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canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 01:13 AM
Where does Wade and LeBron rank all time now that they just picked up a chip?

I'd say both are TOP 20. If they win another next season they will be TOP 15.

justinnum1
06-22-2012, 01:15 AM
wade is top 25 lebron is top 15

when all is said and done, i think wade will be top 15 and lebron top 5

KB-Pau-DH2012
06-22-2012, 01:15 AM
LeBron is #11

In no order:

MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Hakeem and Russell are all ahead of him.

Jerry West, Oscar and Moses are right behind LeBron at #12, #13 and #14.


Wade is probably around #25 all time.

DaSeba5
06-22-2012, 01:17 AM
LeBron is #11

In no order:

MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Hakeem and Russell are all ahead of him.

Jerry West, Oscar and Moses are right behind LeBron at #12, #13 and #14.


Wade is probably around #25 all time.

Exactly this

Avenged
06-22-2012, 01:18 AM
Lebron is 15 to 20 for me.

Wade probably 20-25?

That's without really thinking about it.

JordansBulls
06-22-2012, 01:18 AM
Lebron #11 or #12 and Wade #20

popo85
06-22-2012, 01:19 AM
Agreed with most, James top 15 and Wade in the 25.

Bos_Sports4Life
06-22-2012, 01:19 AM
Wade is 22nd in WS 48 while being 93rd in total..

Once he declines he won't even be top 30

thekmp211
06-22-2012, 01:19 AM
i like KB-Pau's list. cream of the crop at their respective positions for a generation. pretty epic. and bron especially still has a LOT of room to grow.

Fnom11
06-22-2012, 01:22 AM
LeBron is #11

In no order:

MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Hakeem and Russell are all ahead of him.

Jerry West, Oscar and Moses are right behind LeBron at #12, #13 and #14.


Wade is probably around #25 all time.

Co sign

sixer04fan
06-22-2012, 01:24 AM
LeBron is #11

In no order:

MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Hakeem and Russell are all ahead of him.

Jerry West, Oscar and Moses are right behind LeBron at #12, #13 and #14.


Wade is probably around #25 all time.

Boom.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 01:26 AM
Wade is 22nd in WS 48 while being 93rd in total..

Once he declines he won't even be top 30

Once again the absolute garbage posts continue. Guys like you make all statisticians look bad.

WadeKobe
06-22-2012, 01:29 AM
Right now? IMO

LeBron 10-15 range.

Wade 15-25 range.

IMO, when their careers are over, LeBron will likely be the second best player to ever play, and Wade will be top 10-12.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 01:30 AM
LeBron I agree is #11-15 at this point. Wades has already had 2 legendary Finals performances, aside from his current "unWade-like" performance. I think he's no less than 22 at this point, but I have him at 20.

Jayrich28
06-22-2012, 01:31 AM
End thread ....lebron top 15 , wade top 25....i think majority agrees...

Longhornfan1234
06-22-2012, 01:32 AM
LeBron is a top 15 player...and Wade is a top 50-70 player.

KW93KB24
06-22-2012, 01:32 AM
Right now? IMO

LeBron 10-15 range.

Wade 15-25 range.

IMO, when their careers are over, LeBron will likely be the second best player to ever play, and Wade will be top 10-12.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

PatsSoxKnicks
06-22-2012, 01:32 AM
Lebron #11 or #12 and Wade #20

:speechless:

KW93KB24
06-22-2012, 01:34 AM
lebron 12-15

wade 25-35

Gibby
06-22-2012, 01:34 AM
Co sign

ur sig looks so wrong. lol bosh.

b@llhog24
06-22-2012, 01:36 AM
LeBron is #11

In no order:

MJ, Shaq, Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Duncan, Bird, Hakeem and Russell are all ahead of him.

Jerry West, Oscar and Moses are right behind LeBron at #12, #13 and #14.


Wade is probably around #25 all time.

I could live with this.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 01:36 AM
LeBron is a top 15 player...and Wade is a top 50-70 player.

That's BULL!!!! Wade isn't even a top 100 player.

Longhornfan1234
06-22-2012, 01:38 AM
That's BULL!!!! Wade isn't even a top 100 player.

:facepalm: 2x champion and 1 finals MVP, brah.

b@llhog24
06-22-2012, 01:38 AM
once again the absolute garbage posts continue. Guys like you make all statisticians look bad.

