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Chill_Will_24
09-20-2011, 10:17 PM
I just got the whim to make this thread from a debate i had with a guy in the other thread.

If you dont like hypothetical scenarios then please dont read on and if you dont mind them then bear with me.

As we know the NJ Nets are moving to the sports starved city of Brooklyn. If the Nets were to keep Deron Williams (likely) and somehow were to sign or trade for Dwight Howard (unlikely) and they reached success in Brooklyn while the Knicks under performed with their Melo/Amare combo; would that be enough to get the recognition in the NY and league wide that they could never achieve in NJ?

The Nets and Knicks have had a rilvary with NJ winning the games and NY always winning the fans and their money.

Would a MIA like dominance with Dwight and Deron in Brooklyn be enough to compete with the Knicks or will they always be doomed to be the second team no matter how successful, even in Brooklyn with a billion dollar arena?

Just wanted some opinion. I know nobody cares about this :D

likemystylez
09-20-2011, 10:20 PM
knicks fans have suffered enough and it looks like they have turned the tide. Depending how the lock out goes, the knicks have a chance to pick up another star player and be a powerhouse in the east. Melo and amare dont play defense though... LOL which is a different brand of dominance than Knicks fans have been use to in the past.

Sactown
09-20-2011, 10:25 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

PC
09-20-2011, 10:27 PM
Maybe I'm a bit biased but as a Knick fan, I think the Nets will always play second fiddle to the Knicks. Even through this past decade of misery, MSG was constantly sold out while the Nets struggled for fans even during their championship runs. I understand things may be different with a new owner+moving to Brooklyn but to me, there are wayy too many loyal Knicks fans for NY to become a city run by the Nets

juno10
09-20-2011, 10:28 PM
brooklyn nets can definitely do it IMO, new jersey nets not in a million years.

PC
09-20-2011, 10:29 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

In terms of popularity vs. the Nets

DoMeFavors
09-20-2011, 10:37 PM
I dont care who has more fans or who the media likes more I care about championships. As long as my teams doing well thats all I care about.

oak2455
09-20-2011, 10:37 PM
Maybe I'm a bit biased but as a Knick fan, I think the Nets will always play second fiddle to the Knicks. Even through this past decade of misery, MSG was constantly sold out while the Nets struggled for fans even during their championship runs. I understand things may be different with a new owner+moving to Brooklyn but to me, there are wayy too many loyal Knicks fans for NY to become a city run by the Nets

couldnt agree more , example when the Nets were in the finals... the tri state area couldnt care at all..there was no buzz at all :eyebrow:

Andrew32
09-20-2011, 10:40 PM
Yes, Nets are just one of those fish hanging onto the side of the Shark (Knicks)

NY is just such a huge profitable Market which is why they probably still do well financially.

Gotta say I was a big fan of the Kidd/Martin Nets though they were fun to watch.

DoMeFavors
09-20-2011, 10:45 PM
And to the OP I dont think anyone is going to care about Brooklyn, just because of the city the Nets are moving like 15 minutes away.
NJ all day

airronijordan
09-20-2011, 10:48 PM
I have many friends in Brooklyn and they told me theyll never become Nets fans and will make sure their kids dont turn into Nets fans...therefore since I heard that I'm going to say the Nets will always be second fiddle

oak2455
09-20-2011, 10:57 PM
Nets ranked 28th out of 30 teams in attendance soooooooo:D NJ goes hardly:)

Federal Reserve
09-20-2011, 11:00 PM
The Knicks will have Amare, CP3 and Melo in their starting lineup. You don't need a math major to know that that lineup equals multiple championships.

llemon
09-20-2011, 11:18 PM
The Knicks will have Amare, CP3 and Melo in their starting lineup. You don't need a math major to know that that lineup equals multiple championships.

Except that Knicks don't have CP3 (and let's see how far that knee gets him), Amare is obviously injury-prone, and his career could end in a second, and Carmelo is a 2nd-3rd tier star.

RZZZA
09-20-2011, 11:25 PM
I just got the whim to make this thread from a debate i had with a guy in the other thread.

If you dont like hypothetical scenarios then please dont read on and if you dont mind them then bear with me.

As we know the NJ Nets are moving to the sports starved city of Brooklyn. If the Nets were to keep Deron Williams (likely) and somehow were to sign or trade for Dwight Howard (unlikely) and they reached success in Brooklyn while the Knicks under performed with their Melo/Amare combo; would that be enough to get the recognition in the NY and league wide that they could never achieve in NJ?

The Nets and Knicks have had a rilvary with NJ winning the games and NY always winning the fans and their money.

Would a MIA like dominance with Dwight and Deron in Brooklyn be enough to compete with the Knicks or will they always be doomed to be the second team no matter how successful, even in Brooklyn with a billion dollar arena?

Just wanted some opinion. I know nobody cares about this :D

Winning cures everything imo. If the Nets competed for the New York fanbase and their team was much better and more exciting, then NY fans would flock to watch and support the Nets. But the case in NY is not that though; if Dwight came to the Nets to join with Dwill you'd have two exciting teams in NY and you'd get like a Cubs/White Sox thing going on in NY, with fanbases choosing sides.

Chicago fans have had a similar discussion, someone brought up the question of a second NBA team moving to Chicago and whether it would gain fan support. Some people argue that MJ's influence is so great that people would only ever support the Bulls.

Others points out the Cubs and White Sox as examples. As a business it obviously could work but as a fan I don't see myself cheering for another Chicago basketball team. I like the idea of one town, one team. Unity.

Will 2 BE
09-20-2011, 11:26 PM
The Knicks will be the dominate team in the NY area for a long time, playing in Bk is not the same as playing in midtown Manhattan. Mabey if the Nets go on to win multiple titles, a younger generation of fans will identify with the Nets more. But the Knicks are the dominate NY team because they have played in NY for decades, if a new team moved outside of Chicago no one would expect Bulls fans to change loyalties either.

Knicks21
09-20-2011, 11:28 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

Only read the title...

knickfan4life
09-20-2011, 11:29 PM
i think maybe 2 generations later, they can compete, but for the next 20 yrs i think the knicks will still dominate them in terms of favoritism coming from tri state area fans

RZZZA
09-20-2011, 11:30 PM
Should change the name though, Nets? Always thought that was the worst team name/logo/theme in the entire NBA.

You should be the Brooklyn Bad Boys or Billygoats or something. Something scary sounding.

Giants88
09-20-2011, 11:34 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

How bout you try reading what the post actually says

Giants88
09-20-2011, 11:40 PM
And I do think the Knicks will still dominate, knick fans have sufferered but always stick with their team. Just think about how hardcore that fan base is the fact that they still were selling out when the team was god awful. Now the Knicks are good and heading in the right direction, theyre easily a playoff team and if they make the right moves they will soon be championship contenders.

llemon
09-20-2011, 11:41 PM
Should change the name though, Nets? Always thought that was the worst team name/logo/theme in the entire NBA.

You should be the Brooklyn Bad Boys or Billygoats or something. Something scary sounding.

Brilliant idea

sixer04fan
09-20-2011, 11:47 PM
Knicks fans will stay Knicks fans, and Nets fans will stay Nets fans. Duhhhzz...

Mishmin
09-20-2011, 11:50 PM
Whoever's winning.

Punk
09-21-2011, 12:08 AM
To be honest, nobody in Brooklyn here cares about the Nets. I'm not saying that as a Knicks fan, nobody really cares. I was the only one around here in favor of the new arena being built. Everyone else was protesting it.

