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View Full Version : Why Does The NBA Hate Josh Smith?



JNA17
02-09-2012, 09:46 PM
The guy should be a 3-4 time all star by now. But for whatever reason, every year he gets snubbed. Then this year, when he finally looks like he would make the all star team, he gets snubbed...yet again.

Seriously what gives? I'm not even a Hawks fan and this pisses me off to oblivion.

nirvana235
02-09-2012, 09:47 PM
Josh who?

Federal Reserve
02-09-2012, 09:47 PM
Tyson Chandler deserves to be an all-star more than half of the guys selected.

Hawkeye15
02-09-2012, 09:49 PM
Smith gets lost in the shuffle honestly. He isn't elite, so he doesn't make the obvious case, and you get your top 3-4 teams that will get a gimme, and the name recognition spots as well. Honestly, 5 new all stars, and leaving KG, Duncan, Rondo, Amare, and others off is a nice step in the right direction. The NBA coaches actually thought about it, instead of just naming the same old ****.

Hawkeye15
02-09-2012, 09:50 PM
Tyson Chandler deserves to be an all-star more than half of the guys selected.

no, he doesn't.

JNA17
02-09-2012, 09:55 PM
Smith gets lost in the shuffle honestly. He isn't elite, so he doesn't make the obvious case, and you get your top 3-4 teams that will get a gimme, and the name recognition spots as well. Honestly, 5 new all stars, and leaving KG, Duncan, Rondo, Amare, and others off is a nice step in the right direction. The NBA coaches actually thought about it, instead of just naming the same old ****.

He's not elite definitely, but the guy has been all star material and has been keeping the Hawks in line for quite a while. At least better then Joe Johnson has IMO.

I'm glad guys like Roy Hibbert and Iggy making it. But Deng despite having a good year and Pierce making it over Smith is just wrong. Its wrong even by all star game standards. If Blake Griffin the high flying PF can make it over Love, why not Smith?

Sportfan
02-09-2012, 09:57 PM
The better question is why do the internet fans overrate Josh Smith so much? He's good, but no franchise player.

kozelkid
02-09-2012, 09:57 PM
3-4 times? No. But at least twice.

Not sure. Maybe because he's looked at as a knucklehead with talent (ala Rudy Gay, Monta Ellis and Jr Smith).

The difference is that Josh Smith actually uses his athleticism to make a major impact on the defensive end unlike the other 3 I mentioned. He should of made it and is the perfect type of player for highlights in such a game. Better him than Joe Johnson imo.

kozelkid
02-09-2012, 10:00 PM
He's not elite definitely, but the guy has been all star material and has been keeping the Hawks in line for quite a while. At least better then Joe Johnson has IMO.

I'm glad guys like Roy Hibbert and Iggy making it. But Deng despite having a good year and Pierce making it over Smith is just wrong. Its wrong even by all star game standards. If Blake Griffin the high flying PF can make it over Love, why not Smith?

Woah, woah, woah. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLxzXyZFj8M)

Deng has without a doubt been as good as Smith if not better and on a better team to boot. I agree that Smith deserves it, but certainly not over Deng.

Iodine
02-09-2012, 10:02 PM
Tyson Chandler deserves to be an all-star more than half of the guys selected.

http://www.urban75.com/Mag/troll.html
Please learn how to properly troll

Hawkeye15
02-09-2012, 10:06 PM
He's not elite definitely, but the guy has been all star material and has been keeping the Hawks in line for quite a while. At least better then Joe Johnson has IMO.

I'm glad guys like Roy Hibbert and Iggy making it. But Deng despite having a good year and Pierce making it over Smith is just wrong. Its wrong even by all star game standards. If Blake Griffin the high flying PF can make it over Love, why not Smith?

Smith is just forgotten about. I agree that he had more of a right to be there versus Pierce, for sure. He is just not a guy who puts up numbers you can't ignore, and his team always sends JJ, and is never ELITE, so he gets lost in the shuffle.

Just another reason of many why I don't gauge who makes the all star team as a barometer of that player's talent. Its an accolade, like others, but I don't think I have even watched an all star game in 6 years it means that little to me.

