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View Full Version : Heat have not had a player foul out in 75 games



spreadeagle
02-05-2012, 02:48 PM
Not sure if anyone's mentioned this yet but its an NBA record since the start of the shot clock era "1954 I think"...Lot of love from the ref's? good coaching? just luck?

Hawkeye15
02-05-2012, 02:54 PM
That's crazy

tredigs
02-05-2012, 02:58 PM
That's interesting - Well, Wade/Bosh/Lebron just don't foul very often. Some of that may be star treatment, but how would that account for the high foul rate of a guy like D. Howard.

Surprised Haslem hasn't fouled out though, I'm sure he's been close a number of times. Nobody else on their team generally gets enough minutes to foul out.

Cal827
02-05-2012, 03:01 PM
Wow, that's such a long time. I know that I've seen Wade and Bosh play with 5 fouls, I guess they have been smart once that happens.

Haslem/Joel really surprise me though. They play hard and on the boards/inside. That's basically asking for fouls.

Iodine
02-05-2012, 03:07 PM
That's just awesome

gotoHcarolina52
02-05-2012, 03:08 PM
An extremely impressive streak! A testament to great coaching and player awareness. Congratulations, Miami. :clap:

Slimsim
02-05-2012, 03:13 PM
And that's why they are a top defensive team they can get away with hacking and reaching

cbreezy34
02-05-2012, 03:17 PM
No team gets more love from the refs then the Heat. The Heat beat the Sixers on friday because they are the better team and played better but my god did they get every call. It's infurating and a joke how much favoritism their players recieve.

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-05-2012, 03:18 PM
I don't even think the 08 Celtics could have gotten away with that much. Perkins would foul out from time to time at least.

And for the poster saying that Wade and Bosh play well with 5 fouls, well, it that happens consistently, and the never foul out, you can certainly attribute it more to the refs "swallowing the whistle" because it's Wade and Bosh.

And Joel Anthony is a good shot blocker for his size, but when he's going up against centers 6 or 7 inches taller than him, I'm surprised he doesn't get called for more fouls or gets fouled out.

sixer04fan
02-05-2012, 03:21 PM
An extremely impressive streak! A testament to great coaching and player awareness. Congratulations, Miami. :clap:

Are people really this naive?

Iodine
02-05-2012, 03:22 PM
And that's why they are a top defensive team they can get away with hacking and reaching

http://troll.me/y-u-so-mad/

lavilevi23
02-05-2012, 03:27 PM
LMAO @ the haters.

JasonJohnHorn
02-05-2012, 03:27 PM
The officials love these guys.

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-05-2012, 03:28 PM
LMAO @ the haters.

You mean the realists who actually watch NBA basketball around the league and not just games of their own teams and try to look at things from an unbiased perspective?

Yeah, damn those haters! :mad:

mjt20mik
02-05-2012, 03:30 PM
2 Superstars and 1 Allstar + Endless Complaining when they get fouls = Refs swallowing whistle when making calls against Miami.

Lol, they have a good defensive scheme, and solid defensive players.

CHANGO
02-05-2012, 03:42 PM
Definitely a conspiracy.

Slimsim
02-05-2012, 03:45 PM
http://troll.me/y-u-so-mad/

Cause my team suck

lavilevi23
02-05-2012, 03:48 PM
You mean the realists who actually watch NBA basketball around the league and not just games of their own teams and try to look at things from an unbiased perspective?

Yeah, damn those haters! :mad:

No. I mean the ones that actually believe the refs favor the HEAT in each of their games.

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-05-2012, 03:54 PM
No. I mean the ones that actually believe the refs favor the HEAT in each of their games.

It's not the fact they favor the Heat, but the fact that they "swallow their whistle" and are at times hesitant to call fouls on the star players. But I think that's the case for all star players on all teams. If you don't see the best players out on the floor at the end of games, the ratings plummet. That can go for all teams that have star players in all sports, but specifically basketball.

utl768
02-05-2012, 03:58 PM
without even reading one post in this thread i can already tell you every response

lebron traveled
refs love the heat
lebron is protected
wade is a baby
lebron traveled
special treatment
u mad bro

knicksfan42
02-05-2012, 04:00 PM
It actually scary to see how far the game rigging in favor of the Heat goes.

Master Mind
02-05-2012, 04:02 PM
It's called depth dummies

lavilevi23
02-05-2012, 04:03 PM
It actually scary to see how far the game rigging in favor of the Heat goes.


http://www.thewambulance.com/

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

utl768
02-05-2012, 04:09 PM
No team gets more love from the refs then the Heat. The Heat beat the Sixers on friday because they are the better team and played better but my god did they get every call. It's infurating and a joke how much favoritism their players recieve.


I don't even think the 08 Celtics could have gotten away with that much. Perkins would foul out from time to time at least.

And for the poster saying that Wade and Bosh play well with 5 fouls, well, it that happens consistently, and the never foul out, you can certainly attribute it more to the refs "swallowing the whistle" because it's Wade and Bosh.

And Joel Anthony is a good shot blocker for his size, but when he's going up against centers 6 or 7 inches taller than him, I'm surprised he doesn't get called for more fouls or gets fouled out.


Are people really this naive?


The refs swallow their whistle against the heat its obvious...to all you oblivious bandwagon heat fans and lebron dick swallowers open your eyes...its not good coaching not smart playing its the simple fact the refs swallow their whistles


The officials love these guys.


You mean the realists who actually watch NBA basketball around the league and not just games of their own teams and try to look at things from an unbiased perspective?

Yeah, damn those haters! :mad:


2 Superstars and 1 Allstar + Endless Complaining when they get fouls = Refs swallowing whistle when making calls against Miami.

Lol, they have a good defensive scheme, and solid defensive players.


Definitely a conspiracy.


It's not the fact they favor the Heat, but the fact that they "swallow their whistle" and are at times hesitant to call fouls on the star players. But I think that's the case for all star players on all teams. If you don't see the best players out on the floor at the end of games, the ratings plummet. That can go for all teams that have star players in all sports, but specifically basketball.


