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View Full Version : NBA REDRAFT FINALS: 1) El Paso vs. 2) Providence



phlp_bj
09-22-2011, 06:49 PM
Hello Everyone,

Welcome to the playoff voting for the PSD NBA Redraft. Every year we basketball fans enjoy taking part in a PSD game called the NBA redraft where over 60 users participate. The point of the redraft is to draft the best team possible and the obvious goal is to be crowned champion by the NBA forum. You will notice that the team name do not represent current NBA teams. The reason why we avoided this is because we wanted to avoid a bias that exists with current team names. For example, a team that had the Chicago Bulls team name would probably experience a higher volume of votes than letís say the Memphis Grizzlies team simply because they have the larger fan base on PSD. As a result we got rid of that bias completely. Please take the time to review both teams, look at the depth chart and read the write ups to formalize your own opinion on which team would win a 7 game series. As far as injuries go, they will not be playing a factor in this Redraft though players that are continually hurt and have not had a healthy season in quite some time should be viewed as different players than what they once were (Yao, Oden, Roy etc). Thank you for voting and enjoy the match ups.


El Paso has home court advantage


El Paso Depth Chart:
PG: Rajon Rondo/Lou Williams/Jeff Teague/Brian Scalabrine
SG: Manu Ginoblli/Evan Turner/Brian Scalabrine
SF: Michael Beasley/James Posey/Brian Scalabrine
PF: Kevin Garnett/Jordan Hill/Brian Scalabrine
C: Ben Wallace/Nenad Krstic/Brian Scalabrine

http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshots/nba/players/65/3026.jpghttp://assets.espn.go.com/i/nba/profiles/players/65x90/3380.jpghttp://a.espncdn.com/i/headshots/nba/players/65/3418.jpghttp://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshots/nba/players/65/261.jpghttp://assets.espn.go.com/i/nba/profiles/players/65x90/3149.jpg

Providence Depth Chart:
PG: Mo Williams / Eric Bledsoe
SG: Dwyane Wade / Deshawn Stevenson / Xavier Henry
SF: Shane Battier / Omri Casspi
PF: Chris Bosh / Udonis Haslem
C: Brendan Haywood / Joel Przybilla / Jason Collins

http://assets.espn.go.com/i/nba/profiles/players/65x90/3750.jpghttp://assets.espn.go.com/i/nba/profiles/players/65x90/3708.jpghttp://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/i/headshots/nba/players/full/976.png&w=65&h=90&scale=crop&background=0xcccccc&transparent=falsehttp://a.espncdn.com/i/headshots/nba/players/65/1977.jpghttp://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshots/nba/players/65/1000.jpg

Providence Writeup:

PG: Mo Williams vs. Rajon Rondo
On paper this matchup may not seem great for us, but in reality it isnít that bad at all. Rajon Rondo may be a great defender and passer, but scoring wise he canít do much. For us, Mo Williams is the perfect PG as he can be a great third scorer with 14-15 ppg, an excellent shooter, and a pretty good facilitator. There are two things to remember when viewing this matchup. While Rondo is good at getting steals and keeping his man in front of him, Mo Williams is a shooter. He will be running all over the court and setting up for three point shots. Therefore, Rondoís defense isnít really a decisive advantage as Mo Williams isnít our primary ball handler. Another thing to note is Rondoís offense vs. Mo Williamsí defense. While Mo Williams isnít a really good defender, Rondo is one of the leagueís worst shooters from the PG position. The main problem Mo Williams has when defending is keeping his man in between him and the basket. Now, he will be able to play three or four feet off of Rondo and watch the passing lanes rather than worry about Rondo shooting a jumpshot. Overall, El Paso has the advantage in this matchup, but not by as much as it may seem.

SG: Dwyane Wade vs. Manu Ginobili
While Manu may be a talented player, Dwyane Wade is easily the best at his position and this matchup is clearly a substantial advantage for us. On the offensive end, Manu will not be able to stop Wade and with the elderly and ineffective Ben Wallace guarding the rim, he should go off and have an amazing Finals performance as he has done in the past. While Manu is good on offense player, Wade is an all-nba defender and can use his length, strength, and overall athleticism to contain Manu. One thing to also note is that while Dwyane Wade can play about 40 minutes a night for us, Manu, especially after a long playoff run, will only be able to play 33-34. This means that for at least 6-7 minutes per game (perhaps more) Wade will be going against their backup Evan Turner, which needless to say is brutally unfair for El Paso. Overall, this matchup is a big advantage for us as Wade can dominate another Finals series on both ends of the court, while Manu wonít be able to do much on defense and logs significantly less minutes.

SF: Shane Battier vs. Michael Beasley
The matchup between Battier and Beasley is a pretty unique one and honestly we feel it helps us more to a certain extent. There is no denying Beasley can score, but at what expense to his team? He is truly a chucker and extremely inefficient. He is also very inexperienced and will not be able to produce efficiently enough on a finals team as their second highest scorer. We on the other hand, have a great defender and ultimate team player in Shane Battier. Shane will make every point Beasley scores very difficult as he relies on experience, instinct, and intelligence whereas Beasley relies on talent alone. On the offensive end, Battier is a very good 3pt shooter (39%) and should be able to find openings in our offense. It is no secret Beasley is a bad defender and with double teams needed for Wade and Bosh, Battier is sure to get open looks. Overall, in a finals series, we feel that Battier is the better player to have over Beasley since he is more experienced, will help his team on both sides of the court, and do whatever is needed to pull off a victory.

PF: Christopher Bosh vs. Kevin Garnett
One thing to note in this matchup is that these are the 2012 playoffs, which means that while Bosh enters another year into his prime, KG is another year removed from his and will be 36 years old. We feel this matchup gives us an advantage as Bosh is no doubt a top 5 PF and can score in many, many ways. On the offensive end, Bosh is obviously our second scorer and can certainly produce as one. While we donít feel we need Bosh to get 25 and 10 to win, we do expect him to be averaging between 18-20 pts a night and 8-9 rebounds with his usual high efficiency and smart team play. On the defensive end, Bosh is actually a really good post defender. To be fair, he is pretty slow on rotations but in terms of guarding the block, he is no slouch. KG at this point isnít a big offensive threat and expecting more than 15 points next season would be a stretch. Another thing to note is that, like mentioned before, this is the Finals. The combination of a long playoff run and the fact KG will be 36 years old and a 17 year vet., will show as he wonít be able to play huge amount of minutes. This means that Bosh will be guarded by Jordan Hill at times, which is an even bigger advantage for us. Overall I think it is clear that while Bosh will be in his prime averaging 18-20 and 8-9, KG will be close to retirement, at the end of a long playoff, and will be asked to produce more than he can. Therefore, this matchup is a good-sized advantage for us.

C: Brendan Haywood vs. Ben Wallace
While this matchup may not be seen on the stat sheet, it will most certainly be felt on the court. At this point, Ben Wallace is an average backup center at best. He can no longer block slashing wings or matchup with bigger centers as his athleticism has faded. He is also one of the worst free throw shooters in NBA history and at the end of games, if needed, we will happily foul him and send him to the line. Now, starting for us, is Brendan Haywood. Brendan is a legit starting center in this league and youíd be hard-pressed to find 20-25 better ones. He is a strong, physical 7í0, 270 lb space eater and can grab a good amount of boards. For us he will play about 28 minutes, which is about the same he did while playing for the Wizards where he produced 8-10 pts and 8-10 rebs a night. Haywood is also a very good screener and can help Mo Williams get open for threes and pick n roll with Wade if needed. Overall, Haywoodís size and rebounding ability will be too much for the elderly Ben Wallace giving us a clear cut advantage.

Bench: Bledsoe, Stevenson, Casspi, Haslem, Pryzbilla vs. Williams, Turner, Posey, Hill, Kristic

We feel our bench is very talented. Bledsoe is a quick, young point guard who is just fine in the 8-10 minutes he will get. Deshawn Stevenson is a major threat and even started for the championship Mavs this year. Deshawn is a very good defender and can hit the 3 ball. As our 7th man, he can make a difference in this series. Casspi is a decent scorer and provides another option on offense in the very limited minutes he will receive. Then we have our 6th man, Udonis Haslem. He is completely healthy and as such is a great defender and very good rebounder. Able to play the center and power forward positions he will receive major minutes in this series and bring his signature baseline jumper. We feel he matches up well with KG if at PF and if we want more offense at the end of games, we can bring in Haslem for Haywood at C and not lose any defense as Big Ben isnít an offensive threat and undersized as well. Lastly, is Joel Pryzbilla who is a good rebounder and big body should have no problem containing Big Ben or Nenad Kristic in his very limited minutes. Our opponentís bench we feel isnít really as good. They have Lou Williams who is a good scorer, but how is he getting minutes? Rondo will probably get 36-40 a night leaving LouWill with only 8-12, which isnít enough to make a difference. Both players are also undersized and donít have the ability to play SG. Next are Evan Turner and Posey. These are two guys who wonít do much on either end and canít fill in adequately enough for their starters. Then, they have Jordan Hill who is way too young and just not good enough to produce for them. Lastly is Nenad who shouldnít be receiving the major minutes he will be. With Big Ben being old and a terrible starter, they are relying on Nenad to fill in the weakest part of their team. Overall, our bench is definitely better and gives us our final advantage.

One Sentence Conclusion: We will win this series with our experience, leadership, and team-oriented basketball.

El Paso did not send in a writeup

Sadds The Gr8
09-22-2011, 06:52 PM
Providence. El Paso still lacks the scoring to win this and Wade would absolutely own this series.

The_Jamal
09-22-2011, 11:02 PM
I'm going all out to get Wade in the next PSD game. All he does is win championships.

But i'm going Providence as well. I felt El Paso has way too many scoring issues in the last series against Vegas and would struggle even more in this series against a better defensive team. They also have a much better bench and can go 9 deep.

Congrats to both squads for pulling off some rape deals, but JWE and MWC come out ahead here

Sportfan
09-22-2011, 11:34 PM
Wade is going beast mode? yea my ***.

Last 5 matchups Manu vs Wade. (since 09)
Wade's FG% in those games
38%
33%
42%
44%
46%

with those last couple coming off riding lebron's jockstrap. In the last 4 matchups, Manu has outscored Wade twice, in even less minutes.

lolololololol KG-Bosh part. Alright, so you wanna use KG's age against him? How about we take their most recent matchup, 2011 playoffs. Keep in mind they both played exactly equal minutes in the series.
Bosh's statline-40 FG% 13 ppg 10 rpg 1.4 APG 1 BPG 1 SPG 1.6 TOPG
Garnett's statline 43% 15 ppg 11 rpg 1.8 APG 1.2 BPG 1.8 SPG 1.4 TOPG

so yea, garnett beat bosh at literally everything, points, fg%, rebounds, assists, blocks, steals, handling, and of course MUCH MUCH better defense.

and since you love calling out my older guys, let's call out yours. Shane Battier, a great perimeter defender right? last 2 times he's face beasley he shot 50% and averaged 18 ppg. What a chucker :rolleyes: Battier won't be a big problem at all


Oh yea, Rondo rapes Mo. Hard.

MTar786
09-22-2011, 11:42 PM
prividence in a sweep.

the only advantage i see for el paso is having rondo and slightly better rebounding.
providence could get el paso in easy foul trouble with wade and bosh. wade is a better go to option than manu and bosh is a better go to scoring option than kg.
manu is their only 3 point threat on their starting lineup and ben wallace is pretty much useless now at this point. providence also has better depth. Age is also a problem for el paso.. ESPECIALLY since their main two scoring option are highly prone to injury.
honestly, el paso has no chance here.

Sportfan
09-23-2011, 12:16 AM
prividence in a sweep.

the only advantage i see for el paso is having rondo and slightly better rebounding.
providence could get el paso in easy foul trouble with wade and bosh. wade is a better go to option than manu and bosh is a better go to scoring option than kg.
manu is their only 3 point threat on their starting lineup and ben wallace is pretty much useless now at this point. providence also has better depth. Age is also a problem for el paso.. ESPECIALLY since their main two scoring option are highly prone to injury.
honestly, el paso has no chance here.
Bahahhahahahahahahahhsahahahhaha

Ever heard of, defense?


I swear, psd voters are out to get me. I have a killer offensive team last year with D-Will/Thornton/Granger/Jamsion/McGee and all anyone compared about was my lack of D at the 2 and 4. WTF

PocketKings
09-23-2011, 02:24 AM
Defense still wins championships and if El Paso's team gets to this point, I just don't see them losing it because of "offensive woes."

I think the leadership of Rondo / Manu / KG will get them through it.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
09-23-2011, 03:52 AM
providence in 5

Baller1
09-23-2011, 05:02 AM
El Paso for sure.

