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View Full Version : What is Alfonso Soriano's trade value?



Cubsfan365
06-09-2012, 08:58 PM
He has 12 HR in his last 24 games, to go along with an .827 OPS and 39 RBI on the year and has been much improved since switching to a lighter bat. He ranks 8th in the NL in both HR and RBI and has also played pretty good defense in LF, but would probably be most valuable as a DH. Everyone knows he has a lot of money still owed to him by the Cubs, but if the Cubs paid at least 90% of his remaining money, what is his realistic trade value?

rocket
06-09-2012, 09:14 PM
A bag of chips

jlohm1
06-09-2012, 09:21 PM
not very much

Sneaky
06-09-2012, 09:30 PM
Two used baseballs.

nymetsrule
06-09-2012, 09:53 PM
$12

yankeefan54
06-09-2012, 10:43 PM
Zero if the cubs payed every cent mabe he is traded. But he is a dh only on a playoff team.

NateyB24
06-09-2012, 10:46 PM
He doesn't have very much value i would say a throw away prospect he can hit HR's in spurts but overall he isn't a very good hitter and his Defense isn't very good in the OF.

Skippy15
06-09-2012, 10:57 PM
Pretty much none. Contract is still just to big, even towards the end, for the kind of production he puts up. He's not worth the money

STL Don
06-09-2012, 10:59 PM
His production has improved, however, his contract is too big and his age doesn't help his cause either.
I wouldn't want him on my team, his strike out rate turns me off.

Stress
06-09-2012, 11:06 PM
Minimum wage.

TO Rapz
06-09-2012, 11:07 PM
A bag of chips


Two used baseballs.


$12

These three put together in a package.

ElvisIsFat91
06-09-2012, 11:09 PM
His defense has been vastly improved and has become an above average defender out in left. With the way he is swinging the bat, if the Cubs pay the 90-95% of his contract like is being reported, their is no reason why they shouldn't get a mid level prospect or two back...

Panthers4life
06-09-2012, 11:10 PM
i could see the Indians being interested if the cubs paid 90%, with hafner being out until after the all star break he can DH and play some left when he is back. need a right handed bat with some pop. a mid level prospect

Ty Fast
06-09-2012, 11:23 PM
soriano for carl crawford???

oak2455
06-09-2012, 11:41 PM
These three put together in a package.

add a cheeseburger and deal is sealed:clap::clap::clap:

TrueYankee
06-09-2012, 11:46 PM
Sheet...even my alcohol is worth more than that

C-ross12
06-09-2012, 11:49 PM
Not very much, but probably more then a used baseball, a bag of chips, and beer? I'd imagine we'd have to eat 35 - 40 on his 48 left, and maybe get a lottery ticket or two back.

Buckwheat
06-09-2012, 11:59 PM
soriano for carl crawford???

Why in the blue hell would the Cubs do that? Soriano has about two years left on his deal, I think.. Crawford has, what? Five?

sexicano31
06-10-2012, 12:10 AM
Im sure RAJ would trade May and Biddle while paying all of his salary

MetsFanatic19
06-10-2012, 12:43 AM
no matter what kind of deal they make, they would need to eat a vast majority, if not all, of his contract

biglord
06-10-2012, 01:46 AM
his value is whatever someone is will to pay and the cubs paying 90% of whats he's owed is laughable.

WOwolfOL
06-10-2012, 02:20 AM
Yeah the Cubs would be ****ing stupid to do that IMO. Combined with the 15m they pay Miami to let Z pitch and the 5 they paid Boston for taking Byrd that is close to 40 mil they would be paying other teams to use their players.

xabial
06-10-2012, 11:44 AM
Yeah the Cubs would be ****ing stupid to do that IMO. Combined with the 15m they pay Miami to let Z pitch and the 5 they paid Boston for taking Byrd that is close to 40 mil they would be paying other teams to use their players.

The team sucks. If your going to pay Soriano $18M a Year for the next three years, to underperform, why not trade him to a team which could use his 25-30 Home Runs, and pay nearly his whole Salary. You'll get a decent prospect or two, rather then pay him $18M a year for him to play on your team and be Jack Cust.

Its the most aggressive way of GMing. But Its the only way to get something back, for something worth practically Nothing.