It actually scary to see how far the game rigging in favor of the Heat goes.

u mad bro

Slug3
02-05-2012, 04:12 PM
Instead of saying wade/bro/bosh get special treatment, why not ask the last time any super star fouled out of a game (rose, Kobe, durant, etc). They hardly ever do. I could see Anthony easily fouling out but at end of games we usually go with bosh and haslem so Anthony is sometimes not even in there to foul out.

justinnum1
02-05-2012, 04:15 PM
big 3 get some star treatment, and the role players dont play enough minutes to foul out

KingPosey
02-05-2012, 04:15 PM
They had a study a long time ago about LBJ, and how he literally never gets called for fouls, he is NEVER in foul trouble, and how it equates to the other foul #s among elite defenders. It was pretty funny to see how little he gets called for.

D1JM
02-05-2012, 04:17 PM
big 3 get some star treatment, and the role players dont play enough minutes to foul out

This.

More-Than-Most
02-05-2012, 04:17 PM
I have no hate for the heat and realized this same thing the other night when we played them... The sixers should have gone to the line so many times but the refs just don't like to call it... It is a super star league and teams like the heat/Lakers/Celtics and so on will get the benefit from the refs...It is just the way it is and has been and always will be...Its the NBA

Sidenote---Iverson...He would get every damn call.

MTL_123
02-05-2012, 04:19 PM
lol at all the haters. O ya because only wade lebron n bosh get star calls no one else in the league gets them. Really haters come on.

Iversonfan4life
02-05-2012, 04:23 PM
i remember one play in particular on friday when the heat came to philly where iggy beat lebron on baseline and got a nice push in the back. there was no call and the ref was standing right there. that being said it is not just lebron and wade all the superstars get calls because they all yell like little girls everytime someone tries t body them up.

jiggin
02-05-2012, 04:25 PM
wow...no way anyone can say this is just good playing or coaching.

Totally proof that they get a little more love from the refs...of course its obvious if you go to a game and see them in person. I mean, if a guy like wade drive the lane and gets tapped he gets foul shots, but if a guy like bayless drives the lane on the next play and ends up on his *** from being bumped, there is no call.

When people start admitting this, and NOT BEING OK WITH IT, that is when it will change. But people saying, its just part of the game only make it worse. The rule books don't have players names or numbers by the rules...they are suppose to be called the same no matter who has the ball. ITS THE #1 ISSUE WITH THE NBA, IMO. Call all fouls equal and it would dramatically change some of the stars players "skills".

knicksfan42
02-05-2012, 04:26 PM
LeBron James’ statistics are amazing. He’s putting up 30 points, 7 boards, and 8 assists per for essentially the sixth season in a row, and there are exactly zero players who can get close to that trio of numbers for even one season. But he’s doing something else, just as consistently, that no one else of consequence is able to do: not get called for fouls.

Look at the personal fouls column for the top-10 scorers in the league. Nine of them collectively average 2.7 fouls per, falling within the range of 2.3 – 3.4. These nine include some of the NBA’s biggest names who obviously have “earned some calls,” guys who can easily score 10 from the charity stripe in a night while getting the refs’ attention for only their two most obvious hacks.

And the tenth player? That would be James, who averages 1.8–and that’s rounded up. Many people suspect the league helps protect the Wades, Kobes, Anthonys, and other marquee players who keep those turnstiles turning, but how in God’s green earth does LeBron absolutely smoke them all in not getting whistled for defensive misdeeds?

And this isn’t the first time he’s been in the referee’s good graces to this degree. Last year, James averaged 1.7 fouls per. Going backwards from there, you have 2.2, then 2.2, then 2.3, then 1.8, then 1.9… then he was at his high-school prom. Not only is 2.3 fouls per the worst of LeBron’s career, it actually marks the best in the careers of both Wade and Bryant.

Is James, who happens to be the most marketable guy in the league, just that much superior to everyone at not fouling players? We’ve all seen him play, and he’s obviously a very good defender, but he’s no Shane Battier, Ron Artest, Gary Payton, Dennis Rodman, or Bill Russell. James, however, has done a much, much better job than any of them at not being whistled.

Breaking down in great detail LeBron James’ “amazing” fouls rate after the break…

Basic Statistical Comparisons

For starters, we should know how often fouls are being called around the league so we can see if there really is a big difference with LeBron. Through January 22, James played 1702 minutes and committed 77 fouls, good for one foul every 22.1 minutes of court time.

Everyone else in the NBA logged 298,868 minutes and committed 26,473 fouls, good for one every 11.3 minutes. Comparatively, James is half as likely to be called for a foul than the other 300-odd players as a whole. Without even picking up a calculator, it looks like most NBAers who would play 38.7 minutes a game, like James does, would accrue about 3.5 fouls per (remember that his 1.8 is rounded up).

But The Chosen One is no regular professional baller. He just happens to be supremely talented, score a bunch of points, and play on one of the best teams in the league. On top of that, James is the biggest marketing tool the NBA has as it expands its revenue base all over the world in China.

(Eastern Europe and South America have produced far more NBA players, but don’t vote for the All-Star team, aren’t having arenas built in their countries by the league, and don’t host preseason games.)

But the league has had other uber-marketable superstars over the past 30 years. Didn’t they get all the calls as well? Here are three players whose fame and status were similar to LeBron’s, and how their foul counts looked in their first seven seasons:

- As a Laker teamed up with Shaq, Kobe Bryant was a big deal from early on. He guards roughly the same players that LeBron does, and his defensive reputation has been better for most of his career. In Bryant’s first seven full seasons (following two as a reserve), his fouls per game ranged from 2.6 to 3.3, with an average of 2.9.

- Magic Johnson’s smile, collegiate exploits, and style of play made him an instant hit, which the NBA rode up to and beyond his untimely retirement. Magic’s foul counts in his first seven seasons ranged from 1.8 to 2.9, with an average of 2.5 fouls per.

