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View Full Version : How can fans defend stuff like this....



KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 01:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBFo-34hRdM

i honestly dont know how any fan base could justify this and say that there players dont get preferential treatment. I mean i know that the refs dont have it easy because they are watching everything in real time but i mean COME ON.

all a player has to do now a days is throws his arms in the air or fall to the floor and its almost automatically a foul. Sometimes there doesnt even need to be contact a player just simply has to be around another player and fall down.

and just to show that the heat players arent the only ones that do it (they are just ALWAYS on TV) But these are HUGE MEN and they are flopping around the court like fish!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKqngAjDfSg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTd5vDfYTJM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EVPzbkpgQs

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 01:56 PM
and with the way the playoff's in general are going right now there is going to be an even longer flopping compilation made by the end of it.....

justinnum1
05-04-2012, 01:58 PM
:bla:

Fnom11
05-04-2012, 02:02 PM
Most of those flops aren't even flops on purpose. It's just people landing awkwardly.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:03 PM
see you say that but all that does is condone that what they are doing is right. I mean it's one thing to defend your team but it's another to just completely ignore the fact that they're making a mockery of the sport.

You must not like basketball.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:05 PM
Most of those flops aren't even flops on purpose. It's just people landing awkwardly.

see this is just an excuse to justify what they are doing is okay. What they are doing is adding an element to basketball (flopping) and making it acceptable when that is not how the game should be played.

But by all means if it means YOUR team is winning then its okay right?

Kashmir13579
05-04-2012, 02:05 PM
Its just sad that they're the best players in the world and they have to resort to this. And NO i do not think Knicks are getting swept because of Miami's flopping.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:06 PM
Most of those flops aren't even flops on purpose. It's just people landing awkwardly.

and if you could point out which of those were caused by anyone landing awkardly?

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:09 PM
Its just sad that they're the best players in the world and they have to resort to this. And NO i do not think Knicks are getting swept because of Miami's flopping.

clearly Miami is the better team and thats no disrespect to the Knicks. i think that the Heat would still be up 3-0 BUT i think all the games would be a hell of a lot closer without A LOT of these calls that swing momentum in favor of the heat all the time!

Again this is not just about the Heat because EVERY team has a player or 2 that are known to flop its just becoming pathetic that FANBASES are starting to say its okay just because they're team is winning

Chronz
05-04-2012, 02:10 PM
Well so long as it helps your team win, they wont stop doing it.

LongIslandIcedZ
05-04-2012, 02:10 PM
I don't blame the players too much. Their trying to win a game, and if they know flopping wont get called may as well do it.

Having said that, I don't like the idea of flopping and wish the refs could limit it

beasted86
05-04-2012, 02:11 PM
Flopping is only 1 small part in the grand scheme of all the NBA's refereeing and rule issues. Some people will say it has watered down the sport, others will say it's the only way the league can adapt to the 21st century of players... because I can make a good argument half the players wouldn't stand a chance without some of the rules.

We can have a debate that lasts all day about flopping, traveling, goal-tending, what is/isn't an offensive foul, 3 second violation, etc. And just as a tidbit nobody ever talks about... go find an NBA rule book on what they define as a FT lane violation, and tell me 99.9% of 2nd free throws taken in the NBA if they don't result in a lane violation.

Just get over it and live with it.

Byronicle
05-04-2012, 02:12 PM
Miami is close, if not tied for having the most floppers on their team. The other being the Clippers

to say the big 3 don't flop, then you are a homer. Bosh defending Boozer is all I got to say

it is sad that even though these players get phantom calls, they have to go about other means to draw more calls in their favour

justinnum1
05-04-2012, 02:12 PM
Honestly the way i see it is bron should get more calls then he does, every time he goes to the rim he gets contact and many times refs dont call it because he is so big and strong, similar to how they didnt call it on shaq. I'm sure there are many more times where fouls go uncalled then when he flops. many many more times.

Max.This
05-04-2012, 02:17 PM
lost cause for the thread man to be honest. half of your videos are about the Miami HEAT. Everyone and their mothers know that HEAT fans are going to dismiss it. You should've just put the 2nd part without the HEAT and you would get different responses.

Kashmir13579
05-04-2012, 02:19 PM
Honestly the way i see it is bron should get more calls then he does, every time he goes to the rim he gets contact and many times refs dont call it because he is so big and strong, similar to how they didnt call it on shaq. I'm sure there are many more times where fouls go uncalled then when he flops. many many more times.

I could say the same thing about 'Melo but i won't. But anyways, if thats true then the refs should call the foul when he actually gets fouled instead of the tic tacs. He should be getting the same amount of FTs its just a matter of when the refs call it.

FreakaNashur
05-04-2012, 02:19 PM
yawns.

the refs invent calls for the home teams. game 1 n 2 knicks fans complained about that ********. in game 3 the refs gave them all the calls that they needed and still loss.

i find it funny how most of those highlights is of heat players, when the clippers are the biggest floppers in the nba. even manu ginobili flops harder than lebron.

justinnum1
05-04-2012, 02:21 PM
I could say the same thing about 'Melo but i won't. But anyways, if thats true then the refs should call the foul when he actually gets fouled instead of the tic tacs. He should be getting the same amount of FTs its just a matter of when the refs call it.

Difference is lebron goes to the rim at least twice as much as melo does.

I thought the refs did everything they could to help the knicks last night. That meltdown right before halftime did it in for them.

ldawg
05-04-2012, 02:23 PM
Holly crap thats a whole lot of flopping in that short video just imagine how mush BS calls Miami gets away with. You can't come two inches of these clowns. Good lord that crazy. The NBA need a crew to go back and watch films and fine players who flops.

Max.This
05-04-2012, 02:24 PM
yawns.

the refs invent calls for the home teams. game 1 n 2 knicks fans complained about that ********. in game 3 the refs gave them all the calls that they needed and still loss.

i find it funny how most of those highlights is of heat players, when the clippers are the biggest floppers in the nba. even manu ginobili flops harder than lebron.

Wade flops harder then all 3 of them. Every play wade flops. He acts like a gun shot him half way in the air. ginobli flops, but hes not 6 8 260 and acts like a freight train hit him. How are the knicks in this conversation, noone once mentioned the Knicks in this thread

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 02:25 PM
Honestly the way i see it is bron should get more calls then he does, every time he goes to the rim he gets contact and many times refs dont call it because he is so big and strong, similar to how they didnt call it on shaq. I'm sure there are many more times where fouls go uncalled then when he flops. many many more times.

This difference there being...non-calls, missed calls, wrong calls, are all part of every sport. It is reflective of human imperfection. Flopping, flailing, grabbing your eye, head, mouth, etc, falling down when no one touched you; those are all things that have been introduced to sport, which have nothing to do with human error. One does not justify the other. And saying it does just goes to show how bad the league is now that fans are willing to justify these actions.

This is prevalent on all teams. It is ridiculous. It is making a mockery of the sport. Justifying it doesn't make it right or okay. It just means that you have a winning team and are willing to overlook it as long as your team continues to get the benefit of them.

I am a Bulls fan. There are guys on the Bulls that flop. Boozer is a strong man, but he flops. And I HATE it. I am not willing to overlook it because my team has been successful over the last few years. The NBA needs to make some major changes in the way the sport is officiated. You can say it is just the way it is all you want, but that does not help the sport you supposedly love get better.

(Not picking on you, or singling you out justinnum1, just used your post as a jumping off point.)

JWO35
05-04-2012, 02:25 PM
I blame the refs, apart from literally scoring on your own basket...everything is a foul :facepalm:

beasted86
05-04-2012, 02:30 PM
Miami is close, if not tied for having the most floppers on their team. The other being the Clippers

to say the big 3 don't flop, then you are a homer. Bosh defending Boozer is all I got to say

it is sad that even though these players get phantom calls, they have to go about other means to draw more calls in their favour

You picked a bad choice of worst call. Boozer did hit Bosh in the nose with an elbow. Bosh over exaggerated and got the call. But the fact that the glancing blow probably didn't even hurt Bosh, and it took him a good second to figure out he got hit and flopped was what made it bad.

I've seen plays where the player didn't even touch the other guy and wasn't near them. Ex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2k8koWn61dA

But like I said earlier, fans need to get over it.

Gators123
05-04-2012, 02:30 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTQV5AVyqEU

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:33 PM
Honestly the way i see it is bron should get more calls then he does, every time he goes to the rim he gets contact and many times refs dont call it because he is so big and strong, similar to how they didnt call it on shaq. I'm sure there are many more times where fouls go uncalled then when he flops. many many more times.