+1

WadeKobe
06-22-2012, 01:39 AM
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Laugh all you want, but a few things are realities:


Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

And LeBron? Don't even get me started. He will likely retire with the 2nd highest PER, WS/48, most WS of all time, most points, most triple doubles, 6-7 MVPs.

If he gets 4 championships and 4 Finals MVPs, you're going to tell me he wont' have an argument for #2?

Facepalm all you want, it is completly possible.

b@llhog24
06-22-2012, 01:39 AM
I doubt Wade gets to top 10.

naps
06-22-2012, 01:40 AM
Lebron #11 or #12 and Wade #20

:speechless:

JB, you got hacked?


Anyways, I think LeBron is top 12 now and Wade is top 20.

I was just thinking if Wade won his 2nd MVP last year he would have two legendary finals and three rings by now. With that he would be sniffing around top 12 now...WoW! What difference one game makes! **** you LeBron for last years finals.

Bruno
06-22-2012, 01:41 AM
LBJ can be put as high as 11th. As low as 18-18.

Wade, as high as late teens, no lower than 25th.

congrats to Miami. they played great.

WadeKobe
06-22-2012, 01:44 AM
I doubt Wade gets to top 10.

Depends on a lot of things. Very possible he doesn't.

Bruno
06-22-2012, 01:47 AM
has LBJ surpassed West, Oscar, KG, Dirk, Malone, Barkley, Robinson, Dr. J, Moses ect?

IIISSKiLL
06-22-2012, 01:48 AM
Laugh all you want, but a few things are realities:


Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

And LeBron? Don't even get me started. He will likely retire with the 2nd highest PER, WS/48, most WS of all time, most points, most triple doubles, 6-7 MVPs.


If he gets 4 championships and 4 Finals MVPs, you're going to tell me he wont' have an argument for #2?

Facepalm all you want, it is completly possible.

I can't name 25 better players than wade.. and lebron is a great player but all time leader in triple doubles ? rondo is on his *** already for the playoffs

JordansBulls
06-22-2012, 01:49 AM
:speechless:

JB, you got hacked?


Anyways, I think LeBron is top 12 now and Wade is top 20.

I was just thinking if Wade won his 2nd MVP last year he would have two legendary finals and three rings by now. With that he would be sniffing around top 12 now...WoW! What difference one game makes! **** you LeBron for last years finals.

Perception of a player can change for the better once he wins. I for one hated Wade in 2006 and then a few years later he became my favorite player. Once you are a bball guru you give credit after the fact then while they are doing the stuff.

b@llhog24
06-22-2012, 01:49 AM
has LBJ surpassed West, Oscar, KG, Dirk, Malone, Barkley, Robinson, Dr. J, Moses ect?

Easily for me. I could hear arguments for Moses, D-Rob, and Barkley at this point in his career

KW93KB24
06-22-2012, 01:50 AM
Laugh all you want, but a few things are realities:


Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

And LeBron? Don't even get me started. He will likely retire with the 2nd highest PER, WS/48, most WS of all time, most points, most triple doubles, 6-7 MVPs.

If he gets 4 championships and 4 Finals MVPs, you're going to tell me he wont' have an argument for #2?

Facepalm all you want, it is completly possible.


I was laughing because you said it as if it will happen 100% guaranteed.
Wade is getting old and slowing down, lebron is not going to have this athleticism that he has now when he's kobe's age. Come on man.

Your name is WADE>KOBE, im not going to take you seriously. It took lebron 9 years to get his ring, do you understand how incredibly hard it is to get 4 rings or repeat champs? only a few teams have done it. In 2-3 years wade will be a below average player.

LTBaByyy
06-22-2012, 01:50 AM
I think Wade is little overrated, without Shaq or Lebron he didn't do much

I say top #30, people saying #0-#25 is trippin

Lebron on the other hand will be top #5 when its all said and done

TylerSL
06-22-2012, 01:50 AM
Lebron top 15, Wade top 25. If they win again next year, Lebron could move up to like 12 or so, and Wade could get himself in top 20.

:win:

WadeKobe
06-22-2012, 01:55 AM
has LBJ surpassed West, Oscar, KG, Dirk, Malone, Barkley, Robinson, Dr. J, Moses ect?

There is no doubt in my mind he has passed all of those except for West and Moses. That would be interesting.

