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BJBirdy
03-07-2012, 09:11 PM
The thread is pretty self-explanatory. Who would you prefer to see as the everyday Jays' starter in left field: Travis Snider or Eric Thames?

While I'd like to see Snider finally take over in left field, I feel that the LF position is Thames' job to lose at the moment. Even though he's only 24, in my opinion, it's now or never for Snider if he's ever going to be a permanent fixture in the Jays outfield.

North Yorker
03-07-2012, 09:27 PM
Snider in LF.

Maybe a Thames/EE platoon at DH?

BJBirdy
03-07-2012, 09:52 PM
Snider in LF.

Maybe a Thames/EE platoon at DH?

Personally, I'd like to see that.

phillipmike
03-07-2012, 09:58 PM
Snider in LF as he can play D. Thames should be a DH and play LF if need be. Snider is having a pretty good spring, hopefully he is given a fair shot.

Krylian
03-07-2012, 10:32 PM
The correct answer is Snider.

Sanyo
03-07-2012, 10:44 PM
Personally Thames will never exceed the fielding of Snider or some of the minor league guys. His strength will be to take over the DH duty from Edwin.

LechWalesa
03-07-2012, 10:47 PM
I've said it before:

Snider at LF, Thames at DH, EE at first, Lind off the team.

JermanJaysFan
03-07-2012, 10:49 PM
Snider, for two reasons.

The obvious one being- AA and JF have said that Thames has a slight edge on the job as he is the incumbent. That means I'd rather see Snider starting, because Snider starting by definition means he is outproducing Thames.

The other reason being I still believe in him and like his D more than Thames. I'd like to see Snider being the more-or-less fulltime LF, with Thames taking some ABs away from EE at DH and EE taking some ABs at 1B away from Lind.

Krylian
03-07-2012, 11:00 PM
Every post seems to want to see Snider in LF yet he only has 6 votes.

DeRozan10
03-07-2012, 11:08 PM
I want Snider and Thames both in the lineup for the majority of the games as the LF and the DH

If I have to pick one or the other though

Thames. I think he can become a hell of a hitter. Based on his D, I would love him as the every DH, and playing Left Field from time to time.

nithanyo
03-08-2012, 01:29 AM
Im gonna go with Thames. Just cus he has cooler facial hair and not a god damn caterpillar on his lip.

Seriously though Id prefer the better hitter. Whoever that may be. Thinking from a managers perspective I would say Farell gives more leeway for Thames since he had a decent rookie campaign.

Farsight
03-08-2012, 01:47 AM
Snider and for me its not that close. Snider is an above average fielder, and will be as good as Thames offensively (i think he will be a lot better if he plays the full year without worrying about being demoted), so to me Thames is redundant. Thames should be more of a platoon player for the jays this year

bomber0104
03-08-2012, 02:09 AM
Snider and its a pretty easy choice.. he is clearly the better defender unless Thames gets a lot better in that aspect of the game.

Snider has always has the higher ceiling and the time is getting short for him to reach that ceiling.. this is his last option year and i'd like him to get a fair shot before we lose and end up regretting it

The_Jet11
03-08-2012, 02:24 AM
Snider - LF
Thames/EE - DH
Lind - 1B

with EE seeing some 1B and Thames seeing some time in LF.

Davis as the 4th OF, and Francisco shipped to one of the teams looking for a CF. (WAS, CLE)

phillipmike
03-08-2012, 03:35 AM
Snider - LF
Thames/EE - DH
Lind - 1B

with EE seeing some 1B and Thames seeing some time in LF.

Davis as the 4th OF, and Francisco shipped to one of the teams looking for a CF. (WAS, CLE)

Hard to argue with that.

Valleyfella
03-08-2012, 08:22 AM
All things being equal, I prefer Snider. He has the better pedigree and is a better fielder. Still, he has had a number of opportunities in the past and only shown occasional flashes. Thames did well in his only opportunity. I suspect it's Snider's position to lose this spring, but that he better come out of the gate producing in April. His audition won't be lengthy if he struggles at all.

bartron_44
03-08-2012, 10:05 AM
I voted Snider, but that is because I think Thames is going to push him to perform well and win that spot. If he can hit better then Thames, then he will be a solid player for us with his defense.

