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View Full Version : Are the Kings finally developing into the team we thought they could be?



NYtilIdie
02-10-2012, 02:32 AM
Now I'm not saying they're anywhere near their potential, but are they finally starting to develop?

People didn't believe the King fans when they said Westphal was the problem who was holding the team back, many blamed it on the players and Cousins, but ever since the firing Westphal, they've gone 7-11 under Smart and are currently 7-10 against playoff teams including two victories against the Lakers & Thunder. The players clearly enjoy playing for Smart who lets them run more and play loose like the young team should.

Players like Boogie and Tyreke are starting to play to their potential like we knew they could. Tyreke is playing like his rookie year after a disappointing sophomore year & Boogie in the last 10 games is averaging 17 & 13 and is one of the best hustle players in the league today who refuses to give up (if you watched the game you would've seen him outhustle 3 or 4 Thunder players in the paint numerous times in the 4th) and Thorton is huge in the 4th quarters and could go off at any time in the game like those back to back 3's to take the lead tonight.

They have Chuck Hayes back who is anchoring the defense along with Donte Green, Jimmer has been shooting a ridiculous 58% from 3 the last 10 games(now I know he won't keep that up, but he's playing his role well so far), Jason Thompson has revived his career by playing some smart basketball and Isiah Thomas has been the biggest surprise in the draft by playing well above expectations for a 60th pick and has been solid running the offense for the 2nd unit.

They'll end up a lotto team this year, which will help them tremendously in this years stacked draft class, but they've played their ***** off and with a full training camp under Smart, do you think they can be a darkhorse for the playoffs next and finally live up to their huge upside?

Demon11
02-10-2012, 02:36 AM
We've been on fire lately and if we can stop digging ourselves in a hole early in the game i don't think we'll have a lottery pick.

USMCLaker
02-10-2012, 02:37 AM
I really don't understand the Kings record they have so much talent on that team. I wasn't surprised by their win against OKC, I'm surprised when they lose so damn much.

PacersForLife
02-10-2012, 02:37 AM
If they continue playing like this then they could put up a good fight for the 8th seed.

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 02:38 AM
Yes. You see the guys buying into what Smart is coaching and Tyreke/DeMarcus are starting to take over as franchise caliber players. Tyreke is finally healthy after being hurt all last year and DeMarcus has taken that next step to becoming a mature NBA player.

Demon11
02-10-2012, 02:40 AM
I really don't understand the Kings record they have so much talent on that team. I wasn't surprised by their win against OKC, I'm surprised when they lose so damn much.

Meh.. I was in the camp that thought Westphal was holding us back.. he tried molding our players into a system that our players didn't work in.. we're only 7-10 under Smart but we had some tough games after he was elected coach and a young team making a transition to a new system will lead to some tough losses.

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 02:41 AM
I really don't understand the Kings record they have so much talent on that team. I wasn't surprised by their win against OKC, I'm surprised when they lose so damn much.

Westphal essentially didn't coach for two years and the team quit on him earlier in the year. Being the youngest team in the NBA+ a coaching change+ Chuck Hayes being considered your team's veteran leader at 28+ 7 new guys this year and you have why the Kings struggled earlier in the year. We've seen the talent level start to shine through the last 8 games and these guys are starting to learn how to play together and build team chemistry

PacersForLife
02-10-2012, 02:42 AM
Meh.. I was in the camp that thought Westphal was holding us back.. he tried molding our players into a system that our players didn't work in.. we're only 7-10 under Smart but we had some tough games after he was elected coach and a young team making a transition to a new system will lead to some tough losses.

Reminds me of a guy named Jim O'Brien.

USMCLaker
02-10-2012, 02:42 AM
Westphal essentially didn't coach for two years and the team quit on him earlier in the year. Being the youngest team in the NBA+ a coaching team+ Chuck Hayes being considered your team's veteran leader at 28+ 7 new guys this year and you have why the Kings struggled earlier in the year. We've seen the talent level start to shine through the last 8 games and these guys are starting to learn how to play together and build team chemistry

If this team learns how to play together no first seated team would want to see them in the eighth seed.

JLynn943
02-10-2012, 02:45 AM
Yes. You see the guys buying into what Smart is coaching and Tyreke/DeMarcus are starting to take over as franchise caliber players. Tyreke is finally healthy after being hurt all last year and DeMarcus has taken that next step to becoming a mature NBA player.

