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View Full Version : Were the 2007 Suns robbed of a NBA title?



JordansBulls
12-06-2011, 05:42 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2007/series?series=saspho
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200705160PHO.html



Stoudemire and Diaw were suspended for the game by the NBA for leaving the bench area following Robert Horry's flagrant foul on Nash with 18 seconds left in Game 4.

"We were short-handed," Nash said, "and you can look at it any way you want. I've definitely been self-critical the last 20 minutes or half-hour, but it was a lot to ask I guess when you look back. We needed more out of each of us and we just didn't have it."


Suns nearly won that game without Amare or Diaw. Let's say they won game 5 with Amare and Diaw there and lost game 6, do you think they win game 7 vs the Spurs that year at home and eventually the title?

People always use other teams winning titles as an asterick but I don't ever see anyone say this was an asterick so to speak for the Spurs as they benefited an entire series from a cheap shot that caused the Suns to lose there arguable best player for game 5.

KB-Pau-DH2012
12-06-2011, 05:49 PM
All hypothetical. They "could've" won this game or that game. Sadly, sports and life do not work that way.

Bruno
12-06-2011, 05:54 PM
I wouldn't call amare their best player, but imo the outcome of the series was cheapened.

doesn't take anything away from the spurs title- not like they were one and dones. The Spurs could have taken that game seven. but yea, it's a shame.

Hawkeye15
12-06-2011, 05:55 PM
All hypothetical. They "could've" won this game or that game. Sadly, sports and life do not work that way.

for sure this.

Now, do I think the Suns would have won game 7 personally? Yes I do.

SteBO
12-06-2011, 05:57 PM
I wouldn't go that far considering they would have to get through another round in the WC playoffs, but I do agree that Phoenix was heavily short-changed. Can't take anything away from the Spurs though.......

smith&wesson
12-06-2011, 06:02 PM
That was a distastfull foul... and i really beleive the suns would have taken that series. never liked or respected horry after that.

SteBO
12-06-2011, 06:05 PM
And yeah, I do believe the Suns would've taken that series. Amare and Nash were baliin' big time in that series. Those suspensions really stalled their momentum.....

seikou8
12-06-2011, 06:06 PM
its over time to move on its like when toney douglas got tripped in game 1 on ray allen game winning 3. there are so many blowen call its not funny its life the better team won on that day.

Joshtd1
12-06-2011, 06:25 PM
I swear I've seen this thread on more than one occasion from you JB..c'mon.

Who knows, but I am going to say no. We won 3 outta 4 games WITH them having Amare and Diaw. Who's to say that we wouldn't have won that game 5th game where they were suspended had they played anyway?

mdm692
12-06-2011, 06:29 PM
Whatever lets just put 2 asterisks next to the 2007 spurs title and the lockout one.

Joshtd1
12-06-2011, 06:33 PM
Whatever lets just put 2 asterisks next to the 2007 spurs title and the lockout one.

The lockout one? The one where we had to win the same amount of playoff games to win a title as every other team? Guess whoever wins this years title should have an asterisk as well. Sure

I guess every other team thats committed a flagrant foul on another team and ended up winning a title should have an asterisk as well.

king4day
12-06-2011, 06:34 PM
Do we really have to do this?
Amar'e and Diaw violated the rules no matter how much they need changing.

GhostfaceDrilla
12-06-2011, 06:36 PM
1. Steve Nash was always their best player.
2. Prime Shawn Marion was better than prime Amare.
3. Cheap *** shot by Horry but rules are rules.
4. I still believe Spurs would have won.
5. Could Phoenix's weak defense have stopped Cleveland? LeBron sure wouldn't have had the **** series he had against San Antonio.

Joshtd1
12-06-2011, 06:38 PM
Do we really have to do this?
Amar'e and Diaw violated the rules no matter how much they need changing.

Agreed, I shouldn't have taken the bait since I've seen this topic way too many times, and I've seen it more than once from JB.

king4day
12-06-2011, 06:40 PM
its over time to move on its like when toney douglas got tripped in game 1 on ray allen game winning 3. there are so many blowen call its not funny its life the better team won on that day.

I don't think anyone remembers this :)

king4day
12-06-2011, 06:42 PM
Agreed, I shouldn't have taken the bait since I've seen this topic way too many times, and I've seen it more than once from JB.

