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View Full Version : 5 seconds left in the game, down 1, who would you have taking the shot for you?



T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:38 PM
Given the options of kevin durant, derrick rose, and lebron james, 3 players who arent the most clutch with the last shot of the game on the line:

Rose(guarded by a 6"8 player in final seconds in miami series)

Durant(problems figuring out where to take the shot from)

Lebron James(unfocused when the big shot comes)

with your life on the line in a game of basketball against the grim reaper, who would you rather have take the last shot for you?

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:39 PM
id pick rose, hit a big shot against the rockets this year when they needed him, durant is too unfocused and shrinks in the moment, lebron isjust 1-22 all time in last second shots

nycsports2
08-09-2011, 05:40 PM
kobe.... but outa these guys durant

Khalifa21
08-09-2011, 05:41 PM
Out of these guys, LeBron... Out of the whole league, Melo.

Rose-For-Prez
08-09-2011, 05:41 PM
Rose then Durant then lebron

RCarlson85
08-09-2011, 05:42 PM
None of the above...I would take Wade. Out of these 3, probably Durant at this point. It would be a different story if Lebron would drive aggressively. He seems to like to settle for the J when he doesn't need to.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:42 PM
Out of these guys, LeBron... Out of the whole league, Melo.

out of the whole league for me:

1. Mamba 2. Melo 3. Wade 4. Rose

just my opinion

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 05:43 PM
Derrick was clutch in the final moments of a game all season long, you just remember those few times he wasn't, lol.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:43 PM
pick carefully, your life is on the line

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:43 PM
Derrick was clutch in the final moments of a game all season long, you just remember those few times he wasn't, lol.


last second shots is what this thread is about, not whole 4th quarters

Jetsguy
08-09-2011, 05:44 PM
Melo

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 05:45 PM
Yes, Derrick is clutch. I can't speak for these other guys since I've followed Derrick much more than these other guys, but I'm totally fine with letting Derrick have the final shot. Live or die with his final decision, I'm fine with it.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:46 PM
Melo

dont read much? read the options,lol

JWO35
08-09-2011, 05:46 PM
Derrick Rose? :laugh:

gfixer33
08-09-2011, 05:47 PM
Durant

Chill_Will_24
08-09-2011, 05:47 PM
Travis Outlaw

-Kobe24-TJ19-
08-09-2011, 05:48 PM
Mike James

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:49 PM
Travis Outlaw

stick to the options please!

juno10
08-09-2011, 05:49 PM
isn't lebron a free mason he'd probably miss the shot on purpose if my life was on the line jk jk. but honestly id say durant since he can get his shot off over anyone and has more range on his shot.

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 05:49 PM
Derrick Rose? :laugh:

Detroit? :laugh:

You can always tell who's gonna bash Derrick Rose, either Detroit fans or Heat fans.

asandhu23
08-09-2011, 05:50 PM
Monta Ellis was pretty clutch. He had two very clutch shots in a row against Pacers and Kings to tie and win games.


he also makes clutch end of quarter shots like this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM9av21yydo.

Assman22
08-09-2011, 05:50 PM
Why are we choosing between these 3 players anyway? How about Ray Allen or Kobe or D-Wade or Dirk? Or even go down low to DH12? If I was to choose one player out of all the NBA players these 3 you listed would be below the 5 I listed and maybe even further. My choice would be Allen if it's a 3 pointer needed or Dirk if only for 2 pts.

Khalifa21
08-09-2011, 05:51 PM
out of the whole league for me:

1. Mamba 2. Melo 3. Wade 4. Rose

just my opinion

Your opinion's your opinion, but...

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:52 PM
Monta Ellis was pretty clutch. He had two very clutch shots in a row against Pacers and Kings to tie and win games.


he also makes clutch end of quarter shots like this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM9av21yydo.

lol, stick to the options guys

juno10
08-09-2011, 05:53 PM
Why are we choosing between these 3 players anyway? How about Ray Allen or Kobe or D-Wade or Dirk? Or even go down low to DH12? If I was to choose one player out of all the NBA players these 3 you listed would be below the 5 I listed and maybe even further. My choice would be Allen if it's a 3 pointer needed or Dirk if only for 2 pts.

why would anyone give to to dwight if you're in need of last second shot.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:54 PM
why would anyone give to to dwight if you're in need of last second shot.

i guess he wants to die,lol

Hustlenomics
08-09-2011, 05:55 PM
Durant on this list, the other two would have me killed

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:55 PM
isn't lebron a free mason he'd probably miss the shot on purpose if my life was on the line jk jk. but honestly id say durant since he can get his shot off over anyone and has more range on his shot.

freemasonry and illuminati are completely different, to be a free mason, you have to believe in a supreme being

illuminati's sell their souls to the devil

different

Assman22
08-09-2011, 05:55 PM
why would anyone give to to dwight if you're in need of last second shot.

Who's gonna stop him from dunking it with the game on the line, guy's a beast but would look better in a Bulls uni paired with D Rose baby woo!

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 05:57 PM
Who's gonna stop him from dunking it with the game on the line, guy's a beast but would look better in a Bulls uni paired with D Rose baby woo!

the grim reaper is an excellent shot blocker ;)

coryd238
08-09-2011, 05:59 PM
People need to read the damn thread. It's about the superstars/ all-stars who aren't considered clutch. Not about the players who are the most clutch in the league :facepalm:


And I'd take Durant, just because he's the best shooter out of the three.

juno10
08-09-2011, 06:00 PM
Who's gonna stop him from dunking it with the game on the line, guy's a beast but would look better in a Bulls uni paired with D Rose baby woo!

there is 5 secs left just finding him in the post is gonna take some time and this is assuming the defense isn't denying the feed down low and than he would have to actually post but he obviously would not have enough time for that so hes screwed. only some sort of in bound lob pass would work but the defense would try to stop it.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 06:01 PM
People need to read the damn thread. It's about the superstars/ all-stars who aren't considered clutch. Not about the players who are the most clutch in the league :facepalm:


And I'd take Durant, just because he's the best shooter out of the three.

guess ur the only person in the thread who can read

kudos :clap:

naps
08-09-2011, 06:01 PM
LeBron.

Slimsim
08-09-2011, 06:03 PM
D rose > LBJ > durant

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 06:06 PM
exactly my thoughts... RZZZA, transvestite Jenna and the rest of Rose's pajama party fan club need to get real... Rose is a volume scorer and he is overrated. There are only a handful of guys i would trust in such a situation:

Ray Allen
Carmelo Anthony
Kobe Bryant
Dwane Wade

In that order...

we can always count on you to jump on the Rose hater train too.

I'm just answering the threads question, who would I choose. I choose Rose. I've watched Rose far more than those other two so I'd be more comfortable trusting him in a last second shot situation. Durant, I have no idea, I've watched him very little. And Lebron, he had some terrible statistic last season, wasnt he something like 1-16 in last second shots or something like that? Can't trust him.

And you don't even know what you're talking about when it comes to Rose, a few days ago you called him inefficient. Did you even look at his stats before you said that? His efficiency is above average, so let him be a volume scorer if he scores at an above average efficiency.

jeez. some people.

Chill_Will_24
08-09-2011, 06:10 PM
we can always count on you to jump on the Rose hater train too.

I'm just answering the threads question, who would I choose. I choose Rose. I've watched Rose far more than those other two so I'd be more comfortable trusting him in a last second shot situation. Durant, I have no idea, I've watched him very little. And Lebron, he had some terrible statistic last season, wasnt he something like 1-16 in last second shots or something like that? Can't trust him.

And you don't even know what you're talking about when it comes to Rose, a few days ago you called him inefficient. Did you even look at his stats before you said that? His efficiency is above average, so let him be a volume scorer if he scores at an above average efficiency.

jeez. some people.

Dude.. just admit it.. you want his penis...

RZZZA says:

:cry: :cry: :cry: Oh my god! People are such Rose hateeers!!! :cry: :cry: :cry:

Oh my! is that a Rose nude shot? :drool: :drool: :drool:

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 06:11 PM
Dude.. just admit it.. you want his penis...

RZZZA says:

:cry: :cry: :cry: Oh my god! People are such Rose hateeers!!! :cry: :cry: :cry:

Oh my! is that a Rose nude shot? :drool: :drool: :drool:

so do i ;)

SteBO
08-09-2011, 06:13 PM
It's tough between LBJ and Durant, but I'll go with LBJ.

McJoe
08-09-2011, 06:15 PM
I'd pick Kevin Durant because at 6'10" he can get his shot off over almost anyone who can keep up with him on defence. Lebron and Rose aren't bad options but given the circumstances given I'd take Durant.

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 06:17 PM
Dude.. just admit it.. you want his penis...

RZZZA says:

:cry: :cry: :cry: Oh my god! People are such Rose hateeers!!! :cry: :cry: :cry:

Oh my! is that a Rose nude shot? :drool: :drool: :drool:

thats real intelligent conversation, you aren't even worth my time.

Chill_Will_24
08-09-2011, 06:23 PM
thats real intelligent conversation, you aren't even worth my time.

Its tough to have an "intelligent" conversation with a guy who throws the word "hater" around so often. Its always your cop out. You get beat in an argument so you just whine like a little girl and call people "Rose haters" thereby ending the argument without proving anything. Rose is overrated. Its that simple kid.

T-Girl Jenna
08-09-2011, 06:25 PM
Its tough to have an "intelligent" conversation with a guy who throws the word "hater" around so often. Its always your cop out. You get beat in an argument so you just whine like a little girl and call people "Rose haters" thereby ending the argument without proving anything. Rose is overrated. Its that simple kid.

i think carmelo, lebron, howard, westbrook are overated

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 06:25 PM
ok but that's not even a debate that's possible to have, I cant argue with you about whether or not Rose is overrated, its just an opinion. I CAN however argue with you about his efficiency, because I can objectively prove that point.

I call a spade a spade, if somebody has a legit point to make about Rose and criticizes him intelligently, I give that person credence. If its someone like you or itsripcity or justinnum saying stupid things, I can tell you're just haters.

airronijordan
08-09-2011, 06:32 PM
This was easy, Durant!

