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View Full Version : New Clause to be included in the next CBA: The Stretch Clause



RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 01:33 AM
Im pretty sure this wasnt posted as yet due to everyone making imaginary situations involving swapping 2007 kobe and tmac , or threads talking about how the knicks projected 20 million dollars in cap space is somehow greater than the clippers projected over 34 million dollars in space, so im here to supply you with actual valable information that will actually be useful, instead of these fantasy situations


So..Without further adieu, i present you the newest tool that the owners are giving to teams that will make the big market teams even better: The stretch clause:

http://www.hoopsworld.com/cba-scenarios-the-stretch-clause/


All the of buzz in these collective bargaining negotiations between the NBA Owners and Players has gone to the potential ramifications of an amnesty clause, but the truth is another option has the potential to be used more often. The stretch exception, as it’s being called, could be a lifeline to teams over the course of the next collective bargaining agreement.

Eric Pincus did a good job yesterday detailing what the amnesty clause could mean to each team, so here we are going to build on that.

First we need to define the stretch exception. The stretch exception is as currently defined is a modification of the rules under the old CBA that dictated how waived or bought out players counted against the salary cap. (Note: This is widely reported as not quite a done deal in negotiations, but it’s more defining the details rather than the element being in or out of the deal – it’s in.) In the previous CBA a player’s salary counted for the full amount against the cap. If a lower buyout was negotiated, that amount was applied proportionately against the cap for the remaining years of the contract.

This new incarnation of the rules would take the amount owed to the player and instead of applying it to the owed years would apply to double the amount of years plus one, lowering the cap hit for each season. And unlike the amnesty clause, this wouldn’t be a one-time deal. Whether it’s once a year or more, or even optional, is among the aspects still to be defined.

Here’s an example:

Player X is owed $10 million (a flat $5 million per season) over the final two years of his contract. His team decides to waive him using the stretch exception. Instead of a $5 million cap hit, the $10 million would be spread out over five years (double the current contract, plus one). That leaves the team with a $2 million cap hit for the next five years.

It seems like a pretty nice option for teams, but it’s not a solution that allows a team to simply go shopping with no worries. Teams will need to weight very carefully the pros and cons of using the provision, because the financial impact could add up.

Let’s go back to the example. The team has decided Player X is not needed. Their options are to keep him and pay him $5 million each for two years, or to waive him (paying him the full amount) and have a $2 million cap hit for five years. That means that not only does the team need to replace whatever he did bring for $3 million or less to justify the move, but they also need to be able to do that for five years. If they did nothing, in two years the team would have a full $5 million to spend on a replacement player.

See how that works? In the example, to make it worthwhile, the team needs to find a player who does everything player X does, but for at least 60% cheaper to make it worthwhile, and they have to realize that decision will impact their spending for many years to come.

Given all of that, it seems most likely the best use of the stretch exception will be for players who can no longer physically give much of anything due to age or degenerative injuries rather than simply to open a roster spot. Very few players are so highly paid over their contributions they can be fully replaced for something in the range of 60% (depends on the number of years remaining on the contract) of the cost – or less.

Given all of that, let’s take a look at the current contracts and see what players might be good choices for the stretch exception and see what would do their team’s cap figures. It won’t be every team using this exception right off the bat; in fact, it may simply be a subset of the teams who decide to use the amnesty clause because that is the better first choice. Here are some teams who might want to make further cuts. (Click on the team name link to go to the team salary page.)

Charlotte Bobcats: The Cats have a couple options here. Presumably they could use amnesty on DeSagana Diop, which means they could use stretch on someone like Matt Carroll or Eduardo Najera. Najera is due $2.75 million in 2011-12, but under the stretch the cap hit would be $916,667 in each of the next three years. Carroll is owed $7.4 million over the next two years (second is an Early Termination Option), but that could become a $1.48 million cap hit over the next five years. Each of those would buy the Cats another couple million in spending power during the next free agency period.