I will agree with you, its nice to see a changing of the guard, and some of the NAMES of the last 10 years left off for playing poorly, and aging.

NYKnicks4511
02-09-2012, 10:08 PM
no, he doesn't.

He deserves heavy consideration at the very least. He's averaging 12 /10 / 1 steal / 1 block. He's shooting 70% from the floor this year, and has been the defensive anchor of a Knicks team that has many absolutely abysmal individual defensive players.

Bosh is putting up a nicer statline than Tyson is, but I do think that Tyson's efforts with the Knicks so far have been very impressive.

Edit: also I think Tyson should have gotten in over Hibbert, but the Pacers' record is just too good to overlook. Understandable, I forgive them.

Hawkeye15
02-09-2012, 10:13 PM
He deserves heavy consideration at the very least. He's averaging 12 /10 / 1 steal / 1 block. He's shooting 70% from the floor this year, and has been the defensive anchor of a Knicks team that has many absolutely abysmal individual defensive players.

Bosh is putting up a nicer statline than Tyson is, but I do think that Tyson's efforts with the Knicks so far have been very impressive.

Edit: also I think Tyson should have gotten in over Hibbert, but the Pacers' record is just too good to overlook. Understandable, I forgive them.

But he doesn't deserve recognition when there are centers with better numbers on better teams.

The problem with putting him over Hibbert, is that they are literally similar players, only one plays for a team with a lot of wins, the other plays for a struggling Knicks team.

Chandler doesn't belong this year.

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 10:24 PM
why does josh smith love those elbow jumpers that he shoots so poorly???

Sox72
02-09-2012, 10:27 PM
http://www.urban75.com/Mag/troll.html
Please learn how to properly troll

I don't know, I think he/she is pretty good at it.

CudiOnMyiPod
02-09-2012, 10:33 PM
Tyson Chandler deserves to be an all-star more than half of the guys selected.

Chandler was even better last year and he didn't even get considered.

jim51990
02-09-2012, 10:35 PM
My friend is a big hawks fan watches basically every game and tells me all the time that smith is the most overrated player in the league

ugafan
02-09-2012, 10:38 PM
why does josh smith love those elbow jumpers that he shoots so poorly???

He's been shooting them much much better this year.

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 10:45 PM
He's been shooting them much much better this year.

all the more reason he should not be in the ASG then

http://www.nba.com/advancedstats/player.html#Josh-Smith|2746;year=201112;season=r

55-155 mid range for 36% --- Highest percentage of his shots come from here.
15-46 in the paint (excluding restricted area) for 33%

those are pretty bad.. and i don't know his past numbers, but if that's 'much better'.... damn...

reffahead
02-09-2012, 10:46 PM
My friend is a big hawks fan watches basically every game and tells me all the time that smith is the most overrated player in the league

You're friend is an idiot. He deserves it more than Melo(voting), Iggy, Deng, and Pierce. Only guy that had to defend 1-5 at any given moment. Had to tangle with every center because the Hawks don't want to sign a Big until Dampier :facepalm:.

He shoots those elbow jumpers with the shot clock 5 seconds or less left. Could he drive in that time, absolutely. He could also pass and leave a teammate hanging, so he will shoot more times than not.

SportsAndrew25
02-09-2012, 10:48 PM
He is not that good a shooter and he is a bad free throw guy.

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 10:49 PM
You're friend is an idiot. He deserves it more than Melo(voting), Iggy, Deng, and Pierce. Only guy that had to defend 1-5 at any given moment. Had to tangle with every center because the Hawks don't want to sign a Big until Dampier :facepalm:.

He shoots those elbow jumpers with the shot clock 5 seconds or less left. Could he drive in that time, absolutely. He could also pass and leave a teammate hanging, so he will shoot more times than not.

I see him shoot a ton of those jumpers with 10+ seconds on the clock.. looking like he's trying to establish himself for future drives... and if he has the ball with the clock winding down, he needs to pass out of the elbow, that's not his shot, yet he doesn't...

