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grandsalami
09-06-2012, 10:13 PM
Jen Royle ‏@Jen_Royle
Source: "The Red Sox will find a way to bring John Farrell to Boston next year. He is their first and only choice."


http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/09/farrell-likely-to-be-top-choice-in-boston.html

Nomar
09-06-2012, 10:40 PM
I think Farrell is starting to bet too much attention. He is already pretty overrated. People are going to make him out to be the messiah and expectations will be too high.

He was a great pitching coach. IMO Dave Wallace was just as good. Instead of having to pay an extra opportunity cost to get a manager, why not just try to move on? Its a new era, why do we have to bring back some of the old? Lester im sure would be happy to have Farrell back, but its not like Farrell is some god figure who will bring an automatic WS here.

joshhorvath
09-07-2012, 12:07 AM
Whats your offer for Farrell, AA wont make farrell coming to the Red Sox come easy.

grandsalami
09-07-2012, 12:09 AM
Whats your offer for Farrell, AA wont make farrell coming to the Red Sox come easy.

One thing for sure, its going to be less then what the sox got for Theo, because in all honesty... a GM>manager...... its no offense to TOR or farrell, but thats how I see it..

Station 13
09-07-2012, 12:25 AM
Why would we need to offer them anything? Isn't Farrel contract up after 2013?

Nomar
09-07-2012, 12:37 AM
Why would we need to offer them anything? Isn't Farrel contract up after 2013?

if we want him next year

Station 13
09-07-2012, 12:46 AM
if we want him next year

We could wait couldn't we. Unless they want Melancon? :laugh:

NYGIANTS831
09-07-2012, 12:47 AM
for fans who think Bobby V is gonna be gonna after this current season think again he's gonna stay they moved A-Gon because he was his biggest criticizer

Nomar
09-07-2012, 12:52 AM
for fans who think Bobby V is gonna be gonna after this current season think again he's gonna stay they moved A-Gon because he was his biggest criticizer

1) Hes not staying

2) AGon wasnt his biggest criticizer

3) AGon was traded to dump Crawford and Beckett's salaries and pick up 2 good pitching specs.

Nothing you said made sense, have a good one.

Celts22
09-07-2012, 02:02 AM
One thing for sure, its going to be less then what the sox got for Theo, because in all honesty... a GM>manager...... its no offense to TOR or farrell, but thats how I see it..
Maybe Pimentel to free up a spot on the 40 man roster :shrug:

wolf82
09-07-2012, 07:19 AM
Maybe Pimentel to free up a spot on the 40 man roster :shrug:

How about Aceves? He is being a club house cancer, and they are probably gonna try and get rid of him this off-season. OR....

They can have Lackey....and his horrible contract

bagwell368
09-07-2012, 07:42 AM
for fans who think Bobby V is gonna be gonna after this current season think again he's gonna stay they moved A-Gon because he was his biggest criticizer

Yeah sure...

Agon was moved to get rid of CC and because he wasn't quite the leader or power hitter the FO was expecting.

Yesterday Luchhino skipped his usual radio interview. As usual when the bombs are flying, he's hiding in his lair trying to justify his existence. Wait until BV gets axed, you think TF got tarred and feathered on his way out? You ain't seen nothing yet sonny.

bagwell368
09-07-2012, 07:45 AM
One thing for sure, its going to be less then what the sox got for Theo, because in all honesty... a GM>manager...... its no offense to TOR or farrell, but thats how I see it..

That's not for sure, look at what has been given up for Managers in the past. Also the Sox fudged up the compensation totally by not insisting on the price before he was gone. BTW, LL was behind that. I wanted TE to be kicked upstairs and LL to be put out to pasture with some job with a big title and no line responsibility. Owners are stuck on LL because a couple of times he was right/got them out of jams/and built the business well.

Same division. The only card the Sox is Farrell tells Toronto he won't sign an extension. But why would he do that? He could use both of them to crowbar a better contract? Besides, it would be tampering if the Sox said that they know he's coming to Boston.

