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xnick5757
12-21-2011, 05:52 PM
insider article so I won't post what he wrote but these are his rankings:

1.) Heat
2.) Bulls
3.) Celtics
4.) Magic
5.) 76ers
6.) Pacers
7.) Knicks
8.) Bucks
9.) Hawks
10.) Nets
t11.) Wizards
t11.) Pistons
13.) Raptors
14.) Cavaliers
15.) Bobcats


what do you think?

PacersForLife
12-21-2011, 05:55 PM
This could be how it turns out, you never know, but it's unlikely. Just depends on how teams develop with new players. The Knicks could very well end up being a top 3 seed it just all depends.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 05:57 PM
Obviously the Magic drop a bit if Dwight is traded. The Knicks and Pacers should be switched as well.

d nuggets fan
12-21-2011, 05:57 PM
First 3 seem right, but I think it is a toss-up for the next 5. Knicks and Pacers seem to have a better chance to be in the top 5 probably.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 05:58 PM
Obviously Knicks fans will throw a fit because he put them 7th, but here is his reasoning, which is hard to disagree with


This might seem pessimistic in light of the hype coming from Gotham, but in the short term, I'm not sure the Knicks have dramatically improved. They've essentially traded Chauncey Billups for Tyson Chandler, which will help, but this is the wrong season to have a thin bench and brittle stars. Between Amare Stoudemire's knees and Chandler's toes, the Knicks are likely to feel the brunt of the schedule-makers' wrath.

Baron Davis, despite his weaknesses, will prove quite useful when he's able to play. Mike D'Antoni's system demands a point guard who can pass, and Davis can do that when he's not jacking up 3s with 20 on the shot clock. It's even more important given the Knicks' other high-profile moves -- they boast three of the best frontcourt finishers in the game, but nobody to get them the ball.

I factored half a season of Davis into my projection, figuring he will miss more than a quarter of the season with his current back injury and then some more with his next injury. When he's out, the Knicks have Toney Douglas running the point, which is less than ideal. While I like him as a player, he's a bad fit at the point in this system because he's blind as a bat.

Otherwise, the roster is a bit of a mess. Landry Fields and Iman Shumpert are nice prospects but aren't ready to be top-seven players on a contending team. Jared Jeffries and Renaldo Balkman are the top two frontcourt reserves. Really. And at some point the Knicks will have to play Mike Bibby in a real game.

About the best thing New York has going for it is, well, New York. Players are lured by the city, and, as with the Lakers, the Knicks have a great shot at signing any decent veteran who shakes free during the season via buyout, waivers or departure from China. Better yet, the Knicks still have their $2.5 million "under-cap" exception lying around to use on such a player.

Nonetheless, I have trouble envisioning a high seed for this team. The Knicks get more dangerous once the playoffs begin. If their three frontcourt stars and Davis make it to May upright, they'll be a very difficult first-round out. Getting to that point is the problem.

theheatles
12-21-2011, 06:00 PM
knicks and magic should switch, as well as the sixers and pacers

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:01 PM
Basically, most fans are sleeping on the fact that this 66 game season in 135 days will absolutely tear up teams with minimal depth. This is also why he has Denver #2 in the west, because they go 10 deep, 11 when Wilson Chandler comes back.

Depth and health are so much bigger factors this season than normally. Can Amare's knees take a game every other day essentially? Starters minutes will be reduced across the board in the NBA. Teams with depth will prevail in the regular season. Come playoff time, games will be spaced out, and you shorten your rotation

Mr Costanza
12-21-2011, 06:02 PM
Id say there is a .01% chance he is right about the Knicks being a 7th seed. ;)

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 06:11 PM
This guy is the perfect description of someone who is book smart with absolutely no common sense.

RLundi
12-21-2011, 06:12 PM
I think Knicks should be fourth (by default) Magic fifth (Dwight depending) Hawks sixth and Pacers seventh with the Sixers being eighth.

VillaMaravilla
12-21-2011, 06:15 PM
im no homer but even the are biggest haters got to admit there is no way we finish 7th......

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:17 PM
Instead of calling a guy who watches more basketball than any of you an idiot, please explain why you think so.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:19 PM
im no homer but even the are biggest haters got to admit there is no way we finish 7th......

I think its a bit low, but he is dead on. You have zero depth, and will be relying on the health of 2 frontcourt players who have had health concerns.

Again, so many of you don't understand what toll all these games with no rest will have on teams with no depth. And the Knicks have ZERO depth.

tcav701
12-21-2011, 06:21 PM
Not bad for a Hollinger list...

flip NY and IND tho

More-Than-Most
12-21-2011, 06:22 PM
Holy hell the sixers are getting love... JRUE is Jebus

I hope we trade iggy and become a lottery team to be honest.

uprightciti
12-21-2011, 06:22 PM
hollinger is a nut job who the hell pays for the crap he talks about

Jetsguy
12-21-2011, 06:23 PM
Basically, most fans are sleeping on the fact that this 66 game season in 135 days will absolutely tear up teams with minimal depth. This is also why he has Denver #2 in the west, because they go 10 deep, 11 when Wilson Chandler comes back.

Depth and health are so much bigger factors this season than normally. Can Amare's knees take a game every other day essentially? Starters minutes will be reduced across the board in the NBA. Teams with depth will prevail in the regular season. Come playoff time, games will be spaced out, and you shorten your rotation

why do you think he has it effecting the Knicks so greatly and seemingly not the Celtics at all who are ancient with much less depth than they have had in a long time.

Dolfan305
12-21-2011, 06:23 PM
It's beyond me why anyone would pay to read this guys ****

uprightciti
12-21-2011, 06:25 PM
1.) Heat
2.) Bulls
3.) 76ers
4.) Knicks
5.) Celtics
6.) Magic
7.) Pacers
8.) Hawks
9.) Nets
10.) Bucks
t11.) Wizards
t11.) Pistons
13.) Bobcats
14.) Cavaliers
15.) Raptors

Mr Costanza
12-21-2011, 06:26 PM
Instead of calling a guy who watches more basketball than any of you an idiot, please explain why you think so.

I wasnt calling anyone an idiot, i was making a joke about his davis odds. I agree that this will be a very tiring season for the knicks but i cant see them falling below 6. And for the record defending him to knick fans will get you nowhere. For most using hollinger and idiot in the same sentence is redundant.

Smaxor5
12-21-2011, 06:32 PM
Celtics have as much depth as the knicks right now with 3 older players (one of whom has terrible knees) carrying them.......and the knicks are 7th while they're THIRD!?!?

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:32 PM
why do you think he has it effecting the Knicks so greatly and seemingly not the Celtics at all who are ancient with much less depth than they have had in a long time.

Celtics play far better defense. I am not saying I agree with the Knicks being all the way down at 7th, but with their depth and no back court really, they will probably not be getting HCA in round 1 of the playoffs.

The Celtics do sport more depth than the Knicks btw.

Chandler, Amare, Melo. Then what? Honestly. Shumpert hasn't played a game yet, Fields is nice, but not a huge difference maker. Douglas is as average as you get. Baron will miss more than 20 games most likely with his current injury and not being healthy enough to play every other night basically, Bibby sucks, Balkman eats minutes, doesn't do much else, etc.