Great PG, great overall player/playmaker, and possibly the best team leader in the game. Combine that with a nasty overall defense and you have yourself a championship.

Greet
09-23-2011, 08:54 AM
How Providence is even winning is a total joke.

I guess not, I forgot this is the NBA forum. "ZOMG'S DWYANE WADE AND CHRIS BOSH ON THE SAME TEAM, EZ WIN ROFL"

Swashcuff
09-23-2011, 09:15 AM
All those thinking Providence is going to run away with this one I urge you to do the research and read the write ups. It's not as simple as one may think. KG is still a top defensive force in the league the best all round PF around. Manu is still a two way threat and he routinely plays well against Wade. Rondo being the play maker that he is will make Michael Beasley's and Manu's job on offensive a bit easier. Ben Wallace well he's in their for veteran support if you ask me but even so he still aint to shabby defensively.

I still haven't made my vote but it's not as simple as some of you make it out to seem. Wade however is the X-Factor in all of this. Despite the fact that Wade hasn't shot a very high % against Manu in their regular season encounters Dwyane Wade in the regular season and Dwyane Wade in the finals are two completely different human beings. I see no reason why he wouldn't be able to absolutely take games over and will his team to victory even against such an awesome defensive unit.

Tough one for me.

pebloemer
09-23-2011, 09:38 AM
Love the defense on El Paso, and Providence is quite good defensively too.

I have Providence as the deeper, more complete team and I worry about El Paso's bigs outside of Garnett. Wallace is not the force he once was and neither Hill nor Krstic make me feels confident in the front line. Seems to me that Garnett would need to play heavy minutes to deal with Bosh, while Haslem and Haywood are solid players to compliment Bosh in the front line.

With the championship on the line, can the passion, grit and will of El Paso's veteran's overwrite their age and durability concerns? Providence is very solid, and I'll have to think about an answer to that question before I vote.

Avenged
09-23-2011, 12:06 PM
This one is really tough.. I do like the Wade/Bosh duo as I've stated before but the Rondo/Manu duo is good to considering I believe they have the perfect pieces around them.

Beasley may not be very efficient overall but the guy can score. Having Rondo as his teammate will only get him easier looks, and with Many at his side, he'll be drawing most of the attention away from Beasley anyways.

KG is still a very capable defender who will give you 15 efficient points night in and night out.

I guess I'll side with El Paso in this one.

Avenged
09-23-2011, 12:09 PM
Bahahhahahahahahahahhsahahahhaha

Ever heard of, defense?


I swear, psd voters are out to get me. I have a killer offensive team last year with D-Will/Thornton/Granger/Jamsion/McGee and all anyone compared about was my lack of D at the 2 and 4. WTF

You're in the Finals! Nobody is out to get you :p

That team with D-Will and Granger looks pretty good though.

mightybosstone
09-23-2011, 12:14 PM
Without considering the actual matchups, I thought that whichever team won the El Paso-Vegas matchup would win the title. But I'm not so sure now that I examine the rosters. I'll do a little more research when I get home later and cast my vote accordingly...

Corey
09-23-2011, 12:20 PM
El paso is better all around.

OGMarkWahlberg
09-23-2011, 01:09 PM
El Paso in 6, mainly due to their defensive abilities

John Walls Era
09-23-2011, 01:56 PM
Bahahhahahahahahahahhsahahahhaha

Ever heard of, defense?


I swear, psd voters are out to get me. I have a killer offensive team last year with D-Will/Thornton/Granger/Jamsion/McGee and all anyone compared about was my lack of D at the 2 and 4. WTF

doubt it, look at the voters who vote against Providence every time. Plus no one likes MWC.

Sportfan
09-23-2011, 05:14 PM
How Providence is even winning is a total joke.

I guess not, I forgot this is the NBA forum. "ZOMG'S DWYANE WADE AND CHRIS BOSH ON THE SAME TEAM, EZ WIN ROFL"
true dat

El Paso for sure.

Great PG, great overall player/playmaker, and possibly the best team leader in the game. Combine that with a nasty overall defense and you have yourself a championship.
exactly, i built a team that fits together, a lot of teams in this may have better overall talent but the way my team fits is absolutely perfect. providence is pretty much the heat without lebron, if those 3 couldn't win IRL no way the worse of the two are winning here.

All those thinking Providence is going to run away with this one I urge you to do the research and read the write ups. It's not as simple as one may think. KG is still a top defensive force in the league the best all round PF around. Manu is still a two way threat and he routinely plays well against Wade. Rondo being the play maker that he is will make Michael Beasley's and Manu's job on offensive a bit easier. Ben Wallace well he's in their for veteran support if you ask me but even so he still aint to shabby defensively.

I still haven't made my vote but it's not as simple as some of you make it out to seem. Wade however is the X-Factor in all of this. Despite the fact that Wade hasn't shot a very high % against Manu in their regular season encounters Dwyane Wade in the regular season and Dwyane Wade in the finals are two completely different human beings. I see no reason why he wouldn't be able to absolutely take games over and will his team to victory even against such an awesome defensive unit.

Tough one for me.
love the first part of this post lol.

While I agree it changes in the postseason, let's not forget Manu and Rondo are always clutch in the postseason as well, and Manu will be getting way more minutes.

Love the defense on El Paso, and Providence is quite good defensively too.

I have Providence as the deeper, more complete team and I worry about El Paso's bigs outside of Garnett. Wallace is not the force he once was and neither Hill nor Krstic make me feels confident in the front line. Seems to me that Garnett would need to play heavy minutes to deal with Bosh, while Haslem and Haywood are solid players to compliment Bosh in the front line.

With the championship on the line, can the passion, grit and will of El Paso's veteran's overwrite their age and durability concerns? Providence is very solid, and I'll have to think about an answer to that question before I vote.
the answer is yes! durability isn't really a problem with the 1-2 day rests between each game and all. Rondo and Beasley are crazy athletic, hell they could probably play a full 48 minutes. We have our key reserves to give Manu KG and Big Ben some breaks.

You're in the Finals! Nobody is out to get you :p

That team with D-Will and Granger looks pretty good though.
lol, but yea that team was bounced in the first round. it was a blowout too.



would love to hear the other 26 people's opinion on why providence should win, other than "LOL PROVIDENCE SWEEP WADE+BOSH <3 <3 <3"

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 05:24 PM
exactly, i built a team that fits together, a lot of teams in this may have better overall talent but the way my team fits is absolutely perfect. providence is pretty much the heat without lebron, if those 3 couldn't win IRL no way the worse of the two are winning here.


:facepalm:. The talent in a redraft is obviously going to be nowhere near the talent on a real finals team. Also, without Lebron in the finals, the heat may have done better. We have the perfect PG in place (MoWill) who can hit open 3s and create his own shot. Battier still brings really good defense and Haywood is a huge upgrade over Joel Anthony who can't catch a basketball on offense. Then our bench was improved significantly as Deshawn is better than the Mike Miller of last year, Haslem healthy is better than Haslem injured, and Pryzbilla is better than Big Z or Magloire. The only place we downgrade on the bench is Omri Casspi vs. James Jones.

Edit: For the record, Randy Marsh has under 100 posts.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:08 PM
would love to hear the other 26 people's opinion on why providence should win, other than "LOL PROVIDENCE SWEEP WADE+BOSH <3 <3 <3"

1. We have a much better center.
2. We have a better bench.
3. Our SF is very good defensively and can help stop your inefficient SF.
4. Our PG is a great complement to Wade+Bosh, since he can consistently hit open 3s and create his own shot.
5. Our overall team defense is very good and could become even better late in games if we bring in Deshawn and Haslem.
6. We have 5 players from last year's finals in our main rotation and we have just as much experience as your team.
7. Our two best players can log significantly more minutes than your two.

Those are just to name a few. There are many more reasons would win this series.

Baller1
09-23-2011, 06:14 PM
So you substitute Battier, Mo Williams, and Brendan Haywood to replace Lebron, Chalmers, and Joel Anthony... And now they're going to win the championship.

Great logic people.

KnicksorBust
09-23-2011, 06:19 PM
true dat

exactly, i built a team that fits together, a lot of teams in this may have better overall talent but the way my team fits is absolutely perfect. providence is pretty much the heat without lebron, if those 3 couldn't win IRL no way the worse of the two are winning here.

love the first part of this post lol.

While I agree it changes in the postseason, let's not forget Manu and Rondo are always clutch in the postseason as well, and Manu will be getting way more minutes.

the answer is yes! durability isn't really a problem with the 1-2 day rests between each game and all. Rondo and Beasley are crazy athletic, hell they could probably play a full 48 minutes. We have our key reserves to give Manu KG and Big Ben some breaks.

lol, but yea that team was bounced in the first round. it was a blowout too.



would love to hear the other 26 people's opinion on why providence should win, other than "LOL PROVIDENCE SWEEP WADE+BOSH <3 <3 <3"

Rondo is always clutch in the postseason? What? He's had some good series but just last year he was extremely underwhelming. He was downright bad in the Heat series and just hit/miss vs. the pitiful Knicks defense.

Meanwhile, Big Ben is all name value at this point. Combine Wallace's 2.9ppg with Rondo's pitiful 50%TS and El Paso is off to a poor start offensively. Then you have an inefficient chucker like Beasley at the 3. Its not a great mix of talent. With Manu you don't need a true pass-first PG either, they should have flipped Rondo for a better center or even SF. I'm not even sold on KG/Manu both holding up over a deep playoff run.

I'm going to vote Providence.

Corey
09-23-2011, 06:23 PM
1. We have a much better center.
A center that wont even put a mark on the series.

2. We have a better bench.
Explain.

3. Our SF is very good defensively and can help stop your inefficient SF.
Your 'very good' defensive SF allowed Beasley to drop 18 ppg on 50% shooting last year in two matchups.

4. Our PG is a great complement to Wade+Bosh, since he can consistently hit open 3s and create his own shot.
In 6 playoff matchups, Mo Williams has shot 21% from 3pt range against Rondo. In these same matchups, Rondo outscores Williams 20 to 13, outrebounds Williams 6.5 to 3.5 per, and out assists him 12 to 5.5, all while outshooting him overall 54% to 40%.

5. Our overall team defense is very good and could become even better late in games if we bring in Deshawn and Haslem.
Stevenson was terrible defensively last year. Haslem was average.

6. We have 5 players from last year's finals in our main rotation and we have just as much experience as your team.
Meaningless.

7. Our two best players can log significantly more minutes than your two.
Untrue. Manu and KG will play significantly higher minutes in the finals than they would in the regular season, and Rondo can play the whole game.

Those are just to name a few. There are many more reasons would win this series.
No, there aren't.

KnicksorBust
09-23-2011, 06:23 PM
So you substitute Battier, Mo Williams, and Brendan Haywood to replace Lebron, Chalmers, and Joel Anthony... And now they're going to win the championship.

Great logic people.

Spoken like someone who has never done a redraft before. You really expect a GM to be able to build a team comparable to the Miami Heat in game where you are only assigned 1 pick in the first 30?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:23 PM
So you substitute Battier, Mo Williams, and Brendan Haywood to replace Lebron, Chalmers, and Joel Anthony... And now they're going to win the championship.

Great logic people.
This is a huge double-standard. Let's check out his team. Is it even close the Mavericks of last year? The difference between Dirk to KG, Chandler to Ben Wallace (:laugh2:), Marion to Beasley, and a big downgrade in bench does not make up for the difference between Terry + Deshawn vs. Manu. Rondo in terms of impact in this series isn't as valuable as Jason Kidd either.

Rondo is always clutch in the postseason? What? He's had some good series but just last year he was extremely underwhelming. He was downright bad in the Heat series and just hit/miss vs. the pitiful Knicks defense.

Meanwhile, Big Ben is all name value at this point. Combine Wallace's 2.9ppg with Rondo's pitiful 50%TS and El Paso is off to a poor start offensively. Then you have an inefficient chucker like Beasley at the 3. Its not a great mix of talent. With Manu you don't need a true pass-first PG either, they should have flipped Rondo for a better center or even SF. I'm not even sold on KG/Manu both holding up over a deep playoff run.

I'm going to vote Providence.

Agreed.

Sadds The Gr8
09-23-2011, 06:24 PM
well Williams and Haywood are better than Chalmers and Anthony.....

John Walls Era
09-23-2011, 06:27 PM
So you substitute Battier, Mo Williams, and Brendan Haywood to replace Lebron, Chalmers, and Joel Anthony... And now they're going to win the championship.

Great logic people.

You're implying that El Paso is better than the Mavs or at least equal.

Also Lebron was god awful in the finals. The "Chosen one" became the "Frozen one".