Only way they make a move on him is if they are convinced he's the guy, because Toronto will make them bleed.

goshhhjosh
09-07-2012, 08:16 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Jays asked the Sox for Buchholz in a potential Farrell deal. I believe that the Jays will ask for a top prospect, to which I would say, thanks but no thanks.

I don't know if this tweeter has a solid source...but it's bad business to put all of your eggs in one basket. Oh how the Bobby V experiment has failed.

To the poster who said Bobby V is going to stay next year - HA.

SirHizz
09-07-2012, 09:04 AM
I want Farrell, but if the compensation gets out of hand, he can stay in Toronto. He got 1 year left on his deal and has proven nothing so far, unlike Theo and we basically received sh** for our boy wonder.

They can have Melancon or Carpenter, but that's it.

bosox1899
09-07-2012, 09:27 AM
give'em aceves

corky831
09-07-2012, 09:54 AM
id give em aceves and kalish

AI
09-07-2012, 10:08 AM
They should receive nothing more than a RP spec. They ask for Buchholz? Hang up and wait a year until his contract up.

Station 13
09-07-2012, 10:46 AM
I don't get the boner for Farrell. What has he accomplished? Why is he 'respected'?

MiamiBoy77
09-07-2012, 10:49 AM
farrell for Bobby V, Melancon, and a year supply of espn the magazine

bagwell368
09-07-2012, 11:58 AM
I don't get the boner for Farrell. What has he accomplished? Why is he 'respected'?

It's been covered. He was the heir it seemed to TF. He was the pitching coach that guided the 2007 BRS to the best ERA+ in team history. He was able to motivate guys like Lester and Beckett (some say with fear). He's a big hulking guy and casts a deep shadow.

Sox fans are generally desperate. They don't want a whack job like BV again, they don't want a "softie". Since Farrell is untried in this market he has the best thing of all - potential. The media and fans can/will tar and feather him later in most probability - but he's in the desire/honeymoon phase now.

StayOnBoard
09-07-2012, 03:19 PM
That's not for sure, look at what has been given up for Managers in the past. Also the Sox fudged up the compensation totally by not insisting on the price before he was gone. BTW, LL was behind that. I wanted TE to be kicked upstairs and LL to be put out to pasture with some job with a big title and no line responsibility. Owners are stuck on LL because a couple of times he was right/got them out of jams/and built the business well.

Same division. The only card the Sox is Farrell tells Toronto he won't sign an extension. But why would he do that? He could use both of them to crowbar a better contract? Besides, it would be tampering if the Sox said that they know he's coming to Boston.

Only way they make a move on him is if they are convinced he's the guy, because Toronto will make them bleed.

Exactly ^

If Boston really wants him they'll pay for him or they'll go another direction, which I'm sure if fine by the Jays brass (since, you know, they like Farrell).

To say it'll be less than what Theo netted is a joke.... unless the scenario you listed in your post happens (IE: Farrell says he wants out) then it's a different situation entirely.

Why would Toronto let him go for nothing to a division rival when that's the guy the team wants?

Personally I don't think a trade gets done.... I bet Toronto becomes unreasonable with what they will want and Boston says piss off and goes after another manager instead.

StayOnBoard
09-07-2012, 03:21 PM
They should receive nothing more than a RP spec. They ask for Buchholz? Hang up and wait a year until his contract up.

So then your choices are the following
1) Keep Bobby V for one more year... I can't see that happening
2) "Attempt" to hire a lame duck manager to coach them for one season, knowing full well he's going to be replaced at year end (good luck)

Also, is it not possible Toronto could resign Farrell mid-way next season? I really don't see how Boston has any leverage here. If they want him, they'll pay for him and if not they'll go another direction. Completely their decision...

grandsalami
09-07-2012, 05:30 PM
RT @sportstalkmatt: @GordonEdes on @WGAMTheGame "If the Red Sox want John Farrell, they can make this happen relatively painlessly." #RedSox

EEasyA
09-08-2012, 04:40 AM
funny how my thread that had nothing to do with bobby v or farrell gets closed.smh.but anyways farrell is so overrated.dude is going to get killed in boston

GNick
09-08-2012, 06:18 AM
If I was a betting man...I'd say Farrell be in Boston next year. Boston wants him bad, and he's a better fit there than in Toronto. Compensation be more than you predict but not ridicous more than you predict.

house99
09-08-2012, 08:47 AM
Toronto's needs are starting pitching and 2nd base +/- DH . They would love to come away with Dustin, Buchholz, or Lester probably throwing in someone like Rasmus, or Alvarez into the deal.

