PDA

View Full Version : 4 Cases of All-Star Voter Fraud



redbird89
07-12-2012, 12:45 AM
When Major League Baseball announced its All-Star rosters, there was the usual brief outburst of indignation about how certain players got left off of the Midsummer Classic squads. As usual, these fierce, ultimately trivial debates lasted for around 36 hours.

At least these snubbed players weren’t the victims of voter fraud, though. Although the very nature of all-star voting invites trickery (Guy next to you at the stadium’s not going to fill out his ballot? Heck, might as well do it for him…), All-Star Game lore is littered with examples of particularly egregious frauds. Here are a few of our favorites:

1. The 1957 Redlegs Become an All-Star Team
2. Hacker Gets Behind Nomar
3. Vote for Rory
4. The WNBA Revels in “Punch Parties”

Read the full text here: http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/16371#ixzz20NdbbCZP
--brought to you by mental_floss!

It's not strictly MLB, but pretty interesting.

It also mentions that from 1958 to 1970 managers and players chose the team. As it is, people complained about who did or didn't get voted in, then they complained about who La Russa picked. Who should pick the All-Stars: fans, managers, coaches, or players?

utl768
07-12-2012, 01:16 AM
gm's

metswon69
07-12-2012, 01:19 AM
Disclaimer: Before i'm accused, this is not coming from a disgruntled RA Dickey or David Wright fan because i could give 2 ***** about the ASG

That's a really good question..

I don't know how i would handle it but i would certainly not leave the ASG starters to fan votes only.

I think they should find a way to balance it out, where fan votes make up a certain percentage of the tally, manager votes another percentage, then player's votes and with those numbers combined they select the game starters and their backups.

Let's face it, some of the homerism and the ridiculous players like Brandon Crawford and Brandon Belt that end up No 2 in fan voting at their respective positions hurt the credibility of the game and the credibility of the people voting for it.

As for the voter fraud, MLB.com (as with the other major sport's websites) certainly doesn't have the Department of Defense's cyber security.

That type of stuff could happen year in and year out and right from under our noses without anyone noticing it.

Not to say it does, but it's certainly feasible.

ciaban
07-12-2012, 03:34 AM
Disclaimer: Before i'm accused, this is not coming from a disgruntled RA Dickey or David Wright fan because i could give 2 ***** about the ASG

That's a really good question..

I don't know how i would handle it but i would certainly not leave the ASG starters to fan votes only.

I think they should find a way to balance it out, where fan votes make up a certain percentage of the tally, manager votes another percentage, then player's votes and with those numbers combined they select the game starters and their backups.

Let's face it, some of the homerism and the ridiculous players like Brandon Crawford and Brandon Belt that end up No 2 in fan voting at their respective positions hurt the credibility of the game and the credibility of the people voting for it.

As for the voter fraud, MLB.com (as with the other major sport's websites) certainly doesn't have the Department of Defense's cyber security.

That type of stuff could happen year in and year out and right from under our noses without anyone noticing it.

Not to say it does, but it's certainly feasible.
holy crap that's crazy! hey do you know where the final vote total is because i can't find it, also freddy sanchez had the 4th most votes out of any NL 2b and he hasn't played in over a year!

metswon69
07-12-2012, 03:48 AM
holy crap that's crazy! hey do you know where the final vote total is because i can't find it, also freddy sanchez had the 4th most votes out of any NL 2b and he hasn't played in over a year!

It was an article on Bleacher Report but i also heard on MLB TV..

There you go too, that's another example of fan voting losing credibility when Freddy Sanchez is even in the realm of discussion for the ASG when he hasn't played since last June.

metswon69
07-12-2012, 02:46 PM
holy crap that's crazy! hey do you know where the final vote total is because i can't find it, also freddy sanchez had the 4th most votes out of any NL 2b and he hasn't played in over a year!

http://www.bayareasportsguy.com/the-mlb-all-star-game-needs-to-go-back-to-its-roots/

"Brandon Crawford (2nd), Brandon Belt (2nd) and Freddy Sanchez (4th) all finished higher than they should have (statistically speaking, and time on the field speaking in Sanchez’s case) at their position in the fan voting for this year’s game."