Jordan
Wilt
KAJ
Shaq
Duncan
Magic
Bird
Hakeem

Moses/West/BigO/Russel/Kobe

IMO, he's already better than the large majority of them, now it is just a matter of putting together the resumé.

naps
06-22-2012, 01:57 AM
I think Wade is little overrated, without Shaq or Lebron he didn't do much

I say top #30, people saying #0-#25 is trippin


Says a Mavs fan. Two finals beatdowns by Wade. Makes sense.

WadeKobe
06-22-2012, 01:58 AM
I can't name 25 better players than wade.. and lebron is a great player but all time leader in triple doubles ? rondo is on his *** already for the playoffs

Good catch, I meant among players who are in that conversation. My bad. He'll never catch Magic or Oscar.

Bravo95
06-22-2012, 01:58 AM
Lebron's probably Top 15, Moses Malone/Jerry West territory. Wade 25-30.

KB-Pau-DH2012
06-22-2012, 02:01 AM
Laugh all you want, but a few things are realities:


Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

And LeBron? Don't even get me started. He will likely retire with the 2nd highest PER, WS/48, most WS of all time, most points, most triple doubles, 6-7 MVPs.

If he gets 4 championships and 4 Finals MVPs, you're going to tell me he wont' have an argument for #2?

Facepalm all you want, it is completly possible.

Sorry brah, Wade doesn't even come close to touching much less breathing near the iconic Kobe Bean Bryant. He's not even head of the Logo, Jerry West. MJ, Kobe and West (in that order) in the battle of the shooting guards are light yrs ahead of Wade.

KB-Pau-DH2012
06-22-2012, 02:02 AM
Says a Mavs fan. Two finals beatdowns by Wade. Makes sense.

Don't you mean one?

You guys lost last yr to Dallas.

TylerSL
06-22-2012, 02:02 AM
Jordan
Magic
Wilt
KAJ
Hakeem
Bird
Duncan
Oscar
Shaq
Kobe
Russell
Robinson
West
Lebron
Moses

top 15 IMO

naps
06-22-2012, 02:07 AM
Don't you mean one?

You guys lost last yr to Dallas.

No, I meant two. Wade dominated last years finals and would easily got the finals MVP last year had LeBron not choked to death.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:07 AM
Don't you mean one?

You guys lost last yr to Dallas.

Wade still had the best Finals performances in that series of the 2 teams, despite the loss. Good enough for 8th highest Finals PER of all time. Wade also has the highest PER Finals of all time has we speak, and people still don't wanna give this guy his credit.

KB-Pau-DH2012
06-22-2012, 02:07 AM
I don't get how Oscar is ahead of Russell. Oscar has 1 titles, and Russell has freakin 10 more titles than him.

And in 1971, when Oscar won the title with the Bucks, it's because the behemoth Lew Alcindor (Kareem Abdul-Jabbar) in just his 2nd yr (after winning league MVP and ROY in his rookie season) led that franchise to their one and only title. And Kareem was the finals MVP, not Oscar.


If Oscar averaged Triple-Double in a season, well, Russell's defensive monster stats of rebounds over 30+ and blocks over 10+ on several occassions and the fact that the freakin Finals MVP Award is named after the guy should not be shoved aside.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:09 AM
No, I meant two. Wade dominated last years finals and would easily got the finals MVP last year had LeBron not choked to death.

Exactly. Wade was easily the best player in last years Finals. What a difference one year makes. Wade is now a scrub in the eyes of many.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:11 AM
I don't care what anyone says. LeBron is TOP 12, Wade is TOP 20. Another championship next season and both Wade and LeBron are TOP 15

Bravo95
06-22-2012, 02:12 AM
Gotta be careful assuming/predicting future titles to add to resumes. Should only talk about what the player has already won. Crazy **** happens in the NBA every season. Surrounding casts will change, new superstars emerge, and key injuries derail seasons. Nothing is promised.

shep33
06-22-2012, 02:14 AM
LBJ around 15 I'd say, Wade may eventually crack my top 20. The thing about Wade is that he's about to start his decline (probably already has, it happens to everyone), and his numbers won't come close to Kobe or MJ at the SG position when all is said and done.