The MSG new renovation will outshine the entire Barkley Center concept in all honesty. The only thing the Nets might be able to do is gain attendance on the ticket increase at MSG.

Either way, Paul, Carmelo, LeBron, Kobe, Amare are the top names when you talk basketball with new york fans in terms of star power. The simple fact Paul, Melo, Amare is realistic, I doubt anyone will care what NJ does.

I mean, Knicks fans from New York traveled to Newark to attend Knicks games last season at a low price. Imagine that in Brooklyn.

Atlantic Avenue, Isn't Manhattan and there is more hardcore fans than celebs and business fans. People will cheer the stars over the home team over here in Brooklyn. I seem to be the only person around here excited about a team so close to home, which is sad to be honest.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 12:26 AM
Mostly everyone so far is looking at the past when the Nets played in the swamps which even i as a loyal Net fan never drove to cuz it was a nightmare of a place to and the team they have had lately thats been to the lottery like 5 straight times.

Im speaking about a hypothetical scenario. Would getting Dwight to go with Deron get them support in Brooklyn if they become contenders? I hear people talk about the loyal fans and everything but the Nets havent been targeting loyal Knick fans. They are moving to the largest and most racially diverse borough in the largest media market and so far they have said they are targeting casual fans and younger audiences. The Knicks spent the last decade losing and humiliating themselves with one bad move after another. I think the popularity of the NBA is at such a high that NY can definitely support two NBA teams and if the Brooklyn Nets become a powerhouse i cant see the Knicks having the same ironclad hold atop the NY mountain with the fresh stench of losing in the minds of fans for the last decade.

smood999
09-21-2011, 12:33 AM
yes the knicks will always maintain their dominance......ex. yankees over mets (although i am a mets fan)....giants always over the jets (hate both teams)...its just the way it is...

to get into further details the nets and jets, moreso in the nets case...but u see that this is the case growing up in the ny/nj area....ppl from ny are about the giants and knicks more than the nets and jets...and ppl from jersey...if ur from north jersey ur most likely a knicks/giants fan and south jersey ur most likely philadelphia sports fans....this always left the nets and jets out....a lot of jet fans now are bandwagon fans they do not have a true fan base...and everyone saw even when the nets were winning no one cared...this is because this is how the fanbase is divided in ny/nj....

as far as the yankees and mets its more tradition and history as far as the yankees... and the mets have i wanna say a younger fan base overall..which i think is the best case scenario for the brooklyn nets regardless of how good they become...but like the mets to the yankees the nets will always play second fiddle to the knicks...

llemon
09-21-2011, 12:34 AM
To be honest, nobody in Brooklyn here cares about the Nets.

The new voice for the borough

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 12:35 AM
yes the knicks will always maintain their dominance......ex. yankees over mets (although i am a mets fan)....giants always over the jets (hate both teams)...its just the way it is...

to get into further details the nets and jets, moreso in the nets case...but u see that this is the case growing up in the ny/nj area....ppl from ny are about the giants and knicks more than the nets and jets...and ppl from jersey...if ur from north jersey ur most likely a knicks/giants fan and south jersey ur most likely philadelphia sports fans....this always left the nets and jets out....most jet fans now are bandwagon fans they do not have a true fan base...and everyone saw even when the nets were winning no one cared...this is because this is how the fanbase is divided in ny/nj....

as far as the yankees and mets its more tradition and history as far as the yankees... and the mets have i wanna say a younger fan base overall..which i think is the best case scenario for the brooklyn nets...but like the mets to the yankees the nets will always play second fiddle to the knicks...

Brooklyn is not NJ

JasonJohnHorn
09-21-2011, 12:39 AM
It would take a while, but yeah, with some winning season and good management, the Nets could be the big show in town. The Knicks have history in the favour, but there is an old saying that goes like this: What have you done for me lately? If the Nets land Dwight (and that it not entirely unrealistic), then the Derron and Dwight combo would be a title contending duo, even with spare parts alongside them, because those two guys are THAT good. Win a couple titles, and all of a sudden they got as much hardware and the Knicks.

Though they'll never have the classic Willis Reed story.

VillaMaravilla
09-21-2011, 12:43 AM
the Nets will never ever run the CITY, they were better off going to North Dakota or Alaska the City belongs to the orange and blue

smood999
09-21-2011, 12:45 AM
Brooklyn is not NJ

yes i understand that but u cannot discount nj because they are as big of a part of the ny fanbase and media market, etc....but my overall point was that best case scenario theyd be like the mets and the yankees....a younger fan base but still not the same following due to tradition and history and the already large following...either that or they could get a temporary spike like the jets if they r good but it will def go away for the same reason mentioned above and because thats what bandwagoners do....

llemon
09-21-2011, 12:45 AM
It would take a while, but yeah, with some winning season and good management, the Nets could be the big show in town. The Knicks have history in the favour, but there is an old saying that goes like this: What have you done for me lately? If the Nets land Dwight (and that it not entirely unrealistic), then the Derron and Dwight combo would be a title contending duo, even with spare parts alongside them, because those two guys are THAT good. Win a couple titles, and all of a sudden they got as much hardware and the Knicks.

Though they'll never have the classic Willis Reed story.

Nets already have a few classic Willis Reed (horror) stories of their own.

Plus Net fans that were there have classic Ollie Taylor, Wendell Ladner, Rick Barry, Julius Erving and SuperJohn Williamson stories.

smood999
09-21-2011, 12:52 AM
i dont really think this is hard to see....just look at other multi team cities and ull get ur answer...in every sport....biggest one that comes to mind for the person who mentioned its what have u done for me lately is cubs whitesox...whitesox have had the better success recently but its still about the cubs....the mets in the late 80's yeah they had the city rockin but in the end it was still about the yankees....look at the jets and giants now...yeah the jets have a spike in their fanbase...but its still all about the giants even though theyve missed the playoffs the last 2 yrs and the jets have been in the afc championship game the past 2 yrs...

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 12:53 AM
It would take a while, but yeah, with some winning season and good management, the Nets could be the big show in town. The Knicks have history in the favour, but there is an old saying that goes like this: What have you done for me lately? If the Nets land Dwight (and that it not entirely unrealistic), then the Derron and Dwight combo would be a title contending duo, even with spare parts alongside them, because those two guys are THAT good. Win a couple titles, and all of a sudden they got as much hardware and the Knicks.

Though they'll never have the classic Willis Reed story.

:clap: Thats the way i see it. NJ was a horrible place to play. J Kidd hated it, as did Jefferson and mostly every Net. Ugh what a horrible arena the IZOD center was. Brooklyn is starving for its own sports team. There is no question that the Nets will be successful and turn profits in NY because the city is big enough but as you so eloquently put it, the NBA has seen its popularity soar again and its a "what have you done for me lately type thing"

Knicks playoff wins in the last 10 years- 0

Nets playoff wins in the last 10 years- 48

A contending team in Brooklyn with the billion dollar Barclays Center completed, particularly if the Knicks experiment doesnt pan out and the CP3 train doesnt roll thru (likely) will imo comepete with the Knicks for supremacy.

smood999
09-21-2011, 12:57 AM
the knicks dont have the hardware like the lakers do...but the history and tradition and large following is there just the same....ill put this question this way...say the clippers young talent stays together and meet their potential and bring in more pieces and win multiple championships...at the same time..kobe gets older and the lakers r in rebuilding mode for a while...do u think the clippers could ever overtake the lakers? its the same thing here....the lakers knicks and celtics r without a doubt the most popular basketball franchises in the country/world not just in their area and this is y it just will never happen for the nets

llemon
09-21-2011, 01:00 AM
i dont really think this is hard to see....just look at other multi team cities and ull get ur answer...in every sport....biggest one that comes to mind for the person who mentioned its what have u done for me lately is cubs whitesox...whitesox have had the better success recently but its still about the cubs....the mets in the late 80's yeah they had the city rockin but in the end it was still about the yankees....look at the jets and giants now...yeah the jets have a spike in their fanbase...but its still all about the giants even though theyve missed the playoffs the last 2 yrs and the jets have been in the afc championship game the past 2 yrs...