Nyc4You
08-09-2011, 06:33 PM
jbltlhklkj;k;llh

LAKERMANIA
08-09-2011, 06:35 PM
Kobe.. but out of these guys I'd pick Durant, then Rose

NYMetros
08-09-2011, 06:50 PM
Rose
Durant
LeBron

ecorrea
08-09-2011, 06:50 PM
i didnt want to, but i barely chose durant over rose because of his size and ability to shoot over people. next season he will be even better when he finds his spots.

what hes missing tho is roses ability to create whenever and wherever. if rose can add that silky jumpshot late in games, he is neck n neck with durant.

lebron was just awful in the clutch game winning/losing shots this past season. he has to do some work before he gets my vote.

Lil Rhody
08-09-2011, 06:59 PM
uhhhhhhhh RAY FREAKIN ALLEN

MackSnackWrap
08-09-2011, 06:59 PM
Lbj

heyman321
08-09-2011, 07:04 PM
I'd say Lebron quite easily if he started to drive like he used to and not take jumpers for last second shots. Remember all those series vs Washington a couple years back? The Cavs would always be down 1 or 2 and he would drive and barrel his way through and somehow put it in. These days he only takes jumpers.

netsgiantsyanks
08-09-2011, 07:11 PM
durant

LionsFan..LOL
08-09-2011, 07:11 PM
My life on the line, I'll take Durant

nyfinest4life
08-09-2011, 07:18 PM
out of lebron, rose, n durant, i would definitely choose durant. rose has no jumpshot, n either does lebron. if there's 1 player in the nba i want to shoot the ball down 1 with 5 seconds to go its absolutely carmelo. no doubt about it. melo= unstoppable n clutch

Ciruam
08-09-2011, 07:23 PM
Out of those Guys Rose.. Out of the league Melo..

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 07:24 PM
out of lebron, rose, n durant, i would definitely choose durant. rose has no jumpshot, n either does lebron. if there's 1 player in the nba i want to shoot the ball down 1 with 5 seconds to go its absolutely carmelo. no doubt about it. melo= unstoppable n clutch


Rose and Lebron have a jumpshot, come on people. You gotta at least watch these guys play before you should be able to comment.

Lebron is good from 3-9 feet and from 16-23 feet. He doesnt shoot that much from 10-15 feet but he has a decent FG% from there as well.

Rose has a very good mid range game too

Geargo Wallace
08-09-2011, 07:27 PM
Rodman.

Knicks21
08-09-2011, 07:31 PM
Down by 1 Lebron, Down by 2 Durant.

SteBO
08-09-2011, 07:32 PM
Rose and Lebron have a jumpshot, come on people. You gotta at least watch these guys play before you should be able to comment.

Lebron is good from 3-9 feet and from 16-23 feet. He doesnt shoot that much from 10-15 feet but he has a decent FG% from there as well.

Rose has a very good mid range game too
This. BTW, last year LeBron finished 2nd in mid range jump shooting, %ge wise I think, only behind Dirk and Rose has improved greatly on that end as well. They may not be great from mid range, but you don't want to leave them too wide open. They can and most likely will kill you.

PHX2daDEATH
08-09-2011, 07:33 PM
Lebron, and only if Hakeem is teaching him the dream shake..

MVP20
08-09-2011, 07:40 PM
Ima take Durant, Rose and Lebron are to inconsistant of shooters and without looking up stats, i believe Durant has more game winners of the 3. If im wrong then im wrong, but ill still take Durant.

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 07:41 PM
This. BTW, last year LeBron finished 2nd in mid range jump shooting, %ge wise I think, only behind Dirk and Rose has improved greatly on that end as well. They may not be great from mid range, but you don't want to leave them too wide open. They can and most likely will kill you.

and for all the hype Melo gets as this awesome shooter, he's awful from some spots on the floor.

from 3-9 feet, Rose is better. from 10-15 feet, Rose is better.

Funny how perception doesn't match with reality that often

albertc86
08-09-2011, 07:42 PM
It would depend on who's guarding them. I wouldn't pick Rose because he's undersized in comparison to LeBron and Durant. He would have a difficult time getting the shot off against the opposing team's best defender provided that the defender is a SG or SF.

I'd take Durant.

raiderNlakerfan
08-09-2011, 07:42 PM
Kobe

SteBO
08-09-2011, 07:47 PM
and for all the hype Melo gets as this awesome shooter, he's awful from some spots on the floor.

from 3-9 feet, Rose is better. from 10-15 feet, Rose is better.

Funny how perception doesn't match with reality that often
Melo was pretty efficient after the trade to NY, but when discussing him based on his entire body of work, he's pretty inefficient for a guy of his skill and strength. Hell, Luol Deng is a more efficient offensive player than 'Melo. Look, LeBron isn't a great mid range shooter, but he's pretty good and the stats show it. Rose is the same way.

People then go to say that it's a product of playing alot of minutes next to Rose, but that's false. I've seen Luol put up similar numbers in Chicago before Rose was even drafted. With Rose coming into his own and developing the jump shot, it's allowed Deng to get even better looks.

jason6692
08-09-2011, 07:53 PM
i would of said none of them but since they were the only 3 choices i would have to say durant. i can't trust rose or lebron's shooting ability when the clock is winding down

marj987
08-09-2011, 07:54 PM
I swear to GOOODDDDD I was gonna make a thread like this, but I didn't think it was gonna be worthy....AND DID YOU NOT WATCH THE FINALS!?!? Where the hell is DIRK?!?!

SteBO
08-09-2011, 08:01 PM
I swear to GOOODDDDD I was gonna make a thread like this, but I didn't think it was gonna be worthy....AND DID YOU NOT WATCH THE FINALS!?!? Where the hell is DIRK?!?!
The thread is about three guys who aren't known for being clutch down the stretch of games. Out of those three, who would you choose? That's the point of this thread. Not trying to sound snarky, just explaining what the point of this thread really is.

avrpatsfan
08-09-2011, 08:03 PM
Durant easily.

Gators123
08-09-2011, 08:07 PM
1. Durant

2. LeBron


3. Rose

coryd238
08-09-2011, 08:17 PM
and for all the hype Melo gets as this awesome shooter, he's awful from some spots on the floor.

from 3-9 feet, Rose is better. from 10-15 feet, Rose is better.

Funny how perception doesn't match with reality that often

Lol, stats.

People guard Melo for his jumper. People guard Lebron for his driving. Learn Basketball please.

And everyone knows Melo has questionable shot selection.

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 08:19 PM
did you just say "lol, stats" and then "learn basketball please"?

I'm wary about continuing this conversation with you after saying something like that.

You know what type of people discount stats? the type that don't understand stats, how to read them, what they mean or how to apply them to an argument.

Hawkeye15
08-09-2011, 08:24 PM
Out of these guys, LeBron... Out of the whole league, Melo.

100% accurate answer

BrooklynNets15
08-09-2011, 08:28 PM
No doubt, I'm guna have to go with the best scorer in the league in Durant.

I know this is between those three players, but other people were throwing out more obvious names like Kobe, Allen, Dirk, Melo. Just surprised I didn't see these three names: Chris Paul, Pierce, Brandon Roy (injury-plagued, but still clutch).

coryd238
08-09-2011, 08:45 PM
did you just say "lol, stats" and then "learn basketball please"?

I'm wary about continuing this conversation with you after saying something like that.

You know what type of people discount stats? the type that don't understand stats, how to read them, what they mean or how to apply them to an argument.

Obviously you don't know how to read stats. Your first post was laughable.

ragee
08-09-2011, 08:46 PM
Melo or Dirk... Out of those guys, I would have to say Durant...

$GangGr33n$
08-09-2011, 08:56 PM
none i would pick melo or kobe

Bravo95
08-09-2011, 09:00 PM
Out of those names: Durant.

But overall: Bryant, Nowitzki or Anthony.

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 09:02 PM
Obviously you don't know how to read stats. Your first post was laughable.

you're not really saying anything here at all, I can do the same exact thing you're doing.

You first post was laughable, obviously you don't know anything. See? Now I sound like you.

if you have some kind of statistical argument to make, some sort of legitimate point to make, some sort of substantive argument to present...by all means present it.

coryd238
08-09-2011, 09:07 PM
you're not really saying anything here at all, I can do the same exact thing you're doing.

You first post was laughable, obviously you don't know anything. See? Now I sound like you.

if you have some kind of statistical argument to make, some sort of legitimate point to make, some sort of substantive argument to present...by all means present it.

I already stated that those numbers are skewed based on how people guard Melo, Lebron, and Rose.

Maybe you need reading comprehension...

RZZZA
08-09-2011, 09:11 PM
ahh I see, so you're saying people guard Melo's jumpshot, which explains why he's worse from 3-15 feet than Rose, but then he gets out to 16-23 feet and suddenly they don't guard his jump shot as much which explains why he's so much better than Rose from longer distances?

You also said people guard Lebron when he drives but not when he's shooting jumpers, but they must not be doing a very good job of it, because Lebrons at rim percentage is only slightly lower than Dwight Howards. And he doesn't shoot lower than 45% from any where on the floor.

justOmazing
08-09-2011, 09:26 PM
DRose. He was only a rookie last year and look what he accomplished. He took the Bulls farther than MJ did his first year.

knightstemplar
08-09-2011, 09:46 PM
Lebron, hes actually done it before

effen5
08-09-2011, 09:49 PM
Rose then Durant

Out of the whole league....Kobe


Lebrons overrated.

Gators123
08-09-2011, 09:54 PM
DRose. He was only a rookie last year and look what he accomplished. He took the Bulls farther than MJ did his first year.

lolwut?

six
08-09-2011, 10:16 PM
Rose is actually very clutch. He wasn't so clutch during the Miami series, but if you watched him during the regular season you would agree that he saved the Bulls many times during close games with less then a minute left.

chicago lulz
08-09-2011, 10:24 PM
Lebron, hes actually done it before

I'm fairly certain they've all done it before...