This.

USMCLaker
02-10-2012, 02:51 AM
Meh.. I was in the camp that thought Westphal was holding us back.. he tried molding our players into a system that our players didn't work in.. we're only 7-10 under Smart but we had some tough games after he was elected coach and a young team making a transition to a new system will lead to some tough losses.

I was literately telling my nephew an hour ago I don't understand it. This team is stacked at every position and they play with heart so I don't follow them so I couldn't understand why they are losing but I guess your reason my prove to be the reason why.

DerekRE_3
02-10-2012, 02:53 AM
I really don't understand the Kings record they have so much talent on that team. I wasn't surprised by their win against OKC, I'm surprised when they lose so damn much.

With Westphal: 2-5
With Smart (who is installing a new system during a shortened season): 8-11

Since Smart has taken over Tyreke and DeMarcus are new players. They have played much better and more consistently. Smart really has done a great job considering the circumstances. It's tough to teach a team a new system when you have to play so many games and don't have much practice time.

Monta is beast
02-10-2012, 03:04 AM
You guys judge way to fast. People are saying the Knicks are going all the way because of Lin, and now the Kings are all of a sudden a playoff team? Don't get me wrong there good, but with Smart as their head coach, I don't see them making the playoffs. He doesn't preach defense at all, and relies solely on offense to win games. If they can get a proper coaching system in there with the talent they have, then they could be a perennial playoff team, but right now, they can't.

DerekRE_3
02-10-2012, 03:11 AM
Smart improved your team's defense his first year as a coach by 7 points a game. The Warriors have a lot of ****** defensive players. Maybe that's the problem.

raidersrock99
02-10-2012, 03:12 AM
no, there are still some major issues with this team. One thing that stuck out to me was the kings went on two stretches today where they shout 3/18 and 0/10 that cant happen you wont win many games like that, and a coach shouldnt let it ride out there was no timeouts called or subs, however if cousins and evans can play good basketball they can win every game. also Issah Thomas needs more PT he is a good defender for his size and a great spark plug off the bench

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 03:15 AM
No one's denying that the King still have major issues with consistency/talent. But for the first time in 6 years, this team actually looks like it has direction with the talent to back it up

Beltrans Mole
02-10-2012, 03:28 AM
I think they'll be good in another year or two. They'll get another great player in the draft this year to build with Evans and Cousins. They are very young and talented so anythings possible....I still think they're too immature to be a contender anytime soon.

sacgiants1213
02-10-2012, 03:41 AM
I think they'll be good in another year or two. They'll get another great player in the draft this year to build with Evans and Cousins. They are very young and talented so anythings possible....I still think they're too immature to be a contender anytime soon.

Nailed it.

thekmp211
02-10-2012, 09:45 AM
cousins evans thornton are three legit ballers... there is other talent there too but i like the direction. getting rid of westphal was a must.

Hawkeye15
02-10-2012, 09:53 AM
They are still more than a player and maturity away, and have a couple of other young teams in the west that have been lottery teams ahead of them in the rebuilding curve. But their future does seem to suggest they shouldn't be a doormat much longer.

JesusNYY_Savior
02-10-2012, 10:15 AM
id say by the time there home games are played in seattle they will be a contender

Chavacano
02-10-2012, 10:38 AM
They trust Smart and believe in his system. It's something they didn't do with Westphal.

Hawkeye15
02-10-2012, 10:59 AM
They still need a real PG (even if one emerges from the roster), and they need their core to grow up and form chemistry. And like all young teams, they need to be smarter on the offensive end, and start playing defense.

DerekRE_3
02-10-2012, 11:10 AM
Gotta remember that they are trying to overhaul the offense during the season, and under normal circumstances there isn't much time to practice. Add in the shortened season, and there's even less time.

Considering what Smart has been up against he's done a great job. Tyreke is playing some of his best ball, as is DeMarcus. Now they just need Thornton to get up to speed, he's coming back from an injury.

Point is they are finally heading in the direction after treading water for so long. Think of it this way: Last season, they didn't win their 10th game till the 42nd game of the season. This year, it took them 26 despite all the turmoil surrounding Westphal, who was and still is god awful.