JermanJaysFan
03-08-2012, 10:10 AM
People have to realize that to a certain extent, Snider has shown pretty much the same things offensively as Thames.

Over his various stints in the bigs over the past 4 years, Snider has posted a triple slash of .248/.307/.423 for an OPS of .730. Prorate his HR and 2B to a 162 game season and you get 20 and 38 respectively. If you discount Snider's fairly brutal 2011, that triple slash jumps to .255/.318/.446 with an OPS of .764 (with 23 projected HR and 36 doubles).

Thames' triple slash last season was .262/.313/.456 for an OPS of .769. Prorate his HR and 2B totals to a 162 game season and you are looking at 20 and 41 respectively.

It's not at all like Thames is blowing Snider out of the water at the plate. And when you factor in defense, it's a fairly easy decision.

Bob_at_york
03-08-2012, 01:14 PM
Snider. I really wanted Thames to be packaged with a prospect for another starter. I still technically want that.

ILDD
03-08-2012, 01:19 PM
I went with Thames but only just.

I can see the season starting with Thames in LF, Snider in AAA. In a couple of months, Lind is stinking up the place and Snider is tearing up AAA so Snider gets called up to DH, EE goes to 1B and Lind drops down to Vegas.

JaysFan87
03-08-2012, 01:29 PM
People have to realize that to a certain extent, Snider has shown pretty much the same things offensively as Thames.

Over his various stints in the bigs over the past 4 years, Snider has posted a triple slash of .248/.307/.423 for an OPS of .730. Prorate his HR and 2B to a 162 game season and you get 20 and 38 respectively. If you discount Snider's fairly brutal 2011, that triple slash jumps to .255/.318/.446 with an OPS of .764 (with 23 projected HR and 36 doubles).

Thames' triple slash last season was .262/.313/.456 for an OPS of .769. Prorate his HR and 2B totals to a 162 game season and you are looking at 20 and 41 respectively.

It's not at all like Thames is blowing Snider out of the water at the plate. And when you factor in defense, it's a fairly easy decision.

That right there is what should be the clinching factor for Snider over thames. No offense to thames but that is pretty much what I was expecting from thames. Good pop with low average and decent OBP (he prolly maxes out at .330ish), which is of course not terrible but that is what he pretty much expect. What snider has done is his floor (and thames' ceiling more or less) and with his floor being thames average/ceiling then think about the potential if snider exceeds his floor.

Twitchy
03-08-2012, 01:48 PM
Honestly I don't see why the Jays can't play Snider in LF with Thames at the DH allowing EE to just come in for Lind/Thames/Snider vs lefties. Hell if Lind struggles you could just make EE the starting 1B.

I guess I just don't see why it has to be one or the other, although if I had to choose one I'd pick Snider and make it explicitly clear he's not being demoted after a month if he stinks. Even if he doesn't deserve to bat 6th, they should just put him there (behind Lawrie) to show that they're serious about giving him a chance and not batting him 9th like they always do.

Cause then you're looking at something like Escobar/Johnson/Bautista/Lind/Lawrie/Snider or something like that. If they don't put Thames in, you can still follow Snider with Encarnacion/Rasmus/Arencibia. And yes, Rasmus probably deserves to hit higher (and Lind lower) but we know they won't bat Lind lower, and I'd rather the Jays focus on proving to Snider they're actually gonna give him a legit chance.

Bigred91
03-08-2012, 02:27 PM
People have to realize that to a certain extent, Snider has shown pretty much the same things offensively as Thames.

Over his various stints in the bigs over the past 4 years, Snider has posted a triple slash of .248/.307/.423 for an OPS of .730. Prorate his HR and 2B to a 162 game season and you get 20 and 38 respectively. If you discount Snider's fairly brutal 2011, that triple slash jumps to .255/.318/.446 with an OPS of .764 (with 23 projected HR and 36 doubles).

