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THE MTL
08-20-2012, 06:16 PM
He already is considered better than lebron james. It is up to lebron to catch kobe. however lebron doesnt have to win as many rings in my opinion. If lebron can get another 2 rings, i would consider him better than kobe

LakersSaintsLSU
08-20-2012, 06:16 PM
How long are ppl going to use Horry as a reponse? lol

OMG i say at least 50 people in the last year has said the same thing....face it guys this man is a effin god on the bball court......

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:16 PM
Get him a girlfriend? He doesn't contribute. He just spews Kobe hate all day everyday.
I have a girlfriend bro. :hi5:

I don't hate on Kobe but I am against people overrating him.

I am allowed to voice my opinion in a respectful manner.

The majority of people agree with where I rank him anyway so... I don't feel I am in the wrong here. :D

Thought I was on your ignore list? LoL.

TmacBryant
08-20-2012, 06:17 PM
I hate Wade, but 09 Wade > any of Kobe's years.



30, 7, 5, 2, 1 while shooting 50%. :worthy::worthy::worthy::worthy:


Too bad he was surrounded by bonefide scrubs.

Idk why people always make these comparisons, playing against crappy teams will get you better stats.

The east was so bad in 2009 that the bobcats made the playoffs ahead of chicago x.x

LakersSaintsLSU
08-20-2012, 06:18 PM
your new name is kobe's #1 fanboy.

Exactly just shut your *** down like i always do....so run along and find a "NEW" recycled comment to post,whats wrong mad kobe aint on your team? o my bad you had to get to wannabe kobes to win a...wait for it!!!!....lockout ring*

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 06:18 PM
kobe only has 2 finals mvp's. ****, lebron will be tied with him after next season.

Lebron will be crying after he loses to Kobe in 6 games in the nba finals, that is if the heat make it that far

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:18 PM
Lebron will be crying after he loses to Kobe in 6 games in the nba finals, that is if the heat make it that far

Cool story bro. Tell it again.

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 06:20 PM
Yeah and 00-02 or 09-2010 Kobe isn't even in the same breath as 00-02 Shaq or 91-93 Jordan.

Are their Rings of equal value?

Dude, I never said Kobe was better or even close to Jordan. He's not, nobody is. Shaq is the most dominant player of all time, sure he is a HUGE reason Kobe has 3/5 rings, but you can't disregard what Kobe contributed. They were an unbelievable dynamic duo.

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:21 PM
Exactly just shut your *** down like i always do....so run along and find a "NEW" recycled comment to post,whats wrong mad kobe aint on your team? o my bad you had to get to wannabe kobes to win a...wait for it!!!!....lockout ring*

Lebron>kobe. Why would anyone be mad that they have lebron instead of kobe.:)

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:21 PM
Idk why people always make these comparisons, playing against crappy teams will get you better stats.

The east was so bad in 2009 that the bobcats made the playoffs ahead of chicago x.x

The East had a few strong teams in 2009 and it isn't like ECF teams don't face WCF teams.

Weak attempt to diminish the GOAT level season Wade had in 2009.

He was absolutely incredible that year.
GOAT level first-step/slashing ability combined with a deadly mid-range J and a solid 3pt shot with his Peak Athleticism and DPOY level defense... he was flawless that year... no weaknesses.
His roster was disgustingly horrible... probably worse then what Kobe had in 06 but he still single handedly took a strong/deep Hawks team to 7 games.
The same Hawks who took the Finals winning Celtics to 7 games.

Only SG I have ever seen better then 09 Wade is Late 80's / Early 90's Jordan.

LakersSaintsLSU
08-20-2012, 06:22 PM
Stop comparing little wade to kobe if we had to play the nets,bobcats,knicks,bucks and any other crappy eastern team then he would average 35 ppg easy with his eyes closed,you guys will never win an argument with a laker fan because we are the BEST franchise ever(celtics better hold on to that number 1 spot as tight as they can because that wall's coming down soon) and we have the best playyer to play since MJ retired and he's on OUR team not some one else's team lets talk about YOUR team greats.....ill wait......im waiting.......hello anybody home!!!!

ThunderousDemon
08-20-2012, 06:23 PM
Pathetic homers from both sides. Don't you people get tired of having the same damn argument in every thread.

BigCityofDreams
08-20-2012, 06:24 PM
OMG i say at least 50 people in the last year has said the same thing....face it guys this man is a effin god on the bball court......

Last yr??? Try the last like 7 or 8 lol. Are rings the end all be? Of course not but it's when the rings are added to everything the rest of the resume that makes a difference. Dilfer and Manning have the same number of SBs but would anyone in their right mind say they are on the same level.

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:24 PM
Dude, I never said Kobe was better or even close to Jordan. He's not, nobody is. Shaq is the most dominant player of all time, sure he is a HUGE reason Kobe has 3/5 rings, but you can't disregard what Kobe contributed. They were an unbelievable dynamic duo.
I don't disregard it.

However it was still a Jordan / Pippen dynamic.

Shaq in 00-02 was having one of the most dominant 3 year runs in the history of the game including two top #5 All-Time playoff runs.

Kobe in 00 and 02 wasn't even on the same level as Peak Pippen.

So while Kobe was a great #2 he was still a sidekick and for 2/3 years just an All-Star level player.

Those Rings (like Pippens) aren't worth the same as the Rings Shaq and Jordan won.

Do you really think these stats below are just a coincidence and we should ignore them?


Playoff PER

A's (Main Star) :
Shaq (00-02) : 29
Jordan (91-93 + 96-98) : 28.53

B's (Side-Kicks) :
Kobe (00-02) : 21
Pippen (91-93 + 96-98) : 19.5

SaimuKala
08-20-2012, 06:24 PM
The East had a few strong teams in 2009 and it isn't like ECF teams don't face WCF teams.

Weak attempt to diminish the GOAT level season Wade had in 2009.

He was absolutely incredible that year.
GOAT level first-step/slashing ability combined with a deadly mid-range J and a solid 3pt shot with his Peak Athleticism and DPOY level defense... he was flawless that year... no weaknesses.
His roster was disgustingly horrible... probably worse then what Kobe had in 06 but he still single handedly took a strong/deep Hawks team to 7 games.
The same Hawks who took the Finals winning Celtics to 7 games.

Only SG I have ever seen better then 09 Wade is Late 80's / Early 90's Jordan.

Are you a heat fan?

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:25 PM
He already is considered better than lebron james. It is up to lebron to catch kobe. however lebron doesnt have to win as many rings in my opinion. If lebron can get another 2 rings, i would consider him better than kobe

No doubt. If lebron wins 2 more finals mvp's he passes kobe.

LakersSaintsLSU
08-20-2012, 06:25 PM
Lebron>kobe. Why would anyone be mad that they have lebron instead of kobe.:)

Lebron??Lmao yeah the same coward who ran from cleveland and joined dwade's coat tails for a LOCKOUT ring....i dont remeber kobe leaving L.A. to ride someone else's coat tails? you know why? because he sheets on lebron and pisses on dwade,for bosh? he just slaps his fairy ***** and he falls to sleep

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:25 PM
Is this thread for real? Kobe is underNOTHING. My god, I will never get why some fans in certain cities need validation for their homer thoughts.

Sorry, but Kobe is not the best player I have seen in my lifetime. Magic, Bird, Michael, and next is Bron, are all better, Timmy has a case.

As if its such a slap in the face to give a man a top 10 ever status, and then have the audacity to criticize part of his game...

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:26 PM
Lebron??Lmao yeah the same coward who ran from cleveland and joined dwade's coat tails for a LOCKOUT ring....i dont remeber kobe leaving L.A. to ride someone else's coat tails? you know why? because he sheets on lebron and pisses on dwade,for bosh? he just slaps his fairy ***** and he falls to sleep

He tried.

lebron>kobe no argument there.

LakersSaintsLSU
08-20-2012, 06:26 PM
Last yr??? Try the last like 7 or 8 lol. Are rings the end all be? Of course not but it's when the rings are added to everything the rest of the resume that makes a difference. Dilfer and Manning have the same number of SBs but would anyone in their right mind say they are on the same level.

LMAO come on laker haters your getting your *** handed to you in this forum....either back down or continue to receive this beatdown

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 06:27 PM
I don't disregard it.

However it was still a Jordan / Pippen dynamic.

Shaq in 00-02 was having one of the most dominant 3 year runs in the history of the game including two top #5 All-Time playoff runs.

Kobe in 00 and 02 wasn't even on the same level as Peak Pippen.

So while Kobe was a great #2 he was still a sidekick and for 2/3 years just an All-Star level player.

Those Rings (like Pippens) aren't worth the same as the Rings Shaq and Jordan won.

Do you really think these stats below are just a coincidence and we should ignore them?

Again...why are you acting like I ever said Kobe is better than Jordan or Shaq? Do I need to say it again?

and Pippens rings aren't worth the same as Kobes rings. Kobe >>>>>>>>>>>>> Pippen

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:27 PM
Are you a heat fan?

No but I have always been a Wade fan. :)

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:29 PM
Again...why are you acting like I ever said Kobe is better than Jordan or Shaq? Do I need to say it again?

I'm not.
We're cool bro. :cheers:

Kobe is one of the greatest ever and I don't disrespect him.
I just feel strongly that there are 5 players he can never surpass and maybe 4-5 others who will always have a case against him by time he retires.

This isn't including Lebron who I feel will eventually surpass Kobe.

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:29 PM
is this another Kobe/Bron debate.

Look, LeBron's numbers crush Kobe's. Always have, and they will career wise. The one crutch Kobe fans and media had in general, was LeBron hadn't won. Well he is 28, Kobe on the decline. Kobe's legacy is written, even more rings at this point won't do much, he isn't the best player on his team anymore and is in decline. LeBron has won a ring, a Finals MVP, and is collecting trophies and awards now. When its all over he will have the hardware, and his stats will push him ahead of Kobe. I am sorry that upsets so many of you Kobe fans, get over it, many fans had to get over Kobe bumping their guy as well. Its called the evolution and progression of basketball. There will always be someone better.

Kelly Gruber
08-20-2012, 06:29 PM
I think it's because a lot of those other guys made a lot of spectacular athletic plays all over the court, whereas Kobe just throws up 437 shots a game...

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:30 PM
Insecure lakers fans need to relax. Lebron is better than kobe now. If you think otherwise you need a reality check.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 06:31 PM
Anytime your a global icon, Haters are always out there, mainly though because he plays for the Lakers, people don't like him

I don't hate him because he's never really done anything drastic that would make him a target for hate...

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:31 PM
is this another Kobe/Bron debate.

Look, LeBron's numbers crush Kobe's. Always have, and they will career wise. The one crutch Kobe fans and media had in general, was LeBron hadn't won. Well he is 28, Kobe on the decline. Kobe's legacy is written, even more rings at this point won't do much, he isn't the best player on his team anymore and is in decline. LeBron has won a ring, a Finals MVP, and is collecting trophies and awards now. When its all over he will have the hardware, and his stats will push him ahead of Kobe. I am sorry that upsets so many of you Kobe fans, get over it, many fans had to get over Kobe bumping their guy as well. Its called the evolution and progression of basketball. There will always be someone better.
:clap::clap::clap::clap:

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:32 PM
:facepalm: is this another "charles barkley" post? 5=rings vs 1 lockout ring NUFF SAID just stfu

Lebron + 8 years of Prime Shaq = how many rings?
:speechless::smoking:

JNoel
08-20-2012, 06:32 PM
:facepalm: is this another "charles barkley" post? 5=rings vs 1 lockout ring NUFF SAID just stfu

Ouch insulting a mod :speechless:

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:32 PM
:facepalm: is this another "charles barkley" post?

You measure individuals by team accomplishments? No wonder you are so confused...

why would you tell a moderator to stfu?

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 06:32 PM
And these so called coaches and players have kobe in the top 5 of all time?

Yes they do actually. I saw a vid of chuck having Kobe in top 10 in 2009, I believe he updated that earlier last year to top 5 also... I think he totally ****ed up having Kareem out of it rather than big O.

and there is the respect from nba superstars who ACTUALLY have to play with him... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxYZAgKRtM8&feature=relmfu

this is from only 08 btw.

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 06:34 PM
If this is becoming a Kobe/LeBron debate...bottom line is: Kobe is better than LeBron all time, LeBron is better now..LeBron has the potential to eventually surpass Kobe in the rankings. Unless you can tell the future, that is all you need to know.

And this is coming from a huge LeBron fan.

ThunderousDemon
08-20-2012, 06:34 PM
Tick......Tock......Tick......Tock......Tick...... Tock......

Teeboy1487
08-20-2012, 06:35 PM
That's the nature of the world. Different strokes for different folks. Kobe is an all time great. He has had a legendary career and as a fan, it's been a privilege following his career for most of my life. I don't care who is better than Kobe or who he is better than. I'm a fan of Kobe and I'm a Lakers fan for life. I wouldn't care what one site says about him considering how polarizing he is. We all know this, Kobe has had a Hall of Fame career and at the end of day, he will be known as an all time great in this league no matter what anyone says.

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:35 PM
Go suck on lebron wiener while dwade slaps you on your bum

:laugh:

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:35 PM
Yes they do actually. I saw a vid of chuck having Kobe in top 10 in 2009, I believe he updated that earlier last year to top 5 also... I think he totally ****ed up having Kareem out of it rather than big O.

and there is the respect from nba superstars who ACTUALLY have to play with him... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxYZAgKRtM8&feature=relmfu

this is from only 08 btw.

nobody probably remembers my posts on this before, but listening to players and ex-players rank players is a joke. They factor way too much team success, because that is indeed what made them happiest. Fact is, when you rank individuals, you can't just factor in team success at a higher rate than individual play. Of course the young NBA players think Kobe is the greatest, they want 5 titles and to play with Shaq/Gasol/Bynum/Phil type teams as well. They are not evaluating correctly.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 06:37 PM
Yes i see your doing your best to stay away from the sharp edge of my sword,when lebron actually knows how to shoot the ball,have the master footwork of kobe, n fact turn himself into kobe then you can open our piehole....
you guys cried like girls when we had cp3 for a few hours but when lebron joins dwade i guess that didnt take away from him being a great? go suck on lebron wiener while dwade slaps you on your bum

Currently Lebron is better than Kobe, Last year I would have said it was Kobe but Lebron's on another level now

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 06:38 PM
is this another Kobe/Bron debate.

Look, LeBron's numbers crush Kobe's. Always have, and they will career wise. The one crutch Kobe fans and media had in general, was LeBron hadn't won. Well he is 28, Kobe on the decline. Kobe's legacy is written, even more rings at this point won't do much, he isn't the best player on his team anymore and is in decline. LeBron has won a ring, a Finals MVP, and is collecting trophies and awards now. When its all over he will have the hardware, and his stats will push him ahead of Kobe. I am sorry that upsets so many of you Kobe fans, get over it, many fans had to get over Kobe bumping their guy as well. Its called the evolution and progression of basketball. There will always be someone better.

People only brought up the fact that Lebron hadn't won a ring so much due to the fact there were already Lebron fans ranking him ahead of all-time greats (including Kobe). He is on the right path now winning it all this year, but
I dont think 1 championship > 5 championship is correct last time I checked.
yes you said hes only 28 and Kobe has a few years left... Kobe isint the only player hungry for rings, Durant is only 23 or 24 i believe.

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:39 PM
Some of these posters are clueless still think a 34year old kobe is better than lebron, the best player in the league in his prime. Yea, fools running wild in here.

Season can't start soon enough.

ThunderousDemon
08-20-2012, 06:39 PM
Can a mod just merge the other five Heat and lakers related threads if they aren't going to close them?

