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chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 10:14 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

Raps18-19 Champ
05-14-2012, 10:18 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.


A Most Valuable Player (MVP) award is an honor typically bestowed upon the best performing player or players on a specific team, in an entire league, or for a particular contest or series of contests. The National Basketball Association Most Valuable Player (MVP) is an annual National Basketball Association (NBA) award given since the 1955–56 NBA season to the best performing player of the season.

Example: Lebron James' 2011-2012.

So it considers the best performing player in the league, regardless of teams.

Wikipedia's not the best source but it sure as hell is more reliable than your definition.

KnicksorBust
05-14-2012, 10:21 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

You answered your own question.

The MVP is a subjective award. The criteria is limitted and the validity of candidates change at the whims of the voters. I don't understand this belief that LeBron should be except from the award because the Heat would be good without him. How does that make him less valid? You truly believe even if he averaged 50-10-10 that he shouldn't win because the Heat have Wade and Bosh?

1-800-STFU
05-14-2012, 10:21 AM
He had one of the better years in NBA history.

He is the MVP.

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 10:26 AM
See I wish the Wikipedia definition made more sense, because as fans we always talk about the meaning of MVP and I think for the most part we decide it should go to the person who meant the most to their team in that particular season.. I just believe lebrona numbers were phenomenal but how do you say he meant so much to Miami when Dwayne wade was there performing at such an extreme level as well. Let's not forget bosh..

Becks2307
05-14-2012, 10:27 AM
If you really have this much of a problem, you should take it up with the NBA. This doesn't have anything to do with PSD

natelpete
05-14-2012, 10:27 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

You act like MVP is decided by the members of PSD..

Big Zo
05-14-2012, 10:33 AM
What is it about PSD that makes people create the same thread?

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 10:34 AM
A chicago fan saying Lebron doesn't deserve MVP,quit hating anybody who knows basketball will tell you Lebron should have won MVP.Who else will make another Lebron thread bashing him.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 10:36 AM
hater

daleja424
05-14-2012, 10:37 AM
See I wish the Wikipedia definition made more sense, because as fans we always talk about the meaning of MVP and I think for the most part we decide it should go to the person who meant the most to their team in that particular season.. I just believe lebrona numbers were phenomenal but how do you say he meant so much to Miami when Dwayne wade was there performing at such an extreme level as well. Let's not forget bosh..

so then Rose shouldn't have won it last year right? B/c his team got the #1 seed without him playing most of the year this year. In fact...they were 18-9 without him this year (.666 winning %)... so he must not be terribly valuable to his team or the league :confused:

celtNYpatsHeels
05-14-2012, 10:37 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

Well as a Bulls fan, you should understand that the MVP goes to the best player on a top 2-3 team. See Rose, Derrick. While I agree with your translation of most VALUABLE player, that is not what the award is.

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 10:37 AM
Last few posts are what I meant by unintelligent posters. Eh really guys. I am not a hater or being a homer. Derrick rose did not deserve MVP! That what you want to hear? Happy.. I'm not afraid to say it. I love Lebron as a player. I think he was incredible. But I don't believe he was the most valuable to his team. This post was regarding you psd posters and why you always believe Lebron is deserving. You can't sit there and have a intellectual conversation, but have to just bash the op and claim Lebron the king. Pathetic

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 10:38 AM
Swept out of the first round. :rolleyes:

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 10:39 AM
See I wish the Wikipedia definition made more sense, because as fans we always talk about the meaning of MVP and I think for the most part we decide it should go to the person who meant the most to their team in that particular season.. I just believe lebrona numbers were phenomenal but how do you say he meant so much to Miami when Dwayne wade was there performing at such an extreme level as well. Let's not forget bosh..

so then Rose shouldn't have won it last year right? B/c his team got the #1 seed without him playing most of the year this year. In fact...they were 18-9 without him this year (.666 winning %)... so he must not be terribly valuable to his team or the league :confused:

Swept out of the first round :rolleyes:

Big Zo
05-14-2012, 10:40 AM
Swept out of the first round :rolleyes:

Regular season award. :rolleyes:

Noah also out. :rolleyes:

daleja424
05-14-2012, 10:42 AM
so who exactly do you think "deserves" MVP under your "criteria"?

(And for the record... the Bulls did not get swept as you well know... They lost a close series to a tough 76ers team that spent most of the season as a top 4 seed before having a bad finish... and a 76ers team that is giving Boston fits as well)

Cal827
05-14-2012, 10:44 AM
To the OP, I'm curious: Who would you have selected for MVP for the past two seasons (since you also said Rose didn't deserve it)?

THE_G.O.A.T.
05-14-2012, 10:51 AM
I think D-Wade and Bosh look LeBron look better than he actaully is.

THE GIPPER
05-14-2012, 10:55 AM
Wade and Bosh missed 26 games combined this season so the old "Lebron isnt the most valuable player because of his team mates" argument doesnt work.

meloman1592
05-14-2012, 10:56 AM
so who's your mvp?

RiLoc
05-14-2012, 10:58 AM
There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man.Top 5 in voting were LeBron, Durant, CP3, Kobe and Parker. I don't think it's realistic to think anyone outside those 5 would win. You need to have a great season on a team with a great record. Even if there are 7 guys who mean more to their team it doesn't matter, those are the 5 you can realistically choose from.

Out of those 5 guys, I think CP3 probably means the most to his team. That being said, all five of those teams rely heavily on their MVP candidate. I do think MVP voters take the importance of the player to their team aspect into consideration, but CP3's edge wasn't great enough to overcome the all around great season LeBron had.

(snip) This is not a troll thread (...) you all are so naive (snip) That sentence just struck me as funny.

Last few posts are what I meant by unintelligent posters. Eh really guys. I am not a hater (snip)If the thread is about why MVP voting is missing the point, I think a thread not mentioning LeBron in the title and/or a less insulting OP would've garnered more serious responses.

Ill21
05-14-2012, 10:58 AM
MVP should go to the best player and this year it was LeBron.

Algmuskrats
05-14-2012, 10:59 AM
Lebron lead his team in PPG APG and RPG for a #2 seed. Sounds like an MVP too me.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 11:00 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

you're right to make up for it derrick rose should be stripped of last years mvp and the award given to dwight howard

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 11:00 AM
so who exactly do you think "deserves" MVP under your "criteria"?

(And for the record... the Bulls did not get swept as you well know... They lost a close series to a tough 76ers team that spent most of the season as a top 4 seed before having a bad finish... and a 76ers team that is giving Boston fits as well)

Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

KaganRS
05-14-2012, 11:01 AM
They need to have two awards.

MVP for most important to the team.

MOP for most outstanding player.

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 11:02 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

you're right to make up for it derrick rose should be stripped of last years mvp and the award given to dwight howard

Good contribution.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 11:04 AM
Good contribution.

Thanks.

natelpete
05-14-2012, 11:19 AM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

You are insane

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 11:23 AM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

You are insane

How the hell could saying any of those guys are more important to their team be considered insane

daleja424
05-14-2012, 11:45 AM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

haha...

First off, KObe, Parker, Paul, and Durant all have a TON of help around them... so to think one of them deserve it but not Lebron is just foolish.

Second of all... I cant believe you even mentioned Nash or Love. If you dont even make your team a top 16 team in this league...how on earth can you possibly be the most valuable. Even when Wade, Lebron, or Kobe had crap teams they still made the playoffs at least.

nothappyinut
05-14-2012, 11:49 AM
If you look at supporting cast then Jordan would of never won it. He arguable had some of the best overall teams of all time. As well as magic Kareem bird ect.. If you give it to someone like say Nash yet he's team doesn't make the playoffs then what makes him so important they still lost!!! I think you could pick at least one player from every team and call them the "teams MVP" and without them they'd lose a bunch. Doesn't make them the league MVP!!!!

nickdymez
05-14-2012, 11:52 AM
I thought Tony Parker should have gotten MVP. Then CP3 a close second.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 11:52 AM
Last few posts are what I meant by unintelligent posters. Eh really guys. I am not a hater or being a homer. Derrick rose did not deserve MVP! That what you want to hear? Happy.. I'm not afraid to say it. I love Lebron as a player. I think he was incredible. But I don't believe he was the most valuable to his team. This post was regarding you psd posters and why you always believe Lebron is deserving. You can't sit there and have a intellectual conversation, but have to just bash the op and claim Lebron the king. Pathetic

Let me ask you this question,if Lebron didn't deserve to win MVP then who would you have voted for?

If you love Lebron so much you wouldn't have made this thread,your'e basically baiting people to find a reason why Lebron doesn't deserve MVP.Did you create a thread when Drose won his MVP?I don't think you did so quit hating.

1-800-STFU
05-14-2012, 11:53 AM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

lol

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 12:00 PM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

Really Nash,Kobe,Love,and lol Pierce deserve MVP over Lebron,im suprised you didn't throw Drose in the conversation.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 12:04 PM
How the hell could saying any of those guys are more important to their team be considered insane

awkward moment when pierce wasn't even most valuable on his own team

natelpete
05-14-2012, 12:06 PM
How the hell could saying any of those guys are more important to their team be considered insane

It's the league MVP. Maybe each team has their own cute little ceremony for who was most valuable on their respective teams, for moral sake. If it was the "Who Is Most Important To Their Team" award, Ricky Rubio would be getting first place votes.

Even though you may despise Lebron James, you cannot deny that he was far and away the best player in the NBA this past season. Don't let your hate blind you, you're just lying to yourself.

NoahH
05-14-2012, 12:15 PM
G t f o

FreakaNashur
05-14-2012, 12:16 PM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

some people are in this world are just idiots.

Boston-Born
05-14-2012, 12:17 PM
See I wish the Wikipedia definition made more sense, because as fans we always talk about the meaning of MVP and I think for the most part we decide it should go to the person who meant the most to their team in that particular season.. I just believe lebrona numbers were phenomenal but how do you say he meant so much to Miami when Dwayne wade was there performing at such an extreme level as well. Let's not forget bosh..

So based off your definition, Gerald Henderson (or Augustine, Thomas, Walker) of the Bobcats should be in the conversation, maybe even win, since he is the most important player on that team.

JasonJohnHorn
05-14-2012, 12:19 PM
I agree. There is no doubt that LBJ is the best individual player in the league, but take him away from Miami, and the Heat are still a playoff team. Take CP3 out of the Clipper's line up, and they are a lottery team. CP3 is more valuable to the Clippers than LBJ is to the Heat.

They should have two awards really, one for the best overall player, and one for the most VALUABLE player. They use to give out an award for the player with the best stats, but they discontinued the award. I think it was called the IMB award, essentially went to the best 'fantasy' player. Hakeem and Robinson won it a lot, I think Barkley and Malone and Rodman each got one or two. It award points for rebounding and assists... funny thing, Jordan only finished first for that award twice.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Award

That's a link that explains how the award works. I think LBJ would win it every year the way he puts up numbers, and CP3 should have won the MVP.

TheIlladelph16
05-14-2012, 12:20 PM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

Kobe has a top 2 center and a top 2-3 PF on his team, Parker has the deepest/most balanced team in the league, Love couldn't even get his team to the playoffs, and Pierce is honestly laughable as an MVP choice. How can you honestly discount what Lebron is doing because he has Wade and Bosh while still touting that Kobe, Parker, and Durant deserve it more with their supporting casts?

The ONLY one on that list who I remotely can agree on is Chris Paul. He turned that team from one of the worst in the league last year to second round playoff team. Lebron still had the best year of anyone and Miami would not be close to the team they are now without him.

Also if you want people to take your topic seriously and not immediately consider you a troll, you might want to think about a title like "MVP Discussion" rather than blindly hating on Lebron in the title.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 12:30 PM
I agree. There is no doubt that LBJ is the best individual player in the league, but take him away from Miami, and the Heat are still a playoff team. Take CP3 out of the Clipper's line up, and they are a lottery team. CP3 is more valuable to the Clippers than LBJ is to the Heat.

They should have two awards really, one for the best overall player, and one for the most VALUABLE player. They use to give out an award for the player with the best stats, but they discontinued the award. I think it was called the IMB award, essentially went to the best 'fantasy' player. Hakeem and Robinson won it a lot, I think Barkley and Malone and Rodman each got one or two. It award points for rebounding and assists... funny thing, Jordan only finished first for that award twice.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Award

That's a link that explains how the award works. I think LBJ would win it every year the way he puts up numbers, and CP3 should have won the MVP.

last year, take rose of the bulls still a playoff team take dwight off the magic lottery i think when you figure out the mvp award is a media award and given to which ever star brings up the best storyline than you will understand better

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 12:33 PM
Can we close this thread now,chi town is not that bright upstairs.