Meatmypet
02-09-2012, 10:49 PM
Bad attitude.

benzni
02-09-2012, 10:50 PM
Smith deserves to be in

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 10:51 PM
Smith deserves to be in

no, he doesn't...

*Silver&Black*
02-09-2012, 10:55 PM
The better question is why do the internet fans overrate Josh Smith so much? He's good, but no franchise player.

That's weird considering just this year he has had a game that only 4 players in NBA history has had.

reffahead
02-09-2012, 10:55 PM
The reason he's out on the elbow is because Drew is trying to create room for Joe Johnson and an Iso play. If you are truely watching you will see. Usually Joe dribbles down the clock and teams will leave Smith open.

This the play:

Center left wing
Josh left elbow
Joe top of key
Pg right elbow
Sf right wing

They've been doing this play for 6 years now. This play is reserved for the Kobes, Lebrons, Wades, and B. Roys. The Hawks does this play much much more than any team.

SB75
02-09-2012, 10:55 PM
My friend is a big hawks fan watches basically every game and tells me all the time that smith is the most overrated player in the league

There are Hawks fans who don't like Smith because of a desire to see Horford play the 4.

There are Hawks fans that don't like Smith for other reasons.

But I don't ever recall any Hawks fans call Smith overrated! So I'm calling BS on that! If you don't like Josh or think he's overrated, fine. But don't blame it on a fictional Hawks fan!

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 10:58 PM
The reason he's out on the elbow is because Drew is trying to create room for Joe Johnson and an Iso play. If you are truely watching you will see. Usually Joe dribbles down the clock and teams will leave Smith open.

This the play:

Center left wing
Josh left elbow
Joe top of key
Pg right elbow
Sf right wing

They've been doing this play for 6 years now. This play is reserved for the Kobes, Lebrons, Wades, and B. Roys. The Hawks does this play much much more than any team.

because he can't consistently knock the shot down, yet continues to shoot it with reckless abandon... it's the smart defensive move and jsmith plays right into the defense when he shoots that shot...

gotoHcarolina52
02-09-2012, 11:00 PM
It's not that we hate Josh Smith, it's that we're just so damn jealous of his jump shot.

SB75
02-09-2012, 11:01 PM
Bad attitude.

That's a myth, placed on him coming out of high school. He's done nothing but give back to the Atlanta community and work hard, despite playing under the ASG, bad management and coaching.

Could he mature some? YES....... But that's a different question.

reffahead
02-09-2012, 11:03 PM
It's more of a bad offensive play. Joe dribbles the clock down and gets doubled team. He's put in a situation where he has to shoot. You act like he's posting a guy down and retreats outside to shoot a shot.

Any way he deserved over alot reserves and half the NBA feels the same.

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 11:06 PM
It's more of a bad offensive play. Joe dribbles the clock down and gets doubled team. He's put in a situation where he has to shoot. You act like he's posting a guy down and retreats outside to shoot a shot.

Any way he deserved over alot reserves and half the NBA feels the same.

no, i'm not.. when the most shots a player takes is at a clip of 36%, it's not always because of bad offense... there are plenty of times when it's one pass to smith and he just pops it with 10+ seconds left on the clock... he shoots more elbows than dunks, and the guy dunks a ton...

dee279
02-09-2012, 11:06 PM
I agree. Josh Smith to me, is the best player on the Hawks. Joe Johnson is way overrated to me.

*Silver&Black*
02-09-2012, 11:08 PM
How is Josh "Overrated"? He is pretty much in the top 30 (which means if ALL of the so called "stars" was to be spread out over all the teams, he would be the "man" on one of the teams) of every category that the league keeps track of and is never praised by the league:


Ranks #32 in the NBA in Field-Goal Percentage (0.470)
Ranks #6 in the NBA in Blocks Per Game (2.04)
Ranks #31 in the NBA in Minutes Per Game (33.9)
Ranks #23 in the NBA in Minutes Played (881)
Ranks #21 in the NBA in Field Goals Made (166)
Ranks #26 in the NBA in Field Goal Attempts (353)
Ranks #23 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts (124)
Ranks #48 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds (46)
Ranks #7 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds (186)
Ranks #16 in the NBA in Total Rebounds (232)
Ranks #17 in the NBA in Steals (38)
Ranks #6 in the NBA in Blocks (53)
Ranks #31 in the NBA in Points (405)
Ranks #26 in the NBA in Steals Per Turnover (0.6)
Ranks #18 in the NBA in Double-doubles (10)
Ranks #23 in the NBA in Field Goals Per 48 Minutes (9.05)
Ranks #22 in the NBA in Field-Goal Attempts Per 48 Minutes (19.24)
Ranks #33 in the NBA in Free Throws Per 48 Minutes (3.65)
Ranks #19 in the NBA in Free Throw Attempts Per 48 Minutes (6.76)
Ranks #38 in the NBA in Three-Point Field Goals Per 48 Minutes (0.33)
Ranks #16 in the NBA in Offensive Rebounds Per 48 Minutes (2.5)
Ranks #6 in the NBA in Defensive Rebounds Per 48 Minutes (10.1)
Ranks #14 in the NBA in Rebounds Per 48 Minutes (12.6)
Ranks #24 in the NBA in Assists Per 48 Minutes (4.5)
Ranks #18 in the NBA in Steals Per 48 Minutes (2.07)
Ranks #2 in the NBA in Blocks Per 48 Minutes (2.89)
Ranks #28 in the NBA in Points Per 48 Minutes (22.1)
Ranks #16 in the NBA in Total Efficiency Points (504)
Ranks #18 in the NBA in Efficiency Ranking (19.38)
Ranks #17 in the NBA in Efficiency Ranking Per 48 Minutes (27.47)


Also just to show he is the BEST all-around player (meaning does everything on the court) in the league, with a game against the Bulls this year: "25 points, 5 rebounds, 5 assists, 4 steals and 6 blocks becoming the first player in just over 18 years to hit each of those levels in one NBA game since Hakeem Olajuwon did it for the Rockets against the Timberwolves on Dec. 30, 1993. In fact, since the NBA started keeping track of steals and blocked shots in 1973, Olajuwon (five times), Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (four times) and David Robinson (once) are the only other players who have reached, in one game, each of the levels that Smith reached on Saturday night."

How is he "overrated" when he is never "rated" to begin with?

reffahead
02-09-2012, 11:12 PM
no, i'm not.. when the most shots a player takes is at a clip of 36%, it's not always because of bad offense... there are plenty of times when it's one pass to smith and he just pops it with 10+ seconds left on the clock... he shoots more elbows than dunks, and the guy dunks a ton...

He does pop it with 10 seconds left but he shoots ALOT more with time running out. I watch every game twice so let's say I won't tell you how Boozer plays.

Spiggity_ace
02-09-2012, 11:16 PM
he shoulda made it over iggy honestly

PacersForLife
02-09-2012, 11:16 PM
Tyson Chandler deserves to be an all-star more than half of the guys selected.

How..?

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 11:23 PM
He does pop it with 10 seconds left but he shoots ALOT more with time running out. I watch every game twice so let's say I won't tell you how Boozer plays.

what? so it's okay since the clock is running out?? the hawks haven't figured out to NOT pass to him with the clock winding down and he's at the elbow?? weak argument.. when he gets the ball and he shoots... sometimes with the clock at 5, sometimes with the clock over 10.. i'll repeat, it's his highest percentage of shot attempts, they aren't all with the shot clock winding down, c'mon man... either way, it's a bad shot and he shouldn't be taking it, whether it's the teams scheme or his own personal choice...

what does boozer have to do with this conversation?? is anyone pining for booz in the all star game?? nice diversion attempt...