Do you think this is of any concern of the White Sox, Mets, Jets and Clipper fans?

llemon
09-21-2011, 01:02 AM
Melo a 2nd to 3rd tier star you deserve a:facepalm: for that dumb *** statement

As you are a 'Melo fan, I understand your ignorance.

smood999
09-21-2011, 01:06 AM
Do you think this is of any concern of the White Sox, Mets, Jets and Clipper fans?

no but the w question was will they overtake the knicks in popularity as far as the fanbase etc in the area...and those r direct examples that apply to this....and i am a met fan so i am on the other side of this as well....y would u guys think that it would work out differently for the nets if it hasnt for any of these other teams is my question to u? also like i said in a previous post do u not realize how big the brand of the ny knicks r....its like the cowboys, yankees, lakers, celtics...its too big of a battle...these brands r known worldwide let alone locally...and im not saying the knicks have been as successful as these teams but they r just that popular...

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 01:08 AM
i dont really think this is hard to see....just look at other multi team cities and ull get ur answer...in every sport....biggest one that comes to mind for the person who mentioned its what have u done for me lately is cubs whitesox...whitesox have had the better success recently but its still about the cubs....the mets in the late 80's yeah they had the city rockin but in the end it was still about the yankees....look at the jets and giants now...yeah the jets have a spike in their fanbase...but its still all about the giants even though theyve missed the playoffs the last 2 yrs and the jets have been in the afc championship game the past 2 yrs...

Winning cures everything and speaking hypothetically a Dwight Howard- Deron Williams combo would compete with the Knicks for popularity in Brooklyn. Using NJ as a comparison is just not a great idea but i see what you mean. The Nets would never be able to take the Knicks loyal fans but NY and Brooklyn in particular are quite huge in population. The Nets will be successful if they become competitive. The question is will they compete for popularity? Will ESPN NY be split and hype them up as much as the Knicks? Will they create a buzz in NY if they were to meet the Heat in the NBA Finals? History can be created? Is not what happens now, considered history 50 years from now?

This isnt a Lakers-Clippers comparison were talking about. No disrespect to Knicks fans but the Knicks have been a joke for the last 10 years and technically they still are albeit a more hyped joke. They have been no more successful than the Nets have recently and certainly not as successful in the last decade.

Winning is a wonderful medicine and if the Nets were to get Howard they become instant contenders with Deron. This is all hypothetical obviously

llemon
09-21-2011, 01:14 AM
no but the w question was will they overtake the knicks in popularity as far as the fanbase etc in the area...and those r direct examples that apply to this....and i am a met fan so i am on the other side of this as well....y would u guys think that it would work out differently for the nets if it hasnt for any of these other teams is my question to u? also like i said in a previous post do u not realize how big the brand of the ny knicks r....its like the cowboys, yankees, lakers, celtics...its too big of a battle...these brands r known worldwide let alone locally...and im not saying the knicks have been as successful as these teams but they r just that popular...

The word in the thread was 'dominance'.

I don't care who roots for who.

The team that is better is the dominant team.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 01:18 AM
the knicks dont have the hardware like the lakers do...but the history and tradition and large following is there just the same....ill put this question this way...say the clippers young talent stays together and meet their potential and bring in more pieces and win multiple championships...at the same time..kobe gets older and the lakers r in rebuilding mode for a while...do u think the clippers could ever overtake the lakers? its the same thing here....the lakers knicks and celtics r without a doubt the most popular basketball franchises in the country/world not just in their area and this is y it just will never happen for the nets

:laugh2: No offense bro cuz you seen to know what your talking about for the most part but that a horrible comparison. The Lakers are a storied franchise but not only that they have been WINNING. The Lakers are alock to make the playoffs most years and have always made good moves. You cant compare the Knicks to the Lakers anymore than you can compare Lebron and Jordan.

If the Lakers were perennial losers and the Clippers were to start winning the same fans that came to Lakers games would come to Clippers games. I mean the Clippers still suck and they were all over ESPN and getting so much hype and thats while theyre competing with the Lakers!

The Brooklyn-Manhattan thing would be different in that the Knicks have still not proven that hey have put a winning product on the floor so competing with them is not like the Clippers-Lakers

The only thing the Knicks have on the Nets imo is that they play in the arena where Rocky Balboa knocked the spit outta Mr T :D

smood999
09-21-2011, 01:19 AM
Winning cures everything and speaking hypothetically a Dwight Howard- Deron Williams combo would compete with the Knicks for popularity in Brooklyn. Using NJ as a comparison is just not a great idea but i see what you mean. The Nets would never be able to take the Knicks loyal fans but NY and Brooklyn in particular are quite huge in population. The Nets will be successful if they become competitive. The question is will they compete for popularity? Will ESPN NY be split and hype them up as much as the Knicks? Will they create a buzz in NY if they were to meet the Heat in the NBA Finals? History can be created? Is not what happens now, considered history 50 years from now?

This isnt a Lakers-Clippers comparison were talking about. No disrespect to Knicks fans but the Knicks have been a joke for the last 10 years and technically they still are albeit a more hyped joke. They have been no more successful than the Nets have recently and certainly not as successful in the last decade.

Winning is a wonderful medicine and if the Nets were to get Howard they become instant contenders with Deron. This is all hypothetical obviously

ur absolutely right the knicks have been a joke the past 10 yrs...and yes history can be created which was gonna be my next point...if something like this were to happen it would take extreme situations such as literally the knicks being completely irrelevant for the another decade or more and the nets have an enormous amount of success in that time...

but like i said the knicks have not had the success as the lakers or cowboys or yankees...but in terms of popularity country wide, world wide, locally, they r on that level...sad to say but because the success has never met their popularity there are some that will say yes the knicks may very well be the most over hyped sports franchise...its not like theyve had a horrible history though but its def not on par w their popularity just because of how huge their popularity is

their best bet right now is getting a youth movement...and even a youth movement will be stunted due to the popularity of not only the knicks but melo and amare as players.

in all honesty if something like the nets overtaking the knicks in popularity were to happen it would need a good 50 yrs or so esp due to the brooklyn nets young fanbase and the fact that a history to attain such a huge following doesnt happen in only 10 yrs or so....but then again u never know look at the cubs and white sox..and the cubs have been horrible....so i look at that and wonder if it would ever even happen

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 01:20 AM
The word in the thread was 'dominance'.

I don't care who roots for who.

The team that is better is the dominant team.

That was MY mistake so i apologize for not articulating myself correctly

llemon
09-21-2011, 01:22 AM
The only thing the Knicks have on the Nets imo is that they play in the arena where Rocky Balboa knocked the spit outta Mr T :D

You mean the arena that took that major airstrike in 'Godzilla'?