Honestly, if this were an 82 game season, the Knicks would be in my top 3-4 out east. But in this shortened season where Melo and Amare's minutes MUST be limited, they will have some pretty sorry looking lineups out there at times.

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 06:33 PM
I think its a bit low, but he is dead on. You have zero depth, and will be relying on the health of 2 frontcourt players who have had health concerns.

Again, so many of you don't understand what toll all these games with no rest will have on teams with no depth. And the Knicks have ZERO depth.

Even if Melo or Amar'e or Chandler go down these guys will finish better than 7th. If there is one team that I think that is prepared for this its the Knicks because he routintely runs 7 or 8 man rotations thru a wall in an 82 game schedule.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:35 PM
I wasnt calling anyone an idiot, i was making a joke about his davis odds. I agree that this will be a very tiring season for the knicks but i cant see them falling below 6. And for the record defending him to knick fans will get you nowhere. For most using hollinger and idiot in the same sentence is redundant.

Oh I understand arguing the irrational Knicks fans is pointless, but there are plenty of great Knicks fans here worth discussing this topic with.

I do think come playoff time, when the games are spaced out, and rotations shorten, if they have a healthy Baron Davis and their 3 frontcourt players made it through the season healthy, they will be a VERY tough out for anyone.

But we aren't talking about the playoffs. We are talking about a grueling 66 game schedule with 23 back to backs and 2 back-back-back's for the Knicks, all in 134 days. That takes a monster toll on a team with no depth. Lakers will see the same thing happen to them.

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 06:35 PM
Also Bucks>Nets?? Really? I dunno

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:36 PM
Even if Melo or Amar'e or Chandler go down these guys will finish better than 7th. If there is one team that I think that is prepared for this its the Knicks because he routintely runs 7 or 8 man rotations thru a wall in an 82 game schedule.

If the Knicks run a 7-8 man rotation in this season, they will have zero left come playoff time dude. You guys have got to stop viewing this like a regular season, where you routinely get 2 days off between games, sometimes 3 or 4. That isn't happening this year.

Mr Costanza
12-21-2011, 06:37 PM
Even if Melo or Amar'e or Chandler go down these guys will finish better than 7th. If there is one team that I think that is prepared for this its the Knicks because he routintely runs 7 or 8 man rotations thru a wall in an 82 game schedule.

Running a 7-8 man rotation with this schedule is suicide.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:38 PM
Also Bucks>Nets?? Really? I dunno

meh, the case can be made. The Bucks were destroyed by injuries last season. They play defense, and they have depth (that word will continue to be used this season).

Corey
12-21-2011, 06:39 PM
I dont think the Hawks will finish 9th, and Orlando is a bit high for my liking.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:43 PM
I think he got the Sixers just about right honestly.

beasted86
12-21-2011, 06:44 PM
Getting away from the top rankings, I personally think the Bobcats should be dead last. They have the least amount of paper talent top to bottom, and are undersized. They also play in a tough division.

beardown4243
12-21-2011, 06:45 PM
IMO the Knicks and the Hawks should be higher than the Pacers and the Sixers. Yeah if Melo goes down then that changes, but if D Rose or Lebron get injured it's the same thing. Everyone keeps talking about depth because of the schedule, then the Heat shouldn't be ranked first because they have less depth than any team in the East.

EaglesJackson10
12-21-2011, 06:50 PM
I think he got the Sixers just about right honestly.

Agreed. They could be 4th depending on what happens with Dwight. The top 2 teams to me seem pretty clear and I still think the Celtics will be up there despite losing Green.

EaglesJackson10
12-21-2011, 06:51 PM
IMO the Knicks and the Hawks should be higher than the Pacers and the Sixers. Yeah if Melo goes down then that changes, but if D Rose or Lebron get injured it's the same thing. Everyone keeps talking about depth because of the schedule, then the Heat shouldn't be ranked first because they have less depth than any team in the East.

Their depth isn't the only problem. The other problem is that they don't play defense. I know that Chandler will help but they still aren't a very good defensive team.

Jetsguy
12-21-2011, 06:53 PM
Celtics play far better defense. I am not saying I agree with the Knicks being all the way down at 7th, but with their depth and no back court really, they will probably not be getting HCA in round 1 of the playoffs.

The Celtics do sport more depth than the Knicks btw.

Chandler, Amare, Melo. Then what? Honestly. Shumpert hasn't played a game yet, Fields is nice, but not a huge difference maker. Douglas is as average as you get. Baron will miss more than 20 games most likely with his current injury and not being healthy enough to play every other night basically, Bibby sucks, Balkman eats minutes, doesn't do much else, etc.

Honestly, if this were an 82 game season, the Knicks would be in my top 3-4 out east. But in this shortened season where Melo and Amare's minutes MUST be limited, they will have some pretty sorry looking lineups out there at times.

I can not see an effect a 66 game season will have on the Knicks is would not on the Celtics. And honestly beyond Bass what bench do the Celts have? Trust me I am certainly not going to argue the Knicks have a good bench (although it is better than what they ended wth last year) It just seems he is picking and choosing a little.

I think the two will be close this year and I would not be surprised to see the C's at 3, I just dont see how th knicks are more in a bad way for a 66 game season that any other team in the league honestly

KKell2507
12-21-2011, 06:54 PM
The deeper the team, the better they will be this year. Thats why the Bulls win the east again this year.

Also I would not be surprised at all to see the Sixers in the top 4. Not one analyst has said a thing about them yet, and theres reason. Because they made no moves at all, they only got 1 year older. They have there top 12 scorers back from last year. And they might be the deepest or close to deepest team in the east. Theyll have 6-7 guys in double figures, 3 of which could be coming off the bench in Lou Williams, Thad Young, and Evan Turner. The Sixers may be the only team in the east that could lose any of their 5 starters and not miss a beat. Sixers are my 4 seed in the east.

Slimsim
12-21-2011, 06:55 PM
One thing i notice is that When NY get a player that was injured once before they seem to always bring it up in some article. Never hear people talk about wade past injuries, cp3, Blake griffin, boozer, and many others. Always Amare and now Tyson never would have thought Tyson was injury prone last year with Dallas now that he's a kNICK lets bring it up. Almost feel like they are jinxing it than being informative.

NYKSpiritBomb
12-21-2011, 06:58 PM
hate is derived from love and jealousy

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 06:59 PM
I can not see an effect a 66 game season will have on the Knicks is would not on the Celtics. And honestly beyond Bass what bench do the Celts have? Trust me I am certainly not going to argue the Knicks have a good bench (although it is better than what they ended wth last year) It just seems he is picking and choosing a little.

I think the two will be close this year and I would not be surprised to see the C's at 3, I just dont see how th knicks are more in a bad way for a 66 game season that any other team in the league honestly

The Celtics play great defense, remember that. Let's look at both bench's.

Knicks:
Douglas (for 25 games at least, he probably starts)
Shumpert
Fields
Balkman
Jefferies

Celtics:
Bass
Daniels
Wilcox
O'Neal
Pavlovic
Dooling

And again, factor in defense, defense, defense.

P Styles
12-21-2011, 07:00 PM
Whenever someone described the Knicks they give a "glass-half-empty" analysis.