The Flash
05-14-2012, 12:35 PM
So why was Rose MVP last year then?

miller74
05-14-2012, 12:57 PM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.


He def deserved it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFGDCxKfBUY

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 12:58 PM
Atleast I'm getting some good responses back. Ok 1) I said rose didn't deserve it last year, Dwight did. 2) tony Parker, Chris Paul, and Steve Nash are all more deserving of the MVP AWARD this season than Lebron James. I stay strong on that statement, and rather than calling me an idiot and leaving, please explain your opinion.

Fnom11
05-14-2012, 12:58 PM
Yes, Derrick Rose deserved to win this years MVP too, chi-townlove1.

boolish
05-14-2012, 01:17 PM
yes. bron was Unanimous MVP, deserved it, and this is indeed, a troll thread.

Stinkyoutsider
05-14-2012, 01:22 PM
Why are we punishing Lebron for playing with the Heat? Wade is great and Bosh is good, but Lebron is the glue that holds that team together. He lead his team in scoring, rebounds, and assists, 3 very important areas. And, lets not forget that the Heat feed off of Lebron's energy. DWade might have some monster games but most of the time, it's Lebron who sets the table for these guys. He impacts the game in so many areas.

I'm a life long Bulls fan and even I can admit that Lebron deserves it (even though it makes me sick).

The MVP is understood to be the best player on the best team. That's what the sports journalists believe anyway...

THE MTL
05-14-2012, 01:29 PM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.


Yes, Bron has Wade and Bosh, but look at his record without the two of them playing. I think the Heat are still like 7-1 in those scenarios. He still wins games without his homies.

Plus, he statistically had one of the best NBA seasons of all time. He fully deserved it.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 01:43 PM
Atleast I'm getting some good responses back. Ok 1) I said rose didn't deserve it last year, Dwight did. 2) tony Parker, Chris Paul, and Steve Nash are all more deserving of the MVP AWARD this season than Lebron James. I stay strong on that statement, and rather than calling me an idiot and leaving, please explain your opinion.

How can you say Nash and Love deserve the MVP more than Lebron when they can't even lead their team to the playoffs,if you are that valuable you should be good enough to lead your team to the playoffs.If Drose would have won the MVP you would never had made this thread.

TheIlladelph16
05-14-2012, 01:51 PM
Atleast I'm getting some good responses back. Ok 1) I said rose didn't deserve it last year, Dwight did. 2) tony Parker, Chris Paul, and Steve Nash are all more deserving of the MVP AWARD this season than Lebron James. I stay strong on that statement, and rather than calling me an idiot and leaving, please explain your opinion.

Well if you don't want people calling you that then you will need to back up your opinions with more than "Parker, Paul, and Nash deserved it more" and give us statistical facts as to why. Nash did not even get his team to the playoffs. It was a bad roster which he made much better, but I'm fairly certain there hasn't been an MVP that didn't even make the playoffs.

Give us some statistics on why Parker deserves it more than Lebron. Paul is your only reasonable argument, but Lebron still led his team in Points, Rebounds, Assists and had a historic statistical season (His best season ever).

Law25
05-14-2012, 02:11 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks

Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:

MonroeFAN
05-14-2012, 02:14 PM
some people are in this world are just idiots.

;)

Law25
05-14-2012, 02:16 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks

Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:

This part was alittle of a overreaction :D

MonroeFAN
05-14-2012, 02:18 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks

Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:

KD played a minute more per game, it's safe to say that based on the averages Lebron could have scored .9 more PPG, and grabbed .1 more rpg. Lebron destroyed Durant in A:TO, and in mostly every cat outside of blocks. The guy scored 27 points on 50+% shooting for crying out loud, it's one of the best seasons of all time.

KD will have plenty of MVP's in the future, and if anyone had an argument this year it was him. But Lebron was simply amazing, I don't see how you could disagree.

KB-Pau-DH2012
05-14-2012, 02:23 PM
yes. bron was Unanimous MVP, deserved it, and this is indeed, a troll thread.
Incorrect, unanimous MVP means every voter voting LeBron for first place. There has been no unanimous MVP in league history. The closest was Shaq in 2000, and that was because of only one....only one dumbass voter.

Heatcheck
05-14-2012, 02:25 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks



Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:


Not only does he have almost twice as many assists, but he is better and MUCH more versatile Durant defensively.

Durant had a great year though

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 02:25 PM
Well if you don't want people calling you that then you will need to back up your opinions with more than "Parker, Paul, and Nash deserved it more" and give us statistical facts as to why. Nash did not even get his team to the playoffs. It was a bad roster which he made much better, but I'm fairly certain there hasn't been an MVP that didn't even make the playoffs.

Give us some statistics on why Parker deserves it more than Lebron. Paul is your only reasonable argument, but Lebron still led his team in Points, Rebounds, Assists and had a historic statistical season (His best season ever).

Trust me Chi town has no good reason to why Nash,Paul,Love deserve the MVP more than Lebron.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 02:26 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks

Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:

so what your're saying is durant had better stats?

mightybosstone
05-14-2012, 02:37 PM
Fail thread is fail...

SB75
05-14-2012, 02:40 PM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

Dude you either don't realize what LBJ meas to the Heat or you are over rating D-Wade! Ask the cavs what LBJ ment. Went from best record in the NBA to the worst with the same team minus LBJ.

I do agree with the point you started with..... MVP means Most valuable not best! But you lost it when you brought up MJ. MJ won it because he was the best not because he was the most valusble! Chi went to the play-offs the year after he retired the first time.

natelpete
05-14-2012, 02:49 PM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.


awkward moment when pierce wasn't even most valuable on his own team

lol :D

Kobe2324
05-14-2012, 02:51 PM
Crazyness, nobody hates Lebron more than me and he is the clear winner and here is why. To me 4 things determine and MVP and not in any specific order 1. Stats 2. Team Record 3. what conferance they play in and 4. How good is that team if you remove that player. Lebron had the better stats overall, durant had the better team record but only by one game, Durant plays in the harder conferance but where I think the biggest diferance is if you take Lebron away from miami they maybe sneak into the playoffs and only because its the East. Take Durant out and I think they make the playoffs in the west which is a much tougher conferance. So overall OKC has a much better team but only finished on game ahead, Lebron had the better stats and is more valuable to his team...I hate Lebron but I think he was the clear winner, would not have been overly shocked if Durant won it but I would have been surprised.

naps
05-14-2012, 03:10 PM
If anything Derrick Rose never deserved his MVP. That was one of the most laughable MVP of choices of all time. He got that by default since that was the year LeBron was hated most because of his decision. MVP is a regular season award and Bulls still had the best record with Rose missing half the season this year. His impact was waaaaaay overrated and he exactly didn't have the MVP stats.

naps
05-14-2012, 03:18 PM
Oklahoma City Thunder 47-19
Kevin Durant
28pts
8.0rebs
3.5ast
1.17blks
1.3stls

Miami Heat 46-20
LeBron James
27.1pts
7.9rebs
6.2ast
1.8stls
0.81blks

Kevind Durant's team had a better season by one game, and he beats Lebron in 3 of the 5 major categories. Can someone plaese explain how LeBron still got MVP. Its begining to fell like the only criteria for MVP is now first name must be Lebron, and second name must be James :facepalm:

LMFAO! PER game stats mean very little. LeBron was more efficient.

LeBron: 0.298 WS/48, 30.7 PER
Durant: 0.230 WS/48, 26.2 PER

See the difference?

Now tell me do you understand what defense means? LeBron James was a legit candidate for DPOY. He's the best perimeter defender on the planet and most versatile defender in the league by far. Durant's defense doesn't sniff Lebron's.


Try next time.

Sactown
05-14-2012, 03:18 PM
Lebron takes pressure off of Wade, keeping him fresher come playoff time, and also might add some longevity to his career. Wade takes about half as many hits now that Lebron is on his team... So yeah, he's valuable just in that aspect

Law25
05-14-2012, 03:34 PM
KD played a minute more per game, it's safe to say that based on the averages Lebron could have scored .9 more PPG, and grabbed .1 more rpg. Lebron destroyed Durant in A:TO, and in mostly every cat outside of blocks. The guy scored 27 points on 50+% shooting for crying out loud, it's one of the best seasons of all time.

KD will have plenty of MVP's in the future, and if anyone had an argument this year it was him. But Lebron was simply amazing, I don't see how you could disagree.

I dig what your saying but you can also say Lebron could have missed one more shot per game and he could have had one more turnover per game, it goes both ways.

KnicksTape
05-14-2012, 03:43 PM
A chicago fan saying Lebron doesn't deserve MVP,quit hating anybody who knows basketball will tell you Lebron should have won MVP.Who else will make another Lebron thread bashing him.

Holy **** you are one ignorant tool. EVERY thread that mentions Lebron you freak out and say everyone is a hater not to mention the only intelligent words you come up with is Lebron is a beast! LOL Not everyone is hating, get that through your tiny brain. The OP clearly stated that he thinks Lebron is the best player in the NBA and had phenomenal numbers but wasnt the most valuable player to his team in his opinion since they had bosh and wade doing just as good. No one is bashing your baby, grow up and look at things like a smart human being next time.

effen5
05-14-2012, 03:49 PM
If anything Derrick Rose never deserved his MVP. That was one of the most laughable MVP of choices of all time. He got that by default since that was the year LeBron was hated most because of his decision. MVP is a regular season award and Bulls still had the best record with Rose missing half the season this year. His impact was waaaaaay overrated and he exactly didn't have the MVP stats.

:facepalm:

Boozer and Noah missed a ton of games last year and this year Boozer missed none and Noah missed maybe 5.

So please shut the **** up about Rose not being deserving of the award.

It was Rose with Taj Bogans Kurt Thomas and Deng last year while Bron's ****** *** had Wade and Mr. Raptor.

Seriously people needs to stop comparing Bulls season this year and last year....Our front court was injured last year and people keep forgetting that.

IIISSKiLL
05-14-2012, 04:02 PM
Bad word choice. Didn't literally mean swept, just got wiped out of playoffs. And for me, based on my criteria, I think Nash, Kobe, love, Paul, Parker, Durant(iffy because of harden and westbrook being there), pierce are all better options than Lebron.

you my friend are a ********

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 04:03 PM
:facepalm:

Boozer and Noah missed a ton of games last year and this year Boozer missed none and Noah missed maybe 5.

So please shut the **** up about Rose not being deserving of the award.

It was Rose with Taj Bogans Kurt Thomas and Deng last year while Bron's ****** *** had Wade and Mr. Raptor.

Seriously people needs to stop comparing Bulls season this year and last year....Our front court was injured last year and people keep forgetting that.

:cry:

Law25
05-14-2012, 04:05 PM
LMFAO! PER game stats mean very little. LeBron was more efficient.

LeBron: 0.298 WS/48, 30.7 PER
Durant: 0.230 WS/48, 26.2 PER

See the difference?

Now tell me do you understand what defense means? LeBron James was a legit candidate for DPOY. He's the best perimeter defender on the planet and most versatile defender in the league by far. Durant's defense doesn't sniff Lebron's.


Try next time.

I prefer raw stas because it shows what you did plan and simple. advance stats has to many varibles the can effect them like, if your on the court with a line up that inferrior to the oppositions and is forced to force shots and or plays, or if your coach puts you on the court as a decoy so you pass out the double ,but your teammates dont make shots and it dosent work and the other team makes a runs then you lose the plus and minus game and win shares. Or your playing a player that uses multiple screens and scores. Even though you were screened out the play your defensive rating goes down and if im correct. What if your coach tells you to allow the jumpshot just protect the paint, and the player your guarding gets multiple open shots there goes your rating. Thats only half of the factors to me that effect advance stats to me. Raw stats shows what you did plan and simple.Most advance stats should be used to grade a coaches performance more than anything.