BASKETBALL HAS CONTACT DUDE! This is exactly what i mean......just because there is contact does not make it a foul.

And to another person that said just get over it was a HEAT fan. Of course you're not man because it doesn't affect your team. Hell it only benefits em. You must not like the actual sport of basketball though. You know the one where when you play a pick-up game and everyone is always hating on the guy that calls SOFT fouls......that must be the sport you love

Cubby
05-04-2012, 02:34 PM
Honestly the way i see it is bron should get more calls then he does, every time he goes to the rim he gets contact and many times refs dont call it because he is so big and strong, similar to how they didnt call it on shaq. I'm sure there are many more times where fouls go uncalled then when he flops. many many more times.

Rose played at the rim more often than LeBron and still got significantly less calls.

Klivlend
05-04-2012, 02:36 PM
Flopping should be reviewed after the game and be a fineable offense. And, the fines should increase with each offense. It's the only way we can stop the BS floppers.

mvb815
05-04-2012, 02:37 PM
the boozer-bosh thing was a flop, looking at most of that video, most of those weren't flops. i'm not saying the heat don't flop because lord knows they do, but a lot of those so called "flops" in the video are just basketball reactions.

if you're going up and somebody slams the ball out of your hands, your arms are still going to go up.

right now it just seems like people are coming up with any excuse they can to discredit the heat winning a title. you guys just need to face facts, it's going to happen regardless on what you want to see happen.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:37 PM
This difference there being...non-calls, missed calls, wrong calls, are all part of every sport. It is reflective of human imperfection. Flopping, flailing, grabbing your eye, head, mouth, etc, falling down when no one touched you; those are all things that have been introduced to sport, which have nothing to do with human error. One does not justify the other. And saying it does just goes to show how bad the league is now that fans are willing to justify these actions.

This is prevalent on all teams. It is ridiculous. It is making a mockery of the sport. Justifying it doesn't make it right or okay. It just means that you have a winning team and are willing to overlook it as long as your team continues to get the benefit of them.

I am a Bulls fan. There are guys on the Bulls that flop. Boozer is a strong man, but he flops. And I HATE it. I am not willing to overlook it because my team has been successful over the last few years. The NBA needs to make some major changes in the way the sport is officiated. You can say it is just the way it is all you want, but that does not help the sport you supposedly love get better. (Not picking on you, or singling you out justinnum1, just used your post as a jumping off point.)

everything in bold is right :clap:

Kashmir13579
05-04-2012, 02:39 PM
Difference is lebron goes to the rim at least twice as much as melo does.
In the halfcourt? I disagree. they both shoot around 25% of their looks close to or at the rim. Lebron is just a better finisher and gets blocked much less.

I thought the refs did everything they could to help the knicks last night. That meltdown right before halftime did it in for them.
not sure what you're getting at here, or how it applies to the conversation.

Fnom11
05-04-2012, 02:39 PM
This difference there being...non-calls, missed calls, wrong calls, are all part of every sport. It is reflective of human imperfection. Flopping, flailing, grabbing your eye, head, mouth, etc, falling down when no one touched you; those are all things that have been introduced to sport, which have nothing to do with human error. One does not justify the other. And saying it does just goes to show how bad the league is now that fans are willing to justify these actions.

This is prevalent on all teams. It is ridiculous. It is making a mockery of the sport. Justifying it doesn't make it right or okay. It just means that you have a winning team and are willing to overlook it as long as your team continues to get the benefit of them.

I am a Bulls fan. There are guys on the Bulls that flop. Boozer is a strong man, but he flops. And I HATE it. I am not willing to overlook it because my team has been successful over the last few years. The NBA needs to make some major changes in the way the sport is officiated. You can say it is just the way it is all you want, but that does not help the sport you supposedly love get better.

(Not picking on you, or singling you out justinnum1, just used your post as a jumping off point.)


I agree 100%. However, you can't just expect teams that want to contend to not try every to do everything they can to win. It honestly seemed like everyone wrote of flops, including all the BS ones Blake and CP3 have had this year, but once the Heat did it in the playoffs it's now a travesty.



You can thank the Clippers for actually pioneering flopping as a team effort. It's going to get a lot more popular until there's a rule change about it.

fishedz
05-04-2012, 02:48 PM
This is why I stopped watching NBA games. The refs sway games, have been doing it for decades, and the players these days are puss$es. I miss the 80's game honestly, it was much better then. Watching the video of the Heat is embarassing and makes me gald they did not win anything. Am I a hater? yeah...of anyone who pulls BS like that. I hope for the sake of the players that actually play, they never win anything. I mean seriously....if Magic, Bird, Nique, Jordan....ever did anything like this on a regular basis they would have been flamed. Watching stuff like this makes me wish there was a bounty system in the NBA and guys like Lebron and Griffin got their ACL's blown out.

Hater? Yup...haven't been able to watch the NBA games for years. But I'll still keep my collections of cards and Beckett's I got as a kid to remeber when it was a real competition.

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 02:50 PM
I agree 100%. However, you can't just expect teams that want to contend to not try every to do everything they can to win. It honestly seemed like everyone wrote of flops, including all the BS ones Blake and CP3 have had this year, but once the Heat did it in the playoffs it's now a travesty.



You can thank the Clippers for actually pioneering flopping as a team effort. It's going to get a lot more popular until there's a rule change about it.

I agree with you. Players have always tried to get every advantage they could get. And once flopping was introduced, it was bound to become an epidemic. I mostly blame the refs and the league for not having a handle on this.

But the level to which the players are now taking it is disgraceful. They could, and should have integrity for themselves. But they don't. It is just another thing that has gone the way of players not actually caring about the sport itself, the history, or the integrity of the game.

And I don't have a problem with the Heat specifically doing this. I have a problem with ALL players doing this. The Heat get more flak for it in general because they get a ton of benefit from it. It is what happens when you have stars on your team. They happen to have some of the brightest stars in the league. So they are going to get a larger benefit, and more hate because of it.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 02:51 PM
God this just gets more and more ridiculous.. you can tell a lot of people on here have never played basketball..

FLOPPING is not something someone thinks about lol.. you guys act like they go out there with the sole purpose of flopping.. lol I swear some kids see something in slow motion and all of the sudden its a flop??

I GUARANTEE that if you took film of every single game I played and every single time I got hit by somebody and you slowed that down, my arms and body would probably FLAIL all over the place.. doesn't mean I flopped LOL

i swear.. some people damn

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:55 PM
the boozer-bosh thing was a flop, looking at most of that video, most of those weren't flops. i'm not saying the heat don't flop because lord knows they do, but a lot of those so called "flops" in the video are just basketball reactions.

if you're going up and somebody slams the ball out of your hands, your arms are still going to go up.

right now it just seems like people are coming up with any excuse they can to discredit the heat winning a title. you guys just need to face facts, it's going to happen regardless on what you want to see happen.

just curious if you are a fan of the heat or there players. And "basketball reaction"? You say we are the ones making an excuse? come on man, its one thing to throw up your arms but to fall to the floor, jerk your head back, scream, hold you eye mouth or head those are not basketball reactions

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 02:55 PM
God this just gets more and more ridiculous.. you can tell a lot of people on here have never played basketball..

FLOPPING is not something someone thinks about lol.. you guys act like they go out there with the sole purpose of flopping.. lol I swear some kids see something in slow motion and all of the sudden its a flop??

I GUARANTEE that if you took film of every single game I played and every single time I got hit by somebody and you slowed that down, my arms and body would probably FLAIL all over the place.. doesn't mean I flopped LOL

i swear.. some people damn

You can't be serious in saying that these guys have not thought about flopping, learned how to flop, know where the ref is and how to flop in order to get the call based on the ref's positioning.

Flopping is now a learned skill. I played basketball growing up, still play pick-up games multiple times a week. I knew exactly what I could get away with, get a call for in an organized game, that would get me punched in a pick up game. And my organized basketball playing days was almost 20 years ago. The concept of flopping is not new. It has been around AT LEAST since the 80's. Players had a different outlook and view of the game at the time.

If you truly think that what you wrote, you are incredibly naive.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:58 PM
God this just gets more and more ridiculous.. you can tell a lot of people on here have never played basketball..

FLOPPING is not something someone thinks about lol.. you guys act like they go out there with the sole purpose of flopping.. lol I swear some kids see something in slow motion and all of the sudden its a flop??