Then when they describe the team they support it's a "glass-half-full" analysis.

It's tiresome, but whatever. The Knicks aren't the only team in the league with players who have undergone surgery, or a thin bench, and aren't the only team playing a compressed 66 game schedule.

These rankings are pointless though, and getting upset over them is even more pointless.

I'm hoping for a good season, and have enough reason to believe that we will fare better than the 7th seed.

beasted86
12-21-2011, 07:01 PM
IMO the Knicks and the Hawks should be higher than the Pacers and the Sixers. Yeah if Melo goes down then that changes, but if D Rose or Lebron get injured it's the same thing. Everyone keeps talking about depth because of the schedule, then the Heat shouldn't be ranked first because they have less depth than any team in the East.

The HEAT play elite defense. Even if one of our scorers go down we can still play hard and compete with the best of them.

The same can't be said about the Knicks. Aside from that, you need to wake up and realize the HEAT have more depth than the Knicks, even if they aren't the deepest bench in the league. Haslem is better than anyone on the Knicks bench, same goes for Shane Battier... that's kind of sad when you think of it. Neither of those guys are 6th man of the year type candidates, but they are markedly better than anything the Knicks have.

Slimsim
12-21-2011, 07:04 PM
The HEAT play elite defense. Even if one of our scorers go down we can still play hard and compete with the best of them.

The same can't be said about the Knicks. Aside from that, you need to wake up and realize the HEAT have more depth than the Knicks, even if they aren't the deepest bench in the league. Haslem is better than anyone on the Knicks bench, same goes for Shane Battier... that's kind of sad when you think of it. Neither of those guys are 6th man of the year type candidates, but they are markedly better than anything the Knicks have.

Iman > Heats bench

Sig it i don't give a ****

sjbirds
12-21-2011, 07:05 PM
i think bos is gonna slide down... i believe this sprint of a season is gonna hurt them because of their age

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 07:06 PM
One thing i notice is that When NY get a player that was injured once before they seem to always bring it up in some article. Never hear people talk about wade past injuries, cp3, Blake griffin, boozer, and many others. Always Amare and now Tyson never would have thought Tyson was injury prone last year with Dallas now that he's a kNICK lets bring it up. Almost feel like they are jinxing it than being informative.

well, its just the fact that there are so many games in such little time, that those who have had injuries in the past, may see some of those flare up again. That being said, Amare hasn't had issues in years. But their minutes will go down, every starters will. That is why depth and bench's are so important this year, which the Knicks lack. Hell, a lot of teams that have been good a long time will get hurt by this season. Knicks, and Lakers will probably be hurt quite a bit.

But as I said, come playoff time, it won't matter. The games are spaced out, and the starters will play 40 minutes if they need to.

rwynyc
12-21-2011, 07:06 PM
I dont buy the too tired bit a 100%

These are professional athletes in their 20's.

I was playing ball competitive 2 hours a day up until I was 31

Plus the knicks have a couple of more bench guys then a lot of you are listing and a 2.5 million exception they are still looking to use.

Knicks heat ECF count it

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:07 PM
IMO the Knicks and the Hawks should be higher than the Pacers and the Sixers. Yeah if Melo goes down then that changes, but if D Rose or Lebron get injured it's the same thing. Everyone keeps talking about depth because of the schedule, then the Heat shouldn't be ranked first because they have less depth than any team in the East.

wat r u smoking heats have the worst depth in the east they dnt have the best but Battier n Haslem alone r better then any bench player the Knicks HAve right now

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 07:07 PM
I could easily see Boston below #3 if any of their key players suffers an injury, and with that age across the big 3, that is more likely than not.

oak2455
12-21-2011, 07:07 PM
Good job Hollinger.....he picked the Eagles too....I love the hate see yaa in June

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 07:08 PM
I dont buy the too tired bit a 100%

These are professional athletes in their 20's.

I was playing ball competitive 2 hours a day up until I was 31

Plus the knicks have a couple of more bench guys then a lot of you are listing and a 2.5 million exception they are still looking to use.

Knicks heat ECF count it

playing at the Y, and playing NBA basketball, is a world of difference bro.

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:10 PM
One thing i notice is that When NY get a player that was injured once before they seem to always bring it up in some article. Never hear people talk about wade past injuries, cp3, Blake griffin, boozer, and many others. Always Amare and now Tyson never would have thought Tyson was injury prone last year with Dallas now that he's a kNICK lets bring it up. Almost feel like they are jinxing it than being informative.

they always talk bout thier injuries like wade is to reckless n to injury prone same for cp3 wen their were rumors about him going to laker they were saying their big 3 all have knee problems

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 07:10 PM
meh, the case can be made. The Bucks were destroyed by injuries last season. They play defense, and they have depth (that word will continue to be used this season).
So do the Nets now though and Bucks have absolutely no one like D-Will. And he wants to talk about some teams being injury prone? Bogut has missed 72 games in 3 seasons and Brandon Jennings is a chucker.

Slimsim
12-21-2011, 07:10 PM
well, its just the fact that there are so many games in such little time, that those who have had injuries in the past, may see some of those flare up again. That being said, Amare hasn't had issues in years. But their minutes will go down, every starters will. That is why depth and bench's are so important this year, which the Knicks lack. Hell, a lot of teams that have been good a long time will get hurt by this season. Knicks, and Lakers will probably be hurt quite a bit.

But as I said, come playoff time, it won't matter. The games are spaced out, and the starters will play 40 minutes if they need to.

I understand that i just wish they are more consistent. If your going to make previous injury a factor into ranking teams at least do it for everyone Bring up boozer for Chicago, or even Wade in Miami not just single out Amare.

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:11 PM
i still see Knicks finishing 3 or 4 in the east

rwynyc
12-21-2011, 07:13 PM
playing at the Y, and playing NBA basketball, is a world of difference bro.

I agree but I didnt play at the Y. I played all over NYC where the talent was at least college level. I am not talking bout running pick up games with scrubs. Real deal competition.

We can agree to disagree but I think fatigue is being blown out of proportion. It will def be a factor but not to the level a lot are making it.

Slimsim
12-21-2011, 07:14 PM
they always talk bout thier injuries like wade is to reckless n to injury prone same for cp3 wen their were rumors about him going to laker they were saying their big 3 all have knee problems

I never seen a article saying If wade can stay healthy Miami should be the favorites. And only once have I heard Cp3 injuries mention and that's when the knicks was still in the hunt for Cp3

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:16 PM
I never seen a article saying If wade can stay healthy Miami should be the favorites. And only once have I heard Cp3 injuries mention and that's when the knicks was still in the hunt for Cp3

they talked alot about wades health when miami big 3 first formed saying if wade or bosh go down its over because there bothe injury prone they never played a full season and etc

Evolution23
12-21-2011, 07:18 PM
I think its a bit low, but he is dead on. You have zero depth, and will be relying on the health of 2 frontcourt players who have had health concerns.

Again, so many of you don't understand what toll all these games with no rest will have on teams with no depth. And the Knicks have ZERO depth.

hahahahaha Knicks at 7. What a joke!

Heediot
12-21-2011, 07:20 PM
Too much math involved and not enough intuition and feel.