DR_1
08-09-2011, 11:14 PM
Rose then Durant

Out of the whole league....Kobe


Lebrons overrated.

Agree with this.

sofa_king_great
08-09-2011, 11:29 PM
In this list I chose Durant, even though I'm a Rose fan. Rose just misses too many damn clutch free throws, and LeBron just... chokes. :D

In the entire NBA though my list is:

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Carmelo Anthony
3. Dirk Nowitzki
4. Paul Pierce (even though I hate him because I'm a Bulls and Lakers fan)
5. Ray Allen/Dwyane Wade

sofa_king_great
08-09-2011, 11:32 PM
DRose. He was only a rookie last year and look what he accomplished. He took the Bulls farther than MJ did his first year.

:confused: ways

Punkindrublic03
08-09-2011, 11:53 PM
Patrick Chewing

jrm2054
08-09-2011, 11:54 PM
None i want Melo then Kobe then Wade over all those guys last second

Skins4Life
08-10-2011, 12:03 AM
Kobe...

On a side note if it was a few years ago I would pick Gilbert Arenas(pre-injury, of course) over anyone one in the league.

psperry34116
08-10-2011, 12:21 AM
Dirk?

nickdymez
08-10-2011, 12:26 AM
Who would i take out of this list? Durant by far.. Best shooter on the list...

In the league?

1. Kobe 2. Dirk 3. Melo 4. Wade 5. Ray Allen 6. Paul pierce

juno10
08-10-2011, 12:29 AM
Who would i take out of this list? Durant by far.. Best shooter on the list...

In the league?

1. Kobe 2. Dirk 3. Melo 4. Wade 5. Ray Allen 6. Paul pierce

good list but im still a bit iffy about melo, he's clutch no doubt but he takes low percentage shots and usually makes them during meaningless regular season games. was never really a clutch playoff performer

smith&wesson
08-10-2011, 12:36 AM
dirk
kobe
wade
durant
melo

knightstemplar
08-10-2011, 12:39 AM
I'm fairly certain they've all done it before...

rose and durant maybe like 3 times combined
lebron done it atleast that much times in the playoffs, in that situation

Bluerapoileagle
08-10-2011, 12:39 AM
I chose Durant simply because he was the best shooter out of the three.

gwrighter
08-10-2011, 12:52 AM
robert horry

Raph12
08-10-2011, 12:58 AM
Of these three, Lebron easily... Out of the whole league, Melo easily.

AIMelo=KillaDUO
08-10-2011, 01:00 AM
None of the options you gave us would even be in my top three. But of the three: I'd take LeBron... I know he isn't very clutch. But, honestly, I would just tell him to drive to the basket. Hope for a foul. I like my chances with LeBron goin strong to the cup.

Jewelz0376
08-10-2011, 03:07 AM
Who would i take out of this list? Durant by far.. Best shooter on the list...

In the league?

1. Kobe 2. Dirk 3. Melo 4. Wade 5. Ray Allen 6. Paul pierce

good list right there

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 03:12 AM
How does the op come up with these stupid poll options? Thats the real question, here.

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 03:18 AM
For me its Paul Pierce or 'Melo. I've seen those two hit a ridiculous amount of game winners. I'm sure most people who aren't saying "Kobe" would agree.

Wade gets an honorable mention from me as well.

John Walls Era
08-10-2011, 03:30 AM
Probably Wade.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:48 AM
If people are hating on Lebron because of his bad finals, the last person any of you should want near the ball in the fourth quarter is Derrick "I just try and hit floaters or three pointers out of my range" Rose

Yanks All Day
08-10-2011, 04:23 AM
JJ Redick. And its not even close.

PHXfanCRO
08-10-2011, 06:50 AM
Durant

sventhedog
08-10-2011, 07:24 AM
lebron? that's like suicide.

Knicks21
08-10-2011, 07:32 AM
None of the options you gave us would even be in my top three. But of the three: I'd take LeBron... I know he isn't very clutch. But, honestly, I would just tell him to drive to the basket. Hope for a foul. I like my chances with LeBron goin strong to the cup.

This.

Knicks21
08-10-2011, 07:34 AM
Still not getting the whole Kobe number One thing. There are stats available, and kobe is way down the list in terms of percentage.

wjmoffatt
08-10-2011, 07:52 AM
Wouldn't choose any of them as my #1 option on their teams. Heat-Wade, Bulls-Korver or Deng, Thunder-Westbrook.

NBA-GMaster
08-10-2011, 07:57 AM
1. Kobe 2. Wade 3. Nowitzki but among these players "LeBron"

Evolution23
08-10-2011, 08:08 AM
With my life on the line? I guess I'm a dead man then lol.

synister281
08-10-2011, 08:59 AM
I'd go with Durant.

Rose still has to prove his ability in that situation, and Lebron would scare me when he has that chance.

ackar
08-10-2011, 09:14 AM
Rose he was easily the most successful of the three last year, when taking the last second shot.

mjm07
08-10-2011, 09:38 AM
From the options,

Lebron

The whole NBA

Dirk

Of All Time:

Jordan closely followed by Bird.

good day.

Da Knicks
08-10-2011, 09:57 AM
Life on the line, hmm i guess i should be get ready to die with the guys listed but ill play i will go with Durant. If he can shake his defender off he would have the best chance to get it in. Melo would be my choice if my life was on the line...

theheatles
08-10-2011, 10:32 AM
LeBron

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 11:15 AM
If people are hating on Lebron because of his bad finals, the last person any of you should want near the ball in the fourth quarter is Derrick "I just try and hit floaters or three pointers out of my range" Rose

not just because of the finals, Lebron had a terrible stat in the final seconds of a game last season when it came to final shots. The entire Heat team did, don't you remember? There was this big controversy about who would take the final shot, everybody kept missing them.

Derrick was good with the final shot most of the season, there was no controversy. Everybody knew Derrick was getting the ball with the game on the line.

sixer04fan
08-10-2011, 11:27 AM
Durant and its not even close

Hustlenomics
08-10-2011, 11:28 AM
If people are hating on Lebron because of his bad finals, the last person any of you should want near the ball in the fourth quarter is Derrick "I just try and hit floaters or three pointers out of my range" Rose

exactly

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 11:32 AM
Derrick doesn't just take the final shot himself, he also likes to drive and kick to the open man. That's how we beat the Heat in one game and the Pacers in one game.

drive and kick to Luol at the corner, 3, bam. Drive and kick to Korver, 3, bam.

see, he's not selfish. If he has a good shooter open he'll give him the ball.

rhymeratic
08-10-2011, 11:53 AM
I thought MJ would have been an option.... :)

Anyways, I like Lebron in this scenario. D-Rose doesn't have that outside shot as a true threat...

Durant gets pushed around physically at times... well not as much of late but my biggest thing with him is he falls in love with his range and may take a more difficult shot than neccessary...

Lebron is a headcase BUT generally speaking he's more likely to get to the line etc and nobody defensively can truly contain him.

MTar786
08-10-2011, 12:26 PM
hell no, not rose with that terrible shooting %

i went with kd. he can draw a foul just as good as lebron and can shoot better than anyone else here. He's usually taller than the guy guarding him and will get his shot off. its just sad he loses all sense of where he is on te court when it comes to last second shots. I'll also take him because the one game i watched the thunder play last season he hit a buzzerbeating game winning 3. i cant remember who it was against

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 12:31 PM
D-Rose doesn't have that outside shot as a true threat...

What do you consider a true threat to be? Rose hit's that outside shot at about 40%, that's pretty damn good. That's not the only option as a final shot you know, Drose can take a closer shot. Drose is one of the best penetraters in the league, he can drive to the rim.



hell no, not rose with that terrible shooting %

what terrible shooting %?

D-Leethal
08-10-2011, 12:41 PM
You need mid range guys for last second shots. Guys like Rose and Lebron are '3s or triple teamed shots at the rim' type scorers, especially in final seconds with no time to pass. Melo, Kobe, Dirk, and Durant should be the only options.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 12:47 PM
the OP didn't make guys like Melo or Kobe or Dirk an option for a reason.

Lebron and Rose are good mid range shooters, both of them are like 45% shooters from mid range. It's not like they're 25% or 30% shooters, 45% is good.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 12:48 PM
the really interesting stat to look at is %assisted. Kevin Durant is assisted on his shots waaaay more than Lebron or Rose are.

this means Lebron and Rose have the ball in their hands and are creating these shots for themselves, presumably being the focal points of team defenses too

trini_knickfan
08-10-2011, 12:56 PM
out of these 3: Rose

LeBron shouldn't be on the list since he hasn't proved yet to be a last second go to guy

naps
08-10-2011, 01:17 PM
Rose doesn't stand a chance with the other two. LeBron is my pick here. I would never trust someone with a jump shot when my life is on the line, I know LeBron can will his way to the basket if needed to.

Punkindrublic03
08-10-2011, 01:24 PM
Derek Jeter

NYMetros
08-10-2011, 01:31 PM
In all the NBA my list would be
1. Kobe
2. Carmelo
3. Dirk
4. Rose
5. Ray Allen
6. Paul Pierce
7. Durant

Il Mago50
08-10-2011, 01:47 PM
1. Dylan
2. Dylan
3. Dylan
4. Dylan and Dylan

Cuz he spits hot fire

In reality:

1. Kobe
2. Melo
3. Gay
4. Wade
5. Rose

Il Mago50
08-10-2011, 01:50 PM
Also, why the **** is Lebron an option at all, he's notoriously bad in this scenario and you put him against two guys that have hit a fair bit of clutch late game shots (excuse Rose in Miami series).

Kobe should be an option.

Wade should be an option.

Melo should be an option.

Not hating on Lebron at all but he doesn't deserve to be in these talks with how putrid he's been in these clutch situations basically his whole career

juno10
08-10-2011, 02:04 PM
Also, why the **** is Lebron an option at all, he's notoriously bad in this scenario and you put him against two guys that have hit a fair bit of clutch late game shots (excuse Rose in Miami series).

Kobe should be an option.

Wade should be an option.