I didn't mean for my post to seem directed towards you if that's how it came off.

For Suns fans, this was the hardest thing to deal with as fans since it probably was our best crack at a ring. I hate when this is brought back up.

nyKnicks126
12-06-2011, 06:42 PM
1. Steve Nash was always their best player.
2. Prime Shawn Marion was better than prime Amare.
3. Cheap *** shot by Horry but rules are rules.
4. I still believe Spurs would have won.
5. Could Phoenix's weak defense have stopped Cleveland? LeBron sure wouldn't have had the **** series he had against San Antonio.

:facepalm:

Posts like these make this forum look bad.

king4day
12-06-2011, 06:44 PM
1. Steve Nash was always their best player.
2. Prime Shawn Marion was better than prime Amare.
3. Cheap *** shot by Horry but rules are rules.
4. I still believe Spurs would have won.
5. Could Phoenix's weak defense have stopped Cleveland? LeBron sure wouldn't have had the **** series he had against San Antonio.

We still would have had to face the Jazz which wouldn't have been easy.
We swept the Cavs that season if I recall correctly. I don't think it would have been a sweep but I don't think the Suns would have lost to the Cleveland.

nyKnicks126
12-06-2011, 06:44 PM
Suns would have won.. But that's the NBA..

Joshtd1
12-06-2011, 06:46 PM
I didn't mean for my post to seem directed towards you if that's how it came off.

For Suns fans, this was the hardest thing to deal with as fans since it probably was our best crack at a ring. I hate when this is brought back up.

No I didn't feel you did, but just stating in general. I usually try to avoid stuff like this since it always seems to take away from what we did. Who knows what would have happen. Suns could have easily won game 5 and outcome is different, or Spurs could have won game 5 and it been the same way.

I just hate seeing the same stuff over and over when its been discussed to death.

GhostfaceDrilla
12-06-2011, 06:48 PM
:facepalm:

Posts like these make this forum look bad.

ummm how exactly does me saying Nash is the best player and saying Cleveland would have won make the NBA forum look bad?

Carmelo Anthony is the best. Is that the answer you wanted to hear? Damn..

nyKnicks126
12-06-2011, 06:50 PM
ummm how exactly does me saying Nash is the best player and saying Cleveland would have won make the NBA forum look bad?

Carmelo Anthony is the best. Is that the answer you wanted to hear? Damn..
Prime Marion is better than Prime Amar'e Stoudemire?
From a Mavericks point of view maybe, since you are the one that has Marion now.

king4day
12-06-2011, 06:50 PM
No I didn't feel you did, but just stating in general. I usually try to avoid stuff like this since it always seems to take away from what we did. Who knows what would have happen. Suns could have easily won game 5 and outcome is different, or Spurs could have won game 5 and it been the same way.

I just hate seeing the same stuff over and over when its been discussed to death.

I think we had discussed this back when it actually happend too. You and another Spurs regular were cool about it.

GhostfaceDrilla
12-06-2011, 06:53 PM
Prime Marion is better than Prime Amar'e Stoudemire?

Marion from 2000-2007 was an easy 20/10 guy who was an elite defender.

Amare averaged about 24-25 ppg and wasn't nearly as good a rebounder as Marion was. Oh and he played absolutely ZERO defense.

Yes. Prime Phoenix Shawn Marion was better than prime Phoenix Amare Stoudemire.

Ebbs
12-06-2011, 06:53 PM
I believe 100% they win that series if that garbage rule didn't screw them. Title is difficult to say

nyKnicks126
12-06-2011, 06:57 PM
Marion from 2000-2007 was an easy 20/10 guy who was an elite defender.

Amare averaged about 24-25 ppg and wasn't nearly as good a rebounder as Marion was. Oh and he played absolutely ZERO defense.

Yes. Prime Phoenix Shawn Marion was better than prime Phoenix Amare Stoudemire.

You just proved that you make this forum look bad, I won't waste my time posting to you after this post..

GhostfaceDrilla
12-06-2011, 06:59 PM
You just proved that you make this forum look bad, I won't waste my time posting to you after this post..

What did I say that was wrong? At all? Go look at Marion and Amare's stats. Exactly what I just said. And Amare plays no defense. Ask any Suns fan. You should know as well since he played for your team last year. Offense isn't everything.... Amare scored. Marion did it all.

mdm692
12-06-2011, 07:10 PM
Didnt that ex-referee write a book in which he stated how the refs rigged games vs the suns because they didnt like the owner.