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 01:24 AM
ur absolutely right the knicks have been a joke the past 10 yrs...and yes history can be created which was gonna be my next point...if something like this were to happen it would take extreme situations such as literally the knicks being completely irrelevant for the another decade or more and the nets have an enormous amount of success in that time...

but like i said the knicks have not had the success as the lakers or cowboys or yankees...but in terms of popularity country wide, world wide, locally, they r on that level...sad to say but because the success has never met their popularity there are some that will say yes the knicks may very well be the most over hyped sports franchise...its not like theyve had a horrible history though but its def not on par w their popularity just because of how huge their popularity is

their best bet right now is getting a youth movement...and even a youth movement will be stunted due to the popularity of not only the knicks but melo and amare as players.

in all honesty if something like the nets overtaking the knicks in popularity were to happen it would need a good 50 yrs or so esp due to the brooklyn nets young fanbase and the fact that a history to attain such a huge following doesnt happen in only 10 yrs or so....but then again u never know look at the cubs and white sox..and the cubs have been horrible....so i look at that and wonder if it would ever even happen

Agreed. I dont think the Knicks will ever lose their popularity. If anything it will get better if they can land CP3. However certain Knicks fans are of the opinion that even in Brooklyn the Nets will always be a joke. I wanted to present a scenario where it would simply not be the case.

smood999
09-21-2011, 01:25 AM
The word in the thread was 'dominance'.

I don't care who roots for who.

The team that is better is the dominant team.

yes dominance as far as popularity...the question is not what team will be better...the question is def will the knicks maintain their dominant fan base in the area....so yes the question is completely about whos rooting for who

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 01:26 AM
You mean the arena that took that major airstrike in 'Godzilla'?

:laugh: Damn that scene makes me smile... NY is always getting destroyed in movies

smood999
09-21-2011, 01:32 AM
Agreed. I dont think the Knicks will ever lose their popularity. If anything it will get better if they can land CP3. However certain Knicks fans are of the opinion that even in Brooklyn the Nets will always be a joke. I wanted to present a scenario where it would simply not be the case.

o no i dont think theyre a joke at all...my only issue is being from jersey im upset jersey doesnt have their own team even though im a knick fan...but i think this potentially will be great for basketball as a whole and that it will be what the clippers lakers rivalry has been trying to be or atleast come closer to it....esp w how both teams r starting to set themselves up for potential moves and moves that have already been made...the knicks so far do have the upper hand in that department so far and i think next summer free agency, moreso what the nets can get done, will determine the fate of the nets in brooklyn more than anything else...itll determine whether they will go the path of the clippers or if they have a chance at a legit rivalry...def a critical time for the nets

aztr0
09-21-2011, 01:43 AM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

Pretty much shows someone that just replies and doesn't read the OP's post. Anyways. The Knicks will always be the number one team in NYC. Its like a comparison of Yankees and Mets. Mets will always be the second fiddle.

OC Knights #11
09-21-2011, 02:07 AM
What dominance?

Edit: Didn't read the entire thread so oops sorry. Right now the Knicks of course are a better team then the Nets, but depending on which team does what regarding Chris Paul and Dwight Howard it could change.

llemon
09-21-2011, 11:42 AM
yes dominance as far as popularity...the question is not what team will be better...the question is def will the knicks maintain their dominant fan base in the area....so yes the question is completely about whos rooting for who

Then the answer is obvious. Whichever team maintains me as a fan has the dominant fanbase.

Why is this even a question?

TheNumber37
09-21-2011, 12:19 PM
Easy way to settle this. I am from brooklyn and would support both teams. My current avatar is of the nets stadium, because we are indeed excited about getting them back to Brooklyn, but also about taking them away from Jersey... For real. Nets will never match the history of the knicks and the garden, and spike won't buy season tickets. All in all, we'll support the team that will give us bragging rights. Will the nets become the mets of the city - I think they'll fair better. But they have to win, get new jerseys and a new team name because we don't like hand me downs in bk, especially hand me downs we used to own.

ShakeN'Bake
09-21-2011, 12:44 PM
Maybe I'm a bit biased but as a Knick fan, I think the Nets will always play second fiddle to the Knicks. Even through this past decade of misery, MSG was constantly sold out while the Nets struggled for fans even during their championship runs. I understand things may be different with a new owner+moving to Brooklyn but to me, there are wayy too many loyal Knicks fans for NY to become a city run by the Nets

If the OP's scenario plays out the Nets overtake the Knicks nationally but they well never be bigger in the city of new york.

CostanzaNumba0
09-21-2011, 12:56 PM
:clap: Thats the way i see it. NJ was a horrible place to play. J Kidd hated it, as did Jefferson and mostly every Net. Ugh what a horrible arena the IZOD center was. Brooklyn is starving for its own sports team. There is no question that the Nets will be successful and turn profits in NY because the city is big enough but as you so eloquently put it, the NBA has seen its popularity soar again and its a "what have you done for me lately type thing"

Knicks playoff wins in the last 10 years- 0

Nets playoff wins in the last 10 years- 48

A contending team in Brooklyn with the billion dollar Barclays Center completed, particularly if the Knicks experiment doesnt pan out and the CP3 train doesnt roll thru (likely) will imo comepete with the Knicks for supremacy.

Theres just absolutely no chance of this happening, brooklyn is 15 minutes from MSG and a part of NY, theyre not "Starving for a team" thats ridiculous, I think this move is potentially catastrophic for the russian..there are more people in suffolk and nassau than bk-is Long Island "Starving for a team"? the answer is **** no. The nets should move to Las Vegas or seattle or something they will never win the hearts of New Yorkers, the state is blue and orange.

airronijordan
09-21-2011, 01:08 PM
Winning cures everything and speaking hypothetically a Dwight Howard- Deron Williams combo would compete with the Knicks for popularity in Brooklyn. Using NJ as a comparison is just not a great idea but i see what you mean. The Nets would never be able to take the Knicks loyal fans but NY and Brooklyn in particular are quite huge in population. The Nets will be successful if they become competitive. The question is will they compete for popularity? Will ESPN NY be split and hype them up as much as the Knicks? Will they create a buzz in NY if they were to meet the Heat in the NBA Finals? History can be created? Is not what happens now, considered history 50 years from now?

This isnt a Lakers-Clippers comparison were talking about. No disrespect to Knicks fans but the Knicks have been a joke for the last 10 years and technically they still are albeit a more hyped joke. They have been no more successful than the Nets have recently and certainly not as successful in the last decade.

Winning is a wonderful medicine and if the Nets were to get Howard they become instant contenders with Deron. This is all hypothetical obviously

Nets will remain 2nd fiddle to the Knicks even if the Nets win championships.

The Knicks were horrible from 2002-2010, and yet we still sold out every home game. The Knicks have a loyal fanbase. The Knicks also play in the heart of the city.

Nets will probably sell out all their home games in the Barclays Arena, but don't ever expect the Knicks to become second fiddle.

Da Knicks
09-21-2011, 02:29 PM
Knick fan till i die, and that is the stance of most knick fans. We will suffer with our team like we have done no matter if we move anywhere else. The ny, miami game proved that knick fans will always be knick fans. The nets could win the next 10 championships but will still be second fiddle to the knicks. If any such transformation could of happend it would of being done these last ten years. With the knicks on the rise i just cant see the nets ever coming close to them in popularity. Knick fans are all over the place not just New York, Knicks will control New York just like the yankees.

sep11ie
09-21-2011, 02:33 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

Read the OP's post, then try to post again. He's talking about as the dominant fan base of N.Y.