Cal827
12-21-2011, 07:20 PM
I guess I'm the only one that sees the end for the Celtics. No way they are the three seed. Maybe 5th or 6th.

Mr Costanza
12-21-2011, 07:22 PM
wat r u smoking heats have the worst depth in the east they dnt have the best but Battier n Haslem alone r better then any bench player the Knicks HAve right now

You clearly havent seen Bill Walker's skills lately, have you?

Owned.

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:23 PM
You clearly havent seen Bill Walker's skills lately, have you?

Owned.

Bill Walker :facepalm:

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 07:24 PM
I guess I'm the only one that sees the end for the Celtics. No way they are the three seed. Maybe 5th or 6th.

I do to. They'd have trouble staying healthy in an 82 game schedule. No jeff green and no Deltone West and no Big Baby. They aren't as deep. They are going to be on their last legs come March

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 07:26 PM
Good job Hollinger.....he picked the Eagles too....I love the hate see yaa in June

Ugghh I wouldnt exactly call him out on that one yet. Eagles win out they are in. Felix Jones probs out btw.

Mr Costanza
12-21-2011, 07:31 PM
Bill Walker :facepalm:

Harrellson, Green, JEFFRIES, i could go on if you like.

MTL_123
12-21-2011, 07:33 PM
Harrellson, Green, JEFFRIES, i could go on if you like.

lol ya wat u got name me this crazy bench that the KNicks have :D

EaglesJackson10
12-21-2011, 07:34 PM
Ugghh I wouldnt exactly call him out on that one yet. Eagles win out they are in. Felix Jones probs out btw.

Unfortunately this isn't true. They need the Jets to beat the Giants and the Giants to beat the Cowboys also. Hollinger also didn't say that. He's an NBA analyst. He's just pissed because someone made a good argument for why the Knicks are overhyped.

Slimsim
12-21-2011, 07:35 PM
Bill Walker :facepalm:

walker has talent

Jared jeffires :facepalm:

CubbieBlueprint
12-21-2011, 07:38 PM
Id say there is a .01% chance he is right about the Knicks being a 7th seed. ;)

As a Bulls fan, I will take this chances

SteBO
12-21-2011, 07:45 PM
Hollinger is giving legit reasoning as to why he's putting NY at 7, but I still kinda disagree with him on the spot. Granted this season is going to be far from the way we're used to as NBA fans, but at the end of the day the Knicks are much better team than 7th.

waveycrockett
12-21-2011, 07:49 PM
Unfortunately this isn't true. They need the Jets to beat the Giants and the Giants to beat the Cowboys also. Hollinger also didn't say that. He's an NBA analyst. He's just pissed because someone made a good argument for why the Knicks are overhyped.

As a Giants fan gotta say there is a great chance of that happening.

KingShango
12-21-2011, 08:00 PM
One thing i notice is that When NY get a player that was injured once before they seem to always bring it up in some article. Never hear people talk about wade past injuries, cp3, Blake griffin, boozer, and many others. Always Amare and now Tyson never would have thought Tyson was injury prone last year with Dallas now that he's a kNICK lets bring it up. Almost feel like they are jinxing it than being informative.

u r 100% right

sixer04fan
12-21-2011, 08:10 PM
Good job Hollinger.....he picked the Eagles too....I love the hate see yaa in June

Ugghh I wouldnt exactly call him out on that one yet. Eagles win out they are in. Felix Jones probs out btw.

Need the Jets to beat the Giants this week too.

wjmoffatt
12-21-2011, 08:41 PM
1.) Heat
2.) Knicks
3.) Pacers
4.) Bulls
5.) 76ers
6.) C's
7.) Hawks
8.) Magic

*Not as of now, how i think the power rankings will be by the time the playoffs start!

PacersForLife
12-21-2011, 08:47 PM
1.) Heat
2.) Bulls
3.) 76ers
4.) Knicks
5.) Celtics
6.) Magic
7.) Pacers
8.) Hawks
9.) Nets
10.) Bucks
t11.) Wizards
t11.) Pistons
13.) Bobcats
14.) Cavaliers
15.) Raptors

76ers at 3? Really going out on a limb there.

PacersForLife
12-21-2011, 08:49 PM
1.) Heat
2.) Knicks
3.) Pacers
4.) Bulls
5.) 76ers
6.) C's
7.) Hawks
8.) Magic

*Not as of now, how i think the power rankings will be by the time the playoffs start!

Rip Hamilton only looks to make the Bulls better, they will be at least a 2 seed.

1. Heat
2. Bulls
3. Knicks
4. Magic (with Dwight)
5. Pacers
6. 76ers
7. Celtics
8. Bucks

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:02 PM
So do the Nets now though and Bucks have absolutely no one like D-Will. And he wants to talk about some teams being injury prone? Bogut has missed 72 games in 3 seasons and Brandon Jennings is a chucker.

Bucks play defense, and he is projecting his ratings from Bogut being better than he was. Look, I don't personally think the Knicks will fall all the way to #7 seed, but its tough to think that with their depth issues, and the fact that they will not be able to play their starters the normal minutes they get, the Knicks are far better built for the playoffs than they are the regular season.

Depth is going to be more important than ever this regular season, and the Knicks lack it big time.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:04 PM
I understand that i just wish they are more consistent. If your going to make previous injury a factor into ranking teams at least do it for everyone Bring up boozer for Chicago, or even Wade in Miami not just single out Amare.

Oh I agree to an extent. However just a short time ago Chandler failed a physical due to his toe, and having microscopic knee surgery is a big deal compared to a typical injury. That being said, Amare hasn't shown any setbacks for years, so as long as his minutes are reduced, he will be fine. But that is the problem. Taking minutes from Amare and Chandler (which you MUST do), leaves a lot of garbage on the floor at times.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:05 PM
I agree but I didnt play at the Y. I played all over NYC where the talent was at least college level. I am not talking bout running pick up games with scrubs. Real deal competition.

We can agree to disagree but I think fatigue is being blown out of proportion. It will def be a factor but not to the level a lot are making it.

Its been shown though man. During the last lockout, teams with depth survived, and the overall quality of play was down, because players were so beat up after 50 games. A 6'10", 260 lb man takes a bit more of a beating than a normal person.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:06 PM
hahahahaha Knicks at 7. What a joke!

why are you replying to me with that nonsense? Where did I say they would finish 7th? I am simply saying his reasoning for the Knicks not being a top team out east are dead on.

theheatles
12-21-2011, 09:07 PM
I agree but I didnt play at the Y. I played all over NYC where the talent was at least college level. I am not talking bout running pick up games with scrubs. Real deal competition.

We can agree to disagree but I think fatigue is being blown out of proportion. It will def be a factor but not to the level a lot are making it.

LOL so you were playing with bum college players...you can't compare yourself to NBA players...The NBA is the most exclusive professional sports league in the world and they have the biggest and most physically gifted human specimens on earth.

ChiSox219
12-21-2011, 09:20 PM
I am not a fan of projecting injuries or anything like that. The Heat grabbed the 1 seed last shortened season and they certainly weren't young and I don't remember them being particularly deep.