Hawkeye15
12-06-2011, 07:13 PM
That was a distastfull foul... and i really beleive the suns would have taken that series. never liked or respected horry after that.

you respected Horry before that? Guy is a douche, has been since he was in Houston.

Joshtd1
12-06-2011, 07:16 PM
you respected Horry before that? Guy is a douche, has been since he was in Houston.

Teams usually need a tough player like him. But yes I will agree he was an ***, thought it was in Phoenix though that he started before Houston.

Edit: Nevermind, he was in Phoenix after Houston. Thought he played there before for some reason.

GodsSon
12-06-2011, 07:21 PM
The Suns definitely got screwed out of that series win. Would they have won the title? Who knows. But with Marion locking down LeBron, they would have had a real good chance.

CrasH-X
12-06-2011, 07:29 PM
One of my worst memories as an NBA fan .. How things could have been if the Suns made it to the promise land .

Bruno
12-06-2011, 07:41 PM
IMO if the suns got past san antonio the title was theirs. utah and cleveland would have been no problem. no sweeps, but victories in six.

Chronz
12-06-2011, 07:46 PM
They werent the best team and werent favored so Ill stick with the odds.

RevisIsland
12-06-2011, 08:14 PM
Yea but between them, the '06 Mavs and '02 Kings it's not like there weren't plenty of teams that were robbed of titles.

jneises21
12-06-2011, 08:35 PM
I'm still butthurt about the kings vs lakers game 6 in 2002. I'm not even a kings fan, but they got absolutely ****ed. They were the most fun team to watch that i've seen.

evadatam5150
12-06-2011, 09:10 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs2007/series?series=saspho
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200705160PHO.html



Suns nearly won that game without Amare or Diaw. Let's say they won game 5 with Amare and Diaw there and lost game 6, do you think they win game 7 vs the Spurs that year at home and eventually the title?

People always use other teams winning titles as an asterick but I don't ever see anyone say this was an asterick so to speak for the Spurs as they benefited an entire series from a cheap shot that caused the Suns to lose there arguable best player for game 5.

LOL... This is a joke right...?? The Suns robbed...??? Epic.. :clap::clap::clap:

Hangtime
12-06-2011, 11:57 PM
Horry committed a cheap shot and was punished for it. Diaw and Stoudamire left the bench when the rules clearly state not to. Didn't anyone learn anything from the Miami/Ny brawl in 97?

It's their own damn fault.

basketfan4life
12-07-2011, 03:47 AM
Talking about getting ****ed by refs? boston vs lakers 2008 period

3ballbomber
12-07-2011, 04:34 AM
It was a fix, period!

JohnnyOutcast
12-07-2011, 10:30 AM
The Suns defense absolutely robbed them of a title.

OA SLAY
12-07-2011, 11:01 AM
Nope, it's impposible to lose when it's fixed... Ask the Lakers

Da Knicks
12-07-2011, 12:02 PM
Talking about getting ****ed by refs? boston vs lakers 2008 period

? DIDNT CATCH THAT ONE...WHAT HAPPENED?:confused:

whitemamba33
12-07-2011, 12:40 PM
An * next to Spurs 2007 win for a flagrant foul?

I find it funny that so many fans complain about how the league has gotten "soft". Apparently, some of the fans have gotten even softer.

If we are going to start giving *'s every time a player commits a hard foul in the playoffs, we need to reevaluate the 80's.

heyman321
12-07-2011, 12:50 PM
An * next to Spurs 2007 win for a flagrant foul?

I find it funny that so many fans complain about how the league has gotten "soft". Apparently, some of the fans have gotten even softer.

If we are going to start giving *'s every time a player commits a hard foul in the playoffs, we need to reevaluate the 80's.

It wasn't the foul per se genius, it was that Amare and Diaw were suspended, when Amare was balling out of his mind and Diaw was their center.

kdspurman
12-07-2011, 12:56 PM
An * next to Spurs 2007 win for a flagrant foul?

I find it funny that so many fans complain about how the league has gotten "soft". Apparently, some of the fans have gotten even softer.

If we are going to start giving *'s every time a player commits a hard foul in the playoffs, we need to reevaluate the 80's.