On topic, yes I think they do. Knick fans were Knick fans before they were born. That's why they are so damn hard headed and stubborn.

Randy Marsh
09-21-2011, 02:52 PM
Don't think they could or ever will.

mjm07
09-21-2011, 03:21 PM
Don't think they could or ever will but Nets have definetly been the better team over the last decade. IF Nets get Dwight and keep Williams they match up very strong against the Knicks (even if they get CP3, which isn't going to be easy) and even Miami.

smith&wesson
09-21-2011, 03:39 PM
nothings gains popularity more then winning. look at the thunder for example. if brooklyn puts a winning team together ppl will love to watch them across the nation let alone the state.

shep33
09-21-2011, 03:47 PM
It's interesting, because Brooklyn is the biggest bourough in New York, and there are a lot of die hard knick fans there. However, if they bring in Howard, with Williams... IMO, that's a better combo than Melo + Amare, and the Nets would still have Lopez as a nice piece to trade (or keep).

If Brooklyn starts out with a bang, I mean the rivalry will be awesome against the Knicks. I've long watched the Knicks play, a big fan of their style of ball in the 90s, and honestly its good for the league when the Knicks are back in contention.

colinskik
09-21-2011, 03:51 PM
Brooklyn hasn't had a professional sports team since the '50s. That alone will win them more fans then they have as the currently constructed NJ Nets.

Don't forget that the site of the stadium is a major hub, very accesible, and quickly becoming gentrified as fcuk.

Regardless of both teams' success, the Nets will be a more popular team once they move to BK.

I've always been a Knicks fan, and always will be, but with the Nets one subway stop away, I'll become a fan. They'll be my #2 team, no doubt.

Muttman73
09-21-2011, 03:53 PM
Of what? bragging and false hope??

Never

shep33
09-21-2011, 03:54 PM
Brooklyn hasn't had a professional sports team since the '50s. That alone will win them more fans then they have as the currently constructed NJ Nets.

Don't forget that the site of the stadium is a major hub, very accesible, and quickly becoming gentrified as fcuk.

Regardless of both teams' success, the Nets will be a more popular team once they move to BK.

I've always been a Knicks fan, and always will be, but with the Nets one subway stop away, I'll become a fan. They'll be my #2 team, no doubt.

So true, I think location is the biggest advantage they have here. It should start a nice rivalry I think.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 04:13 PM
Here's one thing about NY sports fans, they are very very loyal! No matter how mucha team sucks they will stick by them no matter what. Ask the Mets and Knicks fans. They've been through it all and still I can't find an example of a fan that has switched to a new team. It just doesn't happen here.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 04:24 PM
:clap: Thats the way i see it. NJ was a horrible place to play. J Kidd hated it, as did Jefferson and mostly every Net. Ugh what a horrible arena the IZOD center was. Brooklyn is starving for its own sports team. There is no question that the Nets will be successful and turn profits in NY because the city is big enough but as you so eloquently put it, the NBA has seen its popularity soar again and its a "what have you done for me lately type thing"

Knicks playoff wins in the last 10 years- 0

Nets playoff wins in the last 10 years- 48

A contending team in Brooklyn with the billion dollar Barclays Center completed, particularly if the Knicks experiment doesnt pan out and the CP3 train doesnt roll thru (likely) will imo comepete with the Knicks for supremacy.

If you are talking about recent history lets talk about the last 2 years.

The nets haven't made the playoffs the last 2 years. The knicks after aquiring Amare made the playoffs. You are throwing a lot of hypotheticals out there about Knicks plans not working out. How about a hypothetical about the Deron Williams leaving the Nets to play witha real superstar like Kobe. What if Howard decides to go to LA? Fact of the matter is Knicks fans will never turn their backs on their team. You guys had a shot with Melo, a brooklyn native but at least you got Deron for a year.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 04:25 PM
nothings gains popularity more then winning. look at the thunder for example. if brooklyn puts a winning team together ppl will love to watch them across the nation let alone the state.

The thunder have no other pro basketball team and lets face it, there isn't much to do in OKC.

NYman15
09-21-2011, 04:28 PM
I'm a Knick fan so I might be biased but I don't see it. Knick fans are loyal. They've stuck with this through this last decade, even when the Nets at times were dominating, and now the Knicks are relevant again and on the way up I don't see people changing teams. I just don't see it.Thats not to say the Nets won't be relevant, but in my opinion they'll always be second fiddle to the Knicks. The Knicks have too much history and are right in the middle of Manhattan and with a bright future and a better MSG, I don't see that changing. And while its possible, the OP is still putting out a hypothetical prediction with Howard ending up a Net. Howard to the Nets is a no sure thing, we don't even know if D-will is staying, even though I think he will. I could do the same thing with the Knicks, lets say Cp3 does end up a Knick or Howard then that would just push the Nets down even more. Again its possible Dwight ends up a Net, but even if he did, I don't see the Nets overtaking the Knicks in NY, Knicks fans stuck with this team through some bad times and now that they're on the way up, I don't see many of hem leaving.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 05:06 PM
If you are talking about recent history lets talk about the last 2 years.

The nets haven't made the playoffs the last 2 years. The knicks after aquiring Amare made the playoffs. You are throwing a lot of hypotheticals out there about Knicks plans not working out. How about a hypothetical about the Deron Williams leaving the Nets to play witha real superstar like Kobe. What if Howard decides to go to LA? Fact of the matter is Knicks fans will never turn their backs on their team. You guys had a shot with Melo, a brooklyn native but at least you got Deron for a year.

Why you getting salty homie? The only hypotheticals i used were the Nets getting Dwight in FA or by trade which believe it or not is a big possibility; and the Knicks not doing well in the playoffs which is another possibilty with the Knicks as currently constructed.

Way to bring up the last two years when EVERY team goes thru a rebuilding and the Nets just ended theirs. Deron Williams will NOT leave by virtue of having no options. The only other option is the Clippers but i cant see Deron going there. He MAY wanna go to the Lakers but the Nets will not trade him and they cant sign him. Same with the Knicks and Magic

netsgiantsyanks
09-21-2011, 05:09 PM
another nets vs knicks thread

-_-

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 05:11 PM
BTW Im speaking about overall popularity in NY. Everyone knows that its impossible to turn Knicks fans. They are loyal fans like Boston fans. However NY has a huge population. Casual fans, bandwaggon fans, and Nets fans... its easy to those into loyal fans if the team is winning. This is not the 90's or the 60's or whatever old time people wanna bring up. Yes the Knicks have history but this new age is built on winning and if the Broklyn Nets were to become contenders i believe they would no longer be second fiddle. They would never overtake the Knicks but they will not be known as the inferior team

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 05:14 PM
another nets vs knicks thread

-_-

This is NOT A NETS VS KNICKS THREAD and if people keep with that mentality the thread will be closed. Please keep it civilized. I mean no disrespect to Knicks fans. Just wanted some opinion and a healthy debate.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 06:46 PM
Why you getting salty homie? The only hypotheticals i used were the Nets getting Dwight in FA or by trade which believe it or not is a big possibility; and the Knicks not doing well in the playoffs which is another possibilty with the Knicks as currently constructed.

