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HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 02:03 PM
Why is everyone complaining about seeing the same teams win and whining about change...

In the 80s it was dominated by Lakers, Celtics, Pistons

In the 90s it was Bulls, Rockets

Post Jordan era we have seen Spurs, Lakers, Miami, Boston, Pistons, and Mavericks and guess what? The ratings have been HORRIBLE

This whole thing about seeing the same teams win is stupid cause the era that was mainly dominated by MJ was the highest rated.. Seems to me like people loved seeing the same team win

This era has actually had more teams win then the previous two and less people are watching

Im just saying, I know alot may wanna be surprised but more wants to see a dynasty that people will remember for years to come

llemon
09-17-2011, 02:10 PM
Why is everyone complaining about seeing the same teams win and whining about change...

In the 80s it was dominated by Lakers, Celtics, Pistons

In the 90s it was Bulls, Rockets

Post Jordan era we have seen Spurs, Lakers, Miami, Boston, Pistons, and Mavericks and guess what? The ratings have been HORRIBLE

This whole thing about seeing the same teams win is stupid cause the era that was mainly dominated by MJ was the highest rated.. Seems to me like people loved seeing the same team win

This era has actually had more teams win then the previous two and less people are watching

Im just saying, I know alot may wanna be surprised but more wants to see a dynasty that people will remember for years to come

I'm not concerned about what everyone enjoys.

I'm concerned about what I enjoy.

Hawkeye15
09-17-2011, 02:12 PM
I'm not concerned about what everyone enjoys.

I'm concerned about what I enjoy.

pretty much.


Large markets have a higher number of fans obviously, therefore its profitable for the sport when those teams are good. But fans of the other 26 teams are sick as hell of seeing the same teams win all the time.

bledrules
09-17-2011, 02:22 PM
Why is everyone complaining about seeing the same teams win and whining about change...

In the 80s it was dominated by Lakers, Celtics, Pistons

In the 90s it was Bulls, Rockets

Post Jordan era we have seen Spurs, Lakers, Miami, Boston, Pistons, and Mavericks and guess what? The ratings have been HORRIBLE

This whole thing about seeing the same teams win is stupid cause the era that was mainly dominated by MJ was the highest rated.. Seems to me like people loved seeing the same team win

This era has actually had more teams win then the previous two and less people are watching

Im just saying, I know alot may wanna be surprised but more wants to see a dynasty that people will remember for years to come

The players have changed ALOT since the Jordan era and its a def shame.These days the NBA is a collection of tall,dumb,ego maniacs.
*******s like LBJ and Kobe Bryant have single handedly destroyed the NBA

C-Style
09-17-2011, 02:32 PM
^^^ Jordan was a ego maniac just like the 2 names mentioned above

asandhu23
09-17-2011, 02:47 PM
so you are justifying Stern rigging games for big markets?

gwrighter
09-17-2011, 02:58 PM
wasn't last seasons Celtics vs. Heat season opener the highest rated game in the history of the NBA or something like that?

beasted86
09-17-2011, 02:59 PM
so you are justifying Stern rigging games for big markets?
:pity: SMH at people still on this...

Ill21
09-17-2011, 03:12 PM
:pity: SMH at people still on this...

I know its insane

Tony_Starks
09-17-2011, 04:28 PM
The people that get tired of seeing it are usually fans of organizations known for messing up. It's no coincidence that the teams that win are usually the best in scouting, drafting, trading, and FA signing.

Now if you want to argue that the big market teams have the advantage in FA signings I will definitely agree. But when it comes to scouting/drafting and trades there are no excuses, that just boils down to doing your homework and knowing the game.....

Geargo Wallace
09-17-2011, 04:45 PM
I can't wait til my Raptors win it all and the league goes under for good.

smith&wesson
09-17-2011, 05:04 PM
jordans era was the most viewed because of jordan himself. the world tuned in when jordan was playing. just like the world tuned in when mike tyson fought. he was a globally recognized athlete and he raised basketball popularity around the world.

that being said, i would prefer to watch differnt teams then the same ones over and over again. when the mavs won last year i was very happy for dallas even though im not a mavs fan. i just know they deserved it

Hellcrooner
09-17-2011, 05:11 PM
aditional data.

the 70s when basically every year there was a new champion were the Worst in ratings, so bad that the 80s final was not even broadcasted live.