Im not trying anything I asked a question. Are they now using advance stats to determine the MVP? Have they went that far to raise Lebron? I personaly am starting to hate this era of ball. Flopping is out of control, players are no longer judge by championships, but by stats only and everyone is cool with this. You have players worrying more about stats than actualy winning!! and fans are ok with that. Jordan got his numbers not for numbers sake but that is what was needed to win. Kobe the same. People like to say he's only 45+ percent for his career and he takes bad shots. He like the legends past did what was needed to win, he showed this year how little he cared about scoring titles. I didnt mind Durant going for the tittle the last week I would have done the same thats another trophy on the shelf, but is he never wins a tittle he will be another Iverson, just below Greatness where the MJ's, Magics, Russels, Birds, Kobe's, Shaq's, Duncans, Kareems, West, Cousey's, Garnetts, Peirce's, Wade's etc..live, IMO. If Lebron dosent get a tittle he should be listed below Iverson becuase he had way more help in his career, regardless of his stats.

JOhnnyTHaJet
05-14-2012, 04:10 PM
Deron Williams is the most important player on my team, if he wasn't on the Nets we'd be somewhere in Bobcat territory, but does that mean he's the MVP of the league? Not a chance.

YashBoone
05-14-2012, 04:25 PM
I may be the only one, but i agree with this thread. But, we have to understand something....All real integrity and honesty is gone from professional sports in general. It is all a business. And just like any ther business, the guy who brings in the most money is going to win all the accolades.

Lebron did have a fenominal year. But by strick definition, was he the most vaulable person in the nba to his particular team. I dont think so....Maybe in Cleveland when his team won best record then the year he leaves has damn near the worst.
But when you also have arguably the second best player in the world, plus another top 15 in bosh, then there is alot going on there.

Rose is way more valuble to the bulls

Raph12
05-14-2012, 04:38 PM
Jordan didn't deserve the one DPOY he did get, let alone deserve to win it "each and every season"... As for the Most Valuable Player award, until there is a set criteria, there will always be debate as to who is most deserving. Using your definition, it would actually pay to be on a team of crap, as you'd likely be more valuable to your team than a team that is talented.

Next.

mightybosstone
05-14-2012, 04:39 PM
I don't know if anyone else mentioned this in the thread, but has anyone noted that Wade missed 17 games this season and Bosh missed 9. In a shortened 66-game season, having 2 of your 3 biggest stars (on a team with little-no depth) miss a combined 26 games might be extremely damaging. However, the Heat hardly skipped a beat and had the fourth best record in the NBA.

Without Lebron, the Heat are still a good team, but they're probably no better than the Knicks or Sixers in the East and no way are they the leading contenders to go to the Finals.

And when you throw in the fact that Lebron was CLEARLY the best player statistically in the entire NBA this season and one of the four or five most impactful defensive players, there really isn't a contest as to who should have won that award.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 04:40 PM
I may be the only one, but i agree with this thread. But, we have to understand something....All real integrity and honesty is gone from professional sports in general. It is all a business. And just like any ther business, the guy who brings in the most money is going to win all the accolades.

Lebron did have a fenominal year. But by strick definition, was he the most vaulable person in the nba to his particular team. I dont think so....Maybe in Cleveland when his team won best record then the year he leaves has damn near the worst.
But when you also have arguably the second best player in the world, plus another top 15 in bosh, then there is alot going on there.

Rose is way more valuble to the bulls

was rose way more valuable to the bulls this year?

effen5
05-14-2012, 04:41 PM
:cry:

Back to the old justin I see.

effen5
05-14-2012, 04:42 PM
was rose way more valuable to the bulls this year?

In terms of regular season no, in the playoffs absolutely. But this regular season had a healthy front court which alleviated a lot of the pressure for Watson and JL3 unlike last year where the bulls only scorer was rose.

YashBoone
05-14-2012, 05:31 PM
was rose way more valuable to the bulls this year?

Yes....regardless of what happend during the reg. season, you saw what happened when he went down in the playoffs...

Yeah they were winning without him, but a great deal of why they had the best record was because of him.

tapajafri
05-14-2012, 05:38 PM
LOL this thread is so stupid. The thread starter even said "Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players" then wonders why he won the MVP.

atl_braves_fan
05-14-2012, 05:39 PM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.

Most valuable player is an objective measure (i.e. which player produced more value than all other players). What player could possibly produce more value than the player that outperforms all other (i.e. the best player).

Your definition of most valuable player is a subjective definition (i.e. which player produced the most value to his team in his specific circumstance). That would be a great criteria if the award was MVP to his team in his own very specific circumstances. That abbreviation would be too long, though.

KnicksorBust
05-14-2012, 05:40 PM
.

KnicksorBust
05-14-2012, 05:41 PM
I agree. There is no doubt that LBJ is the best individual player in the league, but take him away from Miami, and the Heat are still a playoff team. Take CP3 out of the Clipper's line up, and they are a lottery team. CP3 is more valuable to the Clippers than LBJ is to the Heat.

They should have two awards really, one for the best overall player, and one for the most VALUABLE player. They use to give out an award for the player with the best stats, but they discontinued the award. I think it was called the IMB award, essentially went to the best 'fantasy' player. Hakeem and Robinson won it a lot, I think Barkley and Malone and Rodman each got one or two. It award points for rebounding and assists... funny thing, Jordan only finished first for that award twice.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Award

That's a link that explains how the award works. I think LBJ would win it every year the way he puts up numbers, and CP3 should have won the MVP.

We don't need more awards. That dilutes them. We have all-nba teams for sharing the wealth of a good season. MVP is 1 player every season. That's the way it should be. If you want to interpret it a different way you can but LeBron had the most complete season of any player in league history and his team was a #2. That's all I need to know.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 05:43 PM
LOL this thread is so stupid. The thread starter even said "Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players" then wonders why he won the MVP.

That's chi town for ya,like I said he must not be very bright upstairs.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 05:51 PM
Yes....regardless of what happend during the reg. season, you saw what happened when he went down in the playoffs...

Yeah they were winning without him, but a great deal of why they had the best record was because of him.


im confused arent we talking about the mvp award how can someone who hardly played this year be more valuable this year? if not i really don't know whats the point of adding that last part

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 05:54 PM
Law25 and Chi town should really get together.

Law25 said that Durant beat LeBron in his 5 major statistical categories and completely ignored every other aspect of basketball :laugh2: Then he goes on to say he doesn't like advanced stats guess what Law25 no one cares what you like the entire league uses advanced stats now and every great basketball mind has started using it as analysis to what a player does and doesn't do on the basketball floor.

Stop trying to have a statistical discussion if you're not going to discuss stats.

Chi town :pity:

Paul Pierce wasn't even the most valuable player on his team but you think he deserves the league MVP over LeBron? :laugh2:

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 06:06 PM
I thought Tony Parker should have gotten MVP. Then CP3 a close second.

This.

I dont think anyone expected Spurs to come in first with an aging Duncan. Parker has been insane though. As for the Heat, with what they accomplished the first year they were together. They were expected (if not even better) to achieve the record they did.

Raps18-19 Champ
05-14-2012, 06:07 PM
I prefer raw stas because it shows what you did plan and simple. advance stats has to many varibles the can effect them like, if your on the court with a line up that inferrior to the oppositions and is forced to force shots and or plays, or if your coach puts you on the court as a decoy so you pass out the double ,but your teammates dont make shots and it dosent work and the other team makes a runs then you lose the plus and minus game and win shares. Or your playing a player that uses multiple screens and scores. Even though you were screened out the play your defensive rating goes down and if im correct. What if your coach tells you to allow the jumpshot just protect the paint, and the player your guarding gets multiple open shots there goes your rating. Thats only half of the factors to me that effect advance stats to me. Raw stats shows what you did plan and simple.Most advance stats should be used to grade a coaches performance more than anything.

Im not trying anything I asked a question. Are they now using advance stats to determine the MVP? Have they went that far to raise Lebron? I personaly am starting to hate this era of ball. Flopping is out of control, players are no longer judge by championships, but by stats only and everyone is cool with this. You have players worrying more about stats than actualy winning!! and fans are ok with that. Jordan got his numbers not for numbers sake but that is what was needed to win. Kobe the same. People like to say he's only 45+ percent for his career and he takes bad shots. He like the legends past did what was needed to win, he showed this year how little he cared about scoring titles. I didnt mind Durant going for the tittle the last week I would have done the same thats another trophy on the shelf, but is he never wins a tittle he will be another Iverson, just below Greatness where the MJ's, Magics, Russels, Birds, Kobe's, Shaq's, Duncans, Kareems, West, Cousey's, Garnetts, Peirce's, Wade's etc..live, IMO. If Lebron dosent get a tittle he should be listed below Iverson becuase he had way more help in his career, regardless of his stats.

So basically, because Lebron is getting praised (praise that he actually deserves), you're mad?

:laugh2:

bucketss
05-14-2012, 06:15 PM
This.

I dont think anyone expected Spurs to come in first with an aging Duncan. Parker has been insane though. As for the Heat, with what they accomplished the first year they were together. They were expected (if not even better) to achieve the record they did.

well they did come in first last year aswell

BALLER R
05-14-2012, 06:16 PM
There should be a MVP award and a Most outstanding player award.

Heater4life
05-14-2012, 06:16 PM
I hate Lebron

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 06:18 PM
This.

I dont think anyone expected Spurs to come in first with an aging Duncan. Parker has been insane though. As for the Heat, with what they accomplished the first year they were together. They were expected (if not even better) to achieve the record they did.

That aging Duncan played better this year than he did last year on both ends of the floor when they also came away with the best record in the league.

Exceeding expectations don't make you an MVP. If that was the case KG should have been given one in 08.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 06:25 PM
What I dont like is people taking this civil question and making it vile. Do I think james is mvp? No . Reasons... 1 . Choke more than once this year, while other stars hit gane winners repeatedly at the same time, during same week. Rose Durant Love. These players imo where all viable contenders for the award. So they one upped James. Minus one James. And Roar called James out in a subtle easy aftet back to back games of buzzer beaters
.2. Passed to wade aka jock riding while kobe wanted to make a playoff memory.. Real recognize real , James put on a mask and became Robin and looked for wade ... East lost game btw.

I can go on, but it is wrong to over kill. I can't deny James is one of the best, but this year it was Durant, and I think Durant is no where as good as James yet... Yet.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 06:26 PM
What I dont like is people taking this civil question and making it vile. Do I think james is mvp? No . Reasons... 1 . Choke more than once this year, while other stars hit gane winners repeatedly at the same time, during same week. Rose Durant Love. These players imo where all viable contenders for the award. So they one upped James. Minus one James.
.2. Passed to wade aka jock riding while kobe wanted to make a playoff memory.. Real recognize real , James put on a mask and became Robin and looked for wade ... East lost game btw.

I can go on, but it is wrong to over kill. I can't deny James is one of the best, but this year it was Durant, and I think Durant is no where as good as James yet... Yet.

:bla:

Text book hater

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 06:26 PM
That aging Duncan played better this year than he did last year on both ends of the floor when they also came away with the best record in the league.

Exceeding expectations don't make you an MVP. If that was the case KG should have been given one in 08.
Thats because Duncan did it on the Defensive end, by him losing 20 pounds from last season.

Im not saying its what makes you MVP. However, take Parker away this year from the Spurs, I bet you they dont crack the top 5 seed in the playoffs.
Take Lebron from Heat and their still top 2

mdm692
05-14-2012, 06:31 PM
Paul, durant and parker were all more deserving.

mightybosstone
05-14-2012, 06:34 PM
Paul, durant and parker were all more deserving.

Based on what exactly? Lebron put up superior numbers than those players and it's not even close. I don't understand how anyone can honestly make an argument against Lebron once they've seen the numbers...

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 06:36 PM
Thats because Duncan did it on the Defensive end, by him losing 20 pounds from last season.

Great so lets not forget that and act as if TD aged and got worse. He was better in all facets.

Im not saying its what makes you MVP. However, take Parker away this year from the Spurs, I bet you they dont crack the top 5 seed in the playoffs.
Take Lebron from Heat and their still top 2[/QUOTE]

LeBron led his team is PPG, APG, RPG and SPG. Dwyane Wade missed 17 games and Bosh missed 9 you honestly think they'd be the 2nd after missing all that? So basically what you're trying to say is that LeBron isn't really that valuable in the very least.

No way the Heat are the #2 seed in the East with their best player gone, Wade missing a huge chunk of games (starting very poorly as well). LeBron made that defense and that's their strongest point. The Heat would be between a 4-7 seed this season had it not be for LeBron.