Corey
09-23-2011, 06:29 PM
Combine Wallace's 2.9ppg
Meaningless, they aren't asking him to be a scorer.


Rondo's pitiful 50%TS
Again, meaningless. Rondo is going to be the 4th option. If he was a high volume shooter, that number might actually mean something.
Then you have an inefficient chucker like Beasley at the 3.
Two matchups vs Battier last year. 18 ppg, 50% from the field. Not too inefficient.
With Manu you don't need a true pass-first PG eitherHaving a pass first point guard takes pressure off Manu. Dont really see the downside.

I'm not even sold on KG/Manu both holding up over a deep playoff run.
Manu just played 80 games, KG played 71. You're basing a vote off hypothetical injuries that neither player even ended the season with?

theheatles
09-23-2011, 06:29 PM
i think providence has the edge at every position except PG...i think providence has the better bench by far as well

Buz
09-23-2011, 06:33 PM
Paso

John Walls Era
09-23-2011, 06:36 PM
28-19 I believe. Randy Marsh has 50 posts.

Sportfan
09-23-2011, 06:39 PM
:facepalm:. The talent in a redraft is obviously going to be nowhere near the talent on a real finals team. Also, without Lebron in the finals, the heat may have done better. We have the perfect PG in place (MoWill) who can hit open 3s and create his own shot. Battier still brings really good defense and Haywood is a huge upgrade over Joel Anthony who can't catch a basketball on offense. Then our bench was improved significantly as Deshawn is better than the Mike Miller of last year, Haslem healthy is better than Haslem injured, and Pryzbilla is better than Big Z or Magloire. The only place we downgrade on the bench is Omri Casspi vs. James Jones.

Edit: For the record, Randy Marsh has under 100 posts.
lmao coming from the 2nd biggest heat homer on the site.

1. We have a much better center.
2. We have a better bench.
3. Our SF is very good defensively and can help stop your inefficient SF.
4. Our PG is a great complement to Wade+Bosh, since he can consistently hit open 3s and create his own shot.
5. Our overall team defense is very good and could become even better late in games if we bring in Deshawn and Haslem.
6. We have 5 players from last year's finals in our main rotation and we have just as much experience as your team.
7. Our two best players can log significantly more minutes than your two.

Those are just to name a few. There are many more reasons would win this series.

Haywood ins't much better than anybody. What has he done lately that makes him so special? he was a backup center on a playoff team.

Not really. Lou Will is the best scorer on anyone's bench. Krstic is the best scoring center in the series. Posey is the best wing defender on either bench. Pryz and Casspi are trash, I'll stick with my bench

Tell me when he actually does slow him down

Wow, he can hit open 3's. Just came back from shooting some hoops, and I was knocking down some treys in a shootout as well eh? What makes you think he'll be wide open? Because I'll be double teaming Wade? Hey, if that means less wade and more Mo Williams chucking then you can guarantee I'll leave Mo in the corner and shutdown Wade. Oh yea, mo still shot 32% from 3 just saying.

From your depth chart, they are both listed only at the PF and SG spot so you basically just said Wade and Bosh are out at the end of the games.

And only one of them has a ring while playing decent role on the team, from 5 years ago might i add.

It won't matter though, because of your super awesome bench you have you'll play them instead of Wade and Bosh at the end of games?-


Rondo is always clutch in the postseason? What? He's had some good series but just last year he was extremely underwhelming. He was downright bad in the Heat series and just hit/miss vs. the pitiful Knicks defense.

Meanwhile, Big Ben is all name value at this point. Combine Wallace's 2.9ppg with Rondo's pitiful 50%TS and El Paso is off to a poor start offensively. Then you have an inefficient chucker like Beasley at the 3. Its not a great mix of talent. With Manu you don't need a true pass-first PG either, they should have flipped Rondo for a better center or even SF. I'm not even sold on KG/Manu both holding up over a deep playoff run.

I'm going to vote Providence.

14/6/10 with the best FG% he's ever had in a single postseason.

Even with Big Ben there, Haywood isn't going to do jackshit making it an irrelevant matchup.
I thought you were always a defensive minded guy?
Don't tell me what I should have done, I'm content with the team i built. made it farther than you did...




:p


But at least you've come out here giving a reason unlike another 20+ voters.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:41 PM
A center that wont even put a mark on the series.

Explain.

Your 'very good' defensive SF allowed Beasley to drop 18 ppg on 50% shooting last year in two matchups.

In 6 playoff matchups, Mo Williams has shot 21% from 3pt range against Rondo. In these same matchups, Rondo outscores Williams 20 to 13, outrebounds Williams 6.5 to 3.5 per, and out assists him 12 to 5.5, all while outshooting him overall 54% to 40%.

Stevenson was terrible defensively last year. Haslem was average.

Meaningless.

Untrue. Manu and KG will play significantly higher minutes in the finals than they would in the regular season, and Rondo can play the whole game.

No, there aren't.

1. Haywood is a better rebounder, defender, and can score 6-8 pts on offense meaning that defenses can't just leave him wide open which is what happened to the Heat in the real Finals. Bosh was doubled as Joel might be the worst offensive player in the league.

2. Read my writeup. Our bench has two very good players and other solid pieces, while there are bench only has one player who can make a difference. But wait a second! How is Louis Williams going to be able to make a difference actually? As SF said, Rondo can play 48 min (or at least 38-40) and neither guard can play SG. 8-10 minutes of Louis Williams isn't enough for him to make a difference when he got 26 mpg in the playoffs and 22-23 in the regular season.

3. I know you like to use two or three individual matchups or seven years worth of data, whenever it helps you more ;). Look at the players around Battier at the time, not that good, and even if they were good, two games of data is too unreliable. Now he has an all-nba defender in Wade for help, Bosh who can contain his man downlow, and Haywood who averages over 2 blocks in the minutes we give him.

4. Yes, this was when Mo Williams was Cleveland's second best player. Now he is our third best player and will receive open looks. If Rondo wants to play super tight on him, we are fine with having the best guard in the NBA (Dwyane Wade) and a top 5 PF (Chris Bosh) getting one on one matchups with broken knees Ben Wallace guarding the hoop. Overall, Mo Williams is a great 3pt shooter for his position and will make open shots if given the opportunity.

5. Did you watch the playoffs? Stevenson played a big part in Dallas' victories and helped guard superstars out of the perimeter. He also made some clutch and timely 3 pointers. Without Deshawn in the finals, the series could have changed. Haslem has always been a great defender, you can't deny that. He also played less than 20 games last year (estimating) and was coming off of a huge injury playoff time. In this, he is completely healthy and there is no reason he wouldn't go back to his old form.

6. Experience is experience. It may not give a team a huge edge, but it can put them over the top.

7. Manu has averaged over 35 mpg in the playoffs once and for his career averages 31. After a long playoff run and whole NBA season, saying he could play for about 33 mpg is fair. KG has averaged 35 mpg of the last two playoffs. There is no reason this total would go up. In fact, when the Celtics made their final run in 09-10, he averaged only 33 mpg for the playoffs. At this point KG would be 36 with 17 or 18 seasons played.

8. Yes. There. Are.

8. Yes. There. Are.

theheatles
09-23-2011, 06:44 PM
i don't see how el paso even scores...

when wade tries, he's the best on ball defender in the league and will contain if not lockdown an old and breaking down manu

battier will put the clamps on beasley

kg is a fossil and can't produce on offense; not to mention bosh gave him the business in the playoffs last year

ben wallace is a nothing at his stage and will get worked on the glass by haywood

rondo will be helpless with this cast, ray and pierce allowed rondo to play his game and excel and now he has 2 slashers instead of the best jump shooter ever and another elite slasher who's an elite jump shooter too

providence in 5

mightybosstone
09-23-2011, 06:47 PM
Meanwhile, Big Ben is all name value at this point. Combine Wallace's 2.9ppg with Rondo's pitiful 50%TS and El Paso is off to a poor start offensively. Then you have an inefficient chucker like Beasley at the 3.

This is essentially the main reason I'm voting Providence, as well. Neither team is a great offensive club, but Providence has two elite offensive players, a strong No. 3 and two defensive minded players who could give you double digits in a pinch. El Paso has Wallace (completely devoid of any offensive skills aside from put backs), Rondo (who is a liability as a shooter and on the free throw line) and Michael Beasley (who has an inflated usage rate and poor shooting numbers on a terrible team). And that's before you consider that KG is well past his point of being a strong second option.

Manu has never done better than 35 minutes and 20 points a game in a postseason before. And I just don't think that's enough to get it done on a team with three huge question marks on the offensive side of the ball. I do think Manu vs. Wade would be EXTREMELY fun to watch in the fourth quarter of games, but if Manu isn't hitting his shots, I'm not sure I trust KG to be the guy who takes over.

And I just really hate their bench. Posey is the only one off the bench with serious postseason experience, there's way too much youth, way too little talent and their front court depth is atrocious for a team with a 72-year-old starting PF and C. Kevben Wallnett is old enough to have great grandchildren, and their response to that is Nenad Krstic and Jordan freakin' Hill!?!

Jordan Hill might be the most frustrating players I've seen on the Rockets since Stromile Swift. For every sweet post move he has, there's three times where he completely misses an assignment on defense, turns the ball over for no reason or misses a wide open 10 footer. And you want him matched up with Bosh or Haslem in game seven of the NBA Finals? :speechless:

In all seriousness, it's not all that bad and it would be a close series. Haywood and Mo are both coming off of really poor seasons and the competitiveness of 4 of El Paso's starting 5 would be pretty intense to face in an NBA Finals. But I think the pieces fall into place a little better with Providence than they do with El Paso.

Providence in six.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:47 PM
i think providence has the edge at every position except PG...i think providence has the better bench by far as well
Preach it :worthy:.


Not really. Lou Will is the best scorer on anyone's bench. Krstic is the best scoring center in the series. Posey is the best wing defender on either bench. Pryz and Casspi are trash, I'll stick with my bench


Wow, he can hit open 3's. Just came back from shooting some hoops, and I was knocking down some treys in a shootout as well eh? What makes you think he'll be wide open? Because I'll be double teaming Wade? Hey, if that means less wade and more Mo Williams chucking then you can guarantee I'll leave Mo in the corner and shutdown Wade. Oh yea, mo still shot 32% from 3 just saying.

From your depth chart, they are both listed only at the PF and SG spot so you basically just said Wade and Bosh are out at the end of the games.


1. WHERE IS LOUIS WILLIAMS GETTING MINUTES? :confused: You also only mention one side of the ball. Pryzbilla is a better defender and rebounder than Kristic. Omri is also a better scorer than Posey. You also left out Deshawn who made a positive difference starting for the 2011 champs.

2. While being a no.2 option on a finals team with a superstar, Mo Williams shot 40% + and was an all-star. As our third option, he will shoot just as efficiently or even better.

3. Wade could slide to PG if needed (like he did in the Finals at times) and as I mentioned Haslem can play C against Ben Wallace. Again, this would only be for the last two or three minutes if needed.

BranWingss
09-23-2011, 06:49 PM
i don't see how el paso even scores...

when wade tries, he's the best on ball defender in the league and will contain if not lockdown an old and breaking down manu

battier will put the clamps on beasley

kg is a fossil and can't produce on offense; not to mention bosh gave him the business in the playoffs last year

ben wallace is a nothing at his stage and will get worked on the glass by haywood

rondo will be helpless with this cast, ray and pierce allowed rondo to play his game and excel and now he has 2 slashers instead of the best jump shooter ever and another elite slasher who's an elite jump shooter too

providence in 5

And Bosh puts up 34/12/10 right?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:52 PM
i don't see how el paso even scores...

when wade tries, he's the best on ball defender in the league and will contain if not lockdown an old and breaking down manu

battier will put the clamps on beasley

kg is a fossil and can't produce on offense; not to mention bosh gave him the business in the playoffs last year

ben wallace is a nothing at his stage and will get worked on the glass by haywood

rondo will be helpless with this cast, ray and pierce allowed rondo to play his game and excel and now he has 2 slashers instead of the best jump shooter ever and another elite slasher who's an elite jump shooter too

providence in 5
Keep on preaching :worthy:.

This is essentially the main reason I'm voting Providence, as well. Neither team is a great offensive club, but Providence has two elite offensive players, a strong No. 3 and two defensive minded players who could give you double digits in a pinch. El Paso has Wallace (completely devoid of any offensive skills aside from put backs), Rondo (who is a liability as a shooter and on the free throw line) and Michael Beasley (who has an inflated usage rate and poor shooting numbers on a terrible team). And that's before you consider that KG is well past his point of being a strong second option.