Hawkeye15
02-10-2012, 11:18 AM
Gotta remember that they are trying to overhaul the offense during the season, and under normal circumstances there isn't much time to practice. Add in the shortened season, and there's even less time.

Considering what Smart has been up against he's done a great job. Tyreke is playing some of his best ball, as is DeMarcus. Now they just need Thornton to get up to speed, he's coming back from an injury.

Point is they are finally heading in the direction after treading water for so long. Think of it this way: Last season, they didn't win their 10th game till the 42nd game of the season. This year, it took them 26 despite all the turmoil surrounding Westphal, who was and still is god awful.

This season is rough for any young team that made a coaching change, and when you factor in a change after 15 games, it makes it even tougher.

Randy West
02-10-2012, 11:34 AM
They are developing but still have a way to go.

Tmath
02-10-2012, 11:44 AM
They should be pretty good by the time they move to Seattle.

Gram
02-10-2012, 11:45 AM
Yes. You see the guys buying into what Smart is coaching and Tyreke/DeMarcus are starting to take over as franchise caliber players. Tyreke is finally healthy after being hurt all last year and DeMarcus has taken that next step to becoming a mature NBA player.

Keith Smart is the next Phil Jackson.

tyfreaks brotha
02-10-2012, 11:46 AM
You guys judge way to fast. People are saying the Knicks are going all the way because of Lin, and now the Kings are all of a sudden a playoff team? Don't get me wrong there good, but with Smart as their head coach, I don't see them making the playoffs. He doesn't preach defense at all, and relies solely on offense to win games. If they can get a proper coaching system in there with the talent they have, then they could be a perennial playoff team, but right now, they can't.

Have you even actually watched a Kings game??? I know sometimes we are weak on defense, but we have definitively improved. Evans always picks a few steals, and Isiah Thomas also usually nabs in a few steals.

tyfreaks brotha
02-10-2012, 11:46 AM
They should be pretty good by the time they move to Seattle.

:punish:

Tmath
02-10-2012, 11:49 AM
:punish:

Sorry :sad2:

tyfreaks brotha
02-10-2012, 12:25 PM
Sorry :sad2:

:phew:

PhillyBoomerang
02-10-2012, 12:26 PM
Potential is key with Kings.. Still not 100% sold on Keith Smart hes doing better then Paul Westphal ever did.. gotta build on what they got and find that defensive 3 would help the kings alot..

DerekRE_3
02-10-2012, 01:02 PM
Potential is key with Kings.. Still not 100% sold on Keith Smart hes doing better then Paul Westphal ever did.. gotta build on what they got and find that defensive 3 would help the kings alot..

Smart is waaaaay better than Westphal. The Kings actually have an offense now and he's been great with Cousins. Westphal didn't have a clue on how to coach him.

KingPosey
02-10-2012, 01:27 PM
We (The Kings), are really talented, especially offensively, as far as individual scoring goes. There is a TON of room to improve as a team, but they are FINALLY playing better.

LA_Raiders
02-10-2012, 02:00 PM
If the players start playing like they care, YES... Jimmer sucks...

Gritz
02-10-2012, 02:08 PM
I'd rather be a lottery team than get swept or go 5 games in the 1st round

YoungOne
02-10-2012, 02:37 PM
I like the team with cousins and evans but I think thornton is overrated

thedfactor
02-10-2012, 02:46 PM
They've had the talent, Keith Smart definitely working with it better. They are a ways away, but it was nice to see them get a win last night. Will be long process with the West so competitive already.

uprightciti
02-10-2012, 02:54 PM
i think harrison barns puts them over the top

uprightciti
02-10-2012, 02:57 PM
OR Michael Kidd Gilchrist!!! he is gonna be a baller!

Kingz4L
02-10-2012, 03:13 PM
Notice that we also played a lot of road games early in the year..we damn near lost all of them..so winning these home games is huge for us if were going to make a run at the playoffs.

mightybosstone
02-10-2012, 03:27 PM
I'm still not ready to say this team has playoff potential next season, but I think they're on the right path if Cousins and Evans to continue to improve and they can add maybe one more piece. The problem is that Cousins and Evans still are not very efficient players. They're both better than last season, but it's not saying a whole lot.

KingsPhillies
02-10-2012, 03:39 PM
OR Michael Kidd Gilchrist!!! he is gonna be a baller!

