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View Full Version : 2012 Mock Offseason Conference Semifinals: 1 San Antonio Spurs vs. 4 Houston Rockets



Catfish1314
08-13-2012, 04:48 PM
Every summer, PSD holds a game which mocks that year's NBA offseason. This year, users from the site were randomly assigned the reigns of NBA franchises and had to utilize their skills via draft, trades, and free agency to improve their teams. At the end of the game, GMs voted on how they believed the regular season of this game would shake up. These are the playoffs of PSD's 2012 NBA Mock Offseason.

Please take the time to consider each line up, the match-up itself, and vote on which team you believe would win in a seven game series.

The Spurs have homecourt advantage in this Western Conference Semifinal series.

Spurs Depth Chart:

PG: Tony Parker | Jordan Farmar,
SG: Ray Allen | Danny Green | Dominique Jones | Josh Selby
SF: Andre Iguodala | James Johnson
PF: Tim Duncan | Ed Davis | Ivan Johnson
C: Nene | Jermaine O'Neal

Rockets Depth Chart:

PG: Steve Nash 36/Shannon Brown 8/Gilbert Arenas 4
SG: Rip Hamilton 28/Shannon Brown 12/Mikael Pietrus 6
SF: Corey Brewer 22/Hedo Turkoglu 22/Mikael Pietrus 4
PF: Kevin Garnett 25/AmirJohnson 23
C: Dwight Howard 38/Kevin Garnett 10

Spurs write-up:


Offensive Philosophy:

I believe that we have one of the most balanced offenses in the game. Our starting five can score in a variety of ways. Our #1 option is Tony Parker. Parker this last year was arguably a top 4 point guard. Parker is a very efficent penatrator and passer. He'll be able to set up everyone else on the court and create his own shot. To finish off our back court, we add Ray Allen. In a limited three pointing starting lineup, Allen provides space to spread the floor. He will demand attention leaving openings for Nene and Duncan downlow, as well as Iguodala and Parker to penatrate. Andre Iguodala will be our 2nd option on offense. Iguodala might not be a terrific scorer, but he is an excellent penatrator and a solid passer at his position. Down low will be two experienced big men who can score from mid range as well as in the post. Duncan will always be able to bring the other teams starting center away from the basket. Off the bench we add good shooters in Farmar and Green, and a poor man's prime Shawn Marion in James Johnson. We will also add Ed Davis as a 6th/7th man who averages a double double PER 36.

Defensive Philosophy:

Just like our offense, our defense is balanced. Andre Iguodala might just be the best perimeter defender in the NBA. Whoever the other teams best scorer is in their back court, Iguodala will be able to shut them down and force turnovers. He will also be able to clog passing lanes and block shots. Although Duncan is getting older, he still is a force defensively. He is able to hold his ground downlow and deny the oppositions shots. He is also very strong in help defense. With Nene being able to do most of the things Duncan can, we will be able to limit the oppostions front courts. Parker is not the strongest defender at the point, but he is coming off his best defensive year in a few years. His defensive rating was on par with other good defender at the point guard position. Adding Davis, O'Neal, and James Johnson off the bench gives up depth defensively.

Matchup:

I believe we match up well with Houston because unlike us, they have two players that are not starting caliber. We believe Andre Iguodala and Ray Allen will be able to exploit Brewer and Hamilton who simply are not starting caliber players.

Voters will have to answer this question, who would you rather take, Parker or Nash? I think it is an easy answer that Parker at this point in their careers would have success on Nash, who simply is not a good defender. We would put the best perimeter defender in the NBA in Andre Iguodala on Nash to severely limit his game. Iguodala's opponents actually averaged a PER less than 10 this year. We believe that by him giving Nash fits, it will destroy the Rockets balance.

The Rockets depth is also not scaring anyone. Shannon Brown and Hedo were actually horrible this past year. Arenas isn't who he use to be and Amir Johnson isn't scaring anyone on offense. We believe that we have a team that can go 9/10 deep, but they can barely go 7 deep. In a long playoff series, that would be the difference maker.

The Rockets have a scary defensive duo down low, but we believe that we would be two much for them for the reasons we mentioned. We would be able to bring Dwight and KG away from the hoop with Duncan/Nene's mid range game and with Parker and Iguodala's driving, Howard and Garnett are going to have to play help defense all night long, which will create easy passes for two great passers.

Rockets write-up:


Cognates to Jets for making it to round 2. You put together a great team and this should be a fun matchup.

Matchups. Steve Nash Vs. Toney Parker
Toney had a great year last year; he was easily a top PG last year. Nash has shown father time doesn’t have anything to say on when it’s your time to stop playing at a high level, 38 and still a top 5 PG last year. Parker would get his there is no doubt about it but he would have to score mostly from the Perimeter due to KG and Dwight being able to help out. Nash on offense would get his, Parker is not a bad defender but Nash is too skilled on offense for him to stop Nash consistently. This really is a pretty easy matchup IMO, Parker and Nash would both get there points.
Advantage: Even

Richard Hamilton vs. Ray Allen
Wow how great of a matchup would this has been if these two were in their Prime? They are both up there in age At this point you have Allen who is basically a 3 point specialist at this point. Rip still has a very good Mid-range Jump shot. His ability to come off curls would give Ray trouble trying to run after Rip. Allen has the same effect, so this is another Similar matchup. Both are average defenders and both can shoot the ball. Rip will be able to stick to Allen and make sure he doesn’t shoot open 3 pointers. Since Ray can’t really create off the dribble anymore I don’t see Rip having trouble guarding Ray. Both similar Players which is why this is a very intriguing matchup
Advantage: Slight Edge to Spurs

Corey Brewer VS Andre Iguodala
This is a matchup where you could see the definite advantage point. Iggy is by far the superior player. Brewer is not a bad role player but this is where the Spurs have the advantage. The reason why this is not a back breaker is because Iggy hasn’t been a big time scorer in over two years. Iggy focus on shutting down the other team’s best wing player and on being a facilitator. Iggy hasn’t shown he can take over a series and score consistently. Put that together with the fact that Brewer is an above average on the ball defender this is not that bad of a place to give up the Matchup. I find it tough to believe that Iggy could put a team on his back and win the series. This team has a couple scorers but they cannot constantly score enough points especially against a great defensive team like my team. Can Iggy win the series? I do not believe he has what it takes to win this series. This is the only Major Advantage the Spurs have.
Advantage: Spurs

Kevin Garnett VS Tim Duncan
This is another very interesting matchup. Both of these players are very solid still even at this age. The advantage I would give Kevin over Tim is defense. Tim is not a bad defender by no means but Kevin is still playing defense like a top 5 defender in the league. You can make the case that KG could guard just about anybody and give them trouble. Offensively they both put up similar numbers last year. KG’s Mid-Range jumper is still as automatic as it gets for a player. Both of these bigs came up huge in the postseason just like they have always. KG put up slightly better numbers and was slightly the better player come postseason time. KG rebounded better in the playoffs then Tim come playoff time. This is a very close matchup. They are even on the Offensive side of the ball, they both are very good rebounders and Tim might have a slight edge in that department. KG’s defense is where I would give him the clear advantage; I believe he would hold Tim in check. Tim would make things tough for KG but would have to have one eye set on Dwight because Nene will not be able to hold Dwight in check, not even close. Tim would have to help Nene out and that would leave KG an opening for his great mid-range shot. This is really tough to give anybody an edge but I think KG on defense has enough of an edge for me to give KG the edge in this matchup.
Advantage: Rockets

Sorry wouldnt let me put the write up on one page here is the rest of it.