Melo should be an option.

Not hating on Lebron at all but he doesn't deserve to be in these talks with how putrid he's been in these clutch situations basically his whole career

the point of the thread was to put up three players that aren't extremely clutch. and lebron has been more clutch in bigger games and hit more game winners than both rose and durant combined.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:09 PM
People seem to forget what Lebron did in Cleveland. It's pathetic.

And all the Rose crotch riding is obnoxious. He's terrible in the fourth quarter. Drive-and-dish isn't taking the last shot. He hasn't shown the ability to do it.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:13 PM
the point of the thread was to put up three players that aren't extremely clutch. and lebron has been more clutch in bigger games and hit more game winners than both rose and durant combined.

Oh precisely. Spot on. NBA fans have the worst short-term memory of all-time. Yes Lebron disappeared in the finals, the biggest of the big games, but that doesn't mean he isn't clutch. It just means the pressure of his summer, the uncertainty of the role he should play on an All-Star team, and the hate got to him. I can't imagine it must be easy. But it's not unheard of, that when the world is rooting against you, you fail.

Before those Finals Lebron single handedly beasted the Heat to the finals. Remember? With the Cavs he was the only fourth quarter option and he took them to the playoffs nearly every season and deep into the playoffs, winning over 50+ games on multiple occasions. You think he did that not being clutch?

AIRMAR72
08-10-2011, 02:19 PM
DURANT is soft and WEAK and cracks under pressure my picks would be brandon roy, paul pierce, dirk nowitski,curry, zack randolph, chris paul ,steve nash ,chris (gay) bosh, pau gasol, wade, deng, bron and tobe i meant kobe

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:25 PM
People seem to forget what Lebron did in Cleveland. It's pathetic.

And all the Rose crotch riding is obnoxious. He's terrible in the fourth quarter. Drive-and-dish isn't taking the last shot. He hasn't shown the ability to do it.

Rose is terrible in the fourth quarter? Which Rose are you talking about? Pete Rose? Axl Rose?

Driving and dishing should count because he's a point guard

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:32 PM
Rose is terrible in the fourth quarter? Which Rose are you talking about? Pete Rose? Axl Rose?

Driving and dishing should count because he's a point guard

Read the thread title. 5 seconds left in the game, down 1, who would you have taking the shot for you. NOT who would you want passing it off to a jump shooter.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:34 PM
the playing field has to be level for something like this, Rose and Lebron are primary ball handlers in such a scenario and Kevin Durant is not. Defenses treat these guys differently as a result.

If they're open all these guys are capable of nailing a last second shot

pd1dish
08-10-2011, 02:34 PM
Lebron would most like pull up for a jumpshot even though he is unstoppable going to the basket.

Rose would also likely pull up for a jumpshot (he did it multiple times in late game situations simply because i think he is dead out there by the end of the game) and i dont think he ever gets the cheap foul call like Wade or Lebron do.

Durant while being a dominant scorer would also probably take a jumpshot. of the 3, id say Durant has the best chance of making the last second shot.

OP needed to add another option in the poll for "other" because Kobe is super clutch and Melo can make a shot anywhere on the floor.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:38 PM
The Bron hate and the Rose love doesn't connect in my head. I'm not a Heat fan or a Bulls fan btw. I just don't understand why in the world people can rag on Lebron for being "bad" in the finals and people can praise Rose despite getting owned in the ECF.

Do people forget that Lebron did what Rose did multiple times and at a higher level in Cleveland? If Rose gets his own super team and still fails, do people rag on him too? I don't get it.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:40 PM
The Bron hate and the Rose love doesn't connect in my head. I'm not a Heat fan or a Bulls fan btw. I just don't understand why in the world people can rag on Lebron for being "bad" in the finals and people can praise Rose despite getting owned in the ECF.

Do people forget that Lebron did what Rose did multiple times and at a higher level in Cleveland? If Rose gets his own super team and still fails, do people rag on him too? I don't get it.

I can only speak for myself but I have to hate lebron because his success comes at the expense of my team. So I can't root for him to succeed, i have to root for him to fail.

Remember though that Lebron is hyped as the greatest player since Michael Jordan, Rose is still seen as a 3rd year youngin', Lebron is expected to be great. Rose surprised everybody.

but on this forum I'd say the Rose hate and Lebron hate is pretty even these days

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:43 PM
I can only speak for myself but I have to hate lebron because his success comes at the expense of my team. So I can't root for him to succeed, i have to root for him to fail.

Why? Because he spurned the Bulls and decided to play with his friends in Miami? Because he exercised his right to become a Free Agent, gave up individual accolades and statistical goals that would have made him a legend beyond what he will be, to win a ring? You hate him because he didn't pick you. Wah. Cry more. Cry. Someone call him a Wambulance.


Remember though that Lebron is hyped as the greatest player since Michael Jordan, Rose is still seen as a 3rd year youngin', Lebron is expected to be great. Rose surprised everybody.


And he is. Or are you one of those fans whose hate blinds them from his game? Do you know how old Jordan was when he won his first NBA title? Do you know how old Jordan was before he was even competitive? Lebron is ahead of Jordan's pace. I don't think people realize that.


but on this forum I'd say the Rose hate and Lebron hate is pretty even these days


Not even close. On this forum Rose is lauded as a top 5 player when he isn't even top 5 at his position. On this forum people take every chance they can to bash Lebron for one bad series despite his accomplishments so far. Rose had one good year that wouldn't hold a candle to Lebron's worst year.

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 02:43 PM
the OP didn't make guys like Melo or Kobe or Dirk an option for a reason.

Lebron and Rose are good mid range shooters, both of them are like 45% shooters from mid range. It's not like they're 25% or 30% shooters, 45% is good.

Would you like me to show you 'Melo's mid-range or clutch stats? And also, are you saying Dirk isn't a good mid-range shooter?

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:46 PM
Why? Because he spurned the Bulls and decided to play with his friends in Miami? Because he exercised his right to become a Free Agent, gave up individual accolades and statistical goals that would have made him a legend beyond what he will be, to win a ring? You hate him because he didn't pick you. Wah. Cry more. Cry. Someone call him a Wambulance.

woah, relax. I don't hate Lebron for any of that, I hate him because his success would mean failure for my team. It would mean failure for your team too, you're a Knicks fan aren't you? Would you root for Lebron?You realize that if he wins, that means the Heat win, and the Knicks lose, right?




And he is. Or are you one of those fans whose hate blinds them from his game? Do you know how old Jordan was when he won his first NBA title? Do you know how old Jordan was before he was even competitive? Lebron is ahead of Jordan's pace. I don't think people realize that.

Well I hope Lebron never wins a championship. If Lebron wins, the Bulls lose. One can't happen without the other happening. Get it?





Not even close. On this forum Rose is lauded as a top 5 player when he isn't even top 5 at his position. On this forum people take every chance they can to bash Lebron for one bad series despite his accomplishments so far. Rose had one good year that wouldn't hold a candle to Lebron's worst year.

I've visited other NBA forums and this forum has way more Rose hate than other forums do. If you don't agree, then you don't agree, I can't do anything to change your mind I'm just telling you my opinion based on what I've seen.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:48 PM
Would you like me to show you 'Melo's mid-range or clutch stats? And also, are you saying Dirk isn't a good mid-range shooter?

Dirk is very good from everywhere on the floor, Melo can't say the same. Melo is good at the rim, he's poor from 3-15 feet, then he gets significantly better the further he gets away from the basket.

actually, strike that, poor isnt exactly the right word. Let's just say Melo is not as good from 3-15 feet as he is from other parts of the floor

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:52 PM
woah, relax. I don't hate Lebron for any of that, I hate him because his success would mean failure for my team. It would mean failure for your team too, you're a Knicks fan aren't you? Would you root for Lebron?You realize that if he wins, that means the Heat win, and the Knicks lose, right?


I don't think you score really well on the reading comprehension section of standardized tests. I am not a Knicks fan. It should be abundantly clear.

Furthermore, I don't hate Lebron James. If his team went up head to head against the team I rep in my signature, than I would want my team to defeat the Heat. I respect his talent, am awed by what he can do on the court, and will tell my grandkids about watching one of the greatest of all-time play his entire career.

Finally, you don't just hate him because his success means failure for the Bulls. Do you hate every other player in the East equally? D12? D-Will? Melo? I don't think so. So save the crap.


Well I hope Lebron never wins a championship. If Lebron wins, the Bulls lose. One can't happen without the other happening. Get it?


You don't get it do you. Your reading comprehension is really really poor. You didn't even answer the string of conversation we had going there. Lebron James is being lauded as the next Michael Jordan. No one will ever be Michael, but Lebron is pretty damn close and on the right path to becoming comparable to the GOAT. His biggest criticism, the rings, is a bs argument at this point because he is way ahead of Jordan in his development as a ballplayer and in his success in the playoffs. So the hate is hypocritical and unwarranted.


I've visited other NBA forums and this forum has way more Rose hate than other forums do. If you don't agree, then you don't agree, I can't do anything to change your mind I'm just telling you my opinion based on what I've seen.


Because Bulls fans here think Rose is a top 5 player when he isn't even top 5 at his position. He's a 2 guard playing out of position with mediocre point guard skills. He's a 2 guard that can't shoot the jumper. An undersized one at that. And yet, Bulls fans think he's the greatest thing ever because he's a Bulls player and he had one good season.

And he's more clutch than Lebron? You'd put the ball in his hands with 5 seconds left in a game over Lebron? You have brain cells?

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 02:53 PM
Dirk is very good from everywhere on the floor, Melo can't say the same. Melo is good at the rim, he's poor from 3-15 feet, then he gets significantly better the further he gets away from the basket.

You are extremely overcritical of Carmelo Anthony and yet would hand the ball to Derrick Rose who got shut down in the ECF and proved he has one move (driving to the basket and floating it) and if you take that away from him he becomes Brian Scalibrine with 10 inches off his frame. Wow you're awesome.


actually, strike that, poor isnt exactly the right word. Let's just say Melo is not as good from 3-15 feet as he is from other parts of the floor


And that's a bad thing?