But who knows, maybe he bounces back, gets healthy. He shouldn't play in the olympics

naps
06-22-2012, 02:18 AM
Sorry brah, Wade doesn't even come close to touching much less breathing near the iconic Kobe Bean Bryant. He's not even head of the Logo, Jerry West. MJ, Kobe and West (in that order) in the battle of the shooting guards are light yrs ahead of Wade.

Kobe and West are light years ahead of Wade? Aren't you pushing it too far (assuming you know what how significant light years mean)?

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:19 AM
LBJ around 15 I'd say, Wade may eventually crack my top 20. The thing about Wade is that he's about to start his decline (probably already has, it happens to everyone), and his numbers won't come close to Kobe or MJ at the SG position when all is said and done.

But who knows, maybe he bounces back, gets healthy. He shouldn't play in the olympics
"May eventually crack the top 20"??? Look at the players around his range right now. A few more years of high level seasons and there is no doubt he TOP 15.

As for his so-called decline, it's obvious Wade was playing injured in the playoffs this season. He will return to his vintage Wade form next season after an offseason surgery.

Miami will only get stronger next season, and if Wade and LeBron win another chip next season both are TOP 15. Kobe has the accolades and longevity thus far, but they are virtually the same player IMO.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:19 AM
Kobe and West are light years ahead of Wade? Aren't you pushing it too far?

Ignore the trolls.

naps
06-22-2012, 02:22 AM
Ignore the trolls.

I wanna hear it again if he meant it correct and then I'll go from there.

Mixeditup1
06-22-2012, 02:24 AM
Nobody has Ewing up in the top 20?

BURAKOBE
06-22-2012, 02:26 AM
You know what, LeBron is so good that if he didn't team up with wade and bosh, i think he would win it all for once in this 2 years anyways. And if he did that i would say #10 now. In these circumstances i say top 15.

PocketKings
06-22-2012, 02:28 AM
After some thought, I have Bron cemented at #11 right now and Wade between 20-22.

b@llhog24
06-22-2012, 02:31 AM
I don't get how Oscar is ahead of Russell. Oscar has 1 titles, and Russell has freakin 10 more titles than him.

And in 1971, when Oscar won the title with the Bucks, it's because the behemoth Lew Alcindor (Kareem Abdul-Jabbar) in just his 2nd yr (after winning league MVP and ROY in his rookie season) led that franchise to their one and only title. And Kareem was the finals MVP, not Oscar.


If Oscar averaged Triple-Double in a season, well, Russell's defensive monster stats of rebounds over 30+ and blocks over 10+ on several occassions and the fact that the freakin Finals MVP Award is named after the guy should not be shoved aside.

What kind off player you think Oscar/Russell would be if placed in this era?

shep33
06-22-2012, 02:35 AM
"May eventually crack the top 20"??? Look at the players around his range right now. A few more years of high level seasons and there is no doubt he TOP 15.

As for his so-called decline, it's obvious Wade was playing injured in the playoffs this season. He will return to his vintage Wade form next season after an offseason surgery.

Miami will only get stronger next season, and if Wade and LeBron win another chip next season both are TOP 15. Kobe has the accolades and longevity thus far, but they are virtually the same player IMO.

Everybody declines. I know it's tough to fathom when some of our favorites go down hill, but I think it's about to begin for Wade as it did for Kobe. I'm not saying he's going to be a bum, he's still a great player, but it just happens to the best of them. Longevity is what makes Kobe's career spectacular imo, I just don't know if Wade can endure that type of longevity.

Wade has played about half as many games as Kobe throughout his career. That's why it'll be hard for me to see Wade accumulating the type of career resume that Kobe will have.

We're predicting a "few more years of high level seasons"... that's a tough thing to do when assessing Wade's style of play.

Again, not trying to bash Wade, I just don't think I can put him in my top 20 just yet. Lebron on the other hand is a beast, top 15.