GrkGawdofWalkz
09-08-2012, 08:50 AM
If I was a betting man...I'd say Farrell be in Boston next year. Boston wants him bad, and he's a better fit there than in Toronto. Compensation be more than you predict but not ridicous more than you predict.

Compensation for Epstein was a 26 year old reliever who was barely a prospect. Good luck getting anything more than a marginal C+ to B- prospect. I'm perfectly fine not going after Farrell at all. Ryne Sandberg has my confidence with his approach and in the way that he's had to bust his *** to earn a MLB job.

StayOnBoard
09-08-2012, 09:08 AM
Compensation for Epstein was a 26 year old reliever who was barely a prospect. Good luck getting anything more than a marginal C+ to B- prospect. I'm perfectly fine not going after Farrell at all. Ryne Sandberg has my confidence with his approach and in the way that he's had to bust his *** to earn a MLB job.

Of course you fail to mention Boston completely screwed that deal up by letting Theo go without having prior confirmation on what the compensation would be. Boston had zero leverage.... zero.... remember?

How it went from Castro to Garza to Brett Jackson to some scrub to Carpenter in "rumored deals"? I'm fairly confident Toronto wouldn't screw things up the same way.

Now - people who think they're getting Buchholtz or Lester are flat out confused too. There's no way they're getting a star player back in any deal, period, unless they're giving fair value and Farrell was a throw-in type piece. I expect Toronto to target guys like Bubby De La Rosa and likely settle for a little less. I actually expect Farrell to coach in Boston next year - sign there long term and build them back from the ground up. He gets a lot of flack in Toronto but he's a pretty good character, I've grown to like him but I think a change in scenery could do everyone some good.

AI
09-08-2012, 09:59 AM
Of course you fail to mention Boston completely screwed that deal up by letting Theo go without having prior confirmation on what the compensation would be. Boston had zero leverage.... zero.... remember?

Well, when the commissioner tells you to let him go before agreeing to what the compensation would be, you have to, regardless if we lose the leverage.


Now - people who think they're getting Buchholtz or Lester are flat out confused too. There's no way they're getting a star player back in any deal, period, unless they're giving fair value and Farrell was a throw-in type piece. I expect Toronto to target guys like Bubby De La Rosa and likely settle for a little less. I actually expect Farrell to coach in Boston next year - sign there long term and build them back from the ground up. He gets a lot of flack in Toronto but he's a pretty good character, I've grown to like him but I think a change in scenery could do everyone some good.

I was thinking someone like Daniel Bard or Mark Melancon.

SirHizz
09-08-2012, 10:22 AM
Of course you fail to mention Boston completely screwed that deal up by letting Theo go without having prior confirmation on what the compensation would be. Boston had zero leverage.... zero.... remember?


And of course you fail to mention that Theo was already a proven commodity and one of the best/most successful GM's in the game. Can the same be said about Farrell? Nope.

And if the owners wanted, we could have sidelined Theo for one year.

We just had to accept the fact that managers/GM's aren't that valuable in the baseball world...and that will be shown once again when Farrell gets traded to Boston.

MG956
09-08-2012, 10:59 AM
Why would Farrell, or anyone else, want to manage here after the last two seasons?

homie564
09-08-2012, 11:26 AM
The Red Sox get Carpenter for Epstein, but Toronto is going to get Jon Lester/Dustin Pedroia/Clay Buccholz for John Farrell? Expect someone more like Che Hsuan Lin, Stolmy Pimental,or maybe like Daniel Nava who would probably still be an overpayment.

Station 13
09-08-2012, 11:46 AM
Why would Farrell, or anyone else, want to manage here after the last two seasons?

There a lot of guys who will want to manage here.