BigCityofDreams
08-20-2012, 06:43 PM
LMAO come on laker haters your getting your *** handed to you in this forum....either back down or continue to receive this beatdown

:clap:

For real though I'm sick of hearing well "Horry has 7 rings is he better than Jordan" SMH forget an MVP award Horry never made an AS team.

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:45 PM
People only brought up the fact that Lebron hadn't won a ring so much due to the fact there were already Lebron fans ranking him ahead of all-time greats (including Kobe). He is on the right path now winning it all this year, but

You will have to pardon me, but B.S. dude. I, and anyone else, said LeBron had individual seasons better than Kobe, but was not near him in the all time rankings. I still think he is a few spots behind Kobe. Anyone who thought Bron had the better career between the two before June is laughable.



I dont think 1 championship > 5 championship is correct last time I checked.

When we are ranking franchises, totally. Not individuals in a team sport..



yes you said hes only 28 and Kobe has a few years left... Kobe isint the only player hungry for rings, Durant is only 23 or 24 i believe.

Kobe has a couple years left as the clear 2nd banana, yet again (if he doesn't accept that role, bad things will happen in Lakerland). I never guaranteed more chips for Bron, but I will guarantee more hardware. If he ends up with 4-5 MVP's, all those accolades and all NBA/Defensive team numbers, with just one ring and a Finals MVP, if he continues with his statistical dominance, I rank him ahead of Kobe anyways.

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 06:45 PM
Currently Lebron is better than Kobe, Last year I would have said it was Kobe but Lebron's on another level now

LeBron has been better than Kobe for 4 seasons now.

ThunderousDemon
08-20-2012, 06:48 PM
Why hasn't this thread been closed yet?

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 06:50 PM
nobody probably remembers my posts on this before, but listening to players and ex-players rank players is a joke. They factor way too much team success, because that is indeed what made them happiest. Fact is, when you rank individuals, you can't just factor in team success at a higher rate than individual play. Of course the young NBA players think Kobe is the greatest, they want 5 titles and to play with Shaq/Gasol/Bynum/Phil type teams as well. They are not evaluating correctly.

Okay so having ex legends like Jerry west, Charles Barkley and other NBA analysts (who have been doing this for their entire lives), come out and say Kobe ranks that high; means nothing and they dont know how to evaluate players??
Then again we are just :horse: with this one as you are always the one saying Lebron is going to be greater.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 06:51 PM
LeBron has been better than Kobe for 4 seasons now.

Lebron has been better all-around for the past 4 seasons but the Kobe fanboys are basing the comparison on his footwork and scoring ability

st13o0
08-20-2012, 06:52 PM
He already is!!! He can shoot any where on the court, he's got better range, he stocked up on clutch shots and at the buzzer shots, and he has more rings..... Dude really...... Smh

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 06:52 PM
LeBron has more talent and potential than Kobe has ever dreamed of...that doesn't make him a better player all time, yet.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 06:53 PM
Hawkeye if Lebron stats keep up the same for the rest of his career but doesn't win any more championships there is no way in hell he will rank higher then Kobe he needs atleast 3 championships to pass him but that's if Kobe doesn't win anything from now on

Matter.
08-20-2012, 06:54 PM
I just want to put this out, But I remember the time when Jordan himself said Kobe is the only player that deserves to be compared to me.... The G.O.A.T himself said that....

PhillyFaninLA
08-20-2012, 06:54 PM
You rape someone and whether you get away from or not you deserve to be rotting in hell and not making millions in the nba...that is why I have no respect for Kobe...no part of me believe he is innocent or blames the girl.

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 06:55 PM
LeBron has more talent and potential than Kobe has ever dreamed of...that doesn't make him a better player all time, yet.
No one is saying lebron is better all time yet. thats crazy talk. at the same time, anyone thinking kobe is currently better than lebron is a ****ing idiot.

Hawkeye if Lebron stats keep up the same for the rest of his career but doesn't win any more championships there is no way in hell he will rank higher then Kobe he needs atleast 3 championships to pass him but that's if Kobe doesn't win anything from now on

:rolleyes:

Lebron is not done winning rings.

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:56 PM
Lebron has been better all-around for the past 4 seasons but the Kobe fanboys are basing the comparison on his footwork and scoring ability

Scoring + Offense / 2009-2012.

Regular season.

Lebron : 28ppg on 51%FG / 60%TS + 7.3apg (119 ORTG)
Kobe : 27ppg on 45%FG / 55%TS + 4.8apg (110 ORTG)
__________________________________________________ _

Playoffs.

Lebron : 29ppg on 49%FG / 59%TS + 6.3apg (118 ORTG)
Kobe : 29ppg on 45%FG / 55%TS + 5apg (113 ORTG)

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 06:59 PM
You rape someone and whether you get away from or not you deserve to be rotting in hell and not making millions in the nba...that is why I have no respect for Kobe...no part of me believe he is innocent or blames the girl.


Philly fans at its finest first of Kobe was innocent plus the girl had like 3 different types of semen from other men so next time you talk little boy please state the facts and last time I checked this was about basketball not someone's personal life which you no nothing about

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 06:59 PM
Hawkeye if Lebron stats keep up the same for the rest of his career but doesn't win any more championships there is no way in hell he will rank higher then Kobe he needs atleast 3 championships to pass him but that's if Kobe doesn't win anything from now on

Shaq's playoff stats are even better then Lebron's and he has 4+ Rings and yet you put Kobe over him don't you?

That is rather hypocritical. :burn:

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:05 PM
You will have to pardon me, but B.S. dude. I, and anyone else, said LeBron had individual seasons better than Kobe, but was not near him in the all time rankings. I still think he is a few spots behind Kobe. Anyone who thought Bron had the better career between the two before June is laughable.




When we are ranking franchises, totally. Not individuals in a team sport..




Kobe has a couple years left as the clear 2nd banana, yet again (if he doesn't accept that role, bad things will happen in Lakerland). I never guaranteed more chips for Bron, but I will guarantee more hardware. If he ends up with 4-5 MVP's, all those accolades and all NBA/Defensive team numbers, with just one ring and a Finals MVP, if he continues with his statistical dominance, I rank him ahead of Kobe anyways.

I can agree somewhat with this, I do think he will need a minimum of at least 1-2 more rings included though... However though we are getting back to those "If" statements rather than what has been accomplished by these players already. Not considering that is a very big IF with what I already mentioned players like Durant and Rose are accomplishing at their much younger age.

LakersKB24
08-20-2012, 07:05 PM
As player:Larry bird

3× NBA champion (1981, 1984, 1986)
2× NBA Finals MVP (1984, 1986)
3× NBA Most Valuable Player (1984–1986)
12× NBA All-Star (1980–1988, 1990–1992)
9× All-NBA First Team (1980–1988)
All-NBA Second Team (1990)
3× NBA All-Defensive Second Team (1982–1984)
NBA Rookie of the Year
(1980)
NBA All-Rookie First Team (1980)
NBA All-Star Game MVP (1982)
3× Three-point Shootout champion (1986–1988)
NBA's 50th Anniversary All-Time Team
No. 33 retired by Boston Celtics
John R. Wooden Award (1979)
Naismith College Player of the Year (1979)
AP National Player of the Year (1979)
Oscar Robertson Trophy (1979)
Adolph Rupp Trophy (1979)
NABC Player of the Year (1979)
2× MVC Player of the Year (1978, 1979)
2× Consensus NCAA All-American First Team (1978, 1979)

Career statistics
Points 21,791 (24.3 ppg)
Assists 5,695 (6.3 apg)
Rebounds 8,974 (10.0 rpg)

Kobe:
5× NBA champion (2000, 2001, 2002, 2009, 2010)
2× NBA Finals MVP (2009–2010)
NBA Most Valuable Player (2008)
14× NBA All-Star (1998, 2000–2012)
4× NBA All-Star Game MVP (2002, 2007, 2009, 2011)
2× NBA scoring champion (2006–2007)
10× All-NBA First Team (2002–2004, 2006–2012)
2× All-NBA Second Team (2000–2001)
2× All-NBA Third Team (1999, 2005)
9× NBA All-Defensive First Team (2000, 2003–2004, 2006–2011)
3× NBA All-Defensive Second Team (2001–2002, 2012)
NBA All-Rookie Second Team (1997)
NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion (1997)
Naismith Prep Player of the Year (1996)


Career stats: 25.4 ppg 4.7 ast 5.3 reb 1.5 steals

So how is Kobe not better then bird, and Russell is ****en overrated as hell

The most important stat out of all the above is the following:

3× NBA champion (1981, 1984, 1986)

5× NBA champion (2000, 2001, 2002, 2009, 2010)


The most outstanding fact about Kobe which makes him so great is that he was basically on top for over a decade! He won 5 championships over 10!!! years. And his window still hasn't closed yet.
When I think of Kobe of course the 81 game comes to mind, his consecutive 50 points games, outscoring the Mavs, Shaq&Kobe and of course the back to back championships. But the most remarkable thing to me is his longevity which in my opinion justifies considering him a Top 5 player (as of now) ever. Others that were considered on his level during his career, that were even drafted after him are far beyond their primes or even retired, now he's competing with the next generation of superstars and still can be considered a Top 5-10 player.

The reason why some people disrespect his career? A lot of people grew up idolizing Magic, Bird, etc when they were children and find it hard to accept that these players are not untouchable and others are capable of taking their spot.
Also the media plays a big part because you get to know a lot more about a player's personal life and you may find out stuff that make's it easier to hate on a player...

Once Kobe's career is over people will probably start appreciating him more, that's just the way it is.

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:08 PM
No one is saying lebron is better all time yet. thats crazy talk. at the same time, anyone thinking kobe is currently better than lebron is a ****ing idiot.


:rolleyes:

Lebron is not done winning rings.

I havent read every single post on here, but I havent seen anyone post on this thread saying Kobe at this age is better than Lebron at his age

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 07:10 PM
I havent read every single post on here, but I havent seen anyone post on this thread saying Kobe at this age is better than Lebron at his age

lakerssaintslsu was saying it

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:10 PM
because Kobe has ended up far greater than he ever should have been.


he's not a seven foot giant (Wilt, KAJ, Shaq, Duncan, Hakeem). he's not a gifted physical anomaly relative to his given position (Magic, LBJ). he doesn't have "billion-dollar hands" like Michael Jordan. He's just another 6'6, 205 pound SG with no clear physical advantage over any of his opponents. Yet he has still managed to have a legendary career, while cracking 90% of all top-ten all-time lists. he's just a dude with a sharp brain and a hard work ethic who was able to surpass many with superior physical advantages. i think many fans resent that for reasons they don't even consider.


simple fact is, everyone wants to be like Mike. but Kobe is one of the few who put in the work, sweat, and countless hours of practice necessary to be like him. i think many fans resent kobe for that reason. they look at their own lives and realize they never put in the work necessary to be as great as they could be (generally speaking), and when they see a dude who did put in the work and achieved great success, there is resentment there.

are their some fans who just don't like him on a personal, surface level? sure. but those people are idiots because they've never met him :)

i'd also tell the OP that kobe is well respected and that PSD doesn't accurately represent all NBA fans. let alone analysts, writers, coaches and management.

bringinwood
08-20-2012, 07:10 PM
The reason Kobe gets no respect its because he is the MOST overrated player in NBA history...

He has never been the best player in basketball at any point in his career and he its treated like Jordan... he its a product of having the best supporting cast out of anyone in NBA history...

to prove this point, you don't need to look further than when Kobe wanted a trade out off la... Then look at the supporting cast of lebrons 08 cavs team when they won like 68 games or something...

The reality that real basketball fans understand is that Kobe is a product of la... La isn't a product of Kobe

PhillyFaninLA
08-20-2012, 07:10 PM
Philly fans at its finest first of Kobe was innocent plus the girl had like 3 different types of semen from other men so next time you talk little boy please state the facts and last time I checked this was about basketball not someone's personal life which you no nothing about


Her being a whore doesn't mean she wasn't rape.

And using a phrase like little boy says more about you then about me.

You need to talk trash to make a point which destroys your message which you didn't really have. I just said I believe he was guilty and you disagree so you resort to this sort of thing rather than act like someone capable of thought.

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:11 PM
I just want to put this out, But I remember the time when Jordan himself said Kobe is the only player that deserves to be compared to me.... The G.O.A.T himself said that....

Haha I brought this fact up too, but like I said for some reason posters on here still remain stubborn and find stuff to discredit Kobe.
That was sort of my point a few pages back though... Who are you going to believe, NBA Legends or a random poster on an online forum?? their response was that those NBA Legends dont know how to evaluate players correctly.

....... therefore we are :horse:

#1chickhearnfan
08-20-2012, 07:13 PM
Hes disrespected because out of all the players after Jordan, Kobe is really the only one that comes close to resembling him and that bugs the **** out of people who
a. watched jordan play and are huge jordan fans.
b. hate the Lakers.

I read somewhere a while ago which I do agree to a certain extent... If Kobe had come first before Jordan and Jordan was playing right now. If Jordan were doing the things he did in the 90s today... They would still say Kobe was better, just because he came first. THIS ISINT SAYING Kobe is better than Jordan Im just saying it doesnt help Jordan Came first. Point is no matter what any player does in the next 20 yrs in the NBA, they wont be considered better than jordan.


Very well said.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 07:14 PM
I respect Kobe a lot as a player, but Lebron is clearly currently better than Kobe

netsgiantsyanks
08-20-2012, 07:15 PM
Facepalm? He is...or at least top 7, and he's not even done yet.

of ALL TIME? no.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:16 PM
Shaq's playoff stats are even better then Lebron's and he has 4+ Rings and yet you put Kobe over him don't you?

That is rather hypocritical. :burn:

Shaq are playoff stats not career stats and yes I have Kobe ranked higher and mostly every nba legend does to

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:18 PM
I respect Kobe a lot as a player, but Lebron is clearly currently better than Kobe

wouldn't be a bit ridiculous if a 34 year old Kobe was better than a 27 year old LeBron? that'd really be saying something.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 07:21 PM
wouldn't be a bit ridiculous if a 34 year old Kobe was better than a 27 year old LeBron? that'd really be saying something.

Some Posters were saying Kobe is currently better so I had to reiterate a fact

bringinwood
08-20-2012, 07:23 PM
wouldn't be a bit ridiculous if a 34 year old Kobe was better than a 27 year old LeBron? that'd really be saying something.

I don't think anyone expects that...

However, Kobe has never been better than lbj has been for the last 5 years...

Kobes best season ever doesn't touch lbjs last 5 seasons. .

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:24 PM
The reason Kobe gets no respect its because he is the MOST overrated player in NBA history...

He has never been the best player in basketball at any point in his career and he its treated like Jordan... he its a product of having the best supporting cast out of anyone in NBA history...

to prove this point, you don't need to look further than when Kobe wanted a trade out off la... Then look at the supporting cast of lebrons 08 cavs team when they won like 68 games or something...

The reality that real basketball fans understand is that Kobe is a product of la... La isn't a product of Kobe

:facepalm:

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 07:24 PM
of ALL TIME? no.

Ok, where would you put him?

C-Style
08-20-2012, 07:25 PM
I doubt Lebron finishes as the better player. But we shall see

Pakman
08-20-2012, 07:25 PM
My dog has a bigger brain than people who believe shaq > kobe. Get ur head out of ur stinker people.

Hardaway Here
08-20-2012, 07:25 PM
This thread needs to be closed seriously there are at a lot of Laker fans who act like nothing negative can be said about Kobe. He is not disrespected at all he gets his props but you Laker fans act like he is God and he can do no wrong. He isn't the best now point blank period. You put any other elite sg on the Lakers instead of Kobe 9 times out of 10 you will get the exact result and I'm talking about championships. You guys act like no one can do what Kobe does. Newsflash there are players that can do it and do it better. Stop being such biased fans and give other players credit when it's due. If anything some Laker fans not all but some disrespect other superstars because yours is Kobe which is just sad

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:25 PM
Some Posters were saying Kobe is currently better so I had to reiterate a fact

anyone who thinks that Kobe is still better than LeBron is in denial. kobe has been a professional in the NBA since 1996. people born in the same year are now driving cars.

