PDA

View Full Version : But this is OK



joeystats
04-24-2012, 02:03 PM
Link Fixed
Originally posted in the Laker Forum but figured i'd put it on here as well

First off I believe Artest was wrong and deserves to be punished, I believe Harden exaggerated a little, but thats besides the point, thats what he's suppose to do. Regardless it was an intentional elbow to the head so thats all that matters. I have a playlist put together that shows most all similar circumstances that have happened in the NBA, granted some are not as bad, but there are a few vicious elbows and no one has ever gotten more than a 2 game suspension for any of these. So people talking 5 or 10 games, I just don't see it, but unfortunately it would not surprise me if they made a example out of him.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL04ABC40A1CDC6BC2&feature=view_all

Kevin Love stomp- 2 games
James Jones elbows to Noah- no games
Affalo Elbow Hayward- 1 game
Garnett Elbow Q Rich- 1 game
DH12 elbow Dalembert- 1 game
Fish lays out Scola- 1game
Jason Smith levels Blake- 2 games
Ariza swing elbow at Derozan- 1 game
Q Rich smushes Henderson face- 2 games
Zach Randolph sucker punch- 2 games
Kobe Elbow Artest- no games
Boozer Elbow Josh Smith- no games
Baron Davis elbows Pau- none
Wade throw Hamilton- no games
Sasha Elbow Dragic- none

NoahH
04-24-2012, 02:04 PM
Your link is broken

Rockice_8
04-24-2012, 02:07 PM
Look no further then the man committing the crime and that's how you come to 5-10 games.

Oh and LOL and the people saying well he's been good for the past 3 years you have to give him credit for that. Hell no you don't.

justinnum1
04-24-2012, 02:08 PM
Jesus! people still trying to downplay what happened? It was the most vicious, malicious act since the palace brawl.

Giraffes Rule
04-24-2012, 02:09 PM
Most of those players don't have a history of this kind of stuff though, including what may have been the worst case of violence in basketball ever. The elbow to Harden wasn't a basketball play and should be treated as harshly as if he had just run up to someone and punched them clean in the jaw.

joeystats
04-24-2012, 02:14 PM
Most of those players don't have a history of this kind of stuff though, including what may have been the worst case of violence in basketball ever. The elbow to Harden wasn't a basketball play and should be treated as harshly as if he had just run up to someone and punched them clean in the jaw.

Exactly my point, Zach Randolph did that and got 2 games. Also Garnett has had a history along with Zach when it comes to scuffles, elbows, pushing, and shoving. Look at the elbow KG gave to Q Rich, it's the same thing.

justinnum1
04-24-2012, 02:16 PM
Exactly my point, Zach Randolph did that and got 2 games. Also Garnett has had a history along with Zach when it comes to scuffles, elbows, pushing, and shoving. Look at the elbow KG gave to Q Rich, it's the same thing.

Thats different, q rich had no business doing or being where he was. kg was in a scrum and used his elbow to clear some space, i ****ing hate kg but its a different situation. What artest did was borderline criminal.

Gibby23
04-24-2012, 02:20 PM
Thats different, q rich had no business doing or being where he was. kg was in a scrum and used his elbow to clear some space, i ****ing hate kg but its a different situation. What artest did was borderline criminal.

What about when Rasheed did this and didn't get suspended.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIT9WHobGwI

justinnum1
04-24-2012, 02:24 PM
no, elbowing someone in the back of the head full force...not much is worse than that imo.

topdog
04-24-2012, 02:28 PM
Haven't had a chance to watch all of these, but the ones that I have occur as part of a basketball play. Now, you can question whether or not that was the intent, but a rip-through is a basketball play, smacking your elbow into someone (with follow-through) on an inbounds is not.

Add on to that that MWP/Artest has a history of incidents and that makes for a longer suspension.

joeystats
04-24-2012, 02:30 PM
Thats different, q rich had no business doing or being where he was. kg was in a scrum and used his elbow to clear some space, i ****ing hate kg but its a different situation. What artest did was borderline criminal.