Way to bring up the last two years when EVERY team goes thru a rebuilding and the Nets just ended theirs. Deron Williams will NOT leave by virtue of having no options. The only other option is the Clippers but i cant see Deron going there. He MAY wanna go to the Lakers but the Nets will not trade him and they cant sign him. Same with the Knicks and Magic

Idk about salty playa. You are talking about the last decade as the most recent event for the Knicks but you forgot to bring up the last 2 seasons for the Nets where they were terrible. If you are talking hypothetical than there is no reason why I can't put CP3 in a Knick uniform because you just did that with Dwight and Deron staying.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 07:10 PM
Idk about salty playa. You are talking about the last decade as the most recent event for the Knicks but you forgot to bring up the last 2 seasons for the Nets where they were terrible. If you are talking hypothetical than there is no reason why I can't put CP3 in a Knick uniform because you just did that with Dwight and Deron staying.

Ok so how do you get CP3? The Nets have the cap space to sign Howard as well as the pieces to trade for him. How do the Knicks get CP3? Im just curious..

smith&wesson
09-21-2011, 07:29 PM
The thunder have no other pro basketball team and lets face it, there isn't much to do in OKC.

regardless, if okc was a losing franchise no one would pay any attention to them. not only are they popular in theyre city but they have gained respect around the league. thats what winning does.

im a raptor fan. no one out side of toronto gives a crap about the raptors. thats because of a losing culture. if your team is a winner.. ppl will want to watch no matter where they play.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 07:36 PM
regardless, if okc was a losing franchise no one would pay any attention to them. not only are they popular in theyre city but they have gained respect around the league. thats what winning does.

im a raptor fan. no one out side of toronto gives a crap about the raptors. thats because of a losing culture. if your team is a winner.. ppl will want to watch no matter where they play.

You guys are coming up. One more lottery pick in the deepest draft since 03 and your franchise will thrive..

NYman15
09-21-2011, 08:41 PM
Ok so how do you get CP3? The Nets have the cap space to sign Howard as well as the pieces to trade for him. How do the Knicks get CP3? Im just curious..

The fact is it all depends on the CBA. If there is a hard cap that could actually help the Knicks as the cap would probably go up. If you look at the last proposal the owners made before the lockout started, the owners proposed a 70 million dollar flex cap. That would give the Knicks more than enough for another max contract. As of now, the Knicks have roughly 42 million dollars committed to the payroll in 2012 with Balkman making a little over 1 million and he could be moved so you're down to roughly 40 million committed to Melo and Amare. Thats all they technically have under contract. Now they'd have to fill the other spots, but it is definitely possibly that they could offer another max contract and thats not even taking into consideration the possibility Cp3 would take a little less to play with his 2 friends. It is possible, but we have to wait for the new CBA. But the Knicks don't have much to trade only Billups expiring and a few young guys so only way a trade is possible is if Cp3 pulls a Melo and demands a trade to 1 team. Its possibly, but we have wait and see.

Robbw241
09-21-2011, 08:45 PM
I'd rather the Knicks be the popular team tbh. Means cheaper ticket prices for me.

Mishmin
09-21-2011, 08:55 PM
It's such an odd experience seeing a sentence with the words knicks and dominance so close together...

ManningToTyree
09-21-2011, 09:02 PM
The Knicks will ALWAYS be the team in NY, Too much history to change that. Knicks fans are as loyal as they come. No matter their talent, they sell out every year, every game. Not going to get a lot of conversions to BK fans. Especially when the Knicks are currently the better team on top of it all

I'm looking forward to the NY rivalry, though. It makes things real interesting in every other major sport. The rivalry will be at the height of its intensity.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 09:05 PM
The fact is it all depends on the CBA. If there is a hard cap that could actually help the Knicks as the cap would probably go up. If you look at the last proposal the owners made before the lockout started, the owners proposed a 70 million dollar flex cap. That would give the Knicks more than enough for another max contract. As of now, the Knicks have roughly 42 million dollars committed to the payroll in 2012 with Balkman making a little over 1 million and he could be moved so you're down to roughly 40 million committed to Melo and Amare. Thats all they technically have under contract. Now they'd have to fill the other spots, but it is definitely possibly that they could offer another max contract and thats not even taking into consideration the possibility Cp3 would take a little less to play with his 2 friends. It is possible, but we have to wait for the new CBA. But the Knicks don't have much to trade only Billups expiring and a few young guys so only way a trade is possible is if Cp3 pulls a Melo and demands a trade to 1 team. Its possibly, but we have wait and see.

I see.. if you guys get him that will be such a fun team to watch! Man thats crazy.

llemon
09-21-2011, 09:19 PM
Let's clear up this 'dominance' thing.

Are Knick fans stating that during the '01-'02 through '03-'04 seasons, that the Knicks were the dominant team, even though the Nets EMBARRASSED the Knicks on pretty much a daily basis?

If that is what is supposed to be the point here, then all I can say is that I hope Kinck fans enjoyed that 'dominance', because I can guarantee you that Net fans obviously recognized an RELISHED what they unknowingly accepted as dominace over the Knicks, and on most occasions making the 'dominant?' Knicks look like an NBDL organization.

My congratulations to you Knick fans. If you felt 'dominant' during those 3 particular seasons, then you must feel like you are 'Kings Of The World' for having been swept in this last seasons playoffs

NYsFinest
09-21-2011, 09:57 PM
Let's clear up this 'dominance' thing.

Are Knick fans stating that during the '01-'02 through '03-'04 seasons, that the Knicks were the dominant team, even though the Nets EMBARRASSED the Knicks on pretty much a daily basis?

If that is what is supposed to be the point here, then all I can say is that I hope Kinck fans enjoyed that 'dominance', because I can guarantee you that Net fans obviously recognized an RELISHED what they unknowingly accepted as dominace over the Knicks, and on most occasions making the 'dominant?' Knicks look like an NBDL organization.

My congratulations to you Knick fans. If you felt 'dominant' during those 3 particular seasons, then you must feel like you are 'Kings Of The World' for having been swept in this last seasons playoffs

Those were the only 4 years the Nets were good in their NBA franchise history.... and still noone in the country gave a crap. Only team I can think of that went to the finals and couldn't even sell out. They are moving to NY hoping to steal Knick fans because they are tired of being NBAs doormat. The desperate move to Brooklyn will prevent them from being a laughingstock, but new yorkers bleed organe and blue, while the Nets will scrape up fake fans who think the "Brooklyn" jerseys look cool.

As for the swept comment, please don't act like you forgot that 2 of their best 3 players practially didn't play in the series.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 10:05 PM
Those were the only 4 years the Nets were good in their NBA franchise history.... and still noone in the country gave a crap. Only team I can think of that went to the finals and couldn't even sell out. They are moving to NY hoping to steal Knick fans because they are tired of being NBAs doormat. The desperate move to Brooklyn will prevent them from being a laughingstock, but new yorkers bleed organe and blue, while the Nets will scrape up fake fans who think the "Brooklyn" jerseys look cool.

As for the swept comment, please don't act like you forgot that 2 of their best 3 players practially didn't play in the series.

