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View Full Version : Who should be the 2 guards on the all NBA 1st team???



Ty Fast
04-01-2012, 03:55 PM
Lebron and KD are locks for the 2 forward spots and D12 is a lock for center, but the guards are kinda in the air. Who do you think should be the 2 selected?

Chacarron
04-01-2012, 03:58 PM
Paul and Wade.

AIsixersFK
04-01-2012, 04:07 PM
Paul and Kobe.

Cal827
04-01-2012, 04:10 PM
Wade and Kobe :D

bronxbomba26
04-01-2012, 04:11 PM
Why Paul? If its strictly performance-based (and not team success) I think Deron Williams should be there over CP3. CP3 is averaging 8.8 assists and 19.6 ppg and Deron is averaging 8.6 assists and 21.6 ppg.

Cal827
04-01-2012, 04:11 PM
Realistic answer:

Nash (If that team somehow sneaks in)
Wade

JLynn943
04-01-2012, 04:13 PM
Paul and Wade.

Wade for sure. Deron is just as deserving as Paul in my opinion, but I can see where winning will factor in.

Cal827
04-01-2012, 04:14 PM
Why Paul? If its strictly performance-based (and not team success) I think Deron Williams should be there over CP3. CP3 is averaging 8.8 assists and 19.6 ppg and Deron is averaging 8.6 assists and 21.6 ppg.

Williams is doubling up Paul on Turnovers and is only shooting 41% (to Paul's 49%). Also he isn't in a big market... He'll probably be on the third team.

Paul is also better defensively (double the steals).

NoahH
04-01-2012, 04:19 PM
Westbrook and CP3

Chacarron
04-01-2012, 04:21 PM
Wade for sure. Deron is just as deserving as Paul in my opinion, but I can see where winning will factor in.

Paul is doing his business much more efficiently than Deron. Paul is averaging 3 less shots, lower USG%, has a higher TS% and eFG%, higher PER, and incredibly higher WS/48.

I doubt Deron gets in the 3rd Team to be honest with players like Westbrook, Parker, Kobe, Nash and Rose all having better years.

AIsixersFK
04-01-2012, 04:24 PM
I can see some making a case for Westbrook. If he didn't have Durant in his shadow he'd get more respect. Watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q5CRRHHisw

JLynn943
04-01-2012, 04:32 PM
Paul is doing his business much more efficiently than Deron. Paul is averaging 3 less shots, lower USG%, has a higher TS% and eFG%, higher PER, and incredibly higher WS/48.

I doubt Deron gets in the 3rd Team to be honest with players like Westbrook, Parker, Kobe and Rose all having better years.

You're right (at least about Paul over Deron), I hadn't really checked out any advanced stats. I think Deron being surrounded by much lesser talent should factor in, but I suppose that's a debatable factor to include.

tmacsc2
04-01-2012, 04:32 PM
Westbrook and Wade for sure

akia83
04-01-2012, 04:43 PM
Westbrook and Wade for sure
:clap:

SportsFanatic10
04-01-2012, 04:44 PM
westbrook and wade. but cp3 has a good case too.

boogie-reke
04-01-2012, 04:53 PM
CP3, Westbrook, KD, Lebron, Dwight.

Venomous88
04-01-2012, 04:57 PM
westbrook and wade, but it will be Kobe and Wade/Westbrook

DR_1
04-01-2012, 04:59 PM
Rose and Kobe

FraziersKnicks
04-01-2012, 05:00 PM
CP3 and Wade will get it, but Westbrook is close.. Westbrook and Parker on the second team, and Kobe and Deron on the third.

PhillyFaninLA
04-01-2012, 05:07 PM
CP3 and Wade with Westbrook and Nash a quarks (its what makes up a proton, electron, or neutron if you did not know) width behind and Rose not far behind them

mekedubs
04-01-2012, 05:08 PM
As much as I like Kobe, I would have to give the vote to Westbrook and Wade... Maybe Kobe to the 2nd team but for what Tony Parker has been doing for the Spurs he should get a spot on the 2nd or 3rd teams as well...

Venomous88
04-01-2012, 05:09 PM
Rose isn't making any all-NBA teams this year and he shouldnt

BSardogan
04-01-2012, 05:11 PM
Lowry and Dragic.

Venomous88
04-01-2012, 05:11 PM
Should be:

Wade
Westbrook

CP3
Kobe

Parker
Nash

b@llhog24
04-01-2012, 05:20 PM
Paul and Wade.
This and...............................

Paul is doing his business much more efficiently than Deron. Paul is averaging 3 less shots, lower USG%, has a higher TS% and eFG%, higher PER, and incredibly higher WS/48.

I doubt Deron gets in the 3rd Team to be honest with players like Westbrook, Parker, Kobe, Nash and Rose all having better years.

This.