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:26 PM
This thread needs to be closed seriously there are at a lot of Laker fans who act like nothing negative can be said about Kobe. He is not disrespected at all he gets his props but you Laker fans act like he is God and he can do no wrong. He isn't the best now point blank period. You put any other elite sg on the Lakers instead of Kobe 9 times out of 10 you will get the exact result and I'm talking about championships. You guys act like no one can do what Kobe does. Newsflash there are players that can do it and do it better. Stop being such biased fans and give other players credit when it's due. If anything some Laker fans not all but some disrespect other superstars because yours is Kobe which is just sad

^kings fan or a clippers fan?

SportsFanatic10
08-20-2012, 07:27 PM
Kobe is and always be better.. if he wins another ring its to become better than Jordan and thats it.

:laugh2::laugh::laugh2::laugh::laugh2: kobe can't touch jordan. and lebron will finish his career better than kobe, its pretty obvious you can see it coming. i won't be surprised if durant ends up being better than kobe as well.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:29 PM
I don't think anyone expects that...

However, Kobe has never been better than lbj has been for the last 5 years...

Kobes best season ever doesn't touch lbjs last 5 seasons. .

So Lebron had 5 season better then 30-6-6, 35-5-5, and 32-6-5 please show me... And Lebron has been better then Kobe for 2 years since 2010 not 2008

Showtime Steve
08-20-2012, 07:30 PM
I think its because of the jordan comparisons. If people let him be himself and appreciate his talent, he would be more respected. Plus the fact that he doesnt care what anyone thinks about him (fans or haters) lol.

C-Style
08-20-2012, 07:30 PM
If Kobe wins one more, specially against Lebron & Wade there to try to stop him. I say he goes to top 4-6

goose14741
08-20-2012, 07:30 PM
jordans unique skill set has only been mimic'd once and kobe is that example. The way he takes over games in the 4th is surreal. Only jordan and kobe have stepped up like that. Dirk came close in 2011

Hardaway Here
08-20-2012, 07:31 PM
^kings fan or a clippers fan?

Actually I'm a DWade fan I just hate when I see post by certain fans like LoveMeorHateMe and that lakersaints guy because they watch basketball with Kobe blinders on. Not even Laker blinders but Kobe blinders. So I just ignore what they post I'm always interested in hearing what unbiased fans have to say. Their arguments are always sensible.

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:31 PM
I don't think anyone expects that...

However, Kobe has never been better than lbj has been for the last 5 years...

Kobes best season ever doesn't touch lbjs last 5 seasons. .

five years?

that's funny because I remember LBJ putting up a PER of 23.7 in the 2011 playoffs (the year he averaged 17 points per game in the NBA Finals). Kobe posted higher playoff PER in 2001, 2009 and 2010, on his way to championships with his team.

LBJ just had a nearly incomparable 2012 campaign, but lets not get too crazy.

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 07:31 PM
Hawkeye if Lebron stats keep up the same for the rest of his career but doesn't win any more championships there is no way in hell he will rank higher then Kobe he needs atleast 3 championships to pass him but that's if Kobe doesn't win anything from now on

well, good to know how you will base your future biased rankings.

C-Style
08-20-2012, 07:31 PM
Next you I can very well see Kobe with:

6 Championships 3 Finals MVP

And Lebron will still have:

1 Championship


That can be a huge blow for Lebron's legacy if he loses next year with Wade(2nd best player in the league)

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:32 PM
Actually I'm a DWade fan I just hate when I see post by certain fans like LoveMeorHateMe and that lakersaints guy because they watch basketball with Kobe blinders on. Not even Laker blinders but Kobe blinders. So I just ignore what they post I'm always interested in hearing what unbiased fans have to say. Their arguments are always sensible.

for sure.

you don't have a favorite team?

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 07:32 PM
Okay so having ex legends like Jerry west, Charles Barkley and other NBA analysts (who have been doing this for their entire lives), come out and say Kobe ranks that high; means nothing and they dont know how to evaluate players??
Then again we are just :horse: with this one as you are always the one saying Lebron is going to be greater.

And Kobe fans beating a dead horse clinging. Until their careers are over and we can look at both, its all just a matter of opinion..

Andrew32
08-20-2012, 07:32 PM
My dog has a bigger brain than people who believe shaq > kobe. Get ur head out of ur stinker people.

The majority of people rank Shaq higher then Kobe.
Quit spouting nonsense. :facepalm:

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:32 PM
Very well said.

Only complaint is... why doesnt your signature play on for just a little longer :cry:

debd2k
08-20-2012, 07:33 PM
Kobe had a much more successful first 8 years than Lebron.

Kobe doesn't have secret meetings to move to better teams.

Kobe didn't need to find all-stars to win, he used the team he was given!

Kobe doesn't break noses, give concussions and trash people.

Kobe was an MVP once and has 4 championships. 3 of which were in the first 4 years.

LeBron got 3 MVP's then finally won a championship with an all-star cast.
So seriously? Lebron may be better now, but is not better all around.

LASTLY KOBE IS THE NUMBER 1 T-SHIRT AND VOTE GETTER IN THE NBA.
Next????? :speechless:

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 07:34 PM
The majority of people rank Shaq higher then Kobe.
Quit spouting nonsense. :facepalm:

Not necessarily. Shaq was clearly more dominant, most dominant of all time in fact. Doesn't make him the better player.

Hardaway Here
08-20-2012, 07:36 PM
for sure.

you don't have a favorite team?

No not really just players I like to watch I grew up watching the Lakers but I wasn't a fan like that only team I follow are the chargers but thats football as far as the NBA goes just players I like DWade being my favorite looking forward to see him healthy again. I also like watching Jrue Holiday and Rondo to name a couple

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:36 PM
basketball reference is one of the most respected, most well know, most used basketball stat page on the internet. fans (ELO Ranking) currently rank Kobe Bryant as the 520th greatest player in NBA history :laugh2:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html

Bruno
08-20-2012, 07:37 PM
No not really just players I like to watch I grew up watching the Lakers but I wasn't a fan like that only team I follow are the chargers but thats football as far as the NBA goes just players I like DWade being my favorite looking forward to see him healthy again. I also like watching Jrue Holiday and Rondo to name a couple

thats chill. some of the best fans i know aren't die-hards for any one specific team. kinda gives you a neutral, reasonable perspective.

JNoel
08-20-2012, 07:37 PM
Kobe had a much more successful first 8 years than Lebron.

Kobe doesn't have secret meetings to move to better teams.

Kobe didn't need to find all-stars to win, he used the team he was given!

Kobe doesn't break noses, give concussions and trash people.

Kobe was an MVP once and has 4 championships. 3 of which were in the first 4 years.

LeBron got 3 MVP's then finally won a championship with an all-star cast.
So seriously? Lebron may be better now, but is not better all around.

LASTLY KOBE IS THE NUMBER 1 T-SHIRT AND VOTE GETTER IN THE NBA.
Next????? :speechless:

Lebron is better all-around, Kobe's got a far better shot tho

XpLiCiTT
08-20-2012, 07:38 PM
basketball reference is one of the most respected, most well know, most used basketball stat page on the internet. fans (ELO Ranking) currently rank Kobe Bryant as the 520th greatest player in NBA history :laugh2:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html

lmao! look at two spots ahead of him...Jeff McInnis! :clap:

Hardaway Here
08-20-2012, 07:38 PM
Kobe had a much more successful first 8 years than Lebron.

Kobe doesn't have secret meetings to move to better teams.

Kobe didn't need to find all-stars to win, he used the team he was given!

Kobe doesn't break noses, give concussions and trash people.

Kobe was an MVP once and has 4 championships. 3 of which were in the first 4 years.

LeBron got 3 MVP's then finally won a championship with an all-star cast.
So seriously? Lebron may be better now, but is not better all around.

LASTLY KOBE IS THE NUMBER 1 T-SHIRT AND VOTE GETTER IN THE NBA.
Next????? :speechless:

I'm sorry but teams do have a lot to do with that you take Kobe out the Lakers put him on Cavs and put Lebron on Lakers your telling me Lebron wouldn't have success in his first 8 seasons with the Lakers like Kobe did.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:39 PM
Actually I'm a DWade fan I just hate when I see post by certain fans like LoveMeorHateMe and that lakersaints guy because they watch basketball with Kobe blinders on. Not even Laker blinders but Kobe blinders. So I just ignore what they post I'm always interested in hearing what unbiased fans have to say. Their arguments are always sensible.

How the hell am I biased I actually can say Lebron is the best in the nba but that it will be hard to pass Kobe not like it will be a piece of cake like hawker and others think, it's funny though most of you don't give credit wear credit is due but what can we expect it's PSD

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:43 PM
I'm sorry but teams do have a lot to do with that you take Kobe out the Lakers put him on Cavs and put Lebron on Lakers your telling me Lebron wouldn't have success in his first 8 seasons with the Lakers like Kobe did.

No because Lebron would have been 10 years old at that time it's like me saying if Kobe was with the bulls instead of Jordan they win 6 championships as well, he wouldn't because he was what maybe 10 at that time as well

Hawkeye15
08-20-2012, 07:44 PM
basketball reference is one of the most respected, most well know, most used basketball stat page on the internet. fans (ELO Ranking) currently rank Kobe Bryant as the 520th greatest player in NBA history :laugh2:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html

that seems a little low..

LeBron Tha GOAT
08-20-2012, 07:45 PM
To answer your original question I think it's because of how overhyped Kobe is on this forum. And when I say overhyped I mean how high he is on the all-time list for a lot of people. So many people have him pegged as the second best ever and I think that's just completely foolish. He's around 8 or 9.

Hardaway Here
08-20-2012, 07:45 PM
How the hell am I biased I actually can say Lebron is the best in the nba but that it will be hard to pass Kobe not like it will be a piece of cake like hawker and others think, it's funny though most of you don't give credit wear credit is due but what can we expect it's PSD

Your clearly a biased fan you created this thread and your opening statement proves it. You call everybody a hater who says Wades 09 season(should of won mvp imo) was better than any of Kobes and when Iverson/Tmac primes mvp like seasons were better than Kobe. You don't give those players credit and you call fans who are just stating their OPINION a hater. How biased is that. That's cool your a Kobe fan but not everyone is going to agree with you period. That doesn't make them a hater.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 07:48 PM
To answer your original question I think it's because of how overhyped Kobe is on this forum. And when I say overhyped I mean how high he is on the all-time list for a lot of people. So many people have him pegged as the second best ever and I think that's just completely foolish. He's around 8 or 9.

Just like how you overhype Lebron with your username
Kobe isn't top 2 but Kobe is a lot closer to being in the top 5 range then top 10

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:49 PM
To answer your original question I think it's because of how overhyped Kobe is on this forum. And when I say overhyped I mean how high he is on the all-time list for a lot of people. So many people have him pegged as the second best ever and I think that's just completely foolish. He's around 8 or 9.

Yea well your username automatically disqualifies you

LeBron Tha GOAT
08-20-2012, 07:53 PM
Just like how you overhype Lebron with your username
Kobe isn't top 2 but Kobe is a lot closer to being in the top 5 range then top 10

My username is not indicative of my actual opinions.

Pakman
08-20-2012, 07:55 PM
My dog has a bigger brain than people who believe shaq > kobe. Get ur head out of ur stinker people.

The majority of people rank Shaq higher then Kobe.
Quit spouting nonsense. :facepalm:u mean the morons/trolls of PSD?

LeBron Tha GOAT
08-20-2012, 07:55 PM
Yea well your username automatically disqualifies you

LeBron Tha Guru of all Trades?? How does that make me automatically disqualified.

bluefire7002
08-20-2012, 07:57 PM
LeBron Tha Guru of all Trades?? How does that make me automatically disqualified.

I see what you did there :laugh2:

Matter.
08-20-2012, 08:34 PM
Haha I brought this fact up too, but like I said for some reason posters on here still remain stubborn and find stuff to discredit Kobe.
That was sort of my point a few pages back though... Who are you going to believe, NBA Legends or a random poster on an online forum?? their response was that those NBA Legends dont know how to evaluate players correctly.

....... therefore we are :horse:

Yah Mr.Andrew Ignored ur post.. i read it

KnicksorBust
08-20-2012, 08:39 PM
Nearly every superstar takes abuse from the media. As a Knicks fan, I've seen everybody from Starks, Ewing, Marbury, Francis, Randolph, Amar'e, Melo all go from potential hero to goat. It comes with the territory. Kobe's so polarizing because he's historically good but has so many reasons to dislike him (dynasty split, colorado, selfish play, etc.). I find it hard to believe he's been more "disrespected" than LeBron though. In this age of overwhelming media coverage (facebook, twitter, endless blogs, radio shows, sports channels) he's taken the most abuse.

MFFL==FML
08-20-2012, 08:46 PM
I can't believe some of the comments I have read regarding Kobe...

I am a fan of Kobe but good grief... top 5? Wtf?

CowboysKB24
08-20-2012, 08:55 PM
Kobe is not the most disrespected... he gets his. Every star has their haters. You just listen to them more.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-20-2012, 08:58 PM
I can't believe some of the comments I have read regarding Kobe...

I am a fan of Kobe but good grief... top 5? Wtf?

Where do you rank him then?

Vidball
08-20-2012, 09:02 PM
Great great great 10 min video...I'm excited to see Kobe go after ring #6.

aman_13
08-20-2012, 09:07 PM
Can't see how Kobe is the most disrespected when he is considered a top 5-7 greatest baskestball player ever.

Aust
08-20-2012, 09:13 PM
When you're great, you'll have your haters

mngopher35
08-20-2012, 09:48 PM
So Lebron had 5 season better then 30-6-6, 35-5-5, and 32-6-5 please show me... And Lebron has been better then Kobe for 2 years since 2010 not 2008

27-6-8 with 30.7 per .298 win share 2012
27-7-7.5 with 27.3 per .244 ws 2011
30-8.6-7 with 31.1 per .299ws 2010
28-7-7.5 with 31.7 per .318ws 2009
30-7-8 with 29.1 per .242 ws 2008

(kobes best year 28 per .224 win share 35-4.5-5.3)

In all 5 years Lebrons TS% is also higher. Im not saying each of these 5 years of Lebrons were for sure better than Kobe but there is definitely an argument to be made. I believe James has been better than Kobe the last 4 seasons. You made it seem like his claim was ridiculous and then used some basic stats of kobes to "prove" it. Well Lebrons stats match up and he was more efficient as well.

MintBerryCrunch
08-20-2012, 09:54 PM
Kobe is a Top 5 player all time.

And he gets hated on because hes the closest thing to Jordan, and everyone here **** rides MJ like there's no tomorrow

MR.TRIPDUB
08-20-2012, 09:55 PM
Wanna talk bout underated stars? Go ask Tim Duncan bout that.

how is underated and disrespected the same. TD is probably the most respected star in his generation much like hakeem was in his. But back to the topic.
Being criticized doesnt necessarily mean hes being disrespected coz whenever someone creates threads like these you open him to critisism. Are you expecting every poster to just marvel at how great he was. If you want that then create an appreciation thread.

For me i love kobe coz he loves his fans here. Hes a great player 9-12 alltime. Jordan magic bird wilt kareem duncan hakeem shaq imo are better players.

Kobe is arguably top 3 in terms of career. Longevity, popularity, achievements, milestones.

justinnum1
08-20-2012, 10:02 PM
Kobe is a Top 5 player all time.

And he gets hated on because hes the closest thing to Jordan, and everyone here **** rides MJ like there's no tomorrow

In your opinion.