Venomous88
06-22-2012, 02:39 AM
This is my list as of now

Official NBA Top Ten List

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Magic Johnson
5. Kobe Bryant
6. Larry Bird
7. Bill Russell
8. Tim Duncan
9. Shaquille O'Neal
10. Hakeem Olajuwon

11. LeBron James
12. Oscar Robertson
13. Moses Malone
14. Jerry West
15. Julius Erving
16. Bob Cousy
17. Karl Malone
18. David Robinson
19. Kevin Garnett
20. Dirk Nowitzki

21. James Worthy
22. Dwyane Wade
23. Isiah Thomas
24. Jon Havlicek
25. John Stockton


I expect Wade to peak top 15-20 and James top 5 if they continue on this trajectory.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 02:42 AM
Everybody declines. I know it's tough to fathom when some of our favorites go down hill, but I think it's about to begin for Wade as it did for Kobe. I'm not saying he's going to be a bum, he's still a great player, but it just happens to the best of them. Longevity is what makes Kobe's career spectacular imo, I just don't know if Wade can endure that type of longevity.

Wade has played about half as many games as Kobe throughout his career. That's why it'll be hard for me to see Wade accumulating the type of career resume that Kobe will have.

We're predicting a "few more years of high level seasons"... that's a tough thing to do when assessing Wade's style of play.

Again, not trying to bash Wade, I just don't think I can put him in my top 20 just yet. Lebron on the other hand is a beast, top 15.

Wade not TOP 20? I can't name 20 players better than Wade. There are all time players in the TOP 20 w/o rings. Wade has had 2 legendary Finals performances and 2 rings and 3 appearances already in 9 seasons. Has made ECFs about half the time, and he's not TOP 20? Wade is TOP 10 all time in season and playoff PER, just how is he not TOP 20 right now?

KingPosey
06-22-2012, 02:56 AM
only on PSD do you become a top 10 player of all time halfway through your career, instantly after you win a championship.

shep33
06-22-2012, 03:01 AM
Wade not TOP 20? I can't name 20 players better than Wade. There are all time players in the TOP 20 w/o rings. Wade has had 2 legendary Finals performances and 2 rings and 3 appearances already in 9 seasons. Has made ECFs about half the time, and he's not TOP 20? Wade is TOP 10 all time in season and playoff PER, just how is he not TOP 20 right now?

Wade is going to be in the HOF, he's a spectacular talent. IMO though, I don't consider him a top 20 player yet, that's just my opinion. His averages are great, but he's also played in the Eastern Conference his entire career, perhaps the worst conference (in terms of the era that he played in) that the NBA has ever seen.

Again, it's just my opinion but I'd still put I don't think he's top 20 yet. Needs to build up on his resume imo.

Wade isn't in the top 100 in all-time scoring yet. Soon to be, but not yet. Nor is he in steals, rebounding, assists, etc.

MadBomber
06-22-2012, 03:06 AM
only on PSD do you become a top 10 player of all time halfway through your career, instantly after you win a championship.

+1 haha

Bravo95
06-22-2012, 03:15 AM
Longevity is what makes Kobe's career spectacular imo
People keep ignoring that. Nevermind the rings for a moment... 16 years in and still a Top 10 active player? That's crazy. Lebron's peak is ridiculous, and Wade is building a solid resume, but it seems like Kobe is one of those polarizing figures who fans won't fully appreciate until he's gone and they look back at his career.

blams
06-22-2012, 03:31 AM
LeBron is from 5-8. Wade is top 30

LakersMaster24
06-22-2012, 04:12 AM
:laugh2:

Kobe > Wade (Career Wise). End of Story.

Raps08-09 Champ
06-22-2012, 04:32 AM
My list goes

1. Jordan
2. Magic
3. Kareem
4. Wilt
5. Bird
6. Russell
7. Kobe
8. Hakeem
9. Shaq
10. Duncan
11. Lebron

With 7-10 really interchangeable. I probably change 7-10 up a bit every now and then.

It'll take 2-3 more rings for Lebron to make a case for the top 5 of that list.

noodle
06-22-2012, 08:20 AM
I think they're both a couple of *****.

Bruno
06-22-2012, 08:38 AM
:laugh2:

Kobe > Wade (Career Wise). End of Story.

wade won't retire the better player.

kobe will retire with more MVPs, more finals MVPs, more titles, more points, more all nba team selections, more all-star appearances, more defensive team selections and greater longevity. wade might take him in a few per game numbers, and some advanced numbers, but not enough so to sway the debate.