TRF929
04-01-2012, 05:33 PM
Parker and Wade

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2012, 06:35 PM
I go by position, you need a PG and a SG, not just two guards of either position. That said I think the obvious selections would be Kobe and CP3. Kobe is having a better year than Wade, even though recently his bad shooting nights have REALLY hurt the team, and Kobe does need to share the ball more, but still, he's the best SG this season. CP3 is the best PG. Is there really any question? I mean, there is an arguement to put Rose ahead of CP3, but Kobe is a lock.

As for the Forwards, I'd give it to LBJ and Love, just because I think there should be a PF and a SF. C is Dwight.

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2012, 06:37 PM
Should be:

Wade
Westbrook

CP3
Kobe

Parker
Nash

you got Westbrook, Parker and Nash all over Rose? WTF?!?!?!?!

Baller1
04-01-2012, 06:42 PM
Westbrook
Wade

CP3
Parker

Kobe
Rose

Rose has played just over half his team's games, that's not all NBA worthy. Otherwise he'd probably be a second team, maybe first.

Westbrook has been incredible, simple as that.

FraziersKnicks
04-01-2012, 07:49 PM
Westbrook
Wade

CP3
Parker

Kobe
Rose

Rose has played just over half his team's games, that's not all NBA worthy. Otherwise he'd probably be a second team, maybe first.

Westbrook has been incredible, simple as that.

I don't even think he's worthy of 3rd team with the amount of time he's missed..

kozelkid
04-01-2012, 07:56 PM
Should be between Paul, Westbrook and Wade. Unfortunately, I have a sneaky suspicion that Kobe makes it again. After seeing Kobe making it to all defensive team the last few years, I have no trust for voters (especially considering the voters for defensive teams are coaches for ****'s sake).

kozelkid
04-01-2012, 07:58 PM
I don't even think he's worthy of 3rd team with the amount of time he's missed..

Neither do I. Rose in his limited time has had his best season, but you can't be looked at as an all NBA player when you missed half the games. I wouldn't be surprised to see Nash or Parker get snubbed, but I would be disappointed as an NBA fan.

EDIT- On second thought, Rose has produced more WS's in his limited games than Parker or Nash so I guess a case can be made. And Kobe as well for that matter.

Teeboy1487
04-01-2012, 08:02 PM
Westbrook and Wade.

justinnum1
04-01-2012, 08:11 PM
Westbrook and Wade.

this

justinnum1
04-01-2012, 08:11 PM
Should be between Paul, Westbrook and Wade. Unfortunately, I have a sneaky suspicion that Kobe makes it again. After seeing Kobe making it to all defensive team the last few years, I have no trust for voters (especially considering the voters for defensive teams are coaches for ****'s sake).

If kobe makes it then the award is a joke.

mavwar53
04-01-2012, 08:13 PM
If I had a vote it would be Wade and Westbrook.

ManRam
04-01-2012, 08:47 PM
Paul and Wade

But I have an inkling Kobe will squeak in...

Russy has played like a 1st teamer too. There need to be 7 spots so

Paul
Wade
Russy
KD
LeBron
Love
Dwight

can all make it. All have played well-enough to be 1st team players.

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 08:51 PM
Nash and whoever

Bruno
04-01-2012, 08:51 PM
Westbrook
Wade

CP3
Parker

Kobe
Rose

Rose has played just over half his team's games, that's not all NBA worthy. Otherwise he'd probably be a second team, maybe first.

Westbrook has been incredible, simple as that.

interesting to me that you'd make the jump of putting westbrook on the first team, but not include Harden on the second or third team. I still think Harden is right there with westbrook. he's more efficient, plays better D and has more win-shares, despite playing hundreds minutes less.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 08:53 PM
A lot of the people saying Rose shouldn't make first team because of time he has missed are also including Wade on their first teams. Wade has missed 20% of the season with injuries, why does he get a pass?

Chronz
04-01-2012, 08:53 PM
Why Paul? If its strictly performance-based (and not team success) I think Deron Williams should be there over CP3. CP3 is averaging 8.8 assists and 19.6 ppg and Deron is averaging 8.6 assists and 21.6 ppg.
Efficiency matters

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 08:53 PM
interesting to me that you'd make the jump of putting westbrook on the first team, but not include Harden on the second or third team. I still think Harden is right there with westbrook. he's more efficient, plays better D and has more win-shares, despite playing hundreds minutes less.

Harden will get plenty of all-nba selections but I'd be surprised if he got one this year, gotta pay dues.

ManRam
04-01-2012, 08:54 PM
A lot of the people saying Rose shouldn't make first team because of time he has missed are also including Wade on their first teams. Wade has missed 20% of the season with injuries, why does he get a pass?

Wade has played 7 more games...that's a significant amount.

Factor that in with the fact that he's just been better than Rose and I think it makes sense...