Jordan
magic
russell
kareem
shaq

are all ahead of kobe

bird and wilt even have arguments for being ahead of kobe

bootleg42
08-20-2012, 10:04 PM
I hated Kobe back when he broke up the winning Laker teams via the feud with Shaq.

He matured, and has earned my respect the last 3 years.

tapajafri
08-20-2012, 11:50 PM
a lot of it has to do with this stuff... he's one of the dirtiest players in NBA history

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUxsK_2imYI

kylem4711
08-20-2012, 11:55 PM
because he is a terrible person and a rapist...

silvTeg98
08-21-2012, 12:20 AM
success brings haters

MadBomber
08-21-2012, 12:22 AM
No way is kobe better than

jordan
magic
russell
kareem
larry


i would eveb put shaq ahead of kobe.

if anyone gets disrespected on here its shaq.

+1 i feel you on that list bro.

Pistol_Pete
08-21-2012, 12:39 AM
I mean, I suppose (allegedly) raping a girl and cheating on your wife will garner a lot of hate.

LaLa_Land
08-21-2012, 12:49 AM
Pre-requisites for being an all-time great player to me, means that you are:

Dominant, athletically or skillfully superior during your time, very good in the clutch (not just game-winners, but game-changing shots in general), and dependable under any surrounding circumstance on both halves of the court.

I'm a huge Kobe fan, but right now I still put the following above him: Jordan, Kareem, Wilt, Magic, Russell, Bird, and Oscar Robertson. I honestly don't think anyone will ever enter those guys' categories. He has solidified himself, undoubtedly, top 10 all-time.

Especially after a back-to-back with Dwight before retiring hehe

beliges
08-21-2012, 12:54 AM
The answer to this question is because he's still playing. Once he's done and calls it a career people will genuinely appreciate what they got to witness for two decades.

COOLbeans
08-21-2012, 01:10 AM
No. Iverson is the mot disrespected super star of all time. Look how the NBA did him.. Puerto Rico? Turkey?? He deserved to end his career in the NBA. C'mon now, he's a legend..

Whereas Kobe had the Denver escapade and nobody ever really talks about that, and Kobe Bryant has played with some of the all time great on his way to multiple chamiponships as the league helped garner his being acquired by the Lakers. He's played for 1 team his entire career no less! Not many players can say that...and in Los Angeles..

There is no competition when it comes to who's the most disrespected nba superstar...the answer is the answer.

LakersEaglesLA
08-21-2012, 02:25 AM
When Kobe gets his 7th Championship its no way you Haters will be able to deny him The Greatest of All Time!! (Deal With It)

Steelers23_06
08-21-2012, 03:31 AM
When Kobe gets his 7th Championship its no way you Haters will be able to deny him The Greatest of All Time!! (Deal With It)

what is he joining the heat after his contract is up to get it :eyebrow:

all jokes aside i look at kobe as the greatest scorer to ever play the game. i think everyone who respects basketball respects kobe. i live in MA and even celtics fans who hate him with a passion say how great he is. i think if anything its lebron. people hate him for NO reason. ok the decision, so hate him as a person (even though you dont know him lol) but when you watch him or lebron play u gotta respect it. and i dont think that many people here will debate kobe is great i honestly think he is the greatest scorer of all time lakers fans make other people discredit kobe because they try to portray him as a God in purple and gold. its like if your friends tells you "man this place on 15th st has the best sandwich you will ever eat in your life you have to go there" then you go and its a really good sandwich but not how your friend played it up in your mind. kobe your a great sandwich but you aint no po' boy lol

justjames
08-21-2012, 03:34 AM
I didn't read through the entire thread so I hope I'm not repeating something. Kobe suffers from the uncanny valley effect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncanny_valley


The uncanny valley is a hypothesis in the field of robotics[1] and 3D computer animation,[2][3] which holds that when human replicas look and act almost, but not perfectly, like actual human beings, it causes a response of revulsion among human observers. The "valley" refers to the dip in a graph of the comfort level of humans as a function of a robot's human likeness.


Jordan is the original and Kobe is the replica that hits too close to home for many people to accept so they hate him.

Steelers23_06
08-21-2012, 04:06 AM
I didn't read through the entire thread so I hope I'm not repeating something. Kobe suffers from the uncanny valley effect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncanny_valley



Jordan is the original and Kobe is the replica that hits too close to home for many people to accept so they hate him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E1ekqE9L1A

aint nothing worse then a smart dumb ***** lol. u went too hard with it. jordan has nothing to do with it. its lakers fans/plus people just hate great. idk y but they do. it usually isnt until after a players career whn they are respected. look at jordan when he was lebrons age even. people were amazed by him but said he was no magic and look at him now. kobe will get his glory sadly it will come from most when his jersey is hanging in the rafters :(

sintaks12
08-21-2012, 07:31 AM
How quickly people forget Colorado... he gets disrespected because he's a d-bag. It's pretty simple. Lebron was anointed as the second coming until he had "The Decision"... then mad disrespect. News flash: people don't like arseholes.

BklynKnicks3
08-21-2012, 08:29 AM
because Jordans is the most beloved player ever and kobe stole his game and his swag alot of jordan fans fear Kobe is close to jordan so they like to discredit him n put him down i seen both Kobe is more skilled Jordans has him beat acompishment wise.

koreancabbage
08-21-2012, 09:07 AM
only think i see disrespecting Kobe is this thread and the OP

koreancabbage
08-21-2012, 09:10 AM
How quickly people forget Colorado... he gets disrespected because he's a d-bag. It's pretty simple. Lebron was anointed as the second coming until he had "The Decision"... then mad disrespect. News flash: people don't like arseholes.

yes they do. thats why the Knicks fans love Carmelo. They will choose the lesser of the two evils but Carmelo was a douche and dick for asking for a trade and creating the drama for the Nuggets organization. Good thing the GM was very talented in orchestrating that trade to get rid of Melo. Look at the Nuggets now - better team than the Knicks and without the drama and glamour of star players.

Heatcheck
08-21-2012, 09:29 AM
wah wah wah, like my player better, wah wah, it'll make me feel better if more people would pull on my favorite basketball players nuts a little more often, wah wah wah.

h2r09
08-21-2012, 09:31 AM
I think, to answer the question, because he raped a women, is selfish and extremely egotistical about his abilitites despite the fact that he doesnt shoot at a percentage high enough to keep shooting that much.

JasonJohnHorn
08-21-2012, 09:44 AM
Because he's a ball hog. And the rape charges haven't help people's perception of him.

YankeesR#2
08-21-2012, 10:02 AM
The main problem is his personality. He is an admitted rapist

http://www.healthy-dating.com/kobe_bryant_press_release.htm

Kobe Bryant Potentially Admits Sexual Assault

September 3, 2004 -- According to Associated Press reports this past Wednesday (September 1st), Kobe Bryant's attorneys released a statement from Kobe Bryant that included, "Although I truly believe this encounter between us was consensual, I recognize now that she did not and does not view this incident the same way I did”

.....

Later in the statement released by his attorneys, Bryant says, “I now understand how she feels that she did not consent to this encounter.”....

In a statement that cannot be used against Bryant in a criminal or civil suit, now he suddenly tells the truth? ......

Why is no one is asking, “Isn’t something wrong when Bryant admits the truth only when he is completely safe of being held accountable?” In his statement, he acknowledged the agreement included that his statement could not be used against him in any criminal or civil court. What if this admission were to a different crime such as murder? ....

Even before that he was considered to be a real dick. The best way to understand it is to compare him to Magic Johnson. I think magic is overrated as a player because of his personality the same way Kobe is underrated beacuse of his.

Captain Moroni
08-21-2012, 10:06 AM
Personally? I haven't forgotten the whole "rape" thing.

StinkEye
08-21-2012, 10:50 AM
Next you I can very well see Kobe with:

6 Championships 3 Finals MVP

And Lebron will still have:

1 Championship


That can be a huge blow for Lebron's legacy if he loses next year with Wade(2nd best player in the league)

... and what will Kobe's be like having lost with his current lineup? Do you knock Kobe down for the Lakers' ****** past two postseasons? If LeBron dominates with the HEAT losing in the finals, how could it be a blow to his legacy?

Decimotox
08-21-2012, 11:07 AM
he already is.

but this would put this nail in the coffin.

This.

b-ballistic
08-21-2012, 11:18 AM
to the op..........i think it's because he cops MJ's style so much. No player ever copied another player in every way like kobe has with mj. he does it well, but he falls a little short. and THAT my friends.....is why he gets disrespected.....and most of you know that already in your subconscious minds.

pd1dish
08-21-2012, 12:39 PM
I couldn't disagree more. I'm a huge LeBron fan...Kobe is a top 5 player of all-time, no debate.

Sure LeBron has the potential to enter that list once his career is over, but right now he has a lot of work to do.

I don't see how Kobe is disrespected at all..



:facepalm:
This is why Kobe gets bashed a lot.

Dude, face palm yourself...Kobe wins PERIOD

I absolutely hate Kobe but how can I deny that he's an all time great? Lebron will be too, but Kobe has the better resume and right now is more of an all time great. Lebron has time though to easily be a top 5 player of all time if he can continue to win and play at the level he's at right now then he will surpass Kobe but its too early to say his career had been better than Kobe's. And to say youd it Wade higher (referring to OP) is ludicrous..

Indi23
08-21-2012, 01:44 PM
Better than kobe? I'm a kobe hater and im saying shhhhieeeet .

2 More rings and hes better than kobe?

Please.

If kobe wins with dwight and nash now lebron has alot of catching up to do. He has won with Shaq, Gasol/Bynum and if he was to win with dwight its too much.


Kobe has been winning rings since 2000 with 2 different teams and all on the lakers. If he wins with 3 different teams but staying with one franchise than no.. Kobe > LBJ.


3 rings and your a winner like most people say. IE Bird.

But to win 5 is to be in the Magic/MJ discussion.

This threads a complete joke. It should have been called " If Kobe wins another ring what does Lebron need to do to fall on the same list." Cuz boy he aint even close yet.

Indi23
08-21-2012, 01:52 PM
This thread is about rings. Read post people. OP is stating rings = better player... Why are people taking discussions in whole different direction. Also certain people need to stop posting what they have already posted before just to get their post count up.

5 to 1 is what the ring total is and that's the base of the original posters question/discussion.. Not who will score more points or who is better on the court right now*. In the end of the day the best players win rings. Ask Jordan Magic Larry.

Hotone1401
08-21-2012, 01:54 PM
... and what will Kobe's be like having lost with his current lineup? Do you knock Kobe down for the Lakers' ****** past two postseasons? If LeBron dominates with the HEAT losing in the finals, how could it be a blow to his legacy?

Kobe is playing with a bunch of old timers and Dwight. Lebron still has the better supporting cast. And if Lebron loses in the finals while carrying his team, it isn't a so much a big blow to his legacy IMO but he will forever lose his chance at surpassing MJ.

Indi23
08-21-2012, 01:58 PM
Kobe is playing with a bunch of old timers and Dwight. Lebron still has the better supporting cast. And if Lebron loses in the finals while carrying his team, it isn't a so much a big blow to his legacy IMO but he will forever lose his chance at surpassing MJ.

Agreed but just one note lol.


Mike is untouchable. Has an astricks beside his name too. Since other people on this thread keep bringing up hypotheticals like Lebron winning DPOY.. 3 rings and other awards <------ Lol. MJ took two years off in which Hakim won 2 titles. If the unfortunate passing of Mike's father passing hadn't occurred one "could" say he would have 8 rings.

NYtilIdie
08-21-2012, 02:03 PM
Yeah, I'd give Kobe that nod.

Big Zo
08-21-2012, 02:05 PM
"Rings, rings rings!" When will you ding dongs realize that's a team accomplishment? Kobe has had Shaq, Gasol, and now Howard and Nash to help him out. Before coming to Miami, LeBron had... Anderson Varejao, and Antawn Jamison. :/

blystr2002
08-21-2012, 02:13 PM
If they retired after this season, Kobe it better all time then Lebron whether he wins this year or not. However it is too early to say if that will last. Lebron will have a good 6 years after Kobe retires to change that. The only way this question would make sense would be if they were the same age.

beasted86
08-21-2012, 02:27 PM
Better than LeBron? Pshhh...

Kobe will be better than MJ if he wins another championship.

6 time NBA champion
3 time Finals MVP
1 time NBA MVP
15 time NBA All-star

He's the G-O-A-T, baby!!! :cheers:


#nuthuggerslogic

Greedy22
08-22-2012, 06:18 AM
Hawkeye, can you lock this? This seems to be a daily ****ing thread lol.

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-22-2012, 02:45 PM
llullz Heat (aka Wade and LeBron) fans. :laugh2:

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-22-2012, 02:51 PM
"Rings, rings rings!" When will you ding dongs realize that's a team accomplishment? Kobe has had Shaq, Gasol, and now Howard and Nash to help him out. Before coming to Miami, LeBron had... Anderson Varejao, and Antawn Jamison. :/

Don't worry, Kobe will win a ring with Antawn Jamison too soon enough, something LeBron couldn't do. ;)

ArmLaker
08-22-2012, 04:20 PM
The fact that a whole lot of us are comparing Kobe, who is on the downside of his amazing career, and Lebron, who is in his prime, just shows you how much better and universal Kobe Bryant is. He played with and dwarfed the big AI, TMAC, VC.....then dwarfed Wade when he was supposed to be in his prime and even dwarfed LeBron until a year or so ago. Players came and went, but Kobe Bryant stayed :). That is how you know he is probably the closest player we've ever had that can hold a candle to the great MJ. Legendary

Hawkeye15
08-22-2012, 04:29 PM
The fact that a whole lot of us are comparing Kobe, who is on the downside of his amazing career, and Lebron, who is in his prime, just shows you how much better and universal Kobe Bryant is. He played with and dwarfed the big AI, TMAC, VC.....then dwarfed Wade when he was supposed to be in his prime and even dwarfed LeBron until a year or so ago. Players came and went, but Kobe Bryant stayed :). That is how you know he is probably the closest player we've ever had that can hold a candle to the great MJ. Legendary

uh, the same could be said of 1991 Jordan versus Magic and Bird. At the time, they had the longer, better, and more successful careers, despite Jordan simply being better than they ever were. No difference here. Anyone who actually thinks Kobe Bryant is anywhere near the level of play that James currently is at, is a blind homer or clinging to a lifetime achievement ranking currently.

ArmLaker
08-22-2012, 04:46 PM
uh, the same could be said of 1991 Jordan versus Magic and Bird. At the time, they had the longer, better, and more successful careers, despite Jordan simply being better than they ever were. No difference here. Anyone who actually thinks Kobe Bryant is anywhere near the level of play that James currently is at, is a blind homer or clinging to a lifetime achievement ranking currently.

You do have a great point, but lets be realistic here. Kobe Bryant is still an elite player and still the greatest in his position today. As far as I can tell, Magic and Bird of the early 90s were just a shadow of their former selves. Kobe on the other hand, after 16 long years and 34 years of age, is still an MVP-caliber player, a first team All-NBA player and after the Lakers acquisition of D12 and Nash, is favored to win number 6 and possibly 7. Kobe is just a universal player simply put. As the saying goes, form is temporary, but class is permanent. In Kobe's case, the man has a whole lot of the latter my friend.

Hawkeye15
08-22-2012, 05:22 PM
[QUOTE=ArmLaker;23405539]You do have a great point, but lets be realistic here. Kobe Bryant is still an elite player and still the greatest in his position today.

Even if you agree he is still the best SG (most don't), that doesn't matter. He simply doesn't belong in the conversation with LeBron, Durant, or Dwight for instance. Again, like I have said so many times, its not Kobe's peak, or his absolute dominance over a period of years where he was clearly the best player on the planet like some of the greats before him, its his RIDICULOUSLY long prime of 12-14 years, which is why I have him top 10 ever.