LOOTERX9
08-10-2011, 02:57 PM
Melo is better at those shots than all 3. But if i had to choose i'd take Durant out of those 3.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 02:58 PM
Wah. Cry more. Cry. Someone call him a Wambulance.


I don't think you score really well on the reading comprehension section of standardized tests.


You have brain cells?


You don't get it do you. Your reading comprehension is really really poor.


Wow you're awesome.


I'm not talking to you any more, I don't like your attitude. This is whats an example of whats wrong with this forum, I'm having a calm, rational conversation with someone who refuses to be calm and is aggressive and insulting.

If you calm down and stop the condescending attitude and the insults, I'll be happy to continue conversing with you. I'm not wasting my time on somebody who is mean and unreasonable though.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:03 PM
I'm not talking to you any more, I don't like your attitude.

:cry:


This is whats an example of whats wrong with this forum

No, actually, you are an example of what's wrong with this forum. Homer fans who come into the NBA forum, purport an insane, ridiculous, and blasphemous agenda, and then cry or get all upset when they're asked to justify it and answer to their blasphemous claims. I learned a few things from you during this conversation:

(1) You're a hypocrite (bashing Melo/praising Rose despite Rose failing more)
(2) You're over-emotional (not being able to handle the tone of the discussion/being butt hurt that Lebron chose Miami)
(3) You either don't read and understand things or choose to run away from things you can't answer.


I'm having a calm, rational conversation with someone who refuses to be calm and is aggressive and insulting.


Look up the word rational. No part of your argument makes any logical or rational sense. I'm sorry if my dumbfoundedness comes off as insulting. I'm not insulting you. I'm just shocked by your inability to put two and two together and get four.


If you calm down and stop the condescending attitude and the insults, I'll be happy to continue conversing with you. I'm not wasting my time on somebody who is mean and unreasonable though.


You're insulting my intelligence.

LOOTERX9
08-10-2011, 03:05 PM
The Bron hate and the Rose love doesn't connect in my head. I'm not a Heat fan or a Bulls fan btw. I just don't understand why in the world people can rag on Lebron for being "bad" in the finals and people can praise Rose despite getting owned in the ECF.

Do people forget that Lebron did what Rose did multiple times and at a higher level in Cleveland? If Rose gets his own super team and still fails, do people rag on him too? I don't get it.


Because Rose atleast tried to play and score the basket. While lebron did not even take many shots and shyed away from the ball. It was a pathetic sight and an embarassment to his family and friends.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 03:06 PM
I'm not bashing Melo, all I said is that Rose is better from 3-15 feet. And Melo is better from 16-23 feet and from 3.

That's stating facts, not bashing. I haven;t been emotional at all in this thread, I'm just stating facts and refuting what some people say using factual arguments. I don't know what you're seeing here but you seem to be creating an image of me that you think is true, but it isn't. I'm not "butthurt" over Lebron joining the Heat over the Bulls, I don't even want him on the Bulls. If you pay attention I've been saying many things in this thread defending Lebron. When people say Lebron has no jumpshot, I correct them.

coryd238
08-10-2011, 03:08 PM
:cry:



No, actually, you are an example of what's wrong with this forum. Homer fans who come into the NBA forum, purport an insane, ridiculous, and blasphemous agenda, and then cry or get all upset when they're asked to justify it and answer to their blasphemous claims. I learned a few things from you during this conversation:

(1) You're a hypocrite (bashing Melo/praising Rose despite Rose failing more)
(2) You're over-emotional (not being able to handle the tone of the discussion/being butt hurt that Lebron chose Miami)
(3) You either don't read and understand things or choose to run away from things you can't answer.



Look up the word rational. No part of your argument makes any logical or rational sense. I'm sorry if my dumbfoundedness comes off as insulting. I'm not insulting you. I'm just shocked by your inability to put two and two together and get four.



You're insulting my intelligence.

So true, that's why I stopped talking to him. It's pointless.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 03:14 PM
Can we get some better people back in here to talk to. Steb0, Chronz? Somebody who doesn't flame or bait, someone who can carry on a civil discussion?

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:17 PM
Because Rose atleast tried to play and score the basket. While lebron did not even take many shots and shyed away from the ball. It was a pathetic sight and an embarassment to his family and friends.

LeBron did that for one series because the media (and probably his coach) was clamoring for Wade to take over the fourth quarter. Wow. Big deal.


I'm not bashing Melo, all I said is that Rose is better from 3-15 feet. And Melo is better from 16-23 feet and from 3.

Are you serious? Do you seriously believe that? Rose only shoots floaters from 3-15 feet. You can't make a floater from 10-15 feet consistently, ergo, Rose isn't good from 3-15 feet. Wow you're such a homer.


That's stating facts, not bashing.

You're guessing, stating your opinion, not stating facts. Show me stats or something that support your blasphemy.


I haven;t been emotional at all in this thread, I'm just stating facts and refuting what some people say using factual arguments. I don't know what you're seeing here but you seem to be creating an image of me that you think is true, but it isn't. I'm not "butthurt" over Lebron joining the Heat over the Bulls, I don't even want him on the Bulls. If you pay attention I've been saying many things in this thread defending Lebron. When people say Lebron has no jumpshot, I correct them.


You hate Lebron James because his success means your teams failure. Yet, you don't hate other superstars in the ECF as much as Lebron. Why? No answer.

You aren't stating facts.

Gah you're a homer.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:18 PM
Can we get some better people back in here to talk to. Steb0, Chronz? Somebody who doesn't flame or bait, someone who can carry on a civil discussion?

Just go to the Bulls forum and recruit people who will make up facts about Derrick Rose.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 03:19 PM
How can I talk to you Melky, you're not asking me to explain things or to state my argument or opinion, you're just ridiculing what I say and then insulting me. You can't carry on a conversation with a person like that.

I can explain everything you just asked if you would let me.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 03:26 PM
Do you want me to clarify my argument or do you want to cuss me out, have me shut up and go away? I can't tell. I'm not going to take time explaining if you won't listen, what would be the point of that.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:32 PM
How can I talk to you Melky, you're not asking me to explain things or to state my argument or opinion, you're just ridiculing what I say and then insulting me.

I don't think you're very good at reading comprehension at all. I'm not insulting you, I'm just stating an opinion backed up by a mountain of evidence that is your inability to grasp what I (and others) have posted in this thread. If you are having a hard time understanding (or if you feel as if you're misinterpreting things) don't hesitate to ask for clarification. I am not insulting you.

I am, though, ridiculing what you're saying. It doesn't make any sense.


You can't carry on a conversation with a person like that. I can explain everything you just asked if you would let me.

(1) Explain how Rose is a better option than Lebron James or Carmelo Anthony in the fourth quarter
(2) Clarify your position on why you hate Lebron James. If it's because his success causes your team to fail, then clarify your position on your equal hatred for other stars in the East (Melo/D-Will)
(3) Cite statistics that show that Rose is a better shooter from 3-15 feet than Carmelo Anthony


Do you want me to clarify my argument or do you want to cuss me out, have me shut up and go away? I can't tell. I'm not going to take time explaining if you won't listen, what would be the point of that.

Again, you really struggle with that reading comprehension thing. I never cussed you out, told you to shut up, or told you to go away.

ackar
08-10-2011, 03:33 PM
In all the NBA my list would be
1. Kobe
2. Carmelo
3. Dirk
4. Rose
5. Ray Allen
6. Paul Pierce
7. Durant
Pretty good list and it is quite balance.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 03:36 PM
Pretty good list and it is quite balance.

If I showed you stats that wouldn't have Derrick Rose in the top 8 would you change your stance on that? Or would you cling to Lebron's NBA finals flop and Rose's one good season and refuse to listen? I'd like to know before I waste my time.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 03:54 PM
Again, you really struggle with that reading comprehension thing. I never cussed you out, told you to shut up, or told you to go away.

"Just go to the Bulls forum and recruit people who will make up facts about Derrick Rose. "

^ told me to go away

"Gah you're a homer. "

^ insulting me

"Wow you're such a homer. "

^ insulting me again

"You have brain cells?"

^ insult

"Wah. Cry more. Cry. Someone call him a Wambulance."

etc, etc. now on to your actual questions. Most of what you've said in the past 2 pages was just useless nonsense, let's get to the meat of your questions now.


(1) Explain how Rose is a better option than Lebron James or Carmelo Anthony in the fourth quarter
(2) Clarify your position on why you hate Lebron James. If it's because his success causes your team to fail, then clarify your position on your equal hatred for other stars in the East (Melo/D-Will)
(3) Cite statistics that show that Rose is a better shooter from 3-15 feet than Carmelo Anthony

1) I can't prove that Rose is a better option than Carmelo Anthony or Lebron James in the 4th quarter, I haven't been trying to prove that anywhere in this thread since there are so many variables involved in proving something like that and I don't have all the necessary facts and figures to do so. What I have been trying to prove/disprove is people here and there saying that Lebron or Rose are not good shooters. Using statistics it's fairly easy to point out the FG% of these different players and what they shoot from different parts of the floor. More on this later.

2) Like I said earlier, I have to root for Lebron to fail because his success comes at the expense of my team. I wouldn't call it "hate" exactly but it's certainly not love either. I feel the same exact way about Wade and the rest of the Miami Heat. They are a imminent threat to my Chicago Bulls. The reason I don't feel the same way about the Melo and the Knicks or Deron and the Nets is because they are not a threat to my Bulls as it stands right now. I don't hate them because I don't see them as an obstacle.

3) Now comes the real proof. You keep accusing me of being a homer but said something ridiculous which I will quote now:
"Are you serious? Do you seriously believe that? Rose only shoots floaters from 3-15 feet. You can't make a floater from 10-15 feet consistently, ergo, Rose isn't good from 3-15 feet. Wow you're such a homer. "

I've never seen a worse way of judging whether somebody is a poor shooter or not than that. You're not using any kind of factual argument here, you're using subjective opinion and frankly it's worth about as much as a pile of doo doo is.

