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craigerlee
02-08-2012, 01:28 PM
In advance of the top 100 prospects list, I've ranked the 30 MLB teams' farm systems based solely on the players currently in the organization who have not yet lost their major league rookie eligibility. Thus, Brett Lawrie doesn't count for the Toronto Blue Jays, but Mike Trout does still count for the Los Angeles Angels.

Past production of players doesn't factor into this. It ain't where you're from; it's where you're at.

1. San Diego Padres


Without Anthony Rizzo, they no longer have a top-25 prospect in their system, but in terms of total future value of players likely to play significant roles in the big leagues, they're ahead of everyone else. Some of these players, especially from the 2011 draft, will develop into stars. But there are so many prospects here with high floors, players who would be top-10 or top-five in other systems but are 11-20 here (such as Robbie Erlin or Edinson Rincon), that they are well-positioned to compete even with modest major league payrolls during the next five to six years. Fans who were upset at the sudden departures of GM Jed Hoyer and assistant GM Jason McLeod for the Cubs should find solace in the fact that the prospects they helped bring into the system (along with many other scouts and execs, including Chris Gwynn, now with Seattle, and Jaron Madison and Randy Smith, still in San Diego) remain in place.

2. Tampa Bay Rays


If you favor ceiling over probability, you could make a strong argument for having the Rays ahead of the Padres, based on the fact that this system could quite easily produce six to eight players who end up as grade-60 players or better in the majors. After that first tier, however, there's a lot less probability here than there was a year or two ago, and several executives from other clubs pointed out that the Rays have a gap in their prospect pipeline coming up that will be filled only if some of their 2011 draft picks move faster than anticipated.

3. Toronto Blue Jays


One of the many reasons criticism of Rogers Communications, the owner of the Blue Jays, for being stingy with free agents is so ignorant is that the club has spent aggressively in the amateur markets during the past three years, grabbing high-ceiling high school players and Latin American prospects by stockpiling picks and paying whatever it took to sign those players. They are the organization most likely to be No. 1 on this list next winter.


ESPN (http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove11/story?id=7547640&_slug_=san-diego-padres-best-farm-system-baseball-mlb&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fmlb %2fhotstove11%2fstory%3fid%3d7547640%26_slug_%3dsa n-diego-padres-best-farm-system-baseball-mlb)

Its Insider so I just posted the top 3. I would of thought cause of depth we'd be ahead of the Rays, but I guess Keith feels that Matt Moore is so can't miss and so good that he puts them over the top.

miller74
02-08-2012, 01:37 PM
thank you Keith Law

ILDD
02-08-2012, 01:41 PM
The only reason that Rays are 2nd is Matt Moore pitched 19.1 innings in 2011 so he has less than the 50 IP limit and is a rookie. Brett has 150 AB's so has just reached over the 130 limit.

If Brett Lawrie had hurt his hand a week earlier or Matt Moore had been brought up 2 weeks earlier then Jays would be ahead of Rays.

ramz.n
02-08-2012, 01:55 PM
3rd is still great with lawrie graduating..goes to show that AA and co. have turned this farm system from nothing to one of the best just by signing those high ceiling players.

TRIUMPHATOR
02-08-2012, 02:36 PM
I actually prefer being third without Lawrie skewing in our favor. It shows that our system is deep, and here's hoping that it develops as Law predicts. 1st place next year.....

Sanyo
02-08-2012, 02:41 PM
Alvarez also only pitched 63 innings -- imagine if Cecil or Drabek had perform to their full capabilities? With Lawrie and Alvarez it would be #1...

rapsjaysfan88
02-08-2012, 04:07 PM
its encouraging to have a team that can win 80-90 games and have a top system. normally the best teams have crap system and crap teams have great farms.

Melo15
02-08-2012, 04:13 PM
Your farm system is absolutely ridiculous :drool:

BlueJayFanDan
02-08-2012, 04:16 PM
We need to trade for Matt Moore. Kid is going to be a top lefty pitcher in like 2-3 years in the majors. What a stud. He will be talked about with guys like Kershaw.

Bombtista
02-08-2012, 04:18 PM
We need to trade for Matt Moore. Kid is going to be a top lefty pitcher in like 2-3 years in the majors. What a stud. He will be talked about with guys like Kershaw.

Exactly why the Rays would never trade him.

DeRozan10
02-08-2012, 04:43 PM
I think we easily have the most talent/potential with guys 25 and under

With our outstanding minor league depth you can add

Lawrie
Alvarez
Rasmus
Drabek
Snider
Cecil
Thames
Arencibia

TRIUMPHATOR
02-08-2012, 04:54 PM
That is why we should be thrilled with our farm. It is starting to look sustainable.

KaiserSose
02-08-2012, 04:58 PM
I think we easily have the most talent/potential with guys 25 and under

With our outstanding minor league depth you can add

Lawrie
Alvarez
Rasmus
Drabek
Snider
Cecil
Thames
Arencibia

Arencibia is 26

Shifty1 69
02-08-2012, 05:55 PM
We need to trade for Matt Moore. Kid is going to be a top lefty pitcher in like 2-3 years in the majors. What a stud. He will be talked about with guys like Kershaw.