As far as I can tell, Magic and Bird of the early 90s were just a shadow of their former selves.

Bird, yes. His back was done. Magic just got beat by Michael in the finals when Jackson decided to try and slow him with Pippen. My point was, there were still the "old dogs" whose fans, and NBA fans in general, were not giving the young pup the credit even though he was far superior. I was 16 in 1991, I remember clearly.


Kobe on the other hand, after 16 long years and 34 years of age, is still an MVP-caliber player, a first team All-NBA player

Here is where we totally disagree. Kobe, at this stage, any accolade or all NBA team he is named to is out of name recognition. He is no longer an MVP caliber player. Hell, he isn't the best player on his own team anymore, and that is easy to prove.


and after the Lakers acquisition of D12 and Nash, is favored to win number 6 and possibly 7.

Last I checked, all analysts had Miami and OKC ahead of them still.


Kobe is just a universal player simply put. As the saying goes, form is temporary, but class is permanent. In Kobe's case, the man has a whole lot of the latter my friend.

Well, we all judge players differently. I prefer production and dominance. Of which Kobe had, maybe not to the extent of some of the other greats (Seriously, LeBron has been the best player on the planet for 4 years, Kobe struggles to make a case for one clear year where you said, "he is the best, easy").

Hawkeye15
08-22-2012, 05:26 PM
Fact is, regarding LeBron and Kobe, LeBron is obviously the better player today. Has been a few years. But his career is not going to be as good as Kobe's if they retired right now. Hell, probably not if he won another MVP, Championship, and Finals MVP and then hung it up. But sitting here and reading Kobe fans deny that LeBron has a great chance at passing him career wise, reminds me of listening to my Dad, and alllllllllllllll the older guys whine about Jordan just being flash and stats over winning versus their heroes, Bird and Magic.

I have been through this song and dance before. If LeBron does whats expected, its going to happen fellas, and there is nothing you can do to stop it.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-22-2012, 05:41 PM
[QUOTE]

Even if you agree he is still the best SG (most don't), that doesn't matter. He simply doesn't belong in the conversation with LeBron, Durant, or Dwight for instance. Again, like I have said so many times, its not Kobe's peak, or his absolute dominance over a period of years where he was clearly the best player on the planet like some of the greats before him, its his RIDICULOUSLY long prime of 12-14 years, which is why I have him top 10 ever.



Bird, yes. His back was done. Magic just got beat by Michael in the finals when Jackson decided to try and slow him with Pippen. My point was, there were still the "old dogs" whose fans, and NBA fans in general, were not giving the young pup the credit even though he was far superior. I was 16 in 1991, I remember clearly.



Here is where we totally disagree. Kobe, at this stage, any accolade or all NBA team he is named to is out of name recognition. He is no longer an MVP caliber player. Hell, he isn't the best player on his own team anymore, and that is easy to prove.



Last I checked, all analysts had Miami and OKC ahead of them still.



Well, we all judge players differently. I prefer production and dominance. Of which Kobe had, maybe not to the extent of some of the other greats (Seriously, LeBron has been the best player on the planet for 4 years, Kobe struggles to make a case for one clear year where you said, "he is the best, easy").

Out of all the all-time greats hawkeye hates Kobe the most, he's usually a knowledgable poster but when it comes to talking about Kobe he becomes way to biased

Hawkeye15
08-22-2012, 05:46 PM
[QUOTE=Hawkeye15;23405818]

Out of all the all-time greats hawkeye hates Kobe the most, he's usually a knowledgable poster but when it comes to talking about Kobe he becomes way to biased

Not really. I rate him where he should be, top 7-9 ever. But I have no issue picking apart some of his game, just like many of the other top players whose careers are either over or getting there.

ThunderousDemon
08-22-2012, 05:51 PM
I can't believe this thread is still alive. :D

ChicagoFan4Eva
08-22-2012, 05:58 PM
Because of that one incident..

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-22-2012, 06:36 PM
Because of that one incident..


It was Consensual!!! :dance:

Kaspa
08-28-2012, 06:29 AM
Man....there's some of the lowest Basketball IQ's I've ever seen in my life in this thread. :laugh2:

Seriously, if you don't know anything about basketball or think you do because you played it on XBOX...

If you're a blind bandwagon fan hanging off the nutz of your favorite NBA player and fail to see logic due to your unrelenting bias...

Just READ the threads and STOP POSTING until you educate yourself enough to make a valid point!

BobbyHillSwag
08-28-2012, 09:08 AM
No. Iverson is the mot disrespected super star of all time. Look how the NBA did him.. Puerto Rico? Turkey?? He deserved to end his career in the NBA. C'mon now, he's a legend..

Whereas Kobe had the Denver escapade and nobody ever really talks about that, and Kobe Bryant has played with some of the all time great on his way to multiple chamiponships as the league helped garner his being acquired by the Lakers. He's played for 1 team his entire career no less! Not many players can say that...and in Los Angeles..

There is no competition when it comes to who's the most disrespected nba superstar...the answer is the answer.

this, iverson was simply amazing. The fact of the matter is iverson shitted on everyone's favorite player multiple times lmao.

Godbe? iverson shitted on countless of times, but godbe won that battle.
Lebron? Iverson shitted on him everytime they played in philly and denver
Wade? It was just ridiculous how bad iverson shitted on him but wade wasnt ever really good though.
Durant? Didnt really get a chance to **** on him
Paul?Iverson shitted on him a couple couple
nash? Iverson couldnt really touch nash in his philly days but when he was on denver he just let all his diarrea out on nash. He ****ed over nash bad when he was on denver
Arenas? when he was actually good iverson was ******** on him
Carter? Iverson shitted on him everytime they played lmao, vince got his in though

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 09:12 AM
Iverson did what to those players? Just because he heaved up a ton more shots and ended up scoring more overall points doesn't mean he beat them up.

basketfan4life
08-28-2012, 09:46 AM
Iverson did what to those players? Just because he heaved up a ton more shots and ended up scoring more overall points doesn't mean he beat them up.

I can't deny when that guy calls Kobe "Godbe", it touches me a little.

But what i actually find amazing is how you can still find the energy of correcting these bad posts almost every time, it doesn't look like worth responding, i guess it's the burden of being a Mod.

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 09:51 AM
I can't deny when that guy calls Kobe "Godbe", it touches me a little.

But what i actually find amazing is how you can still find the energy of correcting these bad posts almost every time, it doesn't look like worth responding, i guess it's the burden of being a Mod.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=bryanko01&p2=iversal01

I mean, Iverson took 3 more shot attempts to score 1 more point a game in the 29 games they faced each other. Iverson shot worse from literally everywhere, and come playoff time, Iverson needed an additional 5 attempts to score 2 more ppg, while again being beat up efficiency wise and on the defensive side of the ball.

basketfan4life
08-28-2012, 09:58 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=bryanko01&p2=iversal01

I mean, Iverson took 3 more shot attempts to score 1 more point a game in the 29 games they faced each other. Iverson shot worse from literally everywhere, and come playoff time, Iverson needed an additional 5 attempts to score 2 more ppg, while again being beat up efficiency wise and on the defensive side of the ball.

I'm not sure if you got me right or wrong but i completely agree with what you said. I just wondered isn't it easier to let it go when you know that one posters almost every post is full of false information. I wouldn't waste my energy.

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 09:59 AM
I'm not sure if you got me right or wrong but i completely agree with what you said. I just wondered isn't it easier to let it go when you know that one posters almost every post is full of false information. I wouldn't waste my energy.

I know you were agreeing with me. I am not sure man, call it the need to correct something that bugs me. I let a ton of stuff go here, but BHS has shown me he at least understands the game to a degree, if it were a poster who I have zip respect for, I would have moved on (and believe me, plenty of them here).

Heatcheck
08-28-2012, 10:02 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=bryanko01&p2=iversal01

I mean, Iverson took 3 more shot attempts to score 1 more point a game in the 29 games they faced each other. Iverson shot worse from literally everywhere, and come playoff time, Iverson needed an additional 5 attempts to score 2 more ppg, while again being beat up efficiency wise and on the defensive side of the ball.

You cant tell these kids anything, iverson scored alot of points and looked cool doing it, thats all that matters anyway. they cant refute anything you write, and will tell you its "just there opinion", like thats not already obvious, or changes the absurdity of it.

basketfan4life
08-28-2012, 10:08 AM
I know you were agreeing with me. I am not sure man, call it the need to correct something that bugs me. I let a ton of stuff go here, but BHS has shown me he at least understands the game to a degree, if it were a poster who I have zip respect for, I would have moved on (and believe me, plenty of them here).

I got you and you are right. Actually i agree with you on BHS, it just seems when it comes to his favorite players, everything he knows goes down the drain and irrationality takes place.

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 10:23 AM
Iverson did what to those players? Just because he heaved up a ton more shots and ended up scoring more overall points doesn't mean he beat them up.

You realize most of the teams Iverson played for where actually really good right??

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 10:26 AM
You realize most of the teams Iverson played for where actually really good right??

Not sure what that has to do with anything..

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 10:26 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=bryanko01&p2=iversal01

I mean, Iverson took 3 more shot attempts to score 1 more point a game in the 29 games they faced each other. Iverson shot worse from literally everywhere, and come playoff time, Iverson needed an additional 5 attempts to score 2 more ppg, while again being beat up efficiency wise and on the defensive side of the ball.

SOOOOOOOOOOO?????????


Iverson didn't have the LUXURY of playing next to the best big man on the planet in Shaq. So dont shoot him for not deffering those 3 shots to the 2nd best player on the team which would of been......Eric Snow? No wait...Aaron Mckie....noooooo nooo noo it was George Lynch I think. Your Showing some real lack of overall bball knowledge here

Oefarmy2005
08-28-2012, 10:27 AM
Kobe is a kJoke... just kidding. He is old and is on a serious decline.

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 10:28 AM
Not sure what that has to do with anything..

I'm saying when teams played against the 76ers it was really


Lakers vs Iverson
Pacers vs Iverson
Nets vs Iverson
Magic vs Iverson


because the 76ers outside of him were GOD AWFUL. Yet he still made the playoff worthy by himself every year.

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 10:32 AM
I'm saying when teams played against the 76ers it was really


Lakers vs Iverson
Pacers vs Iverson
Nets vs Iverson
Magic vs Iverson


because the 76ers outside of him were GOD AWFUL. Yet he still made the playoff worthy by himself every year.

ahh, this argument again. Yeah, having an ELITE defense with multiple vets who guard different positions, work within and offense, are able to hit midrange shots and get offensive rebounds, while spacing the floor perfectly at all times to allow their ballstopper to just keep on working for his shot are awful.

You still have no point here. Iverson was a high volume scorer, meaning he just shot it, and shot it, and shot it, and at the end of the night, he had 28 points on 26 shots.

SirSkyHook
08-28-2012, 11:06 AM
I think in two years Durant wil dominate the league and win rings along with Rose. In saying that I also believe the Lakers are built to win now and I think they will, so Lebron's window to me is much smaller than people actualy think, becuase Wade is declining already and Bosh will pull a Ray Allen and leave for the same reasons. Now I can be wrong he can beat the Lakers than the Thunders and the Bulls, and go down as the second or third best player ever, but I think that highly unlikely. I, like another poster have stated, think becuase on his size his body will decline really fast, and lets be honest if Lebron does not have his speed, and athletic ability than how much would opponets fear his shot and post game. If players know they can stay in front of him they will lay off him and that will make him less of a overall threat. Lebron can score dont get me wrong but he's naturaly a play makers, so without his speed his scoring will drop quickly in my opinion.

Now i understand what ive said is all opinion, and I cant tell the future, but saying he'll win more is an opinion as well,because no one really knows. I have a question , If this is the only title Lebron wins and with it being during the lockout season, how will that affect his legacy.

To answer the op. If the Lakers beat the Heat in the finals and kobe plays Lebron even, than in my mind he has to be considered better than Lebron becuase Lebron is priming and considered by most the best in the game, and Kobe is slowly decling and considerably long in the tooth with age and mileage. I have a feeling though that if that were to happen Lebron will still win finals MVP becuase if you play him even, he will still get the nod like this years season MVP vs Durant, but thats another debate.

Not a Bron hater either.

SirSkyHook
08-28-2012, 11:27 AM
And also If Kobe win another ring or two and is a major contributer or finals MVP he should get more respect as a alltime great. I know people like to say he has had Shaq ( who won nothing prior to Kobe priming), and Gasol ( who won nothing prior), and now Nash/ Howard ( who both won nothing prior), and say he had major help, but I say if they were to win, name aanother player who has rebuild the team three times with one player and won rings.

Magic won with Kareem and than added Worthy, Scott, Coope, and Rambis to the mix
Bird won with his crew for all his rings
Jordan won with Pippen with all his rings

To do it with a different cast on multiple occasions to me says alot. To make three different championship teams work would mean dispite what people think Kobe's one hell of a team player.

Pfeifer
08-28-2012, 11:38 AM
I think Kobe is very good, but he has been a selfish player and person which is not exactly likable. And Shaq is the best player since Jordan.

C_Mund
08-28-2012, 11:39 AM
And also If Kobe win another ring or two and is a major contributer or finals MVP he should get more respect as a alltime great. I know people like to say he has had Shaq ( who won nothing prior to Kobe priming), and Gasol ( who won nothing prior), and now Nash/ Howard ( who both won nothing prior), and say he had major help, but I say if they were to win, name aanother player who has rebuild the team three times with one player and won rings.

Magic won with Kareem and than added Worthy, Scott, Coope, and Rambis to the mix
Bird won with his crew for all his rings
Jordan won with Pippen with all his rings

To do it with a different cast on multiple occasions to me says alot. To make three different championship teams work would mean dispite what people think Kobe's one hell of a team player.

I respect your argument but the fact that this guy is an all-time great and they're still forced to rebuild a brand new contender around him every 3-4 years is pretty telling that Kobe isn't a team player. If your prime is 12 years and you can't keep teammates happy, even when winning multiple championships..... yeah. Dude is selfish as they get, he just also happens to be really really good.

Lewisknows
08-28-2012, 12:12 PM
Why don't people want to give this man his props this man is great after mj Kobe from 2000 to 2011 people talking about he had players really shaq gasol it a given but those who forgot smush Parker Sasha Chris mihm brown pls Lebron won't win with that just give the man his credit.another thing I love how everybody on Lebron balls but when he choose heat everybody oh he can't be great he needs wade oh he will never be great but now since he won a championship this ***** is god now Smh hypocrites

Munkeysuit
08-28-2012, 12:31 PM
Kobe was better than Lebron, let's clear the air with that. I think Kobe is hated on because he's getting pretty darn close to Jordan status and I am not so sure the majority of the public who was fortunate to see Jordan play and have lived through the Jordan era, is ready to let go of him being the G.O.A.T yet ...Kobester is pretty dam close with his 5 rings though.

bucketss
08-28-2012, 12:33 PM
Why don't people want to give this man his props this man is great after mj Kobe from 2000 to 2011 people talking about he had players really shaq gasol it a given but those who forgot smush Parker Sasha Chris mihm brown pls Lebron won't win with that just give the man his credit.another thing I love how everybody on Lebron balls but when he choose heat everybody oh he can't be great he needs wade oh he will never be great but now since he won a championship this ***** is god now Smh hypocrites

yeah lebron wouldn't win with that neither would kobe whats your point? also you want to know whats hypocritical? you whine about people hating on kobe than you hate on lebron? you're basically doing what the kobe haters do so you can't complain about them.