I can't find the link with the final vote tallies though...

Rush
07-12-2012, 03:44 PM
http://www.bayareasportsguy.com/the-mlb-all-star-game-needs-to-go-back-to-its-roots/

"Brandon Crawford (2nd), Brandon Belt (2nd) and Freddy Sanchez (4th) all finished higher than they should have (statistically speaking, and time on the field speaking in Sanchez’s case) at their position in the fan voting for this year’s game."

I can't find the link with the final vote tallies though...

**** like that makes me ashamed to be associated with those types of Giants fans. I can't stand those homers.

metswon69
07-12-2012, 04:41 PM
**** like that makes me ashamed to be associated with those types of Giants fans. I can't stand those homers.

That's why i think baseball should let fan voting only mean so much...

You also need parties that can be more objective than the average fan.

T 980
07-12-2012, 08:28 PM
**** like that makes me ashamed to be associated with those types of Giants fans. I can't stand those homers.

The only way this All Star game could have been better is if it was held in SF. I still find it hilarious how much Giants fans stuffed the ballot box. I wonder what sparked the sudden interest...?

metswon69
07-12-2012, 09:42 PM
Is it me or is anyone else very surprised no one else has an opinion on the ASG voting?

waveycrockett
07-12-2012, 10:46 PM
Matt Cain should be ashamed

T 980
07-12-2012, 10:47 PM
Matt Cain should be ashamed

Why?

giantspwn
07-12-2012, 11:19 PM
HA! Just when you think there's an end to this All star non-sense.

Regardless of ballot tampering, I've never seen such a fan base and media outlet cry when a West coast team steps in to take the spot light. I can guarantee none of this would be as relevant now had the shoe been on the other foot. When Sandoval was snubbed in 09, all you had was a few Giants griping but god forbid RA Dickey doesn't start a game before he most likely falls back into mediocrity. The guy is 38 years old and was a scrub for 10 years, but since he's a pitcher for New York with half a good year under his belt, he will receive more attention than Matt Cain receives his whole career.

This is ridiculous. When has the All Star game ever been fair or it's rules of selection for that matter? Everyone obviously thinks it should be changed. David Wright has definitely been the best third basemen so far. RA Dickey has also been the better pitcher thus far. No one's arguing that. So why fault a fan base for voting their own players in when that's always been the norm for this system. Fault the system, not the fan base.

T.I.-KingofRap
07-13-2012, 12:07 AM
Tony *** Russa

T.I.-KingofRap
07-13-2012, 12:07 AM
Tony La Russa snubbed Red's players.

metswon69
07-13-2012, 12:14 AM
HA! Just when you think there's an end to this All star non-sense.

Regardless of ballot tampering, I've never seen such a fan base and media outlet cry when a West coast team steps in to take the spot light. I can guarantee none of this would be as relevant now had the shoe been on the other foot. When Sandoval was snubbed in 09, all you had was a few Giants griping but god forbid RA Dickey doesn't start a game before he most likely falls back into mediocrity. The guy is 38 years old and was a scrub for 10 years, but since he's a pitcher for New York with half a good year under his belt, he will receive more attention than Matt Cain receives his whole career.

See that's the part that kind of aggravates me (and this argument has nothing to do with this ASG itself), there is an accusation of East Coast bias but obviously the truth is you have no idea how good Dickey has been the last 3 years.

I am sure on the other hand a lot of reasonable Met fans are very cognizant of how good Matt Cain is and can be (arguably a top 10 starter in all of baseball)..