I GUARANTEE that if you took film of every single game I played and every single time I got hit by somebody and you slowed that down, my arms and body would probably FLAIL all over the place.. doesn't mean I flopped LOL

i swear.. some people damn

i can tell you never played basketball if you watched all of those videos and say without a doubt that those weren't purpose flops. HELL lebron winked in one of the videos!!!!!

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 02:59 PM
You can't be serious in saying that these guys have not thought about flopping, learned how to flop, know where the ref is and how to flop in order to get the call based on the ref's positioning.

Flopping is now a learned skill. I played basketball growing up, still play pick-up games multiple times a week. I knew exactly what I could get away with, get a call for in an organized game, that would get me punched in a pick up game. And my organized basketball playing days was almost 20 years ago. The concept of flopping is not new. It has been around AT LEAST since the 80's. Players had a different outlook and view of the game at the time.

If you truly think that what you wrote, you are incredibly naive.

you and i think alike

NoahH
05-04-2012, 03:04 PM
GTFO judging from your avatar you're a Vikings fan so a T-Wolves fan as well? Its not the problem of the Miami HEAT that you guys are perennial losers. Haters everywhere I tell ya

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:06 PM
I agree 100%. However, you can't just expect teams that want to contend to not try every to do everything they can to win. It honestly seemed like everyone wrote of flops, including all the BS ones Blake and CP3 have had this year, but once the Heat did it in the playoffs it's now a travesty.



You can thank the Clippers for actually pioneering flopping as a team effort. It's going to get a lot more popular until there's a rule change about it.

okay and i can see the logic in that BUT then you can't get mad at people calling said player (lebron, wade) out when they do. And the fact that Lebron is always being mentioned with the ALL-TIME Great's people are always going to use this as an arguement of why he will never be the best when its all said and done.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:08 PM
GTFO judging from your avatar you're a Vikings fan so a T-Wolves fan as well? Its not the problem of the Miami HEAT that you guys are perennial losers. Haters everywhere I tell ya

WRONG! I'm from Sacramento actually so i am a Kings fan Hence the name KINGSmadness....but anyways thank you for your ignorant post in which you contributed absolutely nothing to the conversation except for TRYING to bash the team that i like because you cant make a valid arguement because you're ignorant

Nymfan87
05-04-2012, 03:11 PM
GTFO judging from your avatar you're a Vikings fan so a T-Wolves fan as well? Its not the problem of the Miami HEAT that you guys are perennial losers. Haters everywhere I tell ya

Gotta love posts like this. The validity of a person's statement is tied directly to the winning percentage of their favorite team. Seems legit. If anything, it's usually an inverse relationship between a team's average poster intelligence and the team's winning percentage.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:14 PM
THIS IS NOT JUST ABOUT THE HEAT!!!!!!!

Every single NBA team has players that flop. What the whole point of this thread was to point out the fact that fanbases, Such as Miami as a lot of there fans have made it blatantly obvious, give these players a pass and try to do there best to justify it.

If you really love the sport of basketball then you would not be trying to justify what all of these players do. I mean if it happened once or twice in an ENTIRE game thats understandable because you do want to win. But its getting to the point where you have players on both offense and defense just fall down out of no where just to get a call.

again this is everyteam!!!!!

And it doesn't help that the best player in Basketball is also one of the most notorious...

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:15 PM
You can't be serious in saying that these guys have not thought about flopping, learned how to flop, know where the ref is and how to flop in order to get the call based on the ref's positioning.

Flopping is now a learned skill. I played basketball growing up, still play pick-up games multiple times a week. I knew exactly what I could get away with, get a call for in an organized game, that would get me punched in a pick up game. And my organized basketball playing days was almost 20 years ago. The concept of flopping is not new. It has been around AT LEAST since the 80's. Players had a different outlook and view of the game at the time.

If you truly think that what you wrote, you are incredibly naive.

LMAO naive? are you serious?? I'm not naive.. I just use ****ing logic.. yes has lebron flopped before?? LOL no ****.. has dwade flopped before?? NO ****

But its funny how this thread is basically on the notion that they are ruining the game which is COMPLETELY false...

Ill give you an example.. I was lurking during my ban and the Knicks fans and everyone else who HATES the heat were giving **** to LeBron and saying he flopped when Chandler hit him....


ARE you ****ING SERIouS?? LeBron FLOPPED when he got leveled in the back of the neck and didn't even see it coming?? That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard........

god its ****ing pathetic people that analyze everything in slow motion and somehow they know that when LeBron flailed his arms it was because he FLOPPED? ****ING pathetic..

Hawkeye15
05-04-2012, 03:16 PM
Well so long as it helps your team win, they wont stop doing it.

yep. Furthermore, until the NBA puts the clamps on it, expect to see it more and more. LeBron never used to flop and all of a sudden he realizes he can get even MORE calls by doing so.

It will get worse and worse league wide until the NBA shuts it down, so stop whining about the players and concentrate on the NBA peeps.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:23 PM
LMAO naive? are you serious?? I'm not naive.. I just use ****ing logic.. yes has lebron flopped before?? LOL no ****.. has dwade flopped before?? NO ****

But its funny how this thread is basically on the notion that they are ruining the game which is COMPLETELY false...

Ill give you an example.. I was lurking during my ban and the Knicks fans and everyone else who HATES the heat were giving **** to LeBron and saying he flopped when Chandler hit him....


ARE you ****ING SERIouS?? LeBron FLOPPED when he got leveled in the back of the neck and didn't even see it coming?? That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard........

god its ****ing pathetic people that analyze everything in slow motion and somehow they know that when LeBron flailed his arms it was because he FLOPPED? ****ING pathetic..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihuOrQHSjWQ

Just watch that video and justify it. Because that is almost the same reaction that he gave when tyson chandler SCREENED him

Here's the video just for laughs.......BTW where the hell did he get hit in the neck?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2HfddsZ-oE

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:26 PM
THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT PLAYERS FLOPPING!!!!!!! read the thread title its about how can FANS of basketball defend what these players are doing? I know flopping isn't going to stop BUT the point i am trying to make is why are fans justifying what they're doing?

I don't know about you guys but I love the sport before the players.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:27 PM
Dude I said that I know LeBron James flops lol....


And okay he didn't get hit in the neck but his momentum was moving backwards and Chandler countered that with a shot to the upper back which naturally creates whiplash and affects how his arms moved..

I know this for a fact when I've gotten hit or my neck has been hurt I'll look like like a crippled idiot because sometimes it hurts to stand in a normal position when your neck is all out of whack lol so w.e you can keep calling that a flop but someone cant FLOP if they get BLINDSIDED lmao... common ****ING sense

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:28 PM
LMAO naive? are you serious?? I'm not naive.. I just use ****ing logic.. yes has lebron flopped before?? LOL no ****.. has dwade flopped before?? NO ****

But its funny how this thread is basically on the notion that they are ruining the game which is COMPLETELY false...

Ill give you an example.. I was lurking during my ban and the Knicks fans and everyone else who HATES the heat were giving **** to LeBron and saying he flopped when Chandler hit him....


ARE you ****ING SERIouS?? LeBron FLOPPED when he got leveled in the back of the neck and didn't even see it coming?? That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard........

god its ****ing pathetic people that analyze everything in slow motion and somehow they know that when LeBron flailed his arms it was because he FLOPPED? ****ING pathetic..

Except that when LeBron was younger, and didn't flop as much, he was hit SEVERAL times, much harder, without the same exaggerated movement. Yes, these guys get hit. They get hit hard. Some of their body movements are a direct result of them getting hit. And others, a large majority of them at this point, are easily seen, in regular speed, and in slow motion, as being completely and utterly exaggerated.

To think otherwise is just plain being blind. I'm not talking about, "Oh hey, Blake Griffin was hit by Jason Smith like Smith was a linebacker...but he flopped." That is not what I am saying here. I am saying it has become a very PRONOUNCED issue that Blake (and every other player, just using Blake because I used him the example) also contorts their body, grabs their face or the back of their head, winces like a little kid, when they are simply swipped on the arm. Oh and by the way, they do it WHEN THEY ARE NOT HIT AT ALL.