Glen20
06-22-2012, 08:43 AM
wade won't retire the better player.

kobe will retire with more MVPs, more finals MVPs, more titles, more points, more all nba team selections, more all-star appearances, more defensive team selections and greater longevity. wade might take him in a few per game numbers, and some advanced numbers, but not enough so to sway the debate.

but what if Wade ends up with more rings? We all know rings are the only things that count on PSD :)

Bruno
06-22-2012, 08:46 AM
but what if Wade ends up with more rings? We all know rings are the only things that count on PSD :)

he's not gona end up with more rings. four more? thats a tall order man.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 08:48 AM
:facepalm: 2x champion and 1 finals MVP, brah.

That's garbage like you have proven with your sound and profound arguments in the past Shaq and the refs carried Wade to that first title and Shaq just felt sorry for Wade so he let him have the FMVP and well this finals LeBron and Bosh were clearly the best players on the Heat, hell even Battier is better than Wade. Dude you're a genius here on PSD Dwyane Wade is a horrible player.

kantarok
06-22-2012, 08:56 AM
Everyone on this thread is delusional if you think James is top 10-20 range. He is already considered the most or second most talented of all time. When his career is over, he should be top 2. Wade should be just a notch below Kobe because in my eyes he has always been better than Kobe.

BigCityofDreams
06-22-2012, 08:57 AM
I went through the thread and many posters have West outside the top 10. Why is that?

RowBTrice
06-22-2012, 08:58 AM
a chip??? whoever thought of shortening Championship into "chip" is dumb. And to answer the question, LeBron James will be top-20 and Wade top-50.

Raps08-09 Champ
06-22-2012, 08:59 AM
only on PSD do you become a top 10 player of all time halfway through your career, instantly after you win a championship.

Not really. If you earn it, you earn it.

MJ, when he first won his ring, boosted through the rankings.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 09:00 AM
Everyone on this thread is delusional if you think James is top 10-20 range. He is already considered the most or second most talented of all time. When his career is over, he should be top 2. Wade should be just a notch below Kobe because in my eyes he has always been better than Kobe.

So lets say LeBron fails to ever win another MVP or make it to the finals and start to regress from the point on would he still finish top 2?

The question is posed based on this very moment not what we expect by the time his career is over.

Dankster
06-22-2012, 09:01 AM
He's a top 10-14 player already. If we're going by overall resume, statistics and skillset, no question 10-14.

Even if he doesn't win another title but keeps up these ridiculous advanced statistics (ie: PER>30) for a few more years, he's certain to be inside the top 10 comfortably.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 09:01 AM
I went through the thread and many posters have West outside the top 10. Why is that?

Because there are 10 players better than Jerry West? :shrug:

Raps08-09 Champ
06-22-2012, 09:02 AM
I went through the thread and many posters have West outside the top 10. Why is that?

Well for one thing, he was 1/9 in the finals. He doesn't have as much individual accolades (mainly MVP) some of the other players have too.

Swashcuff
06-22-2012, 09:02 AM
only on PSD do you become a top 10 player of all time halfway through your career, instantly after you win a championship.

Actually Jordan was seen as the best player in the history of the game at the half way point in his career (not really halfway point but his age at the time would suggest that it would have been the half way point) and PSD didn't even exist in those days.

SaimuKala
06-22-2012, 09:04 AM
Laugh all you want, but a few things are realities:


Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

And LeBron? Don't even get me started. He will likely retire with the 2nd highest PER, WS/48, most WS of all time, most points, most triple doubles, 6-7 MVPs.

If he gets 4 championships and 4 Finals MVPs, you're going to tell me he wont' have an argument for #2?

Facepalm all you want, it is completly possible.

So if Wade wins 4 rings then he will be in the same discussion with Kobe Bean Bryant? :facepalm:

4 Rings < 5 Rings
0 MVP < 1 MVP
1 FMVP< 2 FMVP (No, Wade will not be a FMVP since LeBron is in his team)

and I'm not even going to the All-NBA teams

Kobe will probably end up like 2nd or 3rd or 4th in all time scoring list.

Wade prime <<<<<<<<< Kobe prime




LeBron will probably end up top 5 and Wade top 15-20

BigCityofDreams
06-22-2012, 09:09 AM
Because there are 10 players better than Jerry West? :shrug:

All the joking aside though the reason I asked is because most older fans of the league feel it's a slap in the face if West isn't in the top 10.


Well for one thing, he was 1/9 in the finals. He doesn't have as much individual accolades (mainly MVP) some of the other players have too.