Dwight Howard VS Nene Hilario
This is where I believe my team has the huge advantage. There is no chance Nene would be able to contain Dwight, let alone stop him. Nene has never been known as a defender and his rebounding for a big man is pretty average. 7.5 Rebounds for a big man are not good enough especially when you have to try and rebound against an animal in Dwight. Since Nene can’t stop Dwight by himself, he is going to need some help and that will either leave Rip open for his mid-range shot or Nash open for his 3 point shot. Either way this is not a good sign for the spurs because either way somebody is going to go off. If they try to say “Let’s give Dwight his points and contain everybody else” then Dwight will simply carry the Rockets to the WCF, Nene has no chance at guarding Dwight one on one. So either way the Spurs are in for some trouble. Defensively Dwight changes games, he was not the best defensive player in the game Last year due to some injuries but there is no denying that Dwight can stop Nene and still effect parker and Iggy when they try to take it inside the Paint. Nene has been up and down and has yet to show that he can come up big in the playoffs.
Advantage: Rockets

Bench:
Neither of our benches is too impressive. I have Hedo playing a role he loves, the Point Forward with some explosive offense from Shannon Brown. Pietrus and Amir are solid defenders so I have a mixture of offense and defense off the bench. The Spurs top gun off the bench is Danny Green. He is a good spark off the bench but his other guys are nothing special. Overall It is pretty even
Advantage: Even

Why I believe I will win this series. IMO Iggy isn’t a guy to take over the series. That is the Spurs main advantage and I don’t believe Toney Parker could be the only big time scoring option. I believe I have the advantage on defense and have 4 real time Options on offense. Rip still is capable of putting up 12+ Points a game. This is going to be a very fun and great matchup and I think this would go very deep, definite 6 or 7 game series. My Advantage is having the two headed monster and having a very good bench big in Amir Johnson. KG is the backup center when Dwight takes his break so KG and Amir are very good running with the bench. Toney will give Nash trouble but KG and Dwight’s Presence will stop Parker from getting to the rack all game long. Dwight will score all game long on Nene. I think that my 3 scoring options are a lot better scorers then the spurs and my defense overall is better.

Depth Chart
PG: Steve Nash 36/Shannon Brown 8/Gilbert Arenas 4
SG: Rip Hamilton 28/Shannon Brown 12/Mikael Pietrus 6
SF: Corey Brewer 22/Hedo Turkoglu 22/Mikael Pietrus 4
PF: Kevin Garnett 25/AmirJohnson 23
C: Dwight Howard 38/Kevin Garnett 10
Good Luck to the Spurs

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 04:51 PM
IMO Dwight would really kill it in this serious and Nash setting both bigs up would be too much for the Spurs to handle. Iggy has the advantage but him and parker will have to hurt us from the outside the whole game..

Super.
08-13-2012, 04:53 PM
Dear xxplayer, it is spelled TONY Parker, not TONEY.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 04:54 PM
Well my bad :cry: Sorry for anything else spelled wrong, Spell check didn't do its job :pity:

Corey
08-13-2012, 05:07 PM
Holy grammatical errors in the Houston writeup.

The Rockets might have the best trio in the entire RD, but I think the Spurs have the most balanced lineup in the West. They have enough offensive firepower to get by the Rockets post defense. Good luck having Steve Nash attempt to contain Parker throughout the series.

phlp_bj
08-13-2012, 05:07 PM
The way I see it, TP would run all over Nash in this series. Nash has never been a defensive force and TP is one of the best offensive guards in the league. Duncan can hold down KG. Iggy would probably own Brewer so bad, it's not even funny. Nene-Dwight matchup would be interesting to see. Rip has died over the yrs. Not the same player he once was. Being a Bulls fan, I saw what he has left in the tank last season and it's not all that great. Ray can still knock down open three's and he should be wide open with good passing big men like Duncan/Nene as well. I'll vote later, but leaning towards Spurs for now

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 05:10 PM
The bigs can hold down the paint well enough to keep parker out. I see Parker having to take shots from the priemeter. Nash in his Phx days didn't have many problems in the playoffs.

Corey
08-13-2012, 05:20 PM
The bigs can hold down the paint well enough to keep parker out. I see Parker having to take shots from the priemeter. Nash in his Phx days didn't have many problems in the playoffs.

priemeter?


You say that Parker can be limited by KG and Dwight, but what happens when they get into early foul trouble because Parker keeps forcing the issue in the paint?

You have ONE reserve big man.

Parker makes a living in the shallow mid-range and in the paint. He would continually attack knowing that you have limited bigs.

Also, you say "Steve Nash in his phx days didn't have many problems in the playoffs''....He didn't even play in the playoffs the past two years. His defense is even worse now. Parker would absolutely abuse him over the course of a series.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 05:22 PM
priemeter?


You say that Parker can be limited by KG and Dwight, but what happens when they get into early foul trouble because Parker keeps forcing the issue in the paint?

You have ONE reserve big man.

Parker makes a living in the shallow mid-range and in the paint. He would continually attack knowing that you have limited bigs.

Also, you say "Steve Nash in his phx days didn't have many problems in the playoffs''....He didn't even play in the playoffs the past two years. His defense is even worse now. Parker would absolutely abuse him over the course of a series.


Corey you know my grammer.... lol Who is to say that Parker is going to get them in foul trouble? Who on the Spurs can contain Dwight? Im not saying Parker won't abuse Nash but its not like Parker is going to lock Nash down.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 05:26 PM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=parketo01&p2=nashst01
Here is more to look at. Parker would do well against Nash but Nash would also do well on offense vs Parker.

PhillyLuver
08-13-2012, 05:30 PM
I think this is a pretty close matchup. Iggy's best skill is wasted because the Rockets don't have any elite wings for him to stop. I'll vote in a little.

sjoerdje
08-13-2012, 05:33 PM
Defensively the rockets are marvelous, Corey, KG and Dwight alone would sport a top 3 defense! with some 'magic' from Nash they can take this series in 6/7. Nobody on that spurs squad is going to stop either Nash or Dwight, Iguodala is not suited to defend point guards like Nash or centers like Dwight.

Jets012
08-13-2012, 05:45 PM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=parketo01&p2=nashst01
Here is more to look at. Parker would do well against Nash but Nash would also do well on offense vs Parker.


I think this is a pretty close matchup. Iggy's best skill is wasted because the Rockets don't have any elite wings for him to stop. I'll vote in a little.

Iguodala will be guarding Nash. So, Iguodala should be able to contain him and almost even shut him down. At his age, Nash is a horrible defender. With Parker's speed and offensive skill set, he would do circles around Nash.

We have the advantage at 1-3 positions and coming off the bench. If Dwight or Garnett get in foul trouble due to Iggy's and Parker's driving ability, which one of the Rockets bench players are going to be able to come of the bench and guard Duncan and Nene?

You basically need to decide what is the bigger advantage. Iggy/Allen over Rip/Brewer or KG/Dwight over Duncan/Nene? Rip and Brewer are not even starting caliber players at their position, while Duncan and Nene are top 10-12 in their positions.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Iguodala will be guarding Nash. So, Iguodala should be able to contain him and almost even shut him down. At his age, Nash is a horrible defender. With Parker's speed and offensive skill set, he would do circles around Nash.

We have the advantage at 1-3 positions and coming off the bench. If Dwight or Garnett get in foul trouble due to Iggy's and Parker's driving ability, which one of the Rockets bench players are going to be able to come of the bench and guard Duncan and Nene?

You basically need to decide what is the bigger advantage. Iggy/Allen over Rip/Brewer or KG/Dwight over Duncan/Nene? Rip and Brewer are not even starting caliber players at their position, while Duncan and Nene are top 10-12 in their positions.

Your banking on Dwight or KG to get into foul trouble. I can say If nash gets Iggy in foul trouble. Your bench isnt the best, I have some solid defenders coming off the bench. Brown can spark and Hedo is still effictave at his Point foward and can knock down the 3.

Corey
08-13-2012, 05:49 PM
And you're acting like it's farfetched to expect KG or Dwight to get into foul trouble.

You have one reserve big.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 05:52 PM
Amir can play both. Its far fected to not think that both my big men are going to get into foul trouble? In the playoffs KG and Dwight both getting into foul trouble in the same game is tough.

Super.
08-13-2012, 06:13 PM
I honestly think Iggy would have some trouble with Nash.

an interesting matchup for sure.

Ebbs
08-13-2012, 06:20 PM
Tough match up

Mr. Baller
08-13-2012, 06:32 PM
I'm undecided on if I want to vote for this or not, since I could possibly face the winner. Still I am torn on who I want to vote for.

PocketKings
08-13-2012, 06:35 PM
This is a tough, tough decision.