Cleveland Cavaliers: How badly to the Cavaliers want to wipe the slate clean? If they use amnesty on Baron Davis, they could use stretch on Antawn Jamison and get it all out of the way now. Owed $15.1 million in the final year of his deal, that becomes a $5 million cap hit in each of the next three years. It buys the Cavaliers $10 million more in spending power now but could hurt them next summer. It would be wise to wait and see what is available to spend their money on before making such a decision on Jamison. It’s also important to note the Cavs have $64 million in commitment, so depending on the decisions they make reducing that amount by $10 million does not necessarily give them $10 million in spending power in free agency.

Denver Nuggets: Denver is a team creating a new face, moving from a team led by Carmelo Anthony, Chauncey Billups and Kenyon Martin to one led by Ty Lawson and Danilo Gallinari. If they choose to use amnesty on Al Harrington, as many speculate, they could go stretch on Chris Andersen. Andersen is a luxury of a playoff team, a defensive maniac off the bench. He can’t contribute much on offense, nor does he play big minutes. He is owed $13.58 million over the next three years, but with the stretch that could become a cap hit of only $1.94 million over the next seven, give the Nuggets $2.3 million in spending power this year in free agency. However, here is where it gets tricky. What does that $2.3 million get you? Already well under the cap it could be the difference between signing a difference maker or not, but if that’s not the intended use can the Nuggets replace what Andersen brings for $2.3 million or less? Remember, if it’s not less, it’s probably not worth it.

Detroit Pistons: If Detroit uses amnesty on Rip Hamilton, they could use the stretch on someone else. Charlie Villanueva? He is owed $24.18 million over three seasons which would become cap hits of $3.45 million over seven, giving them $4.2 million more to spend now. Added to their cap room, they could then sign a solid player.

Golden State Warriors: It’s likely the Warriors, if they choose, would use amnesty on Andris Biedrins or Charlie Bell. If it’s Biedrins, then they may use stretch on Bell (probably doesn’t make sense to go the other way around because of the costs). Bell is due $4.1 million in the last year of his deal, which could become a $1.37 million cap hit for three years. Is it worth it? Do they gain anything there, or should they just deal with the contract for one more season?

Los Angeles Lakers: With the Lakers it would seem using amnesty boils down to Luke Walton or Metta World Peace. If they use the amnesty on Peace (World Peace?), then using the stretch on Walton makes a lot of sense (like with the Warriors, probably not the other way around). Walton is owed $11.48 million over two years, which could become a $2.3 million cap hit for the next five years. At the least, it would lessen the Lakers’ luxury tax payments, which they will be guaranteed to be making for at least the next two years.

Orlando Magic: If the Magic use amnesty much speculation is about them choosing one of the big, overpaid names like Gil Arenas or Hedo Turkoglu. It’s doubtful either would make logical sense with the stretch, but what about Chris Duhon? Duhon could also be an amnesty candidate, but if he’s not (meaning Orlando chose to use it on someone else) he is guaranteed $8.5 million over the next three years (last season is only $1.5 million guaranteed). The stretch would make that a cap hit of $1.7 million over five years. Like with the Lakers, that would lower their taxable amount for the next two years $1.8 million each.

Phoenix Suns: If the Suns use their amnesty clause on someone like Josh Childress, why not use the stretch on Vince Carter? By waiving him they only have to pay him $4 million instead of $18.3 million anyway, so if they changed that to a stretch clause move the cap hit would be only $1.33 million for three seasons. That one move would drop their cap figure for 2011-12 from $67.8 million to $49.8 million – not including an amnesty move.

Toronto Raptors: If the Raptors use their amnesty clause on Jose Calderon, they could consider using the stretch on Leandro Barbosa since neither of them is part of the future of the team. Barbosa is owed $7.6 million in the final year of his deal, which could become cap hits of $2.53 million over the next three. Between that and an amnesty cut, the Raptors would suddenly become major free agent players.

The stretch clause could become a valuable tool moving forward, but it’s not an ideal fix to all situations because it doesn’t allow a team to simply reload. Initially the amnesty clause will have a bigger impact and draw bigger headlines, but the stretch clause will likely prove itself valuable to every team in the league at least once over the course of the next CBA’s lifetime.

What’s your take on the stretch clause? Should your team use it, and on who?

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So, the pistons amnesty gordon, stretch hamilton, the raptors amnesty calderon, stretch barbosa, and evryone else follows suit, next thing we know, these players are signed by all the championship contenders,the celtics,Bulls,lakers,heat,mavericks, and thunder

so what was this CBA about again??? competitive balance, or helping the superteams?

thoughts?