No doubt the schedule is grueling but depth is getting overrated. Come post season, if you are rested because of depth, that might make a difference but I don't think it will be a huge factor in the standings that seemingly everyone is making it out to be, the teams will talent will win.

VillaMaravilla
12-21-2011, 09:21 PM
I think its a bit low, but he is dead on. You have zero depth, and will be relying on the health of 2 frontcourt players who have had health concerns.

Again, so many of you don't understand what toll all these games with no rest will have on teams with no depth. And the Knicks have ZERO depth.

but come on dude ive read a lot of your posts and you seam to know what your talking about but Dwayde is not injury prone and miami has depth? and Boston 3 with no big baby and no green and an unhappy Rondo it just doesnt make sense at all

VillaMaravilla
12-21-2011, 09:23 PM
at the end of the day I dont care where anyone puts us we need to do are talking on the court and thats it, we get in the playoffs and we will get in then thats where we will do our damage if we get in as the number 1 or the number 8 I really dont care, this is a team no one is going to want to face when it counts

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:29 PM
but come on dude ive read a lot of your posts and you seam to know what your talking about but Dwayde is not injury prone and miami has depth? and Boston 3 with no big baby and no green and an unhappy Rondo it just doesnt make sense at all

nope, I think it will hurt Miami to a degree as well, but their starting 5 just puts such a hurt down on most teams, they really aren't dependent on that 2nd unit like most teams will be. Its also a lot better this year than it was last year, with Battier, Haslem, Cole, House, Miller, etc. Not eye popping, but not the worst out there. Look at it this way. The Heat's top 3 players are easily better than the Knicks top 3 players. Even in their help is the same, that equals a decent amount of wins the Heat will have over the Knicks.

I am not calling Amare injury prone. I am saying his knee will need more rest than guys who have had typical injuries.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:31 PM
at the end of the day I dont care where anyone puts us we need to do are talking on the court and thats it, we get in the playoffs and we will get in then thats where we will do our damage if we get in as the number 1 or the number 8 I really dont care, this is a team no one is going to want to face when it counts

I have said this 3 times now. The Knicks are built MUCH better for the playoffs than a 66 game season in 135 days.

Raph12
12-21-2011, 09:31 PM
Magic finally getting some love, I expect Boston to drop out of the Top 4, given the shortened season, replaced by the Knicks... Magic will keep in the Top 4 until Dwight's traded, book it.

Hawkeye15
12-21-2011, 09:33 PM
I am not a fan of projecting injuries or anything like that. The Heat grabbed the 1 seed last shortened season and they certainly weren't young and I don't remember them being particularly deep.

No doubt the schedule is grueling but depth is getting overrated. Come post season, if you are rested because of depth, that might make a difference but I don't think it will be a huge factor in the standings that seemingly everyone is making it out to be, the teams will talent will win.

well, what will happen is teams like my Wolves will end up stealing a game against a contender where they had no business doing so, because the Wolves can run fresh legs at you all night, and that team may be playing their 4th game in 5 nights. I am not saying it will flip the standings upside down, depth that is. I am saying managing your players minutes is very high on the priorities of coach's, and teams with minimal depth will give up a few games they may not have otherwise.

akesh99
12-21-2011, 09:48 PM
IMO it'l be:

Heat
Bulls
Knicks
Celtics
Pacers
76ers
Hawks
Nets

beardown4243
12-21-2011, 10:17 PM
I think the Heat are the best team in the East (and the league), but I think the Bulls will finish the season with the most wins because of their depth. That being said, I think it is most important to get into the playoffs healthy and rested rather than going for the top seed.

ManRam
12-21-2011, 11:58 PM
For you Knick fans that are upset, Hollinger has done some defending of his pick on twitter just now...

40-42 last year, 14-14 with Melo, concerns about defense and depth in a condensed season...etc...

bholly
12-22-2011, 12:07 AM
Nice. I'm going to post the tweets for posterity.


Wow ... lot of angry Knicks fans out there. Picking a 42-40 team to go 35-31 is madness.

As opposed to the 14 of a year ago? RT @MattPMurphy18 How are the Celts 8 wins better than the Knicks?

Vastly better bench. Defense counts. RT @ib84 isaac How come "wrong season to have a thin bench and brittle stars" doesn't apply to Celtics?

Hate? No. Predict to do worse than their fan base does? Guilty. RT @StFlo87 why do you hate the Knicks?

Beat Vegas last year. They were pretty happy with that. RT @NotDrJ does ESPN hold u accountable when ur predictions are way off?


Except for the part where they were 14-14 with Melo RT @ERobertsNY They went 42-40 without Melo all year


From 1 gm behind last yr to 2 gms ahead. Insanity! RT @RobPerito picking 76ers to finish 2 spots ahead of knicks isnt madness?

SMALL MARKET WEST COAST BIAS!!! RT @chroKnick the ESPN extreme hatred for NYK has become ridiculous and quite obvious now.

D Roses Bulls
12-22-2011, 12:11 AM
As I said in the other thread that was closed down, Hollinger isn't credible. Don't ask me why because I fought this all last season and I stand by my arguments. If you wanna know why I think that way, go look at last seasons threads if they still exist. Anyone though with a brain knows you can not trust ESPN when it comes to analyzing sports in general. Just look at the whole thing with Jaws lately with monday night football, that man doesn't even believe half the things he says and I'm sure if that is common practice in the NFL section of the network, I'm sure it's common practices for most of the departments. The only one who seems to ever make sense at that network is Berry Melrose.

bholly
12-22-2011, 12:23 AM
As I said in the other thread that was closed down, Hollinger isn't credible. Don't ask me why because I fought this all last season and I stand by my arguments. If you wanna know why I think that way, go look at last seasons threads if they still exist. Anyone though with a brain knows you can not trust ESPN when it comes to analyzing sports in general. Just look at the whole thing with Jaws lately with monday night football, that man doesn't even believe half the things he says and I'm sure if that is common practice in the NFL section of the network, I'm sure it's common practices for most of the departments. The only one who seems to ever make sense at that network is Berry Melrose.

What was he wrong about last year that others weren't wrong about? Who was more accurate?

29$JerZ
12-22-2011, 12:29 AM
I'm surprised Hawkeye has responded this many times about the Knicks and not blow up :laugh2:

6th or 7th is what I feel NY will hover around. Terrible bench and NY got the worst part of the lockout by not having our chemistry from a midseason trade form. Then you throw in Chandler and an injured Baron there is just too much going against NY to
Be a top seed. I personally don't see what's wrong with that. If we are a low seed but are as talented as some claim we should have no problem
Taking on Chicago, Miami or Boston. To expect dominance with no depth or chemistry is foolish.

Sixerlover
12-22-2011, 12:30 AM
Safe to say I agree with everything EXCEPT Orlando 4th. Even if they have Dwight for the entire season, they don't have the depth or talent to maintain a top 4 team this season. Added the Dwight cloud will be following them all season. I can see Philly 4, Indy 5 (if ABSOLUTELY no injuries), NY 6 and Orlando 7

29$JerZ
12-22-2011, 12:31 AM
For you Knick fans that are upset, Hollinger has done some defending of his pick on twitter just now...

40-42 last year, 14-14 with Melo, concerns about defense and depth in a condensed season...etc...