Not all of NY is Knick territory... Loyal Knicks fans may never turn but thats not who the Nets would be targeting. They would be targeting casual fans and bandwaggon fans and Jersey fans... They would be successful. This is a stars league now and if my scenario were to happen the Nets would gain a LOT of fans

Sinestro
09-21-2011, 10:09 PM
Hmmm...I dont believe lifelong Knicks fans would turn, I think they would be able to get some of the younger fans and the usual bandwagon jumpers but the Knicks would still rule imo

Kinkotheclown
09-21-2011, 10:14 PM
dominance? Did I miss a season? last I checked they were swept in the 1st round of the playoffs

Didn't even read the thread did you? :eyebrow:


NY is NY and the knicks have the upper hand right now but brooklyn is starving and deserving of a team and I think will take to this team quickly and and in a hardcore fashion.
I think a team in brooklyn will change, in a positive way, the NBA and will challenge the knicks NY dominance. The Garden is the Mecca but with Dolan in charge and a few more mediocre seasons (Face it guys, we are still mediocre. We are not an elite team) and a few good brooklyn nets' seasons it could be interesting.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 10:19 PM
Didn't even read the thread did you? :eyebrow:


NY is NY and the knicks have the upper hand right now but brooklyn is starving and deserving of a team and I think will take to this team quickly and and in a hardcore fashion.
I think a team in brooklyn will change, in a positive way, the NBA and will challenge the knicks NY dominance. The Garden is the Mecca but with Dolan in charge and a few more mediocre seasons (Face it guys, we are still mediocre. We are not an elite team) and a few good brooklyn nets' seasons it could be interesting.

Your the man. I agree. It will be an uphill battle thou. Knicks have the best fanbase in the NBA in terms of fan support and loyalty

NYman15
09-21-2011, 10:24 PM
I think it would be a lot of fun for NY to have both teams competitive and playing well. It would make for a great rivalry. I mean could you imagine, although its unlikely, if Dwight ends up a Net and Cp3 ends up a Knick. That would make for some amazing games and a great rivalry.

llemon
09-21-2011, 10:28 PM
Those were the only 4 years the Nets were good in their NBA franchise history.... and still noone in the country gave a crap. Only team I can think of that went to the finals and couldn't even sell out. They are moving to NY hoping to steal Knick fans because they are tired of being NBAs doormat. The desperate move to Brooklyn will prevent them from being a laughingstock, but new yorkers bleed organe and blue, while the Nets will scrape up fake fans who think the "Brooklyn" jerseys look cool.

As for the swept comment, please don't act like you forgot that 2 of their best 3 players practially didn't play in the series.

You haven't shown the full spectrum of your ignorance yet. Please keep posting so you can show everyone the full extent of your idiocy.

I look forward to your next post. And your spelling abilities are nothing less than beautiful.

pito6079
09-21-2011, 10:57 PM
Nets are not too far off. If they start winning and only if their star stays which would attract Dwight

NYsFinest
09-21-2011, 11:22 PM
You haven't shown the full spectrum of your ignorance yet. Please keep posting so you can show everyone the full extent of your idiocy.

I look forward to your next post. And your spelling abilities are nothing less than beautiful.

One typo, take it easy pal. And its not ignorance, NY is and always will be Knick territory, I find it hilarious how the several dozen Nets fans and the whole Nets organization believes it will take over NY. How about worrying about pissing off the handful of loyal fans they have in New Jersey instead of hoping to steal bandwagoners from NYC?

And you should know your Nets history, they have been terrible through the late 80s and 90s, followed by a few decent years and are now back to the bottom. So please don't brag about a 3 year span (in the weakest conference the NBA has ever seen) almost a decade ago to validate your franchise. Since their merger to the NBA over 30 years ago the Nets have had ZERO seasons with 50+ wins and 15 seasons with 50+ losses. In that same timespan the Knicks have had 8 50+ win seasons.... think about that for a second before you attack my ignorance or the competence of the NYK franchise.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 11:22 PM
Let's clear up this 'dominance' thing.

Are Knick fans stating that during the '01-'02 through '03-'04 seasons, that the Knicks were the dominant team, even though the Nets EMBARRASSED the Knicks on pretty much a daily basis?

If that is what is supposed to be the point here, then all I can say is that I hope Kinck fans enjoyed that 'dominance', because I can guarantee you that Net fans obviously recognized an RELISHED what they unknowingly accepted as dominace over the Knicks, and on most occasions making the 'dominant?' Knicks look like an NBDL organization.

My congratulations to you Knick fans. If you felt 'dominant' during those 3 particular seasons, then you must feel like you are 'Kings Of The World' for having been swept in this last seasons playoffs

When you've got to read, you read, you don't talk.

Evolution23
09-21-2011, 11:26 PM
One typo, take it easy pal. And its not ignorance, NY is and always will be Knick territory, I find it hilarious how the several dozen Nets fans and the whole Nets organization believes it will take over NY. How about worrying about pissing off the handful of loyal fans they have in New Jersey instead of hoping to steal bandwagoners from NYC?

And you should know you Nets history, they have been terrible through the late 80s and 90s, followed by a few decent years and are now back to the bottom. So please don't brag about a 3 year span almost a decade ago to validate your franchise. Since their merger to the NBA over 30 years ago the Nets have had ZERO seasons with 50+ wins and 15 seasons with 50+ losses. In that same timespan the Knicks have had 8 50+ win seasons.... think about that for a second before you attack my ignorance or the competence of the NYK franchise.

:burn:

Robbw241
09-21-2011, 11:30 PM
The goal of the Nets move to Brooklyn is not to convert the current Knicks fans(although we'll take any of those that want to jump on the bandwagon) but to get the next generation of fans, the kids who don't have these allegiances. Sure Prok might say the media we are looking to convert the diehards but that's just him getting on the good side of the media. If we can put a good product on the court then we can get the kids of New York to become our fans and we can go from there.

llemon
09-21-2011, 11:33 PM
One typo, take it easy pal. And its not ignorance, NY is and always will be Knick territory, I find it hilarious how the several dozen Nets fans and the whole Nets organization believes it will take over NY. How about worrying about pissing off the handful of loyal fans they have in New Jersey instead of hoping to steal bandwagoners from NYC?

And you should know your Nets history, they have been terrible through the late 80s and 90s, followed by a few decent years and are now back to the bottom. So please don't brag about a 3 year span (in the weakest conference the NBA) has ever seen almost a decade ago to validate your franchise. Since their merger to the NBA over 30 years ago the Nets have had ZERO seasons with 50+ wins and 15 seasons with 50+ losses. In that same timespan the Knicks have had 8 50+ win seasons.... think about that for a second before you attack my ignorance or the competence of the NYK franchise.

So you are saying that when the Nets SWEPT the Knicks in a weak East in '04. the Knicks were the dominant team?

Say no mo'.

Chill_Will_24
09-21-2011, 11:34 PM
One typo, take it easy pal. And its not ignorance, NY is and always will be Knick territory, I find it hilarious how the several dozen Nets fans and the whole Nets organization believes it will take over NY. How about worrying about pissing off the handful of loyal fans they have in New Jersey instead of hoping to steal bandwagoners from NYC?

And you should know your Nets history, they have been terrible through the late 80s and 90s, followed by a few decent years and are now back to the bottom. So please don't brag about a 3 year span (in the weakest conference the NBA) has ever seen almost a decade ago to validate your franchise. Since their merger to the NBA over 30 years ago the Nets have had ZERO seasons with 50+ wins and 15 seasons with 50+ losses. In that same timespan the Knicks have had 8 50+ win seasons.... think about that for a second before you attack my ignorance or the competence of the NYK franchise.