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 01:44 AM
lmaoo, clasue

:facepalm:

FAIL

can someone fix this pls, thx

Hellcrooner
11-09-2011, 01:51 AM
yeah, thats why luxury teams wont be able to do a sign and trade... because they want to help them, yeah? right? Mckey?

ChongInc.
11-09-2011, 01:55 AM
It sounds similar to the a "buy-out" in the NHL. It's nice I the short term, but it's a pain fr a wile. The leafs bought out Tucker ages ago and still have a 2M cap hit from it. Say you buy out 2 players at 5 mil a season for 2 seasons... That's a 5 million dollar cap hit for the next 5 years. No one better pull an alanzo mourning on the raptors ever again lol.

da ThRONe
11-09-2011, 01:59 AM
I hate all these clauses and exceptions.

beasted86
11-09-2011, 02:41 AM
It sounds similar to the a "buy-out" in the NHL. It's nice I the short term, but it's a pain fr a wile. The leafs bought out Tucker ages ago and still have a 2M cap hit from it. Say you buy out 2 players at 5 mil a season for 2 seasons... That's a 5 million dollar cap hit for the next 5 years. No one better pull an alanzo mourning on the raptors ever again lol.

It's the cap hit, but not the actual wallet hit... but I'm sure you knew that already.

In the end the owners save money with a buyout... the NBA only hits their cap so that owners don't compound their mistake with another bad contract.

Kevj77
11-09-2011, 03:31 AM
I like it. It's not a get out of jail free card. This will help teams along with shorter contracts get out from under bad deals. Teams won't get killed by one bad deal, but if teams give out multiple bad deals it won't save them. As it shouldn't anyone can make one mistake making several mistakes is a pattern.

This should benefit all teams.

HT9Canada
11-09-2011, 03:49 AM
I don't see a team like the raptors ever using this. why not get barbosas cap hit off this year by playing it out since they know they wont be competing. 3 years down the road they might be back in the playoff hunt and those extra few million would be worth it.

Seems like something only playoff teams would do right before the playoffs for someone they find that doesnt fit for their playoff roster, and grab someone else someone threw away for the same reason.

Chronz
11-09-2011, 04:17 AM
So basically its what Ive been asking for from day 1. A way for teams to make it easier to undo mistakes or fix unforeseen events (injuries/decline).

Its beautiful, it will really help alot of teams, small/big markets alike.

Chronz
11-09-2011, 04:20 AM
I don't see a team like the raptors ever using this. why not get barbosas cap hit off this year by playing it out since they know they wont be competing. 3 years down the road they might be back in the playoff hunt and those extra few million would be worth it.

Seems like something only playoff teams would do right before the playoffs for someone they find that doesnt fit for their playoff roster, and grab someone else someone threw away for the same reason.
Barbosa is expiring, this is mostly for teams that need the cap space but have an albatross of a contract in the way.

ggb108
11-09-2011, 04:56 AM
interesting clause. i like it.

Kevj77
11-09-2011, 05:05 AM
It seems like a reverse signing bonus in the NFL. How teams can pay players up front money and spread it out over the length of a contract, but if they cut them they take the cap hit in the year they cut them.

This will allow NBA teams to cut a player and spread the cap hit over a few years. Add the shorter contracts and this will really help teams in all markets.

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 10:45 AM
It seems like a reverse signing bonus in the NFL. How teams can pay players up front money and spread it out over the length of a contract, but if they cut them they take the cap hit in the year they cut them.