Corey
08-13-2012, 06:40 PM
Amir can play both. Its far fected to not think that both my big men are going to get into foul trouble? In the playoffs KG and Dwight both getting into foul trouble in the same game is tough.

It doesn't matter if both get into foul trouble.

You have one reserve big man.

If either Dwight or KG picks up quick fouls, you have Amir Johnson and NOTHING ELSE.

Dwight picks up a few quick fouls? No rest the entire game for the 37 year old KG. That's going to go well.

The Spurs can shoot, attack the mid range, slash to the bucket, and they've got players that excel from constant movement. They can beat you from the perimeter with consistency, or they can go to the paint with Duncan and Nene.

Spurs are just a much more well rounded team.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 07:50 PM
Amir isnt a bad big man, Anyway this looks like it is going to be very close.

juggla53
08-13-2012, 07:59 PM
very very close, the starting lineups to me are about equal with the rockets having the better star power but with SA being more balanced, neither bench is great but good god the rockets have no depth if either KG or Dwight got into foul trouble it their big man situation would be a huge liability, i went SA in 7

Jets012
08-13-2012, 09:04 PM
Your banking on Dwight or KG to get into foul trouble. I can say If nash gets Iggy in foul trouble. Your bench isnt the best, I have some solid defenders coming off the bench. Brown can spark and Hedo is still effictave at his Point foward and can knock down the 3.

Shannon Brown is actually coming off of one of his worst defensive seasons in his career. He averaged his lowest WS/48 in the past 4 years and continues to show that he cannot be an efficient scorer by shooting horrible from the field. Turkoglu, is also coming off his worst year as a pro. He posted his lowest PER of his career. I have some bench guys coming off career years. Green started a majority of games throughout the regular season and playoffs for San Antonio as he posted career highs. Jordan Farmar had career highs in points, field goal percentage, and PER. James Johnson is a poor mans prime Shawn Marion. And if you ask many Raptors fans, they would say Ed Davis out played Amir Johnson this year.


Amir can play both. Its far fected to not think that both my big men are going to get into foul trouble? In the playoffs KG and Dwight both getting into foul trouble in the same game is tough.

With Iguodala and Parker's slashing ability, I would be concerned to think KG and Dwight could get in foul trouble. Dwight Howard was top 11 this year in fouls per game and I have guys who are top 3 in their respective positions in drawing fouls. Nash will not be able to keep up with Parker and Brewer will not be able to keep up with Iggy.


I honestly think Iggy would have some trouble with Nash.

an interesting matchup for sure.

Why so? Maybe, but I doubt it. Iggy has 3-4 inches on Nash and is far more athletic. Iggy held opposing Small Forwards to a PER of 5.9 this year. Nash is getting older and is not as athletic as he use to be. He posted a career high in turnovers PER 36 minutes this year.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 09:12 PM
Brown is a spark off the bench. Brewer isnt bad and is a solid defender. He isnt trash. Also Amir is better then your bench big davis. He started over him and Davis while he is very talented didn't get consistant playing time. Both our bench's are nothing speical. Iggy has never shown he can take over a series scoring wise. IMO your team will struggle to score. Also Rip is up there in age but so is allen. Rip still off those curls are money and is an average defender. Allen is a knock down shooter at this point. I think my rebounding and defense is enough. Iggy won't be able to shut down Nash the whole game, Nash is too quick for Iggy to handle.

aussie
08-13-2012, 10:14 PM
wow very close, Go Rockets :D

Eagles4Lyfe
08-13-2012, 10:22 PM
Never thought Player would have it in him to do a solid write up but good job man, I was already leaning towards you guys and although Jets made a nice write up I'm just not swayed enough.

I just think people are really underrating the Dwight+KG effect.

Also that injuries or foul trouble bogus excuse people are using to vote against the Rockets is pretty lame tbh. He still has Steve Nash who's had junk his whole career and still overachieved now having 2 top 30 players to go along with that is just a dangerous weapon.. Not to mention KG last year in the playoffs was just another animal and was beasting while being the only consistant post option in that Heat series. He's at the point in his career where he knows how to avoid significant foul troubles.

That injuries/foul trouble excuse can be used for every team basically and ya depth is a big factor but not significant enough to vote against em. Rip still can ball and although hurt a lot last year when the bulls had that big win against the Heat last year he was very solid and where they are in their respective careers Ray over Rip isn't that big an advantage.

The significant advantage the Spurs have over the Rockets is Iggy on Brewer but its not like Iggy is an offensive force that can take the game over to cause havoc and I don't think its as significant as the Howard-Nene mismatch..

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 10:24 PM
Never thought Player would have it in him to do a solid write up but good job man, I was already leaning towards you guys and although Jets made a nice write up I'm just not swayed enough.

I just think people are really underrating the Dwight+KG effect.

Also that injuries or foul trouble bogus excuse people are using to vote against the Rockets is pretty lame tbh. He still has Steve Nash who's had junk his whole career and still overachieved now having 2 top 30 players to go along with that is just a dangerous weapon.. Not to mention KG last year in the playoffs was just another animal and was beasting while being the only consistant post option in that Heat series. He's at the point in his career where he knows how to avoid significant foul troubles.

That injuries/foul trouble excuse can be used for every team basically and ya depth is a big factor but not significant enough to vote against em. Rip still can ball and although hurt a lot last year when the bulls had that big win against the Heat last year he was very solid and where they are in their respective careers Ray over Rip isn't that big an advantage.

The significant advantage the Spurs have over the Rockets is Iggy on Brewer but its not like Iggy is an offensive force that can take the game over to cause havoc and I don't think its as significant as the Howard-Nene mismatch..

:love:

phlp_bj
08-13-2012, 10:37 PM
as of right now, it's tied 13-13 with the 100 post rule in effect

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 10:47 PM
http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/orlando-magic/players/dwight-howard/comparison/12/22/321/481 Here is some more into the Matchup with Dwight Vs Nene matchup. Phlp, spurs are up one I believe because I had two co's unless Go pacers votes I believe Its 13-12 him.

AWC713
08-13-2012, 10:55 PM
Garnett/ Howard is one dirty post defense. I think that wins it for 'em.

aussie
08-13-2012, 10:55 PM
:love:

backoff his mine ;)

knicks=love
08-13-2012, 10:56 PM
houston's errors in their writeup made my decision. that's how close it was.

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 11:05 PM
houston's errors in their writeup made my decision. that's how close it was.

My grammer errors? Do I sue Word spell check those *******s cost me a vote :cry:

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 11:08 PM
That Link I posted is great. Dwight's efficentcy Recap is 26.4 While Nene is 16.7
Click the link for a full recap of the Matchup. Dwight is at 20 and 14.5 while Nene was 13.7 and 7.5. Dwight has limited Nene in almost every matchup and Dwight has pretty much owned him in rebounding and scoring inside. That is the biggest Disadvantage IMO for this matchup/

xxplayerxx23
08-13-2012, 11:15 PM
Also, Iggy's playoff numbers last year were pretty average. 1st round12ppg 5.8 rebounds, 35 percent shooting. 2nd round 13.7 5.6 4 assists on 40 percent shooting. He doesn't perform come playoff time, his defense is prob top 2 for wing defense but he won't stop Nash. Nash while up their in age is still performing at a high effiecent level and hasn't had the talent I put around him in years. Iggy would have to guard Brewer. he wants parker to Guard Brewer but he has to realize Hedo and Brewer Split time. Hedo has a siz and would give allen or Parker trouble. I feel like he wouldn't have enough scoring to win a 7 game series.

juggla53
08-13-2012, 11:54 PM
Also, Iggy's playoff numbers last year were pretty average. 1st round12ppg 5.8 rebounds, 35 percent shooting. 2nd round 13.7 5.6 4 assists on 40 percent shooting. He doesn't perform come playoff time, his defense is prob top 2 for wing defense but he won't stop Nash. Nash while up their in age is still performing at a high effiecent level and hasn't had the talent I put around him in years. Iggy would have to guard Brewer. he wants parker to Guard Brewer but he has to realize Hedo and Brewer Split time. Hedo has a siz and would give allen or Parker trouble. I feel like he wouldn't have enough scoring to win a 7 game series.

helo would not give anyone trouble, he is absolutely atrocious, idc how much size he has this dude is absolutely awful, you or I could cover him and still have an eye out for other players on the floor

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 12:03 AM
Well im 5 10, he would baby me :D. I don't care how bad he got, he still has the advantage if you put Parker or Allen on him.

juggla53
08-14-2012, 12:52 AM
Well im 5 10, he would baby me :D. I don't care how bad he got, he still has the advantage if you put Parker or Allen on him.

and in turn he has to gaurd parker/allen/or iggy, which is much more a disadvantage then the other way around, hedo is awful and i mean really awful

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:22 AM
and in turn he has to gaurd parker/allen/or iggy, which is much more a disadvantage then the other way around, hedo is awful and i mean really awful

Hedo isn't afwful. Still a playmaker on offense, average on defense. Its whatever Dwight and KG down low need to do their job and the D will be fine.