This is a major issue that is yes, ruining the sport in many people's eyes. The league MUST do something to stop it. The players will do what they can as long as they are allowed to do it. Should the players have more respect for the game and for themselves? YES. But they don't, so it will be up to the league to fix it, or like Hawkeye said, it will get worse until they do. The onus is on the league.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:28 PM
And to answer your question OP just be thankful this isn't ****ing soccer because they actually have a problem with flopping

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:32 PM
Except that when LeBron was younger, and didn't flop as much, he was hit SEVERAL times, much harder, without the same exaggerated movement. Yes, these guys get hit. They get hit hard. Some of their body movements are a direct result of them getting hit. And others, a large majority of them at this point, are easily seen, in regular speed, and in slow motion, as being completely and utterly exaggerated.

To think otherwise is just plain being blind. I'm not talking about, "Oh hey, Blake Griffin was hit by Jason Smith like Smith was a linebacker...but he flopped." That is not what I am saying here. I am saying it has become a very PRONOUNCED issue that Blake (and every other player, just using Blake because I used him the example) also contorts their body, grabs their face or the back of their head, winces like a little kid, when they are simply swipped on the arm. Oh and by the way, they do it WHEN THEY ARE NOT HIT AT ALL.

This is a major issue that is yes, ruining the sport in many people's eyes. The league MUST do something to stop it. The players will do what they can as long as they are allowed to do it. Should the players have more respect for the game and for themselves? YES. But they don't, so it will be up to the league to fix it, or like Hawkeye said, it will get worse until they do. The onus is on the league.

Yes I agree with the majority of this. But honestly... do you really think that because LeBron flops every now and then that it is ruining the game??

How about we talk about players who FLOP more often or we talk about ways to IMPROVE the game in other more important areas. Like the OFFICIATING. Star calls are a way bigger issue than flopping... when a game isn't called fairly thats just bull ****

Ch0ZSeN1
05-04-2012, 03:33 PM
It's crazy how when Lebron and wade drive to the rim the refs are ready to blow the whistle every time! They give them the and 1 nine out of ten times.. The refs anticipate the contact, u can't do that! N that ONE time that Lebron and Wade dont get the call they cry to the refs! Give me a break dude!

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:35 PM
Dude I said that I know LeBron James flops lol....


And okay he didn't get hit in the neck but his momentum was moving backwards and Chandler countered that with a shot to the upper back which naturally creates whiplash and affects how his arms moved..

I know this for a fact when I've gotten hit or my neck has been hurt I'll look like like a crippled idiot because sometimes it hurts to stand in a normal position when your neck is all out of whack lol so w.e you can keep calling that a flop but someone cant FLOP if they get BLINDSIDED lmao... common ****ING sense

There is literally no medical explanation for how LeBron went down when he was hit by Chandler. Those are NOT NATURAL body movements. And yes, when you get abruptly stopped, that part you cannot flop on...the problem is that LeBron flails AFTER the initial body reaction. You can see in the video, TWO distinct body "reactions". (As proven by the difference between John Lucas' body reaction and LeBron's on the two separate plays with the same type of hit.) Watch it again and just stop trying to excuse it away as natural body response to getting hit. The excuse is now bordering on ludicrous after being presented the videos that have been linked on here.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:35 PM
Dude I said that I know LeBron James flops lol....


And okay he didn't get hit in the neck but his momentum was moving backwards and Chandler countered that with a shot to the upper back which naturally creates whiplash and affects how his arms moved..

I know this for a fact when I've gotten hit or my neck has been hurt I'll look like like a crippled idiot because sometimes it hurts to stand in a normal position when your neck is all out of whack lol so w.e you can keep calling that a flop but someone cant FLOP if they get BLINDSIDED lmao... common ****ING sense

okay so either John Lucas whose 5'11 165 is a tough lil dude or lebron whose 6'8 250 is a little girl. and you can't say that the video of Lebron/Rose and Lebron/Chandler the reaction wasn't to far off?

BTW in response to your other post about basketball not being as bad as soccer......in my opinion its getting pretty damn close to it. And just for the record both sports are contact sports!!!!!

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:37 PM
And to answer your question OP just be thankful this isn't ****ing soccer because they actually have a problem with flopping

I agree with this COMPLETELY. Ugh...just ridiculous.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:41 PM
There is literally no medical explanation for how LeBron went down when he was hit by Chandler. Those are NOT NATURAL body movements. And yes, when you get abruptly stopped, that part you cannot flop on...the problem is that LeBron flails AFTER the initial body reaction. You can see in the video, TWO distinct body "reactions". (As proven by the difference between John Lucas' body reaction and LeBron's on the two separate plays with the same type of hit.) Watch it again and just stop trying to excuse it away as natural body response to getting hit. The excuse is now bordering on ludicrous after being presented the videos that have been linked on here.

You just said it yourself... "There is literally no medical explanation for how LeBron went down..."

So then how can you say the arm flail wasn't a part of the reaction by the whiplash?? I guess you can't.

Really tho why WOULD LeBron flop there? Come on give me a good answer.. He gets leveled in the back and the foul is called.. A flop is meant to draw a foul... LeBron doesn't go out there and try to make himself look like a flopping ***** ***** lol..

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:41 PM
I agree with this COMPLETELY. Ugh...just ridiculous.

just because soccer players flop does not excuse NBA players for flopping. and i don't know if you guys have ever watched soccer but when a player flops the manager will send in another player to make sure that if that player wants to fall down again he will make sure there is a reason AKA an enforcer.

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:43 PM
Yes I agree with the majority of this. But honestly... do you really think that because LeBron flops every now and then that it is ruining the game??

How about we talk about players who FLOP more often or we talk about ways to IMPROVE the game in other more important areas. Like the OFFICIATING. Star calls are a way bigger issue than flopping... when a game isn't called fairly thats just bull ****

I agree with you. The issue with this is that the flopping PROMOTES star calls. In today's NBA anyways. The exaggerated movements are going to get a call much more often than if they didn't do it.

And yes, I do believe if the best player in a sport does something that undermines the integrity of the game, it ruins it to a certain degree. And the more it happens, and the more players that participate, it ruins the game. And I was never just talking about LeBron. I didn't bring him up until someone else used him as an example. This is happening with the majority of players now, which is WHY it is such a large issue. If it was every once in a while, there wouldn't be an issue.

I did say in one of my previous posts, that the reason the Heat will get so much flak is because they have three stars on their team. It just so happens that two of those guys, are some of the most egregious of offenders.

LeBron flops WAY more than just every once in a while, and Wade is worse than he is. And there are guys worse than both of them. That's how sad the league has become in relation to this topic.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:43 PM
okay so either John Lucas whose 5'11 165 is a tough lil dude or lebron whose 6'8 250 is a little girl. and you can't say that the video of Lebron/Rose and Lebron/Chandler the reaction wasn't to far off?

BTW in response to your other post about basketball not being as bad as soccer......in my opinion its getting pretty damn close to it. And just for the record both sports are contact sports!!!!!

I'm sorry what does John Lucas have to do with this? LeBron set a completely legal screen.. YES lucas was blindsided but LeBron was SET seconds before contact was made.. Chandler actually initiated the contact by moving his upper body into the backside of LBJ... LeBron was standing still when Lucas hit him... It's common basketball knowledge lol

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:45 PM
just because soccer players flop does not excuse NBA players for flopping. and i don't know if you guys have ever watched soccer but when a player flops the manager will send in another player to make sure that if that player wants to fall down again he will make sure there is a reason AKA an enforcer.

I didn't say it was an excuse for it happening in the NBA, just that I agree it is a bigger problem in soccer.

But you are right, in soccer, teams and players can still somewhat police their own sport in that regard. In the NBA, the John Lucas hit is not a foul, but when LeBron get's hit IN THE EXACT SAME WAY, it is a Flagrant 1 on Chandler.

Absurd.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:46 PM
You just said it yourself... "There is literally no medical explanation for how LeBron went down..."

So then how can you say the arm flail wasn't a part of the reaction by the whiplash?? I guess you can't.

Really tho why WOULD LeBron flop there? Come on give me a good answer.. He gets leveled in the back and the foul is called.. A flop is meant to draw a foul... LeBron doesn't go out there and try to make himself look like a flopping ***** ***** lol..

YES HE DOES!!!! the answer is in the foul call. he got a flagrant out of it which is 2 FT's and a pocession out of it. Are you actually serious?

If he got WHIPLASH he would have significant neck injuries and would have to sit out for some amount of time.

Did John Lucas flail his arms around or run around the court whining like a bafoon or did he get up like a MAN? and he was blindsided too so whats your arguement going to be now?

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:46 PM
just because soccer players flop does not excuse NBA players for flopping. and i don't know if you guys have ever watched soccer but when a player flops the manager will send in another player to make sure that if that player wants to fall down again he will make sure there is a reason AKA an enforcer.