Bruno
04-01-2012, 08:54 PM
It's gone be Kobe and Chris Paul. Wade and Rose have both missed a lot of games, and the voters aren't going to make the jump of putting westbrook over Kobe or Paul. i'm not saying thats right, but that's whats gone happen, IMO. my prediction.

TheBigORobinson
04-01-2012, 08:55 PM
Parker and Kobe 1st team
Rondo and Wade 2nd team
Westbrook and DWill 3rd team

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 08:57 PM
It's gone be Kobe and Chris Paul. Wade and Rose have both missed a lot of games, and the voters aren't going to make the jump of putting westbrook over Kobe or Paul. i'm not saying thats right, but that's whats gone happen, IMO. my prediction.

why does kobe get it over nash?

Bruno
04-01-2012, 08:58 PM
Wade has played 7 more games...that's a significant amount.

Factor that in with the fact that he's just been better than Rose and I think it makes sense...

he has been better than Rose. He's still missed 9 out of 50, that's almost 20% of the season thus far. Not to mention, he's playing 33.2 minutes per game. Other guys have carried much larger loads this season, even though wade has been more productive, and more efficient in his lesser minutes. kobe for example has played 645 more minutes than Wade this season. how are voters going to value that? it's gone be an interesting vote at guard.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 08:59 PM
why does kobe get it over nash?

Phoenix isn't a playoff team. Kobe is better at defense. that's what voters will say to themselves, if I had to say. that's my prediction, not saying if i think its right or wrong.

ManRam
04-01-2012, 09:02 PM
he has been better than Rose. He's still missed 9 out of 50, that's almost 20% of the season thus far. Not to mention, he's playing 33.2 minutes per game. Other guys have carried much larger loads this season, even though wade has been more productive, and more efficient in his lesser minutes. kobe for example has played 645 more minutes than Wade this season. how are voters going to value that? it's gone be an interesting vote at guard.

I don't know how they'll value it.

But if he ends up missing 9 out of 66 games...I don't care. Minutes matter, but Kobe just hasn't been great (1st-team-great) this season. You could argue that there have been a good amount of games where he's actually been a detriment. Wade has been so significantly better that if that games missed number stays at 9, and so long as he's nearly doubling up Kobe in WS/48 and beating him down in the PER battle, the shooting efficiency battle and any other metric you want, I couldn't ever justify myself voting for Kobe...regardless of minutes or anything else.

Unless Wade goes down again for 5+ games, I'd vote Paul and Wade and not look back for a single second. No-brainer to me.

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 09:03 PM
Phoenix isn't a playoff team. Kobe is better at defense. that's what voters will say to themselves, if I had to say. that's my prediction, not saying if i think its right or wrong.

what do you think is right?

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:13 PM
I don't know how they'll value it. I can't be certain either but Paul has been healthy and good, I think they'll give it to him in his first year in LA, considering questions around Wade and Roses health, and Bryants drop off in efficiency. Plus, Paul might get the subconscious mental vote from voters due to his 2011 playoffs (not appropriate, but you know that kinda stuff happens).


But if he ends up missing 9 out of 66 games...I don't care.
I don't know if I'd care, I'd just hope that voters would consider the fact that his brilliant production and efficiency came for only 86% of a full season, and that his production came at less than three quarters a night, during the 86% of games that he did play (33.2 mpg).




Minutes matter, but Kobe just hasn't been great (1st-team-great) this season. It pains me to have to agree with you here, but as a digger, it makes me ask, why hasn't he been first team great? Leading the league in minutes with 2,0007 total minutes is perhaps a serious reason as to why his production and efficiency has dropped off. Per minute production and efficiency has dropped off, that's a statistical fact. but total, non-per minute production is another debate. he has given his team 600+ more minutes than wade this season, and that's gotta count for something.



You could argue that there have been a good amount of games where he's actually been a detriment.
he has, id say 3-5 games without going through his game log. but, by default, Wade not playing nine games is a lot detrimental to his team, by virtue of him not being on the court, or being able to practice with his team.


Wade has been so significantly better that if that games missed number stays at 9, and so long as he's nearly doubling up Kobe in WS/48 and beating him down in the PER battle, the shooting efficiency battle and any other metric you want, I couldn't ever justify myself voting for Kobe...regardless of minutes or anything else.that's because you're a reasonable person. the voters are not. :laugh2:

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:19 PM
what do you think is right?

hm. tough to say man, I do think it's a legit debate. I mean, missed games/low minutes aside, this should be Paul and Wade in a landslide.

I think bryant carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders with his absurd MPG, and not missing a game means a lot, but I also think Wades production has been so much higher, it might have to make up for the minute comparison.

based off what we've seen thus far, I'd probably go Wade/Paul on the first team. there are a lot of ifs. if phoenix makes the playoffs, Nash deserves a spot on the third team. if SA locks up the #1, you'd have to save a spot for Parker. Honestly, Harden can be debated. Rose has been very good when he's been around. a lot of worthy names, a lot of ifs, and a fair share of games left to be played. it's gone be interesting.

