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nithanyo
07-14-2011, 05:21 PM
Aaron hill isnt hitting the ball the way we want him to. From the looks of it AA isnt going to pick up his option.

I dont think we are too deep at the position in the minors either. Considering that what are our options for a second baseman in 2012? The Manny Mayorson guy is hitting fairly well in AAA the last couple of season.

Sidenote: Jose Reyes played 43 games at second in 2004. :pray:

North Yorker
07-14-2011, 05:30 PM
I have been on the Jason Kipnis train for a while. I have no idea why CLE hasnt called him up yet.

An idea I had a week or so ago was Snider for Kipnis and Pestano.

CLE needs a OF bat, especially with Choo on the shelf, and we need a 2B and a CL.

This keeps Thames out of the DH spot, and filles 2 major long term holes on our roster.

JMac4PM
07-14-2011, 07:06 PM
season aint over yet so dont put a nail in Hills coffin just yet...

Luca68
07-14-2011, 07:21 PM
exactly the mans still gotta shot to prove himself.

GNick
07-14-2011, 07:21 PM
I remember thinking Brandon Phillips would make ideal 2b here when the Reds were in town last month. Given his speed and power on our fast turf. Phillips has a 12 m option for next year and free agent after 2012, may entice the Reds more to trade him. They need starting pitching and we could include Hill. I'd try to get Hernandez included in trade and flip him with one of our better bullpen arms for Romo.

Bombtista
07-14-2011, 07:25 PM
2 RBI single for Hill. lets keep him :)

but no, i say we make that call at the end of the season

town123
07-14-2011, 07:42 PM
I remember thinking Brandon Phillips would make ideal 2b here when the Reds were in town last month. Given his speed and power on our fast turf. Phillips has a 12 m option for next year and free agent after 2012, may entice the Reds more to trade him. They need starting pitching and we could include Hill. I'd try to get Hernandez included in trade and flip him with one of our better bullpen arms for Romo.

If Brandon Phillips is Joey Votto's bestest friend in the whole wide world.....

then get a deal done this offseason so we can grease the way for Joey to come home.

es0terik
07-14-2011, 07:51 PM
I say we should trade our entire team for Robinson Cano.

es0terik
07-14-2011, 07:52 PM
Or we somehow poison the Yankees Gatorade, have them lose 65 of the next 70 games and that way Cano just won't want to pick up his option there :)

The_905
07-14-2011, 07:57 PM
Hech is MLB ready defensively, he should be called up in sept and start next year. Thus, Hech at SS and Esco to 2b.

Why the hell would AA try and sign reyes at his highest value?? 18 mill a year is what he will be looking at for at least 7 years.. We have a future perennial gold glover in Hech and because of his value on defense we can wait on his bat.

Babba Ganoush
07-14-2011, 09:34 PM
I cant believe that you have so much confidence in Hech's bat. Looking at his numbers it would seem like he would struggle to even bat .150 in the majors. Even if he has Gold Glove defence, if he cant get at least some ability with the bat, he'll be lucky to get a career like Johnny Mac.

Krylian
07-14-2011, 10:34 PM
Hech's bat is a mess. He needs another year at least in the minors to work on it.

Hill is not an option as far as I'm concerned. If he does well somewhere else, then good for him. I think he needs a change of scenery...and so do we.

Wouldn't surprise me to see AA try to acquire a good young 2B via trade. Not sure who though.

B-Ray
07-14-2011, 11:01 PM
2012 free agent second basemen:
(as per this site (http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2001/04/potential-free-agents-for-2012.html))


Clint Barmes HOU
Willie Bloomquist ARI *
Orlando Cabrera CLE
Robinson Cano NYY *
Jamey Carroll LAD
Luis Castillo NYM
Alex Cora WAS
Craig Counsell MIL
Mark Ellis OAK
Jerry Hairston Jr. WAS
Omar Infante FLA
Joe Inglett HOU
Kelly Johnson ARI
Adam Kennedy SEA
Felipe Lopez TB
Jose Lopez FLA
Aaron Miles LAD
Brandon Phillips CIN *

* means their contract includes a 2012 option

Some decent names on that list.