Very well said.

kdspurman
06-22-2012, 09:24 AM
I don't doubt Lebron will be top 10 (assuming he wins another couple rings of course) , but who do you guys see him replacing in the top 10?

D-Leethal
06-22-2012, 09:24 AM
Wade is probably somewhere around top 25. LeBron is honestly creeping up to top 10 status and I am a LeBron hater.

Raps08-09 Champ
06-22-2012, 09:27 AM
I don't doubt Lebron will be top 10 (assuming he wins another couple rings of course) , but who do you guys see him replacing in the top 10?
Most people have the 10th as Duncan or Hakeem. Hakeem probably slips to 11th if that's the case.

Slade123
06-22-2012, 09:29 AM
No, I meant two. Wade dominated last years finals and would easily got the finals MVP last year had LeBron not choked to death.

If's and buts. He lost. Period!!!

kdspurman
06-22-2012, 09:45 AM
Most people have the 10th as Duncan or Hakeem. Hakeem probably slips to 11th if that's the case.

I can see that or Tim slipping. It's so tough to do something like that though it'd seem.

canefandynasty
06-22-2012, 09:47 AM
If's and buts. He lost. Period!!!

LeBron f'd it up for him though. Wade still had the 8th highest Finals PER of all time from that series. Not to mention the highest Finals PER of all time. Also has the TOP 10 highest career season and playoff PER of all time. How many players can say that.

http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2012/story/_/page/FinalsPerformances-1/greatest-finals-performances-no-1

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/per_career.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/per_career_p.html

Raps08-09 Champ
06-22-2012, 10:02 AM
I can see that or Tim slipping. It's so tough to do something like that though it'd seem.

It'll be tough and it'll take at least 2 more titles.

But if he wins 2 more titles and 2 more F.MVP, I'd even go to say he can jump over to make a case at top 5. 3 F.MVP, 3 Rings and 3 MVPs certainly matches Larry Bird's accolades and I'd think 2 more rings makes him the top SF in league history.

ChiSox219
06-22-2012, 10:27 AM
Had this conversation last night before the game and the consensus was Lebron is top 10, i said he'll end up #2 someone else reponded "lebron already #2" which is defensible if not true.

ManRam
06-22-2012, 10:46 AM
LeBron is in my top 10 already. Individually, and especially statistically, he's easily a top 10 player ever. Some of the other variables knock him down a bit, but he's somewhere in my top 10.

wmudford
06-22-2012, 11:58 AM
Lebron top 15. Wade top 30.

Have Lebron as 2nd greatest SF behind Larry Bird.

rpr (rank per rings)

1: Top 15, #2 SF
3: Top 5, #1 SF
5: #2 player all-time
6: Tied for #1 all-time
7: GOAT

MonroeFAN
06-22-2012, 12:21 PM
I'm not sure I would put Wade in the top 25 right now, another ring sure. But there have been a lot of talented players in this league through out the years.

nastynice
06-22-2012, 12:24 PM
wade top 25? I don't know man, the guy's really been a top tier player for only a couple years. Dude fell of BIG time this year. That's a stretch.

Lebron's as good as it gets. I don't know if you can put him in the legendary category (jordan, kobe, the dream) just cuz of the way he had to join forces, but in all reality he's as good as it gets.

nastynice
06-22-2012, 12:25 PM
Lebron top 15. Wade top 30.

Have Lebron as 2nd greatest SF behind Larry Bird.



i think lebron already smashes bird. even if he were to retire tomorrow i'd put him above bird

nastynice
06-22-2012, 12:30 PM
Wade will likely have 3 or 4 rings, 1 Finals MVP, more WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS/48 than Kobe, more playoff WS than Kobe, a higher career PER than Kobe, higher playoff career PER than Kobe.

If he does, you're going to tell me he won't belong in the same discussion as Kobe? Give me a break. If Kobe is at 8, then Wade at 10-12 is hardly a stretch if he wins another one or two.

LOLOL!!! kobe and wade in the same category?!?

I'm having a hard time believing that even YOU believe that. Wade's own grandmama would slap you if she heard you say that

Hawkeye15
06-22-2012, 12:46 PM
LeBron is in my top 10 already. Individually, and especially statistically, he's easily a top 10 player ever. Some of the other variables knock him down a bit, but he's somewhere in my top 10.