- Michael Jordan was already well known when he entered the league in 1984. He was the NCAA’s consensus Player of the Year, and he had won a national championship at North Carolina. Not only that, I think it’s safe to say that Jordan’s defensive abilities and reputation far trump those of James (Jordan won the Defensive Player of the Year award in 1987-88). His first seven seasons (not counting 1985-86, when he was injured) ranged from 2.5 to 3.5, with an average of 3 fouls per.

Although these three had better foul counts than an average player, LeBron still registers far fewer. On top of that, Jordan and Bryant carried better defensive reputations during their careers, and James often guards big men inside, which almost always results in higher-than-usual foul counts.

Less Than One In a Million

Okay, maybe the Cavs star really is just that much better than the league, other current stars, and three of the most marketable superstars of the David Stern Era at not fouling the man he’s guarding. I’d say that’s highly unlikely, and thankfully math gives us a vehicle to measure how unlikely.

Using a chi-square test (it’s a pain in the *** to explain, so Google away if you’re so inclined) with LeBron’s foul data and the league’s foul data, one derives a chi-square value of 35.9, which translates into a P-value of 0.00000. The P-value is what’s of most use to us here because it tells us how likely something is to happen due simply to chance (e.g. 0.4 means it has a 40% chance of happening). This all means that the likelihood of LeBron’s foul counts occurring with his minutes is less than one in a million.

(A big thank you goes out to Dr. Bradford Crain, a statistics professor at Portland State University, who helped with the calculations and their interpretations.)

That astronomically low number has to be taken with a grain of salt since there are actually a few players in the league who fall into this category, but it’s usually pretty obvious why. For example, Steve Nash is committing a career-low 1.2 fouls per, but he’s such a bad defender, everyone he’s guarding simply dribbles past him and then he’s out of the play. It’s not so obvious with LeBron, considering he’s regularly guarding extremely dynamic players who routinely go to the line, and he’s often banging with the big boys underneath, where a majority of fouls are called.

A more meaningful way to look at the rarity of his foul counts is by comparing him to players who play similar minutes. There are 12 non-centers (centers’ foul counts are always high) who are playing between 38 and 40 minutes per. I decided not to look at their fouls per, since I already know how James stacks up here, but to look at how often these players get into foul trouble compared to James. If a player is in foul trouble, it affects how aggressively he can play in crunch time and if a coach needs to make substitutions, two things that can alter the outcomes of games.

These 12 players (not a slouch in the bunch – Bryant, Gay, Durant, Roy, etc.) combine for 469 games, during which they got called for 4 fouls 53 times, 5 fouls 31 times, and 6 fouls (fouled out) only 4 times. James has logged 44 games, 3 with 4 fouls, and 0 with more. In fact, 4 fouls is the most he’s been called for over the past two seasons.

Using a chi-square test on this data gives us P-values of 0.047 and 0.060 for games with 4-plus and 5-plus fouls, respectively (the calculations for 6 fouls are meaningless since they’re so rare for the entire group). That means that LeBron had a 4.7% and 6% chance of having so few games in those types of foul trouble due simply to randomness. Therefore, something else is at work here (most mathematicians consider anything under 5% to be “significant”).

Checking last year’s data, it’s even worse. There were 10 players who logged between 37.5 and 38.5 minutes per (James, 37.7), and collectively they played 777 games, 109 with 4 fouls, 48 with 5 fouls, and 13 with 6 fouls. James had 9 games with 4 fouls during his 81-game season. This data yields P-values of 0.023 and 0.0089, so he had a 2.3% chance of having so few 4+ fouls games and a 0.89% (less than 1%) chance of having no 5+ fouls games.

Yes, there is definitely something “significant” happening here.
Regular Superstar Treatment?

Maybe the face-of-the-NBA stars ranked similarly low during their top seasons. It turns out Magic was close, but none of them could match what LeBron has been doing for most of his career.

LeBron James

It makes sense to assume Michael Jordan stayed out of foul trouble during his 1992-93 MVP season. In 78 games, he had 4 fouls 10 times, 5 fouls 7 times, and he never fouled out. The nine non-centers who played between 38 and 40.5 minutes totaled 681 games, 124 with 4 fouls, 56 with 5, and 7 with 6. This data yields a P-value of 0.285 for games with 4+ fouls, and 0.936 in games with 5+ fouls. Thus, Jordan had a 28.5% and 93.6% chance of getting into foul trouble at the same rate as these other guys, and he was second to Hakeem Olajuwon in Defensive Player of the Year voting.

Kobe Bryant was similar in his 2007-08 MVP season. In 82 games, he had 18 games with 4 fouls, 6 with 5 fouls, and 1 foul out. The 12 players who played between 37.7 and 39.9 minutes registered 908 games, 162 with 4 fouls, 68 with 5, and 17 with 6. This data produces P-values indicating Kobe’s numbers fit right into this group; he had a 52.3% chance of having that many 4+ fouls games and a 80.5% chance of that many 5+ fouls games.

Magic Johnson did better in his 1986-87 MVP season, playing in 80 games, getting 4 fouls 10 times, 5 fouls 5 times, and never fouling out. The 10 non-centers with 37.1 to 38.6 minutes per totaled 799 games, 128 with 4 fouls, 82 with 5 fouls, and 19 foul outs. The P-values indicate Magic had a 5.9% chance of producing the amount of 4+ fouls games he did with that many games, and a 9.4% chance for games with 5+ fouls. I should mention that these percentages are actually skewed low by the inclusion of four players who had more foul trouble than anyone in LeBron’s years.

None of these players had a percentage fall into the “significant” range, and these three seasons represent some of the best case scenarios of likely “star treatment.”
Conclusions

There is no question that LeBron James is a freakish talent that can do it all, including turning a 17-65 squad into a perennial contender. Not only does he get a lot of points, rebounds, and assists, but he producers these numbers at very good rates (55% eFG%, 11.1 Reb%, 2.2 A/TO).