GNick
09-08-2012, 12:38 PM
Compensation for Epstein was a 26 year old reliever who was barely a prospect. Good luck getting anything more than a marginal C+ to B- prospect. I'm perfectly fine not going after Farrell at all. Ryne Sandberg has my confidence with his approach and in the way that he's had to bust his *** to earn a MLB job.

This will have nothing to do with Epstein! Toronto won't give Farrell to division rival unless something comes back. He's knows Boston without Farrell Sox won't get 50% of the potential out of Lester, Buckholz, etc... AA won't shoot himself in the foot like that. He's got the Red Sox out of the pennant race with no Farrell.

Red Sox want him bad and any manager who is good won't go there knowing the job will be Farrell's in 2014. Doubt Red Sox will piss away their 2013 season over 1 decent player in return for Farrell. It could be a simple deal like Bard for Lind. Or a major trade involving Raasmus, Ellsbury, etc...

bagwell368
09-08-2012, 12:46 PM
This will have nothing to do with Epstein! Toronto won't give Farrell to division rival unless something comes back. He's knows Boston without Farrell Sox won't get 50% of the potential out of Lester, Buckholz, etc... AA won't shoot himself in the foot like that. He's got the Red Sox out of the pennant race with no Farrell.

Red Sox want him bad and any manager who is good won't go there knowing the job will be Farrell's in 2014. Doubt Red Sox will piss away their 2013 season over 1 decent player in return for Farrell. It could be a simple deal like Bard for Lind. Or a major trade involving Raasmus, Ellsbury, etc...

I'm sorry but this is bloody nonsense. No manager or pitching coach in the history of the game has or could double a pitchers quality output across an entire staff - in particular since he'd be a Manager and not a pitching coach.

SirHizz
09-08-2012, 12:52 PM
Why would Farrell, or anyone else, want to manage here after the last two seasons?

Well, because it's still a great franchise afterall. And of course we've just shed 260 Million Dollar, so the manager can expect to get immediate help, even though it might not be a Hamilton. I expect us to put together a roster that is able to contend for a playoff-spot.
And with Bobby, we have hit rock bottom, it can only go up from here on. That's a great and "sexy" opportunity for any manager.

StryderSox
09-08-2012, 02:45 PM
This will have nothing to do with Epstein! Toronto won't give Farrell to division rival unless something comes back. He's knows Boston without Farrell Sox won't get 50% of the potential out of Lester, Buckholz, etc... AA won't shoot himself in the foot like that. He's got the Red Sox out of the pennant race with no Farrell.

Red Sox want him bad and any manager who is good won't go there knowing the job will be Farrell's in 2014. Doubt Red Sox will piss away their 2013 season over 1 decent player in return for Farrell. It could be a simple deal like Bard for Lind. Or a major trade involving Raasmus, Ellsbury, etc...

If you think that a player like Ellsbury or Bard are coming as compensation you need to smoke some more of those drugs you are on (even if it is as part of a deal for Lind or Rasmus)

grandsalami
09-10-2012, 07:47 PM
The Blue Jays shouldn’t part with manager John Farrell unless they are confident they can hire a comparable replacement and make the Red Sox pay dearly for their former pitching coach, Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports writes. The Blue Jays could start by asking for Clay Buchholz again, Rosenthal suggests. Here’s more from around MLB, starting with Farrell...
(MLBTR)

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA........

AI
09-10-2012, 07:56 PM
Laughable.

GNick
09-10-2012, 08:00 PM
The Blue Jays shouldn’t part with manager John Farrell unless they are confident they can hire a comparable replacement and make the Red Sox pay dearly for their former pitching coach, Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports writes. The Blue Jays could start by asking for Clay Buchholz again, Rosenthal suggests. Here’s more from around MLB, starting with Farrell...
(MLBTR)

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA........

As a Jays fan I wouldn't deal Farrell for Buchholz. Why aid a divisional rival who is sinking? Without Farrell Sox won't get 50% out of their rotation. Without starting pitching they are going nowhere, 2013 be like 2012 for them. Keep it that way!!