Couldn't agree more! Personally, I'd rather have Kidd-Gilchrist over Barnes(MKG hustles his *** off on both sides of the floor...we need that). And I do agree that it could potentially be the final piece. Yes, our guard situation is a bit convoluted, but Tyreke and Thomas seem to be doing well for the moment. Tyreke really needs to try and limit his turnovers, though.

All-in-all the team is still definitely a work in progress. I'm definitely happy with the improvement(especially with Cousins), but not ready to say we're even in contention for the 8 seed. We're not. I will not be upset at all if we end up in the lottery again with how stacked it is. Whomever we draft could have a huge impact on this team. But even if we do end up with the ROY next season, that still probably won't be enough to make the playoffs. Perhaps after this season is over we'll have a better idea of where this team is heading, but for the moment, I think we're still a couple years away from the playoffs.

And please, enough with the Seattle comments. If you guys think you're being clever...you're not. Sacramento is as close as it's ever been to getting this arena built. The Maloofs have even stated that the March 1st deadline is "flexible". They have emphatically stated that they are NOT selling the team; something that would probably have to happen in order for the Seattle move to come to fruition. Everything that has been said about the Kings and Seattle over the last week is merely an overreaction to an inquiry. Besides, Anaheim already has an arena(so does Kansas City), Seattle does not. If the Kings were to move, why would they move to a city in the same boat as the one they currently reside? Sure, Seattle may be close to getting a financing deal in place(I don't know for sure). But guess what? So is Sac-Town!

Demon11
02-10-2012, 03:47 PM
I'd rather be a lottery team than get swept or go 5 games in the 1st round

Well getting another draft pick may send the team to Seattle, the better we do the higher chance the city will approve on a stadium deal.

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 04:29 PM
I'm still not ready to say this team has playoff potential next season, but I think they're on the right path if Cousins and Evans to continue to improve and they can add maybe one more piece. The problem is that Cousins and Evans still are not very efficient players. They're both better than last season, but it's not saying a whole lot.

Well, they have to carry the offense by themselves along with Thornton. No one else on the team (at least not yet) have shown the ability to be dependable NBA scorers. We're a few pieces away from being playoff contenders, but we're finally on the right tract to getting there after 4 years of crap

mightybosstone
02-10-2012, 04:41 PM
Well, they have to carry the offense by themselves along with Thornton. No one else on the team (at least not yet) have shown the ability to be dependable NBA scorers. We're a few pieces away from being playoff contenders, but we're finally on the right tract to getting there after 4 years of crap

I will say that I think Cousins has improved significantly from last season. The guy has been an absolute beast on the boards and getting blocks. If he can be a little more consistent defensively and improve his shot selection on offense, I think he has potential to be a top 5 big man in the league.

Evans, however, I have very little hope for. I know he's still only 22, but his jump shot isn't getting any better, he clearly is playing out of position at PG and he isn't nearly as good defensively as I'd like to see from a player with his athleticism and ability.

I think a true PG would really help this team come together. For example, suppose the Kings had gotten lucky and had the first pick in the last draft. Irving distributes, allowing Evans to focus on penetrating and giving everyone better looks. (There's a reason the Kings are dead last in assists) It also would allow Thornton to play a 6th man role, which his game was tailor made for. Although, they could also use an upgrade at SF and at the other big spot.

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 04:58 PM
I will say that I think Cousins has improved significantly from last season. The guy has been an absolute beast on the boards and getting blocks. If he can be a little more consistent defensively and improve his shot selection on offense, I think he has potential to be a top 5 big man in the league.

Evans, however, I have very little hope for. I know he's still only 22, but his jump shot isn't getting any better, he clearly is playing out of position at PG and he isn't nearly as good defensively as I'd like to see from a player with his athleticism and ability.

I think a true PG would really help this team come together. For example, suppose the Kings had gotten lucky and had the first pick in the last draft. Irving distributes, allowing Evans to focus on penetrating and giving everyone better looks. (There's a reason the Kings are dead last in assists) It also would allow Thornton to play a 6th man role, which his game was tailor made for. Although, they could also use an upgrade at SF and at the other big spot.