Thames' triple slash last season was .262/.313/.456 for an OPS of .769. Prorate his HR and 2B totals to a 162 game season and you are looking at 20 and 41 respectively.

It's not at all like Thames is blowing Snider out of the water at the plate. And when you factor in defense, it's a fairly easy decision.

My vote was for Snider. I do think he is much better defensively and he will only get the job if he outperforms Thames with the bat.

My issue with Snider is that he has had several chances in the past and had he taken advantage of one of those chances, we wouldn't even be talking about Thames, whose numbers from his rookie season will likely improve.

rapsjaysfan88
03-08-2012, 02:29 PM
snider has more 5 tool potential. better d, base stealing ability, strong arm. if he ever consistantly hits he could be very good.

wagnall
03-08-2012, 03:47 PM
Snider - LF
Thames/EE - DH
Lind - 1B

with EE seeing some 1B and Thames seeing some time in LF.

Davis as the 4th OF, and Francisco shipped to one of the teams looking for a CF. (WAS, CLE)


I'd like to see this as well, with 1 option left hard to send Snider down without giving him a full shot out there. But I'd like to see them both be on the team. :)

BJBirdy
03-08-2012, 04:22 PM
I went with Thames but only just.

I can see the season starting with Thames in LF, Snider in AAA. In a couple of months, Lind is stinking up the place and Snider is tearing up AAA so Snider gets called up to DH, EE goes to 1B and Lind drops down to Vegas.

I really doubt you'll see the Jays send Lind down to Las Vegas.

I had a bit of an issue with the way the Jays sent Snider down to Vegas at the end of April last season. Yes, he was only batting .184 at the time, but he was beginning to show some signs of progress. In his last 5 games before being sent down he was batting .278 (5-18).

I really feel the Jays are at a point where they need to let Snider work out his kinks in the MLB. He has absolutely nothing left to prove in the minors, and to be honest I think his skills may begin to erode if he doesn't become an everyday major leaguer before much longer.

Krylian
03-08-2012, 04:25 PM
Snider just homered......off a lefty.

Booyah!!

Bombtista
03-08-2012, 04:26 PM
I've said it before:

Snider at LF, Thames at DH, EE at first, Lind off the team.

Lind has proven to have better offensive production than any of those other guys.

As much as you might hate him he will still hit you 30 home runs even if he has a bad year

2009mvp
03-08-2012, 04:33 PM
^^That's news to me, considering he's coming off back to back bad years and failed to hit 30 in either.

BJBirdy
03-08-2012, 04:37 PM
^^That's news to me, considering he's coming off back to back bad years and failed to hit 30 in either.

He hit 26 in 125 games last year. If you prorate that to 162 games, that's 33 home runs.

Converged
03-08-2012, 04:39 PM
After our horrible defense in the OF last year, I expect Farrell might give Snider the upper-hand. It's still early, but he has made some key assists in LF and has been driving the ball. Thamas is doing good as well, but lacks the D.

2009mvp
03-08-2012, 04:45 PM
He hit 26 in 125 games last year. If you prorate that to 162 games, that's 33 home runs.

Cool, so if we guess for 40 games he'll get there. That's real useful information.

craigerlee
03-08-2012, 06:38 PM
Honestly I don't see why the Jays can't play Snider in LF with Thames at the DH allowing EE to just come in for Lind/Thames/Snider vs lefties. Hell if Lind struggles you could just make EE the starting 1B.

I guess I just don't see why it has to be one or the other, although if I had to choose one I'd pick Snider and make it explicitly clear he's not being demoted after a month if he stinks. Even if he doesn't deserve to bat 6th, they should just put him there (behind Lawrie) to show that they're serious about giving him a chance and not batting him 9th like they always do.

Cause then you're looking at something like Escobar/Johnson/Bautista/Lind/Lawrie/Snider or something like that. If they don't put Thames in, you can still follow Snider with Encarnacion/Rasmus/Arencibia. And yes, Rasmus probably deserves to hit higher (and Lind lower) but we know they won't bat Lind lower, and I'd rather the Jays focus on proving to Snider they're actually gonna give him a legit chance.