Also if that's your criteria for MVP taking nothing else into consideration then Dwight Howard should have won last season and Kevin Love should have been 2nd to Parker this season if not taking it away from him.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 06:36 PM
What I dont like is people taking this civil question and making it vile. Do I think james is mvp? No . Reasons... 1 . Choke more than once this year, while other stars hit gane winners repeatedly at the same time, during same week. Rose Durant Love. These players imo where all viable contenders for the award. So they one upped James. Minus one James. And Roar called James out in a subtle easy aftet back to back games of buzzer beaters
.2. Passed to wade aka jock riding while kobe wanted to make a playoff memory.. Real recognize real , James put on a mask and became Robin and looked for wade ... East lost game btw.

I can go on, but it is wrong to over kill. I can't deny James is one of the best, but this year it was Durant, and I think Durant is no where as good as James yet... Yet.

so rose is a viable contender but not lebron when rose missed most of the season???????? pftttttttttttttttt and rose didnt choke this year? i remember him missing a couple free throws that would have gave them the win in miami, and i also remember him doing the same thing against the knicks as carmelo sticked daggers on the bulls so rose choked more than once so i guess you shouldnt think of as mvp.




._. please just stop

YashBoone
05-14-2012, 06:36 PM
Yes....regardless of what happend during the reg. season, you saw what happened when he went down in the playoffs...

Yeah they were winning without him, but a great deal of why they had the best record was because of him.


im confused arent we talking about the mvp award how can someone who hardly played this year be more valuable this year? if not i really don't know whats the point of adding that last part

I just made a general statement that rose is more valuable to the bulls then Lebron is to the heat... But I could care less if Lebron wins MVP.... He ain't winning a ring.

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 06:38 PM
Based on what exactly? Lebron put up superior numbers than those players and it's not even close. I don't understand how anyone can honestly make an argument against Lebron once they've seen the numbers...

Thats the problem with the award year after year. the reason they give it to players changes. Someone already posted on here a few pages back, they should just make an MVP (for the most valuable to his team) and one for whos the best player in general. It does kind of sound stupid but its the truth when one year someone gets it for being so valuable to their team (Steve Nash a few years ago over Kobe averaging 35ppg) when the next year its someone who just had the better stats.

YashBoone
05-14-2012, 06:39 PM
What I dont like is people taking this civil question and making it vile. Do I think james is mvp? No . Reasons... 1 . Choke more than once this year, while other stars hit gane winners repeatedly at the same time, during same week. Rose Durant Love. These players imo where all viable contenders for the award. So they one upped James. Minus one James.
.2. Passed to wade aka jock riding while kobe wanted to make a playoff memory.. Real recognize real , James put on a mask and became Robin and looked for wade ... East lost game btw.

I can go on, but it is wrong to over kill. I can't deny James is one of the best, but this year it was Durant, and I think Durant is no where as good as James yet... Yet.

:bla:

Text book hater

It's funny to me that all Miami fans do is call people haters even when people put forth well thought out arguments...... That's called text book. Denial....

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 06:42 PM
:bla:

Text book hater
My bad for my improper spelling, my 600 dollar phone swype system is acting up. Now what pointo basketball wise where you tring to make? It had to be a heat fan.
No where did I insult you. I can't help it your only real smart response is about texting skill in a basketball convo. I to can do the same ....... You have a.d.d youp can't stay in topic.

mdm692
05-14-2012, 06:57 PM
Based on what exactly? Lebron put up superior numbers than those players and it's not even close. I don't understand how anyone can honestly make an argument against Lebron once they've seen the numbers...

then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 07:01 PM
then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

:laugh2:

Great analysis. I'd tell you what word you should be looking up but I don't want to run the risk of getting banned during playoff time.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 07:03 PM
then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

I'm :mad:starting to see the award as meaningless, as the best players win it only once or twice and it is rarely given to the hands down best player in the game more than twice

Sactown
05-14-2012, 07:04 PM
My bad for my improper spelling, my 600 dollar phone swype system is acting up. Now what pointo basketball wise where you tring to make? It had to be a heat fan.
No where did I insult you. I can't help it your only real smart response is about texting skill in a basketball convo. I to can do the same ....... You have a.d.d youp can't stay in topic.

BALLER! :speechless:

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 07:13 PM
I:mad:
then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

I'm :mad:starting to see the award as meaningless, as the best players win it only once or twice and it is rarely given to the hands down best player in the game more than twice . Hell the award I'm that case should ber the Micheal Jordan award bc he actually really deserved to win it his whole nba life. And to see players out shine him like this is very agha shady.. Its like ppl tring to force MJ out the light as fast as the goat without James actually putting in REAL WORK, like Kobe, like Shaq like Duncan. I have never seen a player celebrated losing in 2 finals with 2 differentteams. One was his, the other he got 2 sta rs. James will win a ship, but at what cost?

ryankc2011
05-14-2012, 07:15 PM
why is this even a conversation. you know he deserved it. pierce ???? really over lebron @ chitown.. you are not that into sports or your the non athletic guy who didnt get much playing time , so you hate on the super star... ya he had bosh and wade. I find it pretty phenominal he put those stats up with those players considering keepin em all happy . just think about it , it makes sense.



twenty ten and five you know how i get down

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 07:19 PM
It's funny to me that all Miami fans do is call people haters even when people put forth well thought out arguments...... That's called text book. Denial....

You call those well thought-out arguments? :confused: You cannot be serious.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 07:19 PM
It's funny to me that all Miami fans do is call people haters even when people put forth well thought out arguments...... That's called text book. Denial....

are you going to sit there with a striaght face and say that was a well thought out argument? i think you need to re-read his paragraph and find the parts where he clearly contradicts his own argument.


My bad for my improper spelling, my 600 dollar phone swype system is acting up. Now what pointo basketball wise where you tring to make? It had to be a heat fan.
No where did I insult you. I can't help it your only real smart response is about texting skill in a basketball convo. I to can do the same ....... You have a.d.d youp can't stay in topic.
:laugh: darn thing always acting up mines did it during a ride on one of my private jets



then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

""In sports, a Most Valuable Player (MVP) award is an honor typically bestowed upon the best performing player or players on a specific team, in an entire league, or for a particular contest or series of contests. Initially used in professional sports, the term is now also commonly used in amateur sports, as well as in other completely unrelated fields of endeavor such as business and music""



I just made a general statement that rose is more valuable to the bulls then Lebron is to the heat... But I could care less if Lebron wins MVP.... He ain't winning a ring.


umm ok.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 07:20 PM
lolol

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 07:21 PM
then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.

I don't get how people think a team with the best player in the NBA, who had the best season in the NBA, would have been just as good without that player.

I don't understand how people believe that the best player in the league, who had the best season in the league, didn't add the most value to his team with his performance. It is simply illogical.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 07:21 PM
I:mad:

I'm :mad:starting to see the award as meaningless, as the best players win it only once or twice and it is rarely given to the hands down best player in the game more than twice . Hell the award I'm that case should ber the Micheal Jordan award bc he actually really deserved to win it his whole nba life. And to see players out shine him like this is very agha shady.. Its like ppl tring to force MJ out the light as fast as the goat without James actually putting in REAL WORK, like Kobe, like Shaq like Duncan. I have never seen a player celebrated losing in 2 finals with 2 differentteams. One was his, the other he got 2 sta rs. James will win a ship, but at what cost?

celebrated? you mean lebron? the mosted hated player in all sports?

Chronz
05-14-2012, 07:23 PM
Prove it

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 07:42 PM
celebrated? you mean lebron? the mosted hated player in all sports?
He is hated, but he is still celebrated.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 07:45 PM
Where is Chi town,He created this stupid thread and left us here to debate it,and he still hasn't come up with a good explanation to why Lebron doesn't deserve the MVP,I guess Nash/Love deserve it more because they didn't take their team to the playoffs.

Please explain Chi town?

lakersfan01
05-14-2012, 07:48 PM
Wow, people are arguing that Lebron didn't deserve MVP, but Chandler winning DPOY wasn't controversial? :laugh2:

yankeesown69
05-14-2012, 07:52 PM
MVP goes to the player who in the opinion of the voters had the best regular season. That's much easier to judge than who is most valuable to their team. If you want to go by who is most valuable it's most likely going to be a guy on a good team that really only has one main star. A guy like Lebron would never win it then because the Heat without him would still be a solid team.

chi-townlove1
05-14-2012, 07:53 PM
What I dont like is people taking this civil question and making it vile. Do I think james is mvp? No . Reasons... 1 . Choke more than once this year, while other stars hit gane winners repeatedly at the same time, during same week. Rose Durant Love. These players imo where all viable contenders for the award. So they one upped James. Minus one James.
.2. Passed to wade aka jock riding while kobe wanted to make a playoff memory.. Real recognize real , James put on a mask and became Robin and looked for wade ... East lost game btw.

I can go on, but it is wrong to over kill. I can't deny James is one of the best, but this year it was Durant, and I think Durant is no where as good as James yet... Yet.

:bla:

Text book hater

It's funny to me that all Miami fans do is call people haters even when people put forth well thought out arguments...... That's called text book. Denial....I

This exactly! And thank you for fighting this for me while I've been at work. Miami fans hate everyone who isn't named Lebron, but when someone says something against him with complete logic they curl up in a ball and cry and ***** and accuse everyone of being haters

naps
05-14-2012, 07:59 PM
I prefer raw stas because it shows what you did plan and simple. advance stats has to many varibles the can effect them like, if your on the court with a line up that inferrior to the oppositions and is forced to force shots and or plays, or if your coach puts you on the court as a decoy so you pass out the double ,but your teammates dont make shots and it dosent work and the other team makes a runs then you lose the plus and minus game and win shares. Or your playing a player that uses multiple screens and scores. Even though you were screened out the play your defensive rating goes down and if im correct. What if your coach tells you to allow the jumpshot just protect the paint, and the player your guarding gets multiple open shots there goes your rating. Thats only half of the factors to me that effect advance stats to me. Raw stats shows what you did plan and simple.Most advance stats should be used to grade a coaches performance more than anything.

Im not trying anything I asked a question. Are they now using advance stats to determine the MVP? Have they went that far to raise Lebron? I personaly am starting to hate this era of ball. Flopping is out of control, players are no longer judge by championships, but by stats only and everyone is cool with this. You have players worrying more about stats than actualy winning!! and fans are ok with that. Jordan got his numbers not for numbers sake but that is what was needed to win. Kobe the same. People like to say he's only 45+ percent for his career and he takes bad shots. He like the legends past did what was needed to win, he showed this year how little he cared about scoring titles. I didnt mind Durant going for the tittle the last week I would have done the same thats another trophy on the shelf, but is he never wins a tittle he will be another Iverson, just below Greatness where the MJ's, Magics, Russels, Birds, Kobe's, Shaq's, Duncans, Kareems, West, Cousey's, Garnetts, Peirce's, Wade's etc..live, IMO. If Lebron dosent get a tittle he should be listed below Iverson becuase he had way more help in his career, regardless of his stats.

Don't make essays. Whatever you like it or not you are following it. And stop comparing Kobe with Jordan in every chance you get. LeBron and Durant had similar stats with LeBron having double the assists and being more efficient. WS is a very important stat. I don't how you can deny that.

And you clearly avoided the point where I mentioned LeBron's defense. MVP is not the best offensive player. Defense is 50% of the game and LeBron is by far the most versatile defender on the planet. You add LeBron's defense with his overall numbers and it's not close at all. That's no shot at KD, he had a phenomenal season as well but LeBron way too dominant at BOTH ends. But ofcourse you wouldn't touch that because that's gonna make your point invalid.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 08:00 PM
I

This exactly! And thank you for fighting this for me while I've been at work. Miami fans hate everyone who isn't named Lebron, but when someone says something against him with complete logic they curl up in a ball and cry and ***** and accuse everyone of being haters

there was no "logic" in any argument so far

naps
05-14-2012, 08:01 PM
Law25 and Chi town should really get together.

Law25 said that Durant beat LeBron in his 5 major statistical categories and completely ignored every other aspect of basketball :laugh2: Then he goes on to say he doesn't like advanced stats guess what Law25 no one cares what you like the entire league uses advanced stats now and every great basketball mind has started using it as analysis to what a player does and doesn't do on the basketball floor.

Stop trying to have a statistical discussion if you're not going to discuss stats.


He doesn't like advanced stats probably because it shows how inefficient Kobe is.

Now wait for the 5 rings phrase. It's coming!!

naps
05-14-2012, 08:06 PM
Ladies and gentlemen, wanna see the pathetic and desperate haters?