Ebbs
08-14-2012, 04:43 AM
I think SPurs or Blazers have the best shots at Pacers in the finals but damn this will come down to the wire.

TrueFan420
08-14-2012, 05:29 AM
Home court decided it for me

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 10:52 AM
Wow this is so close.

PhillyLuver
08-14-2012, 11:56 AM
So is it tied with the 100 post rule?

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 11:57 AM
So is it tied with the 100 post rule?

I believe im down 2 because of that rule.

Super.
08-14-2012, 12:15 PM
Still have no idea who I want to vote for

unleashthebeast
08-14-2012, 12:28 PM
I have read both writeups, and have decided that the Rockets will win this series.

Their post game is ridiculous, and with Parker and Nash both doing work from the PG position, the true difference maker in this series is either Dwight or Iguodola with Duncan and KG somewhat cancelling each other out. I have seen Dwight take over playoff series before, and have yet to see that from Iggy. So my vote goes to the Rockets in a 7 game series.

xnick5757
08-14-2012, 12:42 PM
I have read both writeups, and have decided that the Rockets will win this series.

Their post game is ridiculous, and with Parker and Nash both doing work from the PG position, the true difference maker in this series is either Dwight or Iguodola with Duncan and KG somewhat cancelling each other out. I have seen Dwight take over playoff series before, and have yet to see that from Iggy. So my vote goes to the Rockets in a 7 game series.

Pretty much this. And I think iggy would have trouble guarding Nash.

I'm curious though, why duncan at pf instead of center? I think duncan could guard Howard better than nene could

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 12:46 PM
Spurs for me. They have bodies to throw at Dwight, that alone helps huge. Add in the fact that Dwight is prone to foul. The fact that Tony Parker can get in the paint at will against Nash isn't good for Howard. I would be willing to bet Howard would be in foul trouble in at least 3 games through out the series, and when Dwight is in foul trouble, he is a non factor. With out Dwight, the Rockets are an average at best team with 0 depth in the front court. Spurs would win in 6 IMO

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 12:47 PM
Pretty much this. And I think iggy would have trouble guarding Nash.

I'm curious though, why duncan at pf instead of center? I think duncan could guard Howard better than nene could

While Iggy would have trouble, he would still be one of the best defensive players Nash would ever have to face causing Nash to have a lot of trouble as well. It would slow Nash down to say the least. You have no one to slow down Parker

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 12:50 PM
IMO Dwight's matchup vs Nene is a bigger advantage then Parker on Nash. go look at the matchup Nash vs Parker. Parker does well but he doesn't take over like Dwight has. Ill post the link again on Nash vs Parker.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 12:52 PM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=parketo01&p2=nashst01 Here you go. Also I posted Dwight vs Nene on page 2.
Here is Dwight http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/orlando-magic/players/dwight-howard/comparison/12/22/321/481

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 01:08 PM
IMO Dwight's matchup vs Nene is a bigger advantage then Parker on Nash. go look at the matchup Nash vs Parker. Parker does well but he doesn't take over like Dwight has. Ill post the link again on Nash vs Parker.

Steve Nash has trouble guard Derek Fisher...If Nene is having problems guarding Dwight, Duncan can be switched onto him, being able to do a better job.

Dwight and KG would be dirty on defense, no doubt. But if one of the two get in foul trouble, its game over for the Rockets. Tony Parker can and will get into the lane at will, causing Dwight to have to come over and help (or Garnett) leaving Duncan or Nene wide open, and both can hit that open jumper all day. Steve Nash's lack of being able to do anything on defense will kill Dwight and KG.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:10 PM
1 game Iggy was guarded by Brewer he scored 18 points on 33 percent shooting last year. Brewer scored 14 and held Iggy to 33 percent shooting. Brewer has always been known as quick and a above average defender.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:11 PM
Steve Nash has trouble guard Derek Fisher...If Nene is having problems guarding Dwight, Duncan can be switched onto him, being able to do a better job.

Dwight and KG would be dirty on defense, no doubt. But if one of the two get in foul trouble, its game over for the Rockets. Tony Parker can and will get into the lane at will, causing Dwight to have to come over and help (or Garnett) leaving Duncan or Nene wide open, and both can hit that open jumper all day. Steve Nash's lack of being able to do anything on defense will kill Dwight and KG.

Then why hasn't Parker dominated the matchup vs Nash then? He doesn't really go off vs Nash when matchuped up, go look more indepth at the link I posted. Here is another. http://www.nba.com/advancedstats/player-vs-player.html#Tony-Parker-vs-Steve-Nash|2225,959;year=201112;season=r

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 01:15 PM
Then why hasn't Parker dominated the matchup vs Nash then? He doesn't really go off vs Nash when matchuped up, go look more indepth at the link I posted.

Parker in the playoffs is a different animal than the regular season. Considering Nash hasn't been in the playoffs for a couple years to go against Parker, you can't really use that. Parker played damn well in the playoffs and would tear Nash up

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:18 PM
Parker in the playoffs is a different animal than the regular season. Considering Nash hasn't been in the playoffs for a couple years to go against Parker, you can't really use that. Parker played damn well in the playoffs and would tear Nash up

Nash has had a terrible supporting cast for a couple years. Nash also does well in the playoffs. He made that terrible suns team last year a playoff team. Imagine Nash with Kg and Dwight what he would do. Parker would get his but do you really think he could take over a series? Dwight has taken over series with crap around him.

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 01:27 PM
Nash has had a terrible supporting cast for a couple years. Nash also does well in the playoffs. He made that terrible suns team last year a playoff team. Imagine Nash with Kg and Dwight what he would do. Parker would get his but do you really think he could take over a series? Dwight has taken over series with crap around him.

What happens WHEN Dwight or KG get in foul trouble? You have 1 guy backing up the both of them. One...

You have 3 guys covering 96 minutes, and one of those 3 guys is 37, another is foul prone and another isn't very good.

Also, Nash is 38 years old, 39 by the time the series would begin and going against the best 1 on 1 defender in the NBA in Iggy. Nash is NOT going to take over the game. Will he do ok? Yea, but he's not going to be the Steve Nash of 3-5 years ago

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:29 PM
What happens WHEN Dwight or KG get in foul trouble? You have 1 guy backing up the both of them. One...

You have 3 guys covering 96 minutes, and one of those 3 guys is 37, another is foul prone and another isn't very good.

Also, Nash is 38 years old, 39 by the time the series would begin and going against the best 1 on 1 defender in the NBA in Iggy. Nash is NOT going to take over the game. Will he do ok? Yea, but he's not going to be the Steve Nash of 3-5 years ago

The age is bs IMO. Nash isnt the same I agree with you 100 percent but he is still playing at a high level. Its amazing but he isn't slow, he has a nice shooting touch and would give Iggy all kinds of problems. Amir isn't a bad backup. KG has shown he is a beast last year in the playoffs. Dwight has always shown he can change the game defensivley.

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 01:48 PM
The age is bs IMO. Nash isnt the same I agree with you 100 percent but he is still playing at a high level. Its amazing but he isn't slow, he has a nice shooting touch and would give Iggy all kinds of problems. Amir isn't a bad backup. KG has shown he is a beast last year in the playoffs. Dwight has always shown he can change the game defensivley.

:laugh2:

In that case, I'm done talking with you about this

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:50 PM
:laugh2:

In that case, I'm done talking with you about this

I was reffering to you calling out Nash's age. Nash is still playing at a high level, would you make a case where he isnt a top 5-8 PG?