JaysFan87
07-14-2011, 11:08 PM
nothing in FA is worth spending money on and if you cant get someone via trade that you can project and has an upside then I wouldnt be opposed to being hill back on a 1+1 type contract where if he succeeds then there is an option the jays can pick up and if he doesnt well then he doesnt. Again only if there is no 2B with a track record with at least some upside.

Jay
07-14-2011, 11:11 PM
Buy low on Kelly Johnson and hope it pans out like Escobar did for us.

JaysFan87
07-14-2011, 11:16 PM
Buy low on Kelly Johnson and hope it pans out like Escobar did for us.

Johnson is Aaron Hill 2.0 of 2010 & 2011 with a better walk rate. Dont think he is someone u want on a championship team.

B-Ray
07-14-2011, 11:19 PM
Johnson has more power than Hill.

JoeyBats
07-14-2011, 11:55 PM
Looks like we could very likely have the same problems with 2nd base next season that we had with 3rd base this season. Let's just trade for/sign Reyes and we'll be all set ;)

riderfan60
07-14-2011, 11:58 PM
Johnson has more power than Hill.

I respectfully disagree. Hill hit 62 hr's in 09/10, how many did Johnson hit?

B-Ray
07-15-2011, 12:08 AM
Hill Slugging % 2009: .499, 2010: .394, 2011: 328
Johnson Slugging % 2009: .389, 2010: .496, 2011: .440

This season Hill has 4 HR compared to Johnson's 16.

GNick
07-16-2011, 09:21 AM
Buy low on Kelly Johnson and hope it pans out like Escobar did for us.

That is a strong possibly. Especially with AA known to like Johnson before.

With both Hill and Johnson having off year maybe flip one for another?

StayOnBoard
07-16-2011, 09:29 AM
That is a strong possibly. Especially with AA known to like Johnson before.

With both Hill and Johnson having off year maybe flip one for another?

I think it would take more from our side... but even if we had to throw in a lower level prospect I'd do it (not anyone of importance though).

I'm not a huge Johnson fan but he does have some pop and he's been much better after his horrid start to the season. He'll never have a high batting average and Im sure we'll grow frustrated with him as fans :) All that aside, Hill has really not been good at all and I have no interest in having the patience to let him work it out. Somewhere inside there - was a 30+ 100 RBI 2nd baseman who can hit .300. I'd like that Aaron Hill again - maybe a change of scenery for both can do them well... and in which case I'll wish Hill all the luck :)

GNick
07-16-2011, 10:56 AM
Phillips has a bigger name than Johnson, and Johnson is a very streaky hitter, averaged out over long haul Johnson's OPS is .792 to Phillips .747 and Johnson's WAR is 2.4 to Phillips .8.

Jay
07-16-2011, 11:20 AM
Johnson has had three full seasons where he's batted .275+. I mean, he's not exactly Jeff Francouer lol.

Valleyfella
07-16-2011, 11:37 AM
I wouldn't mind seeing Bautista stay at third and Lawrie play second next year. I know they don't want to keep jerking these guys around, but the jays have a glut of good young outfielders who need to play.

Escobar - ss
Thames - lf
Bautista - 3b
Lind -1b
Snyder -rf
Lawrie - 2b
Encarnacion or whoever - dh
Arencibia - c
Davis - cf

Luca68
07-16-2011, 12:16 PM
^this would not be bad also

Jay
07-16-2011, 12:37 PM
Lawrie doesn't have the glove to project to a second baseman anymore. He's destined for a corner outfield spot, I don't care what you guys say otherwise.

fatkev78
07-16-2011, 12:39 PM
JJ Hardy just signed an extension with the O's, so scratch that idea.

broncosfan_101
07-16-2011, 01:51 PM
Lawrie doesn't have the glove to project to a second baseman anymore. He's destined for a corner outfield spot, I don't care what you guys say otherwise.

Jim Callis said Lawrie's found a home at 3B, so I'll trust him over you. K thx.

