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View Full Version : Can Someone Explain To Me The Final Time How TPE Can Be Used



KB-Pau-DH2012
01-30-2012, 08:11 PM
I was trying this trade on ESPN Trade Machine, and it seems like in certain situations, even with multi-player trades, they allow me to use the TPE.

As an example

I traded:

Dwight Howard and Jameer Nelson to the Lakers


Andrew Bynum, Andrew Goudelock, Devin Ebanks, Derrick Caracter, Darius Morris, Matt Barnes and $8.6 of the 8.9 Lamar Odom TPE to the Magic


When I was doing the trade (before adding in the TPE), there was a TPE option to use on Jameer Nelson's salary, which allowed this trade to become successful.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7gsejf9




So someone please explain to me in general why people keep saying you can't use TPE in a combination with any other player, but ESPN trade machine allows me to do so?



Any explanation would be helpful. Thanks!

Kevj77
01-30-2012, 08:31 PM
The trade machine is wrong I guess because you can't add the TPE with players or other TPE to complete a trade. You can use it in seperate moves.

Lakers could use the TPE and a pick to get Jameer in a seperate deal assuming he makes less than the value of the exception and then in another deal land Howard for Bynum, players and picks, but it can't be one big deal using players and the TPE. It could all probably be negotiated as one big deal just pulled of as two trades.

Orlando wouldn't take that deal though.

Corey
01-30-2012, 08:32 PM
Lakers can acquire a player making the TPE or less without having to trade a player of matching salary in return.

Easiest way to look at it.

KB-Pau-DH2012
01-30-2012, 08:32 PM
The trade machine is wrong I guess because you can't add the TPE with players or other TPE to complete a trade. You can use it in seperate moves.

Lakers could use the TPE and a pick to get Jameer in a seperate deal assuming he makes less than the value of the exception and then in another deal land Howard for Bynum, players and picks, but it can't be one big deal using players and the TPE. It could all probably be negotiated as one big deal just pulled of as two trades.

Orlando wouldn't take that deal though.

Thank you for clarifying, appreciate it.

bholly
01-30-2012, 09:41 PM
Yeah. The combination rules are essentially:
1. You can't combine the TPE with other exceptions or cap space to get a bigger contract. Eg if you have a $4m TPE and $3m cap space, you can't just take on a $7m contract - the only thing you can use the TPE for it contracts of $4m or less.

2. You only get a TPE if you're trading a player by himself. If you trade away a $10m player and take back $2m in salary you get an $8.1m TPE (the $8m difference + $100k). If you trade two $5m players and take back $2m in salary you get no TPE. [Of course in that case they'd organize it as a $5m for $2m trade and a separate $5m for nothing trade, which would give them a $3.1m TPE from the first and a $5m TPE from the second.]

It's also worth nothing that TPEs don't move. A trade can simultaneously use up one team's TPE, while creating another for the other team, but there's a (sometimes very subtle) difference between that and one TPE moving between teams.

So, yeah. In your example it would likely be organized as Dwight for pretty much all those Lakers' in one deal, then Jameer for nothing in the other. The first is just a regular trade. In the second the Lakers use $8.6m of the LO TPE to absorb Jameer, and the Magic would get a $8.7m TPE for sending out Jameer's $8.6m contract and not taking anything back.
I know in this case it looks like the TPE is just moving from LA to Orlando and growing a little bit, because the effect is the essentially the same as what's actually happening, but there are situations where it makes a significant difference and the way the trade machine shows it is misleading.

Kevj77
01-30-2012, 10:07 PM
bholly one thing I'm unclear about is can you use the TPE to trade for a player making under 8.9 million and throw in a draft pick. Can the Lakers trade for Jameer or any other PG with the TPE and a first round pick.

I know it can't be combined with other exceptions, cap space or players. I'm unclear about if picks can be involved.

bholly
01-31-2012, 12:15 AM
You mean can the Lakers send the Magic a pick?
The short answer: Absolutely.

The long answer: Of course - that's how they sent LO to Dallas and got a TPE in the first place - Dallas had a trade exception from Sign+Trading Chandler to NYK, so they traded a first rounder to LAL for a second rounder and LO. Dallas used their TPE from Chandler to absorb LO, and because the Lakers were sending out LO and not taking any salary back they got a TPE of their own. Whether or not there are draft picks doesn't even factor into it - the TPE is just a salary thing and draft picks count as $0.

The rule doesn't even really stop you from sending players out when you're using a TPE - it just says you can't combine the players' outgoing salary with the TPE to bring in a bigger salary.
For example, say you want to bring in a $10m player. Usually (if you're over the cap) you have to match salaries (or at least within 125% + $100k, or whatever the new rule is). So you could trade a $6m player and a $4m player for a $10m player, right?
All this rule says is that you can't combine TPEs with salaries in that way. You can't combine a $6m TPE with a $4m player to bring in a $10m player. That's the rule. You can combine multiple contracts to match salaries with a bigger contract, but you can't combine a TPE with a contract to match salaries with a bigger contract. That's it.

So, in practice, you can really do whatever you want, as long as you aren't using a TPE as part of the salary matching on a bigger contract.
In the example, the Lakers could take on as many picks from the Magic, or send as many picks to the Magic, as they want, because picks have no bearing on salary matching or TPEs.
They could also use the TPE to absorb multiple players (maybe a first round pick for Reddick and Orton, because combined they still fit into the TPE).
The Lakers could even send players to the Magic, eg Fisher for Jameer. The salaries don't match, so they couldn't do it straight up without a TPE, but with the TPE they could organize it as two trades and get it done. In one trade, the Lakers get Jameer for nothing, using the Odom TPE to absorb his salary. This gives the Magic an $8.7m TPE (because they sent out Jameer's $8.6m contract without taking anything back, and you add $100k to it). Then, in a second deal, the Lakers would send Fisher to the Magic for nothing, which the Magic can do by fitting him into their newly created Jameer TPE.

So yeah. They can send/receive picks all they like, and they can send/receive players all they like. The only thing they can't do is use the TPE as part of the salary matching to bring in a contract bigger than the TPE.