NJBASEBALL22
02-09-2012, 11:35 PM
I like when undersized guys play out of position but I rarely trust it. Ie... Josh Smith to me is a natural SF, just an athlete. I don't think he is fit for the PF position with all the big bodies now. Also, I don't usually like tweeners... There is a difference between the two. A tweener has skills of each position but doesn't fit. When you play undersized at a position (see Chuck Hayes) it is because they have the skill set of the position they are too small for but not too many skills for the normal position.

flclfanman
02-09-2012, 11:35 PM
Smith has been balling this year, but when you have a pool of LBJ,Melo, Deng, Iggy, AND Granger; the window is tight. :shrug:

reffahead
02-09-2012, 11:36 PM
the hawks haven't figured out to NOT pass to him with the clock winding down and he's at the elbow??

This is correct, the fanbase wanted another coach. Drew is the coach that likes the iso play. He designs Josh at the elbow. Why he isn't positioned on either wing is on the coach. Drew wants Smith on the elbow for whatever reason.

Just because Smith is a below average shooter doesn't mean he doesn't deserve it more than Iggy, Deng, Pierce, or Melo. What he provides on the defense trumps their offensive stats.

Iodine
02-09-2012, 11:37 PM
and PER48 numbers were used. goodbye

willabeast77
02-09-2012, 11:38 PM
He should have made it over Iguodala or Deng or Bosh

Nick O
02-09-2012, 11:41 PM
cause he touches himself at night

Shmontaine
02-09-2012, 11:49 PM
This is correct, the fanbase wanted another coach. Drew is the coach that likes the iso play. He designs Josh at the elbow. Why he isn't positioned on either wing is on the coach. Drew wants Smith on the elbow for whatever reason.

Just because Smith is a below average shooter doesn't mean he doesn't deserve it more than Iggy, Deng, Pierce, or Melo. What he provides on the defense trumps their offensive stats.

i'm glad we at least can agree on this... it's just a bad play to have him continuing to shoot the J... i think i remember the same thing a few years back with Vinny del negro telling Tyrus thomas that he wants him to shoot MORE jumpers... i don't understand this mentality...

reffahead
02-09-2012, 11:59 PM
Glad we came to some type of understanding because I was not about to argue any longer like woman love to do.

But yeah, Joe Johnson was a "full time pg" an entire year for the Hawks 05-06. They still let him run point even with no explosion at all jumping or first step. His assists numbers were high 6.5 assists but terrible team offense.

SB75
02-09-2012, 11:59 PM
no, i'm not.. when the most shots a player takes is at a clip of 36%, it's not always because of bad offense... there are plenty of times when it's one pass to smith and he just pops it with 10+ seconds left on the clock... he shoots more elbows than dunks, and the guy dunks a ton...

You don't watch much of the Hawks do you?


Josh takes a variety of shots....... Not just dunks and elbow jumpers. Would we as Hawks fans like to see less of the elbow jumpers? Yes! But as Reffahead tried to tell you, it's a result f a flawed offense. Joe spends a lot of time in the post and in Iso's, so where do you think you're bigs are going to be when that is the offense you run?

And for the record he's not consistently jacking jumpers with 10 sec left on the clock. If you don't believe me, just look at the numbers, dude only avg's 13 shots a game. There's no way he can shoot as many elbow jumpers with 10 sec left on the clock as you claim and still have the post shots ( hook, up and under, and fade away), dunks, and runners ( or whatever you want to call that running shot he shoots) and still just make 13 attempts a game. you are just wrong!

You are defending your boi Deng and that's fine. But outside of scoring , Josh out does him every where else. And with you complaining about all the jumpers Josh takes and misses, maybe you would like to explain why Josh's FG% is still 30 points higher than Deng's? I really have no problem with Deng making it. Just don't make things up about josh to defend Deng.........

Sadds The Gr8
02-10-2012, 12:02 AM
I thought hed get in over Deng but I understand giving Deng the nod over him

Sinestro
02-10-2012, 12:10 AM
Smith just doesn't seem that good to me and his team is never top 2 or 3 to where his team warrants 3 all stars since Joe and Horford got it locked up

John Walls Era
02-10-2012, 12:14 AM
Because hes not the traditional PF. I thought he should've made it, but coaches hate tweeners.

Nick O
02-10-2012, 12:19 AM
He should have made it over Iguodala or Deng or Bosh

:facepalm: how should he have made it over bosh?