Turn Aaron back into the hitter he was in his first 3 years, hitting line drives and not trying to lift everything out of the park. Dwayne Murphy is ruining his career.

leafswin2011
07-16-2011, 03:38 PM
if lawrie comes up and plays a decent third base the only position we really need to look at is second base...with bautista going back to the outfield hopefully with snider and thames.that leaves a middle infield spot open, if we got reyes not only would we have one of the best leadoff men in the majors we would possibly have one of the best infields,and maybe one of the best offences in the leage 1 through 9.i still think we need to add a veteran ace to the staff and probably a great closer before we have a chance at doing what tampa has done for the last few years and thats at least compete in this division.a lineup of 1.reyes 2.escobar 3.bautista 4.lind 5.thames 6.snider 7.JPA 8.lawrie 9.either encarnacion or davis...im hoping lawrie will be a good #5 hitter for us eventually but you never know so i put him batting 8th until you see what he can do...i think this lineup would be a HUGE step up from what we started with this year.let me know what you think

bomber0104
07-16-2011, 04:31 PM
At this point, if anyone is looking for Hill to rebound has surely not been following the Jays enough.. the dude has lost it and barring a huge overhaul of his swing and approach, he isn't gonna get it back..

Obviously 2B isn't the deepest position out there but you definitely don't pick up the options on Hill. If you can't find other options, offer him a contract in 5 million range based solely on his defense at 2B and bat him 9th in the lineup

Jay
07-16-2011, 06:12 PM
Jim Callis said Lawrie's found a home at 3B, so I'll trust him over you. K thx.

Turn Aaron back into the hitter he was in his first 3 years, hitting line drives and not trying to lift everything out of the park. Dwayne Murphy is ruining his career.




By Conor Dowley

A very common theme in the prospect world is the question of where will a player ultimately play? While every prospect has a position that he played primarily in high school or college, the picture for him once he becomes a professional is rarely so black and white. One team won't see a player's end position the same way as another. So how does a team determine where a guy winds up?

At first, you'll see a player stick to the position they were playing when they entered the organization. This lets the player get comfortable and it also allows the team a more in-depth, everyday look at his skills in the field. Once a team feels like they have a good feel for a player's defensive talents, they'll start making judgments on where he fits best.

Obviously, different positions require different skills and this is rarely more obvious than in the infield. Shortstop is the most demanding of all the defensive positions. It requires good range, a strong arm, good instincts on what to do as soon as the ball comes off the bat, and physical fluidity. Third base needs the instincts and the arm, and to a lesser extent, a shortstop's range. Second base needs the range, especially moving laterally, and good physical actions, if not the fluidity of a shortstop.

So where does that leave a player like Brett Lawrie? A top prospect in the Toronto Blue Jays' system, thanks to what could be a premium bat, Lawrie had been a second baseman while with the Milwaukee Brewers. His defense, however, rarely received more than a tepid review. He's not a bad athlete, but his stiff actions and poor lateral movement left him as a well-below-average defender at second. The Blue Jays promptly moved him to third base, where his strong arm fit better, and the impact of his weaker physical actions and range was minimized. He's still only viewed as an average defender at third at best, and many see him eventually moving to right field, where his arm and athleticism ought to play well.

The Seattle Mariners made an interesting decision almost two years ago. Dustin Ackley played first base in college while recovering from Tommy John surgery, but he was viewed by many as an outfielder thanks to his athleticism and instincts. He could possibly have even been a center fielder -- a premium defensive position. The M's went in a different direction, moving Ackley to second base at the start of spring training in 2010, seeing his athleticism and bat playing well there. The adjustment has been a long and difficult one for Ackley, with many cringe-inducing reports of his defense coming out last year.

While the reports were better in 2011, it was rarely said that he would be an average second baseman. Now that he's in the majors, however, the pressure for him to push and impress defensively seems to be off, and that freedom seems to have given him a boost in the field. While Ackley still only seems like a decent defender, if he can maintain his recent performance at second, it should be sufficient to let him become a better-than-average bat at the position in Seattle’s lineup.

That brings us to the final point: a player's offense. While physical skills would ideally be the only determining factor when deciding a player's role, the reality is that teams expect different levels of offense from different positions. Shortstop and catcher are glove-first positions, and it is not unusual to see below-average bats at those spots -- especially in the lower levels of the minor leagues. On the other end of the spectrum is first base and, to a lesser extent, left field. Those are considered bat-first positions -- sometimes even bat-only at first base. So projected offense is much more important at those positions when a team is evaluating a prospect's future. In order to be taken seriously as a prospect, a guy who is limited to first base has to project as a middle-of-the-order hitter and be an impact bat.