And other teams need to trade for Lawrie, Alvarez, d'Arnaud, and hutch.:rolleyes:
Easier said than done. Rays have pitching and defense and very little else(not that they need much else apparently).... Doubt they would move him for anything short of a ludicrous offer.

Sanyo
02-08-2012, 07:20 PM
It amazes me how much we still want to go after other team's prospects when those teams/other fans are salivating about the Jays prospects --

Face it the Jays farm is near perfect with good ace potential (Syndergaard, Norris), good starting depth/bullpen arms (Nicolino, Sanchez, Hutch, Cordena, etc, etc.), good potential power bats (Gose, Marisnick, Knecht, Dean, Anderson), good catching (D'Arnaud, Jimenez), good speed (Gose, Marisnick, etc). The one thing the Jays lack are some decent middle infielders (though one can argue the Jays have one in Hech, just needs to come through with the bat) but if thats the worst of it I'll take it! We should be lucky the Jays have such depth -- when other people give us props, take it folks, we are lucky to see what this team could be doing soon enough!

Guys like Marisnick, Gose, D'Arnaud, Syndegaard, Norris and Nicolino could all potentially be top 25 prospects in 2012 --

scaramantula
02-08-2012, 07:39 PM
Arencibia is 26

as are thames and cecil, lol he should have done his research

Krylian
02-08-2012, 10:01 PM
Who is Cordena?

DeRozan10
02-08-2012, 10:18 PM
as are thames and cecil, lol he should have done his research

:facepalm:

Cecil and Thames are both 25. Shoulda done some research.

Arencibia just turned 26 a month ago

The point is still the same regardless. We have a large amount of young talent, both in the big leagues and minors

LechWalesa
02-08-2012, 10:33 PM
I would like to see a few more of those Brett Lawrie trades. Let's start with Lind for a bag of baseballs.

In all seriousness though, I also think a lot of the younger non-prospects that AA has acquired make that farm look even better.

masTOR_shake1
02-09-2012, 07:03 AM
imagine we had beede, oh well should get a good one with 22 this year.

StealingSigns
02-09-2012, 07:20 AM
imagine we had beede, oh well should get a good one with 22 this year.

Every team has a Beede story to tell.

GrumpyOldMan
02-09-2012, 08:54 AM
Not only are they stacked in the minors, but the Jays have young talent at the MLB level as well. Should make for some exciting times to come.

ILDD
02-09-2012, 09:09 AM
Who is Cordena?

Do you mean Adonys Cardona?


The 18 year-old Venezuelan righty came into 2011 as the #19 prospect in the Jays farm system according to Baseball America. Cardona was given a $2.8 million signing bonus, the highest ever given to a Venezuelan amateur. Instead of making his pro debut in the Dominican Summer League, he made it in the Gulf Coast League this summer and out duelled Luis Heredia, the Pirates top international signing, with three shutout innings of one-hit ball while striking out four June 21. That no-decision was followed by two straight losses, as he allowed six runs over five innings. His first and lone professional win came in relief against the Braves July 9 by scattering two hits and a walk over three innings while racking up three strikeouts.

His ERA was 6.75 in June and 5.28 in July but he turned a corner in August with a 2.45 mark. He enjoyed pitching in Dunedin with a 2.55 ERA but his road mark was 7.07. More positives about Cardona’s season were a 3.14 FIP (Fielding Independent Pitching) and an ISO (Isolated Power) against mark of .083.

Initial scouting reports had Cardona’s fastball in the 88-91 mph range, touching 93. There was word he was pumping gas as high as 94-95 over the summer. With a long, lean frame of 6-4, 175 pounds, Cardona could add another tick or two to his heater which has the potential to be a plus pitch. His changeup is said to be advanced with some sink but he needs to work on his curveball. Concerns have also been expressed about his delivery. Cardona, who turned 18 on January 16, was recently rated as the #8 prospect in the Gulf Coast League by Baseball America.

wamco
02-09-2012, 12:17 PM
I thought keith law was a moron and a jay-hater?

Farsight
02-09-2012, 12:26 PM
I thought keith law was a moron and a jay-hater?I think he was more bitter with the JP regime. However, its not like he can ignore a good minor league system (if he hated the jays), or else much of his legitimacy would be gone

StealingSigns
02-09-2012, 12:33 PM
I think he was more bitter with the JP regime. However, its not like he can ignore a good minor league system (if he hated the jays), or else much of his legitimacy would be gone

:nod: K-Law does not even try to hide his disdain for Ricciardi. He has no issue with the actual ball club.

phillipmike
02-09-2012, 12:40 PM
:nod: K-Law does not even try to hide his disdain for Ricciardi. He has no issue with the actual ball club.

X2

He really respect AA and has been pro AA, he just hates JP and rightfully so.

torontosports10
02-09-2012, 01:06 PM
Any have his list of the top 100 prospects?

JaysFan87
02-09-2012, 01:29 PM
Any have his list of the top 100 prospects?