Money's no problem for the Cubs they annually have payrolls in the $132-$142M Range, with horrible losing seasons but yet the fans still show up. The Prospect netted for Zombrano wasn't bad at the time, but so far he's been a bust. Oh well, at least he's under team control for the next 5 years, instead of paying Zombrano $18M for one year, and risk losing him to FA (Cubs werent going to be aggressive in resigning him because of field-issues) Trade him and get something for him, and they did just that. I'd rather a Prospect over one year of Zombrano ANY DAY. (And I'm sure most Cubs fans would agree with me here)

FYI Bryd was cut by the Red Sox. Thats how bad he was. But Since the Cubs were willing to eat up his whole Salary, hey got two good prospects back, instead of paying Bryd $6M in his last year of his contract for .200 hitting.

Its a Genius Way Of GMing to Trade Players worth a Bag of Basketballs, for decent value.

WOwolfOL
06-10-2012, 01:26 PM
Well practically all reports say there is no team interested still anyways so I guess what he's doing isn't gonna matter. But the Cubs got Chris Volstad for Z. That guy is **** and always will be ****. They got Michael Bowden and Hunter Cervenka for Byrd and they already DFA'd Bowden, his stuff is so mediocre anyways, and Cervenka is very interesting but he's not age-appropriate for his league really. However he's a lefty and may turn into something nice.

But Soriano is on another level since switching to the lighter bat, one of the best hitters in the league, in fact.

May: 944 OPS/301 ISO/401 wOBA/150 wRC+
June: 1.202/500/493/212 wRC+

I have a hard time believing teams aren't interested in that.

xabial
06-10-2012, 02:41 PM
Well practically all reports say there is no team interested still anyways so I guess what he's doing isn't gonna matter. But the Cubs got Chris Volstad for Z. That guy is **** and always will be ****. They got Michael Bowden and Hunter Cervenka for Byrd and they already DFA'd Bowden, his stuff is so mediocre anyways, and Cervenka is very interesting but he's not age-appropriate for his league really. However he's a lefty and may turn into something nice.

But Soriano is on another level since switching to the lighter bat, one of the best hitters in the league, in fact.

May: 944 OPS/301 ISO/401 wOBA/150 wRC+
June: 1.202/500/493/212 wRC+

I have a hard time believing teams aren't interested in that.

Lmao, I don't buy these "reports" either.

Believe me Teams are interested.

Its Just a matter of How Much are the Cubs going to pay of his $18M Salary in '12, $18M Salary in '13, and $18M Saary in 14'. (*Shudders*)

And what Prospects are teams going to Give up for a DH who bats .250-.260ish but still nets you 25-30 Home Runs year after year?. He's already 36, too so teams have to ask themselves.. Will he become a Wells at ages 37 and 38?

Personally, I'd trade for him. I'm a Big Fan Of him regarding how he can be utilized to help your team. Sometimes I want to be a GM for this reason. He's out there ready to help offensively starving Teams Like the the A's, and Mariners, or the Yankees Who even need Outfield Help.

Is he the Player he once Was? No. But he's still useful. If Cubs are willing to eat almost all his salary I'd give them a one maybe two Decent, but Not Elite Prospects. Just comes Down to How much money are they willing to Pay for him to play for another Team. Lol.

Eg714
06-10-2012, 03:03 PM
Vernon wells

sf-fanatic
06-10-2012, 03:52 PM
Soriano has played good defense this year...really?

His defense singlehandedly caused the cubs to lose 2 games to the giants in that series alone.

1908_Cubs
06-10-2012, 04:25 PM
Soriano has played good defense this year...really?

His defense singlehandedly caused the cubs to lose 2 games to the giants in that series alone.

Advanced defensive metrics are your friend.

sf-fanatic
06-10-2012, 04:39 PM
Advanced defensive metrics are your friend.

Didn't really bother to check before I posted. Just checked and hes been decent. He still has brain farts like throwing to the wrong base and letting a runner score from first on a single, misjudges balls quite often, and takes some of the worst routes to the ball ive ever seen from a LF.

1908_Cubs
06-10-2012, 05:17 PM
Didn't really bother to check before I posted. Just checked and hes been decent. He still has brain farts like throwing to the wrong base and letting a runner score from first on a single, misjudges balls quite often, and takes some of the worst routes to the ball ive ever seen from a LF.

He isn't perfect but he has been much improved.

Mitchell133
06-10-2012, 05:23 PM
Pay his entire contract and the Jays will take him.

JB0B0
06-10-2012, 07:03 PM
I believe the cubs said they're willing to eat 90% of his contract.

jawjr13
06-10-2012, 07:11 PM
I believe the cubs said they're willing to eat 90% of his contract.

Does that mean 90% of this year or 90% of all that's left on his deal?

xabial
06-10-2012, 07:20 PM
Does that mean 90% of this year or 90% of all that's left on his deal?


I read that too. 90% of whats left on his deal, or very close. Last I read their willing to eat $40MM-$45MM of whats remaining on his contract.

