to a championship solely based off of his defensive production. Not only that but he made the finals a second time as well which is pretty damn impressive for this age of basketball.

Really don't see the comparison though. Without Bill Russell there will be no Ben Wallace. He made defense what we know it to be today.

Bill Russell was WAYYYYYYYYY more than just a defensive basketball player and IMO he impacted the game in more ways without the basketball than any other player to ever play the game including MJ. His IQ at the time was unparalleled, as was his leadership, he's arguably the best outlet passer the game has ever seen as well something that in his day was invaluable to his team and was an actual offensive threat when he wanted to.

IMO there really is no comparison between Wallace and Russell outside of the fact that they were undersized defensively and amazing rebounders. That comparison in itself is the major reason as to why I would say tht here on PSD Russell is underrated.

JayW_1023
10-24-2012, 12:11 PM
Zo.



Intense. A multiple DPOY. A champion (after coming back from his kidney troubles). Amazingly he never dropped off that much as a defender despite a supposed career ending injury.

Zo never got his due.

JayW_1023
10-24-2012, 12:12 PM
And also Glen Rice for the sheer fact that he has the prettiest shooting form in NBA history.

Those Hornet teams built around him would do a lot more damage in todays NBA. Too mad MJ foiled them time and time again.


Bogues, Phills, Rice, Mase and Divac...always liked that line-up.

JordansBulls
10-24-2012, 12:14 PM
I'm starting to think it is NBA version of Julius Erving.

Longhornfan1234
10-24-2012, 12:24 PM
Moses Malone...it's not even close.

JayW_1023
10-24-2012, 12:26 PM
Mike James.

Lo Porto
10-24-2012, 12:51 PM
Scottie Pippen - if he wasn't playing with the overrated Michael Jordan, people would give him the respect he deserves as one of the best players the NBA has seen. He was the best perimeter defender to ever play the game (could guard PG, SG, SF or PF).

He could also score and rebound. It helped that he had Phil Jackson and Jordan, but remember that Jordan goes down as the best all time and Pippen hardly ever gets mentioned. Hell, MJ got a Defensive Player of the Year and Phil calls the Pip the best defender he ever saw and would always put Pippen on the other team's best player. Yet Pippen never won the Defensive Player of the Year award...

JordansBulls
10-24-2012, 12:57 PM
Scottie Pippen - if he wasn't playing with the overrated Michael Jordan, people would give him the respect he deserves as one of the best players the NBA has seen. He was the best perimeter defender to ever play the game (could guard PG, SG, SF or PF).

He could also score and rebound. It helped that he had Phil Jackson and Jordan, but remember that Jordan goes down as the best all time and Pippen hardly ever gets mentioned. Hell, MJ got a Defensive Player of the Year and Phil calls the Pip the best defender he ever saw and would always put Pippen on the other team's best player. Yet Pippen never won the Defensive Player of the Year award...

For someone who NEVER won a defensive player of the year award, you would think he was a lock-down defender like Gary Payton or a post presence like Dikembe Mutumbo. Pippen was an overrated defender. He was a great defender, but I'm saying in the context of the way people talk about his defense, (people who didn't watch Bulls games in that era), his defense gets overrated now.

Pippen averaged 16ppg 6.4reb 5.2ast 2.0stl .8blk 47%fg for his career and people talk about him like he was playing on LeBron's level. The one thing people never talk about with Pippen is the fact that yes he averaged 17ppg in the playoffs 7.6reb and 5.0ast, but Pippen shot 44% in the playoffs for his career. Pippen shot 39% in the 96 playoffs, Pippen shot 41% in the 97 and 98 playoffs. The first year Pippen played in the playoffs without Jordan(99) Pippen shot 32.9% in the playoffs that year. Pippen only had one season shooting over 50% in the playoffs and that was the 90 playoffs when he made 50.4% of his shots. Other than that, he was a streaky scorer, overrated passer and ball handler, overrated defender, and he only shot 30% from 3 point land to go with 72% free throws for his career in the playoffs.

Pippen shot 40% in the 96,97 and 98 playoffs, name one other player who could will his team to a 3 peat, like Jordan did, with a sidekick that shot 40% in the playoffs during those 3 championship runs.


Pippen averaged 17 ppg on 39% FG in 1996 playoffs, he averaged 19 ppg on 42% FG in the 1997 playoffs, and he averaged 17 ppg on 42% FG in the 1998 playoffs. He averaged 22 ppg in the 1991 playoffs on 50% Fg, 20 ppg on 47% FG in the 1992 playoffs and 20 ppg on 47% in the 1993 playoffs.


I've debated this with enough people.

I've been saying for a long time that Pippen is becoming the most overrated player ever, and to me its official cause I've heard enough of it. Pippen is the most overrated player ever.

There really should not be any comparisons, at least comparisons about who's better, between Scottie Pippen and players like Larry Bird and Lebron James. Was he a much greater defender? Absolutely.

But there is no way anyone can seriously say Pippen impacted a game the way Bird and Lebron have.

Bird and Lebron are closer to Jordan then they are to Pippen, and the gap between Jordan and Pippen is pretty wide.