He has 5 in his top 100

6 - d'Arnaud
42 - Hutchison (kinda high IMO)
47 - Marisnick
59 - Gose
96 - Sanchez (kinda high IMO)

The Analyst
02-09-2012, 01:29 PM
Thames doesn't impress me at all. If he's the worst player on your team, then I guess that's all right. I don't see him being anything more than a 4th outfielder on a good team. Maybe he'll improve in 2012, but I'm not banking on it.

Sanyo
02-09-2012, 01:36 PM
He has 5 in his top 100

6 - d'Arnaud
42 - Hutchison (kinda high IMO)
47 - Marisnick
59 - Gose
96 - Sanchez (kinda high IMO)

No Syndergaard which is lame, he's one of the best 19 year olds in baseball, could easily be near the top 25 next year if he continues his path.

Krylian
02-09-2012, 01:41 PM
Do you mean Adonys Cardona?

No. I know all about Cardona. Just noticed another poster keeps writing Cordena...

torontosports10
02-09-2012, 01:45 PM
Wow D'A is way up there

Krylian
02-09-2012, 01:53 PM
#6 is awfully high. I like d'Arnaud as much as anyone but I'm sure I can ramble off more than 5 prospects I'd rather have than Travis.

I figured we'd see around 4-5 prospects in the Top 100. I guess Law doesn't really consider players who haven't thrown a pitch or played a game yet...hence no Norris.

craigerlee
02-09-2012, 01:57 PM
No Syndergaard which is lame, he's one of the best 19 year olds in baseball, could easily be near the top 25 next year if he continues his path.

Law did say that Sanchez, Nicolino and Syndergaard will all probably start in Lansing and would make up the best rotation in minor league baseball and that Syndergaard and Nicolino are likely to be on this list next year. I think Top 25 next year is extremely ambitious for Syndergaard as there's a lot high ceiling prospects on that list that were still in A ball or below that will be there next year like Cole, Machado, Profar, Walker, Taillon, Bell, Bundy, Starling, Bradley, Wheeler, Marisnick, Lindor, etc. Add to that guys in AA that won't be called till September and I highly doubt Syndergaard is in the top 25 unless he develops another plus pitch outta nowhere.

The Analyst
02-09-2012, 02:09 PM
I thought keith law was a moron and a jay-hater?

JP Ricciardi brought in Keith Law to be his stat-genius assistant GM, like Billy Beane had with Paul DePodesta. Although when things didn't pan out for JP he fired Keith as a scapegoat. When ESPN hired Law, he used it as a soap box to crusade against JP whenever possible.

Once JP was fired, Keith had no ill will with the Jays at all. AA used to work under Law, so he probably sees AA as a protege, achieving what he never got the opportunity to do. I used to work in the Jays front office when all three of them were there.

Manatoo
02-09-2012, 02:20 PM
When ESPN hired Law, he used it as a soap box to crusade against JP whenever possible.


:rolleyes:

Twitchy
02-09-2012, 03:05 PM
JP Ricciardi brought in Keith Law to be his stat-genius assistant GM, like Billy Beane had with Paul DePodesta. Although when things didn't pan out for JP he fired Keith as a scapegoat. When ESPN hired Law, he used it as a soap box to crusade against JP whenever possible.

Once JP was fired, Keith had no ill will with the Jays at all. AA used to work under Law, so he probably sees AA as a protege, achieving what he never got the opportunity to do. I used to work in the Jays front office when all three of them were there.

Actually if anything I'd argue the exact opposite. Law has typically avoided questions regarding JP when he could just as easily insult him left right and center.

Fans of every single team always accuse Law of being biased against them. He's actually been pretty fair to the Jays.

The Analyst
02-09-2012, 03:45 PM
Law never attacked JP personally, the way JP attacked Adam Dunn, but he did criticize pretty much every move he made.

North Yorker
02-09-2012, 04:29 PM
6.D'Arnaud might turn out to be the real impact player acquired by Toronto in the Roy Halladay trade -- although I think Kyle Drabek is far too young and talented to assume his story is written -- as a plus defensive catcher who produces across the board on offense.

The two big keys for d'Arnaud in 2011 were staying healthy -- which he did until he tore a thumb ligament while playing for Team USA in October's World Cup -- and starting to grow into his power, which projects as plus, 25-30 homers in a full season of catching down the road.

His defense, always solid, improved this year with help from his manager in New Hampshire, Sal Fasano, who worked with d'Arnaud on game-calling and footwork. There's still more growth in d'Arnaud's bat, and he has the arm strength and release to improve his modest caught-stealing rates when he reaches the majors. He is expected to be healthy for spring training and will start the year in Triple-A, but since Las Vegas is such a hitters' park to begin with, he might knock the walls down before Toronto calls him up later in the year.


42.Hutchison took a huge leap forward in 2011, putting on some weight and seeing his stuff start to inch up, topping out at 94 mph on a regular basis. He'll sit at 91-92 but with uncanny feel for pitching for his age, and deception and angle from a slightly cross-body arm action. That delivery isn't ideal for long-term health, but he gets to his glove side fine and benefits from the way it limits right-handers' looks at the ball. His slider flashes plus right now up to 84 with good tilt, and the changeup has been plus dating back to when the Jays drafted him.