---Read though this thread.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 08:08 PM
are you going to sit there with a striaght face and say that was a well thought out argument? i think you need to re-read his paragraph and find the parts where he clearly contradicts his own argument.


:laugh: darn thing always acting up mines did it during a ride on one of my private jets




""In sports, a Most Valuable Player (MVP) award is an honor typically bestowed upon the best performing player or players on a specific team, in an entire league, or for a particular contest or series of contests. Initially used in professional sports, the term is now also commonly used in amateur sports, as well as in other completely unrelated fields of endeavor such as business and music""





umm ok.


Where is my contradictions? If I made no sense
Let me clear it.

A and fast as my phone/your jet... Whatever
And MVP by definition used by NBA is out of context.

mdm692
05-14-2012, 08:09 PM
Wow, people are arguing that Lebron didn't deserve MVP, but Chandler winning DPOY wasn't controversial? :laugh2:

not even one bit. Chandler took a team that would allow players like channing frye to dominate inside to one of the better defensive teams in all basketball.

Ethix11
05-14-2012, 08:14 PM
What does the word "Valuable" mean to you in MVP? LeBron sells Jerseys, shoes, tickets...that argument is just as valid as making a point for the Clippers without Chris Paul on it because they wouldn't be in the playoffs without him. Now if you cancel both those points, what are you left with? Statistics. Defense is one of those things that don't appear on the box score. Give the award to the player who impacts and dominates the game most not the one who has to do the most with less because their front office is ineffective because then nobody cares about the award...DUH

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 08:14 PM
I

This exactly! And thank you for fighting this for me while I've been at work. Miami fans hate everyone who isn't named Lebron, but when someone says something against him with complete logic they curl up in a ball and cry and ***** and accuse everyone of being haters

Hey man Im still waiting for your explanation to why Lebron doesn't deserve MVP over Nash/Love?

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 08:15 PM
He doesn't like advanced stats probably because it shows how inefficient Kobe is.

Now wait for the 5 rings phrase. It's coming!!

Dude I am an ALLEN IVERSON super fanboy. AI is like the epitome of inefficiency when it comes to volume scorers and the advanced stats expose that. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate the advances in the game of basketball because of it. I am perfectly making a sound argument for Allen Iverson with and without the use of advanced metrics keeping all homerism out of it.

Advanced stats exposing his favourite player's weaknesses even more is no reason to dislike them. If he actually took a minute to understand the statistics he'd hold a much deeper appreciation for how great a player Kobe Bryant really is.

mdm692
05-14-2012, 08:15 PM
:laugh2:

Great analysis. I'd tell you what word you should be looking up but I don't want to run the risk of getting banned during playoff time.

I never said it was analysis but great way to jump to conclusions. And ill give you something to look up "meddling" cause thats what youre doing.

mdm692
05-14-2012, 08:17 PM
I don't get how people think a team with the best player in the NBA, who had the best season in the NBA, would have been just as good without that player.

I don't understand how people believe that the best player in the league, who had the best season in the league, didn't add the most value to his team with his performance. It is simply illogical.

2 words dwyane wade. They would easily be a top 4 team with a wade and bosh duo and would more than likely just win about 5 fewer games.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 08:22 PM
Where is my contradictions? If I made no sense
Let me clear it.

A and fast as my phone/your jet... Whatever
And MVP by definition used by NBA is out of context.


so rose is a viable contender but not lebron when rose missed most of the season???????? pftttttttttttttttt and rose didnt choke this year? i remember him missing a couple free throws that would have gave them the win in miami, and i also remember him doing the same thing against the knicks as carmelo sticked daggers on the bulls so rose choked more than once so i guess you shouldnt think of as mvp.




._. please just stop

..

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 08:27 PM
2 words dwyane wade. They would easily be a top 4 team with a wade and bosh duo and would more than likely just win about 5 fewer games.

The Heat were 14-3 in the games in which Dwyane Wade didn't play and 1-3 in the games in which LeBron didn't. See that whichever way you may but to think that the Heat would still be a top tier contending team without LeBron then you're really selling him extremely short.

Wade missed 25.7% of his team's games and was nursing pretty serious injuries in a great deal of those in which he played. The last time Wade missed that much time and played so many games injured the Heat won just 15 games all season long. Sure they didn't have Bosh but Bosh isn't going to turn that team around by himself when Wade is out.

All and All with no LeBron James and that revolving door at C the Heat's D would be middle of the pack and they wouldn't be seen as legit championship contenders.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 08:30 PM
Chi town will you explain why Nash/Love deserve MVP over Lebron?


I really have to hear your reason.

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 08:34 PM
LeBron led his team is PPG, APG, RPG and SPG. Dwyane Wade missed 17 games and Bosh missed 9 you honestly think they'd be the 2nd after missing all that? So basically what you're trying to say is that LeBron isn't really that valuable in the very least.

No way the Heat are the #2 seed in the East with their best player gone, Wade missing a huge chunk of games (starting very poorly as well). LeBron made that defense and that's their strongest point. The Heat would be between a 4-7 seed this season had it not be for LeBron.

Also if that's your criteria for MVP taking nothing else into consideration then Dwight Howard should have won last season and Kevin Love should have been 2nd to Parker this season if not taking it away from him.




Yep, LeBron on THIS heat team is not as valuable as Parker or even Durant was to the their teams. Now if you go ahead and LeBron puts these numbers and still finishes in one of the top seeds in his Cleveland team.. then without a doubt he deserves it. Now if you were to ask who is the better player between those three players (Bron, Parker, Durant), I would say LeBron without a doubt.

I have a hard time believing they finish under 3rd place in the east still without Lebron. With Dwights drama and Celtics getting old... I cant see any 3 teams better than them in the east. Didnt Wade and Bosh just take some games off for rest?? i could be wrong.

Your final question... Yes if Dwight would have finished the year than yes I would include him in the MVP names as well. Love no though, he couldnt even get his team to the playoffs.
These are the reasons why Im just saying they should create an award for just the best player in the league. This way they dont change the criteria every few years on what it takes to win the mvp

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 08:35 PM
Y
..

Come on buckets .. Chill.. Real talk.. Rose imo outshines James all the time. But I can say this... Rose chokes at the line in the clutch. CAN YOU ABOUT James? And imo at the beginning the racer was in no order, Durant, James,.Love, Kobe. How did James run away with it when Love was putting up Moses Malone numbers..Aka numbers Shaq couldn't do. How was James in lead when rose hit back to back game winners, when James had a two week spree of running from the game shot? How is Durantnot mvpr when he hit game winners at same time james is passing them up, and Durant has best record over Miami ?
and as far as I saw it a healthy Rose was gonna be two time MVP.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 08:36 PM
Y

Come on buckets .. Chill.. Real talk.. Rose imo outshines James all the time. But I can say this... Rose chokes at the line in the clutch. CAN YOU ABOUT James? And imo at the beginning the racer was in no order, Durant, James,.Love, Kobe. How did James run away with it when Love was putting up Moses Malone numbers..Aka numbers Shaq couldn't do. How was James in lead when rose hit back to back game winners, when James had a two week spree of running from the game shot? How is Durantnot mvpr when he hit game winners at same time james is passing them up, and Durant has best record over Miami ?
and as far as I saw it a healthy Rose was gonna be two time MVP.

lol

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 08:40 PM
Every single anti LeBron MVP post in this thread has been based on hypotheticals and nothing else. The hypothetical that had Chris Paul, Tony Parker etc not been a part of their team that their team would do worst that LeBron's.

I don't know about you guys but if I'm the #1 basketball, baseball, football etc in the entire world I'd like something a WHOLE lot more solid than hypothetical when deciding who is the Most Valuable Player in the league.

If you're going to make a case for Parker why don't you say that he really matured in his decision making and really grew as a passer this season. Why don't you say he seemed to be more focused as a defender and really seemed to understand his role on his team and elevated his play as a result. Why don't you say that instead of saying such filth like what if Parker wasn't there blah bla blah.

Would you guys like a what if? What if Dwyane Wade was replaced by Wesley Matthews? Would the Heat still have .700 winning %? Chances are they could possibly have. I mean LeBron carried a Cleveland team with even less support to back to back 0 win seasons. So all and all if you guys want to argue what ifs why don't you look at your what if from a holistic POV instead of your narrow minded agenda based POV?

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 08:41 PM
lol
He does. Better hndles, better hops, better finisher (size relative) better shooter.. Youngest MVP. Number one jersey. Hint hint..jersey sales are good indicator of who is hot and who is best player... Rose been number one.come again!

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 08:46 PM
The Heat were 14-3 in the games in which Dwyane Wade didn't play and 1-3 in the games in which LeBron didn't. See that whichever way you may but to think that the Heat would still be a top tier contending team without LeBron then you're really selling him extremely short.

Wade missed 25.7% of his team's games and was nursing pretty serious injuries in a great deal of those in which he played. The last time Wade missed that much time and played so many games injured the Heat won just 15 games all season long. Sure they didn't have Bosh but Bosh isn't going to turn that team around by himself when Wade is out.

All and All with no LeBron James and that revolving door at C the Heat's D would be middle of the pack and they wouldn't be seen as legit championship contenders.

Thats dumb. so because Lakers had a great record when Kobe missed all those games does that make them better without Kobe? no way. Ive heard it all over tv even Wade said it himself how he has stepped aside and sort of let LeBron run things on the court. If Lebron was not there im sure Wade's numbers would skyrocket because he still a top 5 player in the league.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 08:48 PM
He does. Better hndles, better hops, better finisher (size relative) better shooter.. Youngest MVP. Number one jersey. Hint hint..jersey sales are good indicator of who is hot and who is best player... Rose been number one.come again!

Of course bro. Expect one is the #1 player in the league by a pretty large margin, and the other is a top 8 player.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 08:51 PM
Yep, LeBron on THIS heat team is not as valuable as Parker or even Durant was to the their teams. Now if you go ahead and LeBron puts these numbers and still finishes in one of the top seeds in his Cleveland team.. then without a doubt he deserves it. Now if you were to ask who is the better player between those three players (Bron, Parker, Durant), I would say LeBron without a doubt.

I have a hard time believing they finish under 3rd place in the east still without Lebron. With Dwights drama and Celtics getting old... I cant see any 3 teams better than them in the east. Didnt Wade and Bosh just take some games off for rest?? i could be wrong.

Your final question... Yes if Dwight would have finished the year than yes I would include him in the MVP names as well. Love no though, he couldnt even get his team to the playoffs.
These are the reasons why Im just saying they should create an award for just the best player in the league. This way they dont change the criteria every few years on what it takes to win the mvp

Heat record without Dwyane Wade 14-3

Heat record without LeBron James 1-3

Are you absolutely certain that Parker and Durant mean THAT much more to their teams than James? That much more that we should ignore how dominant AND valuable LeBron has been to his team on BOTH ends of the floor.

Also how has the criteria changed every year?

Raps18-19 Champ
05-14-2012, 08:55 PM
Thats the problem with the award year after year. the reason they give it to players changes. Someone already posted on here a few pages back, they should just make an MVP (for the most valuable to his team) and one for whos the best player in general. It does kind of sound stupid but its the truth when one year someone gets it for being so valuable to their team (Steve Nash a few years ago over Kobe averaging 35ppg) when the next year its someone who just had the better stats.

The MVP is given to the player that is most valuable in the league that year.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 08:55 PM
Y

Come on buckets .. Chill.. Real talk.. Rose imo outshines James all the time. But I can say this... Rose chokes at the line in the clutch. CAN YOU ABOUT James? And imo at the beginning the racer was in no order, Durant, James,.Love, Kobe. How did James run away with it when Love was putting up Moses Malone numbers..Aka numbers Shaq couldn't do. How was James in lead when rose hit back to back game winners, when James had a two week spree of running from the game shot? How is Durantnot mvpr when he hit game winners at same time james is passing them up, and Durant has best record over Miami ?
and as far as I saw it a healthy Rose was gonna be two time MVP.

in the regular season yes i agre.. actually not even in the regular season.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 08:56 PM
Thats dumb. so because Lakers had a great record when Kobe missed all those games does that make them better without Kobe? no way. Ive heard it all over tv even Wade said it himself how he has stepped aside and sort of let LeBron run things on the court. If Lebron was not there im sure Wade's numbers would skyrocket because he still a top 5 player in the league.

Did you at any point whatsoever say the Heat are better without Wade?

