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View Full Version : why doesnt buck schowalter get more credit?



Rain City
09-15-2012, 04:18 AM
They lost a close one tonight, but he took over baltimore was a top 3 most hopeless franchise, and they have only gotten better and better and were tied with NY going into today.

abe_froman
09-15-2012, 04:31 AM
dont get what you mean.he's been getting praised daily by the national media and will most likely win manager of the year award

metswon69
09-15-2012, 04:32 AM
Not to mention the jobs he did with the Yankees and Diamondbacks...

Remember in 1999, he took a second year expansion team (Diamondbacks) to over a 100 wins but i think his perceived lack of respect is partially due to the fact that he was fired right before those teams won their WS titles.

I mean the guy is a two time AL manager of the year and he's done probably his best work this year considering no one expected the Orioles to be anywhere near a playoff contender.

It would be nice to see him finally win a WS because he does a great job getting the most out of teams he manages and is great with young players.

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 09:59 AM
hes overrated

Steel Curtain
09-15-2012, 10:49 AM
Showalter is getting plenty of credit. It's the actual team that doesn't get any love.

Mr. Magoo
09-15-2012, 12:19 PM
hes overrated

I hope you're joking, intercourse.

If it wasn't for that overrated guy, the Yankees probably wouldn't have had Mo, Pettitte, Posada, and that tranny in your signature. He built that Yankee team, then got fired, and Torre got all the credit.

2009mvp
09-15-2012, 12:27 PM
He's a moron. I mean, cotton? Shoulda never agreed to that.

Also, aren't we giving Buck a lot of credit for building teams that were built by, y'know, GMs? Showalter didn't sign super-human late 90's Randy Johnson, or inject Luis Gonzalez and Matt Williams (or maybe he did, who knows).

rkelly7
09-15-2012, 12:36 PM
hes overrated



I thought this was a thread about Showalter, not Joe Girardi :confused:

You sound like a scared Yankee fan saying that. It's ok, the wild card or missing the playoffs completely isn't so bad. ;)

The divsion belongs to the O's.

Mr. Magoo
09-15-2012, 12:49 PM
He's a moron. I mean, cotton? Shoulda never agreed to that.

Also, aren't we giving Buck a lot of credit for building teams that were built by, y'know, GMs? Showalter didn't sign super-human late 90's Randy Johnson, or inject Luis Gonzalez and Matt Williams (or maybe he did, who knows).

Actually, no. Buck has always been a very hands on manager, who has worked side-by-side with GM's and in many cases, has told GM's what talent he wanted and what he didn't want.

OpenAvalin
09-15-2012, 12:53 PM
Bob Melvin is better than Showalter

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 12:55 PM
I hope you're joking, intercourse.

If it wasn't for that overrated guy, the Yankees probably wouldn't have had Mo, Pettitte, Posada, and that tranny in your signature. He built that Yankee team, then got fired, and Torre got all the credit.

He didnt build the team nor was he scouting those guys you mention, if anything gene michaels and bob watson who fought The boss into not trading them away are the real heroes.

The O's are just full of young athletic players playing with a lot of confidence, did Buck make them believe? probably, is he the reason for the success? could be in a way, but managers impact in a game is overrated as much as hitting and pitching coaches, its all year to year.

Sometimes the managers moves work and sometimes they dont, when they dont they are a moron when they do they are genious.

Example, the other day Buck left Teagarden (the backup catcher) hit with RISP when everyone was saying hello weiters?????

Teagarden got a double to drive in runs


Same situation with the yankees, they had risp and Girardi didnt pinch hit chris stewart with russel martin that in those days was on a hot streak, stewart fails to deliver


Buck is called the greatest manager ever

Girardi is called a moron



So no, Its not Bucks success its the teams success therefor he is overrated

srhorioles
09-15-2012, 01:00 PM
Bob Melvin is better than Showalter

why? because he's 2 games ahead?

in that case, just give ron washington al manager of the year.

you make no sense

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 01:04 PM
A's have great pitching, ive been amazed at how they have been capable of producing runs, love me some josh reddick but hes been hot and cold and cespedes has been on and off with injuries

OpenAvalin
09-15-2012, 01:07 PM
why? because he's 2 games ahead?

in that case, just give ron washington al manager of the year.

you make no sense

Look at the players we have, numbnuts. Only 1 is batting over .275. Only 1 is hitting more than 25 homeruns. We are a young team that is managed greatly, and by anyone else, we would probably be doing bad. Orioles have big name players, A's dont. We have Cespedes and Reddick. O's have Adam Jones, Nick Markakis. Manny Machado, Mark Reynolds, JJ Hardy. Melvin has to work with very little, while Showalter works with good stuff

Guppyfighter
09-15-2012, 01:09 PM
why? because he's 2 games ahead?

in that case, just give ron washington al manager of the year.

you make no sense

lol That was a pretty quick straw man.

AI
09-15-2012, 01:09 PM
Because he doesn't matter, he's no Derek Jeter.