Hutchison projects as a solid No. 3 right now, but with the command and feel to be more if his velocity continues to improve and that cross-body delivery holds up. I like his chances to take one more big step in 2012 and even sniff the big leagues by September.


47.Marisnick repeated the Midwest League in 2011 and turned in a breakout season where all five of his tools were on display, as well as a cleaner swing that eliminated the slight reloading hitch he had in high school. He repeats his swing well for line-drive power, and has the hip rotation to drive the ball out as he gets stronger.

His arm is plus and while he's not a burner, his reads in center are good enough to grade his defense there as plus as well. Marisnick is also a very hard worker who has impressed the Jays' staff with his ability to make adjustments. Don't be surprised to see him get to Double-A this year.


59.Gose isn't a finished product, but he has made enormous strides in the 18 months since Toronto acquired him from Philadelphia by way of Houston, and is young enough that forecasting additional growth for him makes sense.

He is a 70 runner with an 80 arm who can run everything down in center field. In high school he was all tools and had no clue as a hitter -- he was an uncoordinated hacker with no consistency to his stance or weight transfer. Now Gose stays back better and repeats his swing in a way he couldn't before, resulting in higher-quality contact and the chance for average power. His two-strike approach still needs work -- because it doesn't really exist -- and the Blue Jays want to have him work more on shooting the ball to left and even on bunting for hits to make use of his speed.

His defense alone makes him a big leaguer, and even a modest improvement in the two-strike approach makes him a regular, with an All-Star ceiling if he continues to make these large adjustments.


96.It wasn't quite the pro debut I'd expected from Sanchez, but after struggling with his control in his first two outings, he implemented an adjustment at Toronto's instruction to keep his front side more closed and produced much better results for the rest of the summer. Sanchez topped out in the mid-90s in just about every start, with an average curveball in the upper-70s and an improving changeup. His arm action is clean and easy, and his body is very projectable, so he could easily sit in the mid-90s in a few years once his body has matured.

He'll need to refine the off-speed pitches and improve his command, which still needs work even with his delivery more on line to the plate. Sanchez, control artist Justin Nicolino and hard-throwing Noah Syndergaard should all start 2012 in Lansing in what will be one of the minors' best prospect rotations, with all three guys strong candidates for next year's list.
.

Twitchy
02-09-2012, 04:36 PM
Law never attacked JP personally, the way JP attacked Adam Dunn, but he did criticize pretty much every move he made.

If you're referring to Wells, Romero over Tulo, AJ, BJ, the Overbay extension, I'd probably have to agree with Law too. He did some good jobs building bullpens on the cheap and I hardly think Law criticized him for that, the Downs extension, Rios (at least at the time it was signed), or the Rolen trade (both acquiring him and flipping him for Stewart).

I don't like generalizations that Law criticized every move. I'm not going to look through Law's quotes on every acquisition but I don't think that's a fair statement.

craigerlee
02-09-2012, 04:55 PM
If you're referring to Wells, Romero over Tulo, AJ, BJ, the Overbay extension, I'd probably have to agree with Law too. He did some good jobs building bullpens on the cheap and I hardly think Law criticized him for that, the Downs extension, Rios (at least at the time it was signed), or the Rolen trade (both acquiring him and flipping him for Stewart).

I don't like generalizations that Law criticized every move. I'm not going to look through Law's quotes on every acquisition but I don't think that's a fair statement.

I agree its probably an overgeneralization, but I don't recall reading anything where Law really praised JP for anything. Just listening to Law's spiel about his times in Toronto on the ESPN podcast and how JP would make fun of his scouts scouting reports, how JP refused to listen to him and other front office guys about how their moneyball approach wasn't working, and how JP led him astray with his stats focused approach. Also, wasn't Law the one that told the media how JP had a chance to trade Jose Cruz Jr. for David Wright and panned the idea by saying he wasn't trading Cruz for some guy in the Sally. It seems to me by what Law has said in the media that there's no love lost between these two guys.

Billyen
02-09-2012, 07:44 PM
JP Ricciardi brought in Keith Law to be his stat-genius assistant GM, like Billy Beane had with Paul DePodesta. Although when things didn't pan out for JP he fired Keith as a scapegoat. When ESPN hired Law, he used it as a soap box to crusade against JP whenever possible.

Once JP was fired, Keith had no ill will with the Jays at all. AA used to work under Law, so he probably sees AA as a protege, achieving what he never got the opportunity to do. I used to work in the Jays front office when all three of them were there.

Well looky here...we have a ex-insider. May I ask what your role was and why would you leave?

StealingSigns
02-09-2012, 09:29 PM
I agree its probably an overgeneralization, but I don't recall reading anything where Law really praised JP for anything. Just listening to Law's spiel about his times in Toronto on the ESPN podcast and how JP would make fun of his scouts scouting reports, how JP refused to listen to him and other front office guys about how their moneyball approach wasn't working, and how JP led him astray with his stats focused approach. Also, wasn't Law the one that told the media how JP had a chance to trade Jose Cruz Jr. for David Wright and panned the idea by saying he wasn't trading Cruz for some guy in the Sally. It seems to me by what Law has said in the media that there's no love lost between these two guys.