Ill21
04-01-2012, 09:24 PM
Jeremy Lin and Iman Shumpert :)





















But for real

CP3 and Wade

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 09:24 PM
hm. tough to say man, I do think it's a legit debate. I mean, missed games/low minutes aside, this should be Paul and Wade in a landslide.

I think bryant carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders with his absurd MPG, and not missing a game means a lot, but I also think Wades production has been so much higher, it might have to make up for the minute comparison.

based off what we've seen thus far, I'd probably go Wade/Paul on the first team. there are a lot of ifs. if phoenix makes the playoffs, Nash deserves a spot on the third team. if SA locks up the #1, you'd have to save a spot for Parker. Honestly, Harden can be debated. Rose has been very good when he's been around. a lot of worthy names, a lot of ifs, and a fair share of games left to be played. it's gone be interesting.



def a lot of what ifs, but I look at what Kobe has and imagine what Nash would do if he had Bynum/Gasol and to me, it's a wrap.

CP3 has been good but kinda of disappointing at the same time. Heat killed without Wade. Suns rely so heavily on Nash to create offense that whatever defensive discrepancy there is should be null and void, imo of course.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:27 PM
Spent a few minutes going over the stats for some of the best guards. As of today, I'd have to do this:

Paul/Wade
Bryant/Westbrook
Rose/Harden.

If the Spurs can lock up the #1 spot out west, Parker deserves serious consideration for a spot, and if the Suns make playoffs, so does Nash. I'd take Rose over Westbrook for the second team if not for the massive amount of games he's missed. Honesty, if he hasn't missed a game, he'd have a fine debate for the first time, considering his production and Chicagos record.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:30 PM
def a lot of what ifs, but I look at what Kobe has and imagine what Nash would do if he had Bynum/Gasol and to me, it's a wrap.
it'd be deadly. LAL would still get torched by elite PG's, but those bigs would have very pretty numbers. although, I don't know if voters will take that swap-hypothetical into consideration when its time to vote. Nashs defensive reputation doesn't help him here either.



CP3 has been good but kinda of disappointing at the same time. Heat killed without Wade. Suns rely so heavily on Nash to create offense that whatever defensive discrepancy there is should be null and void, imo of course. they do. nash has been dirty, dude just keeps plain at a really high level, it's nuts. it's fun to watch.

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 09:33 PM
nash isn't that bad defensively...

samevans7
04-01-2012, 09:39 PM
interesting to me that you'd make the jump of putting westbrook on the first team, but not include Harden on the second or third team. I still think Harden is right there with westbrook. he's more efficient, plays better D and has more win-shares, despite playing hundreds minutes less.

Westbrook is much better defensively than Harden

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:43 PM
Westbrook is much better defensively than Harden

ya think? WB does have a slight edge if defensive advanced stats, if you value that. I think Hardens ability to guard the SG position makes him the more versatile defender.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 09:44 PM
nash isn't that bad defensively...

he can't stay in front of any elite guard. he has little defensive effect or presence, IMO. he has a half a defensive win-share over 47 games.

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 09:46 PM
he can't stay in front of any elite guard. he has little defensive effect or presence, IMO. he has a half a defensive win-share over 47 games.

no one can stay in front of the super guards, lets get that out of the way


outside of that, Nash plays his defensive role really well he's just always had ****** bigs behind him until Gortat

UPRock
04-01-2012, 09:52 PM
Wade and Paul, if Kobe goes first team then something is obviously wrong.

Bruno
04-01-2012, 10:00 PM
no one can stay in front of the super guards, lets get that out of the way well, good offense will always be a step ahead of good defense.

but how about 26/6 on 65% from Kyrie Irving?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201201120PHO.html

23/8 on 54% from Rodney Stuckey?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201203160PHO.html

Nash has gotten burned by non-super guards as well.


outside of that, Nash plays his defensive role really well
he really doesn't. He has the second worst defensive rating on the Suns, behind only Michael Redd. 12th out of 13.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHO/2012.html


he's just always had ****** bigs behind him until Gortat

then how do you explain his 2012 defensive rating being exactly on his career average?

ChiSox219
04-01-2012, 10:09 PM
well, good offense will always be a step ahead of good defense.

but how about 26/6 on 65% from Kyrie Irving?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201201120PHO.html

23/8 on 54% from Rodney Stuckey?
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201203160PHO.html

Nash has gotten burned by non-super guards as well.

he really doesn't. He has the second worst defensive rating on the Suns, behind only Michael Redd. 12th out of 13.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHO/2012.html



then how do you explain his 2012 defensive rating being exactly on his career average?

defensive rating is ****, check out Carlos Boozer

how i explain the descprecency is based on watching the suns and the the book :07 Seconds or Less

I'm not saying Nash is a good defender just that his offensive contribution far outweighs his defensive flaws. He has the polish hammer but Channing Frye is the opposite of prime KG so what can you realistically expect?