LA_Raiders
02-10-2012, 12:21 AM
Josh deserves it more than Clown Pierce

Shmontaine
02-10-2012, 12:22 AM
You don't watch much of the Hawks do you?


Josh takes a variety of shots....... Not just dunks and elbow jumpers. Would we as Hawks fans like to see less of the elbow jumpers? Yes! But as Reffahead tried to tell you, it's a result f a flawed offense. Joe spends a lot of time in the post and in Iso's, so where do you think you're bigs are going to be when that is the offense you run?

And for the record he's not consistently jacking jumpers with 10 sec left on the clock. If you don't believe me, just look at the numbers, dude only avg's 13 shots a game. There's no way he can shoot as many elbow jumpers with 10 sec left on the clock as you claim and still have the post shots ( hook, up and under, and fade away), dunks, and runners ( or whatever you want to call that running shot he shoots) and still just make 13 attempts a game. you are just wrong!

You are defending your boi Deng and that's fine. But outside of scoring , Josh out does him every where else. And with you complaining about all the jumpers Josh takes and misses, maybe you would like to explain why Josh's FG% is still 30 points higher than Deng's? I really have no problem with Deng making it. Just don't make things up about josh to defend Deng.........

i checked the numbers.. here they are...

http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Josh+Smith

he's shooting a career high 5.7 fga from 16-23 feet... more than anywhere else on the court...

this didn't start with me defending deng.. it started with me saying that jsmooth takes way too many jumpers... and there's plenty of evidence and proof to this...

SB75
02-10-2012, 12:23 AM
Smith just doesn't seem that good to me and his team is never top 2 or 3 to where his team warrants 3 all stars since Joe and Horford got it locked up

This kind of sums up my point. Because the Hawks are not in the media spot light, they get shafted. Al has been out basically the entire season, so he's not a lock because he's not playing. The Hawks have been in the top 4 the last 2 years and the top 5 this year ( and at one point just last week had the best record in the South east div.). still no one knows the Hawks players. Al's numbers where down when he was on the floor and numbers wise Josh's have been better then Al's over the years. Joe's numbers are down this year as well. Josh is about where he always is, but he gets the shaft again.

Despite it seeming like I'm hard on Deng, I'm not. I think he deserves it. Iggy and Paul, name recognition got them the nod ( that and Philly deserves at least one All-Star).

SB75
02-10-2012, 12:38 AM
i checked the numbers.. here they are...

http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Josh+Smith

he's shooting a career high 5.7 fga from 16-23 feet... more than anywhere else on the court...

this didn't start with me defending deng.. it started with me saying that jsmooth takes way too many jumpers... and there's plenty of evidence and proof to this...

Problem is that's proving my point, not yours. 13.6 shots a game 5.7 are long jumpers, simply put that means 7.9 are not jump shots. So that big fib you said about all those jump shots being jacked with 10 sec left on the clock, is just that. A big fib! We already said he takes a few, but often they are the shots the offense calls for. If you watch Hawks games, he's where he supposed to be on the floor. This is the problem the media ( Charles barkley) has put out there as a major Smith problem, when they have not watched the Hawks enough to know the offense.

You still didn't answer my question..... If you are going to put Joe on the block and in Iso after Iso, where do you put you're bigs? I'll give you the answer since you don't want to answer. Right where Josh is and as an offense you will have to live with those jumpers.

So back to the original point! It's a flawed offensive concept for the talent we have. Fans kill me when they act as if Josh is out there just doing what he wants to do, when he wants to do it. This falls on the coach and his offensive concept, more than Josh and his jump shot.


You are also aware that your boi Lou shoots the exact same percentage as josh does from 16 to 23 feet! Are you complaining about him and his jump shots....... 36% and he's a small forward!