Where I have some concern is how seldom he’s in foul trouble. This gives an unfair advantage to the Cavaliers, since he never has to watch how he plays or sit for any reason other than to rest. The P-values show how extraordinarily unlikely it is for James to end up with these low foul counts, and his style of play and comparison to more-defensive-minded superstars makes his counts even more unbelievable.

The numbers all come out so ridiculous, it’s undeniable that either a) we’re witnessing a defensive talent more capable than Bill Russell, or b) the NBA/referees are blatantly protecting him. That first one was meant to be a joke, by the way.

Considering there are multiple studies indicating various referee biases, there are several examples of really obvious butcher jobs from the officials that always just happen to help the big-name teams and players, and at least one guy—who the FBI confirms was able to win 80-90% of his bets simply by knowing who was reffing—alleges the NBA has its hands in the outcome of games, I feel comfortable assuming the league is protecting its biggest star to a degree we’ve never seen before… and might never see again.

http://www.emptythebench.com/2010/01/26/lebron-james-fouls/


I actually read another article I haven't found yet, here LeBron hadn't been called for a foul in a number of games in a row (this was in Cleveland).

lavilevi23
02-05-2012, 04:28 PM
http://www.emptythebench.com/2010/01/26/lebron-james-fouls/


I actually read another article I haven't found yet, here LeBron hadn't been called for a foul in a number of games in a row (this was in Cleveland).


http://gifsforum.com/images/gif/did%20not%20read/grand/didnt_read_dance_gif.gif

Lidz
02-05-2012, 04:29 PM
Great coaching awareness!

Young2Kinsler
02-05-2012, 04:45 PM
http://gifsforum.com/images/gif/did%20not%20read/grand/didnt_read_dance_gif.gif

You seem to be the best at getting images...can you find us one of the 2011 NBA champions? I think they won it in Miami, so you can probably find it.

But really, all stars get the same treatment. It is crazy, but people just don't foul out all that often to begin with.

As much as I love to watch the Heat fail, this is a stupid topic.

gotoHcarolina52
02-05-2012, 04:46 PM
Great coaching awareness!

Great coaching awareness and exemplary defensive ability. They suffocate while hardly ever fouling. Very impressive!

:clap:

Basketash
02-05-2012, 04:47 PM
Well if you look up the stats for last year the league average for personal fouls was 1698 and miami had 1647 which is pretty close.

The team with least fouls was Atlanta with 1554 and the highest fouling team was the Utah Jazz with 1865 just for reference.

Judging by the stats Miami fouls at an average pace and while they do get some star treatment it's more on the offensive side then the defensive side.
So going overboard with some new conspiracy theories is just bonkers.

spreadeagle
02-05-2012, 04:52 PM
big 3 get some star treatment, and the role players dont play enough minutes to foul out

id say this is prob the reason

spreadeagle
02-05-2012, 04:56 PM
Young2Kinsler;20848683]You seem to be the best at getting images...can you find us one of the 2011 NBA champions? I think they won it in Miami, so you can probably find it.

But really, all stars get the same treatment. It is crazy, but people just don't foul out all that often to begin with.

As much as I love to watch the Heat fail, this is a stupid topic.
I dont think an entire team not having one player foul out for the length of an entire season is stupid...I think its pretty interesting...Larry the cable guy is stupid

lavilevi23
02-05-2012, 04:59 PM
You seem to be the best at getting images...can you find us one of the 2011 NBA champions? I think they won it in Miami, so you can probably find it.

But really, all stars get the same treatment. It is crazy, but people just don't foul out all that often to begin with.

As much as I love to watch the Heat fail, this is a stupid topic.


Here you go.
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/sportatorium/Mavs%20Wussy%20Logo.jpg

godolphins
02-05-2012, 05:05 PM
No surprise. But I have to admit, its good to have the refs on our side. We all know that the NBA has the worst refs in all of sports so when they favor your team most of the time its a good thing. I'm sure if the refs favored the Knicks, Knicks fans would be happy. If they favored the Bulls, Bulls fans would be happy. The same can be said for the other 27 teams and their fans.

Tmath
02-05-2012, 05:08 PM
Not hard when you have the officials on your side for the majority of games.

BcEuAbRsS
02-05-2012, 05:13 PM
Kinda surprising with how aggressive of a defense they have...

Gibby
02-05-2012, 05:18 PM
They are 10th in the league in PF per game. Look a bit deeper than jumping on any random stat.

1. Luck. plain and simple.

2. Wade, James, and Bosh are just good at avoiding fouls because they are good defensively.

3. Guys like Chalmers and Haslem would foul out more if they got more minutes.

Raps18-19 Champ
02-05-2012, 05:19 PM
Some of these Heat fans are becoming horrible. I have nothing against the Heat but you fans are quickly becoming great ***s.

willabeast77
02-05-2012, 05:26 PM
That's not too impressive but definitely noteworthy. But does this stat include the playoffs?

J_M_B
02-05-2012, 06:41 PM
Some of these Heat fans are becoming horrible. I have nothing against the Heat but you fans are quickly becoming great ***s.

These are the same posters in our forum that just continuously cause trouble, but I wouldn't mind them .. they really aren't that knowledgeable to begin with ..

Anyways, the big 3 have never really been prone to fouling, even before they joined forces. Role players like Haslem(27 mpg), Chalmers(28 mpg), Miller(19 mpg), Anthony(22 mpg) and Battier(23 mpg) don't see enough minutes to foul out.

and yes, some of it has to do with superstar treatment and just simply luck ..

basketfan4life
02-05-2012, 07:17 PM
http://www.emptythebench.com/2010/01/26/lebron-james-fouls/


I actually read another article I haven't found yet, here LeBron hadn't been called for a foul in a number of games in a row (this was in Cleveland).

great article, people say every star gets special treatment and they are right, but lebron treatment is on an highly extraordinary level. Funny thing is, he just doesn't need it.

ghettosean
02-05-2012, 07:45 PM
wow...no way anyone can say this is just good playing or coaching.