Manu has never done better than 35 minutes and 20 points a game in a postseason before. And I just don't think that's enough to get it done on a team with three huge question marks on the offensive side of the ball. I do think Manu vs. Wade would be EXTREMELY fun to watch in the fourth quarter of games, but if Manu isn't hitting his shots, I'm not sure I trust KG to be the guy who takes over.

And I just really hate their bench. Posey is the only one off the bench with serious postseason experience, there's way too much youth, way too little talent and their front court depth is atrocious for a team with a 72-year-old starting PF and C. Kevben Wallnett is old enough to have great grandchildren, and their response to that is Nenad Krstic and Jordan freakin' Hill!?!

Jordan Hill might be the most frustrating players I've seen on the Rockets since Stromile Swift. For every sweet post move he has, there's three times where he completely misses an assignment on defense, turns the ball over for no reason or misses a wide open 10 footer. And you want him matched up with Bosh or Haslem in game seven of the NBA Finals? :speechless:

In all seriousness, it's not all that bad and it would be a close series. Haywood and Mo are both coming off of really poor seasons and the competitiveness of 4 of El Paso's starting 5 would be pretty intense to face in an NBA Finals. But I think the pieces fall into place a little better with Providence than they do with El Paso.

Providence in six.

This was a well articulated response and basically overlaps with what I put in our writeup. I agree completely :up:.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-23-2011, 06:53 PM
And Bosh puts up 34/12/10 right?

Nah, but I think 18-20 and 8-9 is very reasonable since he will see more touches than he did last year and Big Ben is guarding the paint.

mightybosstone
09-23-2011, 07:02 PM
Haywood ins't much better than anybody. What has he done lately that makes him so special? he was a backup center on a playoff team.
Bill Walton was a backup center on a playoff team. And that's just one example...


Not really. Lou Will is the best scorer on anyone's bench. Krstic is the best scoring center in the series. Posey is the best wing defender on either bench. Pryz and Casspi are trash, I'll stick with my bench.
Williams is a strong 6th man, and I like his game, but I don't see you getting a ton of points from the rest of that bench. Krstic being the "best scoring center" in this series is debatable, but even if it's true, it would be like winning a spelling bee among dyslexic second-graders with the word "cat." No one is impressed.

Posey being a better perimeter defender than Stevenson is completely debatable and I wouldn't consider Przybilla or Casspi "trash" at all. Casspi's a decent shooter and rebounder and Przybilla could probably still give you decent defense and rebounding for 10-15 minutes a night.


Because I'll be double teaming Wade? Hey, if that means less wade and more Mo Williams chucking then you can guarantee I'll leave Mo in the corner and shutdown Wade. Oh yea, mo still shot 32% from 3 just saying.
Mo was hurt for a good portion of last season and playing on a terrible team. With Lebron, he put up ridiculous shooting numbers and see no reason why a healthy Mo couldn't put up at least 38% on this team over a series.


14/6/10 with the best FG% he's ever had in a single postseason.
Yeah... Rondo also posted a .509 TS%, a .102 WS/48 and a career low 21.1 TO% in that postseason. Isn't selecting individual stats to prove a point fun!


Even with Big Ben there, Haywood isn't going to do jackshit making it an irrelevant matchup.
This is a fair argument. I don't think either player will make much of a difference on the offensive side of the ball, but I do think Haywood's ability to finish around the rim could provide SOME support as opposed to Ben's NO support.


Don't tell me what I should have done, I'm content with the team i built. made it farther than you did...
Some of us don't think you should have... :shrug:

MTar786
09-24-2011, 12:12 AM
Bahahhahahahahahahahhsahahahhaha

Ever heard of, defense?


I swear, psd voters are out to get me. I have a killer offensive team last year with D-Will/Thornton/Granger/Jamsion/McGee and all anyone compared about was my lack of D at the 2 and 4. WTF

yes i have.. and in my eyes if you're even better at defense its by te slightest of margins.. yes, kg, rondo, ben, manu and posey sound like an all defensive lineup.. but thats if this was 2006.. now kg is what 35? posey is 35? manu is 33 and ben is rather useless now. . Like i said.. age will play against you and rondo is ur x factor.. give me wade,battier,haywood,haslem, and bledsoe and im very happy. young fresh and not near as injury prone as ur squad. lets see.. manu minus this past season was at the doctors office all the time lol.. kg is too old and isnt the same. posey is old news.. ben wallace is ancient history.. that leaves you with rondo. sorry bro.. but you are either getting swept or losing in 5.. yes, you might have the slightest of edges in the defensive department.. but you get OWNED on offense.

John Walls Era
09-24-2011, 01:58 AM
31 to 27 (2 votes by under 100 post members for Paso)

Baller1
09-24-2011, 02:54 AM
:laugh:

People are putting way too much into age. These teams made it to the finals, so now it's time for the player to go all out. You really think Manu and KG would let their age affect them at this point in the season? No, KG isn't what he used to be, but when he's in the game, he's still one of the most dominant defenders and strongest leaders in the game.

El Paso would take this in 6.

Sportfan
09-24-2011, 07:12 AM
Spoken like someone who has never done a redraft before. You really expect a GM to be able to build a team comparable to the Miami Heat in game where you are only assigned 1 pick in the first 30?
He has played this game before though :shrug:

1. Haywood is a better rebounder, defender, and can score 6-8 pts on offense meaning that defenses can't just leave him wide open which is what happened to the Heat in the real Finals. Bosh was doubled as Joel might be the worst offensive player in the league.

2. Read my writeup. Our bench has two very good players and other solid pieces, while there are bench only has one player who can make a difference. But wait a second! How is Louis Williams going to be able to make a difference actually? As SF said, Rondo can play 48 min (or at least 38-40) and neither guard can play SG. 8-10 minutes of Louis Williams isn't enough for him to make a difference when he got 26 mpg in the playoffs and 22-23 in the regular season.

3. I know you like to use two or three individual matchups or seven years worth of data, whenever it helps you more ;). Look at the players around Battier at the time, not that good, and even if they were good, two games of data is too unreliable. Now he has an all-nba defender in Wade for help, Bosh who can contain his man downlow, and Haywood who averages over 2 blocks in the minutes we give him.

4. Yes, this was when Mo Williams was Cleveland's second best player. Now he is our third best player and will receive open looks. If Rondo wants to play super tight on him, we are fine with having the best guard in the NBA (Dwyane Wade) and a top 5 PF (Chris Bosh) getting one on one matchups with broken knees Ben Wallace guarding the hoop. Overall, Mo Williams is a great 3pt shooter for his position and will make open shots if given the opportunity.

5. Did you watch the playoffs? Stevenson played a big part in Dallas' victories and helped guard superstars out of the perimeter. He also made some clutch and timely 3 pointers. Without Deshawn in the finals, the series could have changed. Haslem has always been a great defender, you can't deny that. He also played less than 20 games last year (estimating) and was coming off of a huge injury playoff time. In this, he is completely healthy and there is no reason he wouldn't go back to his old form.

6. Experience is experience. It may not give a team a huge edge, but it can put them over the top.

7. Manu has averaged over 35 mpg in the playoffs once and for his career averages 31. After a long playoff run and whole NBA season, saying he could play for about 33 mpg is fair. KG has averaged 35 mpg of the last two playoffs. There is no reason this total would go up. In fact, when the Celtics made their final run in 09-10, he averaged only 33 mpg for the playoffs. At this point KG would be 36 with 17 or 18 seasons played.

8. Yes. There. Are.

8. Yes. There. Are.
1. Would love to hear your explanation why he's a better defender. Ben Wallace had a higher rebounding rate so I'd give it to him there.With a TS% of 532, go ahead give him more shots jut like you said you'll be giving Mo Williams more shots from 3. With the way it looks right now, Mo and Haywood are your #1 #2 scoters lmao.

2. He'll be getting 15-20ish+ minutes, never said Rondo will play the whole game said he can. He'll go about 45ish minutes. Lol why can't Lou Will play SG? He isn't a passer by any means. I'll always have someone out to defend wade whether is Rondo Manu Posey etc. I could play small ball in some sub packages if I have to with Lou Will and Manu at the wings Posey/Beasley/Krstic at PF and KG at center. Don't forget teague, he made Rose look bad in the playlets can easily do the same to Mo.

3. Dont even start with this. If I use any sort of long term data for KG you'll jump on me that's it's not relevant. What if Wade's postseason was a fluke? What if he reverts back to his old ways? See it works both ways

4. So he was 2nd option, that's pretty said he still couldn't outscore Boston's 4th option.
And you're really killing yourself with this open shot thing. Open looks is basically saying I'm double teaming Wade with Rondo and Manu, if that's the case Wade is getting shut down at all costs. You have Manu playing the hard nosed defense that's slowed Wade down before then Rondo comes right in the passing lane and gambles for the steal, oh man a double team beatdown right there.

5. No, these go for right now, not mid 2012. If that was the Cade though, Beasley and Turner would be all stars with all this vet support.

6. Exactly, my experience puts me over the top

7. kG had no problem playing 40 in the postseason:shrug: You realize there's a big break between the coference finals and NBA finals?

KnicksorBust
09-24-2011, 07:41 AM
Meaningless, they aren't asking him to be a scorer.

There is a difference between starting someone who doesn't need to be a scorer vs. starting someone who is has a negative effect on offense. With Wallace and Rondo you have two extremely ineffecient scorers in the same lineup. Throw in the fact that KG is only good for 15 points and you're only getting about 30 points per game from 60% of your starting lineup. When you compound it with the issues of the rest of the team it becomes worse.


Again, meaningless. Rondo is going to be the 4th option. If he was a high volume shooter, that number might actually mean something.
How you can act like being an ineffecient and a non-scoring threat is meaningless? They almost playing 3 on 5 offensively.


Two matchups vs Battier last year. 18 ppg, 50% from the field. Not too inefficient.

In the first game:
http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/boxscores/minnesota-timberwolves-vs-houston-rockets/2011-01-24/11/17

Battier had 19 points on 12 shots. Beasley had 16 points on 16 shots. Battier lit him up. Beasley had 0 free throw attempts. I'm not really that impressed.

In the second game:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201104020MEM.html

The Grizzlies won big and Battier only played 17 minutes. Sam Young spent more time on Beasley than anybody and even then Beasley got his 20 points on 16 shots while Battier was again an effecient 3-5 from the field and 1-1 from 3pt. If anything, those two sample games show me that Beasley is horrendous at sticking Battier.


Having a pass first point guard takes pressure off Manu. Dont really see the downside.

Whose handling the ball in the 4th? If you tell me Rondo then I really think Providence will win and if you tell me Manu then El Paso really will be playing 3 on 5 with Rondo and Ben Wallace as non-threats.


Manu just played 80 games, KG played 71. You're basing a vote off hypothetical injuries that neither player even ended the season with?

KG was banged up and had his worst postseason in a DECADE (0.0 offensive win shares in 9 games). I saw it with my own eyes and I went back and checked the numbers. They are a great pair in theory but not at this stage in their careers.

KnicksorBust
09-24-2011, 07:44 AM
Krstic being the "best scoring center" in this series is debatable, but even if it's true, it would be like winning a spelling bee among dyslexic second-graders with the word "cat." No one is impressed.



:laugh:

MTar786
09-24-2011, 08:02 AM
providence

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 09:29 AM
2. He'll be getting 15-20ish+ minutes, never said Rondo will play the whole game said he can. He'll go about 45ish minutes. Lol why can't Lou Will play SG? He isn't a passer by any means. I'll always have someone out to defend wade whether is Rondo Manu Posey etc. I could play small ball in some sub packages if I have to with Lou Will and Manu at the wings Posey/Beasley/Krstic at PF and KG at center. Don't forget teague, he made Rose look bad in the playlets can easily do the same to Mo.