Shmontaine
02-10-2012, 01:22 AM
Problem is that's proving my point, not yours. 13.6 shots a game 5.7 are long jumpers, simply put that means 7.9 are not jump shots. So that big fib you said about all those jump shots being jacked with 10 sec left on the clock, is just that. A big fib! We already said he takes a few, but often they are the shots the offense calls for. If you watch Hawks games, he's where he supposed to be on the floor. This is the problem the media ( Charles barkley) has put out there as a major Smith problem, when they have not watched the Hawks enough to know the offense.

You still didn't answer my question..... If you are going to put Joe on the block and in Iso after Iso, where do you put you're bigs? I'll give you the answer since you don't want to answer. Right where Josh is and as an offense you will have to live with those jumpers.

So back to the original point! It's a flawed offensive concept for the talent we have. Fans kill me when they act as if Josh is out there just doing what he wants to do, when he wants to do it. This falls on the coach and his offensive concept, more than Josh and his jump shot.

sorry if i think that a player should take the highest percentage of his shots doing what he does well, and not what he does sub par... blame it on the system if you want... I see enough of him to know he takes many ill advised jump shots out of the flow of the offense... there's plenty of evidence...

http://www.hoopinionblog.com/2012/01/foolish-consistency-is-hobgoblin-of.html
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/06/hawks-drew-has-issue-with-smith%E2%80%99s-shot-selection-now/

“I want him flying all over the place,” Drew said. “I don’t want him sitting out there just shooting jump shots and trying to make plays off the dribble.”

that was just with 5 mins of looking...


You are also aware that your boi Lou shoots the exact same percentage as josh does from 16 to 23 feet! Are you complaining about him and his jump shots....... 36% and he's a small forward!

I haven't mentioned deng at all in this thread.. sorry to disappoint you.... but since you brought it up..

Deng disperses his shot selection much better than smith... while deng shoots 1.3 more fga per game than smith, he shoots 1.2 less fga from 16-23ft than smith... and while deng may shoot the same percentage, one % less actually, as smith from 16-23ft, deng has taken almost 60 less attempts from that area... he shoots, and makes, 3 pointers and also drives to the rim more than shoot the mid range jumper, something smith doesn't do.. the mid range jumper makes up almost half of smith's total shots (44%), while deng's is at 32%.. it's not as big a part of deng's game as and is a huge part of smiths game... i guess that's why the problem is more glaring to me..

but i wasn't talking about deng...

Raph12
02-10-2012, 01:24 AM
More deserving than Joe Johnson...

USMCLaker
02-10-2012, 02:09 AM
The guy should be a 3-4 time all star by now. But for whatever reason, every year he gets snubbed. Then this year, when he finally looks like he would make the all star team, he gets snubbed...yet again.

Seriously what gives? I'm not even a Hawks fan and this pisses me off to oblivion.

You may very well have a point. You never hear about this guy on ESPN or NBA TV. He is on my Laker wish list so I don't think he is under appreciated by everyone.

SB75
02-10-2012, 02:41 AM
sorry if i think that a player should take the highest percentage of his shots doing what he does well, and not what he does sub par... blame it on the system if you want... I see enough of him to know he takes many ill advised jump shots out of the flow of the offense... there's plenty of evidence...

http://www.hoopinionblog.com/2012/01/foolish-consistency-is-hobgoblin-of.html
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/06/hawks-drew-has-issue-with-smith%E2%80%99s-shot-selection-now/


that was just with 5 mins of looking...

Are you one of those posters that after you can't prove your point, you try to change the debate? Because that is exactly what you are doing! No one said that the player shouldn't take the shots that give him the greatest chance of success. In fact I have already said I'd like to see less of the jumpers. The issue is the fib you told about him just jacking jumpers with 10 seconds left on the clock. You should retract that because you where 100% wrong. Well if the system isn't part of the problems answer the question that has been asked 3 times. Where do you put you're big's with your 2 in the post and in iso? This problem can only be solved if Joe makes his move quicker, which won't happen ( Joe is a very patient players, most of that is good but when you hold the ball till it's 5 on the clock it's bad). Or you get into your sets earlier. Just how many Hawks games have you seen? Or can you just not admit when you are wrong?