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 01:10 PM
but the A's have to work with top pitching while the O's have only had 1 starter pitch since the start of the year

ZitoHudson
09-15-2012, 01:11 PM
Look at the players we have, numbnuts. Only 1 is batting over .275. Only 1 is hitting more than 25 homeruns. We are a young team that is managed greatly, and by anyone else, we would probably be doing bad. Orioles have big name players, A's dont. We have Cespedes and Reddick. O's have Adam Jones, Nick Markakis. Manny Machado, Mark Reynolds, JJ Hardy. Melvin has to work with very little, while Showalter works with good stuff

Agreed. Melvin doesnt have the luxeries Buck has

OpenAvalin
09-15-2012, 01:14 PM
Remember in the offseason we traded
Andrew Bailey (09 rookie of the year)
Trevor Cahill
Gio Gonzalez
And everyone thought we were crazy? That we would lose 100 games this year? Well, Bob Melvin just proved how great of a manager he is

ManningToTyree
09-15-2012, 01:32 PM
He is getting plenty of credit, and deservedly so.

thrice4
09-15-2012, 01:37 PM
The men with the gloves and the bats should take most of the credit. I hate the way Buck talks anyway.

Guppyfighter
09-15-2012, 01:44 PM
The men with the gloves and the bats should take most of the credit. I hate the way Buck talks anyway.

Trash men and the mafia?

rkelly7
09-15-2012, 01:58 PM
He didnt build the team nor was he scouting those guys you mention, if anything gene michaels and bob watson who fought The boss into not trading them away are the real heroes.

The O's are just full of young athletic players playing with a lot of confidence, did Buck make them believe? probably, is he the reason for the success? could be in a way, but managers impact in a game is overrated as much as hitting and pitching coaches, its all year to year.

Sometimes the managers moves work and sometimes they dont, when they dont they are a moron when they do they are genious.

Example, the other day Buck left Teagarden (the backup catcher) hit with RISP when everyone was saying hello weiters?????

Teagarden got a double to drive in runs


Same situation with the yankees, they had risp and Girardi didnt pinch hit chris stewart with russel martin that in those days was on a hot streak, stewart fails to deliver


Buck is called the greatest manager ever

Girardi is called a moron



So no, Its not Bucks success its the teams success therefor he is overrated

If Girardi was coaching the O's, they'd be lucky to be a .500 team I bet. Lucky, if not worse.

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 02:12 PM
If Girardi was coaching the O's, they'd be lucky to be a .500 team I bet. Lucky, if not worse.

if your opinions werent so constantly wrong i would take them as credible, but since we have no way to know then I have to just take it as homerism :)

metswon69
09-15-2012, 05:30 PM
He didnt build the team nor was he scouting those guys you mention, if anything gene michaels and bob watson who fought The boss into not trading them away are the real heroes.

The O's are just full of young athletic players playing with a lot of confidence, did Buck make them believe? probably, is he the reason for the success? could be in a way, but managers impact in a game is overrated as much as hitting and pitching coaches, its all year to year.

Sometimes the managers moves work and sometimes they dont, when they dont they are a moron when they do they are genious.

Example, the other day Buck left Teagarden (the backup catcher) hit with RISP when everyone was saying hello weiters?????

Teagarden got a double to drive in runs


Same situation with the yankees, they had risp and Girardi didnt pinch hit chris stewart with russel martin that in those days was on a hot streak, stewart fails to deliver


Buck is called the greatest manager ever

Girardi is called a moron



So no, Its not Bucks success its the teams success therefor he is overrated

Say what you want but he has helped do this with 3 franchises now, maybe he doesn't deserve as much credit with the Yankees because of Michaels and Watson but he certainly does for his time with the Diamondbacks and the O's.

And remember even with the expanded rosters in most cases you don't pinch hit for a catcher because if Weiters wasn't supposed to play that day you have to go a 3rd catcher and if he gets injured what do you do?

I get the impression Showalter is a "hunch" manager too, whereas Girardi is obviously all about the binder and that's why he made the decision to keep in Teagarden.

I'll agree with you about the "genious/moron" decision making process and how they are praised or ridiculed for it but if you look at the success Showalter has had i wouldn't call that being at the right place at the right time.

LakersA's49ers
09-15-2012, 05:42 PM
BoMel for AL Manager of the Year. Name our starting rotation....we've got 4 rooks and anderson. Good to have curt young back as pitching coach as well after being wrongly dumped like francona in boston

Guppyfighter
09-15-2012, 05:46 PM
We have lost a lot of god damned players and missed a lot of our key players for a bit.

infernoscurse
09-15-2012, 05:54 PM
Say what you want but he has helped do this with 3 franchises now, maybe he doesn't deserve as much credit with the Yankees because of Michaels and Watson but he certainly does for his time with the Diamondbacks and the O's.

And remember even with the expanded rosters in most cases you don't pinch hit for a catcher because if Weiters wasn't supposed to play that day you have to go a 3rd catcher and if he gets injured what do you do?

I get the impression Showalter is a "hunch" manager too, whereas Girardi is obviously all about the binder and that's why he made the decision to keep in Teagarden.