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 01:54 PM
I was reffering to you calling out Nash's age. Nash is still playing at a high level, would you make a case where he isnt a top 5-8 PG?

Idk, he's in the top 10 for sure. But Parker is just that much better. 39 year old PG with back problems doesn't spell game changing. And with Iggy manning up on him...that does not help you guys at all.

And I think calling out a 39 year old on age isn't exactly a dumb thing to do

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 01:57 PM
Idk, he's in the top 10 for sure. But Parker is just that much better. 39 year old PG with back problems doesn't spell game changing. And with Iggy manning up on him...that does not help you guys at all.

And I think calling out a 39 year old on age isn't exactly a dumb thing to do

Id like to see a list of Pg's better. Parker is the better Pg but I think your downplaying how good Nash is. Iggy has not shown he could guard a PG like Nash. Im not saying its dumb Im just saying this isn't and oridanary 39 year old guy, he is still playing at a very high level and has talent here to make his job as a PG easier.

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 02:06 PM
Id like to see a list of Pg's better. Parker is the better Pg but I think your downplaying how good Nash is. Iggy has not shown he could guard a PG like Nash. Im not saying its dumb Im just saying this isn't and oridanary 39 year old guy, he is still playing at a very high level and has talent here to make his job as a PG easier.

Iggy has shown he can guard the teams best player and shut him down. Those players are better than Nash. He can guard Nash and throw him off his game, no doubt. If you can guard Lebron some what effectively, you can guard Nash some what effectively.

My list would be

1. Paul
2. Rose
3. Rondo (just because I love Rondo)
4. Parker
5. Williams
6. Westbrook
7. Irving
8. Nash (offensive purposes)
8. Lowry (defensive purposes)
10. Lawson

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 02:09 PM
Iggy has shown he can guard the teams best player and shut him down. Those players are better than Nash. He can guard Nash and throw him off his game, no doubt. If you can guard Lebron some what effectively, you can guard Nash some what effectively.

My list would be

1. Paul
2. Rose
3. Rondo (just because I love Rondo)
4. Parker
5. Williams
6. Westbrook
7. Irving
8. Nash (offensive purposes)
8. Lowry (defensive purposes)
10. Lawson

Well Iggy is Lebron's Postition. Im not saying Nash would thrash him but he would have some success. His passing abilty and shooting abilty would give Iggy problems. Nash is still quick. My list is
1.Paul
2.Williams
3.Rose
4.Westy
5.Parker
6.Nash
7.Rondo
8.Irving
9-10 is tough but I can agree with that, I think there are better pgs then Lawson but Im not really in the mood to look :)

Jets012
08-14-2012, 02:27 PM
25-26 Rockets right now, but if you take into account that one of their GMs votes don't count and all the people who voted under 100 posts don't count then it is 23-21 Spurs.

My final thing I would have to say is, why are people questioning whether or not Iggy can guard Nash? Iggy's height advantage would definitely be a factor and if people think Nash's speed at 38 is going to be tough for Iggy to guard, then they are kidding themselves. Iggy would be able to severely limit Nash, and their offense is not balanced enough for them to have success if Nash is having trouble.

Also, they don't even have a back up big. Dwight year in and year is one of the leaders in fouls. With Iggy and Parker's slashing ability, I have no doubt he would get in foul trouble at least 3 times this series. And Brown/Hedo both don't provide any help off the bench, while we have Green, Farmar, Johnson, and Davis all coming off career years.

Jets012
08-14-2012, 02:27 PM
25-26 Rockets right now, but if you take into account that one of their GMs votes don't count and all the people who voted under 100 posts don't count then it is 23-21 Spurs.

My final thing I would have to say is, why are people questioning whether or not Iggy can guard Nash? Iggy's height advantage would definitely be a factor and if people think Nash's speed at 38 is going to be tough for Iggy to guard, then they are kidding themselves. Iggy would be able to severely limit Nash, and their offense is not balanced enough for them to have success if Nash is having trouble.

Also, they don't even have a back up big. Dwight year in and year is one of the leaders in fouls. With Iggy and Parker's slashing ability, I have no doubt he would get in foul trouble at least 3 times this series. And Brown/Hedo both don't provide any help off the bench, while we have Green, Farmar, Johnson, and Davis all coming off career years.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 02:28 PM
Dwight doesn't lead the league in fouls come playoff time, and I count 22-21 jets.

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 02:39 PM
Dwight gets fouls no matter whether its regular season or playoffs.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 02:41 PM
You guys talk about it where is the proof? I have proof that Dwight can carry a team come playoff time.

rapjuicer06
08-14-2012, 02:50 PM
So can Parker/Duncan. And its been done multiple times

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 02:51 PM
So can Parker/Duncan. And its been done multiple times

Its been a while but you are correct. I believe Nash-KG-Dwight can all do their part to win the series.

MP.Trey
08-14-2012, 02:53 PM
25-26 Rockets right now, but if you take into account that one of their GMs votes don't count and all the people who voted under 100 posts don't count then it is 23-21 Spurs.


Really? I've been voting for nothing this while time? :laugh2:

Catfish1314
08-14-2012, 03:55 PM
:laugh2:

In that case, I'm done talking with you about this

An age argument in the case of Steve Nash is pretty much BS. His consistency, absurd efficiency, durability, and his ability to elevate the play of his teammates (on par with anyone in the league including LeBron and Paul) has defied any decline due to age for the last several years. He had the Suns (with Gortat and a jumbled mess of mediocre old and young talent) in the playoff picture right up until the end of the season the last two years.

And you say Parker is a different animal in the playoffs. Like most players who ever transition from regular season to postseason play, Parker is actually worse statistically in the playoffs. Without looking it up, Nash probably is too so that point is moot any way you look at it.


Iggy has shown he can guard the teams best player and shut him down. Those players are better than Nash. He can guard Nash and throw him off his game, no doubt. If you can guard Lebron some what effectively, you can guard Nash some what effectively.

My list would be

1. Paul
2. Rose
3. Rondo (just because I love Rondo)
4. Parker
5. Williams
6. Westbrook
7. Irving
8. Nash (offensive purposes)
8. Lowry (defensive purposes)
10. Lawson

Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but I would be very interested in your rationale placing Rondo above Parker and Westbrook and especially Irving above Nash.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 04:11 PM
So many under 100 posters voting Ive lost count, Im down 2 I believe. and I agree with CF.

Mr. Baller
08-14-2012, 04:25 PM
Iggy has shown he can guard the teams best player and shut him down. Those players are better than Nash. He can guard Nash and throw him off his game, no doubt. If you can guard Lebron some what effectively, you can guard Nash some what effectively.

My list would be

1. Paul
2. Rose
3. Rondo (just because I love Rondo)
4. Parker
5. Williams
6. Westbrook
7. Irving
8. Nash (offensive purposes)
8. Lowry (defensive purposes)
10. Lawson

No way Westy is 6th best PG in the NBA :laugh2: He is better then rondo, parker, and probably deron at this point.

PocketKings
08-14-2012, 04:30 PM
This is seriously one intense series.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 04:38 PM
Parker has shown time and time again that he can score in the paint regardless of who is gaurding it. His one handed floater is by far the best I've seen. Houston can clog the lane all they want but with the shooters that are surrounding him, it will be open buckets all day. Howard in my opinion is the type of player that hurts his team. He is too busy making sure he gets his numbers and if he gets double teamed by Duncan and Nene he has no offensive awarness to get the ball to an open player. KG is the back up Center so when does he get his rest??? Houston has three top players but the Spurs have the advantage by having at least 8 good players that can score from just about anywhere. Dont forget home court advantage. The Spurs are nearly impossible to beat at home. I give the edge to the Spurs in 6.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 04:39 PM
Howard hurts the team............

Mr. Baller
08-14-2012, 04:43 PM
Damn still another 24 hours to go :jumpy:

PocketKings
08-14-2012, 04:45 PM
This is my problem with the Rockets for this series. I feel like their line-up lacks the balance scoring that might be needed to beat the Spurs. Outside of Nash, they have no other threat to score consistently in this series to balance out the team.