Bruno
04-01-2012, 10:13 PM
defensive rating is ****, check out Carlos Boozer

how i explain the descprecency is based on watching the suns and the the book :07 Seconds or Less

I'm not saying Nash is a good defender just that his offensive contribution far outweighs his defensive flaws. He has the polish hammer but Channing Frye is the opposite of prime KG so what can you realistically expect?

they do. but there are other players who's defensive flaws aren't at the same level of liability of nashs.

PatsSoxKnicks
04-01-2012, 10:17 PM
Paul and Wade and I don't have to think twice about this. Westbrook certainly deserves it but I think Paul has been better, especially recently.

Baller1
04-01-2012, 11:18 PM
interesting to me that you'd make the jump of putting westbrook on the first team, but not include Harden on the second or third team. I still think Harden is right there with westbrook. he's more efficient, plays better D and has more win-shares, despite playing hundreds minutes less.

If I had it my way, it'd be Harden in over Rose or Kobe (being completely honest).

I've always respected Kobe's game despite my hatred for him, but he's been pretty damn bad this season for his standards.

Raph12
04-02-2012, 12:19 AM
Right now? CP3 and WB. At the end of the season? CP3 and DW3... Wade has played at a very high level, but he's been injured a lot, so if he finishes the season strong, he'd get my vote.

kArSoN RyDaH
04-02-2012, 12:24 AM
Paul and Kobe

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 12:36 AM
CP3 and Westbrook. LOL @ people saying Wade. Wade's offensive numbers are down and his defensive stats are terrible.

LA_Raiders
04-02-2012, 01:17 AM
CP3 and Kobe 28/5/5

GSRaider
04-02-2012, 02:00 AM
Current

PG. Paul
SG. Kobe
SF. LeBron
PF. Love
C. Dwight

6. Durant

All Time

PG. Magic
SG. Jordan
SF. Bird
PF. Duncan
C. Russell

6. Shaq

AIRMAR72
04-02-2012, 02:27 AM
wade or harden

Blazers#1Fan
04-02-2012, 02:38 AM
westbrook and wade. but cp3 has a good case too.

this

all 3rd team i bet jeremy lin sneaks in there lol

ManningToTyree
04-02-2012, 02:43 AM
Kobe and Wade.

Westbrook has a chance

Blazers#1Fan
04-02-2012, 03:16 AM
Current

PG. Paul
SG. Kobe
SF. LeBron
PF. Love
C. Dwight

6. Durant

All Time

PG. Magic
SG. Jordan
SF. Bird
PF. Duncan
C. Russell

6. Shaq

All Time

PG. Magic
SG. Jordan
SF. Lebron(will be better then larry come end of his career)
PF. TD
C. Wilt

All Time 2nd team

PG. Jerry West
SG. Bryant
SF. Bird
PF. Malone
C. Russell

Lebron Because his career isnt over but he is just as all around as Bird but he is more beastly with his skills(and i dont like Lebron) i think Durant will be on top of Bird come end of his career!

BradfordIsElite
04-02-2012, 03:19 AM
It should be Westbrook and Kobe.

xILLN355
04-02-2012, 04:15 AM
CP3 and Westbrook. LOL @ people saying Wade. Wade's offensive numbers are down and his defensive stats are terrible.

oh this guy..

Baller1
04-02-2012, 04:36 AM
It's so embarrassing seeing people put Kobe on the first team.

DaLyingofJungl3
04-02-2012, 05:31 AM
its like this

PG-Westbrook
SG-Wade
SF-LeBron
PF-Kevin Durant
C-Howard (by default)

Kobe is 2nd team

thenaj17
04-02-2012, 06:44 AM
you got Westbrook, Parker and Nash all over Rose? WTF?!?!?!?!

Rose has been injured a long time and his team has still been winning regularly. No chance Kobe doesn't make the team anyway, even if it may not be deserved ahead of Westbrook. Reputation does get you a long way in these flawed voting systems.

Jint.
04-02-2012, 07:49 AM
Paul / Wade

-Kobe24-TJ19-
04-02-2012, 08:08 AM
westbrook and kobe

pretty easy choice If you ask me

SDvikes
04-02-2012, 08:55 AM
Westbrook
James
Durant
Klove
Howard

tjlipford
04-02-2012, 10:02 AM
Why do people keep saying wade over Kobe? He's not having a better year thank Kobe but most people keep saying wade over Kobe and saying its not even close. I'm confused after these comments.

Also Westbrook should get it over Chris Paul.

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 10:50 AM
It's so embarrassing seeing people put Kobe on the first team.