How could Wade #s skyrocket if he wasn't on the floor? Wade was injured for a great portion of the season. Missed over a quarter of his team's games and played injured quite a few others.

It's not dumb in any way. Its a fact. LeBron James is more valuable to his team than any other player in the NBA. He showed that in Cleveland and he's shown it as a member of the Heat.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 09:01 PM
Of course bro. Expect one is the #1 player in the league by a pretty large margin, and the other is a top 8 player.
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 09:03 PM
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

I knew you would say that lmfao


:facepalm:

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 09:04 PM
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

A Bulls "fan" who doesn't know that Rose was in his 3rd and not 2nd year when he won the MVP :laugh2:

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 09:36 PM
The MVP is given to the player that is most valuable in the league that year.

I know that... This year they seem to have given it to Lebron for his Numbers or impressive "advanced stats" for ppl into that

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 09:41 PM
Heat record without Dwyane Wade 14-3

Heat record without LeBron James 1-3

Are you absolutely certain that Parker and Durant mean THAT much more to their teams than James? That much more that we should ignore how dominant AND valuable LeBron has been to his team on BOTH ends of the floor.

Also how has the criteria changed every year?

Of course I do. No Durant and the thunder are not playing the Lakers in the playoffs right now. No parker and the Spurs dont finish 1st place, hell probably not 2nd or 3rd in the west. But im sure throughout the course of the season, no Lebron on the heat and they would not go on pace to how they were (1-3) without him this season.

koreancabbage
05-14-2012, 09:44 PM
I know that... This year they seem to have given it to Lebron for his Numbers or impressive "advanced stats" for ppl into that

then? his team has always been good as well. its not like he is on an 8th seed team.

he has been consistently the best player on almost every single court in the NBA for every game that he has played in - i don't get why its so hard to see that...
usually the best offensive player and the best defensive player every night in games he plays in. can't be said for any other player in the league.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 09:52 PM
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

No offense but is English your second language?

Ty Fast
05-14-2012, 09:54 PM
hater

no kidding

mightybosstone
05-14-2012, 09:54 PM
Thats the problem with the award year after year. the reason they give it to players changes. Someone already posted on here a few pages back, they should just make an MVP (for the most valuable to his team) and one for whos the best player in general. It does kind of sound stupid but its the truth when one year someone gets it for being so valuable to their team (Steve Nash a few years ago over Kobe averaging 35ppg) when the next year its someone who just had the better stats.
I can agree with this. I feel like that unless there's one player who is far and away the best player that season, they give it to the player with the best story on a top 5-10 team. Personally, I feel like MVP should be awarded to the player with the overall best, most dominant regular season statistically, but the team's success should also play a role in it.

The problem with the idea of an MVP award which literally goes to the player who is most valuable to his team is that is a completely subjective criteria which provides almost no data whatsoever to back up. People argue that Lebron is not MVP because if you took him off the team the Heat would still be a great basketball team. Would they? Couldn't you argue that the Thunder, Spurs and Lakers would all be decent playoff teams without Durant, Parker and Kobe?

You could perhaps make the case that the Clippers would not be in the playoffs without Chris Paul, but if Chauncey Billups were healthy, that's still quite possible a playoff caliber team. So that overall argument is a terrible one, IMO, and should never be used to determine the MVP.


then you obviously need to pick up a dictionary and look up the word valuable.
Or perhaps you're an idiot who does not understand the value of certain statistics so he uses horrible, vague arguments to make his case for MVP and pretends to know what the hell he's talking about. Pop quiz... Who led the league in PER, WS and WS/48 by an EXTREMELY wide margin? Lebron James. If you do not grasp the concept of why Lebron deserves MVP, it has nothing to do with a misunderstanding of the word "valuable" and everything to do with you being ignorant about the game of basketball and statistical analysis.

Giannis94
05-14-2012, 09:55 PM
I honestly thought Ilyasova should of got it.........

mightybosstone
05-14-2012, 09:58 PM
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

I don't know what's worse, the ignorance of this statement of the ignorance of the grammar. I have literally nothing positive to say about this post...

Raps18-19 Champ
05-14-2012, 10:00 PM
I know that... This year they seem to have given it to Lebron for his Numbers or impressive "advanced stats" for ppl into that

They gave it to Lebron because he was the best performing player. Just like they did with MJ, Bird and other before. Advance stats also shows guys like MJ were one of the better players that year.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 10:07 PM
A Bulls "fan" who doesn't know that Rose was in his 3rd and not 2nd year when he won the MVP :laugh2:

Ok lets be real. I mis spoke..no biggie, but he did say it and backed it up.no matter second out third year...youngest MVP this far. Best record, his soliders know their role, actually hold the forty down in his absence..you guys think the bulls went hard this year bc what ever reason, but like when mj left, the bulls taking on their leaders dna, didn't stop winning..leaders with good soilders make this happen. That's what I know.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 10:11 PM
Ok lets be real. I mis spoke..no biggie, but he did say it and backed it up.no matter second out third year...youngest MVP this far. Best record, his soliders know their role, actually hold the forty down in his absence..you guys think the bulls went hard this year bc what ever reason, but like when mj left, the bulls taking on their leaders dna, didn't stop winning..leaders with good soilders make this happen. That's what I know.

I gots ya bruh... soliders are only as good as there leader does make them... friends comes and gos but soilders stays eternal. :cool:

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 10:16 PM
Yeah since his first year ain't did nothing but drop 25 plus 8 dimes per and win Mvp his second year, you are right Rose is# 1
And James is top 8. And you know what's bad? Roses frosh year I'm the Nba ended with him saying I'm winning Mvp next year.. He did.. He said he coming for the ship.

:laugh:

bluefire7002
05-14-2012, 10:19 PM
I can agree with this. I feel like that unless there's one player who is far and away the best player that season, they give it to the player with the best story on a top 5-10 team. Personally, I feel like MVP should be awarded to the player with the overall best, most dominant regular season statistically, but the team's success should also play a role in it.

The problem with the idea of an MVP award which literally goes to the player who is most valuable to his team is that is a completely subjective criteria which provides almost no data whatsoever to back up. People argue that Lebron is not MVP because if you took him off the team the Heat would still be a great basketball team. Would they? Couldn't you argue that the Thunder, Spurs and Lakers would all be decent playoff teams without Durant, Parker and Kobe?

You could perhaps make the case that the Clippers would not be in the playoffs without Chris Paul, but if Chauncey Billups were healthy, that's still quite possible a playoff caliber team. So that overall argument is a terrible one, IMO, and should never be used to determine the MVP.


Or perhaps you're an idiot who does not understand the value of certain statistics so he uses horrible, vague arguments to make his case for MVP and pretends to know what the hell he's talking about. Pop quiz... Who led the league in PER, WS and WS/48 by an EXTREMELY wide margin? Lebron James. If you do not grasp the concept of why Lebron deserves MVP, it has nothing to do with a misunderstanding of the word "valuable" and everything to do with you being ignorant about the game of basketball and statistical analysis.

Couldnt agree with you more :clap:

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 10:25 PM
I don't know what's worse, the ignorance of this statement of the ignorance of the grammar. I have literally nothing positive to say about this post...

Do you know what the meaning of"ignorance" is? Being un familiar or not having knowledge.do you understand the triple post offense? Do you understand dynamics of running any
offense? I think you don't, and I know you can't. In the triple post the post man down low is fed by the perimeter player, the play evoles due to defense played.if entry man is being denied the post playe r should expect a back door cut.that just one aspect of that one offense with two option s that I know of. N ofow you talking about my grammar, who cares your a bunch of dudes. I know its choppy, and I don't care to correct it.but since out personal and I see you"THINK" you know ball.. Imo stats are good but any SMART man knows stats mean squat. You use them to measure NUMERICALLY. But any smart LAWYER will take your same facts and not use them, or what I like to do is ask you under what condition was these stats taken? When Mj played, where the conditions the same? Did Players face same players and have the same mental make up? if not, you stat is just simple numbers without real meaning without life..you get my drift ?in my world I would crush you. In your world you can talk bc no one knows better..but I do..stfu

koreancabbage
05-14-2012, 10:33 PM
Do you know what the meaning of"ignorance" is? Being un familiar or not having knowledge.do you understand the triple post offense? Do you understand dynamics of running any
offense? I think you don't, and I know you can't. In the triple post the post man down low is fed by the perimeter player, the play evoles due to defense played.if entry man is being denied the post playe r should expect a back door cut.that just one aspect of that one offense with two option s that I know of. N ofow you talking about my grammar, who cares your a bunch of dudes. I know its choppy, and I don't care to correct it.

you're pretty ignorant lol

Lebron top 8? #1 sales in jerseys means he's the best player? WTF what are you smoking? You're basically saying Lebron had no business winning that MVP while a scrub (now) like Nash or Minny's Love should be in the conversation when they didn't even make the playoffs? a top player on a non-playoff team shouldn't even be in the conversation.

naps
05-14-2012, 10:39 PM
Summary of this thread:


Why does LeBron have to be so ****ing good :cry::cry::cry::cry:

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 10:48 PM
I
you're pretty ignorant lol

Lebron top 8? #1 sales in jerseys means he's the best player? WTF what are you smoking? You're basically saying Lebron had no business winning that MVP while a scrub (now) like Nash or Minny's Love should be in the conversation when they didn't even make the playoffs? a top player on a non-playoff team shouldn't even be in the conversation.

I will now use spell check since this dude is way off. I'm saying James year wasnt better than Durants. Im saying Love had a great year and its a team sport. Love put up monster numbers bad team or not. Love showed he is the best PF .The number and effort put in by Love was NO fluk. imo this wasnt James year.its not a insult, he just didn't outshine Durant. Durant hit game winners. Had the second best record. James third best, stats similar to Durant. tie breaker... Game winners... Team success.

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 10:55 PM
I

I will now use spell check since this dude is way off. I'm saying James year want better than Durants. Im saying Love had a great year and its a team sport. Love put up monster numbers bad team or not. Love showed he is the best PF .The number and effort put in by Love was NO fluk. imo this wasnt James year.its not a insult, he just didn't outshine Durant. Durant all hit year game winners. Had the second best record. James third best, stats similar to Durant. tie breaker... Game winners... Team success.
How'd that spell check work out for you?

bucketss
05-14-2012, 11:05 PM
I

I will now use spell check since this dude is way off. I'm saying James year wasnt better than Durants. Im saying Love had a great year and its a team sport. Love put up monster numbers bad team or not. Love showed he is the best PF .The number and effort put in by Love was NO fluk. imo this wasnt James year.its not a insult, he just didn't outshine Durant. Durant hit game winners. Had the second best record. James third best, stats similar to Durant. tie breaker... Game winners... Team success.

except lebrons stats was clearly superior and not including what he did on defense.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 11:05 PM
wait did he just say tie breaker game winners ._.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 11:06 PM
And to piggy back off my last statement, Durant didn't mess up as much, or as bad.. Durant played to the level of star more and more considerably consistant than James.

bucketss
05-14-2012, 11:08 PM
And to piggy back off my last statement, Durant didn't mess up as much, or as bad.. Durant played to the level of star more and more considerably consistant than James.

haha no he didn't

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 11:11 PM
And to piggy back off my last statement, Durant didn't mess up as much, or as bad.. Durant played to the level of star more and more considerably consistant than James.

Just shutup man you are making youself look like a clown.

Hawkeye15
05-14-2012, 11:11 PM
The best player on the planet won MVP. We should cry about it.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 11:13 PM
Just shutup man you are making youself look like a clown.

So basically he's just doing what he does best?

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 11:17 PM
And to piggy back off my last statement, Durant didn't mess up as much, or as bad.. Durant played to the level of star more and more considerably consistant than James.

I'm sorry. :laugh: I ... I just.... haha.. I just... hahahahahahahahha. :laugh2: I... i... I just can... can't st...st.. st.... hahahahaha. I JUST CAN'T STOP LAUGHING!!! hahahaha. :laugh:

WadeKobe
05-14-2012, 11:19 PM
And to piggy back off my last statement, Durant didn't mess up as much, or as bad.. Durant played to the level of star more and more considerably consistant than James.

Ok... seriously though.....


Ways you can "mess up" in basketball:


Miss a shot
Turn the ball over
Get burned on defense.


Well, technically, LeBron did all 3 of those less than Durant soooo...... :confused: I don't understand.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 11:19 PM
i'm sorry. :laugh: I ... I just.... Haha.. I just... Hahahahahahahahha. :laugh2: I... I... I just can... Can't st...st.. St.... Hahahahaha. I just can't stop laughing!!! Hahahaha. :laugh:

lmao.