Ok, so how about the Affalo and DH12 elbows? clearly looked at the target, aimed and struck.

kdspurman
04-24-2012, 02:33 PM
Certainly getting over blown cause of the culprit. Had he pushed him out the way it's be different. but I think he used his celebration to disguise his true motive.

I think he'll get 3-5 games at most. Maybe even less since the league is taking so long to investigate and come out with an official word

joeystats
04-24-2012, 02:34 PM
Haven't had a chance to watch all of these, but the ones that I have occur as part of a basketball play. Now, you can question whether or not that was the intent, but a rip-through is a basketball play, smacking your elbow into someone (with follow-through) on an inbounds is not.

Add on to that that MWP/Artest has a history of incidents and that makes for a longer suspension.

I don't consider these ones on the list as part of a basketball play
Klove, Affalo, Wade, KG, DH, Fish, Ariza, Q Rich, Boozer, and my fav example is Zach Randolph

Stinkyoutsider
04-24-2012, 02:36 PM
Ron has history. His history should also be looked at. I don't think we can honestly look at his 3 year gap between offenses and consider that because that's what he should be doing. Staying out of trouble. We want to give him credit for it, but he shouldn't be doing these sorts of things anymore.

2-ONE-5
04-24-2012, 02:43 PM
Atrests eblow was worse than Bynums hit on Barea

salmonleg
04-24-2012, 02:47 PM
It was a hard hit to a vulnerable area of the body on a player that wasn't looking so I agree with the poster that said "borderline criminal behavior". He should be done for the playoffs no matter how far the Lakers go. It's not like it was his first offense.

THE_LOGO
04-24-2012, 02:48 PM
Not condoning what Artest did but...

Did anyone even notice that while Artest was celebrating, Harden took a couple of steps in Artest's direction to block him, or stop his celebration? Artest's elbow was to say "get off me" and there you go. For the person that said that Artest intention was to bow Harden, Artest wasn't even looking. Yes Artest knew he was there but only because Harden bumped him. So no, Artest's intention wasn't to harm anyone but when someone tries to stop him from celebrating, you get what you get.

raiderfaninTX
04-24-2012, 02:50 PM
Jesus how many more Lakers threads can we get trying to defend their team

please cry a little more

PleaseBeNice
04-24-2012, 02:51 PM
This move by artest can not be defended, i cant believe some people are trying to defend it. i guess harden faked the concussion too? smh

DaLakerz Rulz
04-24-2012, 02:53 PM
It was a hard hit to a vulnerable area of the body on a player that wasn't looking so I agree with the poster that said "borderline criminal behavior". He should be done for the playoffs no matter how far the Lakers go. It's not like it was his first offense.

Criminal behavior, is that a joke? I am not condoning what Artest did but to say it is almost criminal is ridiculous. Harden was looking 100% as he ran up to Artest and bodied him. Artest will get a couple of games. Stop overreacting.

D-Leethal
04-24-2012, 03:06 PM
Just like in the court of law, your previous 'record' matters. Artest is the equivalent of a career criminal getting his 8th offense. You can't compare that to guys who have squeaky clean records in the NBA. The man has been suspended for 118 games in his freakin' career.

D-Leethal
04-24-2012, 03:09 PM
I love how Laker fans are trying to condone Artests cheap shot elbow to the freakin' temple because Harden made body contact? You make body contact with dudes every possession of the game. Guys bump guys in the backcourt all the freakin time. That doesn't warrant a vicious elbow to the dome. Its very pathetic how Laker fans are trying to put this on Harden like he had no business bumping bodies with Artest. This is coming from a guy who's loved Artest since his SJU days and wanted to cry when the Knicks didn't draft him. Laker fans gotta man up because they sound straight pathetic right now.

Slug3
04-24-2012, 03:13 PM
Metta would probably get suspended for just pushing someone. He has a bad history of getting in trouble with things like this so they are not going to take anything he does lightly. His name alone when in a situation like this gets him 3 games most likely.

loublue22
04-24-2012, 03:18 PM
Not condoning what Artest did but...