Totally proof that they get a little more love from the refs...of course its obvious if you go to a game and see them in person. I mean, if a guy like wade drive the lane and gets tapped he gets foul shots, but if a guy like bayless drives the lane on the next play and ends up on his *** from being bumped, there is no call.

When people start admitting this, and not being ok with it, that is when it will change. But people saying, its just part of the game only make it worse. The rule books don't have players names or numbers by the rules...they are suppose to be called the same no matter who has the ball. Its the #1 issue with the nba, imo. Call all fouls equal and it would dramatically change some of the stars players "skills".
This :clap:

Lets start calling basketball and not what player involved in what play... Just to add on that flopping also drives me nuts I hate hearing announcers say "Well you have to sell it" it's ****ing absurd. Make this a ****ing mans game again and let players take some contact instead of this flimsy you got to act or fall on your *** and hold your hands up to get a call. I miss the Micheal Jordan era *Sigh*

CudiOnMyiPod
02-05-2012, 07:53 PM
And still no rings to show for it.

CudiOnMyiPod
02-05-2012, 08:12 PM
They are 10th in the league in PF per game. Look a bit deeper than jumping on any random stat.

1. Luck. plain and simple.

2. Wade, James, and Bosh are just good at avoiding fouls because they are good defensively.

3. Guys like Chalmers and Haslem would foul out more if they got more minutes.

I have never understood the whole "Bosh is a good defender" argument. He has never played defense and he will never be good at it...

Gibby
02-05-2012, 09:00 PM
I have never understood the whole "Bosh is a good defender" argument. He has never played defense and he will never be good at it...

he is not good as wade or james but he is above average. I watched him since he was on toronto. He just played on a bad defensive that why he was considered a bad defender.

Teeboy1487
02-05-2012, 09:30 PM
he is not good as wade or james but he is above average. I watched him since he was on toronto. He just played on a bad defensive that why he was considered a bad defender.

Bosh has always been a mediocre defender. He was a good rebounder in Toronto and a great scorer, but no way he is even an average defender.

As for this thread, I'm not surprise the Heat receives star treatment from the refs. Realistically, that's what I expect. I'm not taking anything away from the Heat. They will be the best with or without it.

However, I'm criticizing the league. It's not the Heat's fault they get the benefit of the whistle. This is completely on David Stern and the NBA FO.

justinnum1
02-05-2012, 09:41 PM
I have never understood the whole "Bosh is a good defender" argument. He has never played defense and he will never be good at it...

Clueless

aussie
02-05-2012, 09:45 PM
in other news Hornets sign Lance Thomas to a 10 day contract...oh wait no one cares

Cubby
02-05-2012, 09:47 PM
lol at all the haters. O ya because only wade lebron n bosh get star calls no one else in the league gets them. Really haters come on.

The heat get more calls than anyone. To say they don't is just pure homerism. Plus I see people in your fanbase complaining about calls after every game, which is odd because when I watch LeBron, he's allowed to take five steps and barrel over everyone when driving the hoop. Not to mention the flopping and the complaining.

In all seriousness, the players outside of LeBron, Wade, and Bosh don't play enough to foul out. But to say Miami doesn't have any games where calls are ridiculously in their favor is beyond preposterous.

Cubby
02-05-2012, 09:49 PM
Clueless

People just think that because of how soft he is, which is exactly why I think he is an average defender. He definitely benefits from playing next to Anthony, who although is undersized, is good defensively.

Cubby
02-05-2012, 09:51 PM
An extremely impressive streak! A testament to great coaching and player awareness. Congratulations, Miami. :clap:

:laugh:

DeyAce
02-05-2012, 10:13 PM
2 words superstar treatment

LakersA's49ers
02-05-2012, 11:23 PM
TITLE CORRECTION: Heat have played 75 games without a player NOT crying after the game

Hawkeye15
02-05-2012, 11:26 PM
big 3 get some star treatment, and the role players dont play enough minutes to foul out

This is the correct answer.

MTar786
02-05-2012, 11:41 PM
i see like 2 or 3 non call lebron fould everytime i watch the heat play.. that robabl sums its up for wade too maybe. bosh is not that physical.. but im surprised haslem hasnt fouled out.. or jeol anthony

Raps18-19 Champ
02-06-2012, 12:12 AM
These are the same posters in our forum that just continuously cause trouble, but I wouldn't mind them .. they really aren't that knowledgeable to begin with ..

Anyways, the big 3 have never really been prone to fouling, even before they joined forces. Role players like Haslem(27 mpg), Chalmers(28 mpg), Miller(19 mpg), Anthony(22 mpg) and Battier(23 mpg) don't see enough minutes to foul out.

and yes, some of it has to do with superstar treatment and just simply luck ..

I don't even bother with most Heat fan who created their account past July 2010.

It's those guys that give posters like you, Mr Baller, and other good Heat posters a bad name.

Marlin234
02-06-2012, 12:52 AM
Lmao at all the people hating. You know what if favoritism is what you can call then hell I'll take it.

But take a moment and think about what happen last year in the finals (besides Lebron choking and game 6 were we missed like 15 free throws) that series in general they screwed us from so many calls

Raph12
02-06-2012, 12:59 AM
Even more interesting is the fact that Lebron has yet to foul out in all of the years he has played (also an NBA record)...

Gram
02-06-2012, 01:09 AM
lol at all the haters. O ya because only wade lebron n bosh get star calls no one else in the league gets them. Really haters come on.