I disagree about Tyreke not being able to run point. He's averaging 7 assists a game the last 13 games and quite honestly should be more if a majority of our role players weren't complete garbage. His growth to able to do this along with his ability to score is a big reason why the Kings are playing better basketball. We don't really need an upgrade at the 4 as JT has been playing the role player role perfectly.

This team needs more veteran leadership/ a SF (Kidd-Gilchrist would be perfect) and just time to gell together as a team

mightybosstone
02-10-2012, 06:19 PM
I disagree about Tyreke not being able to run point. He's averaging 7 assists a game the last 13 games and quite honestly should be more if a majority of our role players weren't complete garbage. His growth to able to do this along with his ability to score is a big reason why the Kings are playing better basketball.
But you're talking about a very limited sample size compared to how the guy has played over 2 1/2 seasons. For the season, his assist numbers are down, but his turnovers really aren't that much. In fact, I'd be willing to bet this it the poorest AST/TO ratio in his three seasons in the league.

Maybe he'll prove me wrong, but when I've seen the guy play, he just looks out of place at PG and he makes way too many mistakes with the ball in his hands. And his shooting either needs to improve significantly or he needs to take way fewer 3s and long 2s.


This team needs more veteran leadership/ a SF (Kidd-Gilchrist would be perfect) and just time to gell together as a team
I agree that Kidd-Gilcrhist makes a lot of sense and would be 10 times better than Salmons. But I still think that until the Kings learn how to run the offense and distribute the ball better, they're going to really struggle on that end of the floor.

They're dead last in assists, 25th in turnovers and dead last in AST/TO ratio. you can't tell me that Evans doesn't have something to do with that.

The_Jamal
02-10-2012, 06:38 PM
But you're talking about a very limited sample size compared to how the guy has played over 2 1/2 seasons. For the season, his assist numbers are down, but his turnovers really aren't that much. In fact, I'd be willing to bet this it the poorest AST/TO ratio in his three seasons in the league.

Maybe he'll prove me wrong, but when I've seen the guy play, he just looks out of place at PG and he makes way too many mistakes with the ball in his hands. And his shooting either needs to improve significantly or he needs to take way fewer 3s and long 2s.


I agree that Kidd-Gilcrhist makes a lot of sense and would be 10 times better than Salmons. But I still think that until the Kings learn how to run the offense and distribute the ball better, they're going to really struggle on that end of the floor.

They're dead last in assists, 25th in turnovers and dead last in AST/TO ratio. you can't tell me that Evans doesn't have something to do with that.

I agree, Reke still needs to work on PG skills. But I'm also not going to ignore how he along with Cousins have become MUCH MUCH better players under Smart than they were under Westphal. Essentially, it tells me that Westphal didn't know how to coach these young guys and just let them play for 2 years. Which is exactly what you don't do with two young guys as talented as Tyreke and Cousins

They aren't near finished projects, but they still have plenty of time to reach their talent potential with Tyreke being 22 and DeMarcus 21. They both have the potential to be top 20 players in the NBA and its matter of if pieces fall in the right places for that to happen

heyman321
02-10-2012, 06:40 PM
Um...this was to be expected. Dont you know that this Evans/Cousins duo will end up as the greatest of all time?

tyfreaks brotha
02-10-2012, 08:41 PM
i think harrison barns puts them over the top

I've been thinking the same thing all year.. Well maybe it's just because I really hate John Salmons, but I do think a core of Evans/Barnes/Cousins wins you a championship all in there prime

KingPosey
02-11-2012, 02:24 AM
I will say that I think Cousins has improved significantly from last season. The guy has been an absolute beast on the boards and getting blocks. If he can be a little more consistent defensively and improve his shot selection on offense, I think he has potential to be a top 5 big man in the league.

Evans, however, I have very little hope for. I know he's still only 22, but his jump shot isn't getting any better, he clearly is playing out of position at PG and he isn't nearly as good defensively as I'd like to see from a player with his athleticism and ability.

I think a true PG would really help this team come together. For example, suppose the Kings had gotten lucky and had the first pick in the last draft. Irving distributes, allowing Evans to focus on penetrating and giving everyone better looks. (There's a reason the Kings are dead last in assists) It also would allow Thornton to play a 6th man role, which his game was tailor made for. Although, they could also use an upgrade at SF and at the other big spot.
I agree with a lot of what you said, but Tyreke is a very good defender.