If the Nets brass think they will be stealing fans from the Knicks they will be disappointed. They will sell out in Brooklyn but not with any converted Knicks fans. They will be loyal Brooklynites and Nets fans and bandwaggoners... these next few years will be crucial fot the Nets. if they become contenders they will compete with the Knicks. If they keep losing they will never get out of the Knicks shadow because the Knicks right now are hot... they have done nothin to earn it but regardless the Knicks have N buzzing with excitement

llemon
09-21-2011, 11:39 PM
When you've got to read, you read, you don't talk.

Words you should live by.

That's assuming you are capable of reading, something I have seen no evidence of thus far from your posts.

NYsFinest
09-21-2011, 11:40 PM
So you are saying that when the Nets SWEPT the Knicks in a weak East in '04. the Knicks were the dominant team?

Say no mo'.

Dominant in terms of fanbase and media attention which is what this conversation is about...


But when you bring up the ineptitude of the Knicks franchise as a whole it makes me wonder if you are 15 years old.

The Jason Kidd era where the Nets actually mustered up their first 49 win season as an NBA team was the highlight of the franchise's 35 year NBA history. So to use that as a bragging point is absurd. The fact that the Knicks SWEPT the Nets last regular season or the that the Nets lost 70 games 2 years ago carries much more weight than the one playoff series 7 years ago.

NYsFinest
09-21-2011, 11:43 PM
If the Nets brass think they will be stealing fans from the Knicks they will be disappointed. They will sell out in Brooklyn but not with any converted Knicks fans. They will be loyal Brooklynites and Nets fans and bandwaggoners... these next few years will be crucial fot the Nets. if they become contenders they will compete with the Knicks. If they keep losing they will never get out of the Knicks shadow because the Knicks right now are hot... they have done nothin to earn it but regardless the Knicks have N buzzing with excitement

Agreed that the Nets will be much better off in BK and that I am actually looking forward to the on-court rivalry if both teams continue to improve.

I just get offended when Nets fans don't know their history and because they remember the Jason Kidd to Martin alley oops they think that they have had a much more successful franchise than the Knicks (in terms of winning). And that since they have such a good franchise it will be a cakewalk to take NY from the Knicks who have clearly never been good because they remember Isaiah.

llemon
09-21-2011, 11:55 PM
Dominant in terms of fanbase and media attention which is what this conversation is about...


But when you bring up the ineptitude of the Knicks franchise as a whole it makes me wonder if you are 15 years old.

The Jason Kidd era where the Nets actually mustered up their first 49 win season as an NBA team was the highlight of the franchise's 35 year NBA history. So to use that as a bragging point is absurd. The fact that the Knicks SWEPT the Nets last regular season or the that the Nets lost 70 games 2 years ago carries much more weight than the one playoff series 7 years ago.

Is there any point responding to you, as you know nothing?

Re-read your post, figure out where you are mistaken, post where you were mistaken, and then I will respond to you.

Oh, and that Nets 12 win season. Knicks didn't sweep the Nets did they? Didn't even take the season series, did they?

kmo429
09-21-2011, 11:55 PM
Dominance??? Lol. They were good last year, and i think theyll get even better this year.. but i think there a ways away from dominance at the moment

NYsFinest
09-21-2011, 11:57 PM
Is there any point responding to you, as you know nothing?

Re-read your post, figure out where you are mistaken, post where you were mistaken, and then I will respond to you.

Oh, and that Nets 12 win season. Knicks didn't sweep the Nets did they? Didn't even take the season series, did they?

Clearly states swept LAST SEASON OR the 70 loss season 2 years ago.

And sorry they had ONE 50 win season... my argument is still valid, stop looking for minor loopholes just to avoid the real issue. Having 1 50+ win season and 15 50+ loss seasons in 35 years does not invalidate the main point of what i am saying.

llemon
09-22-2011, 12:04 AM
Clearly states swept LAST SEASON OR the 70 loss season 2 years ago.

So, in that 70 loss season, Nets and Knicks split the season series, including the Nets putting a SEVERE beating on the Knicks in the last game of that series, at MSG, with the Knicks going 0-18 from three.

Watched that game a few weeks ago on DVD. Truly a joy to behold.

And that wasn't the mistake I was referring to.

Back to the drawing board, sonny.

Punk
09-22-2011, 01:24 AM
I think Nets organization and their fans need to understand they will never replace the Knicks as the dominate the dominate team. Ever.

The Clippers might end up with Dwight and Deron and that does not replace the Lakers as the #1 team in LA.

The Knicks may have "sucked" for 10 years but they still remained memorable in some way shape or form. There has been nothing memorable from the Nets.

Two back to back Finals is great but nobody supported and nobody in NY really supported despite NJ/NY being so married together.

Nobody in NY even cares to remember the Nets glory dates with Kidd, Jefferson and Carter. People care more about Ewing, Starks, Houston, Frasier, Monore.

There is ALOT that creates a dominance and NJ will never have it. I love my Mets but they will never equal anything close to the Yankees no matter what roster they have and I think Miami trying to out do the 90s Bulls is an example of that.

You can't compare what the Nets could be in Brooklyn because they aren't there yet and NJ fans bandwagoning is a terrible idea considering they don't even properly support them in New Jersey right now. Compare Melo's intro to Deron's and you will see my point.

Evolution23
09-22-2011, 01:40 AM
Words you should live by.

That's assuming you are capable of reading, something I have seen no evidence of thus far from your posts.

I can't read, I just magically understood what you were saying. You must be the smartest kid in your middle school.

Chill_Will_24
09-22-2011, 01:43 AM
I think Nets organization and their fans need to understand they will never replace the Knicks as the dominate the dominate team. Ever.

The Clippers might end up with Dwight and Deron and that does not replace the Lakers as the #1 team in LA.

The Knicks may have "sucked" for 10 years but they still remained memorable in some way shape or form. There has been nothing memorable from the Nets.

Two back to back Finals is great but nobody supported and nobody in NY really supported despite NJ/NY being so married together.

Nobody in NY even cares to remember the Nets glory dates with Kidd, Jefferson and Carter. People care more about Ewing, Starks, Houston, Frasier, Monore.

There is ALOT that creates a dominance and NJ will never have it. I love my Mets but they will never equal anything close to the Yankees no matter what roster they have and I think Miami trying to out do the 90s Bulls is an example of that.

You can't compare what the Nets could be in Brooklyn because they aren't there yet and NJ fans bandwagoning is a terrible idea considering they don't even properly support them in New Jersey right now. Compare Melo's intro to Deron's and you will see my point.

The Knicks arent the Lakers

thenetslegend
09-22-2011, 02:17 AM
what dominance??????

Chill_Will_24
09-22-2011, 02:35 AM
what dominance??????

Read the thread! Jesus... :pity:

Bulls_fan90
09-22-2011, 02:59 AM
It's like comparing Manchester City to Manchester United. City can spend all they want but they'll never get close to United. Only difference is Knicks barely win anything unlike United lol.

thenetslegend
09-22-2011, 03:12 AM
Read the thread! Jesus... :pity:

sorry my bad, knicks will always run NY, nets will get alot of new fans though, if they even want to come close to the knicks popularity they would need to get you know who

Bulls_fan90
09-22-2011, 03:22 AM
sorry my bad, knicks will always run NY, nets will get alot of new fans though, if they even want to come close to the knicks popularity they would need to get you know who

voldemort?

thenetslegend
09-22-2011, 03:56 AM
voldemort?

yes!, how did you know?