Nash/KG/Dwight will have to score 65+ points per game in this series for them to win I think. I'm not sure if they are built to do this.

The Spurs have a good balance of players capable of contributing to the scoring with their entire unit. Although, TD/Nene would be limited with the defense of KG/Dwight.

One thing that is interesting though is that both TD/Nene can stretch the inside of that defense a bit with their mid-range jumper.

Although both KG/Dwight are phenomenal rangy defenders.

This series is so difficult. UGH.

I don't know. I think I'm going to remain undecided but this would be an interesting series.

The lack of perimeter play from the Rockets really hurts them.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 04:49 PM
Rip still can put in some points. If we are assuming health(Like we are supposed to) he can still score off those screens. Hedo and Brown can combine for 12-14 PPG in the series. Think about the series Dwight has taken over with his scoring and rebouning. KG last year took over, him and Rondo kept them in vs Miami. Nash career playoff scoring is 17.5. I think I have enough scoring. Rip is huge and I believe Nash being there helps him big time. Defensevly I can hold the spurs down enough. I don't see the spurs putting up big scoring totals in this series.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 04:49 PM
Howard hurts the team............

Yes he does. He puts up great numbers but what players around him has he made better:confused:??? basketball IS a team sport....

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 04:52 PM
Yes he does. He puts up great numbers but what players around him has he made better:confused:??? basketball IS a team sport....

Um. Anybody he has every played with lol. Look at Ryan anderson's numbers with him. He commands double teams which will lead to open shots for the teams. KG open at any point from mid range is deadly and Nash from 3 and Midrange is the same. Rip is still a pure mid range shooter. Him off the screens from nash and open shots from Dwights double will help him. Look at what he did in limited time with the bulls and how much smoother the offense looked with him in there.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 04:56 PM
Rip is nowhere the same but he put in 13 while being one of the bulls top scoring options with rose out. Here he would be the 4th option and everybody would be focusing on the big 3. He could def repeat 13-15 for the series.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 05:02 PM
Um. Anybody he has every played with lol. Look at Ryan anderson's numbers with him. He commands double teams which will lead to open shots for the teams. KG open at any point from mid range is deadly and Nash from 3 and Midrange is the same. Rip is still a pure mid range shooter. Him off the screens from nash and open shots from Dwights double will help him. Look at what he did in limited time with the bulls and how much smoother the offense looked with him in there.

i like the Ryan Anderson comment but i still dont buy it. i like Dwight but in this series with only one person that can create there own shot (Nash) they will fall to the Spurs. Parker can get his own, Iggy can get his own, Green can get his own I would go on but you get the point. Spurs have to much fire power.

unleashthebeast
08-14-2012, 05:05 PM
^Nash is the only one that can create his own shot? Toss the ball down to KG or Dwight in the post and watch what happens. They both are very good back to the basket players, with Dwight being one of the best in the league.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 05:06 PM
i like the Ryan Anderson comment but i still dont buy it. i like Dwight but in this series with only one person that can create there own shot (Nash) they will fall to the Spurs. Parker can get his own, Iggy can get his own, Green can get his own I would go on but you get the point. Spurs have to much fire power.

I respectfully disagree. Nene can't guard Dwight. KG goes to the bench Amir comes in at PF then when Nene needs a rest O'neal goes in and KG goes in thats the way the roatations pan out and KG would go to work on O'neal. I just think I have 3 big time guys with a couple guys that can score. My defense would make it tough for the spurs.

unleashthebeast
08-14-2012, 05:08 PM
Yes he does. He puts up great numbers but what players around him has he made better:confused:??? basketball IS a team sport....

I'm sorry but this just isn't true.

The Magic built the team around Dwight. They didn't have a second star but were consistently a top team in the East. Why? Because of Dwight. Dwight being fed the ball in the paint opens up the three point shot for his teammates. Why do you think that they have had some of the best 3 point shooters in the league on that team? Players like Rashard, Ryan Anderson, Reddick, etc.. They built the team to where Dwight in the post would open up shots for below average players.

In fact, I would say that Dwight is the best big man at allowing his teammates to succeed, because he opens up the floor for them so much whenever he is double teamed in the post.

Jets012
08-14-2012, 05:10 PM
The Rockets have zero depth. Hedo/Shannon Brown both are not good offensively or defensively anymore. Amir Johnson is the only decent bench player he has, and that is his only back up big. Amir is 6'8'', he can't play center.

I have Danny Green and Ed Davis as my 6th/7th men. Danny Green had a career year starting a majority of games for the Spurs and played a crucial role deep into the playoffs. Ed Davis is a better player than Amir Johnson at this point of their career, and Tony Parker would eat alive Nash on defense. Would Nash have as much success on Iguodala? I doubt it because Iguodala has shown in the past that he could defend Nash. We don't need Iggy to average 20 points a game to win.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 05:14 PM
Ed davis didn't start. He was behind Amir, and Amir has played Center. If you see I have Kg as the backup center but AMir can play it. You need somebody to score 20 PPG. Parker has never eat nash alive look at the stats in head to head matchups. Hedo isn't great but when in his point foward role he is average and can still knock down the 3. Brown isnt explosive? Pietrus can't step in and hit the 3 and play good defense?

kraze8
08-14-2012, 05:19 PM
I'm sorry but this just isn't true.

The Magic built the team around Dwight. They didn't have a second star but were consistently a top team in the East. Why? Because of Dwight. Dwight being fed the ball in the paint opens up the three point shot for his teammates. Why do you think that they have had some of the best 3 point shooters in the league on that team? Players like Rashard, Ryan Anderson, Reddick, etc.. They built the team to where Dwight in the post would open up shots for below average players.

In fact, I would say that Dwight is the best big man at allowing his teammates to succeed, because he opens up the floor for them so much whenever he is double teamed in the post.

In no way am i trying to slam Dwight. To clear things up a little i will put it like this. Tim Duncan makes his teammates better. Who was Tony Parker his first couple of years?? He was not a top anything, Tim made him better. ginobili, who was that guy? drafted in the second round but Tim made him better. Look at Danny Green same thing. Even Jackson, when he left the Spurs he declined. what im saying is that teamates become what the leader of the team allows them to be. Dwight was the leader in orlando, what teammate did he make an allstar?

unleashthebeast
08-14-2012, 05:25 PM
In no way am i trying to slam Dwight. To clear things up a little i will put it like this. Tim Duncan makes his teammates better. Who was Tony Parker his first couple of years?? He was not a top anything, Tim made him better. ginobili, who was that guy? drafted in the second round but Tim made him better. Look at Danny Green same thing. Even Jackson, when he left the Spurs he declined. what im saying is that teamates become what the leader of the team allows them to be. Dwight was the leader in orlando, what teammate did he make an allstar?

So you expect Dwight to make his teammates into allstars?

Duncan didn't turn Parker into an allstar. Duncan as well as TP's talent as well as Pop's coaching and many other factors made Parker into an allstar.

When Dwight isn't given talented players around him, none of them are going to become allstars, it is impossible. But, he did help some of his teammates get big contracts when they became FA's because of their play in Orlando. See Hedo Turkoglu and Ryan Anderson and Rashard Lewis.

It isn't Dwight's fault that none of his teammates ever became allstars, that is crazy. I mean LeBron is the best in the league at making his teammates better in my opinion, but did you see any of his teammates in Cleveland become allstars? No. Not because of LeBron, but because of the talent level of the other players.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 05:37 PM
So you expect Dwight to make his teammates into allstars?

Duncan didn't turn Parker into an allstar. Duncan as well as TP's talent as well as Pop's coaching and many other factors made Parker into an allstar.

When Dwight isn't given talented players around him, none of them are going to become allstars, it is impossible. But, he did help some of his teammates get big contracts when they became FA's because of their play in Orlando. See Hedo Turkoglu and Ryan Anderson and Rashard Lewis.

It isn't Dwight's fault that none of his teammates ever became allstars, that is crazy. I mean LeBron is the best in the league at making his teammates better in my opinion, but did you see any of his teammates in Cleveland become allstars? No. Not because of LeBron, but because of the talent level of the other players.

