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View Full Version : To Start A Team: Offensive Juggernaut Player Vs Defensive Juggernaut Player



JNA17
08-05-2011, 12:03 AM
So everybody knows that defense wins championships, yet people call certain players the best because of how good they are offensively, so let's test that notion with this example.

You have the option of picking one of these two great players to START your team and build around with. Player A is an offensive juggernaut but lacks defense. He's really bad at defense in fact, but not to the point where it's not like he can't guard anybody, it's just he focuses all his energy on offense and slacks off on defense. This was his regular stats from last season...

Player A (SF)
PPG: 33.4
APG: 10.1
RPG: 1.5
SPG: 0.2
BPG: 0.3
FG: 55%
3P: 45%
FT: 95%
TO: 3.3

As you can see, for a SF, he's got high scoring numbers and high assists numbers while shooting at a high % and is an average ball handler. This guy can score almost every game at a high level and do it against any player on any position. But his defense...well it's almost non-existent.

Next...

Player B (SF)
PPG: 5.5
APG: 1.3
RPG: 22.7
SPG: 10.5
BPG: 11.2
FG: 42%
3P: 0% (doesn't shot threes)
FT: 72%
TO: 1.4

The definition of a defensive stopper. Can guard any player at any position in the league. Because of his amazing defense, he also grabs for the defensive boards like no other rebounder can. However, he's probably the last option you would want to have in scoring on offense. I mean he can make open layups or wide open mid range shots sometimes if needed but your better off with anybody else you have on the team on offense.

So who would you rather have to START your team and build around with? Do you take the gifted offensive juggernaut and build around him the role players he needs. With his assists along with his high scoring, he would definitly find the open looks for whatever shooters or post players he has on his team. Or do you go with the ultimate defensive stopper? Guards, Forwards, Centers, it doesn't matter. He can guard and stop them all in their tracks. Hell on a two or three on one break away with player B being the one, he would win. With his incredible defense, he would lead the team in every single defensive categories along with being one of the best rebounders in the league.

For the TLDR People: You like the best offensive player ever or the best defensive player ever?

23dragonzord
08-05-2011, 12:13 AM
The guy who averages a triple double with defensive stats

marvILLous
08-05-2011, 12:21 AM
lol did u see the stats u posted? hahaha obviously the defensive player.. scoring players are a lot easier to find

naps
08-05-2011, 12:34 AM
This is not even close to reality. Put some logical and close to real stats that would seem more interesting. No one will ever average 10 or 11 spg/bpg. Also a starting SF will never average 1.5 rpg. And how is player a an average ballhandler when has 10 apg and puts up gigantic scores?

JNA17
08-05-2011, 12:39 AM
This not even close to reality. Put some logical and close to real stats that would seem more interesting. No one will ever average 10 or 11 spg/bpg. Also a starting SF will never average 1.5 rpg. And how is player a an average ballhandler when has 10 apg and puts up gigantic scores?

I should have also posted that the stats here are pretty illogical. I just wanted to post huge numbers for the sake of it. As for the ball handling part, he makes smart passing decisions, but when he goes one on one and ball hogs a play, sometimes he would get careless and TO the ball which is why his TO numbers are 3+.

But what numbers for each player do you think would be more logical?

ugafan
08-05-2011, 12:40 AM
This is a little ridiculous...

Anybody not taking the defensive player is crazy. He'd probably have at least 6-7 quadruple doubles per season. :laugh2:

naps
08-05-2011, 12:51 AM
But what numbers for each player do you think would be more logical?

Something closer to the league's best offensive stats and best defensive stats.

Cal827
08-05-2011, 01:00 AM
So everybody knows that defense wins championships, yet people call certain players the best because of how good they are offensively, so let's test that notion with this example.

You have the option of picking one of these two great players to START your team and build around with. Player A is an offensive juggernaut but lacks defense. He's really bad at defense in fact, but not to the point where it's not like he can't guard anybody, it's just he focuses all his energy on offense and slacks off on defense. This was his regular stats from last season...

Player A (SF)
PPG: 33.4
APG: 10.1
RPG: 1.5
SPG: 0.2
BPG: 0.3
FG: 55%
3P: 45%
FT: 95%
TO: 3.3

As you can see, for a SF, he's got high scoring numbers and high assists numbers while shooting at a high % and is an average ball handler. This guy can score almost every game at a high level and do it against any player on any position. But his defense...well it's almost non-existent.

Next...

Player B (SF)
PPG: 5.5
APG: 1.3
RPG: 22.7
SPG: 10.5
BPG: 11.2
FG: 42%
3P: 0% (doesn't shot threes)
FT: 72%
TO: 1.4

The definition of a defensive stopper. Can guard any player at any position in the league. Because of his amazing defense, he also grabs for the defensive boards like no other rebounder can. However, he's probably the last option you would want to have in scoring on offense. I mean he can make open layups or wide open mid range shots sometimes if needed but your better off with anybody else you have on the team on offense.