This will allow NBA teams to cut a player and spread the cap hit over a few years. Add the shorter contracts and this will really help teams in all markets.

yea, but mostly the big market teams benefit, caus when these veterans, ex.camby,hamilton,gordon,calderon,etc are cut, these guys arent exactly going to sign with the raptors nd twolves,lol. they are headed to the big market teams for either the minimum or the MLE

mkdo
11-09-2011, 10:49 AM
i can say that this clause is only geared on providing tax savings for the teams and not really to improve team


sample
why would a non-playoff team use this when it will only help the playoff other teams.

it can only really help teams who are playoff teams and who has salary cap. and not many playoff teams have the cap space to sign players freed from this clause

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 11:14 AM
i can say that this clause is only geared on providing tax savings for the teams and not really to improve team


sample
why would a non-playoff team use this when it will only help the playoff other teams.

it can only really help teams who are playoff teams and who has salary cap. and not many playoff teams have the cap space to sign players freed from this clause

to create cap space,lol

you gotta learn from the past that these small teams(not small market teams, but teams that fell they have enough money to go after a star somehow) are crazy, i mean look, the knicks started clearing cap space for lebron since what? 2005?

lol, and i hear they are considering clearing cap for rose and durant

u better believe teams like the raptors, pistons, and a few others like the hornets will use both clauses to their advantage

Ebbs
11-09-2011, 01:28 PM
I don't want to read all of that :hide: can someone break it down in a paragraph

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 01:30 PM
I don't want to read all of that :hide: can someone break it down in a paragraph

teams can cut players and only have a percentage of the money still on the cap

so basically a team with a player making say 10 million dollars in a situation can cut them and only have a low percentage counted towards the cap for each year until the deal is done

and this can be done unlimited times, unlike the amnesty clause which has a limit

nate2usmc
11-09-2011, 01:49 PM
Yesss!! This clause was made for the Knicks to get CP3, Melo, STAT and D12 to play for pennies on the dollar and win not 1, not 2.... chips together!!!!!! Knicks will eventually win 18 championships to be known as greatest franchise everrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!! :clap:

Hawkeye15
11-09-2011, 01:54 PM
it can help every team, therefore I am fine with it.

GodsSon
11-09-2011, 01:55 PM
I'm down with it.

Although I don't get why the Raptors would use it on Barbosa.

Hellcrooner
11-09-2011, 02:23 PM
I'm down with it.

Although I don't get why the Raptors would use it on Barbosa.

nah use it on Jose.

this or the amnesty, but for gods sake make him free, Lakers need him.

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 02:26 PM
nah use it on Jose.

this or the amnesty, but for gods sake make him free, Lakers need him.

amnesty jose, and stretch barginani, hes making too much for a player who cant even grab 8 boards a game

Birdmannn
11-09-2011, 04:19 PM
No way the raps use it on bargnani. He may not be the most conventional big man but what he brings to the game is fairly unique and I would say has decent value.
Also the raps don't need the money right now what they need to do is focus on their guys getting better, barg, davis and derozan while also keeping a ****** record. A top pick next year and valanciunas joining the team will hopefully turn the team a round. No need to make cuts that don't help them.

Chronz
11-09-2011, 04:24 PM
yea, but mostly the big market teams benefit, caus when these veterans, ex.camby,hamilton,gordon,calderon,etc are cut, these guys arent exactly going to sign with the raptors nd twolves,lol. they are headed to the big market teams for either the minimum or the MLE

It benefits small markets because its better than the alternatives they were left with before this.

Chronz
11-09-2011, 04:26 PM
amnesty jose, and stretch barginani, hes making too much for a player who cant even grab 8 boards a game

Bargs has a horrible deal but hes not the kind of player I would apply this to but what do I know, should be interesting to see who gets what applied to them once the CBA is set.

da ThRONe
11-09-2011, 05:23 PM
In a labor situation where the league was complaining about losing money they keep adding rules that allow them to waste more. SMH. Am I the only one who see's this?

The salary system should be simple with a ceiling, a floor, and every penny of contract money counts against the cap. Everything else is a rule that's over complicating things. Sometime K-I-S-S is just the right thing to do.

Hellcrooner
11-09-2011, 05:39 PM
all bargnani needs is raptors to get a GOOD CENTER that can defend and rebound ( like say chandler or marc gasol) and allow him to play PF and focus on scoring solely.

like some dudes out there like amare or dirk.

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 07:05 PM
No way the raps use it on bargnani. He may not be the most conventional big man but what he brings to the game is fairly unique and I would say has decent value.
Also the raps don't need the money right now what they need to do is focus on their guys getting better, barg, davis and derozan while also keeping a ****** record. A top pick next year and valanciunas joining the team will hopefully turn the team a round. No need to make cuts that don't help them.

and how many wins has he produced over his career?

how many playoff appearances?

steep price for a golorified version of Yi jinlin

nickdymez
11-09-2011, 07:34 PM
This isnt THAT "valable".....