:nod:

I can recall some ESPN chats where Law said some unflattering things about Ricciardi.

Krylian
02-09-2012, 10:11 PM
As far as JP was concerned you didn't exist until you turned 21 (College Junior).

Farsight
02-09-2012, 10:48 PM
As far as JP was concerned you didn't exist until you turned 21 (College Junior). Near the end of his tenure, he started to draft more highschool players in the earlier rounds, but that statement tended to be true throughout his career as the GM

phillipmike
02-09-2012, 11:04 PM
There are a little surprises here. I think D'Arnaud and Hutch is too high, and that Sanchez is on the list over others (Norris, Syndergaard etc.).

But that is why i am fan and Law gets paid to do this. If D'Arnaud turns out to be anything like Law's prediction then i would be extremely pleased. That is an elite catcher.

Dol-Fan
02-09-2012, 11:15 PM
Don't really care about Syndergaard being left off, but how do you put Sanchez on there over him?

StealingSigns
02-09-2012, 11:19 PM
I'm not surprised by Sanchez' ranking. Had he not sputtered out of the gate this season, he would be ranked much higher. This kid is going to be fantastic. I still think he has the highest ceiling out of any Jays pitching prospect.

Dol-Fan
02-09-2012, 11:34 PM
I'm not surprised by Sanchez' ranking. Had he not sputtered out of the gate this season, he would be ranked much higher. This kid is going to be fantastic. I still think he has the highest ceiling out of any Jays pitching prospect.

I agree that it's at the very least arguable, but after Noah's performance last year, do you not think that Syndergaard has a similar ceiling to Sanchez? Both have heat (Syndergaard better) a solid breaking ball (Sanchez better) and developing change and cutter.

I think they certainly have similar ceilings (although the real-plus breaking pitch for Sanchez could give him the edge...judgment call I guess, but it wouldn't be mine)...but if you base it on ceiling AND performance, you HAVE to have Syndergaard over Sanchez.

Farsight
02-10-2012, 12:00 AM
I agree that it's at the very least arguable, but after Noah's performance last year, do you not think that Syndergaard has a similar ceiling to Sanchez? Both have heat (Syndergaard better) a solid breaking ball (Sanchez better) and developing change and cutter.

I think they certainly have similar ceilings (although the real-plus breaking pitch for Sanchez could give him the edge...judgment call I guess, but it wouldn't be mine)...but if you base it on ceiling AND performance, you HAVE to have Syndergaard over Sanchez.I completely agree with you but a lot of scouts are split on whether or not Syndergaard will be a starter or a relief pitcher, that may have effective K.Law ranking

Dol-Fan
02-10-2012, 12:04 AM
I completely agree with you but a lot of scouts are split on whether or not Syndergaard will be a starter or a relief pitcher, that may have effective K.Law ranking

Could the same argument not be made for Sanchez? If he can't harness some control (which Syndergaard has already done quite well) and can't master 1-2 more pitches, is he not a reliever?

craigerlee
02-10-2012, 12:16 AM
My guess is that Law probably isn't too high on Syndergaard's secondary stuff and probably hasn't seen him too much of him this year. Back when we drafted him Law panned the pick saying that he was pretty much arm strength with no secondary stuff or polish.

StealingSigns
02-10-2012, 12:24 AM
Oh I hear you on Syndergaard. Scouts are raving about him, Sickels has him as a B+ (and the Jays third best prospect). But, Sickels also has McGuire as a B+, which i don't get.

Baseball America has Sanchez rated higher. MLB.com has Syndergaard rated higher.

All I know is if both these guys hit their ceilings... :drool:

Farsight
02-10-2012, 12:57 AM
Could the same argument not be made for Sanchez? If he can't harness some control (which Syndergaard has already done quite well) and can't master 1-2 more pitches, is he not a reliever?i dont think the issue is control for Syndergaard, its his development of secondary pitches as you mentioned before. Sanchez has nasty stuff already, and im assuming with development time, they hope he learns control, where as i believe its harder to teach "stuff"

bomber0104
02-10-2012, 12:57 AM
Really weird rankings from Law

D'Arnaud is way too high and shouldn't be in the top 10 and probably not in the top 15.. Like someone already said, its very easy to think of more than 5 prospects we'd rather have in our farm over Travis as awesome as he is. Guys like Moore, Harper, Trout, Machado, Profar, Miller, Teheran, Cole, Bauer are pretty much no brainers.

Law has always been high on Huchison so the ranking doesn't surprise me

I'm puzzled by Sanchez being the top 100 over Syndergaard just like most people here. Sanchez was clearly flashier prospect in the draft but Syndergaard is a few steps ahead of him in terms of development despite being the same age and having the same experience

StealingSigns
02-10-2012, 01:01 AM
From Klaws chat re. the rankings:


Matt (London, ON)
Was Aaron Sanchez over Syndergaard and Nicolino a tough decision? How close was it?
Klaw
Not really.

Farsight
02-10-2012, 01:13 AM
From Klaws chat re. the rankings: I think K.LAW prefers more stuff>performance at lower levels as i allude to before. Its easier to teach control than stuff i believe

Sanyo
02-10-2012, 02:05 AM
Sanchez reminds me of Romero -- a guy who's struggling to find his stuff but has a ton of upside -- though yes Romero had college experience when he joined the minors and Sanchez is still just a teen, which gives him even more upside...time will tell with Sanchez.