So who would you rather have to START your team and build around with? Do you take the gifted offensive juggernaut and build around him the role players he needs. With his assists along with his high scoring, he would definitly find the open looks for whatever shooters or post players he has on his team. Or do you go with the ultimate defensive stopper? Guards, Forwards, Centers, it doesn't matter. He can guard and stop them all in their tracks. Hell on a two or three on one break away with player B being the one, he would win. With his incredible defense, he would lead the team in every single defensive categories along with being one of the best rebounders in the league.

For the TLDR People: You like the best offensive player ever or the best defensive player ever?

:drool::drool::drool::drool:

So Defensive over the Offensive guy. 23 rebounds, 11 blocks 11 steals? That could basically remove 50-60 points off the opposing teams. Also, he could help get a ton of second chance points (you know cause averaging 23 rebounds will likely result in offensive rebounds as well lol)

Anyways, just to start off a team in general (assuming that the numbers aren't this high, lets say 11, 3 and 2)... I would still probably pick the defensive guy.... It seems easier to teach someone to perfect their shooting stroke over teaching them to outhustle the opponent... look at the many star players who are still subpar on defense, like Bosh and Melo.

Also, the offensive small forward might be a great passer, but that could be dealt with, if they can get a pass first point guard on their team.... harder to replace 10 blocks per game lol

JNA17
08-05-2011, 01:01 AM
:drool::drool::drool::drool:

So Defensive over the Offensive guy. 22 rebounds, 11 blocks 11 steals? That could basically remove 50-60 points off the opposing teams.

Anyways, just to start off a team in general (assuming that the numbers aren't this high, lets say 11, 3 and 2)... I would still probably pick the defensive guy.... It seems easier to teach someone to perfect their shooting stroke over teaching them to outhustle the opponent... look at the many star players who are still subpar on defense, like Bosh and Melo.

yeah i will probably edit the numbers in the OP. I just wanted to give the idea of a best offensive player ever vs the best defensive player ever.

Kashmir13579
08-05-2011, 01:02 AM
Offense wins championships.

RapToronto95
08-05-2011, 01:20 AM
yeah i will probably edit the numbers in the OP. I just wanted to give the idea of a best offensive player ever vs the best defensive player ever.

In that case,

Player A (SF)
PPG: 93.4
APG: 12.1
RPG: 1.0
SPG: 0.2
BPG: 0.3
FG: 95%
3P: 85%
FT: 99.99%
TO: 0

tr3ymill3r
08-05-2011, 01:21 AM
Offense wins championships.

Sarcasm I assume.

Cal827
08-05-2011, 02:10 AM
yeah i will probably edit the numbers in the OP. I just wanted to give the idea of a best offensive player ever vs the best defensive player ever.

lol, I knew what you were getting at (as I assumed the numbers written were just to emphasize their dominance on one side of the court)... imagine someone out there averaging 10+ blocks out there per game though.... he would probably be the first player to get a max contract without the ability to score lol......


In that case,

Player A (SF)
PPG: 93.4
APG: 12.1
RPG: 1.0
SPG: 0.2
BPG: 0.3
FG: 95%
3P: 85%
FT: 99.99%
TO: 0

I don't care about the 12.1 asts per game... that guy is still a ****ing ball-hog lol

John Walls Era
08-05-2011, 02:36 AM
RPG: 22.7
SPG: 10.5
BPG: 11.2

The guy shoots 42%, not terrible. I'll take him any day of the week, and this is assuming his man D is one of the best?

Ultimate player, doesn't need to score a lot to make an impact. Now all I need are some shooters around him.

LakersMaster24
08-05-2011, 02:47 AM
To be honest, I would pick the offensive guy as the "star" of my team. Because, when you look at it, most stars on the championship teams were outstanding scorers; Kobe, Jordan, Kareem, etc. However, these players were great defensive players also, but they always had a defensive pro on their lineup such as Pippen and Rodman for the Bulls, or Michael Cooper for the Lakers. So, if I was a GM, I would pick the guy that can score for me, and surround him with key defensive role players, who may not be superior on defensive like "Player B", but will provide enough defense to win games.

Cool007
08-05-2011, 09:49 AM
This is not even close to reality. Put some logical and close to real stats that would seem more interesting. No one will ever average 10 or 11 spg/bpg. Also a starting SF will never average 1.5 rpg. And how is player a an average ballhandler when has 10 apg and puts up gigantic scores?

+1.