BULLSFAN0810
05-14-2012, 11:21 PM
except lebrons stats was clearly superior and not including what he did on defense.

Scoring title and best record means nothing? You can argue for any player... Best record, scoring title.. Is a strong argument don't you agree?

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 11:25 PM
Scoring title and best record means nothing? You can argue for any player... Best record, scoring title.. Is a strong argument don't you agree?

Go to bed kid,you are embarassing yourself.

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 11:25 PM
Scoring title and best record means nothing? You can argue for any player... Best record, scoring title.. Is a strong argument don't you agree?

Except the Thunder did not have the best record and Durant winning the scoring title means squat when you consider the fact that LeBron was 10 times the defensive player Durant is.

Doesn't defense mean anything? Next thing you'll tell me that Durant blocked more shots than LeBron and because of that he's a better defender.

DeyAce
05-14-2012, 11:37 PM
Durant or Parker should have won it

Swashcuff
05-14-2012, 11:40 PM
Durant or Parker should have won it

Great sound analysis here. How can one argue against that.

D12 fan
05-14-2012, 11:41 PM
Ok Im starting to think all Chicago fan's are retards.

justinnum1
05-14-2012, 11:53 PM
lol

mightybosstone
05-15-2012, 12:27 AM
Do you know what the meaning of"ignorance" is? Being un familiar or not having knowledge.do you understand the triple post offense? Do you understand dynamics of running any
offense? I think you don't, and I know you can't. In the triple post the post man down low is fed by the perimeter player, the play evoles due to defense played.if entry man is being denied the post playe r should expect a back door cut.that just one aspect of that one offense with two option s that I know of. N ofow you talking about my grammar, who cares your a bunch of dudes. I know its choppy, and I don't care to correct it.but since out personal and I see you"THINK" you know ball.. Imo stats are good but any SMART man knows stats mean squat. You use them to measure NUMERICALLY. But any smart LAWYER will take your same facts and not use them, or what I like to do is ask you under what condition was these stats taken? When Mj played, where the conditions the same? Did Players face same players and have the same mental make up? if not, you stat is just simple numbers without real meaning without life..you get my drift ?in my world I would crush you. In your world you can talk bc no one knows better..but I do..stfu

Wow... So much of this is unreadable. But what the **** does the triple post offense have to do with anything we're talking about? That's the equivalent of you telling me I know nothing about baseball statistics and then me explaining how a ****ing squeeze bunt works. It's completely irrelevant.

But seriously, I think it's hard for me or anyone else in this forum to take you remotely seriously, because you can barely string coherent sentences together. Perhaps you should focus on simple sentence structure and punctuation before you try to make a persuasive argument on an internet forum. If anything, you've displayed the very epitome of ignorance. :shrug:

mightybosstone
05-15-2012, 12:34 AM
Ok Im starting to think all Chicago fan's are retards.

I hate to group them all together like that, but I can't say I disagree with this statement that much. I can't understand why the Bulls have so much hatred for Lebron or why they are unwilling to accept him as the league's MVP. Seriously, I would like ONE person to give me a legitimate argument as to why the guy should not be MVP. And, IMO, I think there's only one other player who you could make a legitimate case for...

WadeKobe
05-15-2012, 01:04 AM
I hate to group them all together like that, but I can't say I disagree with this statement that much. I can't understand why the Bulls have so much hatred for Lebron or why they are unwilling to accept him as the league's MVP. Seriously, I would like ONE person to give me a legitimate argument as to why the guy should not be MVP. And, IMO, I think there's only one other player who you could make a legitimate case for...

Same reason so many Knicks fans do. It's because he rejected the big-market teams and chose to play for insignificant Miami.

M.Bibby2.0
05-15-2012, 01:39 AM
I'm pretty sure even a baboon would recognize LeBron James as mvp, and even a dimwitted baboon would recognize LeBron as a top 5 mvp candidate, but outside of top 7? That's insane.

OP you're struggling to make a valid argument because one simply can't be made. Even by your own definition of MVP Lebron would be a top 3 candidate.

A case could be made for Durant because of his teams record, but I think the heat had more injury issues and in a shortened season, its hard comparing two teams in different conferences, the nod goes to the best player statistically (LeBron)

DeyAce
05-15-2012, 01:50 AM
Ok Im starting to think all Chicago fan's are retards.

I'm just glad I'm not a Magic fan

DeyAce
05-15-2012, 01:52 AM
Great sound analysis here. How can one argue against that.

My bad I don't spend 24 hours on PSD

Unrequited
05-15-2012, 01:56 AM
It's really subjective. Most valuable to team like Nash transforming the Suns into a contender made him MVP because he was the most valuable player in terms of what he's worth to his team compared to the other players worth to their team.
This year we have LeBron putting up historical statistics. However, I don't believe the way Nash was selected as MVP is being voted the same way for LeBron..

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 02:20 AM
What is it about PSD that makes you people not understand what MVP means. Most valuable player - the person who means the most to their team and had the most individual influence on the players around them.. It does not mean the best player in the world or the best player of the year. It doesn't mean give it to the person who had numbers closest to Michael Jordan. Because if that were the case then Michael Jordan would have won the MVP and defensive player of the year each and every season.

Lebron James is the best ball player in the world, had the best season of all NBA players, but was not the MVP. There is a list of atleast 7 other guys that meant more to their team than that man. Can you guys try to have an intelligent and mature conversation discussing why Lebron actually got this award. This is not a troll thread at all, but more me trying to understand how you all are so naive to believe that Lebron deserved it.
Lebron doesn't deserve any reg season league MVP's as long as his teamed up with top 2-3 player in the league Dwyane Wade. Both these guys field goal %'s has been the best ever in the careers in the past 2 seasons playing along side one another. Its' not rocket science that this teaming has made it easier for Lebron when you have another elite player getting just as much attention on the floor. He is no longer cloaked by 3 players and can be seen wide open on a few occasions p/ game.

Take away Lebron in Miami in the weaker conference of the NBA and Miami would have still been a top 3 team. Miami would have had the depth and addressed issues in the 1 & 5 spot hving a more balanced team without Lebrons contract. So no doubt they would be one of the top teams still in the EAst minus lebron.

naps
05-15-2012, 02:32 AM
LeBron hate from these Bulls fans and Lakers fans has been unprecedented. I mean if you wanna hate so badly hate with something arguable. How can you argue with something so lopsided (84 to 24 1st place and 2nd place)? What an embarrassment! :laugh2:

TheIlladelph16
05-15-2012, 02:34 AM
Things I have learned from this thread:

1. Chitown decided to create a troll thread and give absolutely no statistical backing why Nash, Parker, Paul, Love, Pierce, etc. all deserved MVP over Lebron while repeatedly ignoring poster's requests to hear some semblance of a coherent argument out of him.

2. Bullsfanwhateveritis is a HUGE homer who apparently just learned to speak/type/spell in the last year or so. Rose is in no way shape or form better than Lebron James dude do you watch basketball other than the Bulls games?

3. According to people who disagree with Lebron getting MVP, advanced statistics are pretty much useless and hypothetical/subjective opinions are what should be deciding who was the most valuable player.

Lebron was the best player in the league this year hands down. Without him, their offense is badly hurt and they go from being an elite defensive team to a very average one. On top of that DWade missed 25% of the season and Bosh missed a bunch of games as well yet the Heat continued to basically dominate most teams.

And to whomever said "whatever he ain't never winning a ring" (paraphrasing)... Can't wait until he wins one to shut all the blind haters like you up.

M.Bibby2.0
05-15-2012, 02:36 AM
Lebron doesn't deserve any reg season league MVP's as long as his teamed up with top 2-3 player in the league Dwyane Wade. Both these guys field goal %'s has been the best ever in the careers in the past 2 seasons playing along side one another. Its' not rocket science that this teaming has made it easier for Lebron when you have another elite player getting just as much attention on the floor. He is no longer cloaked by 3 players and can be seen wide open on a few occasions p/ game.

Take away Lebron in Miami in the weaker conference of the NBA and Miami would have still been a top 3 team. Miami would have had the depth and addressed issues in the 1 & 5 spot hving a more balanced team without Lebrons contract. So no doubt they would be one of the top teams still in the EAst minus lebron.

Look I can assign arbitrary constraints for mvp too:
-can't play with top 3 PG
-can't have the leagues best shot blocker
-can't have the 6th man of the year
Oops sorry Durant your not eligible.

Without LeBron the heat are not a championship calibre team.

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 02:38 AM
LeBron hate from these Bulls fans and Lakers fans has been unprecedented. I mean if you wanna hate so badly hate with something arguable. How can you argue with something so lopsided (84 to 24 1st place and 2nd place)? What an embarrassment! :laugh2:
and i ask you again, naps...........why is it every time somebody has a view opposing your own that it is considered "hating". You Heat/Lebron fans need to grow up, grow some balls and get your lebron-goggles off. It's called criticism and for some arguments fact. not every form of criticism towards Lebron is 'Hate' from a 'Hater'. have more maturity and diversify your retorts.

naps
05-15-2012, 02:39 AM
Things I have learned from this thread:

1. Chitown decided to create a troll thread and give absolutely no statistical backing why Nash, Parker, Paul, Love, Pierce, etc. all deserved MVP over Lebron while repeatedly ignoring poster's requests to hear some semblance of a coherent argument out of him.

2. Bullsfanwhateveritis is a HUGE homer who apparently just learned to speak/type/spell in the last year or so. Rose is in no way shape or form better than Lebron James dude do you watch basketball other than the Bulls games?

3. According to people who disagree with Lebron getting MVP, advanced statistics are pretty much useless and hypothetical/subjective opinions are what should be deciding who was the most valuable player.

Lebron was the best player in the league this year hands down. Without him, their offense is badly hurt and they go from being an elite defensive team to a very average one. On top of that DWade missed 25% of the season and Bosh missed a bunch of games as well yet the Heat continued to basically dominate most teams.

And to whomever said "whatever he ain't never winning a ring" (paraphrasing)... Can't wait until he wins one to shut all the blind haters like you up.



Oh no...I still wanna hate LeBron. Why do you have to point out those embarrassments?

















Please, go tell LeBron not to be so ****ing good. Okieeee?

:cry::cry::cry:

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 02:44 AM
Look I can assign arbitrary constraints for mvp too:
-can't play with top 3 PG
-can't have the leagues best shot blocker
-can't have the 6th man of the year
Oops sorry Durant your not eligible.

Without LeBron the heat are not a championship calibre team.
lol, oh please...w/out Lebron Miami would have had the money to address many gaping holes in their team from depth to the on going center and pg issues. Not sure if you realize but Wade can carry a team fairly well and even minus Lebron this is one of the best team mates he has ever had. imagine if they were more balanced w/ depth.

naps
05-15-2012, 02:46 AM
and i ask you again, naps...........why is it every time somebody has a view opposing your own that it is considered "hating". You Heat/Lebron fans need to grow up, grow some balls and get your lebron-goggles off. It's called criticism and for some arguments fact. not every form of criticism towards Lebron is 'Hate' from a 'Hater'. have more maturity and diversify your retorts.

Shut up! You are just mad because Rose didn't win the MVP.


I have seen your posts. Only time you show up here to troll on LeBron. To LeBron you are exactly what Longhornfan1234 is to Wade.

If you think you understand the game then make an actual case for someone against LeBron instead of crying like a baby "He should never get an MVP because he plays with Wade" :rolleyes: I am sure you are not aware of the fact that Heat went 12-1 without Wade :facepalm:

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 02:50 AM
Shut up! You are just mad because Rose didn't win the MVP.


I have seen your posts. Only time you show up here to troll on LeBron. To LeBron you are exactly what Longhornfan1234 is to Wade.

If you think you understand the game then make an actual case for someone against LeBron instead of crying like a baby "He should never get an MVP because he plays with Wade" :rolleyes: I am sure you are not aware of the fact that Heat went 12-1 without Wade :facepalm: you are not serious w/ this argument. How in the world did Miami fans become worse than Lakers fans. And to think most of you are ex Cavs fans. congrats the lot of you. everybody mad and hating.