Big fan of this idea, but it seems Farrell wants another RH bat off the bench with some pop, so Francisco is likely to get that bench role. Seeing as Francisco can't play CF or run the bases all that well Davis gets the other OF bench spot by elimination. I guess that's what happens when you decide to have so many no bat guys on your bench in Mathis and Vizquel.

I think Snider has to make it over Thames, cause if Snider gets optioned to the minors this year, he'll be out of options by 2013 and you won't have a clue what this guy can do over a full season. Thames has options send him down if you want Francisco off the bench so bad, don't waste an asset like Snider.

town123
03-08-2012, 06:57 PM
Lind has proven to have better offensive production than any of those other guys.

As much as you might hate him he will still hit you 30 home runs even if he has a bad year

Bah! I say. Carnation Milk at 1st and Thames DH'ing makes the most sense unless Lind magically finds his way again. Give that Snider kid a full year.

Kelly Gruber
03-08-2012, 07:19 PM
Ideally Snider earns the spot. As much as I do like Thames, there is much more value to the team in Snider becoming what he was supposed to do.

Not sure dropping Lind and letting E5 play 1st is a good idea. That dude shouldn't be allowed to have a glove. Can't just let him fly and teach someone else to back-up 1st on the fly. Lind will be around.

BBB
03-08-2012, 08:11 PM
I can't really decide who I want, so.... May the best man win.

BJBirdy
03-08-2012, 08:27 PM
I know that it may be early to be taking a close look at spring training numbers, but here is the comparison between Snider and Thames after five games for those of you keeping score at home:

Snider: 4-15, 1 2B, 2 HR, 6 RBI, 1 SB, .267/.733/.267

Thames: 3-12, 1 HR, 2 RBI, .250/.500/.250


After five games, it looks like Snider should have the lead.

rapsjaysfan88
03-08-2012, 09:04 PM
doesn't snider have 3 outfield assists?

BJBirdy
03-08-2012, 09:25 PM
doesn't snider have 3 outfield assists?

Indeed he does, which obviously helps his case.

Twitchy
03-08-2012, 10:49 PM
Big fan of this idea, but it seems Farrell wants another RH bat off the bench with some pop, so Francisco is likely to get that bench role. Seeing as Francisco can't play CF or run the bases all that well Davis gets the other OF bench spot by elimination. I guess that's what happens when you decide to have so many no bat guys on your bench in Mathis and Vizquel.

I think Snider has to make it over Thames, cause if Snider gets optioned to the minors this year, he'll be out of options by 2013 and you won't have a clue what this guy can do over a full season. Thames has options send him down if you want Francisco off the bench so bad, don't waste an asset like Snider.

It's their own damn fault for building a weak bench. Whose bright idea was it to have Mathis AND Vizquel on the same team? Davis makes sense in the OF, but I don't see what Fransisco brings to the table that they couldn't already have with EE. They said he's been working in LF, so he could play 1B/3B/OF and Davis could come into the OF as well. And under my scenario if Bautista needed a day off or they wanted to DH him they could just use Thames/Rasmus/Snider in the OF.

The only real issue I see is having too many LH bats in the lineup.

But re-reading your comment I don't see how Farrell wanting a RH bat off the bench changes anything. If Thames/Snider don't play the bench is Davis, EE, Mathis & Vizquel. So EE would be the strong RH bat off the bench.

2009mvp
03-08-2012, 11:05 PM
I don't see why it's a given Francisco makes the team. I actually doubt he does, I'd expect them to carry two of Vizquel/Valbuena/McCoy before both Davis and Francisco. This is the American League, wanting a big right handed bat off the bench isn't nearly a good enough reason for a guy winning a roster spot, especially when said player has little to no defensive value and isn't especially good against LHP anyways.

craigerlee
03-09-2012, 12:50 AM
It's their own damn fault for building a weak bench. Whose bright idea was it to have Mathis AND Vizquel on the same team? Davis makes sense in the OF, but I don't see what Fransisco brings to the table that they couldn't already have with EE. They said he's been working in LF, so he could play 1B/3B/OF and Davis could come into the OF as well. And under my scenario if Bautista needed a day off or they wanted to DH him they could just use Thames/Rasmus/Snider in the OF.

