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View Full Version : OT: Why won’t NFL owners open their books to players?



Wade>You
11-17-2011, 07:12 AM
This article was written around the NFL lockout when their players where asking the owners to prove they were incurring losses by opening up their books.

Why won’t NFL owners open their books to players? (http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/why-wont-nfl-owners-open-their-books-to-players/2011/03/10/ABXqYZQ_story_1.html)
The owners contend that as private businesses, they are not obligated to lay out all their financial data. Experts say, however, their reticence is likely driven at least in part by a desire to avoid the controversy or embarrassment that could result from giving players access to detailed and specific data on how each team spends its money.

That concern may have increased after detailed financial records from seven Major League Baseball teams became public last year, revealing questionable expenditures and apparent accounting tricks by team owners.

...

Major League Baseball, meantime, took a public relations hit when financial information about several of its teams was released last year. In May, divorce court records showed that two sons of Dodgers owner Frank McCourt were on the payroll for a combined $600,000, though one was reportedly enrolled at Stanford business school and the other worked for Goldman Sachs in New York.

Records also showed the team was charging itself $14 million in rent on land it already owned; and that a consulting company known as the John McCourt Company had raked in some $4 million over 18 months, according to published reports.

More disclosures followed in August, when detailed financial statements from the Florida Marlins, Pittsburgh Pirates, Tampa Bay Rays, Los Angeles Angels, Texas Rangers and Seattle Mariners were posted on the Web site Deadspin. The records showed that some teams that had been operating shoestring payrolls, collecting large sums from the league’s shared revenue pool and begging for publicly funded stadiums had, in fact, been making significant annual profits.

This one was around the time that MLB financials were leaked.

Marlins execs funneled cash to themselves (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-marlinsfinancials082810)

So programmed is that statement in Samson’s head, he keeps repeating it, like a robot with a shorted circuit. He’s right. Jeffrey Loria did not put a dollar in his pocket.

He put millions.

On Page 34 of the documents, under the heading Note Y, is a transaction called “Management Fee.” A corporation named Double Play Company is listed as the Marlins’ managing general partner. The partner is paid a yearly sum. For the two years the documents cover, the fees were $2.6 million and $2.8 million. In 2009, the documents say, the fee was raised to $3.2 million.

Records from the Florida Division of Corporations show Double Play’s CEO is Jeffrey Loria. Its president is David Samson.

...

In 2008, the Marlins spent $9.8 million on marketing, according to their balance sheet. The Tampa Bay Rays spent $23 million, the Pittsburgh Pirates $17.1 million, the Texas Rangers $16 million and the Los Angeles Angels $10 million. The only team to budget less among the six whose financials were leaked was the Seattle Mariners, whom the Marlins outspent by $11,000.

This isn’t a white lie here, a fib there. It is systemic. Marlins mislead, public follows. The balance sheet was a gift to Miami-Dade County taxpayers who deserve – and have deserved since the “yes” vote – to know how the team they were endowing is run.

The poor, poor Marlins had an operating profit of $48.9 million in 2008 and 2009, including $11.1 million last year, when they increased payroll and started paying off their stadium debt. Loria has already doubled his money on the Marlins – he bought the team for $158.5 million, including a $38.5 million interest-free loan, and it’s now worth $317 million, according to Forbes’ valuations – and the revenue streams from the new stadium should only increase that figure. A county hemorrhaging jobs funneled tax money to fund a stadium for a team with a reckless disregard for its community’s welfare.

No wonder owners don't want to open up their books, even when they are claiming to be losing money. It'd be great to see how much of this is going on in not just the NBA, but in all sports.

Hellcrooner
11-17-2011, 11:57 AM
This article was written around the NFL lockout when their players where asking the owners to prove they were incurring losses by opening up their books.

Why won’t NFL owners open their books to players? (http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/why-wont-nfl-owners-open-their-books-to-players/2011/03/10/ABXqYZQ_story_1.html)

This one was around the time that MLB financials were leaked.

Marlins execs funneled cash to themselves (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-marlinsfinancials082810)


No wonder owners don't want to open up their books, even when they are claiming to be losing money. It'd be great to see how much of this is going on in not just the NBA, but in all sports.

sadly is not only bout sports, is about the real lifw world.

there a re TONS of bussiness that "tweak" their numbers to pay less taxes, to justify massive firings of workers adn so on.