Sanyo
02-10-2012, 02:06 AM
For me at this point I go Syndergaard, Norris, Nicolino, Sanchez, Hutchison as my five potential starters in 2016...with Cardona as a toss in with Osuna not too far behind...

Farsight
02-10-2012, 02:08 AM
Sanchez reminds me of Romero -- a guy who's struggling to find his stuff but has a ton of upside -- though yes Romero had college experience when he joined the minors and Sanchez is still just a teen, which gives him even more upside...time will tell with Sanchez. Sanchez probably has the most upside out of all our pitching prospects. Mel Queen said (R.I.P.) he is the best arm he has seen in our system since Halladay (or he reminded him of Hallady?). He really has a chance to be a legit number one

phillipmike
02-10-2012, 02:25 AM
This is someone's full list...

RANK POSITION PLAYER TEAM HEIGHT WEIGHT AGE
1 CF Mike Trout L.A. Angels 6-1 217 20
2 RF Bryce Harper Washington 6-2 245 19
3 LHP Matt Moore Tampa Bay 6-2 205 22
4 SS Manny Machado Baltimore 6-3 185 19
5 RHP Shelby Miller St. Louis 6-3 195 21
6 C Travis d'Arnaud Toronto 6-2 195 22
7 SS Jurickson Profar Texas 5-11 165 18
8 C Devin Mesoraco Cincinnati 6-1 220 23
9 DH/C Jesus Montero Seattle 6-3 235 22
10 RHP Gerrit Cole Pittsburgh 6-4 220 21
11 RHP Dylan Bundy Baltimore 6-1 200 19
12 SS Hak-Ju Lee Tampa Bay 6-2 170 21
13 OF Wil Myers Kansas City 6-3 205 21
14 RHP Arodys Vizcaino Atlanta 6-0 190 21
15 OF Bubba Starling Kansas City 6-4 180 19
16 RHP Jameson Taillon Pittsburgh 6-6 225 20
17 3B Anthony Rendon Washington 6-0 190 21
18 RHP Julio Teheran Atlanta 6-2 175 21
19 RHP Archie Bradley Arizona 6-4 225 19
20 LHP Martin Perez Texas 6-0 180 20
21 RHP Trevor Bauer Arizona 6-1 175 21
22 RHP Carlos Martinez St. Louis 6-0 165 20
23 LHP Manny Banuelos N.Y. Yankees 5-11 155 20
24 RHP Taijuan Walker Seattle 6-4 195 19
25 LHP Tyler Skaggs Arizona 6-4 195 20
26 3B Nolan Arenado Colorado 6-1 205 20
27 RHP Zack Wheeler N.Y. Mets 6-4 185 21
28 3B Miguel Sano Minnesota 6-3 195 18
29 RHP Jacob Turner Detroit 6-5 210 20
30 LHP Danny Hultzen Seattle 6-3 200 22
31 RHP Jarrod Parker Oakland 6-1 195 23
32 RHP Casey Kelly San Diego 6-3 195 22
33 RHP A.J. Cole Oakland 6-4 180 20
34 OF Mason Williams N.Y. Yankees 6-0 150 20
35 SS Francisco Lindor Cleveland 5-11 175 18
36 1B Anthony Rizzo Chicago Cubs 6-3 220 22
37 3B Nick Castellanos Detroit 6-4 195 19
38 RHP Matt Harvey N.Y. Mets 6-4 210 22
39 RHP Wily Peralta Milwaukee 6-4 240 22
40 OF Rymer Liriano San Diego 6-0 211 20
41 RHP Zach Lee L.A. Dodgers 6-4 190 20
42 RHP Drew Hutchison Toronto 6-2 165 21
43 3B Cheslor C*thbert Kansas City 6-1 190 19
44 SS Jean Segura L.A. Angels 5-11 160 21
45 LHP Drew Pomeranz Colorado 6-5 230 23
46 1B/LF Jonathan Singleton Houston 6-2 215 20
47 OF Jake Marisnick Toronto 6-4 200 20
48 OF Christian Yelich Miami 6-4 189 20
49 RHP Joe Ross San Diego 6-3 185 18
50 OF Eddie Rosario Minnesota 6-0 170 20
51 LHP James Paxton Seattle 6-4 220 23
52 LHP Mike Montgomery Kansas City 6-4 185 22
53 OF Oscar Taveras St. Louis 6-2 180 19
54 RHP Daniel Corcino Cincinnati 5-11 165 21
55 C Gary Sanchez N.Y. Yankees 6-2 220 19
56 3B Jonathan Schoop Baltimore 6-1 187 20
57 SS Nick Franklin Seattle 6-1 175 20
58 RHP Taylor Jungmann Milwaukee 6-6 220 22
59 OF Anthony Gose Toronto 6-1 190 21
60 OF George Springer Houston 6-3 205 22
61 RHP Allen Webster L.A. Dodgers 6-3 185 22
62 SS Xander Bogaerts Boston 6-3 185 19
63 RHP Chris Archer Tampa Bay 6-3 185 23
64 SS Billy Hamilton Cincinnati 6-1 160 21
65 C Yasmani Grandal San Diego 6-2 205 23
66 3B Zack Cox St. Louis 6-0 215 22
67 OF Josh Bell Pittsburgh 6-4 195 19
68 CF Gary Brown San Francisco 6-1 190 23
69 1B Yonder Alonso San Diego 6-2 240 24
70 RHP Garrett Richards L.A. Angels 6-3 215 23
71 RHP Jake Odorizzi Kansas City 6-2 175 21
72 OF Starling Marte Pittsburgh 6-1 170 23
73 RHP Sonny Gray Oakland 5-11 200 22
74 RHP Tyrell Jenkins St. Louis 6-4 180 19
75 3B Mike Olt Texas 6-2 210 23
76 RHP Trevor May Philadelphia 6-5 215 22
77 OF Michael Choice Oakland 6-0 215 22
78 RHP Jarred Cosart Houston 6-3 180 21
79 RHP Nate Eovaldi L.A. Dodgers 6-3 195 21
80 OF Aaron Hicks Minnesota 6-2 185 22
81 RHP John Hellweg L.A. Angels 6-9 210 23
82 3B Matt Davidson Arizona 6-3 225 20
83 RHP Dellin Betances N.Y. Yankees 6-8 260 23
84 LHP Enny Romero Tampa Bay 6-3 165 21
85 OF Oswaldo Arcia Minnesota 6-0 210 20
86 OF Robbie Grossman Pittsburgh 6-1 190 22
87 OF Mikie Mahtook Tampa Bay 6-1 200 22
88 RHP Taylor Guerrieri Tampa Bay 6-3 195 19
89 CF Brett Jackson Chicago Cubs 6-2 210 23
90 3B Jedd Gyorko San Diego 5-10 195 23
91 RHP Chad Bettis Colorado 6-1 195 22
92 RHP Jordan Swagerty St. Louis 6-2 175 22
93 C Derek Norris Oakland 6-0 210 22
94 C Christian Bethancourt Atlanta 6-2 190 20
95 SS Javier Baez Chicago Cubs 6-0 180 19
96 RHP Aaron Sanchez Toronto 6-4 190 19
97 RHP Addison Reed Chicago White Sox 6-4 215 23
98 RHP Randall Delgado Atlanta 6-3 200 22
99 RHP Neil Ramirez Texas 6-3 185 22
100 C Blake Swihart Boston 6-1 175 19