Did anyone even notice that while Artest was celebrating, Harden took a couple of steps in Artest's direction to block him, or stop his celebration? Artest's elbow was to say "get off me" and there you go. For the person that said that Artest intention was to bow Harden, Artest wasn't even looking. Yes Artest knew he was there but only because Harden bumped him. So no, Artest's intention wasn't to harm anyone but when someone tries to stop him from celebrating, you get what you get.

You push someone to get them off you, which I would have had no problem with. You can't co ck your elbow and go for the head. It's no different than a punch.

LeMarcus
04-24-2012, 03:20 PM
Definitely not criminal behavior but a deviant act. There are too many factors involving this incident to not use it as a means of sending a message by the commissioner.
In a nutshell Ron has the history, his mental stability, and his size equates into a dangerous person. If this does happen again there is not a single person in that arena that can stop Ron.

ddent12
04-24-2012, 03:22 PM
I love how Laker fans are trying to condone Artests cheap shot elbow to the freakin' temple because Harden made body contact? You make body contact with dudes every possession of the game. Guys bump guys in the backcourt all the freakin time. That doesn't warrant a vicious elbow to the dome. Its very pathetic how Laker fans are trying to put this on Harden like he had no business bumping bodies with Artest. This is coming from a guy who's loved Artest since his SJU days and wanted to cry when the Knicks didn't draft him. Laker fans gotta man up because they sound straight pathetic right now.

This is great for sports science to see the force of artest elbow on a dummy to see if it could cause such concussion damage. I think if harden didn't flop along with contact .... The nba would have given artest his 2 to 3 games and this topic would be over. If this was such a one sided thing. It would not take this long to figure out. They must be looking from both sides. Surprisingly why hasn't harden been interviewed. Of course he knows he will be questioned about it. So like a coward he won't say a word until after the punishment has been dealt. I love his peek a boo pic of him looking around while on the ground.

Raph12
04-24-2012, 04:13 PM
Yes but Ron-Ron has a history of this stuff, it's not like this is his first offence, so it has more dire consequences as well...

Swashcuff
04-24-2012, 04:45 PM
These guys keep trying to defend this nonsense. Stuff like this has NO place in any professional sport (not even MMA because that was a blind cheap shot) and he should be held accountable for his actions. What Artest did was HORRENDOUS and given his past he should face the stiffest punishment possible.

DaLakerz Rulz
04-24-2012, 04:49 PM
These guys keep trying to defend this nonsense. Stuff like this has NO place in any professional sport (not even MMA because that was a blind cheap shot) and he should be held accountable for his actions. What Artest did was HORRENDOUS and given his past he should face the stiffest punishment possible.

No one is saying he shouldn't be held accountable. But people on here are claiming he should be gone the rest of the year, or banned from the league. That is just ridiculous and incredibly stupid. LOL stiffest punishment possible...some have said he should be charged with assault :rolleyes: I just find it amusing how people on PSD overreact to every single thing that happens in the NBA. The media has also run with this incident just to create controversy...and that is what is troubling. The NBA is gonna respond to that and give out a harsher punishment than is warranted.

Gibby23
04-24-2012, 04:51 PM
These guys keep trying to defend this nonsense. Stuff like this has NO place in any professional sport (not even MMA because that was a blind cheap shot) and he should be held accountable for his actions. What Artest did was HORRENDOUS and given his past he should face the stiffest punishment possible.

he should be banned for life like Iverson.... Oh, wait....

RaiderLakersA's
04-24-2012, 04:53 PM
no, elbowing someone in the back of the head full force...not much is worse than that imo.

Then you don't have a very good imagination when it comes to violence. Call me when Metta World Peace goes all "Midnight Express" on Rifki, err, Harden and pounces on him, bites his tongue out of his mouth and spits it out on the court.

I think 2 - 4 games is about right, but I'm sure Stern is going to throw the book at him. 6 is my bet. Over/under?