So Rondo gets about 45 minutes at PG and you plan on playing LouWill 15-20. Basically you are saying that LouWill will get 3 mpg at PG and 12-17 at SG. Wade would wreck LouWill at SG and even Deshawn would have an advantage. That makes no sense at all. It would be like moving Dwyane Wade to small forward, just illogical. But wait, James Posey of all people will be stopping Dwyane :laugh2:. That's a joke. How will Manu be defending Wade when according to you he might only play 31 mpg considering LouWill might get 3 at PG and 17 at SG. 9-10 minutes of LouWill or Posey on Dwyane Wade (Wade will play 40-41 mpg) would get me at least 10 points on 60 FG% +. OR, you can avoid some of these problems and play "small ball". Wait a second. The problems are still there. You will have a undersized PG (6'1) and a true SG just moving up to SG and SF, respectively. They don't have the ability to do that. LouWill and Manu have been playing PG and SG for their whole careers and now in the Finals they are going to magically just change positions, especially when LouWill is going against the best guard in the NBA as voted by PSD. This is just garbage. I won't even get into Posey or Kristic at PF guarding Bosh or KG guarding the paint at C :laugh: :facepalm:.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 09:43 AM
yes i have.. and in my eyes if you're even better at defense its by te slightest of margins.. yes, kg, rondo, ben, manu and posey sound like an all defensive lineup.. but thats if this was 2006.. now kg is what 35? posey is 35? manu is 33 and ben is rather useless now. . Like i said.. age will play against you and rondo is ur x factor.. give me wade,battier,haywood,haslem, and bledsoe and im very happy. young fresh and not near as injury prone as ur squad. lets see.. manu minus this past season was at the doctors office all the time lol.. kg is too old and isnt the same. posey is old news.. ben wallace is ancient history.. that leaves you with rondo. sorry bro.. but you are either getting swept or losing in 5.. yes, you might have the slightest of edges in the defensive department.. but you get OWNED on offense.
Preach it :worthy:!


In the first game:
http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/boxscores/minnesota-timberwolves-vs-houston-rockets/2011-01-24/11/17

Battier had 19 points on 12 shots. Beasley had 16 points on 16 shots. Battier lit him up. Beasley had 0 free throw attempts. I'm not really that impressed.

In the second game:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201104020MEM.html

The Grizzlies won big and Battier only played 17 minutes. Sam Young spent more time on Beasley than anybody and even then Beasley got his 20 points on 16 shots while Battier was again an effecient 3-5 from the field and 1-1 from 3pt. If anything, those two sample games show me that Beasley is horrendous at sticking Battier.



Whose handling the ball in the 4th? If you tell me Rondo then I really think Providence will win and if you tell me Manu then El Paso really will be playing 3 on 5 with Rondo and Ben Wallace as non-threats.

Good catch on their matchups. I didn't even bother to look at them since it was only two games, but anyways it looks like Battier has actually played great against Beasley as he has exposed Beasley's defense and made him work hard on offense, like I said.

I also agree completely with the last part. Late in games or just the whole game really, I don't see how they are going to score enough or efficiently enough. Wade will be able to hold Manu to his averages or lower and as we all know, Dwyane boosts his game during the Finals. Battier will be sticking Beasley very well and while Beas could get 16-18 in this series, I don't see him being a consistent or efficient enough scorer to partly lead a finals team on offense. The only person on their offense who I can see surely getting 14-15 a night is KG (other than Manu), but then again that is probably the most he will get. To win this series they either need much more.

Sportfan
09-24-2011, 02:34 PM
So Rondo gets about 45 minutes at PG and you plan on playing LouWill 15-20. Basically you are saying that LouWill will get 3 mpg at PG and 12-17 at SG. Wade would wreck LouWill at SG and even Deshawn would have an advantage. That makes no sense at all. It would be like moving Dwyane Wade to small forward, just illogical. But wait, James Posey of all people will be stopping Dwyane :laugh2:. That's a joke. How will Manu be defending Wade when according to you he might only play 31 mpg considering LouWill might get 3 at PG and 17 at SG. 9-10 minutes of LouWill or Posey on Dwyane Wade (Wade will play 40-41 mpg) would get me at least 10 points on 60 FG% +. OR, you can avoid some of these problems and play "small ball". Wait a second. The problems are still there. You will have a undersized PG (6'1) and a true SG just moving up to SG and SF, respectively. They don't have the ability to do that. LouWill and Manu have been playing PG and SG for their whole careers and now in the Finals they are going to magically just change positions, especially when LouWill is going against the best guard in the NBA as voted by PSD. This is just garbage. I won't even get into Posey or Kristic at PF guarding Bosh or KG guarding the paint at C :laugh: :facepalm:.
Way to only point out one point in my post. I guess you must agree with everything else I said about your team

When did I say Manu was playing 31 minutes a game? Thanks for putting words into my mouth, again

Lou Will can't play the 2? lol what. He's never been a pg, jrue and iggy are always playing as the point. and once again you fail to show your ability to read when i said Lou Will won't be defending wade, he'll be on the pg.

WHat is illogical? A lot of teams have small ball sub packages especially with how many useless centers there are. You think there's never been time when Wade was the 3rd biggest guy on the court for his team?

yea, because basketball is all about height. smaller guys have an advantage too, they're much more athletic and quicker.


you won't get into it, because there is really nothing to laugh at :shrug:

oh yea, let's not forget we're pulling wade and bosh out late in the game :rolleyes:

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 02:52 PM
Way to only point out one point in my post. I guess you must agree with everything else I said about your team

When did I say Manu was playing 31 minutes a game? Thanks for putting words into my mouth, again

Lou Will can't play the 2? lol what. He's never been a pg, jrue and iggy are always playing as the point. and once again you fail to show your ability to read when i said Lou Will won't be defending wade, he'll be on the pg.

WHat is illogical? A lot of teams have small ball sub packages especially with how many useless centers there are. You think there's never been time when Wade was the 3rd biggest guy on the court for his team?

yea, because basketball is all about height. smaller guys have an advantage too, they're much more athletic and quicker.


you won't get into it, because there is really nothing to laugh at :shrug:

oh yea, let's not forget we're pulling wade and bosh out late in the game :rolleyes:

Where did I say I would pull out Wade and Bosh at the end of games? In fact, I addressed that in another post. Deshawn plays SG, Wade could play PG for very limited minutes at the end of games, and Haslem can play C since Big Ben is also undersized and sucks on offense. It's not my fault you can't read. So if you have LouWill on Mo Williams then I guess Rondo's defense on MoWill which you talked about in this series, doesn't do **** if he's not guarding him. Besides, Wade would wreck Rondo on offense and on defense Rondo wouldn't even get a shot off (not that he can make one anyways ;)). Battier on Manu is fine with me. Shane is still a really good defender and has significantly more strength and more size than Manu. It's not like Manu is super athletic or super fast.

HOW THE HELL IS JAMES POSEY ON CHRIS BOSH, OK? Bosh is way too skilled and offensively dominant for the old and worthless James Posey. In fact, Bosh is definitely quicker than Posey which basically negates your logic that since Posey is smaller he is more athletic. Nenad Kristic isn't much better either :facepalm:. Bosh would make Nenad his *****. Chris dominates on slower, less agile PFs. Now you are going to put an even less athletic and slow CENTER on him. You are delusional. You are trying to put a ****** center and piss-poor small forward on a top 5 PF who has the second best jumpshot at his position.

Swashcuff
09-24-2011, 02:52 PM
In the first game:
http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/boxscores/minnesota-timberwolves-vs-houston-rockets/2011-01-24/11/17

Battier had 19 points on 12 shots. Beasley had 16 points on 16 shots. Battier lit him up. Beasley had 0 free throw attempts. I'm not really that impressed.

In the second game:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201104020MEM.html

The Grizzlies won big and Battier only played 17 minutes. Sam Young spent more time on Beasley than anybody and even then Beasley got his 20 points on 16 shots while Battier was again an effecient 3-5 from the field and 1-1 from 3pt. If anything, those two sample games show me that Beasley is horrendous at sticking Battier.

Something we have to be wary of in head to head match-ups (especially when talking about a few games) is system. I mean the Timberwolves were the fastest paced team in the league last season and the 4th worst defensively. Conversely the Rockets were 7th in Pace and 11th in D. One would expect that when these 2 teams play each other tonnes of points will be scored and that was evident by the 254 points they scored in their first match-up against each other.

I'd figure that El Paso would be below league average in terms of their pace while Providence would be average. This would change the dynamic of the scoring output of certain head to head comparisons.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
09-24-2011, 02:54 PM
I think El Paso has a slight edge here.

pd1dish
09-24-2011, 03:55 PM
Providence. El Paso....if you arent going to put the effort into a write-up, then i cant vote for you. even though i dont read the writeups anyways

Sportfan
09-24-2011, 03:59 PM
Providence. El Paso....if you arent going to put the effort into a write-up, then i cant vote for you. even though i dont read the writeups anyways
For this guy's vote to be worth more than somebody with under 100 posts is idiotic

Thanks a lot MWC.

John Walls Era
09-24-2011, 04:06 PM
nvm

Crom-Viscera
09-24-2011, 04:28 PM
looking at El Paso's roster there's more skilled players at each position than Providence. not only does El Paso have better talented players IMO they also have good players that could come off the bench and score

Corey
09-24-2011, 04:34 PM
There is a difference between starting someone who doesn't need to be a scorer vs. starting someone who is has a negative effect on offense. With Wallace and Rondo you have two extremely ineffecient scorers in the same lineup. Throw in the fact that KG is only good for 15 points and you're only getting about 30 points per game from 60% of your starting lineup. When you compound it with the issues of the rest of the team it becomes worse.
You're right. The Celtics starting Perk and Rondo for the last handful of years was super-detrimental to the offense.



How you can act like being an ineffecient and a non-scoring threat is meaningless? They almost playing 3 on 5 offensively.
That's really hurt the Celtics the last three years, hasn't it? A fourth option not being the most efficient scorer isn't a concern for any team. He takes like 6 shots per game. Whoop-de-doo.




In the first game:
If anything, those two sample games show me that Beasley is horrendous at sticking Battier.

Pick and choose what stats you want to put up, that's convenient. At the end of the day, Beasley averaged 18 ppg and 50% from the field. Try to shape it anyway you want.


Whose handling the ball in the 4th? If you tell me Rondo then I really think Providence will win and if you tell me Manu then El Paso really will be playing 3 on 5 with Rondo and Ben Wallace as non-threats.
Providence will win if Rondo is setting up plays in the 4th quarter? How does that make any sense? He's a top 5 point guard.



KG was banged up and had his worst postseason in a DECADE (0.0 offensive win shares in 9 games). I saw it with my own eyes and I went back and checked the numbers. They are a great pair in theory but not at this stage in their careers.
Win shares is just as much based on team performance. The Celtics played like **** against the Heat. In the regular season he produced .194 WS/48 with 3.4 OWS and 5.6 DWS. You're basing his body of work on a playoff series in which the Celtics had no shot, and completely dismiss his ridiculously productive regular season in which he was the best defensive PF in the NBA.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 04:39 PM
looking at El Paso's roster there's more skilled players at each position than Providence. not only does El Paso have better talented players IMO they also have good players that could come off the bench and score

And we don't? In fact, we have more bench weapons. Haslem, Casspi, Stevenson would definitely score more than LouWill, Posey, Nenad. Especially when you consider Louis Williams will be playing at most 20 mpg and more at SG while Posey will be at PF according to their GM.

Pete Dahh Sneak
09-24-2011, 04:42 PM
For this guy's vote to be worth more than somebody with under 100 posts is idiotic

Thanks a lot MWC.

I voted El Paso to negate that guy's vote.

Fly
09-24-2011, 04:48 PM
definitely el paso. Rondo will shut down Mo, and will have no problem driving in for layups against a weak big man in Bosh. Manu will give Wade more problems than people think he will. Beasley owns Battier, and Garnett will shut down Bosh.

MTar786
09-24-2011, 05:14 PM
providence would win in 5 or 6.. but since el paso has no game plan (write up) they get swept haha

the_jon
09-24-2011, 08:08 PM
El Paso. I love defense and Brian Scalabrine.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 08:15 PM
El Paso. I love defense and Brian Scalabrine.

While his team has a good amount of defense, it is not like my team is lacking one bit. At this point, Haywood is a much better defender than Big Ben. Wade is an all-nba defender and better than Manu. Battier is a very good, technical defender and so much better than Beasley. While Mo Will is obviously not great on D, PG defense is generally considered the least significant. And then I got Bosh who may be slow on rotations, but is pretty good in the post. Plus with Haywood, Wade, and Battier handling their men and MoWill playing three or four feet of off Rondo, Bosh shouldn't have to worry about getting blocks.

Sportfan
09-24-2011, 08:29 PM
still waiting to hear how haywood is better defender than big ben. not denying it, want to see your reason

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 08:42 PM
still waiting to hear how haywood is better defender than big ben. not denying it, want to see your reason

Haywood for us will be receiving about 28-30 mpg which is the amount he received in 09-10. During this time he averaged 9+ rebs, 2.1 blks with 3.0 WS and a blk% of 5. In Dallas he was receiving inconsistent minutes and just couldn't get into a rhythm. Some night he got 8 minutes and others 20. I believe it is fair to say he could produce similar numbers to the ones he posted just two seasons ago. Haywood is also a pretty good man to man post defender and can match any center with his size and strength. Big Ben was one of the greatest defensive players in his prime, but now he is a shell of his former self. He doesn't have the athleticism or strength from his youth to make up for his height or be feared in the paint. Per 36, he averages less defensive rebounds and blocks as Haywood (even counting last season as well for Haywood). His dRTG and DWS have also been lower than Haywood's for each of the last two years, individually.