I'll agree with you about the "genious/moron" decision making process and how they are praised or ridiculed for it but if you look at the success Showalter has had i wouldn't call that being at the right place at the right time.

im not saying hes a bad manager and isnt influencing the team, im just on the side that managers are overrated could he have turned the red sox season this year instead of bobby V? no, its about the players. and fans eat into it

boston for example everyone wanted bobby v cause he was loud and was supposed to electrify the lineup

when joe g won manager of the year everyone loved him cause he was into the book and was the manager the yankees needed cause joe torre was so old school, now that the yankees arent winning apparently the problem is that he goes by the book and not by hunch which is totally unfair to the manager cause its the players not performing not the manager and fans just jump ship from opinions year to year

metswon69
09-15-2012, 06:13 PM
im not saying hes a bad manager and isnt influencing the team, im just on the side that managers are overrated could he have turned the red sox season this year instead of bobby V? no, its about the players. and fans eat into it

boston for example everyone wanted bobby v cause he was loud and was supposed to electrify the lineup

when joe g won manager of the year everyone loved him cause he was into the book and was the manager the yankees needed cause joe torre was so old school, now that the yankees arent winning apparently the problem is that he goes by the book and not by hunch which is totally unfair to the manager cause its the players not performing not the manager and fans just jump ship from opinions year to year


Fair enough but again the O's weren't picked to make the playoffs neither was that 1999 Diamondbacks team. I mean there is a reason why the Orioles have a negative run differential and are still winning.

All i am saying is that aside from Texas, Showalter has been part of some quick turnarounds and i think he deserves more credit than just "it's just about the players" because if you looked at the O's roster to start the season you wouldn't have called that anything else but a last place team.

That's part of being a good manager, is getting a team to exceed expectations consistently.

The Red Sox were a mess from the very beginning, i had this discussion with someone else here and the truth was that roster was overrated especially when David Ortiz went down. They had no SP, they lost Andrew Bailey (who they had hopes for being a very good closer), ownership spent no money on improving the team last offseason, and the truth was nobody wanted Bobby there besides Larry Lucchino.

Bobby V's "rah rah" style of managing belongs with a younger less accomplished team and not a team that had prior success under a completely different style of manager.

That was a sinking ship from day one...

MetsFanatic19
09-15-2012, 06:44 PM
I've always said he'd be the AL Coach of the Year :shrug:

Steel Curtain
09-15-2012, 08:06 PM
lol That was a pretty quick straw man. Said Dr. Pot to Dr. Kettle. You must be Keith Law, everyone but him is enjoying a nice feel-good season by the Orioles, can't you do the same? Get the stick out of your ***.

Guppyfighter
09-16-2012, 01:26 AM
When did I create a straw man? Anyways, you are getting pretty upset about a team that's not even yours. I don't have positive or negative feeling about the Orioles, but it being a feel good story doesn't mean I should ignore the fact it's mostly smoke/mirrors. A's broke up a streak of 13 wins a row in one run games for the Orioles on Friday. I'd rather the O's make the playoffs then the Angels/Rays. I don't want to see Weaver or Price. I want to see the O's.

Jeffy25
09-16-2012, 08:32 PM
He is probably the American League Manager of the Year

I think he is getting plenty of credit. That team should not have the record they have. He is squeezing everything out of them that he can.

Jeffy25
09-16-2012, 08:34 PM
im not saying hes a bad manager and isnt influencing the team, im just on the side that managers are overrated could he have turned the red sox season this year instead of bobby V? no, its about the players. and fans eat into it


Having a manager that makes good in-game decisions is worth about 5 wins a season

That doesn't even include the influence and leadership that they need to carry and any instructional things they might do.


Managers can be as valuable to a team as a player, rather easily too.

7chuck7
09-17-2012, 07:36 AM
They lost a close one tonight, but he took over baltimore was a top 3 most hopeless franchise, and they have only gotten better and better and were tied with NY going into today.

He is a ahole. He is a crybaby. He is a know-it all. He holds grudges. He really is not a 'great baseball mind'. He has the personality of a frog. He is ugly. He is a jerk. He is not likable.

Is that enough?

Pinstripe pride
09-17-2012, 08:39 AM
isn;'t he the favorite for manager of the year? pretty sur ehe gets a good deal of creidt for his work in baltimore

WolvesJagsOs
09-18-2012, 12:22 AM
He is a ahole. He is a crybaby. He is a know-it all. He holds grudges. He really is not a 'great baseball mind'. He has the personality of a frog. He is ugly. He is a jerk. He is not likable.

Is that enough?

Haha, you tell them. Obviously everyone around baseball agrees with you.

Nomar
09-18-2012, 12:27 AM
In what world is Buck not getting credit. He is like Maddon 2.0

WolvesJagsOs
09-18-2012, 12:56 AM
I agree, he's getting plenty of credit, just thought it was funny how a guy was actually bashing the guy. Everyone loves what Buck has done with this ball club and everyone in the Orioles clubhouse loves playing for him.