How so? Educate us... You probably have Wade over Kobe. :facepalm:

b@llhog24
04-02-2012, 11:51 AM
westbrook and kobe

pretty easy choice If you ask me

Your a guy who likes to use advanced stats as your arguement. Which makes me wonder how you have kobe here. :confused:

b@llhog24
04-02-2012, 11:52 AM
Why do people keep saying wade over Kobe? He's not having a better year thank Kobe but most people keep saying wade over Kobe and saying its not even close. I'm confused after these comments.

Also Westbrook should get it over Chris Paul.
:laugh2:


How so? Educate us... You probably have Wade over Kobe. :facepalm:

:facepalm:

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 11:58 AM
westbrook and kobe

pretty easy choice If you ask me

I'd like to know your reasoning for having Kobe over CP3 and Wade?? And why it's a "pretty easy choice" for you?

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 12:00 PM
I'd like to know your reasoning for having Kobe over CP3 and Wade?? And why it's a "pretty easy choice" for you?

28,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 5, 5


Kobe destroyed Wade on both ends a month ago.

b@llhog24
04-02-2012, 12:03 PM
28,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 5, 5


Kobe destroyed Wade on both ends a month ago.

Cool story bro.

DerekCzajkowski
04-02-2012, 12:07 PM
No one said rondo?

b@llhog24
04-02-2012, 12:08 PM
No one said rondo?

Its because he's undeserving.

Birdmannn
04-02-2012, 12:13 PM
Tony Parker should make the first team.

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 12:13 PM
Cool story bro.

Wade will never be better than the Black Mamba. Deal with it.

Birdmannn
04-02-2012, 12:15 PM
You mad, bro? Wade will never be better than the Black Mamba. Deal with it.

You never know if the Heat go on a 4 streak of championships Wade would pass him.

The Final Boss
04-02-2012, 12:15 PM
Westbrook and Bryant.

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 12:15 PM
28,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 5, 5


Kobe destroyed Wade on both ends a month ago.


Rk Player Season Age G GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
1 Kobe Bryant 2011-12 33 53 53 38.6 9.9 23.5 .424 1.5 5.1 .291 6.7 8.0 .844 1.2 4.3 5.5 4.6 1.3 0.3 3.7 1.8 28.1
2 Dwyane Wade 2011-12 30 42 42 33.3 8.7 17.3 .503 0.3 1.2 .286 5.0 6.4 .794 1.5 3.5 5.0 4.8 1.6 1.4 2.6 2.3 22.8


It's really not close statistically.. Kobe has Wade beaten by 5 points, and that is it. Wade has a much higher FG%, more steals, more blocks and less turnovers... As the 2nd option on his team.

Advance stats he beats him out even more:


Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
1 Kobe Bryant 2011-12 33 53 2044 22.0 .521 .455 3.7 11.8 8.0 24.7 1.7 0.6 12.0 36.6 104 104 3.7 2.2 5.9 .138
2 Dwyane Wade 2011-12 30 42 1398 27.5 .567 .513 5.7 11.7 8.9 28.1 2.6 3.3 11.5 31.6 114 99 4.8 2.3 7.1 .244


It's not even close.. Superior PER, TS% eFG%, higher ORtg, lower DRtg, more win shares whilst playing 11 less games and a much higher WS/48.

I really struggle to see a legit reason for why Kobe should be 1st team over either Wade or CP3...

jim51990
04-02-2012, 12:23 PM
westy and cp3

i dont understand how anyone can say wade this year hes played the worst ive seen him play in along time

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 12:28 PM
westy and cp3

i dont understand how anyone can say wade this year hes played the worst ive seen him play in along time

I agree with your selections, but Wade is still playing better than 99% of the league..

23/5/5 on 51% shooting? And his team is gonna finish with a top 3 record in the league is probably enough to justify a 1st team selection.

kdspurman
04-02-2012, 12:35 PM
Parker and Westbrook

JordansBulls
04-02-2012, 12:41 PM
Rose and Kobe

You can't put a guy on the first team who has missed 1/3 of the season.

Marlin234
04-02-2012, 01:00 PM
Wade got robbed the year after his injury. Where he had an MVP season and Kobe took the 1st team and Lebron his second MVP because he had the best record. What makes u think he will get it this year

Marlin234
04-02-2012, 01:03 PM
Rk Player Season Age G GS MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS
1 Kobe Bryant 2011-12 33 53 53 38.6 9.9 23.5 .424 1.5 5.1 .291 6.7 8.0 .844 1.2 4.3 5.5 4.6 1.3 0.3 3.7 1.8 28.1
2 Dwyane Wade 2011-12 30 42 42 33.3 8.7 17.3 .503 0.3 1.2 .286 5.0 6.4 .794 1.5 3.5 5.0 4.8 1.6 1.4 2.6 2.3 22.8


It's really not close statistically.. Kobe has Wade beaten by 5 points, and that is it. Wade has a much higher FG%, more steals, more blocks and less turnovers... As the 2nd option on his team.