Did he really tweet 40-42
We were 42-40

Hawkeye15
12-22-2011, 12:34 AM
I'm surprised Hawkeye has responded this many times about the Knicks and not blow up :laugh2:

6th or 7th is what I feel NY will hover around. Terrible bench and NY got the worst part of the lockout by not having our chemistry from a midseason trade form. Then you throw in Chandler and an injured Baron there is just too much going against NY to
Be a top seed. I personally don't see what's wrong with that. If we are a low seed but are as talented as some claim we should have no problem
Taking on Chicago, Miami or Boston. To expect dominance with no depth or chemistry is foolish.

nah man, I actually like a bunch of Knicks fans here. But yeah, his reasoning isn't flawed, I just don't agree with his exact placement in the east.

knicks=love
12-22-2011, 12:35 AM
Did he really tweet 40-42
We were 42-40

no he tweeted 42-40. the other guy is just dumb :p

D Roses Bulls
12-22-2011, 12:37 AM
What was he wrong about last year that others weren't wrong about? Who was more accurate?

oh please man don't get me writing a whole lot. Just go and try and find some of the threads that I even started on Hollinger last year in my archive.

Cali4rnia
12-22-2011, 12:37 AM
1.) Heat
2.) Bulls
3.) Celtics
4.) Magic
5.) Knicks
6.) 76ers.
7.) Hawks
8.) Pacers
9.) Milwaukee
10.) Nets
t11.) Wizards
t11.) Pistons
13.) Raptors
14.) Cavaliers
15.) Bobcats
I think that should be the list.

29$JerZ
12-22-2011, 12:44 AM
nah man, I actually like a bunch of Knicks fans here. But yeah, his reasoning isn't flawed, I just don't agree with his exact placement in the east.

I think it's a perfect ranking. Some really don't understand how a shortened season is terrible for guys like Amare and even Melo after his surgeries.

Teams who really benefit from this season are Minnesota and Denver who are filled with young talent and don't have much to lose by resting their best players.

Evolution23
12-22-2011, 09:33 AM
why are you replying to me with that nonsense? Where did I say they would finish 7th? I am simply saying his reasoning for the Knicks not being a top team out east are dead on.

Knicks will be a top 4 team. I am willing to bet money on it.

BklynKnicks3
12-22-2011, 09:39 AM
Hollinger is awful he is a math nerd who thinks he knows basketball iam not just saying that as a knick hater. Wojo is a knick hater but he is dead on often.

sintaks12
12-22-2011, 09:44 AM
Yeah, we have depth issues... but the Sixers, Pacers and Celtics don't? GTFO. Hollinger is a hack.

xxplayerxx23
12-22-2011, 09:46 AM
Dont disagree. I think we finish better but with our injury prone front court 66 games only and Back to back to back games arent going to go well for us. I say we finish top 4 but IMO 7 is that much of a strech going to take time to get things together, Davis hopefully will be back and step up. Doesnt mean come playoff time we can be hitting all stides and make a run in the playoffs. we dont know how this team will come out not a big deal for him saying were 7

mjm07
12-22-2011, 10:25 AM
The deeper the team, the better they will be this year. Thats why the Bulls win the east again this year.

Also I would not be surprised at all to see the Sixers in the top 4. Not one analyst has said a thing about them yet, and theres reason. Because they made no moves at all, they only got 1 year older. They have there top 12 scorers back from last year. And they might be the deepest or close to deepest team in the east. Theyll have 6-7 guys in double figures, 3 of which could be coming off the bench in Lou Williams, Thad Young, and Evan Turner. The Sixers may be the only team in the east that could lose any of their 5 starters and not miss a beat. Sixers are my 4 seed in the east.

If you meant have the best record in the East or NBA like last year you can have it. The HEAT won the east last year not the bulls.

xnick5757
12-22-2011, 10:50 AM
knicks fans seem to think that Melo, STAT, and Chandler will play 48 minutes a game this year.

when you are giving minutes to Mike Bibby, you know your bench is crap.

--23--
12-22-2011, 11:18 AM
I know why he put the Knicks at 7 but i think they will finish in the top 4, I would switch the Magic with the Knicks.

mike44
12-22-2011, 11:26 AM
Having the Hawks at 9 and Magic at 4 is a little suspect considering the Hawks beat the Magic in the playoffs last year.

Sixerlover
12-22-2011, 12:34 PM
Yeah, we have depth issues... but the Sixers, Pacers and Celtics don't? GTFO. Hollinger is a hack.

Sixers and Pacers are actually the complete opposite of the Knicks and Celtics. No huge names, but plenty of depth.

ttam68
12-22-2011, 12:36 PM
Having the Hawks at 9 and Magic at 4 is a little suspect considering the Hawks beat the Magic in the playoffs last year.

Obviously the Kansas City Chiefs will win the superbowl

sixer04fan
12-22-2011, 12:40 PM
Yeah, we have depth issues... but the Sixers, Pacers and Celtics don't? GTFO. Hollinger is a hack.

...do you have any idea what you're talking about? like, at all? The Sixers are universally known around the league to have great depth.

omdigga
12-22-2011, 12:53 PM
76er's are a solid team.. i think they take the next step this season.. i watched their last preseason game against the wizards and they have got some nice pieces.. and definitely good depth...

jrue holiday is a stud.. gonna make a name for himself as an elite pg this season..

SeoulBeatz
12-22-2011, 12:53 PM
Agreeing with Sixerfan.

Well the Celtics are seriously lacking in depth, but the Pacers and Sixers???

Jrue Holiday/ Lou Williams
Jodie Meeks/ Evan Turner
Andre Iguodala/ Craig Brackins/ Andres Nocioni
Elton Brand/ Thaddeus Young/ Lavoy Allen
Spencer Hawes/ Marreese Speights/ Nikola Vucevic

No superstars, but we have one of the deeper teams in the league. 3 guys on the bench are starters on other teams, that's probably the Sixers greatest strength.

Corey
12-22-2011, 12:56 PM
Sixers and Pacers are actually the complete opposite of the Knicks and Celtics. No huge names, but plenty of depth.

I was about to say the same. Those are two of the deeper teams.

I'm really high on Philly this year.

Celtics aren't as shallow as people think though. A bench with Dooling, Daniels, Wilcox and Bass isn't terrible. The loss of Green is what killed it.

SeoulBeatz
12-22-2011, 12:59 PM
I was about to say the same. Those are two of the deeper teams.

I'm really high on Philly this year.

Celtics aren't as shallow as people think though. A bench with Dooling, Daniels, Wilcox and Bass isn't terrible. The loss of Green is what killed it.

They just had some bad luck. Losing Green was a serious blow to that bench IMO. I don't trust Keyon Dooling, Daniels, or Wilcox. I really like Brandon Bass though, great pickup.

Edit: I think Avery Bradley and Etwan (spell?) Moore need a mention... those are probably the most intriguing names on that bench because if they can find roles this year they will definitely contribute more than keyon and daniels.

sixer04fan
12-22-2011, 01:00 PM
Not to mention the Sixers and Celtics actually play defense...