He didn't say it was an excuse haha.. It's just the truth. Our problem in the NBA isn't anywhere near soccers problem and soccer is still the MOST popular sport in the world.. and I don't think the flopping has changed that haha..

Watch this video and then tell the flopping problems are anywhere remotely similar lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhYU_znLSRk

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:47 PM
I'm sorry what does John Lucas have to do with this? LeBron set a completely legal screen.. YES lucas was blindsided but LeBron was SET seconds before contact was made.. Chandler actually initiated the contact by moving his upper body into the backside of LBJ... LeBron was standing still when Lucas hit him... It's common basketball knowledge lol

Umm...except that LeBron bends his knees and leans into the hit on Lucas. Which as far as basketball rules go, is just as illegal as what Chandler did. They were both set in the spot, but both moved into the player coming into the screen.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 03:49 PM
LeBron braces himself for the contact WHILE standing still and Chandler LEANS his upper body into the back and EXTENDS his arms..

One screen was legal and the other wasnt.. There isn't much to argue here.

Master Mind
05-04-2012, 03:49 PM
Literally every team does it.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:52 PM
Why do you crabs act like Miami's the only team that flop. Literally every team does it, get your panties out of a bunch.

before you post read all the post and then get back to me....

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:55 PM
You just said it yourself... "There is literally no medical explanation for how LeBron went down..."

So then how can you say the arm flail wasn't a part of the reaction by the whiplash?? I guess you can't.

Really tho why WOULD LeBron flop there? Come on give me a good answer.. He gets leveled in the back and the foul is called.. A flop is meant to draw a foul... LeBron doesn't go out there and try to make himself look like a flopping ***** ***** lol..

You're right, I said that. There is no medical explanation that will tell you that LeBron's natural body reaction to that hit, was accurate. In other words, getting hit in that manner, does not make the body move in that fashion. It's just not physically possible.

Besides that, there are two separate "Reactions" from LeBron. The initial, holy ****, that hurt, and then the "I better flail and fall down. These players are now very weel versed in how to manipulate a foul call, or a worse foul call, etc.

And who would flop there. I could give you a list of players that would in fact flop in that situation. The situation being, I just got hit, the ref may not have seen it, IF I flop, they won't be able to miss the motion. (Which is the point of ALL flopping. Exaggerate so that it is very noticeable) (Which is also the answer to WHY LeBRon would flop there. Why would any NBA player flop in any situation? To get a call they may not get. In this case, a flagrant rather than a normal call or no call.)

And whiplash can be received on a hit of less than five miles per hour, but it doesn't mean that it makes your react as if you got shot. lol whiplash

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:56 PM
I'm sorry what does John Lucas have to do with this? LeBron set a completely legal screen.. YES lucas was blindsided but LeBron was SET seconds before contact was made.. Chandler actually initiated the contact by moving his upper body into the backside of LBJ... LeBron was standing still when Lucas hit him... It's common basketball knowledge lol

okay i am done talking about the actual screen since clearly lebron does nothing wrong in your opinion which is fine its your opinion. my point in bringing lucas into this was the fact that he was able to get up LIKE A MAN after having the same if not more contact than lebron who is built like a tank.

I will no longer talk to you about lebron because this thread is not about him

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:56 PM
LeBron braces himself for the contact WHILE standing still and Chandler LEANS his upper body into the back and EXTENDS his arms..

One screen was legal and the other wasnt.. There isn't much to argue here.

You weren't watching LeBron very closely in the Lucas hit then. He bends his knees and leans towards Lucas. In the rules, you cannot make any motion towards the player being screened. Regardless of if you are bracing yourself or not. It is the same with a charge vs a block. You cannot initiate contact. Period.

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 03:57 PM
Literally every team does it.

You don't read, or you don't comprehend what you read. Either way....I'm sorry for you.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:58 PM
You're right, I said that. There is no medical explanation that will tell you that LeBron's natural body reaction to that hit, was accurate. In other words, getting hit in that manner, does not make the body move in that fashion. It's just not physically possible.

Besides that, there are two separate "Reactions" from LeBron. The initial, holy ****, that hurt, and then the "I better flail and fall down. These players are now very weel versed in how to manipulate a foul call, or a worse foul call, etc.

And who would flop there. I could give you a list of players that would in fact flop in that situation. The situation being, I just got hit, the ref may not have seen it, IF I flop, they won't be able to miss the motion. (Which is the point of ALL flopping. Exaggerate so that it is very noticeable) (Which is also the answer to WHY LeBRon would flop there. Why would any NBA player flop in any situation? To get a call they may not get. In this case, a flagrant rather than a normal call or no call.)

And whiplash can be received on a hit of less than five miles per hour, but it doesn't mean that it makes your react as if you got shot. lol whiplash

you're waisting your time dude. He has turned this entire thread into a Lebron thing and thats not why i made it.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 03:59 PM
Can some of the other people reading these post and tell me if you feel the same about entire fan bases defending there players that flop......which is why this thread was created in the first place!!!!

this was more meant to be a thread talking about how flopping is changing how people percieve basketball.....and i dont know about you guys but like i said before i Love the game before the players playing it. I dont care if your on the team i root for or the team i hate flopping is a disgrace to the sport.

JC_
05-04-2012, 04:04 PM
YES HE DOES!!!! the answer is in the foul call. he got a flagrant out of it which is 2 FT's and a pocession out of it. Are you actually serious?

If he got WHIPLASH he would have significant neck injuries and would have to sit out for some amount of time.

Did John Lucas flail his arms around or run around the court whining like a bafoon or did he get up like a MAN? and he was blindsided too so whats your arguement going to be now?

Fail post. Think about **** before you say it. Watch videos of both plays and see if you can pick out the differences between both screens and also the potential pain they might have caused.

Have you ever been hit from behind? It can hurt like hell for a few seconds without causing a "significant neck injury".

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 04:05 PM
okay i am done talking about the actual screen since clearly lebron does nothing wrong in your opinion which is fine its your opinion. my point in bringing lucas into this was the fact that he was able to get up LIKE A MAN after having the same if not more contact than lebron who is built like a tank.

I will no longer talk to you about lebron because this thread is not about him

Dude common.. it pains me to argue with a fellow vikings fan but this is getting stupid.. I could go on all day.. Lucas ran into LeBron straight up and get hit and got up..

Lebron got hit in the back and suffered whiplash.. stop trying to compare the two screens because they ARENT comparable

Stinkyoutsider
05-04-2012, 04:09 PM
I'm as tired of the flops as the next guy but it's there and it's a part of the NBA. I'm not sure who started all this, but the game is physical and should be played like it's supposed to. This isn't golf or tennis. This is basketball.

The refs need to get together and figure out a training method that can increase their understanding of what a flop is and to start penalizing for it.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:10 PM
Fail post. Think about **** before you say it. Watch videos of both plays and see if you can pick out the differences between both screens and also the potential pain they might have caused.

Have you ever been hit from behind? It can hurt like hell for a few seconds without causing a "significant neck injury".

alright well please enlighten me....you let me know exactly what was different that warrented the response from the 6'8 250 MAN made of muscle.

And just so you know there is a difference of something hurting and being in pain then running around the court wincing in pain and looking like your about to fall down several times FROM A SCREEN. for god sakes do you people watch football? people get hit on there blindside all the time and what happnens.....they get up.

Chandler didn't run full speed into lebron's back and Lebron didnt run full speed into a brick wall.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:15 PM
http://www.webmd.com/pain-management/guide/pain-management-whiplash

this is what your saying happened to Lebron from that screen? is that what im getting because i'm pretty sure he played the rest of the game and game 3 with no problems what so ever....

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:15 PM
Can some of the other people reading these post and tell me if you feel the same about entire fan bases defending there players that flop......which is why this thread was created in the first place!!!!

this was more meant to be a thread talking about how flopping is changing how people percieve basketball.....and i dont know about you guys but like i said before i Love the game before the players playing it. I dont care if your on the team i root for or the team i hate flopping is a disgrace to the sport.

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 04:18 PM
http://www.webmd.com/pain-management/guide/pain-management-whiplash

this is what your saying happened to Lebron from that screen? is that what im getting because i'm pretty sure he played the rest of the game and game 3 with no problems what so ever....

To be fair, the effects of whiplash may not show up for several hours after the incident. And that is in something like a car accident where your muscles are not warmed up and more able to compensate for the injury.