Using statistics which are readily available for everybody to see at hoopdata, we can see that Derrick Rose averages a 48% FG% from 3-9 feet for his career. Carmelo Anthony averages a 38% FG% from 3-9 feet for his career.

From 10-15 feet, Derrick Rose averages a 43% FG% for his career. Carmelo Anthony averages 35%

these numbers are all available here: http://hoopdata.com/

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:10 PM
^ this is what I mean when I say most of what you've posted is useless nonsense. Now, I've clarified my position on several of the things you've asked, and I've used statistics to prove my point. Consider yourself pwnd, and please refrain from spamming this thread up with any more of your garbage.

If you want to have an actual debate, let's do it. If you want to insult, bait, flame and spam nonsense then the mods will come and they will infract you for it

CowboysKB24
08-10-2011, 04:15 PM
Kobe

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 04:15 PM
^ this is what I mean when I say most of what you've posted is useless nonsense. Now, I've clarified my position on several of the things you've asked, and I've used statistics to prove my point. Consider yourself pwnd, and please refrain from spamming this thread up with any more of your garbage.

If you want to have an actual debate, let's do it. If you want to insult, bait, flame and spam nonsense then the mods will come and they will infract you for it

:facepalm: I can see why no one talks to you now.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:19 PM
No. What you've been doing here is trying to prove that Derrick Rose is a good shooter, which he isn't.

define good. Derrick has a very decent mid range game, as is reflected in his FG%




I call BS

who cares




Where can you see his career FG% from 3-9 feet?

It's simple math, take his Fg% from every year, add it up, and divide by the number of years

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 04:21 PM
define good. Derrick has a very decent mid range game, as is reflected in his FG%


So now you go from good to decent? I can show you why he's not even decent if you want me to embarrass you. Because HoopData wasn't too kind to D-Rose in 2011.


It's simple math, take his Fg% from every year, add it up, and divide by the number of years


Are you serious? Can someone explain to him how this drastically skews the true FG% of a player throughout the career...please.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:27 PM
So now you go from good to decent? I can show you why he's not even decent if you want me to embarrass you. Because HoopData wasn't too kind to D-Rose in 2011.




Are you serious? Can someone explain to him how this drastically skews the true FG% of a player throughout the career...please.

good and decent are synonyms. 2011 is one year, I took the career averages because it's the most fair way to do it. One year is not enough time to judge, players can have a hot year or a cold year, and Carmelo played for 2 different teams in 2011 so yeah...its not really fair to judge that way.

even if we do it your way and take only the stats from the year 2011, Derrick Rose still has a better FG% than Carmelo from 3-15 feet.

NYman15
08-10-2011, 04:30 PM
Out of everyone, I go with Melo or Kobe, but for this list I go with Durant mainly because he is the best shooter of the bunch.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 04:33 PM
good and decent are synonyms.

No, not in the way you are using the word at least. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/good). You're using definition 8 of good and decent is not a synonym of that definition.


2011 is one year, I took the career averages because it's the most fair way to do it.

You can't simply add up the FG% and divide them by the years the players have played in the NBA. It completely skews the sample. You would need to add up the Makes and the Attempts for all of the years and then determine the FG%. How you can't see that you drastically skewed the numbers is mind-boggling.


One year is not enough time to judge, players can have a hot year or a cold year, and Carmelo played for 2 different teams in 2011 so yeah...its not really fair to judge that way.


I agree. But HoopsData does not give career averages. I can show you their true career averages from other websites, if you would like, and I can show you why Rose is a mediocre shooter (at best).


even if we do it your way and take only the stats from the year 2011, Derrick Rose still has a better FG% than Carmelo from 3-15 feet.


No he does not.

smith&wesson
08-10-2011, 04:34 PM
5 seconds left and my life is on the line ? i want kobe with the ball and bargnani gaurding him. so whats everyone doing after the game :)

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:39 PM
if you add up the makes and attempts, you get the same exact number. Derrick Rose, 3-9 feet, 48%.

yes he does have a better Fg% than carmelo from 3-15 feet for the year 2011, where are you looking?

Derrick Rose 3-9 feet: 40% Carmelo Anthony 3-9 feet: 32% in denver 26% in New York
Derrick Rose 10-15 feet: 42% Carmelo Anthony 10-15 feet 38% in Denver 37% in New York

Gators123
08-10-2011, 04:41 PM
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b85/cool_dude100/popcorn.gif

cowboyz180
08-10-2011, 04:42 PM
Dirk.... but out of those three I gotta go with Durant

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 04:45 PM
if you add up the makes and attempts, you get the same exact number. Derrick Rose, 3-9 feet, 48%.

yes he does have a better Fg% than carmelo from 3-15 feet for the year 2011, where are you looking?

Derrick Rose 3-9 feet: 40% Carmelo Anthony 3-9 feet: 32% in denver 26% in New York
Derrick Rose 10-15 feet: 42% Carmelo Anthony 10-15 feet 38% in Denver 37% in New York

Derrick Rose attempted 194 shots from 3-9 feet in 2011. He made 77 of those shots. He shot 39.7% from that distance. The league average is 39.0%. Among qualifying players (who played over 40 games and at least 20 minutes a game) Rose ranked 92nd in the NBA. All of this information is from HoopsData.com. He's mediocre from 3-9 feet.

From 10-15 feet he shoots 42% from the field, which among qualifying players puts him at 72nd in the league. The league average is slightly above 39%.

From 16-23 feet he is 113th in the league. Shooting 38%. The league average is 39%.

He's mediocre.

gbpackers12
08-10-2011, 04:45 PM
Ben Wallace from three, but out of these three I'd pick Durant then Rose then LeBron.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:48 PM
Derrick Rose attempted 194 shots from 3-9 feet in 2011. He made 77 of those shots. He shot 39.7% from that distance. The league average is 39.0%. Among qualifying players (who played over 40 games and at least 20 minutes a game) Rose ranked 92nd in the NBA. All of this information is from HoopsData.com. He's mediocre from 3-9 feet.

From 10-15 feet he shoots 42% from the field, which among qualifying players puts him at 72nd in the league. The league average is slightly above 39%.

From 16-23 feet he is 113th in the league. Shooting 38%. The league average is 39%.

He's mediocre.

You're just looking at the year 2011, Rose's mediocre numbers for that year are still better than carmelos, which is what we've been debating for the past 2 pages. Jeez.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 04:50 PM
You're just looking at the year 2011, Rose's mediocre numbers for that year are still better than carmelos, which is what we've been debating for the past 2 pages. Jeez.

You've also argued that Rose is a "good shooter". He's clearly not.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 04:54 PM
You've also argued that Rose is a "good shooter". He's clearly not.

ok so we're moving on to a different argument now? You've conceded that I've proven to you that Rose is a better shooter than Carmelo from 3-15 feet? lovely. I always appreciate it when people can admit that they were wrong. It only took 2 freakin' pages to finally get past this stupid argument that for anybody else could have been ended in about 2 minutes.

Rose is a good mid range shooter if you take his career average, like I said, one year is not enough time to judge. People have hot years and then some years their shooting takes a dip. A lot has happened for Derrick between his first 2 years and his 3rd. A new coach, a new system, becoming the focal point of the offense and a focal point for opposing teams defense. The shooting ability is still there, the circumstances have changed.

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 04:56 PM
:cry:



No, actually, you are an example of what's wrong with this forum. Homer fans who come into the NBA forum, purport an insane, ridiculous, and blasphemous agenda, and then cry or get all upset when they're asked to justify it and answer to their blasphemous claims. I learned a few things from you during this conversation:

(1) You're a hypocrite (bashing Melo/praising Rose despite Rose failing more)
(2) You're over-emotional (not being able to handle the tone of the discussion/being butt hurt that Lebron chose Miami)
(3) You either don't read and understand things or choose to run away from things you can't answer.



Look up the word rational. No part of your argument makes any logical or rational sense. I'm sorry if my dumbfoundedness comes off as insulting. I'm not insulting you. I'm just shocked by your inability to put two and two together and get four.



You're insulting my intelligence.

:worthy:

I have had the same problem with RZZZA.. Ive never seen a poster on this forum get more butt hurt from Rose criticism as he does. In fact i dont think theres another poster that uses the phrase "Rose hate" as much as he does... Its always his cop out when he gets beat in argument with another poster..

About time somebody called him out on his bull ****..

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 04:58 PM
Can we get some better people back in here to talk to. Steb0, Chronz? Somebody who doesn't flame or bait, someone who can carry on a civil discussion?

:laugh2:

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 05:00 PM
ok so we're moving on to a different argument now? You've conceded that I've proven to you that Rose is a better shooter than Carmelo from 3-15 feet? lovely. I always appreciate it when people can admit that they were wrong. It only took 2 freakin' pages to finally get past this stupid argument that for anybody else could have been ended in about 2 minutes.

The number of attempts skews Carmelo's numbers. Rose is a slasher and will always attempt higher percentage shots from 3-9 feet. It doesn't make him a better shooter, it makes him a better slasher. Melo takes harder shots (fall-aways and jumpshots) against better defenders.

Again, if you look at the raw totals you'll see this discrepency. Look at the %AS as well and it's clear that Rose just slashes and lays it in most of the time. Doesn't make him a better SHOOTER.


Rose is a good mid range shooter if you take his career average, like I said, one year is not enough time to judge. People have hot years and then some years their shooting takes a dip. A lot has happened for Derrick between his first 2 years and his 3rd. A new coach, a new system, becoming the focal point of the offense and a focal point for opposing teams defense. The shooting ability is still there, the circumstances have changed.


So he sucks from this point forward? Thanks. I get it now.

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 05:01 PM
Dirk is very good from everywhere on the floor, Melo can't say the same. Melo is good at the rim, he's poor from 3-15 feet, then he gets significantly better the further he gets away from the basket.

actually, strike that, poor isnt exactly the right word. Let's just say Melo is not as good from 3-15 feet as he is from other parts of the floor

Do you not realize that the bulk of 'Melo's game winners come from 15 feet? Isn't that what this thread is about?