MTar786
09-24-2011, 08:53 PM
the funny part is that providence wouldnt be able to beat the heat and el paso wouldnt be able to beat boston haha.. just thought id mention this

SeoulBeatz
09-24-2011, 09:07 PM
It's El Paso for me.

People seem to be overlooking Manu (one of the best scorers in the league) and getting caught up in Wade and Bosh's big names.

I think El Paso just has a better overall team IMO.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 09:22 PM
It's El Paso for me.

People seem to be overlooking Manu (one of the best scorers in the league) and getting caught up in Wade and Bosh's big names.

I think El Paso just has a better overall team IMO.

Eh, I'm not buying that at all. Wade and Bosh aren't just "big names". Wade is BY FAR the best SG in the league and the BEST GUARD as voted by the majority of PSD. Bosh is also a perennial all-star and at worst at top 5 PF. Manu is no doubt an excellent player but he will be asked to carry the load offensively and have to score major points and play major minutes for them to even have a chance to win.

Edit: Manu is a really good scorer, but he is in no way one of the best. Lebron, Dwight, Wade, Dirk, CP3, KD, Rose, Amare, Dwill, Kobe, Pau, Kevin Martin are all better to name a few. Hell, Chris Bosh averaged more pgg in the regular season and only 2 pts less in the posteason...as a number three option.

Sportfan
09-24-2011, 09:28 PM
Haywood for us will be receiving about 28-30 mpg which is the amount he received in 09-10. During this time he averaged 9+ rebs, 2.1 blks with 3.0 WS and a blk% of 5. In Dallas he was receiving inconsistent minutes and just couldn't get into a rhythm. Some night he got 8 minutes and others 20. I believe it is fair to say he could produce similar numbers to the ones he posted just two seasons ago. Haywood is also a pretty good man to man post defender and can match any center with his size and strength. Big Ben was one of the greatest defensive players in his prime, but now he is a shell of his former self. He doesn't have the athleticism or strength from his youth to make up for his height or be feared in the paint. Per 36, he averages less defensive rebounds and blocks as Haywood (even counting last season as well for Haywood). His dRTG and DWS have also been lower than Haywood's for each of the last two years, individually.
Sounds more like hoping for best case scenario rather than an actual reason

MiamiWadeCounty
09-24-2011, 09:36 PM
Sounds more like hoping for best case scenario rather than an actual reason

Haywood still posted better stats defensively as mentioned in the 10-11 compared to Big Ben in the 10-11 season. Guess you overlooked that part. Plus, while Haywood has the opportunity to get better in consistent minutes, there is no upside for Big Ben.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
09-25-2011, 04:01 AM
Haywood is much better than Wallace now.

Big Ben is close to retiring.

Avenged
09-25-2011, 05:32 AM
Haywood is much better than Wallace now.

Big Ben is close to retiring.

Yeah but I think it's safe to say the position at the 5 won't hold much of an impact on either team. Haywood may be better but he's not good enough to make a mark in this series.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:31 AM
And we don't? In fact, we have more bench weapons. Haslem, Casspi, Stevenson would definitely score more than LouWill, Posey, Nenad. Especially when you consider Louis Williams will be playing at most 20 mpg and more at SG while Posey will be at PF according to their GM.
stevenson and casspi are trash


I voted El Paso to negate that guy's vote.
:hi5:

providence would win in 5 or 6.. but since el paso has no game plan (write up) they get swept haha
lol

While his team has a good amount of defense, it is not like my team is lacking one bit. At this point, Haywood is a much better defender than Big Ben. Wade is an all-nba defender and better than Manu. Battier is a very good, technical defender and so much better than Beasley. While Mo Will is obviously not great on D, PG defense is generally considered the least significant. And then I got Bosh who may be slow on rotations, but is pretty good in the post. Plus with Haywood, Wade, and Battier handling their men and MoWill playing three or four feet of off Rondo, Bosh shouldn't have to worry about getting blocks.
no he isn't "much better" and ben proved to be a better rebounder
battier's d is as good as posey's defense, take that however way you want.

yea play off rondo, like teams havent tried that already. it doesnt work.

It's El Paso for me.

People seem to be overlooking Manu (one of the best scorers in the league) and getting caught up in Wade and Bosh's big names.

I think El Paso just has a better overall team IMO.
agreed. plus evan turner and lou will :drool:

Yeah but I think it's safe to say the position at the 5 won't hold much of an impact on either team. Haywood may be better but he's not good enough to make a mark in this series.
yup, plus its more of a rotation of krstic and big ben, krstic for O and ben for defense/rebounding

big ben had a 107 drtg on the worst defensive team in the league, by far the best on his team. haywood wasn't even top 5?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:10 AM
A lot of votes in a short amount of time coming here.

roshan3ai
09-25-2011, 11:14 AM
Holy **** how did that happen? I checked like an hour ago and it was a solid lead for Providence

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:20 AM
Holy **** how did that happen? I checked like an hour ago and it was a solid lead for Providence

Basically, with SF wearing that sig, he went into the Boston forum and started posting. Obviously, his friends/Boston fans, will proceed to vote giving him 7 consecutive votes in 30 minutes. Therefore, I changed my sig, since it was really unfair of him to do that in the first place.

Anyways, Providence is up by 1 since we have 1 voter under 100 and El Paso has 2.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:23 AM
oh man, i posted in my own forum how could i.


just like you made a random post in the raptors ot forum? hmmm.

just like you posted in the miami forums right now? hmmm

if it really bugs you i can take it off

but i really want to see those 7 boston fans you're mentioning

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:25 AM
oh man, i posted in my own forum how could i.


just like you made a random post in the raptors ot forum? hmmm.

just like you posted in the miami forums right now? hmmm

if it really bugs you i can take it off

but i really want to see those 7 boston fans you're mentioning

Yep. If you are going to use this "loophole", it is only fair I have the same chance.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:29 AM
i don't care, go ahead and use it. if you want me to take it off i'll take it off because all it's doing is increasing the amount of votes for both sides.

still waiting on those 7 boston fans

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 11:33 AM
double post

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 11:33 AM
wow 48-48...this is game 7 double OT

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:35 AM
wow 48-48...this is game 7 double OT

Technically it is 47-46 Providence. But yeah, it's super close.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:35 AM
47-46 actually, with 7 hours to go

roshan3ai
09-25-2011, 11:44 AM
That is pretty shady SF. And I see what MWC is talking about. I saw a few Boston fans' votes that weren't there when I check a couple hours ago. It definitely gives you an advantage to have that in your sig, post in your team's forum with that sig with people that you are friends with/familiar with. It won't matter since MWC will do the same thing to even it out but to say it doesn't give you an advantage is just false.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:46 AM
That is pretty shady SF. And I see what MWC is talking about. I saw a few Boston fans' votes that weren't there when I check a couple hours ago. It definitely gives you an advantage to have that in your sig, post in your team's forum with that sig with people that you are friends with/familiar with. It won't matter since MWC will do the same thing to even it out but to say it doesn't give you an advantage is just false.

Yeah I changed my sig a few hours after I saw him getting votes last night. I decided to change it back to nothing this morning and so has sportfan mostly. But to be honest, the damage has already been done as you can see.

Edit: You are also forgetting one key thing. I don't have any friends :sad2:.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:48 AM
because smashmouth, sensandraps, boms are all defiantly biased to me :eyebrows: 2 boston fans happend to vote for me, (not 7 like mwc says) patsfan56 is a new voter, and he voted for providence. see it works both ways.

sigs are taken down anyway so doesnt matter


^lol votes from last night? i didnt make a single post in any boston forum last night, stop with the bs.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:51 AM
tied game!


but wait, my players are in my sig, so that vote isnt legit, right mwc? :sigh:

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:53 AM
tied game!


but wait, my players are in my sig, so that vote isnt legit, right mwc? :sigh:

I will direct you to Rosh's post. Anyways, Providence up by 1.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 11:55 AM
and i answered

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 11:58 AM
because smashmouth, sensandraps, boms are all defiantly biased to me :eyebrows: 2 boston fans happend to vote for me, (not 7 like mwc says) patsfan56 is a new voter, and he voted for providence. see it works both ways.

sigs are taken down anyway so doesnt matter


^lol votes from last night? i didnt make a single post in any boston forum last night, stop with the bs.

Avrpatsfan, bigA9331, schilling, ne3xchamps all have voted within the hour.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 12:07 PM
Avrpatsfan, bigA9331, schilling, ne3xchamps all have voted within the hour.
schilling isnt a sox fan

ne3x voted last night pretty sure.

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 12:10 PM
I could've sworn I was the GM... :sigh:

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 12:11 PM
why the hell do you keep doing that, stop taking RR's credit

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 12:46 PM
Mainly because I don't care for the tension in this thread :)

KnicksorBust
09-25-2011, 12:48 PM
You're right. The Celtics starting Perk and Rondo for the last handful of years was super-detrimental to the offense.


The Celtics could get away with it because they had three super effecient scorers. That Kevin Garnett was a 20 point scorer and had Pierce/Allen flanking him. I don't believe this trio stacks up to the Boston title team at all.


That's really hurt the Celtics the last three years, hasn't it? A fourth option not being the most efficient scorer isn't a concern for any team. He takes like 6 shots per game. Whoop-de-doo.

The problem is compounded by the team. Beasley is an ineffecient #2, Rondo is an ineffecient #4, and Ben Wallace is ineffecient #5 who can't produce any points at this point in his career.



Pick and choose what stats you want to put up, that's convenient. At the end of the day, Beasley averaged 18 ppg and 50% from the field. Try to shape it anyway you want.

16 points per game over 2 games. Are people really supposed to be that impressed by it? Especially considering Battier lit him up even worse in the first game and barely guarded him in a blowout win in the 2nd game?


Providence will win if Rondo is setting up plays in the 4th quarter? How does that make any sense? He's a top 5 point guard.

Unless it's the 4th quarter of a close game. He had an eFG% of 34.3% last season.


Win shares is just as much based on team performance. The Celtics played like **** against the Heat. In the regular season he produced .194 WS/48 with 3.4 OWS and 5.6 DWS. You're basing his body of work on a playoff series in which the Celtics had no shot, and completely dismiss his ridiculously productive regular season in which he was the best defensive PF in the NBA.

So LeBron would lead the league in win shares because the Cavs team was so good? I disagree but if you don't like win shares then we'll use Garnett's well below average 48% TS%.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 12:49 PM
The Celtics could get away with it because they had three super effecient scorers. That Kevin Garnett was a 20 point scorer and had Pierce/Allen flanking him. I don't believe this trio stacks up to the Boston title team at all.



The problem is compounded by the team. Beasley is an ineffecient #2, Rondo is an ineffecient #4, and Ben Wallace is ineffecient #5 who can't produce any points at this point in his career.




16 points per game over 2 games. Are people really supposed to be that impressed by it? Especially considering Battier lit him up even worse in the first game and barely guarded him in a blowout win in the 2nd game?



Unless it's the 4th quarter of a close game. He had an eFG% of 34.3% last season.



So LeBron would lead the league in win shares because the Cavs team was so good? That's just wrong. If you don't like win shares then we'll use Garnett's pitiful 48% TS%.

Beautiful post :clap:. I saw you were replying for like 15 minutes.

Mell413
09-25-2011, 12:52 PM
I think I'm going Providence here. They have Wade who can be that guy who is the best player on a title team. If KG was younger he could be that guy, but he's not as good as he used to be. EL Paso's defense would be solid, but I don't think they have enough offense. If this were Wallace and KG in their primes I'd probably go for EL Paso, but it's not

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 01:27 PM
nvm

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 02:19 PM
The Celtics could get away with it because they had three super effecient scorers. That Kevin Garnett was a 20 point scorer and had Pierce/Allen flanking him. I don't believe this trio stacks up to the Boston title team at all.



The problem is compounded by the team. Beasley is an ineffecient #2, Rondo is an ineffecient #4, and Ben Wallace is ineffecient #5 who can't produce any points at this point in his career.




16 points per game over 2 games. Are people really supposed to be that impressed by it? Especially considering Battier lit him up even worse in the first game and barely guarded him in a blowout win in the 2nd game?



Unless it's the 4th quarter of a close game. He had an eFG% of 34.3% last season.