Really that's your evidence? Really? We have already discussed the number of jumpers, so why do you keep bringing that up as evidence? It's because you are looking for away out of a misguided statement you made. Or ill advised( sorry couldn't resist). The coach has said the same ting all of Hawks fans have said, but he's using Josh as a scape goat and everyone in Atl knows it. Just revert back to the question if you put your 2 in the post, what do you do with the 4 and or 5 for that matter?



I haven't mentioned deng at all in this thread.. sorry to disappoint you.... but since you brought it up..

I can admit when I error........ I got you confused with someone else.


Deng disperses his shot selection much better than smith... while deng shoots 1.3 more fga per game than smith, he shoots 1.2 less fga from 16-23ft than smith... and while deng may shoot the same percentage, one % less actually, as smith from 16-23ft, deng has taken almost 60 less attempts from that area... he shoots, and makes, 3 pointers and also drives to the rim more than shoot the mid range jumper, something smith doesn't do.. the mid range jumper makes up almost half of smith's total shots (44%), while deng's is at 32%.. it's not as big a part of deng's game as and is a huge part of smiths game... i guess that's why the problem is more glaring to me..

but i wasn't talking about deng...

Again no one denies that Deng shot selection maybe a tad better than Josh's. But he also plays with a PG that attracts more attention than any Hawks player creating more room for him to move freely and get better shots. It's still interesting that he shoots the same % as Josh and the NBA world doesn't freak out.

My point is the original statement you made is just wrong. No matter how many stats you throw up, It won't be right. He's not out there just doing what he wants to do. Our offense is what it is, love it or hate it. Josh is not just jacking jumpers with 10 sec left on the clock.

If you care to go back a week or 2 you will see that Josh was making that jumper at a much higher percentage. He has struggled these last 2 weeks until last night. So going forward..... If he's going to make them like he did after the Horford injury, 5.7 is not a horrible number. If he's going to shoot like he has the last two weeks........ Drew has to get him more touches on the box. Little known to those outside of Atlanta, he actually has a more than decent post game.




One more thing about Deng so you can stop this notion that the offense doesn't have anything to do with it. In 2007,2008,2009, and 2010 Deng more than 5.6 16-23 ft jump shots a game. What happened? Rose became one of the best players in the NBA and the Bulls changed coaches. We changes coaches and kept much of the same flawed offense.

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-10-2012, 02:42 AM
Josh Smith didn't make the all-star team....


And it's all LeBron's fault.

*Silver&Black*
02-10-2012, 02:49 AM
Josh Smith didn't make the all-star team....


And it's all LeBron's fault.

I want to see them 2 play together. 2 guys that can play Point Forward that also plays above the rim. Take turns with alley-oops to each other would be fun to watch in an all-star game. Not seeing Joe Johnson or Paul Pierce hold onto the ball to jack up a jumper.

Chronz
02-10-2012, 03:51 PM
Because it loves Joe Johnson.

Fnom11
02-10-2012, 07:56 PM
Who would you drop off the Allstar team for Josh? Peirce? Deng? Bosh? Only one that makes sense is Peirce because he was hurt but he turned that team from a .300 team to a .500.

jim51990
02-10-2012, 08:22 PM
There are Hawks fans who don't like Smith because of a desire to see Horford play the 4.

There are Hawks fans that don't like Smith for other reasons.

But I don't ever recall any Hawks fans call Smith overrated! So I'm calling BS on that! If you don't like Josh or think he's overrated, fine. But don't blame it on a fictional Hawks fan!

no fictional fan im actually a celtics fan who tells him all the time id love to have smoove on the celts.
He just says as you said horford should play the 4 and claims smith is a terrible shooter who turns the ball over to much

*Silver&Black*
02-10-2012, 11:32 PM
Smith tonight showed he got snubbed.

Pakman
02-10-2012, 11:54 PM
Cause PSD is full of morons.

Blink
02-11-2012, 12:10 AM
Lol Tyson doesn't deserve to be an allstar. Monroe is having a very nice season too. But he is on a struggling team...maybe not as much as the Knicks but still.

Bravo95
02-11-2012, 01:22 AM
Damn near got 20-20 in this game.