phillipmike
02-10-2012, 02:30 AM
Add someone else's top 10 Jays prospects.

Jays Top 10 prospects

1. Travis d'Arnaud, C
2. Drew Hutchison, RHP
3. Jake Marisnick, CF
4. Anthony Gose, CF
5. Aaron Sanchez, RHP
6. Justin Nicolino, RHP
7. Noah Syndergaard, RHP
8. A.J. Jimenez, C
9. Adonis Cardona, RHP
10. Deck McGuire, RHP

Krylian
02-10-2012, 10:29 AM
#6 d'Arnaud
#7 Profar

Someone! Quick!! Get on the horn and offer d'Arnaud straight up for Profar!

craigerlee
02-10-2012, 11:18 AM
As part of my overall top prospect package, I've highlighted at least one player in each of the 30 organizations who I think can take a big step forward in 2012 and potentially end up on the overall top 100 for 2013, preferably in the middle or at the top of the rankings. Last year's list put 10 guys in the top 100, including Mason Williams, Jonathan Schoop, Xander Bogaerts, Drew Hutchison and A.J. Cole.

Unlike last year, I didn't repeat any sleeper candidates, but would still throw a vote of confidence behind the Rockies' Will Swanner, the Mets' Akeel Morris, the Royals' Yordano Ventura and the Angels' Cam Bedrosian as he comes back from elbow surgery.


Toronto Blue Jays
Left-hander Justin Nicolino has raised his arm slot since high school, giving him more depth on the breaking ball for an average pitch alongside his 90-92 mph fastball and plus changeup. He and hard-throwing Noah Syndergaard (up to 98 but still in need of a breaking ball) will likely join Aaron Sanchez in Lansing's rotation this year.

ESPN Insider (http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/7559644/mlb-sleeper-prospects-every-organization)

Billyen
02-10-2012, 12:13 PM
Well looky here...we have a ex-insider. May I ask what your role was and why would you leave?

Ex jays insider on the boards and no one cares? Hmmm.

Krylian
02-10-2012, 12:22 PM
Ex jays insider on the boards and no one cares? Hmmm.

Or people are just skeptical.

Sanyo
02-10-2012, 12:29 PM
Or people are just skeptical.

Maybe he's JP Riccardi?

wamco
02-10-2012, 04:17 PM
Law never attacked JP personally, the way JP attacked Adam Dunn, but he did criticize pretty much every move he made.

anyone remember "keith law is an idiot"- JP Riccardi? That was a classic

town123
02-11-2012, 10:34 AM
#6 d'Arnaud
#7 Profar

Someone! Quick!! Get on the horn and offer d'Arnaud straight up for Profar!