Cal827
11-09-2011, 07:46 PM
Hey Reke, since you are a Bulls fan.. How would you like a 7 footer who can hit 3s as your shooting guard? lol :D

But I like the clause... every team benefits, but the teams will still suffer for making a bad signing since they would still have to pay a chunk across their cap... I don't think the Raptors would use Amnesty on Jose though; some teams might make a decent offer for one of the pure Pgs in the League (Yes I know he can't defend too well, but his APG is usually good, hell he averaged about 9 per game with that Raptor roster)

And the Barbosa one is just silly.

Hellcrooner
11-09-2011, 07:55 PM
mmm i wonder what is going to avoid bron and wade sweetalking into dwights ear, then at seasons end amnesty cutting bosh and signing howard in is place.

Cal827
11-09-2011, 08:01 PM
mmm i wonder what is going to avoid bron and wade sweetalking into dwights ear, then at seasons end amnesty cutting bosh and signing howard in is place.

Would Miami even have enough? I mean they went over the cap last year, and the 3 players all took smaller contracts... I think they would have to rid another big contract (Joel Anthony sticks out to me here for them to use the Stretch on if they use Amnesty on Bosh)

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 08:03 PM
mmm i wonder what is going to avoid bron and wade sweetalking into dwights ear, then at seasons end amnesty cutting bosh and signing howard in is place.

sure, all they have to do is amnesty bosh, stretch haslem, mike miller,joel anthony, and dont resign chalmers in 2011

they they wld be back to square one, having 3 stars, 0 bench, 0 pg= 0 rings

RekeHavoc
11-09-2011, 09:13 PM
yo u are the biggest knick hater/ idiot on this site. did every knick player/fan screw your mom or something, cuz every thread or reply you have to mention the knicks. are you really that mad they are on the come up? you make all this random **** up, and then you get told off, and go crawl back into your hole and when the smoke clears, your back talking ****?

rose and durant? your an idiot, nobody and i mean nobody has even mentioned it. your prob thinking it b/c you can't get the taste of the knick dick out your mouth.

we were clearing cap since 2005? r u ********? we didn't clear cap for lebron, we cleared cap for flexibility so we could go after a star. and yea at that time, lbj was a fa, but so was wade, bosh, and amare. the knicks weren't going anywhere with zbo, d lee, and j crawford. we were in cap hell, close to 100 mil on the books. either way you look at it, clearing cap for lbj or w/e, it would have taken us atleast 2 years to fix our cap situation.

u need to hop off son.

awwwww someones throwing a hissy fit :cry:

you cleared cap space for lebron, the dam NY post/daily news had a pic of him in a knicks jersey the moment the season ended, it was all about lebron

u missed out on him, you settled for melo, and stat

stats injury plagued career and you ENTIRE team's lack of defense wil just keep u guys running in circles, by 2013, i firmly expect the knicks to begin preparing for the freeagency of durant and rose, and im not the only one who believes this, even in your heart, you know that the knicks will continue to clear space for these impending freeagents because 90% of the knicks roster for the past 7 years have been full of players that were not originally drafted by them

you guys are talking baout getting cp3 and pairing him with non defensive melo, and stat :injury: and surrounding them with minimum contract players and magically expect to be able to win with a roster with turiaf at center

your fans are completly illogical, make threads claiming they have the most cap space, make up threads that are not only illogical,impossible, but completly ignorant

All hail the "Hardcore" Knicks fan, established Febuary 21st 2011 :clap:

:facepalm:

i can respect Heat fans, they are cocky, but they know what they are talking about alot of the time

knicks fans:

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showthread.php?t=665889

"What are the chances of the knicks going after, and getting him? I got no problem takin chandler with nash at the vet min. If things don't pan out well with howard and paul"

and then you ask me why i react to knicks fans the way i do!

HOW DARE YOU?

LOOK AT THIS^

you do it to yourselves, you all magically became fans this febuary, i respect fans who have been fans for years and proudly supported their team and are intellectuals, not those that dont know hte basic rules of basketball

so yes, i do have a problem