It's not a guy coming out of nowhere to have one miraculous first half, Dickey has been one of the better pitchers in the NL the last 3 years (his W-L record not doing him justice because the Mets were not very good in 2010 and 2011)

I mean his aggregate ERA since starting with the Mets in 2010 is just an eyelash over 2.8.

And if you had read the OP's question, this wasn't a condemnation on players of the game but a question regarding who should have final say on ASG participants.

Personally, it doesn't matter what the year, the ASG voting needs an overhaul as leaving the starters to just the fans snubs quite a number of players.

Pens_fan_21
07-13-2012, 12:23 AM
I'd leave it up to the coaching staffs in each League...AL coaches vote on AL players and NL for NL players...they get to see them everyday, they get whats going on...add all of them up and there is your team...still give fans the final vote so they don't feel left out when they vote for the wrong guy..er...guy they like

Luke_K77bear
07-13-2012, 12:35 AM
Did i watch the same game as you guys? i saw SF Giants players score 5 runs of 8. **** New York! Quit *****ing! learn how to use a computer. your on one now 'Mets Fans'
La Russa picked Cain over Dickey since he actually watches west coast ball.

bklynny67
07-13-2012, 12:50 AM
HA! Just when you think there's an end to this All star non-sense.

Regardless of ballot tampering, I've never seen such a fan base and media outlet cry when a West coast team steps in to take the spot light. I can guarantee none of this would be as relevant now had the shoe been on the other foot. When Sandoval was snubbed in 09, all you had was a few Giants griping but god forbid RA Dickey doesn't start a game before he most likely falls back into mediocrity. The guy is 38 years old and was a scrub for 10 years, but since he's a pitcher for New York with half a good year under his belt, he will receive more attention than Matt Cain receives his whole career.

This is ridiculous. When has the All Star game ever been fair or it's rules of selection for that matter? Everyone obviously thinks it should be changed. David Wright has definitely been the best third basemen so far. RA Dickey has also been the better pitcher thus far. No one's arguing that. So why fault a fan base for voting their own players in when that's always been the norm for this system. Fault the system, not the fan base.

Ok you ignorant ***, why don't ya learn a little something or at least know what the hell you're talking about.

Using 2009 as an example to solidify your argument is basically worthless. Yes, Pablo was having a much better season then the underachieving Wright that year and deserved to get the start, BUT the Mets also didn't have guys like Luis Castillo and Ryan Church finish 2nd at their postions in voting because their fans stuffed the ballots.

Thats the argument here, Giants fans stuffing the ballot!

Giants fans went above and beyond this yr and got Brandon Crawford and Brandon Belt 2nd place finishes in voting??? And Sanchez 4th? That's pathetic and a disgrace to the Giants fanbase. Yes, Wright was voted in as the starter, but it was because Pablo wasn't well known yet and Wright had already had multiple great seasons and it was not because Mets fans stuffed the ballots. It was because the average fan didn't know Pablo. When they look at the ballot, everyone knew Wright is a very good player, despite what he was doing that year. Thats pretty obvious..........

Giants fans voted their players regardless if they suck or aren't even playing this yr. Its ******** and I feel bad for the legit fans out there who didn't vote for guys like Crawford and Belt.

giantspwn
07-13-2012, 01:03 AM
See that's the part that kind of aggravates me (and this argument has nothing to do with this ASG itself), there is an accusation of East Coast bias but obviously the truth is you have no idea how good Dickey has been the last 3 years.

I am sure on the other hand a lot of reasonable Met fans are very cognizant of how good Matt Cain is and can be (arguably a top 10 starter in all of baseball)..

It's not a guy coming out of nowhere to have one miraculous first half, Dickey has been one of the better pitchers in the NL the last 3 years (his W-L record not doing him justice because the Mets were not very good in 2010 and 2011)

I mean his aggregate ERA since starting with the Mets in 2010 is just an eyelash over 2.8.

And if you had read the OP's question, you would realize that no one was complaining about Dickey or Wright not starting.