AI
09-10-2012, 08:14 PM
As a Jays fan I wouldn't deal Farrell for Buchholz. Why aid a divisional rival who is sinking? Without Farrell Sox won't get 50% out of their rotation. Without starting pitching they are going nowhere, 2013 be like 2012 for them. Keep it that way!!

WTF are you talking about? You're delusional. I'm not even going to bother since you've made it painfully obvious that you lack the knowledge to go back and forth with me.

50% of the rotation? Who ever heard of a manager who would increase his pitcher's performance by such an amount, absolutely laughable. As for how our pitching will fair in 2013? Step away from your magical crystal ball buddy, what we do remains to be seen.

bagwell368
09-10-2012, 08:17 PM
As a Jays fan I wouldn't deal Farrell for Buchholz. Why aid a divisional rival who is sinking? Without Farrell Sox won't get 50% out of their rotation. Without starting pitching they are going nowhere, 2013 be like 2012 for them. Keep it that way!!

Rubbish.... Prove this 50% claim - as you were already asked.

He's done such a bang up job with the Blow Jays....

torontosports10
09-10-2012, 08:19 PM
I don't know how he can say 50% like the role a pitching coach has is a science, and even then he would be a manager and have to deal with the entire offense as well.

That said, all Kenny Rosenthal said is to ask for him and set the bar high to let them know your not donating Farrell to them, which happens in everv negotiations, especially inter divisional.

At the end of the day, I see Farrell staying, unless they offer something significant, which they shouldn't for a manager.

bagwell368
09-10-2012, 08:24 PM
I don't know how he can say 50% like the role a pitching coach has is a science, and even then he would be a manager and have to deal with the entire offense as well.

That said, all Kenny Rosenthal said is to ask for him and set the bar high to let them know your not donating Farrell to them, which happens in everv negotiations, especially inter divisional.

At the end of the day, I see Farrell staying, unless they offer something significant, which they shouldn't for a manager.

I see Farrell not extending with Toronto so he can play the Sox off against the Jays to max out his next deal. He'd be stupid to do anything else.

AI
09-10-2012, 08:26 PM
I don't know how he can say 50% like the role a pitching coach has is a science, and even then he would be a manager and have to deal with the entire offense as well.

Finally a Toronto fan with a brain.


That said, all Kenny Rosenthal said is to ask for him and set the bar high to let them know your not donating Farrell to them, which happens in everv negotiations, especially inter divisional.

Did you follow the Theo compensation talks? We asked for Garza, Castro, etc in exchange for our "wonderboy GM" (a position that has far more importance than a manager) and had to settle for a post prospect and a RP spec.

Where do these guys we got as compensation for Theo rank in our farm? Chris Carptenter (24) and Aaron Kurcz (42). Expect a similar return but nothing "significant".

Crucis
09-10-2012, 09:08 PM
Did you follow the Theo compensation talks? We asked for Garza, Castro, etc in exchange for our "wonderboy GM" (a position that has far more importance than a manager) and had to settle for a post prospect and a RP spec.

Where do these guys we got as compensation for Theo rank in our farm? Chris Carptenter (24) and Aaron Kurcz (42). Expect a similar return but nothing "significant".

Yeah, but don't forget that the Sox had already let Theo go to the Cubs BEFORE there was any talk of compensation. The Sox had given up most of their leverage.

grandsalami
09-10-2012, 09:14 PM
Yeah, but don't forget that the Sox had already let Theo go to the Cubs BEFORE there was any talk of compensation. The Sox had given up most of their leverage.

Once again thats a misconception.... BUD wanted them to announce the move before the WS so that fiasco would not overshadow the WS.... Once bud forced them to announce it, nothing the sox could do

Crucis
09-10-2012, 09:24 PM
Once again thats a misconception.... BUD wanted them to announce the move before the WS so that fiasco would not overshadow the WS.... Once bud forced them to announce it, nothing the sox could do

Irrelevant. Whether the Sox let him go, or Selig forced it, the fact is that Theo was gone before the compensation was settled, and thus the Sox lost their leverage.

grandsalami
09-10-2012, 09:26 PM
Irrelevant. Whether the Sox let him go, or Selig forced it, the fact is that Theo was gone before the compensation was settled, and thus the Sox lost their leverage.

actually it is 100% relevant. because bud forced them to announce the move the sox could not hold him hostage until the compensation was settled. since bud forced them to announce it... it became more complicated, Had bud let them do this all on there own. the move may not have been announced till closer to ST....