Advance stats he beats him out even more:


Rk Player Season Age G MP PER TS% eFG% ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG% ORtg DRtg OWS DWS WS WS/48
1 Kobe Bryant 2011-12 33 53 2044 22.0 .521 .455 3.7 11.8 8.0 24.7 1.7 0.6 12.0 36.6 104 104 3.7 2.2 5.9 .138
2 Dwyane Wade 2011-12 30 42 1398 27.5 .567 .513 5.7 11.7 8.9 28.1 2.6 3.3 11.5 31.6 114 99 4.8 2.3 7.1 .244


It's not even close.. Superior PER, TS% eFG%, higher ORtg, lower DRtg, more win shares whilst playing 11 less games and a much higher WS/48.

I really struggle to see a legit reason for why Kobe should be 1st team over either Wade or CP3...


Don't bother he's the biggest wade hater.

Spiderman 1nner
04-02-2012, 01:12 PM
well its gonna be wade and kobe but that doesn't mean it should be. Wade deserves his spot, but I think Tony Parker, Russell Westbrook, Steve Nash, Derrick Rose, and CP3 are all more deserving than Kobe.

NoahH
04-02-2012, 01:13 PM
Derrick Rose has only played 34 games, he won't make the first team.
Kobe imo isn't as deserving as Westbrook, CP3 or Wade

DaLyingofJungl3
04-02-2012, 01:21 PM
You mad Wade is a better finals performer than Kobe?

Baller1
04-02-2012, 01:25 PM
I don't understand why we're even debating this. We all know Kobe will undeservingly get All NBA First Team, and probably all Defensive First Team as well.

AntiG
04-02-2012, 01:34 PM
Westbrook and Kobe.

Bruno
04-02-2012, 01:53 PM
If I had it my way, it'd be Harden in over Rose or Kobe (being completely honest).

I've always respected Kobe's game despite my hatred for him, but he's been pretty damn bad this season for his standards.

for sure. i mean, his counting stats are on par, but his efficiency has just dropped off. as a fan, i'm gona find a reason to make an excuse for that. leading the NBA in total minutes as a 16 year vet being a pretty decent one. he's gotten less efficient as the season has gone on (check out by blog), he's losing his legs and brown has played him far too much.

I'd like to think that he'd be more efficient if he was getting Wade type minutes (33, instead of 39 a game). but the Lakers can't afford that luxury if they want home-court in the first round. bryant has played 646 more minutes than Wade this season.
It would take Wade an additional 19.4 games, at his average of 33.3 minutes per game to match Bryant in total minutes this season. Wade has only missed nine games, but Bryant playing six extra minutes per game played, adds up to a nearly 20 game difference. That's gotta count for something.

JayAllDay
04-02-2012, 02:03 PM
Williams is doubling up Paul on Turnovers and is only shooting 41% (to Paul's 49%). Also he isn't in a big market... He'll probably be on the third team.
Paul is also better defensively (double the steals).

Oh Deron's in a big market and Nets moving to Brooklyn only adds to that.
Don't get that twisted.

It's just that nobody in the Tri-states care about the Nets.

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 03:04 PM
Westbrook and Kobe.

I'm still waiting for someone to provide a decent argument as to why Kobe should make the 1st team?

willabeast77
04-02-2012, 03:05 PM
Truthfully at this point I see it being Westbrook and Kobe, but it should be Paul and Wade

willabeast77
04-02-2012, 03:07 PM
I'm still waiting for someone to provide a decent argument as to why Kobe should make the 1st team?

The voters will most likely give it to Kobe based on him leading the league in scoring and the Lakers being 3rd in the East. The same excuses why Wade probably wont make it is because he's 2nd fiddle to LeBron, and Wade's stats seem a little down this season. Kobe has his name rep which helped him the past few seasons.

DaLyingofJungl3
04-02-2012, 03:13 PM
willabeast77 is point
sadly thats how the media is gonna look @ it

eugene
04-02-2012, 03:25 PM
wade and rondo ;)

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 03:40 PM
The voters will most likely give it to Kobe based on him leading the league in scoring and the Lakers being 3rd in the East. The same excuses why Wade probably wont make it is because he's 2nd fiddle to LeBron, and Wade's stats seem a little down this season. Kobe has his name rep which helped him the past few seasons.

I completely agree with you, but I wanna hear what someone who genuinely thinks he should make it from his seasons performance has to say about it.

Chronz
04-02-2012, 05:14 PM
28,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 5, 5
False

FrenchSunsFan
04-02-2012, 05:48 PM
Westbrook and Wade for the 1s team and Parker and Kobe for the 2nd team.

justinnum1
04-02-2012, 05:52 PM
CP3 and Westbrook. LOL @ people saying Wade. Wade's offensive numbers are down and his defensive stats are terrible.