Pippen's a great player, HOFer, top 35 at least, maybe top 30 or 25 all-time, top 10 SF all-time, possibly top 5.

But he is what he is. A great versatile player that could do it all, but he lacked the killer instinct and ability to dominate to be the best player on a championship team.

That is not Bird, and its probably not Lebron. I really want someone to point out Pippen dominating the way Jordan did on multiple occassions, like dropping 55 on the Suns in the 93 Finals, or Lebron, when he scored 25 straight against the Pistons a few years ago, or Bird who in high temperatures had 34 points/17 rebounds against the Lakers in the Finals one game. Pippen has never had a game that comes close to any of those.

He has become greatly overrated.


Next off people overrate Pippen based on one year of being the man, but on the other hand a guy like Gary Payton who led a team to 6 seasons in a row of 55+ wins gets underrated and called overrated all the time. A guy like Iverson led a team to the the #1 seed as well once and people call him overrated. Drexler led a team to the finals twice as the man and won 59+ games 3 years in a row and some call him overrated. But Pippen leads a team once as the man to 55 wins and he is considered underrated.
Isiah developed into a star on his own while Pippen was helped to turn into a star. Pippen didn't have the ability to lead a team to the title as the man. If guys like Barkley, Malone, DRobinson all who were better than Pippen did not win titles as the man and even guys like Ewing and Drexler then what makes it that Pippen could?

On defense, Jordan was the better defender between the two of them from 1988-1993. Pippen was better afterwards from the time they played together.

Lo Porto
10-24-2012, 01:23 PM
Phil Jackson said Pippen was the best defender he ever saw. Which means Phil Jackson said he was a better defender than Jordan. So you're saying you know better than the best coach of all time?

Also, Jordan never won jack crap without Pippen. So bring up all the shooting % stats you want, it doesn't take away from the fact that Jordan isn't the supposed "best of all time" without Pippen doing all his dirty work.

Lo Porto
10-24-2012, 01:25 PM
I'm not saying Pippen is better than Bird or LeBron, but if people can say that Jordan is the best player of all time (which I don't think is such a given like most people say) then Pippen deserves a hell of a lot more credit than most give him. Thus taking us back to the point of this thread - who is the most underrated player of all time.

Dr Positivity
10-24-2012, 01:26 PM
Mitch Richmond is the clear cut frontrunner for MUOAT in my opinion

JordansBulls
10-24-2012, 01:31 PM
Phil Jackson said Pippen was the best defender he ever saw. Which means Phil Jackson said he was a better defender than Jordan. So you're saying you know better than the best coach of all time?

Also, Jordan never won jack crap without Pippen. So bring up all the shooting % stats you want, it doesn't take away from the fact that Jordan isn't the supposed "best of all time" without Pippen doing all his dirty work.

Jordan won titles when Pippen didn't even make the allstar team. Pippen also went to play with Hakeem and Barkley was lost in round 1. So why couldn't Pippen win with them? Why is it when you bring up Houston then people say he was old as dirt but then try to say he was the man the next season on Portland? While MJ won with him the season before including when Pippen missed nearly half the season and was playing injured all season long?
Not to mention Jordan is the only top 10 player all time to never play with a guy who won league or finals mvp. So don't give me this crap that Jordan had more help than anyone else. Wilt had a guy who averaged nearly 40 ppg in the finals on his team and a team that was in 5 finals that decade before Wilt arrived. Russell came to a team that had the ROY and league mvp winner. We all know the Kobe/Shaq. Hakeem went to a team who had the ROY in Sampson as soon as he got there. Sure he won later on but that was due to MJ leaving but also because Seattle got upset in the 1st round. Next off he did play with Barkley and Drexler and they furthest they got was the WCF. Kareem and Magic were together and then Kareem and Oscar were together.

Chronz
10-24-2012, 01:58 PM
LOL JB still trying to trick people with first grade logic..... hope this one becomes sig worthy too.

JordansBulls
10-24-2012, 02:05 PM
LOL JB still trying to trick people with first grade logic..... hope this one becomes sig worthy too.

First grade logic is because so and so said this and he is a coach it must be true.

I.E. My teacher told me today that the earth is flat, so that is true because it came from my teacher.

Chronz
10-24-2012, 02:07 PM
First grade logic is because so and so said this and he is a coach it must be true.

I.E. My teacher told me today that the earth is flat, so that is true because it came from my teacher.

Thats more like 2nd grade logic bro

Hellcrooner
10-24-2012, 02:10 PM
First grade logic is because so and so said this and he is a coach it must be true.

I.E. My teacher told me today that the earth is flat, so that is true because it came from my teacher.

If your teacher was S Hawkins or Einsten, you shoudl at least listen to him.

Phil Jakcson knows one or two things bout basketball...............:rolleyes:

JordansBulls
10-24-2012, 02:23 PM
If your teacher was S Hawkins or Einsten, you shoudl at least listen to him.

Phil Jakcson knows one or two things bout basketball...............:rolleyes:

Not if they said the Earth is flat.

teddygreen17
10-24-2012, 02:28 PM
David Robinson...dude was a beast..but you never hear his name