A good example of this is the debate we saw in some circles surrounding two first basemen in Triple-A Omaha for the Royals: Eric Hosmer and Clint Robinson. Hosmer was widely acknowledged as a premium prospect, but Robinson was actually outhitting him. But while Robinson was doing well in Triple-A, he was the type of “professional” hitter that at his age should be doing well in Triple-A. At the same time, he did not project well at all in the majors. These guys often wind up falling into the “Quadruple-A” player category: too good for the minors, but not good enough for the majors. Now Hosmer is in the majors, and Robinson is still toiling away in Omaha, and doesn't seem likely to get a shot because he's a limited defender without the projection to make an impact with his bat.

So when you're looking at your favorite prospect of the moment, and wondering how he could fit in your organization's plans, keep in mind that there are a lot of determining factors. Some involve his physical skills in the field, some with the bat. The picture isn't always as clear as it might appear, and often requires multiple looks from multiple perspectives, and even then, sometimes even the best get it wrong.


Opinions from BA are not Gospel.


K Thnx Bye.

13Lawrie13
07-16-2011, 07:33 PM
Opinions from BA are not Gospel.


K Thnx Bye.

John Sickels said Lawrie will stick at 3rd.

/argument.

TO Rapz
07-16-2011, 08:45 PM
Opinions from BA are not Gospel.


K Thnx Bye.

:laugh:

Luca68
07-16-2011, 08:47 PM
a lot of sass right there haha

The_905
07-16-2011, 11:00 PM
Neil Walker would look great in a Jays jers

nithanyo
07-17-2011, 01:25 AM
i think hill can still hit but like bomber said he needs to rework his swing. i always thought it was pretty long. the older he gets he should shorten his swing and go back to being a line drive/gap hitter. the power thing was a fluke.

otherwise a change of scenery is required

Pride
07-17-2011, 02:04 AM
Honestly, Dwayne Murphy is ruining Hill. He just doesn't seem to have an approach at the plate anymore. Every day he seems to have a slightly different swing. Murphy is just not your ideal hitting coach.

StayOnBoard
07-17-2011, 07:33 AM
Neil Walker would look great in a Jays jers

Would he ever :drool:

Pirates want to ADD players though - not remove them... especially given they're in 1st for the first time in a really long time (at least, this late in the year)

T.O. Fan
07-17-2011, 09:51 AM
Phillips would be at the top of my wish list, but he'd cost a lot to trade for and they would have to sign him to an immediate extension.

Rickie Weeks is another one, but with Fielder probably leaving via FA the Brewers would be unlikely to move him.

Kipnis is definitely a guy I'd want the Jays to go after.

Krylian
07-17-2011, 10:18 AM
Jose Reyes. He's elite and is young enough that he'll be very good for years.

Lind
Reyes
Escobar
Lawrie

*boner city*

13Lawrie13
07-17-2011, 10:46 AM
Jose Reyes. He's elite and is young enough that he'll be very good for years.

Lind
Reyes
Escobar
Lawrie

*boner city*

I think you're missing someone.

town123
07-17-2011, 10:50 AM
I think you're missing someone.

Who else is he missing from the infield?

13Lawrie13
07-17-2011, 10:57 AM
Who else is he missing from the infield?

Wow, I completely misread that.

I thought he was listing the core players. :facepalm:

My bad. :p

Jay
07-17-2011, 01:26 PM
i think hill can still hit but like bomber said he needs to rework his swing. i always thought it was pretty long. the older he gets he should shorten his swing and go back to being a line drive/gap hitter. the power thing was a fluke.

otherwise a change of scenery is required

He's lost his identity as a hitter, as well as any ounce of power/torque in his swing. It HAS TO BE a mechanical/fundamental flaw in his whole approach that can be tweaked.

The fact that Dwayne Murphy hasn't picked up on it yet, nor had Hill transition the necessary changes effectively into his game speaks volumes about the job he's done for us this season.

McJoe
07-17-2011, 01:55 PM
For the record, I think Lawrie's future should be in center. A position of need, great athlete, great speed, good arm, doesn't need to field a ball on every play, speed covers a lot of ground, and he'd kind of be a 5 tool type guy if he kept his average up and learned the glovework properly. Whether he can stick at 3rd or not remains to be seen but his athleticism will keep him in the field somewhere regardless.