Crucis
09-10-2012, 10:38 PM
actually it is 100% relevant. because bud forced them to announce the move the sox could not hold him hostage until the compensation was settled. since bud forced them to announce it... it became more complicated, Had bud let them do this all on there own. the move may not have been announced till closer to ST....

The Red Sox could have told Selig to eff off until the compensation was determined. They didn't. Their fault.

Nomar
09-10-2012, 10:48 PM
The Red Sox could have told Selig to eff off until the compensation was determined. They didn't. Their fault.

Not so sure thats true.

grandsalami
09-10-2012, 10:52 PM
The Red Sox could have told Selig to eff off until the compensation was determined. They didn't. Their fault.

If your boss tells you to get it done ASAP, you get it done... Go tell your boss to **** off, and see if you still have a job the next day

grandsalami
09-10-2012, 10:52 PM
Not so sure thats true.

exactly

AI
09-10-2012, 10:54 PM
There's NOTHING the Sox could do once Selig basically giftwrapped Theo.

Nomar
09-11-2012, 01:01 AM
Regardless of this mini-argument, no major league ready talent (maybe a RP) or significant prospect would be given as comp, so talking about Buchholz rivals something that Jose Canseco would announce to us over the internet with his shirt off (if you guys catch the reference).

GNick
09-11-2012, 02:36 AM
WTF are you talking about? You're delusional. I'm not even going to bother since you've made it painfully obvious that you lack the knowledge to go back and forth with me.

50% of the rotation? Who ever heard of a manager who would increase his pitcher's performance by such an amount, absolutely laughable. As for how our pitching will fair in 2013? Step away from your magical crystal ball buddy, what we do remains to be seen.

Red Sox rotation imploded after Farrell left. He got the most out of them, Lester, Bard, Lackey, Buchholz not same without him. If Farrell there collapse of '11 doesn't happen. Why aid the Red Sox by trading them Farrell? AA would know Sox out of 2013 playoff picture with their pitching. Why would he help them when he has them out of contention?

GNick
09-11-2012, 02:40 AM
Yeah, but don't forget that the Sox had already let Theo go to the Cubs BEFORE there was any talk of compensation. The Sox had given up most of their leverage.

Why not settle on compensation package before allowing Cubs to talk to Theo? They can't talk to him if under contract to Sox. Sounds odd way of handling situation.

bagwell368
09-11-2012, 06:18 AM
Red Sox rotation imploded after Farrell left. He got the most out of them, Lester, Bard, Lackey, Buchholz not same without him. If Farrell there collapse of '11 doesn't happen. Why aid the Red Sox by trading them Farrell?

Collapse?

2010 Red Sox Team Pitching ERA+: 104

2011 Red Sox Team Pitching ERA+: 104

Is this the 50% you were talking about?

I find that before making claims it's best to do the research so as to avoid getting pig piled for being dead wrong.

bagwell368
09-11-2012, 06:19 AM
Why not settle on compensation package before allowing Cubs to talk to Theo? They can't talk to him if under contract to Sox. Sounds odd way of handling situation.

You have that right.

GNick
09-11-2012, 06:43 AM
Collapse?

2010 Red Sox Team Pitching ERA+: 104

2011 Red Sox Team Pitching ERA+: 104

Is this the 50% you were talking about?

I find that before making claims it's best to do the research so as to avoid getting pig piled for being dead wrong.

Has to be his past success handling Boston's pitching staff....why else Red Sox after Farrell? Look at Lester, look at Buchholz, look at Bard? This makes twice Boston have come hard after Farrell. They must want him bad! Wouldn't be because what he has accomplished with the Jays. He's been okay at best. It's not because of lack of manager candidates, there are many top ones available. There is nothing else.

bagwell368
09-11-2012, 08:10 AM
Has to be his past success handling Boston's pitching staff....why else Red Sox after Farrell? Look at Lester, look at Buchholz, look at Bard? This makes twice Boston have come hard after Farrell. They must want him bad! Wouldn't be because what he has accomplished with the Jays. He's been okay at best. It's not because of lack of manager candidates, there are many top ones available. There is nothing else.