This. When you add his past two week run of a man possessed, dominating everything and closing out the best, along with his ridiculous statistics, MVP's, Finals MVP, defensive teams, NBA teams, etc, and his playoff play over his career has been awesome as well, if he retired today, LeBron is top 10 ever.

Wade top 25 or so.

nicegoing
06-22-2012, 12:46 PM
LeBron will go down as the best SF, Wade will go down as third best SG.

hugepatsfan
06-22-2012, 12:49 PM
Wade is probably about were he will end up all time. I wouldn't expect him to go up or down too many spots. Tough to place him exactly on the list though because he's further down.

Lebron will eventually be the best player ever IMO (if healthy). IDK where I'd put him now though - judging players in the middle of their careers is tough.

Hawkeye15
06-22-2012, 01:09 PM
Wade is probably about were he will end up all time. I wouldn't expect him to go up or down too many spots. Tough to place him exactly on the list though because he's further down.

Lebron will eventually be the best player ever IMO (if healthy). IDK where I'd put him now though - judging players in the middle of their careers is tough.

They way I personally judge it is in they retired right now, where do you have them?

hugepatsfan
06-22-2012, 01:13 PM
They way I personally judge it is in they retired right now, where do you have them?

Well the tought part about that is, for example, if you were comparing Bird to Lebron. Bird's career includes his phyiscal declinem, while Lebron's obviously doesn't. Do you adjust your perception of Bird to only includes his prime? Ranking injured players w/ short but amazing peaks (T-Mac) and still active players (Lebron) is real tough because they're career #s need context when compared to guys w/ full, healthy careers.

tbone2171
06-22-2012, 01:32 PM
Where does Wade and LeBron rank all time now that they just picked up a chip?

I'd say both are TOP 20. If they win another next season they will be TOP 15.

Tortilla or potato?

Bruno
06-22-2012, 05:07 PM
This. When you add his past two week run of a man possessed, dominating everything and closing out the best, along with his ridiculous statistics, MVP's, Finals MVP, defensive teams, NBA teams, etc, and his playoff play over his career has been awesome as well, if he retired today, LeBron is top 10 ever.

Wade top 25 or so.


LeBron is in my top 10 already. Individually, and especially statistically, he's easily a top 10 player ever. Some of the other variables knock him down a bit, but he's somewhere in my top 10.


no way, you guys are living in the moment. he hasn't knocked any of these guys out yet in overall career. he needs another rings to even qualify for the debate. all these guys have multiple rings and at least two finals MVPs.

MJ
KAJ
Wilt
Russell
Magic
Bird
Shaq
Bryant
Duncan
Hakeem

LBJ may have leap-frogged a bunch of players on the all time list, but not these ten.

Bruno
06-22-2012, 05:10 PM
LBJ obviously retires top ten. maybe top five. but he's not there yet. not as of today.

ThunderZubb
06-22-2012, 06:10 PM
You wonder fans hate Miami HEAT TEAM AND IT'S FANS BECAUSE STUPID THREADS LIKE THIS COMPARING LEBRON TO MICHAEL JORDAN OR SAYING LEBRON WILL BE THE BEST PLAYER ALL TIME IN THE NEXT 10 YEARS GIMMIE ME A BREAK SERIOUSLY. IT IS MOSTLY MIAMI HEAT FANS WHO ARE 16 Years old or younger. HAHA WHAT A JOKE HAVE YOU JOBBERS WATCHED MICHAEL JORDAN PLAY AGAINST THE BAD BOYS IN HIS PRIME. YOU KNOW HOW HE GOT HIT BADLY BY BAD BOYS PISTONS TRUST ME DEREK FISHER FOUL WAS NOT A FRAGANT AND I AM TELLING LEBRON WOULD NOT SURVIVE IN THE 90 ERA. CHARLIE OAKLEY, DENNIS RODMAN, BILL LIAMBEER, ANTHONY MASON AND ETC WOULD OF ATE LEBRON ALIVE PLUS HE HAS NO ****ING HEART.

LEBRON CANNOT HOLD MICHAEL JORDAN JOCKSTRAP

BKdoubleStacker
06-22-2012, 06:21 PM
Is longevity not a factor? Lebron is no doubt going to be top 10, but he is not there YET.

Wade is not top 20 (probably top 30) nor will he ever be. I dont see him moving up, or down really. I think his best basketball is behind him, though he should still be good for atleast another season or two.