I spy... A Miami bandwagon. ;)

Gram
02-06-2012, 01:13 AM
Clueless

Ah shut up. If the Heat had signed Boozer as opposed to Bosh and someone said Boozer couldn't play defense, you'd call them clueless too.

swirl54
02-06-2012, 01:14 AM
The NBA lets the LeBron yell at refs, lobby for calls, complain about no calls, and walk on the floor like a coach when he is on the bench what other player can do that? Then there is Wade who kicks his feet out on jumpers just hoping to get a call and whines more than anyone. The Bulls Heat game this year Wade stayed on the court at halftime for a minute to talk to a ref what player does or can even do that? With all this said and the advantage the refs give the Heat on a nightly basis they can still be beat and I still love the NBA. It is just stupid that it is so obvious.

swirl54
02-06-2012, 01:16 AM
lol at all the haters. O ya because only wade lebron n bosh get star calls no one else in the league gets them. Really haters come on.

I wonder who your team was before Lebron took his talents to South Beach

swirl54
02-06-2012, 01:19 AM
Clueless

I do not get your GIF at all why is Wade so mad at one of his BFFs and why is he letting Erik yell at him. Also Bosh is horrible on defense.

Sadds The Gr8
02-06-2012, 01:21 AM
Rigged.

lavilevi23
02-06-2012, 01:34 AM
LMAO @ Bulls fans jumping all over this thread. Haters.
BTW Bosh is solid on D. Much better than Boozer or Amare.

swirl54
02-06-2012, 01:42 AM
LMAO @ Bulls fans jumping all over this thread. Haters.
BTW Bosh is solid on D. Much better than Boozer or Amare.

I suggest you look at your sig pic before you call Bulls fans "haters" plus isn't calling someone a hater getting old? How bout you defend or make a valid excuse as to why they get away with every thing possible. You can't so carry on "hater"

swirl54
02-06-2012, 01:43 AM
rigged.

go colts

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-06-2012, 01:46 AM
Even more interesting is the fact that Lebron has yet to foul out in all of the years he has played (also an NBA record)...

Wow, is this really true? This is his 9th year! :speechless:

gotoHcarolina52
02-06-2012, 01:49 AM
2 words superstar treatment

10 words. I love every minute of it, especially against the Bulls.

Bulls_fan90
02-06-2012, 02:11 AM
This makes what Dallas did last season even more impressive. Even with the superstar treatment, the Heatles still can't win a ring.

Raph12
02-06-2012, 02:12 AM
Wow, is this really true? This is his 9th year! :speechless:

No but as close as it comes to it, he's fouled out 3 times and had 5+ fouls only 26 times out of a possible 741 games... He rarely gets into foul trouble.

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-06-2012, 02:15 AM
Great, Bulls and Heat fans at it again!

-Kobe24-TJ19-
02-06-2012, 02:21 AM
Mr. Stern is awesome

SportsFanatic10
02-06-2012, 02:24 AM
the role players don't play enough minutes to foul out and spo takes them out as soon as they're in foul trouble. i'm not surprised by this at all. and wade/lebron/bosh only average like 2 point something fouls per game for their careers.

naps
02-06-2012, 02:29 AM
Smartest team on the planet. That's what happens when you have world's two greatest players and another top 2 bigman on your team. #SmartBasketballAwareness.

Cubby
02-06-2012, 02:34 AM
Spo is a great coach and is the reason why the HEAT are never in foul trouble. All you haterz can suck it cuz star treatment is a mith, homez.

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

KB-Pau-DH2012
02-06-2012, 02:48 AM
Mr. Stern is awesome

No sir, your sig is awesome! :clap:

JC_
02-06-2012, 03:14 AM
This makes what Dallas did last season even more impressive. Even with the superstar treatment, the Heatles still can't win a ring.

Dallas got the calls in that series, even in Miami.. It was blatantly obvious too from game 2 on.

NYKnicks4511
02-06-2012, 03:25 AM
Wait til Eddy Curry starts playing more minutes hahah

lavilevi23
02-06-2012, 04:20 AM
I suggest you look at your sig pic before you call Bulls fans "haters" plus isn't calling someone a hater getting old? How bout you defend or make a valid excuse as to why they get away with every thing possible. You can't so carry on "hater"

LOL u shouldn't be talking with the calls Rose gets this season. Every time someone blows on him, he snaps his head back and the refs blow the whistle. Just do us all a favor and shut up.

Heatcheck
02-06-2012, 12:19 PM
...

Heatcheck
02-06-2012, 12:19 PM
can we get a link? all ive been able to find is this years stats, where the heat are one of five or six teams to not have a player foul out.

side note: Wilt Chamberlain never fouled out, thought that was pretty interesting.

29$JerZ
02-06-2012, 12:25 PM
Awareness and some ref support make this impressive

swirl54
02-06-2012, 12:38 PM
LOL u shouldn't be talking with the calls Rose gets this season. Every time someone blows on him, he snaps his head back and the refs blow the whistle. Just do us all a favor and shut up.

What a great response telling a grown man to shut up nice. Also yeah Rose gets calls but we're talking about having fouls called on players not for players and Rose gets fouls called on him.

Gibby
02-06-2012, 01:02 PM
What a great response telling a grown man to shut up nice. Also yeah Rose gets calls but we're talking about having fouls called on players not for players and Rose gets fouls called on him.

Rose averages 1.4 PF, which is less than Lebron or Wade. So why isn't there any threads about that? Bulls are also 30th in the league in PF, while Heat are only 10th. Surprising since Bulls play really aggressive on defence.

Marlin234
02-06-2012, 01:43 PM
I suggest you look at your sig pic before you call Bulls fans "haters" plus isn't calling someone a hater getting old? How bout you defend or make a valid excuse as to why they get away with every thing possible. You can't so carry on "hater"

Doesn't Derrick rose get to the foul line just as much? Doesn't he get all the calls he deserves?
Doesn't that explain why our stars get calls to.. Because these type of players are prone to getting fouled all te time. So just shut up already quit the whinning.

avon_barksdale
02-06-2012, 02:16 PM
it be amazin the amount of times lebron lowers his shoulders an run ppl over that he never foul outta games

swirl54
02-06-2012, 02:21 PM
Doesn't Derrick rose get to the foul line just as much? Doesn't he get all the calls he deserves?
Doesn't that explain why our stars get calls to.. Because these type of players are prone to getting fouled all te time. So just shut up already quit the whinning.