AA will ask them to throw in Martin Perez as well ... :)

GNick
02-11-2012, 12:27 PM
ESPN (http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove11/story?id=7547640&_slug_=san-diego-padres-best-farm-system-baseball-mlb&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fmlb %2fhotstove11%2fstory%3fid%3d7547640%26_slug_%3dsa n-diego-padres-best-farm-system-baseball-mlb)

Its Insider so I just posted the top 3. I would of thought cause of depth we'd be ahead of the Rays, but I guess Keith feels that Matt Moore is so can't miss and so good that he puts them over the top.

Plus we traded for Santos out of our system so maybe we did have the best farm.

Krylian
02-11-2012, 09:26 PM
Plus we traded for Santos out of our system so maybe we did have the best farm.

Molina doesn't crack Law's Top 100, and IIRC he's not a Molina fan anyway. Didn't like the average stuff albeit with excellent command. Doubt his loss was a major setback.

wamco
02-12-2012, 12:18 PM
I think it had to play in a little bit as he was still another good piece in the system that was valued enough by a GM to give up Santos.

JaysFan87
02-12-2012, 01:47 PM
Molina is still young enough to improve but the difference between him and someone like Hutchison is that Hutchisons' stuff actually improved last year where his fastball can now top 94 and his secondary stuff took a huge step forward. Molina still relies significantly location and command which is good but his stuff isnt as advanced which is why many believe he will top out at a 4 maybe a 3 but most likely in the pen. That is a trade I would make everyday.

Shifty1 69
02-12-2012, 06:01 PM
I thought keith law was a moron and a jay-hater?

Only when hates on the jays....:rolleyes::D

es0terik
02-13-2012, 01:01 AM
Past production doesn't count for players? Law is such a moron.

JaysFan87
02-13-2012, 02:24 AM
Past production doesn't count for players? Law is such a moron.

Huh?

3mikee_
02-13-2012, 03:31 AM
We should be ahead of the Rays ..

StealingSigns
02-13-2012, 04:19 PM
Didn't want to create a new thread, so I'll put this here:

Kevin Goldstein of Baseball Prospectus released his top 101:

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=16020&tw_p=twt

16. Travis D'Arnaud
28. Jake Marisnick
54. Daniel Norris
68. Anthony Gose
93. Noah Syndergaard

bartron_44
02-13-2012, 04:50 PM
I wonder what it would take to get Tyler Skaggs from Arizona. They have 3 pitchers in the top 40 (Bauer,Skaggs and Bradley), but no highly touted position players. I would love to have that young lefty in our organization. ...

Krylian
02-13-2012, 05:44 PM
I wonder what it would take to get Tyler Skaggs from Arizona. They have 3 pitchers in the top 40 (Bauer,Skaggs and Bradley), but no highly touted position players. I would love to have that young lefty in our organization. ...

We have more arms than position players too.

It would take a lot.

Sanyo
02-13-2012, 07:33 PM
I wonder what it would take to get Tyler Skaggs from Arizona. They have 3 pitchers in the top 40 (Bauer,Skaggs and Bradley), but no highly touted position players. I would love to have that young lefty in our organization. ...

Jays have Daniel Norris...would love Skaggs too but not at what the Dbacks would ask for..

craigerlee
02-13-2012, 09:20 PM
Jays have Daniel Norris...would love Skaggs too but not at what the Dbacks would ask for..

What does having Daniel Norris have to do with acquiring Skaggs? Norris is an 18 year old with zero professional experience who's likely 3-4 years away. Skaggs is 20 year old who's likely to be in the majors by the end of the year.

Krylian
02-14-2012, 01:30 AM
What does having Daniel Norris have to do with acquiring Skaggs? Norris is an 18 year old with zero professional experience who's likely 3-4 years away. Skaggs is 20 year old who's likely to be in the majors by the end of the year.

2 high ceiling lefties.

craigerlee
02-14-2012, 01:58 AM
2 high ceiling lefties.

Still don't see why it matters that we already have Norris, they're probably 3-4 years apart in arrivals to the major leagues and Norris is no sure bet. So I don't see why having Norris would affect our decision of whether to try and acquire Skaggs or not. Its not as if Skaggs is gonna block Norris or make Norris redundant.

AA09-?
02-14-2012, 09:56 AM
Still don't see why it matters that we already have Norris, they're probably 3-4 years apart in arrivals to the major leagues and Norris is no sure bet. So I don't see why having Norris would affect our decision of whether to try and acquire Skaggs or not. Its not as if Skaggs is gonna block Norris or make Norris redundant.

Agreed.

Krylian
02-14-2012, 12:06 PM
Still don't see why it matters that we already have Norris, they're probably 3-4 years apart in arrivals to the major leagues and Norris is no sure bet. So I don't see why having Norris would affect our decision of whether to try and acquire Skaggs or not. Its not as if Skaggs is gonna block Norris or make Norris redundant.

Not saying he'd block Norris...just saying that's why Norris was mentioned.

I'd love to have Skaggs too...but 'Zona would want a ton and I don't think we'd be willing to give what they'd want...Lawrie's name would certainly be the first one to come up.