Swashcuff
04-24-2012, 05:06 PM
No one is saying he shouldn't be held accountable. But people on here are claiming he should be gone the rest of the year, or banned from the league. That is just ridiculous and incredibly stupid. LOL stiffest punishment possible...some have said he should be charged with assault :rolleyes: I just find it amusing how people on PSD overreact to every single thing that happens in the NBA. The media has also run with this incident just to create controversy...and that is what is troubling. The NBA is gonna respond to that and give out a harsher punishment than is warranted.

And other guys are saying that Harden looked for it an deserved it. I find that amusing.

Swashcuff
04-24-2012, 05:07 PM
he should be banned for life like Iverson.... Oh, wait....

OMG you just hit me with an Allen Iverson diss :speechless:

You're such an amazing person :rolleyes:

Grow up.

Gibby23
04-24-2012, 05:13 PM
OMG you just hit me with an Allen Iverson diss :speechless:

You're such an amazing person :rolleyes:

Grow up.

STFU with your nonsense. Some stupid stat geek telling me to grow up over the internet. Go play with your PER..

thekmp211
04-24-2012, 05:30 PM
maybe when artest is banned for the playoffs you numb skulls will understand the point.

YoungOne
04-24-2012, 05:32 PM
if he is allowed to play again this season that would just be horrible, and even more considering how they try to "clean up" the league the last few years...

ThunderousDemon
04-24-2012, 05:40 PM
This argument is still alive? :facepalm:

LakersMaster24
04-24-2012, 05:41 PM
I am one of the few Lakers fans that think this play was completely unnecessary and stupid and that Ron deserves to be suspended for a few games.

BUT COME ON.

Some of you people here are saying he should be suspended for the whole playoffs or be ejected from the league? :laugh2: This tells me you never played real basketball. Basketball is a game filled with emotions, and Ron let his emotions take over his brain. You guys are acting like complete wussies. Some of you claim you were a NBA fan in the 90's but I am starting to doubt that, because if you cant handle this how the hell did you watch NBA back then? :laugh2:

CoffeeJanitor
04-24-2012, 06:55 PM
STOP READING LAKER FORUMS YOU MORONS. I went over to Lakersground to see what the climate was like over there, and jesus christ everyone was acting like it was Harden's fault and MWP did no wrong. Shut up.

I am one of the few Lakers fans that think this play was completely unnecessary and stupid and that Ron deserves to be suspended for a few games.

BUT COME ON.

Some of you people here are saying he should be suspended for the whole playoffs or be ejected from the league? :laugh2: This tells me you never played real basketball. Basketball is a game filled with emotions, and Ron let his emotions take over his brain. You guys are acting like complete wussies. Some of you claim you were a NBA fan in the 90's but I am starting to doubt that, because if you cant handle this how the hell did you watch NBA back then? :laugh2:Ron should have been banned from the league after the brawl. It is not safe to have someone that strong and unstable on the court.

thekmp211
04-24-2012, 07:00 PM
I am one of the few Lakers fans that think this play was completely unnecessary and stupid and that Ron deserves to be suspended for a few games.

BUT COME ON.

Some of you people here are saying he should be suspended for the whole playoffs or be ejected from the league? :laugh2: This tells me you never played real basketball. Basketball is a game filled with emotions, and Ron let his emotions take over his brain. You guys are acting like complete wussies. Some of you claim you were a NBA fan in the 90's but I am starting to doubt that, because if you cant handle this how the hell did you watch NBA back then? :laugh2:



this is the "street ball" internet tough guy defense that is just so whack. you have NEVER taken a shot like that in a pick up game, you've never seen a shot like that in a pick up game.

nothing like this happened in the 90's. the last time anything like this happened was tomjonovich, which was taken very seriously. but you probably just hear people talk about the 90's being tougher and make assumptions based on that. there was never a place for this **** in the league.

smith&wesson
04-24-2012, 07:10 PM
Like i said before he will get 2-3 games. 4 max.

Knicks21
04-24-2012, 07:10 PM
Jesus! people still trying to downplay what happened? It was the most vicious, malicious act since the palace brawl.

Knicks v Nuggets was worse.