I've had whiplash several times. On more than one occasion, I didn't realize anything was really wrong...other than just damn that hurt, and soreness, until almost 24 hours later.

MTL_123
05-04-2012, 04:18 PM
the bosh flop on boozer still makes me laugh lol

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 04:22 PM
the bosh flop on boozer still makes me laugh lol

I HATE flopping, but it still makes me laugh too.

Live, it pissed me off. Every time I see it in replay, it makes me laugh for the pure ridiculousness of it.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:26 PM
^ agreed it made me really mad when i was watching the game but now i just chuckle and say i cant believe that was seriously called a offensive foul.

IamKaiserSoze
05-04-2012, 04:26 PM
this thread is crazy. i'm not a heat fan, but what are they supposed to do? "pardon me ref, i may have exagerrated that last bit of contact, i would be most grateful if you could disregard that last basket of ours and award the other team the points instead. because it would be the sportsmanlike thing to do...".

you try to win. at the end of the day, whether or not you like it...all anyone remembers or cares about is if you win. if you don't think it's fair...do it too. if you don't want to do it...there's the bus.

JC_
05-04-2012, 04:33 PM
alright well please enlighten me....you let me know exactly what was different that warrented the response from the 6'8 250 MAN made of muscle.

And just so you know there is a difference of something hurting and being in pain then running around the court wincing in pain and looking like your about to fall down several times FROM A SCREEN. for god sakes do you people watch football? people get hit on there blindside all the time and what happnens.....they get up.

Chandler didn't run full speed into lebron's back and Lebron didnt run full speed into a brick wall.

You're contradicting yourself like a pro. Lebron got up after and yet you say he's not like football players who "get up".

I'm not Lebron so I can't say what pain he was in but it was obvious he was hurting. We've seen his commercials. His acting isn't that good.


I have no problem with you making a case against flopping because flopping is lame but you're not going to get very far with terrible examples. That first video you posted is not good and doesn't show the "flopping epidemic".

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 04:33 PM
I'm not trying to defend flopping. I think it's a horrible thing to do BUT let's be honest here, NBA reffing is pretty horrible. Lebron is a tank. He gets hit often but lots of times the hits he receives don't move him. Same with shaq. Doesn't mean he wasn't fouled. Refs are stupid. They only react based on exaggeration that is obvious when they are out of position. when Lebron gets hit and a ref doesn't have the line of sight to see him and doesn't get the call he b#%^**. So now he's added the repertoire to over exaggerate his fouls so he isn't robbed of a call. It doesn't mean he wasn't fouled. Chandler for instance did foul him. Lebron just flopped to get it called. It's an ethical issue, not a ruining the sport issue.

I've been watching the nba for over 20 years, flopping has been around for a long time. It's only now with all the tv cameras, HD telecasts do we really see everything. Go back on YouTube and pull up some games from the 80's. There are like 2 camera angles - that's it. Not to mention the antenna like clarity. Basically you can't see everything that's happening on the court like you can today. Plain and simple. And for those complaining about wishing it was the 80's in the terms of the NBA you're idiots. Ive watched basketball in the 80s and believe me, just based on technology and speed of the game today it's not that great. Just a bunch of old fogies like bill Simmons reminiscing about his glory days when the celts mattered and when he was younger. Everyone does this. It's called nostalgia. Doesn't mean that time period was any better than it is today.

JC_
05-04-2012, 04:34 PM
I HATE flopping, but it still makes me laugh too.

Live, it pissed me off. Every time I see it in replay, it makes me laugh for the pure ridiculousness of it.

lol yeah it was epic.

JasonJohnHorn
05-04-2012, 04:35 PM
Flopping is so out of hand. Unless an official actually SEES contact, they should not be making a call for a foul.

And in my book, guys that flop are PU$$!E$

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:35 PM
this thread is crazy. i'm not a heat fan, but what are they supposed to do? "pardon me ref, i may have exagerrated that last bit of contact, i would be most grateful if you could disregard that last basket of ours and award the other team the points instead. because it would be the spotsmanlike thing to do...".

you try to win. at the end of the day, whether or not you like it...all anyone remembers or cares about is if you win. if you don't think it's fair...do it too. if you don't want to do it...there's the bus.

this thread was not created to talk about the heat though at all. It was to bring to light the fact that fan bases will continually give players of ANY teams a green light and justify what they are doing is right!

The hope i had in creating this thread was so people would start being honest and not defend there players when people from other fan bases call them out for flopping. it's one thing to defend your players if people are just saying they suck for no reason and so on and so forth but when they are pointing out flops and fan bases are like "no that wasn't a flop he was clearly hit and that's why he did a 360 arm flailing dive in to the second row"

instead of sticking up for the players why don't we stick up for the sport that we all love?

IamKaiserSoze
05-04-2012, 04:42 PM
in baseball if a hitter gets to first base after the ball, but gets called safe...is he going to correct the ump?

in football if an offensive lineman gets away with holding is he going to stop the play and tell the ref the truth?

the game is the game. and it is what it is. you don't have to like it. but you sure as crap had better accept it. if you don't, turn the channel. because nothing said here in this thread is going to change anyhting. in fact, nothing...period...is going to change it. accept it...or not. but complaining about it will get you nowhere.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:44 PM
I'm not trying to defend flopping. I think it's a horrible thing to do BUT let's be honest here, NBA reffing is pretty horrible. Lebron is a tank. He gets hit often but lots of times the hits he receives don't move him. Same with shaq. Doesn't mean he wasn't fouled. Refs are stupid. They only react based on exaggeration that is obvious when they are out of position. when Lebron gets hit and a ref doesn't have the line of sight to see him and doesn't get the call he b#%^**. So now he's added the repertoire to over exaggerate his fouls so he isn't robbed of a call. It doesn't mean he wasn't fouled. Chandler for instance did foul him. Lebron just flopped to get it called. It's an ethical issue, not a ruining the sport issue.

I've been watching the nba for over 20 years, flopping has been around for a long time. It's only now with all the tv cameras, HD telecasts do we really see everything. Go back on YouTube and pull up some games from the 80's. There are like 2 camera angles - that's it. Not to mention the antenna like clarity. Basically you can't see everything that's happening on the court like you can today. Plain and simple. And for those complaining about wishing it was the 80's in the terms of the NBA you're idiots. Ive watched basketball in the 80s and believe me, just based on technology and speed of the game today it's not that great. Just a bunch of old fogies like bill Simmons reminiscing about his glory days when the celts mattered and when he was younger. Everyone does this. It's called nostalgia. Doesn't mean that time period was any better than it is today.


did you watch all of the video's? Robert horry literally dove on the floor without being touched.....same with Kerilinko and even Lebron did it to. Everyone wants to talk about this recent screen thing and just focus on that one example. Raja bell and JR Smith flopped on each other when there was almost no contact at all! same with Bell and Manu. Demarcus cousins literally did not touch blake griffin but swiped at the air and the because girffin held his eye he and looked at the ref he got the call!

ITS NOT JUST LEBRON I KNOW THIS!!! and i know the ref's are just as much to blame as the players!!!!!!!

I'll say it again the whole point of this was for US the Fans to not justify flopping with excuses and make it acceptable....

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 04:45 PM
in baseball if a hitter gets to first base after the ball, but gets called safe...is he going to correct the ump?

in football if an offensive lineman gets away with holding is he going to stop the play and tell the ref the truth?

the game is the game. and it is what it is. you don't have to like it. but you sure as crap had better accept it. if you don't, turn the channel. because nothing said here in this thread is going to change anyhting. in fact, nothing...period...is going to change it. accept it...or not. but complaining about it will get you nowhere.

You seem to be stuck on this correcting the ref thing.

No one is saying that if an official calls a foul that is clearly a flop, then the player should say "Mr. Ref sir, I flopped there."

Literally, no one has said anything like that.

The idea is, not to flop in the first place to GET the call.

And the original poster wanted to know how fans could defend this bullcrap, not an analogy that has nothing to do with what anyone said.