Joined forum after James came figures. Go go bandwagon

swirl54
02-06-2012, 02:27 PM
Rose averages 1.4 PF, which is less than Lebron or Wade. So why isn't there any threads about that? Bulls are also 30th in the league in PF, while Heat are only 10th. Surprising since Bulls play really aggressive on defence.

Because the Bulls don't have two very aggressive offensive players. We have one who never got any call until last year. Lebron has got all the calls since day one. Also the Heat whine and get away with more than any other team. Why can Lebron argue calls from the damn bench? Why can wade kick his feet out on every jumper? Why can wade stay on the court for a min at halftime to talk to a ref? It's all just a little weird. I'm not whining or "hating" it is just weird as hell.

RowBTrice
02-06-2012, 02:49 PM
Completely too much favoritism from the Refs........it's so obvious

BALLER R
02-06-2012, 02:59 PM
Refs are the reason for this. I find it hard to believe that a team that plays so aggressive not one person fouls out. Also if you have a good shot block to tend to foul out every now and then.

Raps18-19 Champ
02-06-2012, 03:04 PM
can we get a link? all ive been able to find is this years stats, where the heat are one of five or six teams to not have a player foul out.

side note: Wilt Chamberlain never fouled out, thought that was pretty interesting.

Why would he?

He never even had to jump. He was taller than everyone else. All he had to do was keep his hands up for the most part.

naps
02-06-2012, 03:21 PM
Rose averages 1.4 PF, which is less than Lebron or Wade. So why isn't there any threads about that? Bulls are also 30th in the league in PF, while Heat are only 10th. Surprising since Bulls play really aggressive on defence.

I wonder what a Bulls homer's response would be.

MTL_123
02-06-2012, 03:32 PM
I wonder what a Bulls homer's response would be.

lol their just gonna act like no one said that.:facepalm:

Agar81
02-06-2012, 03:41 PM
I hate to say it, but it's not all coincidental.

majestic
02-06-2012, 03:47 PM
stern probably realizes the heat have no depth.

Piercefan34
02-06-2012, 04:01 PM
yeah im sorry but you can't ignore the treatment they receive on a stat like this lol its not 'haters' or anything its just logic lets be real 'heat fans'

Fnom11
02-06-2012, 04:07 PM
Why is this thread still alive

Piercefan34
02-06-2012, 04:16 PM
Why is this thread still alive

cause its ****in annoying listening to ignorant heat fans say they dont get preferential treatment when stats like this are thrown right in their face lmao

justinnum1
02-06-2012, 04:31 PM
all stars get special treatment...bostons big 3 included

CHANGO
02-06-2012, 04:50 PM
Definitely a conspiracy.

http://troll.me/images/conspiracy-keanu/its-a-conspiracy-thumb.jpg

Sofnr
02-06-2012, 04:51 PM
Rose averages 1.4 PF, which is less than Lebron or Wade. So why isn't there any threads about that? Bulls are also 30th in the league in PF, while Heat are only 10th. Surprising since Bulls play really aggressive on defence.

From what i can tell the Bulls are 29th with 17.3 per game and the Heat are 9th with 20.7 per game. I was a little surprised to see the Bulls that low although you would expect good defenses to average fewer fouls per game. They are better at their rotations and are less likely to be chasing players around and hacking them. The 5 teams who have the least Personal fouls are San Antonio, Chicago, Atlanta, Philadelphia, and Orlando. The Hawks, sixers, bulls, and magic are easily top 10 defensive teams.

Either way i don't think Heat or Bulls fans have a reason to yell conspiracy. On the other side of the coin Miami opponents average 22.4 personal fouls per game which is tied for third in the league and Chicago's opponents average 17.8 tied for 27th.

As far as D-Rose goes i'm a little surprised that number is that low but he's not a big risk taker on defense either. Rose also gets some star treatment. I don't think anyone is going to argue he doesn't. The main reason the heat havn't fouled out in 75 games is that they have three guys who get some star treatment. Lebron and Wade are also excellent defensively. Nobody else on the team really recieves enough minutes to foul out very often. Its weird they have gone 75 games without anyone fouling out but certainly doesn't mean the refs are favoring Miami.

http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/personal-fouls-per-game
http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/opponent-personal-fouls-per-game

Slade123
02-06-2012, 05:08 PM
Instead of saying wade/bro/bosh get special treatment, why not ask the last time any super star fouled out of a game (rose, Kobe, durant, etc). They hardly ever do. I could see Anthony easily fouling out but at end of games we usually go with bosh and haslem so Anthony is sometimes not even in there to foul out.

Because this thread is about how the Heat have not had a player foul out in 75 games. It has nothing to do with Kobe, the Lakers or any other team.

gotoHcarolina52
02-06-2012, 05:31 PM
Rose averages 1.4 PF, which is less than Lebron or Wade. So why isn't there any threads about that? Bulls are also 30th in the league in PF, while Heat are only 10th. Surprising since Bulls play really aggressive on defence.

:shush: Shhhhh. Don't tell anybody.

Sactown
02-06-2012, 11:00 PM
It seems like Shaq had more rings in LA than games fouled out... this is a stupid thread... It's obvious Star players get Star calls.. the more Star players a team has the more benefit of the doubt they're going to get.. it's really not a big deal. I remember watching the Kings and the Nuggets and Melo had 5 fouls and blatantly hit Greene and later Beno and nothing was called because fans come to see the star players play not sit on the bench.. it has and always will be this way

Wade>You
02-07-2012, 12:46 AM
Not sure if anyone's mentioned this yet but its an NBA record since the start of the shot clock era "1954 I think"...Lot of love from the ref's? good coaching? just luck?Spo, he let's the refs dictate his lineups. Anytime a player is in foul trouble, Spobot immediately sends him to the bench and waits for the appropriate time listed in his "Coaching for Dummies" manual before he puts that player back in the game.