That's what I was saying, they screwed themselves over by adding so many no bat guys in Vizquel and Mathis. If they would of gone out and signed a guy like Shoppach they could of carried both Snider and Thames easily as Shoppach could of DH'd against LH or pinch hit against LH.


The only real issue I see is having too many LH bats in the lineup.

But re-reading your comment I don't see how Farrell wanting a RH bat off the bench changes anything. If Thames/Snider don't play the bench is Davis, EE, Mathis & Vizquel. So EE would be the strong RH bat off the bench.

I think that's a huge issue and the main reason why Farrell wants to carry Francisco. We were god awful against LH last year and having that many LH bats in the lineup could really hurt. Lind's an auto out against LH, Rasmus is pretty close to that too at a career .293 wOBA vs. LH, Snider's been atrocious at a .253 wOBA, and Thames had a .273 wOBA against LH.

JermanJaysFan
03-09-2012, 01:21 AM
My vote was for Snider. I do think he is much better defensively and he will only get the job if he outperforms Thames with the bat.

My issue with Snider is that he has had several chances in the past and had he taken advantage of one of those chances, we wouldn't even be talking about Thames, whose numbers from his rookie season will likely improve.
In 3 out of his 4 "stints", Snider has produced at around the same level offensively as Thames did last year (.769 OPS), while providing better defense.

2008: .803 OPS
2009: .748 OPS
2010: .767 OPS

He really sucked balls in 2011 (.616 OPS), but Snider has proven about as much or more as a big-league hitter than Thames, and unquestionably has the better glove and greater upside.

JermanJaysFan
03-09-2012, 01:36 AM
I don't see why it's a given Francisco makes the team. I actually doubt he does, I'd expect them to carry two of Vizquel/Valbuena/McCoy before both Davis and Francisco. This is the American League, wanting a big right handed bat off the bench isn't nearly a good enough reason for a guy winning a roster spot, especially when said player has little to no defensive value and isn't especially good against LHP anyways.
I'm also of the opinion that Francisco doesn't need to make this team. Deal him to a team looking for OF help.

I'd be OK with this lineup to start the season (barring any developments):

SS- Escobar (R)
2B- Johnson (L) or CF- Rasmus (L)
RF- Jose (R)
1B- Lind (L)
3B- Lawrie (R)
LF- Snider (L)
DH- Encarnacion (R)
CF- Rasmus or 2B- Johnson (L)
C- Arencibia (R)

Bench:
LF/CF/RF- Davis (can come in against lefties if necessary- better than some alternatives)
DH/LF- Thames
3B/SS/2B/OF?- Vizquel (or Valbuena or McCoy)
C- Mathis

Let Thames DH against righties, with EE spelling either Thames or Lind every time a lefty is on the mound. If you want to get both of those two off the field against a lefty, EE can man first, and Davis (career .292/.350/.491 against lefties; .287/.388/.463 last year) can slide into a corner OF spot and give either Snider or Jose a day at DH .

es0terik
03-09-2012, 02:22 AM
The Jays are in a very stupid position because of some of the idiotic moves that they made this offseason. Why exactly did they sign Ben Francisco when they already had 17 outfielders on the 25 man roster? Why did they sign Luis Valbuena if they had Mike McCoy?