You know, defense, that thing that accounts for the entire other half of the sport of basketball? No? You don't know? That's ok...

mike44
12-22-2011, 01:16 PM
Obviously the Kansas City Chiefs will win the superbowl

The Hawks young players are still improving and Teague should emerge as a solid point guard in the league after his showing late in the season and in the playoffs. Plus Joe should be healthy this year and back to form so i don't see this team missing the playoffs. Don't really know what your comment means since the Hawks actually did beat the Magic last year and the Chiefs didn't win the Super bowl, or get close really.

xxplayerxx23
12-22-2011, 01:24 PM
Not to mention the Sixers and Celtics actually play defense...

You know, defense, that thing that accounts for the entire other half of the sport of basketball? No? You don't know? That's ok...

Oh thats ok We have a thing called Offense Ever heard of it? Dont worry we will get stops in keep places, and finish further then the 76ers :D

theDISH
12-22-2011, 01:33 PM
Having the Hawks at 9 and Magic at 4 is a little suspect considering the Hawks beat the Magic in the playoffs last year.

Have you seen the Hawks roster? They are not a playoff team. I mean hell they have T-Mac and Stackhouse on the roster.

sixer04fan
12-22-2011, 01:39 PM
Oh thats ok We have a thing called Offense Ever heard of it? Dont worry we will get stops in keep places, and finish further then the 76ers :D

We'll see... :D

I think we can all agree though that the Pacers should win the East easily considering Paul George grew 2 inches.

mike44
12-22-2011, 01:47 PM
Have you seen the Hawks roster? They are not a playoff team. I mean hell they have T-Mac and Stackhouse on the roster.

They still have the core of Horford, Smith, and Johnson. Johnson should be healthy this year and get back to form and Teague will be a solid point guard as he performed well in the playoffs and late in the season when actually given the chance. Horford has improved every year and i see him making this team his this year. Yeah, dont really understand the offseason signings either but hopefully they wont get much run. I see them getting the 6 or 7 seed.

xxplayerxx23
12-22-2011, 03:21 PM
We'll see... :D

I think we can all agree though that the Pacers should win the East easily considering Paul George grew 2 inches.

Ofcourse the pacers scare me out of my boxers :D

bovice163
12-22-2011, 03:23 PM
They still have the core of Horford, Smith, and Johnson. Johnson should be healthy this year and get back to form and Teague will be a solid point guard as he performed well in the playoffs and late in the season when actually given the chance. Horford has improved every year and i see him making this team his this year. Yeah, dont really understand the offseason signings either but hopefully they wont get much run. I see them getting the 6 or 7 seed.

People have been saying the same **** for the last 2-3 seasons. Everyone on the roster improved blah blah blah, when the fact of the matter is they can't get it done in the playoffs.

mike44
12-22-2011, 03:39 PM
People have been saying the same **** for the last 2-3 seasons. Everyone on the roster improved blah blah blah, when the fact of the matter is they can't get it done in the playoffs.

I never said they will get anything done in the playoffs... Just disputing the other poster who said they wont even make the playoffs. They have been to the second round 3 straight years but yeah i agree, don't see them doing much after the first round again.

Pierzynski4Prez
12-22-2011, 03:44 PM
Hawks are still a 45-50 win team, during an 82 game season that is.

shizzle09
12-22-2011, 06:02 PM
Knicks should be higher IMO. As high as #4

kozelkid
12-22-2011, 06:24 PM
Knicks should be higher IMO. As high as #4

I don't. Don't get me wrong, come postseason, I think they're the third or fourth most dangerous team. However, their lack of depth and necessity to rest injury prone guys like Amare and Chandler can really hurt them in this type of schedule. I really could see them as low as a sixth or seventh seed because of that.

Then again, with D'antoni on the hot seat, it wouldn't surprise me if he overplayed them only to see one of them go down due to injuries or else too tired to be at their best come the postseason.

This lockout is going to absolutely kill teams like NY, LA and Boston. Possibly Miami as well.

Meanwhile, teams like Indiana, Portland, Denver, Chicago, Minn, Philly, and OKC should really thrive from it.

It's also why I expect Chicago to ultimately repeat as the number one seed again. Miami can't afford, nor need to, overplay Lebron, Wade or Bosh.

Again, too many people here don't remember or didn't witness the '99 season. There's a reason why Knicks ended up as the 8th seed and yet ultimately dominated come playoff time.

It's also why people shouldn't sleep on SAS this year. If there's one team that is completely experienced with a shortened season, it's that coach and team.

Captain Moroni
12-23-2011, 03:01 AM
the anti-new york bias is real. thing is you can whine about it all you want, to shut them up, win. that is the magic potion. and the knicks will indeed win. get ready, sunday is coming fast!

Captain Moroni
12-23-2011, 03:05 AM
I don't. Don't get me wrong, come postseason, I think they're the third or fourth most dangerous team. However, their lack of depth and necessity to rest injury prone guys like Amare and Chandler can really hurt them in this type of schedule. I really could see them as low as a sixth or seventh seed because of that.

Then again, with D'antoni on the hot seat, it wouldn't surprise me if he overplayed them only to see one of them go down due to injuries or else too tired to be at their best come the postseason.

This lockout is going to absolutely kill teams like NY, LA and Boston. Possibly Miami as well.

Meanwhile, teams like Indiana, Portland, Denver, Chicago, Minn, Philly, and OKC should really thrive from it.

It's also why I expect Chicago to ultimately repeat as the number one seed again. Miami can't afford, nor need to, overplay Lebron, Wade or Bosh.


so let me get this straight, everyone else will suffer because their stars will be worn out except derrick rose?

D1JM
12-23-2011, 03:34 AM
so let me get this straight, everyone else will suffer because their stars will be worn out except derrick rose?

derrick rose is an immortal. he suffers no fatigue at all

toovey107
12-23-2011, 07:31 AM
Rose is too humble to suffer fatigue... whatever that is.

CELTICS4LYFE
12-23-2011, 09:41 AM
My biggest question is why is ORL ranked so high?? Mayb im having a brian fart but whats their "big 3" Howard Nelson n Davis???

Heatcheck
12-23-2011, 12:08 PM
Basically, most fans are sleeping on the fact that this 66 game season in 135 days will absolutely tear up teams with minimal depth. This is also why he has Denver #2 in the west, because they go 10 deep, 11 when Wilson Chandler comes back.

Depth and health are so much bigger factors this season than normally. Can Amare's knees take a game every other day essentially? Starters minutes will be reduced across the board in the NBA. Teams with depth will prevail in the regular season. Come playoff time, games will be spaced out, and you shorten your rotation

arent martin and smith in china til like march though?

Sixerlover
12-23-2011, 01:26 PM
Rose is too humble to suffer fatigue... whatever that is.

:laugh2:

This is true

beasted86
12-23-2011, 03:12 PM
I don't see how Hollinger has the 76ers 5th, but Atlanta 9th.

Can anyone give any details from the article that can explain how the Sixers jumped so far ahead of ATL?

Rockice_8
12-23-2011, 04:37 PM
IMO Hollinger is usually one of the best when it comes to assessments. I think the Knicks are low but they very well could be a seventh seed. Orlando, IND, Philly, and ATL are no pushovers, so one injury to that frontcourt and they could struggle with their lack of depth. If you remember last year they were a .500 team after Melo joined.