RZZZA
09-17-2011, 05:13 PM
aditional data.

the 70s when basically every year there was a new champion were the Worst in ratings, so bad that the 80s final was not even broadcasted live.

ok but that's not comparable at all since back then basketball had nowhere near the popularity and cultural importance as it achieved in the late 80's/early 90's.

Some big market teams you cannot say that people are tired of seeing win. The Knicks? When was the last time they won.

HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 05:14 PM
The people that get tired of seeing it are usually fans of organizations known for messing up. It's no coincidence that the teams that win are usually the best in scouting, drafting, trading, and FA signing.

Now if you want to argue that the big market teams have the advantage in FA signings I will definitely agree. But when it comes to scouting/drafting and trades there are no excuses, that just boils down to doing your homework and knowing the game.....

Exactly... Alot of small market teams are in the top 3 picks every year(Minnesota cough, cough) and cant win over 25 games to save their lives probably because of mistakes like trading Brandon Roy, drafting Brewer, Johnny Flynn, trading Lawson with other idiotic mistakes

But teams like Boston proved why they have titles back in 2007 offseason

Its just the way it is.. You make good moves then you get good results

NYKalltheway
09-17-2011, 05:16 PM
you forgot the Sixers in the 80s, 1983 = best team ever ;)

llemon
09-17-2011, 05:16 PM
aditional data.

the 70s when basically every year there was a new champion were the Worst in ratings, so bad that the 80s final was not even broadcasted live.

Sorry, don't care. The '70s, especially the last 5 years of the ABA, was the most exciting pro ball I have ever witnessed.

Again, I don't care about what everyone wants. I care about what I want.

Hawkeye15
09-17-2011, 05:18 PM
Sorry, don't care. The '70s, especially the last 5 years of the ABA, was the most exciting pro ball I have ever witnessed.

Again, I don't care about what everyone wants. I care about what I want.

you didn't share when you were a child did you llemon...

HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 05:19 PM
aditional data.

the 70s when basically every year there was a new champion were the Worst in ratings, so bad that the 80s final was not even broadcasted live.

Thank you


ok but that's not comparable at all since back then basketball had nowhere near the popularity and cultural importance as it achieved in the late 80's/early 90's.

Some big market teams you cannot say that people are tired of seeing win. The Knicks? When was the last time they won.

You know why it didnt have the popularity? Because it didnt have a dominant force like Magic/Bird or like Jordan

and the Knicks are a Big market because its NY just like all of NY teams... No matter what they will always be a large market, especially since they have/had just one team in the NBA

Hawkeye15
09-17-2011, 05:25 PM
Marv Albert saved the NBA obviously. As did John Tesh when he created the song that played on NBA on NBC

These proud men deserve the credit.

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 05:26 PM
This hopefully up until now has been by design. Stern and company purposely let the the large market teams dominant the tv because that's the easy to generate ratings. They are finally realizing that's the short sighted way to grow your league. When you run your league properly it doesn't matter who's on tv it will still at the very least get great ratings.

llemon
09-17-2011, 05:27 PM
Thank you



You know why it didnt have the popularity? Because it didnt have a dominant force like Magic/Bird or like Jordan

and the Knicks are a Big market because its NY just like all of NY teams... No matter what they will always be a large market, especially since they have/had just one team in the NBA

NBA did have this tall guy named Jabbar.

And the Knicks and Celtics each won two Titles in the 70's BEFORE the merger.

And Earl Monroe and Walt Frazier really were quite the boring players to watch.

Basketball fans knew more about basketball then.

Now..........not so much. The new breed gets there opinions from advanced stats rather than observing the game and how it's played.

RZZZA
09-17-2011, 05:28 PM
You know what I think helped the NBA become more popular? Hip hop culture.

Yeah, seriously. The black male is obviously the most "cool" and emulated person in America, once they jump on something it becomes cool.

NYKalltheway
09-17-2011, 05:29 PM
You know what I think helped the NBA become more popular? Hip hop culture.

Yeah, seriously. The black male is obviously the most "cool" and emulated person in America, once they jump on something it becomes cool.

on the contrary, this is what killed the NBA's popularity across the world ;)

Tony_Starks
09-17-2011, 05:31 PM
Can anyone name me some small market teams that have been running their teams extremely well for years that should've had a championship by now? The closest one I can think of would be Utah but I can't really say them since they let all their pivotal pieces walk in free agency last year.....