:facepalm::facepalm:
Even spo feels the same way

http://i39.tinypic.com/oqc2mx.jpg

Cal827
04-02-2012, 06:00 PM
Oh Deron's in a big market and Nets moving to Brooklyn only adds to that.
Don't get that twisted.

It's just that nobody in the Tri-states care about the Nets.

:laugh: @ the edit reason. My bad. I guess I was thinking of where they are now compared to where they will be going.

jjcox82
04-02-2012, 06:56 PM
Rose and Kobe

I dont know how it could be Paul and Williams when Roses numbers are

22.8 ppg 8 apg and 45 % from the field better than paul and williams in all three and plays for the team with the best record in the league

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 09:11 PM
False

Nice argument brah.

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 09:12 PM
:facepalm::facepalm:
Even spo feels the same way

http://i39.tinypic.com/oqc2mx.jpg

:facepalm:


Wade stans are so delusional.

ManRam
04-02-2012, 09:16 PM
28,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 22, 5, 5



Hahaha.

It's incredible that with all the resources we have today that people still dumb it down to that...emphasis on the word "dumb".

Even basic stats like FG%, blocks, steals (both are iffy stats, at best), TOs etc. can be used to show how Kobe hasn't been nearly as good as Wade this year. Dive into anything that's remotely "advanced", and it's game over.

22,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 28,5,5 and I've never been more certain of anything in my life. Even if you round Kobe's rebounds up to 6...

ManRam
04-02-2012, 09:17 PM
No one said rondo?

I love Rondo as much as any PG in the NBA...but he has not had a great season. He doesn't even make my third team this year :sigh:

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 09:20 PM
Hahaha.

It's incredible that with all the resources we have today that people still dumb it down to that...emphasis on the word "dumb".

Even basic stats like FG%, blocks, steals (both are iffy stats, at best), TOs etc. can be used to show how Kobe hasn't been nearly as good as Wade this year. Dive into anything that's remotely "advanced", and it's game over.

22,5,5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 28,5,5 and I've never been more certain of anything in my life. Even if you round Kobe's rebounds up to 6...


It's nice that you forgot how Kobe destroyed Wade on both ends a month ago.

FraziersKnicks
04-02-2012, 09:25 PM
It's nice that you forgot how Kobe destroyed Wade on both ends a month ago.

It's nice that you forgot that the All-NBA teams are based on the ENTIRE season and not just one game... I have no idea why I'm even replying to you. You are such an obvious Wade troll it's ridiculous.

Longhornfan1234
04-02-2012, 09:30 PM
It's nice that you forgot that the All-NBA teams are based on the ENTIRE season and not just one game... I have no idea why I'm even replying to you. You are such an obvious Wade troll it's ridiculous.

Team accomplishments don't matter? Kobe's team is the 3rd seed in the West. The Western conference is much tougher than East. Btw... Kobe is number the one option unlike Wade.

Ladies Man
04-02-2012, 09:33 PM
If Derrick Rose didn't get injured it could have been him.. But Kobe and Westbrook in my opinion. The second team is difficult because you have Wade, Williams, and even Nash so I'm not sure on that one

DillyDill
04-02-2012, 09:37 PM
Yea I also agree with having two awards forshore. Bcuz by the way the award is be handled, Howard will win it every single year until retirement

assisi805
04-02-2012, 11:25 PM
Westbrook and Wade, Although I wouldn't be upset with Paul.

b@llhog24
04-02-2012, 11:44 PM
Yea I also agree with having two awards forshore. Bcuz by the way the award is be handled, Howard will win it every single year until retirement

wrong thread.

Fnom11
04-03-2012, 12:19 AM
Team accomplishments don't matter? Kobe's team is the 3rd seed in the West. The Western conference is much tougher than East. Btw... Kobe is number the one option unlike Wade.

You really think Kobe's having better year than Wade? Like really? Wade is the actual lock here the other guard spot is for the others.


Trolls gonna troll

Bruno
04-04-2012, 03:27 PM
Another missed game by Wade, that's 10. Does he play tonight vs OKC?

dtmagnet
04-04-2012, 04:13 PM
Westbrook and Nash.

Chronz
04-04-2012, 04:23 PM
Nice argument brah.

My opinion is as good as yours, and my opinion is that your wrong.

JordansBulls
04-04-2012, 04:40 PM
Another missed game by Wade, that's 10. Does he play tonight vs OKC?

He should.

RonE Coleman
04-04-2012, 04:54 PM
Cp3 and Wade... i seriously question anyones basketball knowledge who has westbrook over either of them

felixng2012
04-04-2012, 05:03 PM
Cp3 and Wade... i seriously question anyones basketball knowledge who has westbrook over either of them

Westbrook has had a better year than Wade who has missed many games.

RonE Coleman
04-04-2012, 05:26 PM
Westbrook has had a better year than Wade who has missed many games.

Id go back and look at there stats if i was you cause your wrong... check there per and shooting percentrages... and we all know wades a better defender