They are just that type of team that could end anywhere from the 2 seed to the 8 seed, I think they are the biggest jekyl and hyde team which makes it almost impossible to predict where they fall.

bholly
12-23-2011, 05:50 PM
As I said in the other thread that was closed down, Hollinger isn't credible. Don't ask me why because I fought this all last season and I stand by my arguments. If you wanna know why I think that way, go look at last seasons threads if they still exist. Anyone though with a brain knows you can not trust ESPN when it comes to analyzing sports in general. Just look at the whole thing with Jaws lately with monday night football, that man doesn't even believe half the things he says and I'm sure if that is common practice in the NFL section of the network, I'm sure it's common practices for most of the departments. The only one who seems to ever make sense at that network is Berry Melrose.

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?t=680191

nate2usmc
12-23-2011, 06:14 PM
Idc what seed Knicks are, as long as they're in the playoffs...HEALTHY. That's all I want from this season. Next season, however, I have higher expectations.

theDISH
12-23-2011, 06:41 PM
I don't see how Hollinger has the 76ers 5th, but Atlanta 9th.

Can anyone give any details from the article that can explain how the Sixers jumped so far ahead of ATL?

Sixers are better. Hawks just arent that good. Josh Smith is overrated, Horford is good but hes nothing too special. They lost Crawford and Bibby and replaced em with McGrady and Stackhouse lol. Also giving Teague big minutes for the first time in his career. Sixers went 38-28 to finish the season last year and there are big expectations for Holiday and Turner. Sixers also are one of the best defensive teams in the East and certainly the deepest.

bholly
12-23-2011, 06:52 PM
Oh, wow, the Hawks signed Stackhouse? I had no idea, haha. That's awesome.

KnicksR4Real
12-23-2011, 07:07 PM
I think its a bit low, but he is dead on. You have zero depth, and will be relying on the health of 2 frontcourt players who have had health concerns.

Again, so many of you don't understand what toll all these games with no rest will have on teams with no depth. And the Knicks have ZERO depth.

The Heat were the same last year. Not saying were at that level, but two top ten players, a top 2 defensive player, a all rookie team shooting guard, and a piece of crap deserve better than the 7th seed. We also have shumpert coming in, baron davis, mike bibby and harrelson.

beasted86
12-23-2011, 07:10 PM
Sixers are better. Hawks just arent that good. Josh Smith is overrated, Horford is good but hes nothing too special. They lost Crawford and Bibby and replaced em with McGrady and Stackhouse lol. Also giving Teague big minutes for the first time in his career. Sixers went 38-28 to finish the season last year and there are big expectations for Holiday and Turner. Sixers also are one of the best defensive teams in the East and certainly the deepest.

Well they actually went 18-17 post all-star break. Don't see what's so special about that.

I also remember clearly there was the same type of talk in 2009. In 2008 the Sixers started the season 23-30, then went on a strong streak after the break finishing 17-12 in the 2nd half and 40-42 total. People thought the team was headed to new heights and started a hoopla when Elton Brand signed there... then the team proceeded to only go 41-41 only a 1 game win improvement.

So forgive me if I'm not ready to buy in yet.

For one, they replaced Bibby with Kirk Hinrich (that was the actual trade buddy :facepalm:). Next, some of the same Hawks players you just talked about are probably better than any individual on that whole Philly team. Joe Johnson is probably more talented than any player the Sixers have on the whole team. Al Horford, the same applies. I can make a very solid argument for Smith being equal or possibly better than both Igoudala and Holiday who are the Sixers best players.

justinnum1
12-23-2011, 07:13 PM
The Heat were the same last year. Not saying were at that level, but two top ten players, a top 2 defensive player, a all rookie team shooting guard, and a piece of crap deserve better than the 7th seed. We also have shumpert coming in, baron davis, mike bibby and harrelson.

no. melo is borderline top 10 amare is not top 10

bholly
12-23-2011, 07:27 PM
The Heat were the same last year. Not saying were at that level, but two top ten players, a top 2 defensive player, a all rookie team shooting guard, and a piece of crap deserve better than the 7th seed. We also have shumpert coming in, baron davis, mike bibby and harrelson.

I really almost hate to do this, but the Heat had two top 5 players, two MVP candidates. The Knicks have two players that Knicks fans think are top 10, but almost everyone else (PSD rankings, ESPN rankings, SI rankings) calls 11-15 or so (Melo occasionally squeezes into #10).

Don't get me wrong, I think everyone agrees the Knicks have gotten together an impressive amount of talent, but exaggerating it doesn't help your argument - it only makes people disregard it.

arkanian215
12-23-2011, 07:28 PM
Now that Brook Lopez is injured and the Nets acquired Memo Okur, where do the Nets go in this ranking?

theDISH
12-23-2011, 07:47 PM
Well they actually went 18-17 post all-star break. Don't see what's so special about that.

I also remember clearly there was the same type of talk in 2009. In 2008 the Sixers started the season 23-30, then went on a strong streak after the break finishing 17-12 in the 2nd half and 40-42 total. People thought the team was headed to new heights and started a hoopla when Elton Brand signed there... then the team proceeded to only go 41-41 only a 1 game win improvement.

So forgive me if I'm not ready to buy in yet.

For one, they replaced Bibby with Kirk Hinrich (that was the actual trade buddy :facepalm:). Next, some of the same Hawks players you just talked about are probably better than any individual on that whole Philly team. Joe Johnson is probably more talented than any player the Sixers have on the whole team. Al Horford, the same applies. I can make a very solid argument for Smith being equal or possibly better than both Igoudala and Holiday who are the Sixers best players.

I was mistaken with Hinrich my bad. But get real dude Josh Smith isnt nearly as good as Iggy and he is a 10x worse shooter. Brand is better then Horford, yes long term I would take Horford but Brand it a better player right now. Joe Johnson is among the most overpaid/rated players in the league. Max deal for a 20-22 ppg guy who does nothing else. We have seen the best of the Hawks and their best is mediocre. Yes the Sixers are viewed by most as mediocre but they will change that perception this year.

beasted86
12-23-2011, 07:52 PM
I was mistaken with Hinrich my bad. But get real dude Josh Smith isnt nearly as good as Iggy and he is a 10x worse shooter. Brand is better then Horford, yes long term I would take Horford but Brand it a better player right now. Joe Johnson is among the most overpaid/rated players in the league. Max deal for a 20-22 ppg guy who does nothing else. We have seen the best of the Hawks and their best is mediocre. Yes the Sixers are viewed by most as mediocre but they will change that perception this year.

Josh Smith "isn't nearly" as good as Igoudala? Are we watching the same players, looking at the same stats?

It's one thing to override their shooting stats completely and claim he's a better shooter, but to say there is such a far gap between the two players that Smith "isn't nearly as good as Iggy" is quite laughable.

Whoever you are, it's pretty clear you have some sort of bias that isn't allowing you to see these comparisons clearly. Brand better than Horford right now?

Yeah, I'm done discussing this topic with you.

bholly
12-23-2011, 08:25 PM
Yeah, Brand > Horford is super lol. I want to live in that world.