Seems to me everyone is pretty much getting the success or failure they deserve based on the moves they've routinely been making.

llemon
09-17-2011, 05:35 PM
Can anyone name me some small market teams that have been running their teams extremely well for years that should've had a championship by now? The closest one I can think of would be Utah but I can't really say them since they let all their pivotal pieces walk in free agency last year.....

Seems to me everyone is pretty much getting the success or failure they deserve based on the moves they've routinely been making.

Spurs? Pistons?

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 05:35 PM
Can anyone name me some small market teams that have been running their teams extremely well for years that should've had a championship by now? The closest one I can think of would be Utah but I can't really say them since they let all their pivotal pieces walk in free agency last year.....

Seems to me everyone is pretty much getting the success or failure they deserve based on the moves they've routinely been making.

Some of you talk as if the system is fair and small market teams just are all being run by David Kahn clones. The fact that the large market teams can afford to give away salaries that can top or compete with smaller markets while still remaining incredibly profitable is completely being ignored by some.

smith&wesson
09-17-2011, 05:39 PM
i would like to see any team that hasnt won a ship win one in the next couple years. like the suns, or the grizzlies, thunder or raps .. it be nice for an under dog team to win for a change

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 05:41 PM
The rating spikes are driven by casual fans. Since all the casual fan is feed about the NBA is the handful of large market teams that's all they want to see. Stern tells them through his actions that the only teams worth watching are the Lakers, Heat, Celtics, or Bulls. So when somebody else does well finally casual fans don't care because they're conditioned to only care about a select few.

NYKalltheway
09-17-2011, 05:44 PM
i would like to see any team that hasnt won a ship win one in the next couple years. like the suns, or the grizzlies, thunder or raps .. it be nice for an under dog team to win for a change

with 7 game series, it's guaranteed that a top 4 team will win the league year in year out

HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 05:46 PM
Spurs? Pistons?

There are 7 titles between the two... He said that shouldve won a title

Tony_Starks
09-17-2011, 05:46 PM
Some of you talk as if the system is fair and small market teams just are all being run by David Kahn clones. The fact that the large market teams can afford to give away salaries that can top or compete with smaller markets while still remaining incredibly profitable is completely being ignored by some.


What's the excuse for drafting and trading poorly though? NO for example had been needing a reliable backup pg for years to give CP3 a rest and they finally find a darn good one in Collison and what happens? They ship him out. Things like that have nothing to do with big market/ small market they're just really dumb moves.

Its the small moves that actually get you over the hump. Everyone has the MLE for example but how many teams just totally blow it on random players?

llemon
09-17-2011, 05:50 PM
There are 7 titles between the two... He said that shouldve won a title

He said SHOULD HAVE won a Title. Are you saying Spurs and Pistons SHOULDN'T have won those Titles?

HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 05:52 PM
He said SHOULD HAVE won a Title. Are you saying Spurs and Pistons SHOULDN'T have won those Titles?

:facepalm:

Kevj77
09-17-2011, 05:57 PM
The rating spikes are driven by casual fans. Since all the casual fan is feed about the NBA is the handful of large market teams that's all they want to see. Stern tells them through his actions that the only teams worth watching are the Lakers, Heat, Celtics, or Bulls. So when somebody else does well finally casual fans don't care because they're conditioned to only care about a select few.I'd say your right about casual fans driving ratings. What makes a casual fan watch though. Is it parity, nope. The Celtics vs. Lakers in the 80s drew a lot of new casual fans. Jordan got the NBA legions of new fans. My over 60 year old parents that don't watch sports much know who those people are and watched the Lakers v Celtics and Jordan in the finals.

Tony_Starks
09-17-2011, 06:05 PM
If they put in a hard cap I wish we could save this thread and revisit it in a few years. Guess what I bet will have happened? Either the Lakers, MIA, Boston, Spurs, or Chicago will have added at least on more ring to their collection. And the bottom tier teams (if they still have the same manangement) will still be in the same predicament.

The only difference will be their owners will have a bigger private jet, thats about it........

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 06:15 PM
What's the excuse for drafting and trading poorly though? NO for example had been needing a reliable backup pg for years to give CP3 a rest and they finally find a darn good one in Collison and what happens? They ship him out. Things like that have nothing to do with big market/ small market they're just really dumb moves.

Its the small moves that actually get you over the hump. Everyone has the MLE for example but how many teams just totally blow it on random players?

We traded a back up PG for a starting SF. We still have Jack as a back up PG.