LoveMeOrHateMe
08-28-2012, 12:50 PM
[QUOTE=LoveMeOrHateMe;23405961]

Not really. I rate him where he should be, top 7-9 ever. But I have no issue picking apart some of his game, just like many of the other top players whose careers are either over or getting there.

I don't mind you saying that and ranking him there what I do not like is you saying no matter what Kobe does in his final 2-3 like lets say win championships, break records and finals MVP that he won't move up your list smh

Lewisknows
08-28-2012, 01:17 PM
yeah lebron wouldn't win with that neither would kobe whats your point? also you want to know whats hypocritical? you whine about people hating on kobe than you hate on lebron? you're basically doing what the kobe haters do so you can't complain about them.

What are u talking about what is the topic?u prove my point all I said is with the quality of players he had Kobe stilled ball I'm just saying stop hatin on the man and give him his props that all and trust me I can't stand Lebron but that boy is a beast and he is the best now so now what

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 01:36 PM
[QUOTE=Hawkeye15;23406012]

I don't mind you saying that and ranking him there what I do not like is you saying no matter what Kobe does in his final 2-3 like lets say win championships, break records and finals MVP that he won't move up your list smh

It's HOW you do it man, and I personally don't feel Kobe has enough left in the tank to continue climbing, just as I don't think there is much that can make him move down unless its a player moving past him eventually.

I don't see any REALISTIC way that Kobe gets in the top 5 all time. I do not think he has enough left, and becoming second banana again with lesser stats (which is what is happening) does not make him move up.

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 03:01 PM
ahh, this argument again. Yeah, having an ELITE defense with multiple vets who guard different positions, work within and offense, are able to hit midrange shots and get offensive rebounds, while spacing the floor perfectly at all times to allow their ballstopper to just keep on working for his shot are awful.

You still have no point here. Iverson was a high volume scorer, meaning he just shot it, and shot it, and shot it, and at the end of the night, he had 28 points on 26 shots.
You seem to be confused

1) AI was the best defender on the team period. Yes Larry Brown put in a nice team defense with some scrappy defenders that on it's own doesn't even guarantee a playoff spot and AI was the man who most often turned defense into offense with steals.

2)AI was the offense point blank period. They had a bunch of guys who couldn't dribble, who definitely couldn't shoot and not a single big man with a post game.

3)No you still have no point here because without AI being a VOLUME scorer the 76ers would have averaged 55 points a a game.

Chronz
08-28-2012, 03:07 PM
You seem to be confused

1) AI was the best defender on the team period.
The Defensive Player of the Year, wasnt even the best defender on his own team?


Yes Larry Brown put in a nice team defense with some scrappy defenders that on it's own doesn't even guarantee a playoff spot and AI was the man who most often turned defense into offense with steals.
Maybe, but I bet they would be in the running for the playoffs.


2)AI was the offense point blank period. They had a bunch of guys who couldn't dribble, who definitely couldn't shoot and not a single big man with a post game.
Well isnt that the way AI likes it? When they tried to surround him with offensive threats, didnt they just see their effectiveness dwindle and watch it rise once they left him? So rather than continue failing to find an offensive performer that can play alongside AI, they went all in on the defenders. Guys who would impact the game regardless of whether AI was feeding them or not.


3)No you still have no point here because without AI being a VOLUME scorer the 76ers would have averaged 55 points a a game.Let me get this straight, your quantifying a players impact on his team by making up an absurd number that even teams in the deadball era would exceed? LOL cmon man, 55pts? If you want to be taken seriously then stop exaggerating.

lookie8
08-28-2012, 03:22 PM
Has it ever occurred to anyone that Kobe goes out of his way to be disrespected.

The way he speaks about players, teammates, himself.

Thinking he's bigger than the game.

And expecting fans to believe the arrogance he shows on the court should be interpreted as leadership?

Jason Kidd has oncourt leadership capabilities. Steve Nash also. Rondo too, and Kevin Garnett. Tim Duncan. Chauncey Billups. Even Andre Miller.

Kobe should watch some tape of these guys.

SaimuKala
08-28-2012, 03:32 PM
Has it ever occurred to anyone that Kobe goes out of his way to be disrespected.

The way he speaks about players, teammates, himself.

Thinking he's bigger than the game.

And expecting fans to believe the arrogance he shows on the court should be interpreted as leadership?

Jason Kidd has oncourt leadership capabilities. Steve Nash also. Rondo too, and Kevin Garnett. Tim Duncan. Chauncey Billups. Even Andre Miller.

Kobe should watch some tape of these guys.


Kobe always says good things about his teammates... and the other players.

You really have to watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIgmXTaLeBM

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 03:34 PM
Has it ever occurred to anyone that Kobe goes out of his way to be disrespected.

The way he speaks about players, teammates, himself.

Thinking he's bigger than the game.

And expecting fans to believe the arrogance he shows on the court should be interpreted as leadership?

Jason Kidd has oncourt leadership capabilities. Steve Nash also. Rondo too, and Kevin Garnett. Tim Duncan. Chauncey Billups. Even Andre Miller.

Kobe should watch some tape of these guys.

llullz

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 03:36 PM
You seem to be confused

Not, not at all.


1) AI was the best defender on the team period.

Uh, hell to the no. Snow, McKie were much better perimeter defenders. Um, he had the DPOY behind him. Iverson was not remotely their best defensive player.


Yes Larry Brown put in a nice team defense with some scrappy defenders that on it's own doesn't even guarantee a playoff spot and AI was the man who most often turned defense into offense with steals.

Here is a lesson for you. Iverson was a roamer. When you have those, you need a great defense behind them to cover up all the misses (there were plenty) in those passing lanes. Snow was guarding the top guard at all times, McKie and even Lynch the best wing(s). There were very good defensive big men behind them as well.


2)AI was the offense point blank period. They had a bunch of guys who couldn't dribble, who definitely couldn't shoot and not a single big man with a post game

Iverson was obviously the guy who had the offense run through him. The very fact that he needed a large amount of shots to get his, DESPITE drawing fouls, shows he was a huge volume shooter who needed, at that time, the right system players around him to succeed. Not until later with Denver did he learn that he didn't need to run the show at all times, which made it easier for teams to set gameplans.


3)No you still have no point here because without AI being a VOLUME scorer the 76ers would have averaged 55 points a a game.

You were the one that jumped in with the "weak" support crap again. Elementary fans of the sport only believe legit help is/are players that score well, not players with perfect cohesion, defense, rebounding, spacing, and specialized skillsets that a high volume shooter needs to have around him to succeed. Didn't you pay attention to the players that AI played with that went on to better teams, or were on teams before him, where they simply played better?

Lakerhead4ever
08-28-2012, 03:50 PM
Has it ever occurred to anyone that Kobe goes out of his way to be disrespected.

The way he speaks about players, teammates, himself.

Thinking he's bigger than the game.

And expecting fans to believe the arrogance he shows on the court should be interpreted as leadership?

Jason Kidd has oncourt leadership capabilities. Steve Nash also. Rondo too, and Kevin Garnett. Tim Duncan. Chauncey Billups. Even Andre Miller.

Kobe should watch some tape of these guys.

Kobe doesn't have to watch tape of those guy. His career and legacy goes beyond theirs.

Haters are going to hate though.

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 03:53 PM
Uh, hell to the no. Snow, McKie were much better perimeter defenders. Um, he had the DPOY behind him. Iverson was not remotely their best defensive player.


You realize Ivo played with the 76ers from 96-2007 right? And you realize Mutumbo played with Ivo for only 106 games which is like 1.25 seasons right? Snow was guarding the other teams SG most of the time because IVO needed to stay out of foul trouble. It's common in the NBA for that to happen. Most of the time Rasho Nesterovic and David Robinson guarded the teams best big man in the post to keep Duncan out of foul trouble too. They were better defenders? No





You were the one that jumped in with the "weak" support crap again. Elementary fans of the sport only believe legit help is/are players that score well, not players with perfect cohesion, defense, rebounding, spacing, and specialized skillsets that a high volume shooter needs to have around him to succeed. Didn't you pay attention to the players that AI played with that went on to better teams, or were on teams before him, where they simply played better?
Ok so they didn't have a weak supporting cast? Really? So who was their best post player? What was the shooting% of their best perimeter shooters? Who on that team could create a shot other than AI? I'll wait.

JasonJohnHorn
08-28-2012, 03:54 PM
I don't think the rape allegations help, nor the fact that he's a ball hog who shoots more than he should.

Tony_Starks
08-28-2012, 04:15 PM
Definitely one of the most if not the most disrespected superstar of all time. Kobe could win a championship playing with 11 high school kids and people would say "thats just because nobody in the nba wanted to play with him!"

In some peoples eyes there's just nothing he can do for them to recognize his greatness but it really doesn't matter at this point. Men lie, women lie, numbers don't.........

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 04:20 PM
You realize Ivo played with the 76ers from 96-2007 right? And you realize Mutumbo played with Ivo for only 106 games which is like 1.25 seasons right?

Correct. The one team that went deep in the super weak east (let's be real, at that time, the west finals team had already gone through at least 2 better teams by the time it ran into the east rep), is the one I am specifically talking about. If you wish to go year by year, you have nothing to stand on because Iverson still had elite defensive teams when the Sixers were competitive, this one stood out.


Snow was guarding the other teams SG most of the time because IVO needed to stay out of foul trouble.

100% false. Iverson guarded the weakest link because he roamed (not by Brown's desire, by AI's natural tendency), where as Snow and McKie were the lockdown perimter guys, Snow specifically.


It's common in the NBA for that to happen. Most of the time Rasho Nesterovic and David Robinson guarded the teams best big man in the post to keep Duncan out of foul trouble too.

Not really, come playoff time, you know, the real games, a coach has his best defensive player on the best player in his range, its up to the star to not get in foul trouble. Iverson was not a good defender.


Ok so they didn't have a weak supporting cast? Really? So who was their best post player?

Again, it's flying straight over your head. Iverson didn't play well with other ball dominators, so the best strategy for the Sixers was to employ a tough minded, veteran laced defensive team that would settle into a role. It was essential they did this to compete.


What was the shooting% of their best perimeter shooters? Who on that team could create a shot other than AI? I'll wait.

see above. Done with AI, I have been on this ride forever. Those in love with offense will support him forever, because he scored tons of points and didn't have teammates that did, that same fan not understanding context at all. This is a Kobe thread. It all started with me replying that Iverson didn't kick Kobe's *** at any point. The opposite actually.

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 04:25 PM
Definitely one of the most if not the most disrespected superstar of all time. Kobe could win a championship playing with 11 high school kids and people would say "thats just because nobody in the nba wanted to play with him!"

In some peoples eyes there's just nothing he can do for them to recognize his greatness but it really doesn't matter at this point. Men lie, women lie, numbers don't.........

he has done the opposite however. Which is why many people don't discredit those rings, but its just as big of disservice to walk around acting as if Bryant is superior to others because he won 5 rings as it is to say he shouldn't get much credit due to having such dominant help.

lookie8
08-28-2012, 04:29 PM
[/B]

Kobe doesn't have to watch tape of those guy. His career and legacy goes beyond theirs.

Haters are going to hate though.

And D-Bags like Kobe are going to be disrespected, and rightfully so.

And I didn't say Kobe wasn't better than those guys.

I said if Kobe wanted to actually be an effective leader on and off the court, he should take lessons from those guys.

Now Michael Jordan, there was an oncourt leader.

Tony_Starks
08-28-2012, 04:34 PM
he has done the opposite however. Which is why many people don't discredit those rings, but its just as big of disservice to walk around acting as if Bryant is superior to others because he won 5 rings as it is to say he shouldn't get much credit due to having such dominant help.


No other Superstar in the history of the nba gets maligned as much as Kobe for winning championships with great help. Not Magic, Bird, Duncan, KG, and for damn sure not MJ. And all those guys played with top 50 players of all time/ future HOF's. Some with multiple.

There is simply no denying this.

Tony_Starks
08-28-2012, 04:35 PM
And D-Bags like Kobe are going to be disrespected, and rightfully so.

And I didn't say Kobe wasn't better than those guys.

I said if Kobe wanted to actually be an effective leader on and off the court, he should take lessons from those guys.

Now Michael Jordan, there was an oncourt leader.

The same Jordan that used to punch people out in practice right? Ok. Learn your history, Jordan was respected but by NO means liked.....

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 04:37 PM
I don't think the rape allegations help, nor the fact that he's a ball hog who shoots more than he should.

You're one of the few ignorant little kids here who keeps bringing up the rape thing. I think you have like 15 of the same types of posts in this thread already. Great job. :clap:

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 04:38 PM
No other Superstar in the history of the nba gets maligned as much as Kobe for winning championships with great help. Not Magic, Bird, Duncan, KG, and for damn sure not MJ. And all those guys played with top 50 players of all time. Some with multiple.

There is simply no denying this.

Magic and Bird are rarely talked about anymore. Jordan is just clearly better, Duncan is in San Antonio. Nobody cares about SA outside like 10 people here.

Welcome to being a polarizing, arrogant athlete that has dealt with off court drama, as well as on court drama in one of the largest markets out there. And he is still playing...

It will die down some when he retires.

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 04:39 PM
lookie8 = Andrew32

Shlumpledink
08-28-2012, 04:43 PM
Because most fans on the internet love stats. Most people realize at some point that basketball isn't a great game for stats. Now we have more advanced metrics, but basketball is fundamentally difficult to attach stats to, unlike baseball. So people on the internet will make great statistical arguments about player x y and z.

I don't believe the statistical argument is the reason people don't like Kobe. I think it might be a little deeper than that, but its usually manifested in that way. Most people who don't like Kobe, didn't like him before they pulled up his basketball reference page. I doubt anyone who isn't a fan of a player, looks at their stats page and becomes a fan. The mind has already been made up, and they look to the stats to validate their hatred.

But to compare Kobe's stats to players who play entirely different positions and entirely different games of basketball, see different defensive schemes and run different offensive schemes, is just like comparing apples and oranges. Basketball doesn't have the same plug in and play mechanics that is part of baseball. Trying to break the game down using just stats is going to look pretty on an internet forum, but ultimately won't account for a whole lot.

Shlumpledink
08-28-2012, 04:45 PM
And D-Bags like Kobe are going to be disrespected, and rightfully so.

And I didn't say Kobe wasn't better than those guys.

I said if Kobe wanted to actually be an effective leader on and off the court, he should take lessons from those guys.

Now Michael Jordan, there was an oncourt leader.

The guy who berated his teammates on the court and in the locker room at half time. That is what you call great leadership? Or are you simply misinformed?

Tony_Starks
08-28-2012, 04:48 PM
I used to dislike MJ's game quite a bit. I thought he was the king of the superstar call and toward the last 2 minutes of a playoff game you literally couldn't breathe on him without sending him to the line. That being said when I watch his games now objectively I realize how great he was.

I think the same will happen with Kobe. Years later people are going to appreciate his game like "Wow, I forgot how unstoppable he was!"

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 04:52 PM
I used to dislike MJ's game quite a bit. I thought he was the king of the superstar call and toward the last 2 minutes of a playoff game you literally couldn't breathe on him without sending him to the line. That being said when I watch his games now objectively I realize how great he was.

I think the same will happen with Kobe. Years later people are going to appreciate his game like "Wow, I forgot how unstoppable he was!"

You may have something there. I was a HUGE MJ fan, so I defended him with rabid intensity. Of course, I was 9 when he came in, 16 his first chip, etc, so I was the young fan that acted off passion over rational (sounds familiar, doesn't it). I appreciate completely that I have been fortunate to watch Kobe, Duncan, KG, Dirk, Shaq, and now LeBron, Paul, and some others. I still have my favorites and those I dislike, but I can seperate that much better now as an older, more patient fan who just loves watching good basketball.

pacofunk64
08-28-2012, 04:59 PM
Why? Because he's been the closest thing to MJ and I don't...I mean the people don't ever want MJ to be dethroned.