I dont expect for Dwight to do anything... Turk and Lewis contracts where actually the worst I've ever seen and no one wants them or there contracts but thats another story. Lebron did make ydrūnas Ilgauskas a lot better even Gibson. Like i said i will give you Anderson but the bottom line is Dwight cant guard everyone and i think the Spurs will outlast the Rockets in this series.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 05:38 PM
I dont expect for Dwight to do anything... Turk and Lewis contracts where actually the worst I've ever seen and no one wants them or there contracts but thats another story. Lebron did make ydrūnas Ilgauskas a lot better even Gibson. Like i said i will give you Anderson but the bottom line is Dwight cant guard everyone and i think the Spurs will outlast the Rockets in this series.

Wow. You act like Dwight is the only game changing defender I have. I have Rip who is average, Brewer who is above average and then KG who is IMO a top Notched defender.

Mr. Baller
08-14-2012, 05:39 PM
Damn Rockets just got like 6 votes.

unleashthebeast
08-14-2012, 05:39 PM
I dont expect for Dwight to do anything... Turk and Lewis contracts where actually the worst I've ever seen and no one wants them or there contracts but thats another story. Lebron did make ydrūnas Ilgauskas a lot better even Gibson. Like i said i will give you Anderson but the bottom line is Dwight cant guard everyone and i think the Spurs will outlast the Rockets in this series.

I realize that but after their play with dwight, someone obviously thought that they deserved their contracts or they would have never received them.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 05:45 PM
Wow. You act like Dwight is the only game changing defender I have. I have Rip who is average, Brewer who is above average and then KG who is IMO a top Notched defender.

By no means am i calling this a blow out. This is a very tough series for both teams. I just give the edge to Parker, Iggy and Green. Dwight and KG will do there thing like they always do but so will Duncan and Nene. Shannon Brown is a poor mans Ray Allen and Arenas doesnt have anything left. who is gonna run the offense when Nash is on the bench?

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 05:49 PM
By no means am i calling this a blow out. This is a very tough series for both teams. I just give the edge to Parker, Iggy and Green. Dwight and KG will do there thing like they always do but so will Duncan and Nene. Shannon Brown is a poor mans Ray Allen and Arenas doesnt have anything left. who is gonna run the offense when Nash is on the bench?

Green? You act like green is a stud. I agree this is very close. Duncan and KG take each other out, KG was the better rebounder in the playoffs. No comment on the Brown comment :pity: and Hedo plays point foward, while Brown/arenas guard the backup PG.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 05:53 PM
Key stats for Turk. 10.9 PPG, 4.4 Assists Per game and 35 percent from down town, not great but off the bench /5 or 6th option not bad. Also shot over 40 percent from 3 in the playoffs last year.

PocketKings
08-14-2012, 05:58 PM
What's the actual vote count?

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 06:01 PM
I believe Im up 2 votes if I counted correctly.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 06:01 PM
Green? You act like green is a stud. I agree this is very close. Duncan and KG take each other out, KG was the better rebounder in the playoffs. No comment on the Brown comment :pity: and Hedo plays point foward, while Brown/arenas guard the backup PG.

Green is not a stud but in my opinion green is better than your starter and your back up at the 2 position. yes hamilton was a good player but time has passed him by, Brown has hit his ceiling and has started to decline. Green is in his prime and is only getting better. I just dont see Arenas running the offense when nash is on the bench. i think if you had a better back up at the point you MIGHT change my mind but Dwight, KG and Nash cant play the entire game. your bench is lacking.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 06:04 PM
Green is not a stud but in my opinion green is better than your starter and your back up at the 2 position. yes hamilton was a good player but time has passed him by, Brown has hit his ceiling and has started to decline. Green is in his prime and is only getting better. I just dont see Arenas running the offense when nash is on the bench. i think if you had a better back up at the point you MIGHT change my mind but Dwight, KG and Nash cant play the entire game. your bench is lacking.

Um I just told you Hedo is running the offense with Nash on the bench. Hedo will run pt foward. Green is solid but lets not over react like he is a beast. Rip isnt great anymore but he can still come off screens and shoot the mid range better then most.

kraze8
08-14-2012, 06:10 PM
Um I just told you Hedo is running the offense with Nash on the bench. Hedo will run pt foward. Green is solid but lets not over react like he is a beast. Rip isnt great anymore but he can still come off screens and shoot the mid range better then most.

I will agree but i do think that putting KG as your back up Center is a bit of a stretch. That would be like having Nene and Duncan switch positions and calling them the back up to each other. So KG as a starter/back up isnt realistic. Hedo can still play i give you that.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 06:12 PM
I will agree but i do think that putting KG as your back up Center is a bit of a stretch. That would be like having Nene and Duncan switch positions and calling them the back up to each other. So KG as a starter/back up isnt realistic. Hedo can still play i give you that.

How come? For example 5 mins left in the first sub Amir comes in. End of the 1st KG comes in for Dwight. Dwight comes in at 8 mins for Amir. Amir comes in for KG at 2 or 3 mins. Its not like KG is too old to play 8 or 9 mins in a row lol.

Super.
08-14-2012, 07:30 PM
I feel like the lack of big man depth will eventually be the downfall for Houston

Corey
08-14-2012, 08:07 PM
This voting shows how much name value means in these games.

The Spurs are a better team. No doubt in my mind.

Sadds The Gr8
08-14-2012, 08:17 PM
Hooustons wings are horrible and I think they cana be doubled off of to guard D12 and kg. Its close but I think spurs in 7. Alsoo, parker will own nash.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 08:22 PM
Rip is a great fit with the team. Brewer is an above average defender. He is very alethic as well. Parker has never owned nash in any of the matchups.

homestarunner93
08-14-2012, 09:26 PM
The Rockets are a horrible team. This result is utterly ridiculous.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 09:30 PM
The Rockets are a horrible team. This result is utterly ridiculous.

I was waiting for you.

Sadds The Gr8
08-14-2012, 10:34 PM
Rip is a great fit with the team. Brewer is an above average defender. He is very alethic as well. Parker has never owned nash in any of the matchups.

Parker hasn't faced 38 year old nash. Pretty sure hed destroy him. And what u said abour ripp and brewer has nothing to do with my first point. U cana doublle ooff those guys because they aarent big offensive threats, especially brewer who sucks on offense

mightybosstone
08-14-2012, 10:37 PM
I think Houston built a very good team, but I don't understand how a team that is better at 3/5 positions and is a wash at the 4th isn't the better basketball team. The Spurs are better constructed and have no weaknesses in their starting five. Offensively and defensively, that team is superior.

phlp_bj
08-14-2012, 10:45 PM
whats the official count?

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 10:45 PM
I think Houston built a very good team, but I don't understand how a team that is better at 3/5 positions and is a wash at the 4th isn't the better basketball team. The Spurs are better constructed and have no weaknesses in their starting five. Offensively and defensively, that team is superior.

Nash and Parker are close, Rip and Allen are close. Dwight is a lot better then Nene, while Iggy is a lot better then brewer I feel that iggy can't take over this series. I think I have the edge in rebounding and Dwight can take the series over, and for once in his career he has legit help.

xxplayerxx23
08-14-2012, 10:57 PM
whats the official count?

Not 100 percent sure. Its either tied or he is up 1 I believe.

kraze8
08-15-2012, 09:55 AM
Its good to see that I'm not the only one who thinks the Spurs are a better well rounded/Offensive team. Houston May have the big Superstar in Dwight but the players around him with the acceptation of nash and KG are pretty much useless.

Mr. Baller
08-15-2012, 10:36 AM
Its a shame your vote doesn't count

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 11:05 AM
Its a shame your vote doesn't count

lol this.

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 11:22 AM
official count as of now:

spurs : 28

rockets: 29

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 11:25 AM
Oh I counted wrong, I had it
Spurs:29
Rockets:30

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 11:26 AM
oh hm maybe i was wrong. pretty sure i had it right. regardless rockets are up 1

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 11:27 AM
oh hm maybe i was wrong. pretty sure i had it right. regardless rockets are up 1

Yeah lets hope it stays that way, ;)

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 11:38 AM
I'll be casting my vote here in a bit. Just doing some last minute thinking.

Just re-reading through this entire thread once more to see if there is any particular argument that grips me.