And the bolded part. If you don't like people complaining, don't come into the thread. This is what a forum is for. And besides that, if people didn't complain about things they didn't like in sports, then lot's of things in sports that HAVE been changed, wouldn't have been changed. Sports change based on two things. How can we make as much money as possible, and how can we keep the fans happy, because they are the reason we make money at all. So yes, complaining can work. Just not in a forum. But still the point of a forum. Don't like it don't come into the thread (change the channel. Complaining about people complaining won't stop it. accept it or not)

Lakers + Giants
05-04-2012, 04:46 PM
Mavs won. Get over it.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:47 PM
in baseball if a hitter gets to first base after the ball, but gets called safe...is he going to correct the ump?

in football if an offensive lineman gets away with holding is he going to stop the play and tell the ref the truth? the game is the game. and it is what it is. you don't have to like it. but you sure as crap had better accept it. if you don't, turn the channel. because nothing said here in this thread is going to change anyhting. in fact, nothing...period...is going to change it. accept it...or not. but complaining about it will get you nowhere.

those 2 examples are so pointless to what i am trying to say. There is a difference between trying to influence the referee by flopping and the referee just plain making a mistake.

as for the second part of that statement you'll go far in life with an attitude like that.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:48 PM
Mavs won. Get over it.

dude Profound post. I mean honestly thank you for taking the time to write that.

Did you only watch the 1st video because there were plenty more with a lot more players.

krazylegz
05-04-2012, 04:53 PM
nba has been as fake and fixed as pro wrestling for years now....how people still watch is baffling to me at times

JC_
05-04-2012, 04:55 PM
this thread was not created to talk about the heat though at all. It was to bring to light the fact that fan bases will continually give players of ANY teams a green light and justify what they are doing is right!



The Heat is all over your original post so forgive people if they talk about them.

There are obvious flops and there are questionable flops. I'm sure most fans don't like obvious flops even done by their own team. When you start using anything you think "might" be a flop as an example you are losing the credibility of your thread.

The league should definately do something about "obvious flopping" but some of your examples look like straight up hateramples and those won't get you very far.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 04:59 PM
The Heat is all over your original post so forgive people if they talk about them.

There are obvious flops and there are questionable flops. I'm sure most fans don't like obvious flops even done by their own team. When you start using anything you think "might" be a flop as an example you are losing the credibility of your thread.

The league should definately do something about "obvious flopping" but some of your examples look like straight up hateramples and those won't get you very far.

ACTUALLY i only used the Heat one time in my entire first post. When i typed in youtube NBA flops that was one of the first videos i saw so i decided to share it. And even when i did talk about the heat i said that i was providing other videos so people wouldn't turn this into a heat bashing thread.

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 05:01 PM
did you watch all of the video's? Robert horry literally dove on the floor without being touched.....same with Kerilinko and even Lebron did it to. Everyone wants to talk about this recent screen thing and just focus on that one example. Raja bell and JR Smith flopped on each other when there was almost no contact at all! same with Bell and Manu. Demarcus cousins literally did not touch blake griffin but swiped at the air and the because girffin held his eye he and looked at the ref he got the call!

ITS NOT JUST LEBRON I KNOW THIS!!! and i know the ref's are just as much to blame as the players!!!!!!!

I'll say it again the whole point of this was for US the Fans to not justify flopping with excuses and make it acceptable....

I saw the videos. I also agree with you that flopping is an unethical part of the game. Regardless, you and I both know this topic has only come up because Lebron just flopped - no need to try and say you're not trying to pick out heat fans because you kind of are. I doubt this topic would have come up if Lebron didn't flop this past week.

If you are complaining about flopping from previous years then you are contradicting yourself and proving my original post correct - which, if you bothered to read basically said that flopping has been around for a long time. Its nothing new, better get used to it now since you seem to be new to the game of basketball. I don't mean anything I said as an insult just my strong opinion. The only way to stop flopping is to add more refs to the game and use instant replay all the time - which would slow the game down tremendously. Then people will complain about how slow the NBA is. The game is too fast for refs to judge flops vs real fouls in real time under the current format without slowing down the game.

A possible solution is possible fines or suspensions after the game is over using video by the league office. But nothing, can or should be done in the middle of a game, unless you plan on having a game last 4 hours.

IamKaiserSoze
05-04-2012, 05:06 PM
those 2 examples are so pointless to what i am trying to say. There is a difference between trying to influence the referee by flopping and the referee just plain making a mistake.

as for the second part of that statement you'll go far in life with an attitude like that.

actually an offensive lineman getting away with holding in football (which happens on every play) does influence a game. he's just sneaky about it. and the longer he does it, the better he gets. it's a lot like flopping, actually.

JC_
05-04-2012, 05:07 PM
ACTUALLY i only used the Heat one time in my entire first post. When i typed in youtube NBA flops that was one of the first videos i saw so i decided to share it. And even when i did talk about the heat i said that i was providing other videos so people wouldn't turn this into a heat bashing thread.

The only reason you said that is so your thread doesn't get closed. You picked an all Heat video that isn't even good to put at the top of your post. Pretty self explanatory.

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 05:10 PM
I think the real question here is what defines flopping? My definition of flopping is a guy that doesn't get hit but acts like he was. That's a flop. Its like a fake fight scene where the actor was never really hit.

But if the player does get hit, but over exaggerates his movements to get attention is NOT a flop. He's being a b#$%, yes. But he was fouled after all. This all comes back to the issues of refs. Do you trust the refs in the NBA to make the right call all the time? I sure as hell don't. If my favorite player has to act like a b#$%% when he gets fouled in order to go to the free throw line, I'm - sad to say this - OK with it. Its nothing new to the game. Its been going on for years.

championships
05-04-2012, 05:16 PM
Miami is the best at persuading some calls. Almost seems as they practice this.

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 05:18 PM
double post

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 05:20 PM
I think the real question here is what defines flopping? My definition of flopping is a guy that doesn't get hit but acts like he was. That's a flop. Its like a fake fight scene where the actor was never really hit.

But if the player does get hit, but over exaggerates his movements to get attention is NOT a flop. He's being a b#$%, yes. But he was fouled after all. This all comes back to the issues of refs. Do you trust the refs in the NBA to make the right call all the time? I sure as hell don't. If my favorite player has to act like a b#$%% when he gets fouled in order to go to the free throw line, I'm - sad to say this - OK with it. Its nothing new to the game. Its been going on for years.

I agree with this to an extent. Not all contact is a foul though. So a player can draw contact that is not a foul, flop, and get a foul that should not have been called. That too needs to be addressed.

And as far as being okay with it....I am never okay if officials get calls wrong. I understand that it is part of the game, as they are human. Getting a few calls wrong over the course of the game, allowing flopping as a legitimate form of drawing fouls, and overall poor officiating are all very different things. I should not have to be okay with poor officiating or with flopping being justified and permissible. This can be addressed by the league. It SHOULD be addressed by the league. But instead, it has become worse in the 30 years I have watched basketball.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 05:24 PM
I think the real question here is what defines flopping? My definition of flopping is a guy that doesn't get hit but acts like he was. That's a flop. Its like a fake fight scene where the actor was never really hit.

But if the player does get hit, but over exaggerates his movements to get attention is NOT a flop. He's being a b#$%, yes. But he was fouled after all. This all comes back to the issues of refs. Do you trust the refs in the NBA to make the right call all the time? I sure as hell don't. If my favorite player has to act like a b#$%% when he gets fouled in order to go to the free throw line, I'm - sad to say this - OK with it. Its nothing new to the game. Its been going on for years.

here are some examples of players that are contacted and by your definition not flopping:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw6-HGxCKSo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrBR_KPWVtE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNxiWES8G0o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWRjyUzPX70&feature=related
^ this whole video every one of those players had some kind of contact from another player so by your definition none of those were flops?

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 05:26 PM
I agree with this to an extent. Not all contact is a foul though. So a player can draw contact that is not a foul, flop, and get a foul that should not have been called. That too needs to be addressed.

And as far as being okay with it....I am never okay if officials get calls wrong. I understand that it is part of the game, as they are human, that doesn't mean that I have to be okay with poor officiating. This can be addressed by the league. It SHOULD be addressed by the league. But instead, it has become worse in the 30 years I have watched basketball.

This is the only part I disagree with. I believe that this has only become more relevant due to HD telecasts, more tv angles, more instant replays, more reviewing/analysis of the games, 24 hour sports news cycle. This has always been a part of the game. Its just harder to hide now with today's technology. Think about it, the NBA finals games in the 80's were tape delayed, had no HD, less camera angles, less true fans, etc. etc. It doesn't mean the sport was more pure in the 80's. Like I said before its just people being nostalgic about their childhood/pasts/etc. The flaws of the game are just more evident now than it was then.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 05:26 PM
I agree with this to an extent. Not all contact is a foul though. So a player can draw contact that is not a foul, flop, and get a foul that should not have been called. That too needs to be addressed.