His contract is really simple. He only gets paid $18M annually.

Here's his contract Break Down.

$18M in 2012 (This year), $18M in 2013. (Next Year), and $18M in 2014 (The Year after that). That means at the beginning of this season he had $56M and three years remaining on his deal.

To Put that into perspective that means If the Cubs Pay $40M, the Team receiving Soriano Will be paying him $5.3M for the duration of his contract instead of $18MM yearly he was owed.

If Cubs Pay $45MM, the Team with Alfonso Soriano will have to Pay Him a measly $3.6M a year for the duration of his contract, instead of the $18MM yearly.

BcEuAbRsS
06-10-2012, 07:32 PM
I'm sure the Cubs will be expecting a decent prospect back if they do indeed pay 90% of his deal...

Yagyu+
06-10-2012, 08:00 PM
I'm not going to speculate one way or another, but during the off-season the Cubs were seeking something along the lines of a reclamation starter/starting pitching prospect in return for Soriano, and that was with picking up a smaller portion of his salary.

JB0B0
06-10-2012, 08:29 PM
With the way Sori is playing, I'd like to think Theo would want a decent prospect in return. I could see the Cubs packaging Dempster and Sori to Detroit: both would fill needs for the Tigers and they could send back one of their better prospects.

Jeffy25
06-10-2012, 08:41 PM
Nothing. You could designate him and I doubt anyone would even claim him, unless Tony Regains gets a GM job again.

Jeffy25
06-10-2012, 08:45 PM
Advanced defensive metrics are your friend.

-0.1 dWAR

1 DRS

If anything, he has been neutral defensively this year, and since being with the Cubs, his defense overall has been pretty awful.

onlythisfar41
06-10-2012, 08:59 PM
There are definitely some teams interested but like others have said, it all depends on how much contract the Cubs are willing to eat. If this is about a straight salary dump for the Cubs not only will they get nothing in return but they will still have to eat some of that contract.

Well see what happens as it gets closer to the deadline and we start hearing some concrete rumors.

Driven
06-10-2012, 09:59 PM
Why in the blue hell would the Cubs do that? Soriano has about two years left on his deal, I think.. Crawford has, what? Five?
Carl Crawford won a Gold Glove in 2010

Jeffy25
06-10-2012, 10:41 PM
soriano for carl crawford???

And 65 million

1908_Cubs
06-10-2012, 11:47 PM
-0.1 dWAR

1 DRS

If anything, he has been neutral defensively this year, and since being with the Cubs, his defense overall has been pretty awful.

He's a career 67.2 UZR LF'er. He's had one negative UZR season. His RNG is always very high.

Sure he's prone to errors, however he's been actually an above average defender of his career. And very good this season.

I'm also not a big fan of dWAR, however, as I don't like TZR. And this isn't me against it simply because it's hurting my point, as I just don't like it to begin with.

UZR > TZR anyday of the year. Using fangraphs defensive ratings, his FLD has been positive every season except 2009 for the Cubs. I still agree, he has very little value (I still think if the Cubs eat 90% of his salary, he'll bring back a low a ball prospect with a little upside, as I think he's proving this season he's got a wee bit of action left in the bat). And I would also agree SSS, his UZR is a little high right now. But he's been anything but a negative defender in his time in Chicago.

xabial
06-11-2012, 12:36 AM
He's a career 67.2 UZR LF'er. He's had one negative UZR season. His RNG is always very high.

Sure he's prone to errors, however he's been actually an above average defender of his career. And very good this season.

I'm also not a big fan of dWAR, however, as I don't like TZR. And this isn't me against it simply because it's hurting my point, as I just don't like it to begin with.

UZR > TZR anyday of the year. Using fangraphs defensive ratings, his FLD has been positive every season except 2009 for the Cubs. I still agree, he has very little value (I still think if the Cubs eat 90% of his salary, he'll bring back a low a ball prospect with a little upside, as I think he's proving this season he's got a wee bit of action left in the bat). And I would also agree SSS, his UZR is a little high right now. But he's been anything but a negative defender in his time in Chicago.

Great Post.

Jeffy25
06-11-2012, 12:37 AM
He was awful at second base throughout his career btw (-38 runs saved in 6700 innings)

Negative 26 runs saved in 2005 (yikes)

In his first year in left in Washington he saved 18 runs
The next year, his first with the Cubs, he saved 17.

In the 4500 innings since, he has cost the Cubs 34 runs defensively by playing in left. The positive UZR that you are seeing is all arm and range, and his arm and range are both quickly diminishing. Both are still positives, but barely. He is down to basically neutral in both categories at this point.