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 11:44 AM
ooooo if PK chooses Spurs, tie game!

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 11:58 AM
Tie game :sigh:

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 12:01 PM
who voted?

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:02 PM
Twin fan or something like that

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 12:04 PM
guess it'll come down to PK

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 12:05 PM
Alright, I'm about to breakdown my vote entirely:

I think what I love about the Spurs is that they just have an incredible balance throughout their starting line-up. Without hyperbole, truth is, you could make an argument that Tony Parker was the best PG this past season. Period. He is a gamebreaker with his ability to penetrate-and-kick and with a slasher like Iggy, and a shooter like Ray-Ray, with those bigs being able to space and occupy space. That team has such a beautiful offense really.

Defensively, I think they are solid. They aren't great on this end but they are definitely solid.

What I love about the Rockets is that they've essentially covered any weakness Nash might have in ISO-based situations defensively with two elite defensive players who are both probably top 3-5 impact defenders in the league.

Nash offensively with those bigs would create so much havoc with PNR/PNP situations.

I stick by this even reading throughout the thread, the perimeter play of the Rockets despite how strong Nash/KG/Dwight just is really not good.

Rip is one year older. Brewer from that SF position is a weakness due to his LACK of being able to space the floor consistently which will be needed with a Nash/KG/D12 PNR/PNP.

With that said some other thoughts.

I'm not worried at all about KG/D12's potential ability of getting into foul trouble when that same regard could be said about TD/Nene. When the post-season comes most teams roll with an 8-9 man rotation and the bigs rotation is really set to 3 players rotating.

I'd be very intrigued to see how the Iggy on Nash scenario would play out. This is one of those situations where I don't think the whole "Iggy being the best perimeter defender negates Nash's impact" like argument can be effective because Nash isn't some ISO scorer, he's a distributor able to hurt you anywhere on the court with his precision passing and absurdly amazing efficiency.

In the end, after giving the way I see this series panning out, I have to give it to San Antonio in 7.

San Antonio is far more balanced offensively, and although they are not elite defensively like the Rockets, I think they have the firepower still to make Nash/KG/Dwight essentially outscore the balanced Spurs line-up and I don't know if that could happen.

I'd put it this way, if the Rockets even had some semblance of a consistent scorer from the perimeter or a guy from the SF position who would be a dependable shooter from 3 to allow the appropriate spacing of the floor with Nash/KG/Dwight PNR/PNP I would've voted for the Rockets.

Brewer's fit on this team really doesn't make sense tbh. With KG/Dwight there is no need for an above average wing defender. The smartest thing the Rockets could've done was nab a guy who could play the Ray Allen role for the Spurs. Just space the floor and hit the 3 ball. Outside of Nash, I can't trust their starting perimeter players to give the Rockets at least even three 3's a game. The Spurs can pack the paint and I think they'll do enough to contain - keyword is contain, not stop - the Nash/KG/Dwight trio, and in the end it is enough for the Spurs to pull it out.

Spurs in 7.

I have a lot of respect for both these GM's and it pains me to make a vote so late that essentially ties the series, but I wanted to thoroughly think this through.

In my times playing these games (short history), I'll say this was the toughest vote I've had to make.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:10 PM
Anyway for the voters yet to vote and some don't go back to read anything Ill just say one last big thing here. Nash has had sucess on offense vs Parker Parker has had good sucess while guarded by Nash but has yet to really go off against him. In the matchups i posted they were bascally even all year last year and years before that. Allen is a 3 point shooter while Rip is an average defender and willl thrive coming off screens from Nash. Rip can contain Allen while allen can contain Rip too, Rip fits in great with the team and could put in double digit points as a 4th option. Brewer is very aletic and Iggy has yet to take over a series.Look at his playoff numbers last year, he was horrible. KG and Duncan are as even as it gets. KG was the better scorer and Rebounder in the playoffs and really showed what he had left against the heat. Nene is an average rebounder for a center, and Dwight has taken over series against better compettition with worse teamates around him.Dwight will go off think about all the games in the playoffs he has changed. Dwight will get doubled which leads KG,Rip,Nash wide open all game. Hedo comes in and plays point foward, and is splitting time with Brewer, he shot 35 percent from 3 in the regular season and 40 from 3 in the playoffs. Shannon brown is explosive and can spark the bench, he can shoot the ball and Piertrus is a good defender and can hit the 3. Amir started a lot of games and is solid rebounding defending and can put in a couple buckets during his time on the floor. Overal, I think the bigs on both side of the ball will be too much. Nene has gone up and down and didn't seem into it last year, Dwight should be able to hold him down while going off on offense. Thats really most of what i have to say :p

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 12:12 PM
spurs up 1 as of now

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:27 PM
It would suck to lose by 1 or 2 lol.

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 12:29 PM
I nearly didn't vote, but as a GM apart of this game I felt like I had to cast a vote no matter how hard it is.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:31 PM
I nearly didn't vote, but as a GM apart of this game I felt like I had to cast a vote no matter how hard it is.

Yeah, I understand how tough it is. I could only imagine who I would vote for if I wasn't the Rockets GM. Its really a close matchup.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:37 PM
I say 87 is close enough to 100, :nod: if you agree :D

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 12:38 PM
lol. Sorry it doesn't work that way. lol.

Someone should list the votes that don't count.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:39 PM
:cry: we would be tied....... Its sad how Im going to be leading the vote on the polls lol.

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 12:47 PM
Not the first time it's happened, but at the same time, it's a rule that has to be implied.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:48 PM
Yeah Im just playing, Sucks to be down 2 now :(

aussie
08-15-2012, 12:55 PM
whats the point of asking the forum if not everyones vote counts?

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 12:57 PM
whats the point of asking the forum if not everyones vote counts?

It prevents cheating. Its the rule.

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 12:58 PM
whats the point of asking the forum if not everyones vote counts?

Posters with less than 100 posts can hint at dupes or unfair tampering of votes through a various of ways. Obviously you can cheat using different methods (i.e. what Sportfan did in previous games), but this is one of the easiest and best ways to try and keeping the integrity of voting as clean as possible.

It has been a rule in these games since I started playing and I know it was around before I was playing.

aussie
08-15-2012, 01:01 PM
how do u know who's voted and who hasnt?

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 01:04 PM
Aussie, click the number on the votes and all who has voted pops up.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 01:23 PM
Down 3! :sigh:

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 02:42 PM
Tied up Bump :p

knicks=love
08-15-2012, 02:50 PM
what's the score

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 02:50 PM
Not sure the exact numbers but Im pretty sure its tied.

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 03:43 PM
Let's get another bumparoo.

PocketKings
08-15-2012, 03:43 PM
I would love to see this match reach 100 votes.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 03:47 PM
This has been an epic matchup. 1 hour left still anybody's series :jumpy:

phlp_bj
08-15-2012, 03:49 PM
i think the worst part about so many people voting is clicking on each name you don't recognize to see if they are 100 post or less lol

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 03:51 PM
Lol, exactly. Ive hit peoples names just to see 100 posts and I :cry: Its so damn close.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 04:45 PM
Wow. :O. Very happy with the outcome. Well 4 mins away from it.

Catfish1314
08-15-2012, 05:14 PM
My final count was 37-34 Houston.

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 05:21 PM
My final count was 37-34 Houston.

Thats what I got too. :dance2:

juggla53
08-15-2012, 05:29 PM
Its crazy how even these teams were, sounds like the rockets won, i voted spurs but cant really argue either way, good luck against that Indiana team though...

xxplayerxx23
08-15-2012, 05:31 PM
Its crazy how even these teams were, sounds like the rockets won, i voted spurs but cant really argue either way, good luck against that Indiana team though...

lol, this wasn't even the WCF, wait until you see the 2-3 Matchup. That is going to be another tough one. Indiana is going to be the hardest to knock down.

juggla53
08-15-2012, 05:39 PM
lol, this wasn't even the WCF, wait until you see the 2-3 Matchup. That is going to be another tough one. Indiana is going to be the hardest to knock down.

oh haha yeah that makes sense, guess i should have realized with both matchups being 1 vs 4's, for some reason thought they were, but yeah that indiana team is stacked