So LeBron would lead the league in win shares because the Cavs team was so good? I disagree but if you don't like win shares then we'll use Garnett's well below average 48% TS%.
efficient this efficient that.


wade and bosh have been ineffcient against manu and garnett. it all cancels out

theres more to a game than offense, although im not surprised coming from a knick fan. lots of defending you're doing for a guy that tried avoiding you

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 02:24 PM
efficient this efficient that.


wade and bosh have been ineffcient against manu and garnett. it all cancels out

theres more to a game than offense, although im not surprised coming from a knick fan. lots of defending you're doing for a guy that tried avoiding you

What? I voted for KoB last round and I believe my co voted for you. I don't understand how I was trying to avoid him. I also think it is funny how you just take shots at a fan base rather than make a plausible counter.

KnicksorBust
09-25-2011, 02:32 PM
efficient this efficient that.


wade and bosh have been ineffcient against manu and garnett. it all cancels out

theres more to a game than offense, although im not surprised coming from a knick fan. lots of defending you're doing for a guy that tried avoiding you

:laugh: You're ridiculous. "I don't like what you're saying so I'm going to take a cheap shot at your favorite team!!"

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 02:34 PM
:laugh: You're ridiculous. "I don't like what you're saying so I'm going to take a cheap shot at your favorite team!!"

Yep. He called me a huge heat homer because I didn't agree with him.

KnicksorBust
09-25-2011, 02:36 PM
Yep. He called me a huge heat homer because I didn't agree with him.

That's different. You are a huge Heat homer.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 02:37 PM
That's different. You are a huge Heat homer.

:sad2:. In what way? All I said is that Dwyane Wade is the best SG in the league and Bosh is a top 5 PF. Two true or at the very least supportable statements.

McJoe
09-25-2011, 02:44 PM
Vancouver! oh wait...

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 02:51 PM
Vancouver! oh wait...

If only you would have given me Joakim and Love :sigh:.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
09-25-2011, 02:56 PM
lmao el paso has taken a lead now

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 02:58 PM
lmao el paso has taken a lead now

Technically Providence is up by 2, but yeah I feel ya. It is going back and forth.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 05:03 PM
What? I voted for KoB last round and I believe my co voted for you. I don't understand how I was trying to avoid him. I also think it is funny how you just take shots at a fan base rather than make a plausible counter.
coming from the guy who's letting someone else defend his team

and i did make a counter....wade and bosh have been just as ineffcient against manu and kg.


Yep. He called me a huge heat homer because I didn't agree with him.

and i will continue calling you a huge heat homer.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 05:15 PM
coming from the guy who's letting someone else defend his team

and i did make a counter....wade and bosh have been just as ineffcient against manu and kg.



and i will continue calling you a huge heat homer.

Wade will in no way be inefficient in a Finals no matter who is guarding him. He has stepped up when it matters the most in the Finals and that's a fact. If that's being a homer to you then so be it. And what do you mean by "letting someone else defend you team". I haven't seen you really counter KoB's statements. You just say "inefficient this, inefficient that" like it doesn't matter since their on your team. You have three inefficient offensive players in your starting lineup and that's a fact. In the 4th quarter of games they get even worse.

Next, if Corey and KoB are going to debate each side, they can. No reason for me to stop them. You are letting Corey defend your team so you are just as guilty of whatever you are accusing me of doing.

phlp_bj
09-25-2011, 05:28 PM
why do people who are not gm's of these two teams keep selecting that option as their vote?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 05:29 PM
why do people who are not gm's of these two teams keep selecting that option as their vote?
Lol. Idk. Anyways, I think the score is 56-53, Prov currently.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 06:08 PM
Prov up by 1

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 06:09 PM
If you guys want, you can take back my vote as a GM and I'll vote :)

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 06:11 PM
if you vote for el paso, then sure!

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 06:13 PM
Prov up by 1
? sure it's not 2?

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 06:16 PM
if you vote for el paso, then sure!

I've read all argument and writeups, and would like to make an educated vote :) If it's cool

jetsfan89
09-25-2011, 06:16 PM
Meant to vote for El Paso, i accidently voted for Providence.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 06:17 PM
yesssssssss jf89 with the clutch accidental vote, tied game

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 06:19 PM
nvm. I have no clue what the score is

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 06:23 PM
you have 2 less than 100 guys in rangers331 and evil empire. jf voted for me, so you have 56. i have 3 guys with under 100 and jf's vote which is 56.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 06:26 PM
you have 2 less than 100 guys in rangers331 and evil empire. jf voted for me, so you have 56. i have 3 guys with under 100 and jf's vote which is 56.

Yeah I understand now. On my phone and didn't see JF say he changed his vote on the last page. Fair enough. Although I do have a screen shot of you breaking the rules, but I'll get into that later.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 06:49 PM
Providence up by 2...

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 06:52 PM
PROVIDENCE WINS, PROVIDENCE WINS! Congrats to sf on a great run and even more props to my awesome co JWE. We might fight a lot behind the scenes but it has been worth it. The Providence Panthers, your PSD NBA ReDraft Champions! Thanks to everyone who voted for us!

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:08 PM
Calm your panties MWC, it's tied

BranWingss
09-25-2011, 07:10 PM
Calm your panties MWC, it's tied

If so, what happens? Maybe ALL mods and TM's of the NBA forum cast their vote.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:11 PM
Calm your panties MWC, it's tied
What we were tied when it was 59 58 according to both of us. Now we got two more votes hence I am 99% sure we won by 1 or 2

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:14 PM
Calm your panties MWC, it's tied

Plus I have evidence you cheated on one vote.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:16 PM
you have two dupes i have 3. makes it 59-56. you have jf's vote which is mine, makes it 58-57, and the guy who voted for gm voted for me so yea its tied

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:17 PM
Plus I have evidence you cheated on one vote.
and i have evidence you cheated me with the writeup thing, as one voter voted for you just because of that

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:19 PM
you have two dupes i have 3. makes it 59-56. you have jf's vote which is mine, makes it 58-57, and the guy who voted for gm voted for me so yea its tied

Where did the overrated guy say he was specifically voting for you before the vote closed? Plus I have evidence you cheated on Melos vote so Phlp will either DQ you or take that 1 off.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:21 PM
If so, what happens? Maybe ALL mods and TM's of the NBA forum cast their vote.
well im winning the mod vote so there!

he sent me a pm saying how to change his vote and that he picked my team.

and yea, i did send melo a link, just returning the favor, eagles told me you were trying to get him to vote for you. and then there's the guy who complained about no writeup

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:24 PM
well im winning the mod vote so there!

he sent me a pm saying how to change his vote and that he picked my team.

That doesn't mean anything. He didn't officially change his vote in the thread.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:27 PM
it was before the deadline and i have full proof of that. he had no idea how to. his vote was casted in on the poll, accidental or not

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:29 PM
it was before the deadline and i have full proof of that. he had no idea how to. his vote was casted in on the poll, accidental or not

Doesn't matter. He should have said I change my vote in the thread. Him not knowing the rules doesn't matter.

Avenged
09-25-2011, 07:30 PM
This game is all politics.. :pity:

BTW I do not know SF and we even argued in another matchup, so to accuse me (and other Mods) of an alliance with him is just dumb.

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 07:33 PM
:laugh:

Sorry for all the confusion guys. If you count my vote or not is up to you guys, but I indeed think El Paso has the slightest of edges, and wanted to vote for them

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:33 PM
This game is all politics.. :pity:

BTW I do not know SF and we even argued in another matchup, so to accuse me (and other Mods) of an alliance with him is just dumb.
You have no idea. All these redrafts ad mocks have several drama controversies.

Yea plus you provided reasoning too

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:34 PM
This game is all politics.. :pity:

BTW I do not know SF and we even argued in another matchup, so to accuse me (and other Mods) of an alliance with him is just dumb.

What? I don't excuse you of anything. Anyways providence won this by at least one vote. The poster did not follow the rules and votes can not be change via PM

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 07:35 PM
so who won? Providence?

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:36 PM
Tied

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:37 PM
What? I don't excuse you of anything. Anyways providence won this by at least one vote. The poster did not follow the rules and votes can not be change via PM
Last I checker you arent commish. Stop making up rules

pd1dish
09-25-2011, 07:38 PM
For this guy's vote to be worth more than somebody with under 100 posts is idiotic

Thanks a lot MWC.

well, put in some effort. the GM to Providence did and he deserves to win more than you, imo. its like the guy who autodrafts in fantasy football and doesnt check his team. then he gets lucky and wins it all somehow and its complete ********.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:43 PM
Even if Overated'svote somehow counted which would be ridiculous since he never officially changed his vote until after the poll closed in the thread,I have proof you got at least 1 extra vote by VMing Melo. That would put us upby 1 or 2. Also, I never duped you at all with the writeup.And even if you think I did and got an extra vote, Pete Dah Sneak specifically voted for you to negate that guy'svote so it doesn't matter. Either way, Providence won by either 1 vote or 2.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 07:47 PM
well, put in some effort. the GM to Providence did and he deserves to win more than you, imo. its like the guy who autodrafts in fantasy football and doesnt check his team. then he gets lucky and wins it all somehow and its complete ********.
shut the **** up. go in the nba redraft lounge and see why exactly i didnt havea writeup done. your boy providence that did "so much work" screwed me over.

except he did change his vote before the deadline

i sent him the link...you tried getting eagles to vote for you.

yea, because he totally wouldn't have voted if it wasn't for that :rolleyes:

i love how avenged24 is creeping this thread like a teenage girl facebook catfight :laugh2:

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 07:48 PM
:catfight:..................

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 07:50 PM
shut the **** up. go in the nba redraft lounge and see why exactly i didnt havea writeup done. your boy providence that did "so much work" screwed me over.

except he did change his vote before the deadline

i sent him the link...you tried getting eagles to vote for you.

yea, because he totally wouldn't have voted if it wasn't for that :rolleyes:

i love how avenged24 is creeping this thread like a teenage girl facebook catfight :laugh2:

I never duped you at all. I said I was doing a writeup if the conditions weren't met that we agreed to. I never got to talk to phlp with you like I said and you recognized this. It is not my fault you are laztyy. Second, he didn't change his vote in this thread before the deadline from what I can see on my phone. Saying you vote for someone in a PM isn't an official vote. You also dont know if Pete Dah Sneak would have voted for you if the other guy didn't vote for me based on his reasoning. You also dont know if that guy was going to vote for me anyways.

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 07:54 PM
<3

phlp_bj
09-25-2011, 08:07 PM
I see no proof as to if he changed his vote or not. I also see no proof as to if SF cheated or not either. I wanted ovratd to change his vote because every vote would matter, which is why I made a post questioning why someone would vote as the gm. Not sure what the official tally is, but if I can get proof that ovratd changed his vote, them it'll be tied as SF said. Or if I get proof that he cheated, then he will be DQ'd

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 08:22 PM
I never duped you at all. I said I was doing a writeup if the conditions weren't met that we agreed to. I never got to talk to phlp with you like I said and you recognized this. It is not my fault you are laztyy. Second, he didn't change his vote in this thread before the deadline from what I can see on my phone. Saying you vote for someone in a PM isn't an official vote. You also dont know if Pete Dah Sneak would have voted for you if the other guy didn't vote for me based on his reasoning. You also dont know if that guy was going to vote for me anyways.
we went over this a bazillion times. you sent me a message on AIM when I was OFFLINE, and didnt get until i logged on the next day the night before voting went up. no pm, or vm. calling me lazy? lmao, i have a clear screenshot saying you felt lazy and didnt wanna do a writeup. you knew i was busy during the weekdays.

stop making up conditional excuses like that.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 08:27 PM
we went over this a bazillion times. you sent me a message on AIM when I was OFFLINE, and didnt get until i logged on the next day the night before voting went up. no pm, or vm. calling me lazy? lmao, i have a clear screenshot saying you felt lazy and didnt wanna do a writeup. you knew i was busy during the weekdays.

stop making up conditional excuses like that.

But like you said, I did do a writeup and told you a full day beforehand I was doing a writeup. Plus the terms were never met for not doing a writeup so you should have been prepared anyways.

JNA17
09-25-2011, 08:29 PM
Ah crap why does my vote say providence? I wanted to vote El Paso, can someone change that for me?

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 08:30 PM
But like you said, I did do a writeup and told you a full day beforehand I was doing a writeup. Plus the terms were never met for not doing a writeup so you should have been prepared anyways.
A full night is more like it. Telling me at 9-10, a couple hours before I headed to bed, went to school and had football.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 08:34 PM
Ah crap why does my vote say providence? I wanted to vote El Paso, can someone change that for me?
:laugh: :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: :laugh: :laugh::laugh::laugh:

this is ****ing hilarous

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 08:42 PM
:laugh: :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: :laugh: :laugh::laugh::laugh:

this is ****ing hilarous
What's hilarious is that it doesn't matter. You can't just change your vote over an hour after it has closed.