SB75
08-28-2012, 05:02 PM
WHAT? Kobe disrespected? Dude get real! Kobe is not disrespected! You must be a huge Kobe fan to even think this crap up........

Why didn't you just name the thread...... Why I think Kobe is better than LBJ! That is what it's really about. Love for Kobe and hate for LBJ!

Kobe does not get disrespected at all!

BigCityofDreams
08-28-2012, 05:23 PM
I used to dislike MJ's game quite a bit. I thought he was the king of the superstar call and toward the last 2 minutes of a playoff game you literally couldn't breathe on him without sending him to the line. That being said when I watch his games now objectively I realize how great he was.

I think the same will happen with Kobe. Years later people are going to appreciate his game like "Wow, I forgot how unstoppable he was!"

Yes when he retires it will change to some degree because it happens with every star when he hangs them up.

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 05:30 PM
WHAT? Kobe disrespected? Dude get real! Kobe is not disrespected! You must be a huge Kobe fan to even think this crap up........

Why didn't you just name the thread...... Why I think Kobe is better than LBJ! That is what it's really about. Love for Kobe and hate for LBJ!

Kobe does not get disrespected at all!

llullz

lookie8
08-28-2012, 06:31 PM
The same Jordan that used to punch people out in practice right? Ok. Learn your history, Jordan was respected but by NO means liked.....

Can you read, for Crise sakes?

Where was being liked mentioned?

Jordan was an oncourt leader.

Kobe is the guy oncourt that is going to take the most shots, forced or not.

Kidd's not liked by his teammates. Neither is KG. But they are both respected by their teammates because they are both all about winning. Kobe ain't about that. Kobe is about Kobe.

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 06:34 PM
Can you read, for Crise sakes?

Where was being liked mentioned?

Jordan was an oncourt leader.

Kobe is the guy oncourt that is going to take the most shots, forced or not.

Kidd's not liked by his teammates. Neither is KG. But they are both respected by their teammates because they are both all about winning. Kobe ain't about that. Kobe is about Kobe.

Too much blood boiling and hate is not good for the health, not good for the soul.

SteBO
08-28-2012, 06:41 PM
Kobe is all about Kobe? Look I think the man on too many occasions takes more shots than he should be taking, but to say that he's only about himself is insinuating that he would do it for selfish purposes. Let's not forget that a big reason why Kobe shot a ton the past two years is because Pau and Bynum more times that I can count had games where they simply didn't show up. At that point I don't blame Kobe for unloading his gun if he sees that his two most reliable players aren't playing with any fire.

And all Kobe had done since he's been in the league is expand his game when necessary, while winning 5 titles in the process.

amos1er
08-28-2012, 06:46 PM
Can you read, for Crise sakes?

Where was being liked mentioned?

Jordan was an oncourt leader.

Kobe is the guy oncourt that is going to take the most shots, forced or not.

Kidd's not liked by his teammates. Neither is KG. But they are both respected by their teammates because they are both all about winning. Kobe ain't about that. Kobe is about Kobe.

This post is exactly what the OP is talking about. Total disrespect from an obviously bias fan. The sad thing is that posts like these are not isolated incidents...there are many other jealous haters out there that sputter just as much, if not more, foolish jargon than this. The guy has five rings and is one of the most accomplished winners in NBA history and that is not enough to silence guys like this that are so obviously blinded by jealously and hate. 5 championships later and still people are foolish enough to claim that Kobe is more Kobe than winning. There aren't enough facepalms in the world for a post like this, but here goes...:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

BTW: If Kobe was really about Kobe and not about winning, than he would have played the last game of this season and taken the scoring title from Durant. But he decided that it was more important to rest for the playoffs rather than go for an individual accolade by playing in a meaningless game.

Also, when Kobe scored 62 in 3 quarters, he sat out the 4th because the game had been won already. If Kobe was truly all about Kobe and not about winning, than he would have played in the 4th and tried to go for a NBA record. But again he decided that an individual accolade was not more important than the overall teams success.

Basically, think before you speak. Thank you and good day.

lookie8
08-28-2012, 06:52 PM
Too much blood boiling and hate is not good for the health, not good for the soul.

Could there POSSIBLY be a better way to vent one's anger than on an anonymous NBA Forum.

And are you saying that everyone doesn't have some hate in their heart and their soul, especially with the state of the world as it currently exists?

If you are saying that, then you are either in a deep pit of denial, or just lying.

amos1er
08-28-2012, 07:06 PM
Could there POSSIBLY be a better way to vent one's anger than on an anonymous NBA Forum.

And are you saying that everyone doesn't have some hate in their heart and their soul, especially with the state of the world as it currently exists?

If you are saying that, then you are either in a deep pit of denial, or just lying.

Again you're missing the point. KB-Pau-DH2012 said that hate was not good for the soul and you respond out of context by justifying you're reasons for being a hater.

Let me break it down for you. He is saying that holding on to that kind of hate is not healthy. When you attempt to justify you're hate by using the overall hate that exists in the world today as an excuse, it makes no sense because you are still damaging yourself regardless of what everyone else is doing.

With that said, you're overall logic is flawed as well. You are basically saying that its ok to jump of a bridge if everyone else is doing it too. You will still die if you jump off a bridge regardless of whether everyone else does it, just like being a hater is still damaging to your soul regardless of the overall quantity of haters in the world like yourself.

bucketss
08-28-2012, 07:09 PM
Again you're missing the point. KB-Pau-DH2012 said that hate was not good for the soul and you respond out of context by justifying you're reasons for being a hater.

Let me break it down for you. He is saying that holding on to that kind of hate is not healthy. When you attempt to justify you're hate by using the overall hate that exists in the world today as an excuse, it makes no sense because you are still damaging yourself regardless of what everyone else is doing.

With that said, you're overall logic is flawed as well. You are basically saying that its ok to jump of a bridge if everyone else is doing it too. You will still die if you jump off a bridge regardless of whether everyone else does it, just like being a hater is still damaging to your soul regardless of the overall quantity of haters in the world like yourself.

you're probably the biggest lebron hater on this site you know that right? lol:D

3RDASYSTEM
08-28-2012, 07:20 PM
why does people/fans start and rate KB career from 2000 til now, is it because he started fulltime in 2000 after riding pine since 96? how can you be so great yrs later but not early if you a truly top 5-10 of all time? nevermind its called a developing player.....its why i called him a scoring version of PIPP,its who he was when he came in league and he just scored more later and stop doing all that other lil stuff that PIPP was so good at and had that fued with SHAQ cause he compared himself to JORDAN and took his game/style,how can you be JORDAN but tell PHILJAX you tired of being a sidekick?(wasnt PIPP a sidekick?) SHAQ/BRON/AI wouldnt have came in NBA out of highschool and rode bench for nobody for no yrs no way no how as nobody sidekick, just equal....BRON is my proof on that just go back and check circa 2003-04 season...20ppg 6rpg and 6apg and he wasnt no sidekick when he went to south beach.....AI was 20yr old rookie putting up basically 24ppg and 8apg and he wasnt no sidekick when he went to MELOVILLE, KB/PIPP were both developing 7ppg rookies scorers(now do you understand my reason for calling KB a scoring version of PIPP?) PIPP is a top 50 player of all time with 6rings, so what would make a scoring version of him with 5rings, top 30 of alltime? but i dont base players off of rings like yall do, i do it off of game/impact from first day of NBA, even in college i could tell how dynamic a player would be, IVERSON had his same game since HIGHSCHOOL as a junior, he didnt play his SENIOR yr because of that bs bowling alley fiasco prison stint

HAWKEYE15, did IVERSON **** your dad's mistress? CHRONZ you know better,especially if you big up TMAC like you do(and if that trade would have went down between him and HUGHES then AI/TMAC would have been that 2000's pistons version in 98-99,but way more dynamic offensively with 2 40pt capable scorers)

Funniest **** on here is you talking about how MCKIE/SNOW/LYNCH are good defenders right....of course they are good defenders because thats all they could ...literally, well MCKIE could hit a wide open 3 pt shot after being setup via IVERSON....SNOW couldnt create or hit a 'elbow' jumper and hes a point guard? LYNCH couldnt create a shot,were T.HILL/MUTOMBO more MANUTE BOL in the post or more WILT/MCHALE? case closed...its funny that yall dont bring up they were avg like 3-4ppg when they teamed with AI but they ppg shot up after playing with him(so did he make his teammates better or not? or made game easier for'em like i like to call it?)....but yall keep saying players had career yrs before and after him, who the **** did? TYRONE HILL? 36yr old MUTOMBO? LYNCH and his 6-8ppg, SNOW and his 3-4ppg, MCKIE and his career high 10PPG with TRAILBLAZERS in like his rookie yr only to regress and rot on pistons bench, Wat about MCCOULLOUGH/GEIGER,did they tear up the league with annual double doubles? wats so funny is HAWKEYE15/CHRONZ are convinced AI played with SHAQ or KG or DUNCAN and a HOF coach with offseason championship expectations for his first 8yrs and failed,but then i'd destroy AI...but he did complete opposite albeit having a HOF coach who was so lost according to HAWKEYE he had AI running baseline to baseline to shoot 3's and create for teammates(though HAWKEYE15 says he was all about 'elite seperation', like really wat made him elite was that elite seperation? not his 'playground' handle,not his elite physical/mental toughness? not his blinding speed/quickness and 44inch vertical or his elite conditioning(44minutes per game)? not his pull up jumper on fast break? not his 3pt shot that he could get anytime anywhere according to his former HOF coach LB?

its funny that yall keep saying he had defenders around him like im that ****ing dumb to not see that, but yall keep acting like he had offense help or just wanted to chuck chuck chuck....JORDAN is the only player who shot more per game annually more seasons but its close,and when PIPP came around his shots dipped down....who was AI's PIPP in SIXERLAND? MCKIE or KORVER or IGGY? didnt IGGY just make his first allstar squad at 12ppg this past yr? maybe AI was the problem since IGGY couldnt get going with him there,but almost 6yrs later after IVERSON he gets that first allstar nod...and IGGY is who he was from his first 3yrs in league, why do i have to look at KB any diff. from his first 3yrs....because he didnt win **** his first 3yrs,so that was plenty for me to see,i didnt need to see him win a ring in 2000 where he dropped 28ppg to convince myself he was better than i thought,he just scored more... a big improvement from his PIPP like 7ppg rookie yr.....scoring version of PIPP,good job KB

this is who AI inherited as his core, yet players like CP3/BRON go team up with better talent instead of staying with there equivalent cast to AI's .....why do CP3/BRON get props for going to play with better talent but AI gets killed for being overly loyal taking a offensive challenged squad to FINALS against a tru LAKER dynasty?

after 3yrs you are who you are..go check the history of players..only a ring seperates you via media talk cause its an agenda they got to stick to..but your game is your game from WILT to IVERSON to SHAQ to BRON to JORDAN to MAGIC to BIRD to ALCINDOR to WILT to BARKLEY to TMAC to KG to KIDD to NASH to KB and so on,they were who they were they first 2-3yrs and then on and on as same,Its just IVERSON was playing same game/style in 2008 that he did in 1993...minus a half step which is normal for a 17yr old to a 33yr old..still a half step aint bad at all..jus like 'come fly with me' JORDAN to postup up FADEAWAY JORDAN, not bad at all


how in the hell can a guy who wants to shoot shoot shoot dont want a sidekick who can equally score,its like when AI came in league all rules changed or something? you guys talking on here like IVERSON wanted to shoot 25-30x a game when he literally cried on draft nite in 1998 after management ****ed off that PIERCE draft pick and took hughes #8(or maybe AI wanted 25 easy shots with PP instead of 25 tough ones with running mates MCKIE/SNOW?) why yall think they ran off the GM PAT CROCE who was building around AI right way ? do you know how dangerous that squad would have been with 2 capable 40pt scorers in that LB defensive scheme for those 6yrs he coached there? scary ..but i'll leave it up to HAWKEYE15 to say he didnt play no defense but he lead the NCAA in steals both seasons(as well as DPOY in BIGEAST both seasons) then takes his talents to the league and does same thing and ends up with a NBA record 3yrs in a row steals per game in that LB def. scheme and miraculously hes the 'weak' link because he's doing both OFF/DEF at high level and he has nothing but defenders surrounding the 7'2'' 325lb beast...wait he was only 5'9 and 155lbs and had nothing but defenders around him, old at that.....the DPOY was 36yrs old, yall should be slapped just for mentioning that and the fact that his core big 2 were MCKIE/SNOW, they signed 6yrs via IVERSON or was it based off they game? did that defense get them 42million dollar contracts a piece? would you pay a player that type of money to just play defense? you guys ****ing amaze me on here....Last time i checked a steal is a gamble, just like going to block a shot is a gamble,jus like taking a charge is a gamble..even floppers gamble, even the rogue refs gamble..according to STERN

did DALY put IVERSON rules on AI because he had help or lack of?
Magic coach Chuck Daly is using the type of defense on Iverson (middle) that he used to implement against Michael Jordan


There was all that Allen Iverson stuff in the media about how nobody could guard him. We just tried to take the challenge and come at him a little harder today."

Iverson, who said he actually got a lot more than 15 minutes of sleep, made 12 of 29 shots and finished with seven assists, five rebounds, two steals and six turnovers in 45 minutes ----- --------Imagine AI with a another scorer to relieve him from taking those 29shots per game, imagine if CP3/NASH/STOCKTON/RONDO/COUSY/ had to do that type of reversal mode and score instead of dish dish dish....would they stay so damn high in PER/Efficiency and logging those type of minutes per game? didnt think so--------------only EZAIL/ZEKE/TINY were built like that and they didnt have the athletic/physical ability of EZAIL

When Orlando tried to double-team the scoring champion, Iverson did a good job of finding Geiger and other teammates. Magic coach Chuck Daly is not sure the Magic can do much different defensively against him in Game 2 Tuesday night.

“We’ve done about everything. And I think that regardless of what you do, he’s going to get 25 points … He’s really a genius with the basketball,” Daly said.

SO HE DID A GOOD JOB OF FINDING GEIGER/LYNCH but would have trouble doing it with 2-3 other allstar teammates? HAWKEYE15 should be banned for talking out his ***

http://ballislife.com/1999-allen-iverson-playoff-debut-vs-penny-hardaway-magic/ - look how many diff. ways he scores, like a combo of DURANT/MILLER/JORDAN mixed with nothing we ever seen physically from a lil guy in bigmans league, but they listed at 7ft and 6'7' and 6'6'...AI is commissioner STERNS height... AI had the difficulty of getting JORDAN rules ran on him and he couldnt shoot 50pct from the field after taking 25 out of 30 tough shots annually from 96-2007? whos fault is that, the player or GM/OWNER for not getting quality or equal talent to surround him with? why is it cool for BIRD/MAGIC and others to have a legit HOF to build with but AI took a offensive starved team to a FINALS app. and everybody say it was the defense which carried him but he led league in steals just like he did in college? so did that G'TOWN college team d help him do that also? was OTHELLA and JUNK YARD WILL that good at def. in college?

Although the 76ers are in the playoffs for the first time since 1991, eight of the 15 players on the team had postseason experience before Sunday. Rick Mahorn, who’s in his 16th season, led the way with 101 games. The other seven — Tyrone Hill, Eric Snow, Harvey Grant, Aaron McKie, George Lynch, Matt Geiger and Theo Ratliff — had a combined 94 games of playoff experience … Iverson won the scoring title despite shooting just .412 from the field — the lowest mark by a scoring champion since George Mikan shot 40.7 percent in 1949-50 - --------------MAN LOOK AT THOSE 1ST TEAM ALLNBA PLAYERS...THAT IS A LETHAL CORE TO BUILD AROUND A SUPERSTAR - JERRY WEST

Amazing IVERSON beat out a multiple champion dominant bigman for FG pct....i wonder if MIKAN got JORDAN rules thrown at him or would it be WILT rules?