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 05:07 PM
No, not in the way you are using the word at least. (http://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/good). You're using definition 8 of good and decent is not a synonym of that definition.



You can't simply add up the FG% and divide them by the years the players have played in the NBA. It completely skews the sample. You would need to add up the Makes and the Attempts for all of the years and then determine the FG%. How you can't see that you drastically skewed the numbers is mind-boggling.



I agree. But HoopsData does not give career averages. I can show you their true career averages from other websites, if you would like, and I can show you why Rose is a mediocre shooter (at best).



No he does not.

Dude you are raping this kid a new one.... let it be man. You cant fix homerism... oh wait.. he considers the word "homer" an insult so i guess i better stop...

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 05:10 PM
The number of attempts skews Carmelo's numbers.

what does that even mean? Yeah, if you attempt more shots and you miss more, your FG% will be lower. That's how it works. That's not any type of excuse.



Rose is a slasher and will always attempt higher percentage shots from 3-9 feet. It doesn't make him a better shooter, it makes him a better slasher. Melo takes harder shots (fall-aways and jumpshots) against better defenders.

Look, whatever, the stats indicate that Rose has a higher FG% from certain places on the floor than Melo. Try to parse it however you want but thats what the fact is. Melo has a higher FG% from some places on the floor than Derrick. It's just fact.




Again, if you look at the raw totals you'll see this discrepency. Look at the %AS as well and it's clear that Rose just slashes and lays it in most of the time. Doesn't make him a better SHOOTER.

the %AS stats indicate that Melo is assisted on his shots more often than Rose is. All this means is that Rose is the primary ballhandler for his team and is creating his shots more often. Melo being a wing player and Rose being a point guard, this makes total sense. It doesn't indicate anything about slashing or not slashing.




So he sucks from this point forward? Thanks. I get it now.

Is that what I said? You accused me of poor reading comprehension and of being a hypocrite earlier. Now who has poor reading comprehension and is being a hypocrite? Carmelo Anthony had high points and low points in his career with FG% too, almost every player has them. in 2009 Carmelo shot 39% from 16-23 feet, in 2008 he shot 44%. Case in point.


Do you not realize that the bulk of 'Melo's game winners come from 15 feet? Isn't that what this thread is about?

I did not realize that, I'm very interested to see where you got these stats from.

Hellcrooner
08-10-2011, 05:14 PM
to the best FREE THROW SHOOTING BIG man in the team, i dont care if its brian scalabrine, the other team has to decide to allo him to shoot FROM INSIDE for free, or FOUL him and give him Two free throws.

Of course that cant happen in the nba, the "star" or "second start" at Worse case scenario has to shoot mandatory...

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 05:17 PM
what does that even mean? Yeah, if you attempt more shots and you miss more, your FG% will be lower. That's how it works. That's not any type of excuse.

No, the more shots you attempt the more reliable the sample, and the most recent sample is always the most reliable unless it's a severe outlier. Simple statistics. In Rose's case, 2011 was the most representative sample of attempts taken from the field. The volatility of shots from 3-9 became a lot more reliable in 2011.

Your argument is severely flawed. You're using FG% from 3-9 feet to determine who is a better "shooter" from 3-9 feet. We can both agree that floaters and lay-ups are not "jump shots" and are very high percentage shots. To determine which one of Rose's shots were "jump shots" or "lay-ups" you can use HoopData's %As metric. What percentage of his shots came off of assists? Obviously if he creates his own shot and lays it in, no one is getting an assist.

Derrick Rose is 214th in the league in %As (14%) and Melo is at 33%. Clearly, Melo takes more jump shots (lower percentage shots) from that distance. Hence, this sample is highly skewed. Rose doesn't post up and shoot jumpers, he slashes. Using this statistic to prove who is the better "shooter" is inconclusive. You're wrong.


Look, whatever, the stats indicate that Rose has a higher FG% from certain places on the floor than Melo. Try to parse it however you want but thats what the fact is. Melo has a higher FG% from some places on the floor than Derrick. It's just fact.


Read my above statement.



the %AS stats indicate that Melo is assisted on his shots more often than Rose is. All this means is that Rose is the primary ballhandler for his team and is creating his shots more often. Melo being a wing player and Rose being a point guard, this makes total sense. It doesn't indicate anything about slashing or not slashing.


You're really losing it here. Read above.


Is that what I said? You accused me of poor reading comprehension and of being a hypocrite earlier. Now who has poor reading comprehension and is being a hypocrite? Carmelo Anthony had high points and low points in his career with FG% too, almost every player has them. in 2009 Carmelo shot 39% from 16-23 feet, in 2008 he shot 44%. Case in point.


That's not as severe of a gap as Rose. Nowhere close.

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 05:17 PM
I did not realize that, I'm very interested to see where you got these stats from.

I don't need stats to tell you what is pretty much common knowledge. He does the same move every time. Jab-step, quick dribble, and pulls up from mid-range.:confused:

Are you saying that isn't the case, or do you just want to admit you have no idea? doesn't matter to me at all.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 05:20 PM
Jesus Melky, now you're really debating and carrying on a civil conversation. What took you so long? I totally disagree with you on a lot of what you just said.


I don't need stats to tell you what is pretty much common knowledge. He does the same move every time. Jab-step, quick dribble, and pulls up from mid-range.

Are you saying that isn't the case, or do you just want to admit you have no idea? doesn't matter to me at all.

I admit I have no idea, I thought there were stats somewhere available that could quantify this sort of thing

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 05:26 PM
I admit I have no idea, I thought there were stats somewhere available that could quantify this sort of thing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlsCt2viDxU

^ Check it out. This video is horrible quality but you'll get the idea. Over half the game winners shown are from mid range. This was made in 2009 and since then he's refined this move and hit several more.

As far as stats go, i know how to find his clutch stats, and i know how to find percentages from different spots on the floor, but i DON'T know how to combine them. I guess you gotta just take my word for it, dude. The Iso at about 15-18 feet out is where 'Melo goes to hit his game winners. Even on the rare occasion he ends up driving to the bucket, the play starts from 15-18 out.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 05:31 PM
No, the more shots you attempt the more reliable the sample, and the most recent sample is always the most reliable unless it's a severe outlier. Simple statistics. In Rose's case, 2011 was the most representative sample of attempts taken from the field. The volatility of shots from 3-9 became a lot more reliable in 2011.

How can you say this? If a greater sample results in greater accuracy then you'd want to add up all makes and attempts for the entire career and come up with an average. That's exactly what you told me to do earlier, and thats what I did, and his average is a good FG%. 2011 was the most representative sample? How so? I thought we agreed that one year is not a big enough sample size.


Your argument is severely flawed. You're using FG% from 3-9 feet to determine who is a better "shooter" from 3-9 feet. We can both agree that floaters and lay-ups are not "jump shots" and are very high percentage shots. To determine which one of Rose's shots were "jump shots" or "lay-ups" you can use HoopData's %As metric. What percentage of his shots came off of assists? Obviously if he creates his own shot and lays it in, no one is getting an assist.

Firstly, I don't differentiate between what type of shot it is, as long as its a shot then it counts towards FG%. It doesn't matter to me if its a jump shot or a floater or a hook shot or a granny style underhand shot, whatever. If it's a Fg attempt then it counts. Secondly, I've never seen the %As stat used in the way that you just explained it. Are you looking at the Shot Location section or the Passing stats section?


Derrick Rose is 214th in the league in %As (14%) and Melo is at 33%. Clearly, Melo takes more jump shots (lower percentage shots) from that distance. Hence, this sample is highly skewed. Rose doesn't post up and shoot jumpers, he slashes. Using this statistic to prove who is the better "shooter" is inconclusive. You're wrong.

Derrick shoots a lot of jumpers too, I mean you can see from the shot placement how many he attempts per game and how many he attempted for the season. in 2011 he attempted 366 jump shots from 16-23 feet. Your assertion that Rose doesn't shoot jump shots is wrong. He shoots them a lot.

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 05:36 PM
Jesus Melky, now you're really debating and carrying on a civil conversation. What took you so long? I totally disagree with you on a lot of what you just said.



I admit I have no idea, I thought there were stats somewhere available that could quantify this sort of thing

Rose is a mediocre shooter... He has improved but he still not as good as Bulls fans try to paint him..

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 05:38 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlsCt2viDxU

^ Check it out. This video is horrible quality but you'll get the idea. Over half the game winners shown are from mid range. This was made in 2009 and since then he's refined this move and hit several more.

As far as stats go, i know how to find his clutch stats, and i know how to find percentages from different spots on the floor, but i DON'T know how to combine them. I guess you gotta just take my word for it, dude. The Iso at about 15-18 feet out is where 'Melo goes to hit his game winners. Even on the rare occasion he ends up driving to the bucket, the play starts from 15-18 out.

ooh, I like that song :) Mobb Deep

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 05:42 PM
How can you say this? If a greater sample results in greater accuracy then you'd want to add up all makes and attempts for the entire career and come up with an average. That's exactly what you told me to do earlier, and thats what I did, and his average is a good FG%. 2011 was the most representative sample? How so? I thought we agreed that one year is not a big enough sample size.



Firstly, I don't differentiate between what type of shot it is, as long as its a shot then it counts towards FG%. It doesn't matter to me if its a jump shot or a floater or a hook shot or a granny style underhand shot, whatever. If it's a Fg attempt then it counts. Secondly, I've never seen the %As stat used in the way that you just explained it. Are you looking at the Shot Location section or the Passing stats section?



Derrick shoots a lot of jumpers too, I mean you can see from the shot placement how many he attempts per game and how many he attempted for the season. in 2011 he attempted 366 jump shots from 16-23 feet. Your assertion that Rose doesn't shoot jump shots is wrong. He shoots them a lot.

So your looking at the stats how you want to and interpreting them whichever way it makes Rose look better.. :pity:

Rose is a slasher so his FG% is skewed. Layups, dunks and floaters arent shots! So how is Rose a good shooter??? You just dont make any sense...

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 05:46 PM
So your looking at the stats how you want to and interpreting them whichever way it makes Rose look better..