And as far as being okay with it....I am never okay if officials get calls wrong. I understand that it is part of the game, as they are human. Getting a few calls wrong over the course of the game, allowing flopping as a legitimate form of drawing fouls, and overall poor officiating are all very different things. I should not have to be okay with poor officiating or with flopping being justified and permissible. This can be addressed by the league. It SHOULD be addressed by the league. But instead, it has become worse in the 30 years I have watched basketball.

why does it seem like we are the only ones bothered by the blatant disregard for the game of basketball?

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 05:27 PM
This is the only part I disagree with. I believe that this has only become more relevant due to HD telecasts, more tv angles, more instant replays, more reviewing/analysis of the games, 24 hour sports news cycle. This has always been a part of the game. Its just harder to hide now with today's technology. Think about it, the NBA finals games in the 80's were tape delayed, had no HD, less camera angles, less true fans, etc. etc. It doesn't mean the sport was more pure in the 80's. Like I said before its just people being nostalgic about their childhood/pasts/etc. The flaws of the game are just more evident now than it was then.

did you watch those videos?

KnickaBocka.44
05-04-2012, 05:29 PM
A lot of people don't understand that just because there is contact on a play, there is not necessarily a foul. This is true for the players now as well.


Players like Wade and LeBron are unreal athletes, quick enough to get into the lane at will. But once they are there and someone comes to defend them they are forced into a tough shot and instead of being lost in the air and committing a turnover, they flail their arms in the air and jerk their body around to give the illusion that their shot has been altered by contact....when in reality they just got stuck and knew they werent going to be able to convert.

Having been a basketball and a Knicks fan my whole life, I know that the only way to fix this flopping garbage is to teach the floppers what actually happens when you get hit as hard as they claim to be, like the Knicks used to do in the 90's to punks who tried to come in the lane.


That being said, I think fans who stand by flopping are the same fans that hop on and off bandwagons.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 05:31 PM
A lot of people don't understand that just because there is contact on a play, there is not necessarily a foul. This is true for the players now as well.


Players like Wade and LeBron are unreal athletes, quick enough to get into the lane at will. But once they are there and someone comes to defend them they are forced into a tough shot and instead of being lost in the air and committing a turnover, they flail their arms in the air and jerk their body around to give the illusion that their shot has been altered by contact....when in reality they just got stuck and knew they werent going to be able to convert.

Having been a basketball and a Knicks fan my whole life, I know that the only way to fix this flopping rule is to teach the floppers what actually happens when you get hit as hard as they claim to be, like the Knicks used to do in the 90's to punks who tried to come in the lane.


That being said, I think fans who stand by flopping are the same fans that hop on and off bandwagons.

thank you for actually contributing to the topic of conversation! AND i agree with you 100%

When did basketball stop being a contact sport?

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 05:34 PM
did you watch those videos?

But those didn't qualify as actual fouls. They were guys falling down when a player barely touched him.That's a flop because of the delayed responses as well. I'm talking about exaggerations that are too close to call. But again, in real time and through the camera angles you're viewing the game its easy for you to see. Not the same for a ref trying to see a million things on the court at the same time. Some times all they can do is see the exaggerations to draw their attention away from watching the ball.

In regards, to all your videos though, those players are acting like b#$%^.

Sota4Ever
05-04-2012, 05:35 PM
Only a heat fan could complain about his player not getting enough foul calls. Just wait until the nba finals you guys should be getting every call imaginable.

celtisox41
05-04-2012, 05:37 PM
They should make it a technical foul to be caught flopping. They should also fire all the refs in the NBA because they're basically encouraging it by calling them fouls. The players and the refs in the NBA are both disgraces. Actually, the whole NBA is a disgrace

Sota4Ever
05-04-2012, 05:38 PM
Refs in the nba are the worst officials in all of sports.

SwatTeam
05-04-2012, 05:39 PM
They should make it a technical foul to be caught flopping. They should also fire all the refs in the NBA because they're basically encouraging it by calling them fouls. The players and the refs in the NBA are both disgraces. Actually, the whole NBA is a disgrace

Thanks, are you going to go video tape some minicamps and offseason practices now for belichek? c'mon man, you sound ridiculous and seem like a huge hypocrite.

KnickaBocka.44
05-04-2012, 05:40 PM
thank you for actually contributing to the topic of conversation! AND i agree with you 100%

When did basketball stop being a contact sport?

I'm not sure. It is just particularly sad that the best player in the world is becoming one of the worst offenders.

Cfrey
05-04-2012, 05:40 PM
lambourghini mercy, your chick she so thirsty

MassoDio
05-04-2012, 05:53 PM
This is the only part I disagree with. I believe that this has only become more relevant due to HD telecasts, more tv angles, more instant replays, more reviewing/analysis of the games, 24 hour sports news cycle. This has always been a part of the game. Its just harder to hide now with today's technology. Think about it, the NBA finals games in the 80's were tape delayed, had no HD, less camera angles, less true fans, etc. etc. It doesn't mean the sport was more pure in the 80's. Like I said before its just people being nostalgic about their childhood/pasts/etc. The flaws of the game are just more evident now than it was then.

See, I see this as a bunch of excuses. Fans of sports are so used to making excuses for poor officiating, bad rules, etc, that it is now the TV's fault that we can see these things. I understand there are far more camera angles now.

In live action basketball, it is by and large the same view on TV they have shown the game in for 40 years. The replays have become much better. In LIVE action I can see the flops have increased. And it has become FAR...FAR worse in the last 5 years than it has ever been. In five years, the camera angles have not drastically changed enough to make this excuse.

I know flopping has always been a part of the sport. No one is saying that it hasn't. And I don't believe I have waxed nostalgic in this thread to say it should be more like 19xx's basketball. I just said the flopping needs to be addressed because it is ridiculous, and yes, I believe it ruins the game to certain extent.

The excuses you are making, is exactly what the original poster was asking about. How can we as fans excuse this stuff. It is absurd, and it makes the NBA look like professional wrestling. I don't see why any of us should HAVE to be okay with this, like a few posters have said. Or GET OVER it. The sport does not change and does not improve if fans simply allow the status quo to go on without complaining and making their voices heard.

This is the reason there is an option to email the league about improvements located on the NBA.com website. Because FANS HAVE THAT RIGHT.

Lidz
05-04-2012, 06:16 PM
Every player has a way to get calls. Some of them figure out their own way even if it isn't labeled as "flopping". D. Rose jerks his head back every time he comes in contact with a defender when drivin' and that gets called a lot. Dwight Howard & Glen Davis yell "AYEE!" every time they put up a lay-up and that gets called a lot. D. Wade(as much as I hate it because he's my fav. player) screams like a little girl whenever he goes up for a lay-up. LBJ flops way more on defense than he does offense but nonetheless, he usually gets the call. A lot of guys know how to get calls their way and as much as I HATE floppin', it's not goin' anywhere unless the NBA punishes guys for it, which I HIGHLY doubt.

KingsMadness44
05-04-2012, 06:40 PM
See, I see this as a bunch of excuses. Fans of sports are so used to making excuses for poor officiating, bad rules, etc, that it is now the TV's fault that we can see these things. I understand there are far more camera angles now.

In live action basketball, it is by and large the same view on TV they have shown the game in for 40 years. The replays have become much better. In LIVE action I can see the flops have increased. And it has become FAR...FAR worse in the last 5 years than it has ever been. In five years, the camera angles have not drastically changed enough to make this excuse.

I know flopping has always been a part of the sport. No one is saying that it hasn't. And I don't believe I have waxed nostalgic in this thread to say it should be more like 19xx's basketball. I just said the flopping needs to be addressed because it is ridiculous, and yes, I believe it ruins the game to certain extent.

The excuses you are making, is exactly what the original poster was asking about. How can we as fans excuse this stuff. It is absurd, and it makes the NBA look like professional wrestling. I don't see why any of us should HAVE to be okay with this, like a few posters have said. Or GET OVER it. The sport does not change and does not improve if fans simply allow the status quo to go on without complaining and making their voices heard.

This is the reason there is an option to email the league about improvements located on the NBA.com website. Because FANS HAVE THAT RIGHT.

Everyone should read this post and just stop and think about it. This is exactly the entire point of this thread and I couldnt put it any better myself. So take a second and if you don't want to read through the entire thread just read this....

ManRam
05-04-2012, 06:46 PM
Because every team does it.

I saw KD, Russy and Dirk all flop last night. no one cares though, because they aren't the Heat.