"They deserve to win this series," said Magic coach Chuck Daly, who watched Iverson score 30 or more points in three of four games in the series. "This was Allen Iverson's show. He scored 37 points on 14-of-27 shooting and he is such a tough competitor. I don't think you '''(the media '''&CHRONZ&HAWKEYE&BAGWELL''')''' realize all the things he does."

“He’s an incredible player, one of the top 10 in history,” former Pistons coach Chuck Daly told a visitor before Iverson ignited and torched Detroit’s defense for game-high totals of 37 points and 15 assists in a 2005 game at Wachovia Center. -DALY DOESNT KNOW WAT HE TALKING ABOUT, HE DOESNT KNOW ******* ABOUT COACHING TALENT OR TRYING TO STOP A HOF/ALLNBA CALIBER PLAYER..right HAWKEYE15?

SHAQ DIESEL said he was a top 5 player ever - http://youtu.be/SBZ2jlhwpR0

“The difference (between defending Jordan and Iverson),” Daly added, “is that Michael had Scottie (Pippen), who was one of the best players in the league.”Iverson never had a true running mate during his 10-plus years in Philadelphia, and there are many who believe that fact was his fault(or a few as in HAWKEYE/CHRONZ)

so HAWKEYE you and CHRONZ say you guys use PER/WS and all that other stuff because NBA teams hired guys to keep up with this type of stuff which is all good, but on other note wouldnt guys like CHUCK DALY and SHAQ DIESEL words and analysis also mean even more since DALY did coach against JORDAN/MAGIC/KAREEM and others and SHAQ battled HAKEEM/EWING/ROBINSON/DUNCAN/HOWARD/MING and played with PENNY/KB/WADE? wouldnt they word mean just as much(way way more in my book) as the employees in the NBA collecting the PER/WS% ******** data?

Tony_Starks
08-28-2012, 07:24 PM
"Kobe is about Kobe" pretty much sums up the general consensus of psd Kobe haters. They will go around and around with all sorts of backwards logic and meaningless comparisons but "Kobe is about Kobe" is bound to come out sooner or later.

It's like when I see somebody say "Lebrick" I just automatically stop reading because you know the hate machine is in high gear.......

bucketss
08-28-2012, 07:26 PM
^wow

@3rdAsystem

3RDASYSTEM
08-28-2012, 07:33 PM
I kno right, jus wow

how could one spew so much documented poppycock right?

amos1er
08-28-2012, 07:37 PM
you're probably the biggest lebron hater on this site you know that right? lol:D

Not really, I just feel that people overrate him tremendously. But even if that were true, at least I don't justify it by using the hate of others a crutch.

Chronz
08-28-2012, 08:17 PM
3rdasystem finds anything you ever say on AI... anywhere

amos1er
08-28-2012, 08:40 PM
why does people/fans start and rate KB career from 2000 til now, is it because he started fulltime in 2000 after riding pine since 96? how can you be so great yrs later but not early if you a truly top 5-10 of all time? nevermind its called a developing player.....its why i called him a scoring version of PIPP,its who he was when he came in league and he just scored more later and stop doing all that other lil stuff that PIPP was so good at and had that fued with SHAQ cause he compared himself to JORDAN and took his game/style,how can you be JORDAN but tell PHILJAX you tired of being a sidekick?(wasnt PIPP a sidekick?) SHAQ/BRON/AI wouldnt have came in NBA out of highschool and rode bench for nobody for no yrs no way no how as nobody sidekick, just equal....BRON is my proof on that just go back and check circa 2003-04 season...20ppg 6rpg and 6apg and he wasnt no sidekick when he went to south beach.....AI was 20yr old rookie putting up basically 24ppg and 8apg and he wasnt no sidekick when he went to MELOVILLE, KB/PIPP were both developing 7ppg rookies scorers(now do you understand my reason for calling KB a scoring version of PIPP?) PIPP is a top 50 player of all time with 6rings, so what would make a scoring version of him with 5rings, top 30 of alltime? but i dont base players off of rings like yall do, i do it off of game/impact from first day of NBA, even in college i could tell how dynamic a player would be, IVERSON had his same game since HIGHSCHOOL as a junior, he didnt play his SENIOR yr because of that bs bowling alley fiasco prison stint

You do realize that when Kobe was drafted onto the Lakers they were considered a playoff team at the time right? Kobe was competing against players like Van Exel and Byron Scott for PT. The Cavs instantly started Lebron because they were a lottery team that didn't even had a top 50 SF on their roster.

Now can you see why Kobe didn't instantly start? You have to be smart enough to realize that Kobe would have started if he were drafted onto the Cavs in that same situation right?

In fact, one of the reasons Del Harris was fired was because he didn't give Kobe more PT and the Lakers FO felt that Kobe's development was being hindered by Del Harris's ineptness as a coach. You see, the Lakers were very high on Bryant, in fact, Jerry West (their GM at the time) upon drafting Kobe said that he would be the best player in the league within the next five years. With that said, I hope you can understand why its hard for me to except your asinine little theory about how Kobe was a "developing player" that can be compared to the likes of Scottie Pippen. The Lakers FO would not have fired a coach and traded away a top 5 center for a "developing player" on par with Scottie Pippen.

When Kobe was 20, the same age as Iverson when he was a rookie, he was putting up 20, 4 and 5 compared to Iverson's 24, 8, and 4. Kobe also was playing 3 less minutes per game and was shooting at 46.5% from the field compared to Iverson's 41.6%. Also, Iverson had more opportunities due to the fact that the ball was in his hand more of the time as he was the number one option and Kobe was number 2 to Shaq when he was 20. Kobe also didn't have the college experience that Iverson had before he was 20. Kobe was essentially coming off the bench for 2 years, not gaining nearly the same valuable experience that Iverson had under his belt by being the leader of a team back in college for 2 years. Not to mention that Kobe was an all-NBA defensive 2nd team member when he was 20. Iverson never made a defensive team in his whole career.

Sorry to bust you're little Iverson bubble, but back in the year 2001 when Iverson won MVP, Kobe was clearly the better player. Iverson put up 31.1 ppg in the regular season, but he only shot 41.9% and he was the number one scoring option. Kobe however put up 28.5 ppg and he did it while being 1b to Shaqs 1a while shooting 46.4 from the field. Kobe also had more assists and rebounds than did Iverson.

In fact, in the playoffs that year Kobe averaged 29.4 ppg 6.1 apg, and 7.3 rpg on 46.9% from the field as being the number 1b option. Iverson did put up 32.9 ppg, but he did it while shooting a measly 38.9% from the field while being the clear cut number one option. He had 6.1 apg, which was the same as Kobe, but much less rebounds at 4.7. But lets not let stats tell the whole story now shall we.

During the 01 playoffs, the Lakers set a record by going 15-1. That record will never be matched, also, Shaq was quoted by saying that Kobe was by far the best player in the league.

Basically, you're little theory about Kobe riding pine for the first 2 years of his career is completely false and doesn't prove a damn thing. Do you really believe that a 17 year old Jordan would have started over Scott or Van Excel, especially when Kobe was only the second major player ever to be drafted out of high school after KG? Kobe was a pioneer setting the stage for guys like Lebron to come here straight out of high school. Its because of Kobe's success that Lebron got the chance to be drafted number one and to be the number one scoring option for his team right off the bat. In the end you're argument means nothing as Kobe has gone on to be considered one of the top ten players of all time and has dwarfed guys like Iverson and Pippen. Kobe has set the gold standard for a player that was drafted out of high school. The way I see it...Lebron still has a long way to go to match him and thats saying a lot considering Kobe was the one who set the stage for high school drafted players. Iverson's best year in the NBA doesn't even compare to Kobe's fifth best...now thats pretty damn impressive for a "developing player" that should be compared to Scottie Pippen. In closing I would just like to say... :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

lookie8
08-28-2012, 09:49 PM
This post is exactly what the OP is talking about. Total disrespect from an obviously bias fan. The sad thing is that posts like these are not isolated incidents...there are many other jealous haters out there that sputter just as much, if not more, foolish jargon than this. The guy has five rings and is one of the most accomplished winners in NBA history and that is not enough to silence guys like this that are so obviously blinded by jealously and hate. 5 championships later and still people are foolish enough to claim that Kobe is more Kobe than winning. There aren't enough facepalms in the world for a post like this, but here goes...:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

BTW: If Kobe was really about Kobe and not about winning, than he would have played the last game of this season and taken the scoring title from Durant. But he decided that it was more important to rest for the playoffs rather than go for an individual accolade by playing in a meaningless game.

Also, when Kobe scored 62 in 3 quarters, he sat out the 4th because the game had been won already. If Kobe was truly all about Kobe and not about winning, than he would have played in the 4th and tried to go for a NBA record. But again he decided that an individual accolade was not more important than the overall teams success.

Basically, think before you speak. Thank you and good day.

You think my posts would exist if people didn't start threads like this one?

Plus, all the umwarranted love from his groupies makes me hate him more, so there is never anyway I will ever respect the stool-pigeon rapist.

Always a pleasure to disrespect Kobe.

lookie8
08-28-2012, 09:55 PM
Again you're missing the point. KB-Pau-DH2012 said that hate was not good for the soul and you respond out of context by justifying you're reasons for being a hater.

Let me break it down for you. He is saying that holding on to that kind of hate is not healthy. When you attempt to justify you're hate by using the overall hate that exists in the world today as an excuse, it makes no sense because you are still damaging yourself regardless of what everyone else is doing.

With that said, you're overall logic is flawed as well. You are basically saying that its ok to jump of a bridge if everyone else is doing it too. You will still die if you jump off a bridge regardless of whether everyone else does it, just like being a hater is still damaging to your soul regardless of the overall quantity of haters in the world like yourself.

Does being a hater actually have to be justified?

This the NBA. Entertainment. I watch NBA basketball to ne entertained.

I've hated the Knicks and Celtics since the '60s. Who cares? That's how I get enjoyment out of the game.

Hating Kobe pleases me to no end.

I'm such a horrible man. Get a grip, you psychopaths.

Chronz
08-28-2012, 10:29 PM
lol at hating pleasing you to no end. Good quote

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-28-2012, 10:34 PM
Does being a hater actually have to be justified?

This the NBA. Entertainment. I watch NBA basketball to ne entertained.

I've hated the Knicks and Celtics since the '60s. Who cares? That's how I get enjoyment out of the game.

Hating Kobe pleases me to no end.

I'm such a horrible man. Get a grip, you psychopaths.

llullzz

lookie8
08-28-2012, 10:37 PM
lol at hating pleasing you to no end. Good quote

Better than kicking the dog.

bucketss
08-28-2012, 10:49 PM
lol this lookie8 guy is hilarious

lookie8
08-28-2012, 11:30 PM
lol this lookie8 guy is hilarious

Thank you

waveycrockett
08-28-2012, 11:46 PM
Not really, come playoff time, you know, the real games, a coach has his best defensive player on the best player in his range, its up to the star to not get in foul trouble. Iverson was not a good defender.


Oh so now were just talking about playoff time? So like how Shane Battier checked Durant about 75% of the time instead of LeBron? Interesting

TRUTH-TELLER
08-28-2012, 11:52 PM
the rape than trying to bribe his wife with a diamond the size of a golfball. he is talented but he is a sucker.

and how can you not get along with shaq?

Hawkeye15
08-28-2012, 11:53 PM
Oh so now were just talking about playoff time? So like how Shane Battier checked Durant about 75% of the time instead of LeBron? Interesting

You defended AI as if it was his peak. My thoughts fit in that timeline.

mightybosstone
08-29-2012, 12:19 AM
Reading some of the posts on here is just flat out ridiculous. Winning a title against a specific player does not make you better than that player, being a better player makes you a better player. If Lebron loses to Kobe in the Finals, but Kobe is the second or third best player on that team and Lebron completely goes off for like 35/7/7 every game, is Kobe the better player? No. This is a ridiculous argument.

I do still believe that Lebron has a ways to go before he can pass Kobe. Kobe's clutchness and longevity are legendary, but Lebron's prime crushes his to pieces. If Lebron can play another 5-10 season and notch maybe 1-2 more rings on his belt, I firmly believe that Lebron will be the greater all-time player.

amos1er
08-29-2012, 02:17 AM
Reading some of the posts on here is just flat out ridiculous. Winning a title against a specific player does not make you better than that player, being a better player makes you a better player. If Lebron loses to Kobe in the Finals, but Kobe is the second or third best player on that team and Lebron completely goes off for like 35/7/7 every game, is Kobe the better player? No. This is a ridiculous argument.

I do still believe that Lebron has a ways to go before he can pass Kobe. Kobe's clutchness and longevity are legendary, but Lebron's prime crushes his to pieces. If Lebron can play another 5-10 season and notch maybe 1-2 more rings on his belt, I firmly believe that Lebron will be the greater all-time player.

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:

Kobe in his prime scored 81 points in a single game, scored 62 in three quarters, had 4 consecutive games of 50 or more, and won two titles as the finals MVP. Kobe's prime was ridiculous as far as an individual talent. No way that Lebron can even touch that. Even Skip Bayless and Stephen A Smith agree on this one. When it comes to advanced stats however, Lebron is the man and Kobe cannot touch him. As far as winning, breaking countless scoring records, one on one play, fundamentals, being clutch and carrying a team on their back...Kobe far surpasses Lebron.

KB-Pau-DH2012
08-29-2012, 02:33 AM
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:

Kobe in his prime scored 81 points in a single game, scored 62 in three quarters, had 4 consecutive games of 50 or more, and won two titles as the finals MVP. Kobe's prime was ridiculous as far as an individual talent. No way that Lebron can even touch that. Even Skip Bayless and Stephen A Smith agree on this one. When it comes to advanced stats however, Lebron is the man and Kobe cannot touch him. As far as winning, breaking countless scoring records, one on one play, fundamentals, being clutch and carrying a team on their back...Kobe far surpasses Lebron.

#winningpost

waveycrockett
08-29-2012, 02:44 AM
You defended AI as if it was his peak. My thoughts fit in that timeline.

You said flat out AI was not a good defender. I can't imagine how a guy who led the NBA in steals not once, not twice but THREE TIMES in his career is a bad defender. Can you name a me a bad defender who has done that?

Lewisknows
08-29-2012, 02:46 AM
But why the change of heart on Lebron we he went to maimi I heard that oh he will never be compared to the great oh he can't be great but what ever but I asked this to all the doubters about Kobe greatness tell the nba to take his jersey,his shoes of the market from china and other parts of the world see what they tell an Hell no

waveycrockett
08-29-2012, 02:49 AM
:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:

Kobe in his prime scored 81 points in a single game, scored 62 in three quarters, had 4 consecutive games of 50 or more, and won two titles as the finals MVP. Kobe's prime was ridiculous as far as an individual talent. No way that Lebron can even touch that. Even Skip Bayless and Stephen A Smith agree on this one. When it comes to advanced stats however, Lebron is the man and Kobe cannot touch him. As far as winning, breaking countless scoring records, one on one play, fundamentals, being clutch and carrying a team on their back...Kobe far surpasses Lebron.

LeBron doesn't WANT to score like Kobe did. He's not about "getting his" and screw everyone else the way kobe is/was. He is an all-around monster, a triple-double threat every game, he looks to make EVERYONE better. This is why he was voted the best player in the NBA 3 times and Kobe only once because Kobe was OBVIOUSLY a selfish player who only cared about how many times he shot the ball. If LeBron wanted to drop buckets like that he could SA and Skip have the least credibility in the entire ESPN corporation their opinions mean very little if nothing at all.