Not to mention a flagrant that Nash admitted to flopping. Believe me I wish no one got suspended that series, and I honestly don't think Horry should've been suspended 2 games for that. But rules are in place even if they aren't the best.That moment, the Spurs coaches all restrained their players while the Suns all got up and ran over there.


http://vimeo.com/12834943

OA SLAY
12-07-2011, 01:30 PM
That's complete BS you can't suspend players during the WCF

braveniler58
12-07-2011, 01:44 PM
Yeah, the Suns were.

kdspurman
12-07-2011, 02:00 PM
That's complete BS you can't suspend players during the WCF

That's not the best logic... So what you're saying is the rules should be "bent" based off the circumstances? Like if guys fight or throw a punch during the WCF or Finals, then they should not be punished cause of the situation?

That hurts the credibility of the league, and makes it seem like they are not enforcing the rules. While I don't agree entirely with the rule, it's the fault of the Suns coaching staff for not being aware, and restraining their players.

Ty Fast
12-07-2011, 02:05 PM
they still lost game 6 with amare. how bout when zo got suspended for the 5th game againts the knicks?

OA SLAY
12-07-2011, 04:04 PM
That's not the best logic... So what you're saying is the rules should be "bent" based off the circumstances? Like if guys fight or throw a punch during the WCF or Finals, then they should not be punished cause of the situation?

That hurts the credibility of the league, and makes it seem like they are not enforcing the rules. While I don't agree entirely with the rule, it's the fault of the Suns coaching staff for not being aware, and restraining their players.

What hurts the credibIlity is suspending players for no reason at the peak of the season. This wouldn't happen in another league and was a complete over reaction stemming from the malice in the palace...BS

kdspurman
12-07-2011, 04:19 PM
What hurts the credibIlity is suspending players for no reason at the peak of the season. This wouldn't happen in another league and was a complete over reaction stemming from the malice in the palace...BS

For no reason? If you leave the bench area during an altercation you will be suspended. That's a rule. Those guys broke that rule. While I agree it probably is an overreaction, you can't blame them for keeping the safety of the players/officials in mind.

That's how things happen, when 2 sides come charging at each other, in the heat of the moment things happen. Remember the Knicks/Nuggets game? Guys leaving the bench, no good can come of that.

The Bradley
12-07-2011, 05:27 PM
Didnt that ex-referee write a book in which he stated how the refs rigged games vs the suns because they didnt like the owner.

He did. He talked about how the Sun's, Heat's and Maverick's owners were jerks so most of the refs would screw those teams over in the playoffs.

kdspurman
12-07-2011, 05:45 PM
He did. He talked about how the Sun's, Heat's and Maverick's owners were jerks so most of the refs would screw those teams over in the playoffs.

Right, only this particular incident had nothing to do with the refs. If Amare/Diaw stay put, then they aren't suspended. It's on them and the Sun's coaching staff 100%.

OA SLAY
12-08-2011, 02:30 AM
Leaving the bench to restrain one of your teamates = Suspension...
Your right.
Silly Me.

mdm692
12-08-2011, 02:43 AM
That's not the best logic... So what you're saying is the rules should be "bent" based off the circumstances? Like if guys fight or throw a punch during the WCF or Finals, then they should not be punished cause of the situation?

That hurts the credibility of the league, and makes it seem like they are not enforcing the rules. While I don't agree entirely with the rule, it's the fault of the Suns coaching staff for not being aware, and restraining their players.

all they did was get up to check on steve nash they walked to where the coaches usually stand. Yeah that is bs now if they would of gone all the way to where nash and horry were then yeah suspensions but they didnt. They got suspended for getting up and taking 2 steps.

kdspurman
12-08-2011, 10:20 AM
all they did was get up to check on steve nash they walked to where the coaches usually stand. Yeah that is bs now if they would of gone all the way to where nash and horry were then yeah suspensions but they didnt. They got suspended for getting up and taking 2 steps.

I get we're all fans, but seriously, getting up and taking 2 steps? They got from the bench to where the incident happened. They were on the court, by the scores table.

Amare even came up with that lame excuse that he was going to "check in" the game. Seriously? He got up and ran over there, he didnt get up and take 2 steps. In case you need a refresher here you go... It's clear as day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnSxGriD6GA