M.Bibby2.0
05-15-2012, 02:52 AM
lol, oh please...w/out Lebron Miami would have had the money to address many gaping holes in their team from depth to the on going center and pg issues. Not sure if you realize but Wade can carry a team fairly well and even minus Lebron this is one of the best team mates he has ever had. imagine if they were more balanced w/ depth.

What a joke, without lebron every single player on the team would demand higher pay. Players settled for less to play with the big 3 (and the big 3 settled for less to play with each other). But lets consider your ridiculous hypothetical with 16 mill from Lebrons contract miami could get an average PG and a mediocre Center (which are expensive)

naps
05-15-2012, 02:56 AM
you are not serious w/ this argument. How in the world did Miami fans become worse than Lakers fans. And to think most of you are ex Cavs fans. congrats the lot of you. everybody mad and hating.

Yeah, you made a great case against LeBron :rolleyes:

I knew you couldn't. Just because Heat fans see the reality which is clear as day light they are bad and ex-cavs fans. Your posts are embarrassing. I asked you to make a case against LeBron you got mad and came out with personal attacks :laugh2:

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 02:58 AM
I assume you don't follow Miami or Wade much. did you not see what Wade achieved with that wack a(s)s Miami team he had in 2008 w/ a rookie team and a rookie coach to boot? they had no business making the playoffs let alone take that Atlanta Hawks team to 7 games. You underestimate this team w/out Lebron.

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 03:00 AM
Yeah, you made a great case against LeBron :rolleyes:

I knew you couldn't. Just because Heat fans see the reality which is clear as day light they are bad and ex-cavs fans. Your posts are embarrassing. I asked you to make a case against LeBron you got mad and came out with personal attacks :laugh2:
lol, naps you're a kid. grow some nuts there were no personal attacks. if i'm not mistaken the childish 'shut up' comment came from you mouth. unlike yourself i'd much rather let you keep talking to keep proving my point about Heat fans over taking LA fans. hating and mad.

M.Bibby2.0
05-15-2012, 03:00 AM
I assume you don't follow Miami or Wade much. did you not see what Wade achieved with that wack a(s)s Miami team he had in 2008 w/ a rookie team and a rookie coach to boot? they had no business making the playoffs let alone take that Atlanta Hawks team to 7 games. You underestimate this team w/out Lebron.

Wades also not at the same level he was in 2008. and some achievement: they lost to a non contender in the first round.

TheIlladelph16
05-15-2012, 03:03 AM
I assume you don't follow Miami or Wade much. did you not see what Wade achieved with that wack a(s)s Miami team he had in 2008 w/ a rookie team and a rookie coach to boot? they had no business making the playoffs let alone take that Atlanta Hawks team to 7 games. You underestimate this team w/out Lebron.

This is 2012 and Wade has four (maybe 3?) seasons of basketball wear and tear on his body since 2008. His style of play has resulted in a lot of injuries over the last few years and have slowed his game a bit and forced him to adjust his style of play. He is still a very good player, but is he the dominant, driving force he used to be? No. The Heat w/o Lebron with Wade missing 25% of the season would not be as great of a team as your making them out to be.

naps
05-15-2012, 03:05 AM
lol, naps you're a kid. grow some nuts there were no personal attacks. if i'm not mistaken the childish 'shut up' comment came from you mouth. unlike yourself i'd much rather let you keep talking to keep proving my point about Heat fans over taking LA fans. hating and mad.

:laugh2:

Good comeback.You are getting personal and calling me a kid LMFAO! Now can you make a case for someone against LeBron instead of mumbling like a kid "LeBron shouldn't get it because he plays with Wade."?

YoungOne
05-15-2012, 03:13 AM
take lebron off the heat and they are a borderline playoffteam.

3ballbomber
05-15-2012, 03:16 AM
Wades also not at the same level he was in 2008. and some achievement: they lost to a non contender in the first round.
pretty sure it was only last season where Wade had one of the best finals stats/performances in nba playoffs history close to achieving his 2nd MVP had Miami won. C'mon man be real.

edit: my initial point was....that Hawks team was 20 X better than What Wade was playing w/ that season. Yet it took them 7 games to defeat that inexperienced bunch. Take away Wade from that seasons line up and they would be lottery bound being the bottom of the ladder.

Swashcuff
05-15-2012, 09:40 AM
Look I can assign arbitrary constraints for mvp too:
-can't play with top 3 PG
-can't have the leagues best shot blocker
-can't have the 6th man of the year
Oops sorry Durant your not eligible.

Without LeBron the heat are not a championship calibre team.

But wait people said Allen Iverson didn't deserve his MVP because he had the DPOY (who played less than half the season in a 76ers uniform and in no way shape or form did he change the dynamic of the team), had the SMOY (who really didn't deserve to be 6MOY since he was basically average as a bench player and solid when he started) and the COY (which Scott Brooks won not too long ago).

One thing A.I. didn't have however was the Top 3 player, or another player who was capable of scoring 25 points in a game (no player other than A.I. in that entire season scored more than 25 for Philly nor were they capable of doing so).

People said A.I. had more than enough help. So what about Durant. Russell Westbrook and James Harden are capable to go for 25+ on any given night Serge Ibaka finished 2nd in DPOY and Scott Brooks isn't that far removed from being considered as one of the top coaches in the game.

People who say that Durant doesn't have help are flat out ********.

Swashcuff
05-15-2012, 09:48 AM
lol, oh please...w/out Lebron Miami would have had the money to address many gaping holes in their team from depth to the on going center and pg issues. Not sure if you realize but Wade can carry a team fairly well and even minus Lebron this is one of the best team mates he has ever had. imagine if they were more balanced w/ depth.

Do you know what happened last time Wade missed more than a quarter of the Heat's games in a season? They won just 15 games. This season when he missed 17 games they won 14.

LeBron James is the most valuable player on that team. Imagine if they were more balanced with depth? They'd be considered in the same light as the Bulls. A solid regular season team but just not good enough to get over the hump and be considered legit title contenders. They'd just be the East's version of the Thunder in terms of structure but just not as good overall.

Remove Wade however and give LeBron a player of Chris Bosh's calibre and add those pieces in which you alluded to and they'd be considered legit threats to the title for years to come. LeBron is that valuable. You do know that the Heat's strong suite is defense right and LeBron is their defensive anchor. Without LeBron they'd go from being an Elite Defensive team to a middle of the pack defensive team.

LeBron is the MVP. Live with it. I'm not a Heat fan but I can agree with Naps for calling you a hater because that's all you do when the topic is LeBron James.

john545455
05-15-2012, 09:55 AM
Lebron is a joke

D12 fan
05-15-2012, 10:15 AM
I'm just glad I'm not a Magic fan

Dwight fan buddy.

D12 fan
05-15-2012, 10:21 AM
This thread has turned into a Chicago troll thread.Man the hate for Lebron is ridiculous,I not that big of fan of Lebron,but the guy is the best player in the world,and he deserved the MVP this year.


Im still waiting for Chi town(troll),to explain his reason to why Nash/Love/Pierce derserve MVP over Lebron?

bucketss
05-15-2012, 10:55 AM
you are not serious w/ this argument. How in the world did Miami fans become worse than Lakers fans. And to think most of you are ex Cavs fans. congrats the lot of you. everybody mad and hating.

lol do yourself a favor and just try to stay out of lebron related threads you get to emotional my friend

BULLSFAN0810
05-15-2012, 11:00 AM
Wow... So much of this is unreadable. But what the **** does the triple post offense have to do with anything we're talking about? That's the equivalent of you telling me I know nothing about baseball statistics and then me explaining how a ****ing squeeze bunt works. It's completely irrelevant.

But seriously, I think it's hard for me or anyone else in this forum to take you remotely seriously, because you can barely string coherent sentences together. Perhaps you should focus on simple sentence structure and punctuation before you try to make a persuasive argument on an internet forum. If anything, you've displayed the very epitome of ignorance. :shrug:

You guys call people ignorant, but don't know offenses or defenses, never played ball all day in your life. You called me ignorant therefore, I explained the triangle, the offense most nba players don't like and can't understand. And as far as my sentence youre hating...and its shameful. A grown *** man, getting butt hurt and cant debate, so they call names, avoiding a real convo. What a real man! Cant fist fight mentally, so he throw low blows. Any real G, would've read my statement, maybe got mad and moved on, but youre soo small minded you had to insult me, a person not insulting you, I don't know you.. I don't throw your short comings in your face.. Your broke compared to me. And I know this without knowing you. Now we can talk ball or **** on each other about baby ****. Our we can learn from each other. I have watched 20 years of ball, half of them high school, and mid majors. I have friends who play in the nba, actual friends. We talk ball, I'm not an insider, but I know ball.and to hrat you not debate me, you come off as lame, I don't know you and I don't wanna know you.

BklynKnicks3
05-15-2012, 11:11 AM
lebron is a coward who took the easy was out and the league rewards that what a joke. Their are players whos team would be lucky to get 30 wins without them. Heat would be a contender in the eastw ith out lecunt

bucketss
05-15-2012, 11:16 AM
lebron is a coward who took the easy was out and the league rewards that what a joke. Their are players whos team would be lucky to get 30 wins without them. Heat would be a contender in the eastw ith out lecunt

can i ask you a question? a couple actually who do you think is the best team in the league and who will win the championship this year?

bucketss
05-15-2012, 11:18 AM
when miami is winning "wahh they're cheaters taking the easy way out they ruined the league who can compete with two superstars,refs are helping them" when they're losing " lol heat suck, bron and wade don't compliment each other, they should have used lebrons money on role players, lebron should have went to chi town,new york blah blah"

BULLSFAN0810
05-15-2012, 11:23 AM
lebron is a coward who took the easy was out and the league rewards that what a joke. Their are players whos team would be lucky to get 30 wins without them. Heat would be a contender in the eastw ith out lecunt

And I plus one this statement, people have the right to feel this way..some people have morals that see this as weak, some see this as smart, but this argument is valid imo, but I feel I don't need to say it bc James play this year with all the good, he played very suspect, and I look over and see Durants team, and how Durant is playing plus record .Why not Durant?

MTL_123
05-15-2012, 11:31 AM
lebron is a coward who took the easy was out and the league rewards that what a joke. Their are players whos team would be lucky to get 30 wins without them. Heat would be a contender in the eastw ith out lecunt

can u explain to me wat melo did again hater

bucketss
05-15-2012, 11:31 AM
And I plus one this statement, people have the right to feel this way..some people have morals that see this as weak, some see this as smart, but this argument is valid imo, but I feel I don't need to say it bc James play this year with all the good, he played very suspect, and I look over and see Durants team, and how Durant is playing plus record .Why not Durant?

how did durant play better than lebron?

bucketss
05-15-2012, 11:35 AM
can u explain to me wat melo did again hater

lol i guess when chris paul,melo and amare made a toast in melos wedding that they would team up they were cowards... luckily for paul he found out what a trap new york would have been and went to the more balanced clippers team

mightybosstone
05-15-2012, 11:35 AM
lebron is a coward who took the easy was out and the league rewards that what a joke. Their are players whos team would be lucky to get 30 wins without them. Heat would be a contender in the eastw ith out lecunt


And I plus one this statement, people have the right to feel this way..some people have morals that see this as weak, some see this as smart, but this argument is valid imo, but I feel I don't need to say it bc James play this year with all the good, he played very suspect, and I look over and see Durants team, and how Durant is playing plus record .Why not Durant?

Regardless of your completely overblown opinion on "The Decision" and incessant wining, the decision has literally NOTHING to do with him winning the MVP for the 2011-2012 NBA season. I doubt there are many MVP voters out there who approved of The Decision or how that whole situation played out (which is why they probably didn't vote for him last year even though he was probably the MVP), but how does that have any bearing on him winning the award a year later?

Bottom line, he was the most dominant player in the NBA this season, the Heat would be a mediocre basketball team without him and none of you have yet to make a legitimate argument as to why he shouldn't have won the award.

mightybosstone
05-15-2012, 11:38 AM
lol i guess when chris paul,melo and amare made a toast in melos wedding that they would team up they were cowards... luckily for paul he found out what a trap new york would have been and went to the more balanced clippers team

While I agree that New York is currently a mess, I don't think for a second that adding Chris Paul wouldn't have made them a top 3 seed in the East. The Clippers "balance" is really no more balanced than New York, as they essentially have Paul, Griffin, Billups (when healthy) and a bunch of average-below average role players.

behindmydesk
05-15-2012, 11:41 AM
Hopefully everyone got enough trolling and yelling at each other for the past 24 hours.

/Closed