I suppose this is what a fan of another team sees. Farrell was respected and even feared by some pitchers and some everyday players. He was seen as one of the unusual few pitching coaches that had a broad enough view of the game (both traditional and SABR), and carried enough gravitas to get respect from all players to actually work. He was also the clear heir to TF, but he got sick of waiting.

Coaches in football are worth something to sign away, but in baseball? In some cases perhaps in most - no. The Red Sox are not giving up Buchholz to sign him because they can always get the message to his agent that they'll beat the heck out any Blue Jays extension offer. If they can get him to agree and then he tells the Jays to make plans for 2014 because he won't be around his value in a deal goes down to the PTBNL level.

The cost for the Sox is another wasted year if they really want Farrell which is why they will very publicly kick the tires on a number of candidates after BV is axed. If Toronto can work that out for themselves than they might actually get a real warm body, but, it won't be a SP, even one with injury issues. that's great one year, very well another, decent in a 3rd, and meh in the 4th of his last 4 years.

BTW, I'd still like to hear about this 50%.

AI
09-11-2012, 02:27 PM
If we can't get Farrell, I would like to see us go after Ryne Sandberg.

StryderSox
09-11-2012, 02:50 PM
Personally I am still on the Dave Martinez/Mike Maddux bus. Outside of those two I think Dave Roberts could be interesting but as I mentioned before lacks experience and might not be ready.

AI
09-11-2012, 02:54 PM
Personally I am still on the Dave Martinez/Mike Maddux bus. Outside of those two I think Dave Roberts could be interesting but as I mentioned before lacks experience and might not be ready.

Mike Maddux is also a guy I like, not sure he'd leave Texas or would want to come to Boston though.

-Lavigne43-
09-11-2012, 05:50 PM
It depends on what Farrell wants really. If he really wants to be the Red Sox manager he will come and we should not have to give up anything we care about to get him. The Jays are not going to keep a lame duck, pissed off manager for a year if they want to move forward. If he doesn't have a strong preference to be the Red Sox manager then the Jays will ask for a lot, and he will probably end up playing this off for an extension.

It would simply be stupid to give up anything that hurts for Farrell, or any manager out there not named Joe Maddon. And by "hurt" I mean a B level prospect.

Nomar
09-11-2012, 05:57 PM
It depends on what Farrell wants really. If he really wants to be the Red Sox manager he will come and we should not have to give up anything we care about to get him. The Jays are not going to keep a lame duck, pissed off manager for a year if they want to move forward. If he doesn't have a strong preference to be the Red Sox manager then the Jays will ask for a lot, and he will probably end up playing this off for an extension.

It would simply be stupid to give up anything that hurts for Farrell, or any manager out there not named Joe Maddon. And by "hurt" I mean a B level prospect.

Totally agree, but Joe Maddon is an overrated tool.

-Lavigne43-
09-11-2012, 06:09 PM
His defensive positioning has more of an impact on the field than anything any other manager does well. The last 3 years the Rays lead the league in pitching babip and it's not even close.

Nomar
09-11-2012, 06:35 PM
His defensive positioning has more of an impact on the field than anything any other manager does well. The last 3 years the Rays lead the league in pitching babip and it's not even close.

I just think he tries all of these radical things just to look smart, but to your point, just look at Hellickson.

Hellickson's career ERA is 3.15, and since entereing the league, he is always high up the leaderboard in ERA. That's great for him, but his career FIP/xFIP is 4.60. Thats a huge difference. Hard to deny that Maddon's defensive shifts aren't the reason for this big gap that favors Hellickson.

No other Rays pitchers are outperformers like Hellickson is though, so im reluctant to buy into Joe Maddon's whole genius image. He's a good manager regardless, but i dont consider him the best.

todu82
09-11-2012, 08:09 PM
Farrell's a good coach but I doubt Toronto would want to get rid of him. I'd rather we go after Dave Martinez or Mike Maddux.