He is not a good defensive ball player, the only metric that likes him is UZR, nothing else does, and he is clearly declining in left.

Either way, he has no trade value unless the Cubs eat 80-100% of his remaining 45 million.

1908_Cubs
06-11-2012, 12:48 AM
He was awful at second base throughout his career btw (-38 runs saved in 6700 innings)

Negative 26 runs saved in 2005 (yikes)

In his first year in left in Washington he saved 18 runs
The next year, his first with the Cubs, he saved 17.

In the 4500 innings since, he has cost the Cubs 34 runs defensively by playing in left. The positive UZR that you are seeing is all arm and range, and his arm and range are both quickly diminishing. Both are still positives, but barely. He is down to basically neutral in both categories at this point.

He is not a good defensive ball player, the only metric that likes him is UZR, nothing else does, and he is clearly declining in left.

Either way, he has no trade value unless the Cubs eat 80-100% of his remaining 45 million.

Well you can't really discount his positive ability with his arm and his range. Those are extremely key components. Saying that is like saying about a hitter "well his only two attributes are contact and power". Again, he's always been prone to mental lapses/errors but his positive UZR score makes him a slightly above average defender out there. Also he's obviously not down to neutral yet as his RNG and his UZR are still very high. And were above average last season as well. He'll get to neutral eventually, but he's not there quite yet. I agree, though, his value is as a DH, not as a fielder going forward.

Secondly, his numbers at 2b are simply meaningless to everything. He sucked there. We know that. He'll never play another inning there.

Lastly, agreed on his value. But he does have some value. To a team like, say, Baltimore, who could use another bat, especially in the DH hole. The Cubs wont get any good return, and they will be eating salary, but there will be teams who look for him. Honestly, as a discounted DH, and your team is only paying him $3.5-$4m in salary, he's not worthless. He's not a prime option, but as a budget option, he should carry weight.

Jeffy25
06-11-2012, 12:56 AM
Secondly, his numbers at 2b are simply meaningless to everything. He sucked there. We know that. He'll never play another inning there.
I only said that because I thought you said he has always been a pretty good fielder.



Lastly, agreed on his value. But he does have some value. To a team like, say, Baltimore, who could use another bat, especially in the DH hole. The Cubs wont get any good return, and they will be eating salary, but there will be teams who look for him. Honestly, as a discounted DH, and your team is only paying him $3.5-$4m in salary, he's not worthless. He's not a prime option, but as a budget option, he should carry weight.

Yeah, I agree.

1908_Cubs
06-11-2012, 01:03 AM
I only said that because I thought you said he has always been a pretty good fielder.




Yeah, I agree.

Oh when I say "good fielder" I should have made it clear as a LF'er. As a 2b he's god awful. Perhaps a benchmark of how bad a player truly can be at a position.

Havoc Wreaker
06-11-2012, 01:51 AM
A bag of chips

When I read the threat title this was the first response that popped into my mind

:clap:

ChrisSabo17
06-11-2012, 02:08 AM
Some Big League Chew! (Gum)

StrandedCub
06-11-2012, 03:27 AM
When I read the threat title this was the first response that popped into my mind

:clap:

Creative.

Pinstripe pride
06-11-2012, 09:48 AM
1 hamburger with a preformance option for cheese

adab
06-11-2012, 10:18 AM
The general consensus seems to be that Soriano has no value. Quite simply, even at 10% of his contract cost, he's not worth the money. Maybe if the Cubs picked up the entire contract and paid a team to take him, you might get the worst player in A ball as fair value.

gaughan333
06-11-2012, 11:44 AM
The general consensus seems to be that Soriano has no value. Quite simply, even at 10% of his contract cost, he's not worth the money. Maybe if the Cubs picked up the entire contract and paid a team to take him, you might get the worst player in A ball as fair value.

quality post...shows you truly understand baseball

Rush
06-11-2012, 01:11 PM
Soriano has played good defense this year...really?

His defense singlehandedly caused the cubs to lose 2 games to the giants in that series alone.

He was fighting an injury during that series. He wasn't 100%.

Illinirob83
06-11-2012, 05:59 PM
He's been good this year. He still is a slugger, always has been during this horrible contract. If the Cubs ate a large majority of the deal he would be attractive because he can hit the ball hard, and that hasn't changed. The Cubs shouldn't move him for the sake of moving him. Even as a platoon LFer his final two years of his deal is > paying off most of the contract and not getting a quality prospect in return, it's not like he's Zambrano in the clubhouse, the players all like him and he works extremely hard.