MJ-BULLS
09-17-2011, 06:19 PM
well, when jordan was around, we had massive ratings because he is the greatest player in nba history, arguably. The lakers, celtics and Bulls...etc all have been winners in the past history. therefor having large fan bases, not only in the states they currently play in, but all around the nation. Kind of like the yankees and redsox.

smith&wesson
09-17-2011, 06:47 PM
with 7 game series, it's guaranteed that a top 4 team will win the league year in year out

may be true, but in a 82 game season any team can finish top 4 in each respective conference.

NYKalltheway
09-17-2011, 06:53 PM
may be true, but in a 82 game season any team can finish top 4 in each respective conference.

I meant a top 4 team in the NBA in terms of strength, not top 4 seed ;)

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 07:05 PM
may be true, but in a 82 game season any team can finish top 4 in each respective conference.

I'm convicted that 82 games are way too many and hurt the NBA from a popularity stand point. I would like to see them address this. Ratings or rather increasing ratings IMO is what the league should be focusing.

smith&wesson
09-17-2011, 07:15 PM
I meant a top 4 team in the NBA in terms of strength, not top 4 seed ;)

lol ... either way its usually big market teams. :(

smith&wesson
09-17-2011, 07:16 PM
I'm convicted that 82 games are way too many and hurt the NBA from a popularity stand point. I would like to see them address this. Ratings or rather increasing ratings IMO is what the league should be focusing.

hmm... im selfish i like as much nba ball as possible. hell they can increas it to 92 games lol .. but i understand what your saying.

llemon
09-17-2011, 07:32 PM
:facepalm:

Facepalm THIS, douchebag.

I kinda get a feeling that posters that use 'facepalm' have sexual identity issues.

Can't think of another reason the 'facepalm' would be used.

RZZZA
09-17-2011, 07:34 PM
lol^

I don't like it either but lol at that comment

LakersMaster24
09-17-2011, 07:39 PM
:pity: SMH at people still on this...

Are you one of those people that think Al-Qaeda blew up the towers? Or, the ones that think Saddam actually had nuclear weapons and was planning to use it against the USA? :eyebrow:

Mudvayne91
09-17-2011, 07:47 PM
:pity: SMH at people still on this...

The refs are very biased towards major market teams and super star players. I consider that an unfair advantage for those teams compared a Minnesota. So yeah, I feel in a sense it is rigged.

RZZZA
09-17-2011, 07:51 PM
The refs are very biased towards major market teams and super star players. I consider that an unfair advantage for those teams compared a Minnesota. So yeah, I feel in a sense it is rigged.

Ask Bulls fans if they think Rose or Boozer get a fair shake from the refs, I think you'll be surprised at the answers...

HouRealCoach
09-17-2011, 07:52 PM
We traded a back up PG for a starting SF. We still have Jack as a back up PG.

Darren Collison is not a back up PG... He could very well become a star some day

Chandler for Okafor was a dumb trade, Thornton for Landry was a HUGE steal for the Kings

When Lakers had their expiring contract they got Gasol, Houston once got Artest, New Orleans got Jarrett Jack, along with trading Jerryd Bayless

West might be leaving for nothing and could be followed by Chris Paul

That franchise is slowly becoming a joke

Mudvayne91
09-17-2011, 07:53 PM
Maybe so, but ask all the small to mid markets if they feel their teams get a fair shake when playing a team like the Lakers.

da ThRONe
09-17-2011, 08:04 PM
Darren Collison is not a back up PG... He could very well become a star some day

Chandler for Okafor was a dumb trade, Thornton for Landry was a HUGE steal for the Kings

When Lakers had their expiring contract they got Gasol, Houston once got Artest, New Orleans got Jarrett Jack, along with trading Jerryd Bayless

West might be leaving for nothing and could be followed by Chris Paul

That franchise is slowly becoming a joke

DC may be a star but he'll never be better than Chris. Plus Darren struggled this year.

Chandler was having issues staying healthy. I for one thought Okafor was much better on offense than he is.

Thornton was having issues with Monty Williams. Don't know why or what happened, but ultimately it lead to trading him. Didn't love the decision at the same time don't know all the factors

Can't make West stay. IMO this is a bad move for West. Giving the fact that player salaries will most likely be reduced moving forward I really don't see teams throwing money at him coming off a major knee injury.

Bayless was worth giving up for Jack that was a good trade for us.

I wouldn't call us a joke. We have made some mistakes what organization doesn't? With the right CBA and the right owner we should be one of the most improved team moving forward.