The Jays only have 25 spots on the roster come April. I think it's pretty much guaranteed 100% that these following players are on it (disregarding chance of injury):

1 - Adam Lind
2 - Kelly Johnson
3 - Brett Lawrie
4 - Yunel Escobar
5 - JP Arencibia
6 - Jose Bautista
7 - Colby Rasmus
8 - Edwin Encarnacion
9 - Ricky Romero
10 - Brandon Morrow
11 - Jason Frasor
12 - Casey Janssen
13 - Darren Oliver
14 - Francisco Cordero
15 - Sergio Santos

None of these players are getting demoted anytime soon. Now there's a 90% chance that the following players will also be on that roster (barring any extreme situation occurring during spring training):

16 - Brett Cecil
17 - Henderson Alvarez
18 - Dustin McGowan

Now there are seven spots left on the roster. One is guaranteed to be taken by one of Snider or Thames. For the sake of this post, let's assume Snider wins it. Now another roster spot will go to Jeff Mathis, who, for whatever satanic reason is the only current realistic option for backup catcher.

19 - Travis Snider
20 - Jeff Mathis

So now the Jays have five remaining slots on the Opening Day roster and are left with the following players:

OF - Rajai Davis, Ben Francisco, Eric Thames
IF - Luis Valbuena, Mike McCoy, Omar Vizquel
P - Kyle Drabek, Luis Perez, Joel Carreno, Carlos Villanueva

Now there is no way in hell a team that talked about wanting 8 relievers last year will roll with only the five I mentioned above, so let's logically assume that Villanueva (2.2M) has himself a spot. The Jays also need a fourth outfielder and let's not kid ourselves; Rajai Davis is going to get that spot. He's making 2.75M and they have absolutely no reason to demote him.

21 - Carlos Villanueva
22 - Rajai Davis

This leaves us with Francisco, Thames, Valbuena, McCoy, Vizquel, Drabek, Perez and Carreno; eight players with three open spaces on the roster. What the ****. This almost guarantees that right off the bat Carreno will be demoted to the minors. I can easily live with that. Brings us down to 7 players for 3 spots.

Luis Perez and Luis Valbuena are both out of options. Both are nearly guaranteed to be picked up off waivers if sent down. This makes me believe that one spot will go to Perez because the Jays likely don't want to just throw him away.

23 - Luis Perez

Now if the Jays believe Vizquel still has a season in the tank, it makes perfect sense to just DFA Valbuena and demote McCoy. I think it's safe to say that one of these guys gets a spot and the other two will be either gone (Vizquel and Valbuena) or demoted (McCoy - how the hell does this guys till have any options left?). For the sake of this post, let's assume Vizquel gets the spot.

24 - Omar Vizquel

Eric Thames. Ben Francisco. Kyle Drabek. 1 spot. Here's where I get irritated. It is so friggin' dumb to demote Kyle Drabek at this point and he seems like the most logical option after Carreno and McCoy. It's also stupid to demote Thames after he's proven that he can fare decently against big league pitching. It also blatantly throws in our faces the fact that Thames will always be itching to come back up and that only means that Snider will be kept under scrutiny the whole time he's on the roster and probably won't ever get that comfort that we all desperately want him to have. Drabek and Thames should both be on the big league roster and if it were just the two of them, at least there would be the comfort in knowing that one of them would get the nod. That isn't the case however because we still have Ben ":facepalm:" Francisco.

The logical thing to do here is to DFA Francisco and pay him not to play for us the same way we did with Teahen (can you imagine if we needed to still give him a roster spot?) or trade him away, and keep Thames up as a platoon/DH player. This would ease up Snider's nerves and would make the most sense for the team overall. This still sends Drabek back down to the minors which is ludicrous, especially if they put him back down in Vegas. They need to just trade one of the guys up on the roster and make space for Drabek, or else they're just wasting his time.

A few questions for you guys if anyone actually read this thing:

1 - Are you fine with Drabek going back down to the minors, and if not, how would you make space for him on the roster?

2 - If you had to give a roster spot to only one of Drabek or Thames, which would you pick?

3 - What will your reaction be if Francisco is kept on the roster and both Thames and Drabek are demoted?

25 - ?

*Note: If you are going to respond to my post, please don't quote the entire thing. Just take that specific part.

craigerlee
03-09-2012, 02:56 AM
1 - Are you fine with Drabek going back down to the minors, and if not, how would you make space for him on the roster?
I'm fine with this, however I'd rather see him go to AA as he really needs to work on throwing strikes and bringing back his curveball and I don't think the PCL is the place to work on that. I know if you can't pitch in the PCL you have no business pitching in the MLB, but its just not the right environment for youngish pitcher to work out some issues.