The Final Boss
04-24-2012, 07:14 PM
I agree with the op.

smith&wesson
04-24-2012, 07:16 PM
maybe when artest is banned for the playoffs you numb skulls will understand the point.

Sorry my skull is super numb. what was the point again ?

thekmp211
04-24-2012, 07:21 PM
Sorry my skull is super numb. what was the point again ?

head injuries in todays sports world are a humungous deal, and for good reason. look at the nfl. now consider how seriously they take it, and take into account almost every head injury in the nfl is just a product of circumstance.

imagine for a moment if james harrison cracked some rb in the head with his elbow after dropping him in the backfield? do you think he'd be allowed back in the nfl?

people don't get that the severity of punishment, and why everyone is so pissed at MWP and lakers fans trying to rationalize their way out of tis, is 100% related to the fact that ITS A HEAD INJURY.

now add in intent, and past history, and sterns concern for keeping his league professional...that's the point. i'd be shocked if MWP was heard from again this season and he deserves it.

NE Sportsfan
04-24-2012, 07:22 PM
Artest is a scumbag. That idiot said it was an accident, LOL.

kingjaymes23
04-24-2012, 07:23 PM
Artest wound up and hit Harden in the side of the head. Lakers fans are driving me crazy trying to act like it wasn't a big deal or doesn't deserve a lengthy suspension. KGs elbow wasn't even close to the same, nor was Afflallos. The closest one was Howard's, but even that isn't a good comparison because MWP wound up for the elbow and did it on a defenseless player for absolutely no reason. It was a thug play and deserves a suspension of 5 or more games.

LakersMaster24
04-24-2012, 07:26 PM
this is the "street ball" internet tough guy defense that is just so whack. you have NEVER taken a shot like that in a pick up game, you've never seen a shot like that in a pick up game.

nothing like this happened in the 90's. the last time anything like this happened was tomjonovich, which was taken very seriously. but you probably just hear people talk about the 90's being tougher and make assumptions based on that. there was never a place for this **** in the league.

I am pretty sure Kareem got his hand broken once because some moron decided to cheap shot him. Also Rodman had plenty of nice moments as well.

beasted86
04-24-2012, 07:30 PM
Artest wound up and hit Harden in the side of the head. Lakers fans are driving me crazy trying to act like it wasn't a big deal or doesn't deserve a lengthy suspension. KGs elbow wasn't even close to the same, nor was Afflallos. The closest one was Howard's, but even that isn't a good comparison because MWP wound up for the elbow and did it on a defenseless player for absolutely no reason. It was a thug play and deserves a suspension of 5 or more games.
Agreed.

And like I said in the other thread, I'd like Stern to fine him like $1.5M and set a precedent. That should amount to something like 20% of his contract this year because he wanted to be a tough guy.

thekmp211
04-24-2012, 07:37 PM
I am pretty sure Kareem got his hand broken once because some moron decided to cheap shot him. Also Rodman had plenty of nice moments as well.

77-78. kareem threw the punch, after he got cheap shotted. i actually had never watched the video until now -- holy ****!

http://slumz.boxden.com/f16/throwback-kareem-goat-breaks-his-hand-while-sucker-punching-kent-benson-video-1718708/

so not the 90's, the 70's, when the league was a comparative mess. we're tolerating this kind of stuff?

LakersMaster24
04-24-2012, 08:13 PM
77-78. kareem threw the punch, after he got cheap shotted. i actually had never watched the video until now -- holy ****!

http://slumz.boxden.com/f16/throwback-kareem-goat-breaks-his-hand-while-sucker-punching-kent-benson-video-1718708/

so not the 90's, the 70's, when the league was a comparative mess. we're tolerating this kind of stuff?

Yea I know this was the 70's. However the 90's had some bright moments as well. Remember when Kurt Thomas threw down Rodman when he was on the Lakers?

Kyben36
04-24-2012, 08:41 PM
there was entent on Artest Elboy no question, the guy also has a record and needed to be tought a lesson. this **** cant happen in the nba today.

KB-Pau-DH2012
04-24-2012, 08:44 PM
Close thread, we have a Metta-7 game suspension thread.