A large part of the current world "crisis" is fictional in based on faked data of selfish people that just wants to have even more profit and even more control of workers who are being deprived of more and more sotial rights .

Chronz
11-17-2011, 12:06 PM
Never knew that, just gos to show why we should all stop acting like we know who should be winning this battle. Too much unknown.

PhillyFaninLA
11-17-2011, 12:14 PM
2 things:

- nothing here is illegal and businesses when creating annual reports do in a wayto show a certain image using real accurate data, when plan the next years finances they move money around to make things look a certain way or just to change the way thing are funded or who gets what in bonuses.

- taking money from a company you own is legal and not even unethical, it might be in poor taste. To look down on Frank McCord (who I do not like or respect) or any other business owner for taking money out of the business and being mad they did is like someone being mad at you for taking money out of your own bank account.


edit:

There is no legal reason for them to open there books to anyone and give any information that they are not required to give.

Heater4life
11-17-2011, 12:43 PM
2 things:

- nothing here is illegal and businesses when creating annual reports do in a wayto show a certain image using real accurate data, when plan the next years finances they move money around to make things look a certain way or just to change the way thing are funded or who gets what in bonuses.

- taking money from a company you own is legal and not even unethical, it might be in poor taste. To look down on Frank McCord (who I do not like or respect) or any other business owner for taking money out of the business and being mad they did is like someone being mad at you for taking money out of your own bank account.


edit:

There is no legal reason for them to open there books to anyone and give any information that they are not required to give.

Im no attorney nor will i sit here and try to play the part of one; but when claiming to be operating at a loss i dont see a reason why owners shouldnt be forced to open their books.

If we are to determine a "fair" deal i think all financial information should be put on the table.

Knowing todays world, some of these owners are crying wolf.

ghettosean
11-17-2011, 12:49 PM
:clap:

Law25
11-17-2011, 01:10 PM
Im no attorney nor will i sit here and try to play the part of one; but when claiming to be operating at a loss i dont see a reason why owners shouldnt be forced to open their books.

If we are to determine a "fair" deal i think all financial information should be put on the table.

Knowing todays world, some of these owners are crying wolf.

This. :clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:. To the OP great read thanks.

DLeeicious
11-17-2011, 01:18 PM
this is one of my biggest issues with the owners. Not only all of the above and the clever tax shifting/revenue shifting strategies they all use to make their numbers look worse but also the fact that their business as an asset is increasing in value. See Warriors sale for 450MM.

They can be claiming to lose $X but it's always significantly less than that and they always ignore the increased value of their team that there is always demand to buy.

ink
11-17-2011, 01:24 PM
Find an article that actually talks about the NBA and we can leave it up. This is about the NFL.

Where it mentions the NBA, it even says:


NFL officials have pointed out that the NBA’s owners provided detailed financials for each of their teams to the National Basketball Players Association, yet have made no progress in their collective bargaining discussions.

That key passage clearly goes AGAINST what you are suggesting about disclosure of financials.

But of course, that quote was left out of the OP because the article's point was misrepresented. Please quote accurately if you are going to use articles.

ink
11-17-2011, 01:50 PM
FYI here is the article from Forbes often cited about NBA financials:


Sources close to the NBA labor negotiations have provided Net Income numbers for the league each year over the last five years, plus projected losses for the 2010-11 season. Given that the NBA is saying that they are running at a net loss, as opposed to the NFL, which is saying they are seeing profits declining, the NBA is compelled to open their books as part of labor law, and have done so. The following numbers are audited figures. If the projected figures are correct, the NBA will have lost $1.845 billion over the last 6 years, not turned a profit, as reported by Silver.

The following shows the losses, as well as the number of teams that reportedly have run at a loss the last 5 years, plus projected losses for the 2010-11 season:


05-06: 19 clubs ran at a loss, total losses of $220 million
06-07: 21 clubs ran at a loss, total losses of $285 million
07-08: 23 clubs ran at a loss, total losses of $330 million
08-09: 24 clubs ran at a loss, total losses of $370 million
09-10: 23 clubs ran at a loss, total losses of $340 million
* 10-11 23 clubs ran at a loss, total loss of $300 million

http://www.forbes.com/sites/sportsmoney/2011/07/06/audited-numbers-show-nba-lost-over-1-5b-over-last-five-years/