JNA17
09-25-2011, 08:48 PM
What's hilarious is that it doesn't matter. You can't just change your vote over an hour after it has closed.

If I may, just my little idea here but why not have a recount then? I'm obviously not the only one with that little error so it's obvious the votes are a little, well skewed.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 08:58 PM
If I may, just my little idea here but why not have a recount then? I'm obviously not the only one with that little error so it's obvious the votes are a little, well skewed.
Because once the vote ends, then there is no more changing or anything, whether it favors me or SF. What's the point of having a poll end at a certain time if we have to recheck with every single voter to make sure he voted for the team he meant. Anyways, I really don't care that much. SF will be DQed shortly as phlp said if I show him the evidence of him cheating, then he is DQed. So once phlp gets on, it will all be settled.

Corey
09-25-2011, 09:00 PM
The user is claiming that he clicked the wrong team...He isn't trying to change his vote.

There's a difference IMO.

BranWingss
09-25-2011, 09:00 PM
Because once the vote ends, then there is no more changing or anything, whether it favors me or SF. What's the point of having a poll end at a certain time if we have to recheck with every single voter to make sure he voted for the team he meant. Anyways, I really don't care that much. SF will be DQed shortly as phlp said if I show him the evidence of him cheating, then he is DQed. So once phlp gets on, it will all be settled.

Really?

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 09:06 PM
Because once the vote ends, then there is no more changing or anything, whether it favors me or SF. What's the point of having a poll end at a certain time if we have to recheck with every single voter to make sure he voted for the team he meant. Anyways, I really don't care that much. SF will be DQed shortly as phlp said if I show him the evidence of him cheating, then he is DQed. So once phlp gets on, it will all be settled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vxiQ9JCKvE

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 09:12 PM
Really?

Oh I care about the outcome, but it really doesn't matter which way he voted. SF cheated therefore he will be DQed...

BranWingss
09-25-2011, 09:14 PM
Oh I care about the outcome, but it really doesn't matter which way he voted. SF cheated therefore he will be DQed...

How'd he cheat?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 09:17 PM
How'd he cheat?

Why don't you ask him. He has been real quiet about it for obvious reasons...

Ovratd1up
09-25-2011, 09:17 PM
Ah crap why does my vote say providence? I wanted to vote El Paso, can someone change that for me?

That was so climactic, just perfect :laugh2:

Nice job in building these teams people, seriously.

Avenged
09-25-2011, 09:27 PM
shut the **** up. go in the nba redraft lounge and see why exactly i didnt havea writeup done. your boy providence that did "so much work" screwed me over.

except he did change his vote before the deadline

i sent him the link...you tried getting eagles to vote for you.

yea, because he totally wouldn't have voted if it wasn't for that :rolleyes:

i love how avenged24 is creeping this thread like a teenage girl facebook catfight :laugh2:

I'm just laughing at the back & forth. Apparently there's rigged votes, rigged voters, cheaters, alliances, liars, people who want to change their vote.. :laugh2: This thing is just so dramatic. It's like after a close NBA Game where someone loses by 1 because of the refs.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 09:28 PM
I'm just laughing at the back & forth. Apparently there's rigged votes, rigged voters, cheaters, alliances, liars, people who want to change their vote.. :laugh2: This thing is just so dramatic. It's like after a close NBA Game where someone loses by 1 because of the refs.
That's every game. The refs are always to blame :p.

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 09:29 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vxiQ9JCKvE

ur clownin ur own co? :laugh2:

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 09:30 PM
sorry the sox are making me piss in my pants

What's hilarious is that it doesn't matter. You can't just change your vote over an hour after it has closed.
he misclicked. if anything blame psd for having the poll options so close to each other:pity:


oh yea, i linked melo to the poll, just like you tried getting a vote from eagles

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 09:34 PM
I'm just laughing at the back & forth. Apparently there's rigged votes, rigged voters, cheaters, alliances, liars, people who want to change their vote.. :laugh2: This thing is just so dramatic. It's like after a close NBA Game where someone loses by 1 because of the refs.

A lot of hate too. MWC vs SF battle is out of control :laugh:.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 09:35 PM
ur clownin ur own co? :laugh2:
Lol. He does that all the time, we're good though. :p

he misclicked. if anything blame psd for having the poll options so close to each other:pity:


oh yea, i linked melo to the poll, just like you tried getting a vote from eagles
The poll is already over, misclick or not it is closed. That would be like voting for a president or senator and after the voting ends you come back and say "oh i meant to vote for that guy so he wins, my bad". Also, apparently JWE accidentally voted for you in the WCF. Guess we need a recount there. Wait, then that means Las Vegas would have won. Man, we have to get this settled. JWE AIMed me that he just realized the problem right now. Darn, sorry SF.

Secondly, I never gave eagles a link to the pool nor did I even mention the redraft. In fact, when he confronted me about the redraft and told me how I need his vote, I told him to do whatever he wants. I was as unbias as possible and never even suggested for him to vote for me nor did I bring up the redraft.

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 09:36 PM
:laugh:

Sadds The Gr8
09-25-2011, 09:37 PM
i swear outta the 170 posts in this 130 of them is this stupid argument that's been dragging on lol. this fighting is ****in stupid...this is literally the gayest argument i've ever seen.

Eagles4Lyfe
09-25-2011, 09:43 PM
Why don't you ask him. He has been real quiet about it for obvious reasons...

Do tell us what he's done;)

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 09:47 PM
Do tell us what he's done;)
Lol. He already admitted it. He asked for somebody to vote for him on their wall and they did. I on the other hand, never asked you to vote for me and even said to do whatever you want...

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 09:58 PM
i posted a link..., never said "vote for el paso" or for me or anything like that

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:04 PM
i posted a link..., never said "vote for el paso" or for me or anything like that

You gave him your team link and provided a link to vote for you. He then called you a "good sir" and said you got his vote. It is fairly obvious you have a friendship/connection with him, but even if you didn't it is cheating nonetheless. If you were allowed to do this then people would just do the same every redraft onto their friends walls, posters who like the same teams/players, or anybody else for that matter to give them a clear advantage.

JNA17
09-25-2011, 10:05 PM
The user is claiming that he clicked the wrong team...He isn't trying to change his vote.

There's a difference IMO.

Thank you.

Guy's this isn't the voting for the President of the United States, this is a voting for best make believe redraft team. There were people like me who apparently mouse clicking happy and didn't pay attention to what they voted for. This isn't "changing votes", this is correcting a vote to what it should be.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:09 PM
Thank you.

Guy's this isn't the voting for the President of the United States, this is a voting for best make believe redraft team. There were people like me who apparently mouse clicking happy and didn't pay attention to what they voted for. This isn't "changing votes", this is correcting a vote to what it should be.
That is true, but then we would have to ask every poster in every single round to confirm they meant to vote for who they did. Also some could claim to have meant to vote for someone else when in fact they are just doing it for other reasons (not in any way saying you did this, but for others in the future it is possible.) Once the poll closes it should be final, mistake or no mistake.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:15 PM
i swear outta the 170 posts in this 130 of them is this stupid argument that's been dragging on lol. this fighting is ****in stupid...this is literally the gayest argument i've ever seen.
uh, in a redraft playoff vote you're kinda supposed to....argue ya know?


Lol. He already admitted it. He asked for somebody to vote for him on their wall and they did. I on the other hand, never asked you to vote for me and even said to do whatever you want...
did the samething you did to eagles so it balances out...


You gave him your team link and provided a link to vote for you. He then called you a "good sir" and said you got his vote. It is fairly obvious you have a friendship/connection with him, but even if you didn't it is cheating nonetheless. If you were allowed to do this then people would just do the same every redraft onto their friends walls, posters who like the same teams/players, or anybody else for that matter to give them a clear advantage.
the only connection i have to melo is being in the same Fantasy Football league as him, and he's a knicks fan so that rules out. are you seriously using good manners as a way to prove your point :laugh:

and uh, you did do that with eagles, and posting nonstop in the miami forum with your sig on.

everyone is responsible for knowing who they voted for, but if you come in in just an hour our two after you voted, saying you misclicked, there's nothing really wrong with that. i'm sure you would be doing the same if the sides were switched :rolleyes:

JNA17
09-25-2011, 10:18 PM
That is true, but then we would have to ask every poster in every single round to confirm they meant to vote for who they did. Also some could claim to have meant to vote for someone else when in fact they are just doing it for other reasons (not in any way saying you did this, but for others in the future it is possible.) Once the poll closes it should be final, mistake or no mistake.

That's also true. Which is why I propose a recount with NO POLL and instead have each poster POST their votes. That way there is no way they can change it because if they do, that little feature at the very bottom of their posts will show up "this post was edited...". Have it one day long and boom, your new winner.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:22 PM
did the samething you did to eagles so it balances out...


the only connection i have to melo is being in the same Fantasy Football league as him, and he's a knicks fan so that rules out. are you seriously using good manners as a way to prove your point :laugh:

and uh, you did do that with eagles, and posting nonstop in the miami forum with your sig on.

I don't care about your connection to Melo. The fact that you posted a link on his wall and told him your team name, is against the rules and always has been. Show me where I even mention anything about the redraft to eagles. Post the convo I had with him if you want. Every time he mentions the redraft, I tell him to do whatever he wants and I never asked for his vote. Also he never even voted. Lastly, the posting goes both ways. You did the same thing and in fact even told voters to vote. Mine doesn't do any of that.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:25 PM
you clearly edited it, doesn't matter if he voted or not you still tried to get him to vote.


wtf are you talking about? you copied my sig word for word, only I didn't make 100 posts during the game so my sig would keep showing up.

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:28 PM
you clearly edited it, doesn't matter if he voted or not you still tried to get him to vote.


wtf are you talking about? you copied my sig word for word, only I didn't make 100 posts during the game so my sig would keep showing up.

Your sig said "Vote". Mine does not. There is a difference. Also I never edited my convo with Eagles at all. You are just making up a complete lie out of that convo. I never clearly edited anything and never asked eagles to vote for me in that convo as you can see. You, however, tried to quickly edit your convo with melo when confronted about it.

Edit: I'm going off tonight. No point in arguing until phlp makes some decisions.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:34 PM
yes it did

i dont need to make up anything, eagles clearly said you were trying to get him to vote for you. the inference from that is you edited your post.

you never confronted me?

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:37 PM
yes it did

i dont need to make up anything, eagles clearly said you were trying to get him to vote for you. the inference from that is you edited your post.

you never confronted me?
Last thing, haha. Eagles said I was trying to get him to vote for me jokingly when I in fact wasn't. Your inference is dead wrong and you can get a mod to check if I edited that convo or something because I didn't in anyway. Eagles can think what he wants but I never asked for a vote and I never even mentioned the redraft. Good job making something up you have no absolute knowledge about.

Also my sig never said vote when I posted in the GT Dolphins thread. It was exactly the same as it is now.

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:40 PM
i thought you were donemwc?
makes omething up? its on my ****ing wall http://prosportsdaily.com/forums/converse.php?u=53289&u2=35935

coming from the guy who creeps and tried interfering when i was tattle-tailing on him to KoB :)

MiamiWadeCounty
09-25-2011, 10:42 PM
Show the VM where I ask for his vote. Wait, there is none because I never did ask for his vote.

Eagles4Lyfe
09-25-2011, 10:44 PM
Lol. He already admitted it. He asked for somebody to vote for him on their wall and they did.I on the other hand, never asked you to vote for me and even said to do whatever you want...

Hmmmmm

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:45 PM
Show the VM where I ask for his vote. Wait, there is none because I never did ask for his vote.
or maybe you pm'd him? hmmmm who gave me that idea? :eyebrow:


go to bed mwc.

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 10:47 PM
My title is being tarnished by my own co...

JNA17
09-25-2011, 10:48 PM
I get more action watching internet forum fights then I do getting laid :D....

wait I mean... :(

Sportfan
09-25-2011, 10:49 PM
jwe is technically part of both teams, you win no matter what


lol jna

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 10:50 PM
:laugh: JNA

John Walls Era
09-25-2011, 10:50 PM
jwe is technically part of both teams, you win no matter what


lol jna

O. In that case you guys can continue w.e. is going.

phlp_bj
09-25-2011, 10:57 PM
can i mod close this. gracias

JNA17
09-25-2011, 11:00 PM
can i mod close this. gracias

Phlp_bj has spoken!...

wait what does it mean?

phlp_bj
09-25-2011, 11:06 PM
the lebron in me will make a decision soon :)

JNA17
09-25-2011, 11:07 PM
the lebron in me will make a decision soon :)

Your too good of a human being to have a "Lebron" in you good sir :).

phlp_bj
09-25-2011, 11:10 PM
oh shucks. making me blush