MTar786
02-07-2012, 03:11 AM
It seems like Shaq had more rings in LA than games fouled out... this is a stupid thread... It's obvious Star players get Star calls.. the more Star players a team has the more benefit of the doubt they're going to get.. it's really not a big deal. I remember watching the Kings and the Nuggets and Melo had 5 fouls and blatantly hit Greene and later Beno and nothing was called because fans come to see the star players play not sit on the bench.. it has and always will be this way

actually shaq fouled out a lot for us. also, kobe didnt get the superstar treatment on offense as shaq did. but in miami thy still give lebron and wade the same amount as superstar treatment even though theyre on the same team. watever.. its no surprise though. this is how the nba works.
the couple years kobe got lebron like treatment he averaged 36 and 32 lol.. then went back down to 6-7 ft attempts per game

North Yorker
03-04-2012, 06:57 PM
Well, the streak is over.

koberulesall
03-04-2012, 07:21 PM
its cause the league wants them to win ......also when lebron hurt his ankle in todays game in the 4th, was it just me? or did anyone else hope it was broke and he was out for the year?

koberulesall
03-04-2012, 07:24 PM
Why is this thread still alive

hey look its one of thos huge "hardcore heat fans" that have been around all the way dating to last summer:clap::clap::clap::clap:

Davidgta1
03-04-2012, 07:25 PM
I though it was 86 games?

LA_Raiders
03-04-2012, 07:33 PM
Basketball reasons...

spreadeagle
03-04-2012, 07:41 PM
I though it was 86 games?

I made this thread weeks ago lol

Young2Kinsler
03-04-2012, 07:56 PM
Refs ****in cheated

YoungOne
03-04-2012, 07:57 PM
finally :D

Davidgta1
03-04-2012, 08:00 PM
I made this thread weeks ago lol

Well don't I feel like a dumb dumb now lmao

CHANGO
03-04-2012, 08:06 PM
its cause the league wants them to win ......also when lebron hurt his ankle in todays game in the 4th, was it just me? or did anyone else hope it was broke and he was out for the year?

:facepalm::facepalm:

Lakers + Giants
03-04-2012, 08:24 PM
its cause the league wants them to win ......also when lebron hurt his ankle in todays game in the 4th, was it just me? or did anyone else hope it was broke and he was out for the year?

Pretty stupid **** to say to be honest.

spreadeagle
03-04-2012, 09:23 PM
Im not a Heat fan or hater,I enjoy watching them play,so many highlights but damn the refs just do not call many fouls on them and Bron and Wade seem to complain so much whenever there is one called on them too

H_HEAZY
03-04-2012, 09:47 PM
The Heat are the best team in the league

justinnum1
03-04-2012, 11:05 PM
The Heat are the best team in the league

touché

beliges
03-04-2012, 11:10 PM
When youre that talented, that athletic and that good defensively, youre not gonna foul out too often. Today, Miami just got outmatched by the Lakers. They were missing Bosh badly. Furthermore, Kobe outplayed both LBJ and Wade. Lakers played great D and Wade was frustrated and out of control for long durations in this game. As a result, he fouled out.

LAKobeBryant
03-04-2012, 11:27 PM
The Heat are the best team in the league

did you start cheering for the heats the same date as you registered for PSD

Aust
03-04-2012, 11:58 PM
LMAO @ the haters.

LMAO @ the homers.

KB-Pau-DH2012
03-05-2012, 12:04 AM
Miami's theme:

All I do is foul foul foul foul and get away with it....until now. ;)

beliges
03-05-2012, 12:10 AM
The Heat are the best team in the league

Actually, so far this season the Thunder are the best team in the league followed by the Bulls. But the Heat are certainly the most talented team in the league. That does not make them the best team in the league however.

BULLSFAN0810
03-05-2012, 12:56 AM
i dont wanna diss...but 88 games? with all those holes downlow? joel anthony ,shotblocker that he is hasnt fouled out? Frontrunners? or good coaching/playing?

C_Mund
03-05-2012, 01:27 AM
I'm no Miami fan and this stat is pretty eye-opening HOWEVER....

The big 3 play a ton of minutes. Bosh is great at showing on pick and rolls but doesn't bang inside a ton for a pf. That takes care of that.
Lebron and Wade are both very athletic and strong to go along with incredible defensive awareness. It's understandable that these two would foul less than the league average because of their ability to keep their man in front of them on the outside and body up on the interior.
Also, having smart veterans like Battier and Miller helps the rest of the team because rotations are air-tight so the team is able to avoid fouling situations.

Just a couple thoughts. I'd like to see somebody foul out in the first quarter next game though

Raph12
03-05-2012, 03:12 AM
I knew Wade would be the first to break this record, he's just so aggressive on both ends, it was inevitable.

smiddy012
03-05-2012, 04:38 AM
I just wish Rose got calls like LBJ & Wade, he consistently gets whacked in the head like it's his business.

BULLSFAN0810
03-05-2012, 04:54 AM
I just wish Rose got calls like LBJ & Wade, he consistently gets whacked in the head like it's his business.

When youre good,they dont call the foul bc you fought through it to get a very good shot off therefore the foul doesnt seem to happen,or the foul doesnt seem to effect your shot at first glance.......or it could be;hes that good that the refs get caught watching in awe....I think a little of both.

kdspurman
03-05-2012, 11:20 AM
I just wish Rose got calls like LBJ & Wade, he consistently gets whacked in the head like it's his business.

The reason he doesn't is because Wade and James flail their arms up in the air and scream and get the fouled called. It's disgraceful to watch sometimes lol, but that's what usually happens.

USAF_AMMO
03-05-2012, 11:55 AM
The reason he doesn't is because Wade and James flail their arms up in the air and scream and get the fouled called. It's disgraceful to watch sometimes lol, but that's what usually happens.

100% correct.