JobaRules26
09-12-2012, 02:29 AM
The ownership is what is killing you guys. LL and John Henry are the absolute worse. Get rid of those two clowns and bring back Francona. Personally, I hope Girardi is canned and Tito comes to the Bronx. I always thought Demarlo Hale would have been good too.

Nomar
09-12-2012, 09:23 AM
The ownership is what is killing you guys. LL and John Henry are the absolute worse. Get rid of those two clowns and bring back Francona. Personally, I hope Girardi is canned and Tito comes to the Bronx. I always thought Demarlo Hale would have been good too.

Girardi is a good manager

AI
09-12-2012, 12:32 PM
Please fire Girardi, that way we can sign him.

JobaRules26
09-12-2012, 06:21 PM
Please fire Girardi, that way we can sign him.

Girardi and Cano for Pedroia and Ciriaco? =)

AI
09-13-2012, 01:54 PM
Nope, keep Cano and what will soon be a $200M contact.

GNick
09-30-2012, 05:12 PM
AA said during yesterday's Yankees game Farrell is his manager for 2013. So, looks like Red Sox has to go in different direction

Towelie
09-30-2012, 05:18 PM
AA said during yesterday's Yankees game Farrell is his manager for 2013. So, looks like Red Sox has to go in different direction

Means nothing.

bagwell368
09-30-2012, 07:57 PM
Not this thread again.... Look just give the Jays whatever they want or nothing - but enough of this pitiable thread.

infernoscurse
09-30-2012, 09:18 PM
@Jen_Royle: Source: Jays willing to let Farrell go Boston as long as they're compensated due to friction btwn JF and GM Alex Anthopoulos

buchholz for farrell :D

Towelie
09-30-2012, 10:05 PM
buchholz for farrell :D

Would never happen in a million years. I don't even see a major leaguer being part of any deal let alone a pitcher who would be the best pitcher for the Jays.

SirHizz
10-01-2012, 01:03 AM
They can have Carpenter, he's even better than he was a year ago when we got him. Buchholz for Farrell is laughable and not even worth a formal discussion.

wolf82
10-01-2012, 08:06 AM
buchholz for farrell :D


Zach Stewart for Farrell more like it. Jays are not getting anything close to a MLB ready player for him.

Nomar
10-01-2012, 11:16 AM
Zach Stewart for Farrell more like it. Jays are not getting anything close to a MLB ready player for him.

I think a bullpen guy isnt out of question. Carpenter had MLB experience when we got him.

infernoscurse
10-01-2012, 02:12 PM
why would the bluejays want zack stewart back, they got rid of him for a reason

Nomar
10-01-2012, 02:14 PM
Inferno, why do think they deserve anything more than a guy like Stewart for a manager of a team with almost 90 losses?

bagwell368
10-02-2012, 12:24 PM
Jim Duquette says there are problems with Farrell and his GM, and that Farrell has expressed that he wants to go to Boston.

The problems between AA and Farrell is supposed to be quite intense.

If that's true the worst thing for the Sox or Farrell is to talk about it, it just drives up the price.

OTOH having a lame duck Manager isn't wise either.

Whatever it is, just hire the new Manager with 3 weeks and make sure BC looks to be the leader in doing it.

infernoscurse
10-02-2012, 01:23 PM
Inferno, why do think they deserve anything more than a guy like Stewart for a manager of a team with almost 90 losses?

i dont, but you must understand also I am a yankee fan and buchholz to the jays would be funny, for me :D

i think managers are overrated so i wouldnt trade a big leaguer for a manager

Nomar
10-02-2012, 01:36 PM
i dont, but you must understand also I am a yankee fan and buchholz to the jays would be funny, for me :D

i think managers are overrated so i wouldnt trade a big leaguer for a manager

Understandable :). That makes two of us though on the second part.

bagwell368
10-02-2012, 02:31 PM
i think managers are overrated so i wouldnt trade a big leaguer for a manager

I would!

John Lackey - done