Those stats NEVER EVER happen. So what's the point in discussing something that there is ZERO chance of happening.

I would compare like Ben Wallace of the world (DPOY for a couple of times) but not good on offense to someone like Kevin Durant (Scoring champion) but not so good defender.

Who would you rather build around?

Give me the offensive juggernaut over defensive specialist any day, any week, any time.

Cool007
08-05-2011, 10:05 AM
Offense wins championships.


Sarcasm I assume.

Why?

Individual with great offense almost always beats out individual defense.

People are very mistaken about "Defense wins championships" When they say defense, it's basically TEAM defense moreso than individual defense. You don't need a DPOY to win the championship but you do need that reliable top 5 player who can score at will at any given time (4th qtr) to put the team over the top.

This is why I always and I mean always take individual great offensive player vs individual great defensive player.

RLundi
08-05-2011, 10:32 AM
Both- Dwight Howard.

RLundi
08-05-2011, 10:37 AM
In all honesty, the defensive player is a complete monster. You can always find scorers but where are you gonna find someone that snags half your team's boards and all of the steals and blocks?

I'd take the defensive player in a heartbeat.

sp1derm00
08-05-2011, 11:47 AM
Defensive player. Most NBA players are good offensively anyways.

tredigs
08-05-2011, 11:56 AM
From these video game number statistics? The defensive player easily. He would be 3x better than the best defender in NBA history.

In REALITY? Ideally you take the two way player - but your next best bet is the elite offensive option. From there, you build a defensive core and solid 2/3 options, preferably one of them being a post/clean-up option.

nycericanguy
08-05-2011, 12:09 PM
In General you need an offensive star to win. But the defensive player you mentioned here would be the greatest to ever play the game so you have to go with him.

You should make this more realistic though if you want to get more honest answers.

No one is going to NOT take a guy that averages 22rpg 11bpg and 10spg.

This would make more sense if it was more realistic, such as...

Would you take Durant

OR

A healthy Oden who could average 12ppg 15rpg and 3bpg.

Dade County
08-05-2011, 12:13 PM
The OP should have just posted ...

Would you pick MJ or a mixture of D Howard & Dennis Rodman put together.

pd1dish
08-05-2011, 12:14 PM
This is not even close to reality. Put some logical and close to real stats that would seem more interesting. No one will ever average 10 or 11 spg/bpg. Also a starting SF will never average 1.5 rpg. And how is player a an average ballhandler when has 10 apg and puts up gigantic scores?

this.

those stats are so outrageous and impossible that its not even fun to think about this thread.

YungIce12
08-05-2011, 06:49 PM
These are some more realistic stats.

Player A (SF)
PPG: 33.4
APG: 10.1
RPG: 4.5
SPG: 0.2
BPG: 0.3
FG: 50%
3P: 45%
FT: 90%
TO: 3.3
PF: 2.2
Cltuch in the 4th quarther. Can play in the post or perimeter; perferably perimeter.

Player B (SF)
PPG: 5.5
APG: 1.3
RPG: 14.8
SPG: 3.3
BPG: 6.8
FG: 42%
3P: 0% (doesn't shot threes)
FT: 72%
TO: 1.4
PF: 4.1

Can guard all 5 posistions; preferably PG-SF. Usually holds PG-SF to 20 points or less. Usually holds PG-SF to 42% shooting or less. Never allows anyone to score over 30 points or shoot over 50%.

Kashmir13579
08-05-2011, 07:04 PM
Sarcasm I assume.

Kinda. I don't think its any more ignorant of a statement than "defense wins championships".

It takes a combination of both and a plethora of intangibles.

coryd238
08-05-2011, 07:13 PM
This is honestly one of the most ridiculous threads I've ever seen. No offense.

faze38
08-05-2011, 07:25 PM
To be honest, I would pick the offensive guy as the "star" of my team. Because, when you look at it, most stars on the championship teams were outstanding scorers; Kobe, Jordan, Kareem, etc. However, these players were great defensive players also, but they always had a defensive pro on their lineup such as Pippen and Rodman for the Bulls, or Michael Cooper for the Lakers. So, if I was a GM, I would pick the guy that can score for me, and surround him with key defensive role players, who may not be superior on defensive like "Player B", but will provide enough defense to win games.

agree 100%

MTar786
08-06-2011, 05:39 AM
the defensive guy would be the GOAT easily

PurpleJesus
08-06-2011, 06:22 AM
wow, those stats of imaginable players you posted are extremely scewed...with what you posted, i choose the defensive player, but in real life, i would choose a monta ellis over a ben wallace

YoungOne
08-06-2011, 06:56 AM
just lol

RLundi
08-06-2011, 10:54 AM
Thread should be titled 'Offensive Juggernaut vs Defensive GOD.'