2 - If you had to give a roster spot to only one of Drabek or Thames, which would you pick?
I'd pick Thames, there's no way I'm carrying 8 relievers it just makes no sense. Especially when we went out and spent on Cordero and Gordon, acquired a 3.75M dollar reliever in Frasor, and traded a decent prospect for Santos. We spent all that money on the pen so we wouldn't need to carry 8 relievers.

3 - What will your reaction be if Francisco is kept on the roster and both Thames and Drabek are demoted?


Its very likely to happen so I won't react too harshly as I'm expecting it to happen. I'm pretty confident Drabek isn't breaking with the team unless there's an injury. From listening to interviews with AA and Farrell it sounds like the loser of the LF job gets sent to AAA as they want both Thames and Snider to get AB's and don't feel both will get AB's on the big league club.

2009mvp
03-09-2012, 03:14 AM
Well let's not act like signing Francisco somehow cripples the team's flexibility or something. He's in the same situation Reed Johnson was in the year he was cut out of ST, it's not like they have millions tied up in the guy. He was brought in to compete for a job, I don't see how he's entitled to anything. I just think it's a horrible idea to roster a guy like that, he's essentially a DH who doesn't hit all that much. Almost makes more sense to go grab D Lee or Vladdy or something and plug Kelly Johnson/EE in LF every once in a while if need be.

To the post above, I'm not sure how you boiled it down to Drabek vs Thames in the first place. Pretty standard fare to go 12 arms, 13 position players. It's not like another starter won't be needed pretty quickly anyways, the odds on both McGowan staying healthy and Cecil not completely sucking for any extended period of time are pretty darn low.

es0terik
03-09-2012, 03:19 AM
Except even if Cecil sucks, it'll be an era before the Jays demote him (what they did with Reyes) and McGowan is a wild card as of now. The point is, I didn't see them demoting any of the previous 24 guys so yeah the last spot came down to either Francisco, Thames or Drabek unless they keep one of the other guys that I assumed they will cut (the likeliest option being Valbuena)

2009mvp
03-09-2012, 03:25 AM
I should have tossed Alvarez in there too, count me as pretty skeptical that a 22 year old two pitch guy who doesn't miss any bats is gonna learn a slider at the big league level. Certainly has the stuff to be solid in the longrun, but I fully expect the league to expose him a bit early. Sounds awfully pessimistic, I know, but I really do think it's pretty much a race between Alvarez/Cecil to the minors and McGowan to the DL. Drabek (or whoever happens to be next in line) won't have to wait long for a shot, methinks.

es0terik
03-09-2012, 03:28 AM
I'm actually with you on that one, I'm very much expecting Alvarez to eventually get another taste of the minor leagues. The bold side of me says that if Alvarez doesn't actually get demoted to the minors at some point this year, it means he became Felix Hernandez. :p

craigerlee
03-09-2012, 03:31 AM
I should have tossed Alvarez in there too, count me as pretty skeptical that a 22 year old two pitch guy who doesn't miss any bats is gonna learn a slider at the big league level. Certainly has the stuff to be solid in the longrun, but I fully expect the league to expose him a bit early. Sounds awfully pessimistic, I know, but I really do think it's pretty much a race between Alvarez/Cecil to the minors and McGowan to the DL. Drabek (or whoever happens to be next in line) won't have to wait long for a shot, methinks.

Aren't you just sunshine and rainbows today. LOL. I agree on Cecil and Mcgowan, but Alvarez chalks up a lotta GB's and doesn't walk many, he can survive on that repertoire in the AL East, he'll just never be elite till he gets a 3rd offering.

PJ Awesome
03-09-2012, 05:02 AM
Snider has been impressive thus far in spring, and I'd like to see him get another shot to prove himself. Not that I don't want to see Thames up here, I love him as a player though I'm still concerned about his defensive game.