No I'm not, will you stop already? I'm not such a massive homer as you think. Believe it or not but I can be wrong about things too, if I'm wrong then just prove to me where I'm wrong and I'll say "Ok, you got me".

slashing is part of the at rim%, lay ups and dunks.

Floaters most definitely count as shots, they are field goal attempts and if they occur from 3-9 feet then they count as part of that FG%. Why are floaters not shots to you?

coryd238
08-10-2011, 05:56 PM
I wish there was a way to get individual fastbreak stats. I know Rose gets a lot of his close range baskets from that. Same with Lebron.

Ebbs
08-10-2011, 05:58 PM
It always amazes how many people think Melo and Kobe are clutch

coryd238
08-10-2011, 06:02 PM
It always amazes how many people think Melo and Kobe are clutch

I'd like to see you dispute the fact that Melo's clutch.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 06:02 PM
I'm dumbfounded by how RZZZA is arguing that Rose is a good shooter based off of his ability to hit floaters and layups

Chill_Will_24
08-10-2011, 06:03 PM
It always amazes how many people think Melo and Kobe are clutch

Im a Melo and Knicks hater but even i must admit Melo is cold blooded clutch. His defense is horrible, he is terribly inefficient and his shot selection is poor. He is very overrated but still.. with my life on the line i would trust Melo with a game winner. He is clutch.

The numbers dont favor Kobe as much thou...

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 06:07 PM
It always amazes how many people think Melo and Kobe are clutch

http://www.82games.com/1011/CSORT11.HTM

According to the Clutch Stats, taking into account defense and FG%/A - Lebron James was the most clutch player in the NBA in 2010-2011. Anthony is a close second, shooting a ridiculous 46% from the field.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 06:10 PM
I'm dumbfounded by how RZZZA is arguing that Rose is a good shooter based off of his ability to hit floaters and layups

uhm...I'm not? I never even mentioned atrim%, which is where lay ups and dunks would be classified. And floaters count like any other field goal attempt, I'm sure melo hits some floaters too. If it's from 3-9 feet then it counts as a shot.

Your entire idea that Rose only slashes and shoots floaters is wrong, and I just proved to you how it's wrong, did you miss it? look how many jumpers he takes from 16-23 feet. He shoots jumpers from mid range too. from 10-15 feet I'm positive those are not floaters. From 3-9 feet, some of those are floaters and some are jump shots but it doesn't even matter.

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 06:15 PM
You're kidding yourself if you think Rose shoots jumpshots from 3 feet away from the basket.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 06:16 PM
well its 3-9 feet. Why cant he be shooting jumpshots from 9 feet away?

why does that even matter dude, why are you so fixated on jump shots only? There's other types of shots too, why is jump shots the only type of shot that matters to you?

MelkyNYY
08-10-2011, 06:19 PM
Because you're ARGUING that Rose is a good SHOOTER.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 06:22 PM
Well to clarify I was only actually arguing that Rose is a better shooter than Melo from 3-15 feet.

I didn't realize that floaters don't count as shots to you.

If I was to amend my statement and say that Rose is a better field goal-maker from 3-15 feet than Melo, would that make you feel better?

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 06:42 PM
Well to clarify I was only actually arguing that Rose is a better shooter than Melo from 3-15 feet.

I didn't realize that floaters don't count as shots to you.

If I was to amend my statement and say that Rose is a better field goal-maker from 3-15 feet than Melo, would that make you feel better?

OK. I asked you this the other day when you were comparing 'Melo and
Rose's efficiency numbers to Kobe. Where are you getting your stats??

Rose:

Shot Att. eFG%
Jump 69% .441
Close 29% .556

'Melo:

Shot Att. eFG%
Jump 74% .458
Close 23% .615

Why do you post things in such a definitive way when you haven't even looked into the numbers? Its most important to inform yourself when debating about your favorite player; otherwise you come off as quite the homer.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10NYK14.HTM
http://www.82games.com/1011/10CHI3.HTM

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 06:49 PM
I'm getting my stats from hoopdata, I don't know how to use 82games.com

What does "close" mean? Whats the difference between "close" and "inside"?

Those are interesting stats though. thanks for posting them. They seem to contradict the stats from hoopdata somewhat

SteBO
08-10-2011, 06:49 PM
Cool it in here.....

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 06:55 PM
I'm getting my stats from hoopdata, I don't know how to use 82games.com

What does "close" mean? Whats the difference between "close" and "inside"?

Those are interesting stats though. thanks for posting them. They seem to contradict the stats from hoopdata somewhat

Inside is lay-ups. Close is where you claimed Derrick Rose was better.
It would be cool if you could actually post the stats from hoopdata and a link.

THE GIPPER
08-10-2011, 06:56 PM
id pick rose, hit a big shot against the rockets this year when they needed him, durant is too unfocused and shrinks in the moment, lebron isjust 1-22 all time in last second shots

Thats is 100% false.

RZZZA
08-10-2011, 06:57 PM
ok, here you go:

Derrick: http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Derrick%20Rose
Carmelo: http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Carmelo%20Anthony

If you scroll down and look at shot placement, it shows Derrick has a better Fg% than Carmelo from 3-15 feet both for the 2011 season and also if you were to take an average. Carmelo is better than Derrick from 16-23 feet and also from 3. Carmelo also finishes at rim with a higher %.

lakerboy
08-10-2011, 07:21 PM
How the hell does Lebron have 31 votes? If my life were on the line, I'd choose Jason Terry over him.

MJ-BULLS
08-10-2011, 07:24 PM
I would give it to Kobe Bryant. but out of that list, I will go with Kevin Durant.

KeepMonta#8
08-10-2011, 07:43 PM
:offtopic: i pretty sure i remember reading somewhere that kobe has missed the most game winners in nba history, but i think he's top 3 or 5 in most made

back to the thread- i would pick durant guy's a great shooter, then lebron, for all the hate he gets he can hit clutch shots i think in the chicgo and boston series he proved that, just sometimes i dont think he has that mental edge yet. Rose i think will be hard to get a shot of because you know there going to have a sg or sf defend that is taller and can kinda keep up with him, no hate on any of these guys

Kashmir13579
08-10-2011, 07:58 PM
ok, here you go:

Derrick: http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Derrick%20Rose
Carmelo: http://www.hoopdata.com/player.aspx?name=Carmelo%20Anthony

If you scroll down and look at shot placement, it shows Derrick has a better Fg% than Carmelo from 3-15 feet both for the 2011 season and also if you were to take an average. Carmelo is better than Derrick from 16-23 feet and also from 3. Carmelo also finishes at rim with a higher %.

Thanks. The two sources do contradict each other a bit. (if i'm understanding everything correctly)

Hitman21
08-10-2011, 08:16 PM
out of those 3?..hmmm ill take melo

faridk89
08-10-2011, 10:05 PM
why is kobe not on here??

gatkins11
08-10-2011, 10:19 PM
Dirk.

Catoblepas
08-10-2011, 11:01 PM
im assuming that wade wouldnt be in the game for Miami.. so I choose Durant easily

mcyz
08-10-2011, 11:10 PM
Given the options of kevin durant, derrick rose, and lebron james, 3 players who arent the most clutch with the last shot of the game on the line:

Rose(guarded by a 6"8 player in final seconds in miami series)

Durant(problems figuring out where to take the shot from)

Lebron James(unfocused when the big shot comes)

with your life on the line in a game of basketball against the grim reaper, who would you rather have take the last shot for you?

paul pierce

iam brett favre
08-10-2011, 11:18 PM
Other: D-Will
Honorable Mention: Gordon Hayward

coryd238
08-10-2011, 11:32 PM
why is kobe not on here??

Read the thread :P

nickdymez
08-12-2011, 01:52 PM
It's tough between LBJ and Durant, but I'll go with LBJ.

What a shock!!!! :speechless::speechless:

SteBO
08-12-2011, 01:54 PM
What a shock!!!! :speechless::speechless:
Yeah, what a shock that I'm giving my honest opinion. I'll take my chances with a LeBron drive to the basket as opposed to Durant long jumper. :rolleyes:

juno10
08-12-2011, 02:09 PM
How the hell does Lebron have 31 votes? If my life were on the line, I'd choose Jason Terry over him.

get ready to die than.

nickdymez
08-12-2011, 02:39 PM
Yeah, what a shock that I'm giving my honest opinion. I'll take my chances with a LeBron drive to the basket as opposed to Durant long jumper. :rolleyes:

Yea well i took it as a last minute shot.. Like 15-20 ft jumper.. And even if they are driving to the hole, wouldn't you want Durant who draws more fouls than anyone else and shoots like 90% free throws driving?

SteBO
08-12-2011, 02:42 PM
Yea well i took it as a last minute shot.. Like 15-20 ft jumper.. And even if they are driving to the hole, wouldn't you want Durant who draws more fouls than anyone else and shoots like 90% free throws driving?
The FT shooting is what had me stuck between picking Durant and LeBron. If we're looking at it that way, then hell yeah I'd pick KD. The guy is money at the line, as opposed to LeBron whose missed big FT's before. In saying that though, LeBron shoots a career 85% from the line in the last 2 minutes of games. Depends how you looks at the situation honestly. Obviously though, based on percentages, KD is better at the line in pressure situations.

juno10
08-12-2011, 02:47 PM
Thats is 100% false.

lol i know right, i can name two off the top of my head, vs the warrirors and vs the orlando magic ECF.

meloman1592
08-12-2011, 03:36 PM
out of these guys lebron...out of the whole league, melooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Raph12
08-12-2011, 03:52 PM
Idk why people keep saying Durant, if I want a 30+foot 3pt shot heaved, then I'll choose KD to shoot it... That guy takes the most ill-advised shots when it comes to buzzer-beaters.

JasonJohnHorn
08-12-2011, 04:17 PM
I'd call up Reggie Miller and see if he'd come out of retirement.

juno10
08-12-2011, 04:21 PM
I'd call up Reggie Miller and see if he'd come out of retirement.

why not just bring back MJ while you're at it.