This was about ways to improve the ASG voting which needs a significant overhaul.

This thread was going in that direction as soon as it was posted. What other direction could it go in? The all star game just happened. The last All-star game thread was titled "RA Dickey Snubbed".

You sound very knowledgeable of baseball outside of the east coast along with many fans on this forum I'm sure but if you asked a random fan in New York who Matt Cain was, they probably would have no idea. There is no national exposure for West Coast outside it's time zone.

In regards to Dickey's career numbers, Matt Cain has been better every year to this point at the age of 27 with a huge lists of accomplishments while he doesn't get mentioned at all. MLB Network literally can't go 5 minutes without slobbering on Dickey's knob. The same goes for many other east coast teams players.

Thus proving my point, that had the All star balloting been different, this conversation would be completely non existent because it would be the "norm".

giantspwn
07-13-2012, 01:06 AM
Ok you ignorant ***, why don't ya learn a little something or at least know what the hell you're talking about.

Using 2009 as an example to solidify your argument is basically worthless. Yes, Pablo was having a much better season then the underachieving Wright that year and deserved to get the start, BUT the Mets also didn't have guys like Luis Castillo and Ryan Church finish 2nd at their postions in voting because their fans stuffed the ballots.

Thats the argument here, Giants fans stuffing the ballot!

Giants fans went above and beyond this yr and got Brandon Crawford and Brandon Belt 2nd place finishes in voting??? And Sanchez 4th? That's pathetic and a disgrace to the Giants fanbase. Yes, Wright was voted in as the starter, but it was because Pablo wasn't well known yet and Wright had already had multiple great seasons and it was not because Mets fans stuffed the ballots. It was because the average fan didn't know Pablo. When they look at the ballot, everyone knew Wright is a very good player, despite what he was doing that year. Thats pretty obvious..........

Giants fans voted their players regardless if they suck or aren't even playing this yr. Its ******** and I feel bad for the legit fans out there who didn't vote for guys like Crawford and Belt.

Nice insult there! :clap:

Your post proves my point exactly.

metswon69
07-13-2012, 01:17 AM
This thread was going in that direction as soon as it was posted. What other direction could it go in? The all star game just happened. The last All-star game thread was titled "RA Dickey Snubbed".

You sound very knowledgeable of baseball outside of the east coast along with many fans on this forum I'm sure but if you asked a random fan in New York who Matt Cain was, they probably would have no idea. There is no national exposure for West Coast outside it's time zone.

In regards to Dickey's career numbers, Matt Cain has been better every year to this point at the age of 27 with a huge lists of accomplishments while he doesn't get mentioned at all. MLB Network literally can't go 5 minutes without slobbering on Dickey's knob. The same goes for many other east coast teams players.

Thus proving my point, that had the All star balloting been different, this conversation would be completely non existent because it would be the "norm".

Hey i won't argue there is certainly an East Coast bias...

Fox drools at the possibility of something like the 2009 WS year in and year out..

And ESPN is certainly no better..

But i would think you would admit a guy like Freddy Sanchez who hasn't played since last June should not have finished 4th in ASG voting at 2nd base this year.

That's where my problem lies, fans of respective teams can let their homerism cloud their judgment and start these crazy campaigns to get guys undeserved into the ASG.

I am just looking for a way in which baseball can be more objective in the voting process for all stars and i think that starts with taking some of the fan influence out of the total decision.

And i think you are giving the players and managers far too little credit, i am sure they wouldn't exclude West Coast players if they had input on the ASG starters...

bklynny67
07-13-2012, 01:29 AM
Nice insult there! :clap:

Your post proves my point exactly.

So your point was that the whole 2009 Wright winning the vote over Pablo carries no weight? Then why did u mention that in your argument?

Because Mets fans weren't stuffing the ballots for their guys in 2009, but Giants fans did.... it was pathetic and embarrassing for SF fans.