Looking at 2nd base for next season, I think it will still ultimately be Hill. I might be wrong but I think its only a 1 year option at a time thing and his defence is still at least league average (at least that's what I take from the violent fluctuations) with the potential to be higher like it was in 06. Then just hope that his bat comes back somehow. He's probably done though without a change of scenery. When someone like Hech takes his job away from him or forces him out, that's when he will be gone IMO.

broncosfan_101
07-17-2011, 02:04 PM
The Kipnis talk probably needs to die. The guy's a top 40 prospect, and we don't have any rental options with real value. Patterson? Encarnacion? Frasor? Camp? Put them all together and pay for all of their remaining salaries and it's still not even close.

MAYBE we can try to sell high on Villanueva for him, or try to convince the Indians that Jo-Jo will be a 4.25 xFIP guy outside of the AL East, but even then, we're kicking in something else significant-ish. It's not like Valbuena, Phelps and O.Cabrera are really making the organization forget about this kid.

bartron_44
07-19-2011, 02:39 PM
Screw not going after him because his value is at an all time high, if all it takes is dollars to get Jose Reyes in a Jays uni for the next 5 or 6 years, then I say give him the loot!!! while everyone else bids on Fielder and Pujols, concentrate all efforts on signing Jose Reyes.

Before you say he isn't worth the money, ask yourself these questions:

How many SS's have an OPS over .900? 1
How many SS's have a SLG% over .525? 1
how many SS's have a BA over .320? 1
How many SS's have an OBP over .380? 1
How many SS's walk more then they K? 1
How many SS's already have 30SB's? 1
How many players have double digit triples? 1
How many SS's have already scored over 60 runs? 1

If we ever want to win a world series, this is the kind of player we need to go after.

bomber0104
07-19-2011, 02:51 PM
For the record, I think Lawrie's future should be in center. A position of need, great athlete, great speed, good arm, doesn't need to field a ball on every play, speed covers a lot of ground, and he'd kind of be a 5 tool type guy if he kept his average up and learned the glovework properly. Whether he can stick at 3rd or not remains to be seen but his athleticism will keep him in the field somewhere regardless.

Looking at 2nd base for next season, I think it will still ultimately be Hill. I might be wrong but I think its only a 1 year option at a time thing and his defence is still at least league average (at least that's what I take from the violent fluctuations) with the potential to be higher like it was in 06. Then just hope that his bat comes back somehow. He's probably done though without a change of scenery. When someone like Hech takes his job away from him or forces him out, that's when he will be gone IMO.

if Hill comes back.. it better be on another deal. there is no reason to pay a guy 12 million dollars for his defense alone

nithanyo
07-19-2011, 02:52 PM
For the record, I think Lawrie's future should be in center. A position of need, great athlete, great speed, good arm, doesn't need to field a ball on every play, speed covers a lot of ground, and he'd kind of be a 5 tool type guy if he kept his average up and learned the glovework properly. Whether he can stick at 3rd or not remains to be seen but his athleticism will keep him in the field somewhere regardless.

Looking at 2nd base for next season, I think it will still ultimately be Hill. I might be wrong but I think its only a 1 year option at a time thing and his defence is still at least league average (at least that's what I take from the violent fluctuations) with the potential to be higher like it was in 06. Then just hope that his bat comes back somehow. He's probably done though without a change of scenery. When someone like Hech takes his job away from him or forces him out, that's when he will be gone IMO.

i think that would be an amazing idea, considering Bautista doesnt mind staying as the full time 3B. Sign Fielder to platoon DH/1B with Lind and we are set offensively for the forseeable future. I wouldnt mind resingning Hill if we can do that.

Escobar SS
Thames LF
Bautista 3B
Fielder 1B/Dh
Lind DH/1B
Lawrie CF
Snider RF
Arencibia C
Hill 2B

bomber0104
07-19-2011, 02:53 PM
The Kipnis talk probably needs to die. The guy's a top 40 prospect, and we don't have any rental options with real value. Patterson? Encarnacion? Frasor? Camp? Put them all together and pay for all of their remaining salaries and it's still not even close.

MAYBE we can try to sell high on Villanueva for him, or try to convince the Indians that Jo-Jo will be a 4.25 xFIP guy outside of the AL East, but even then, we're kicking in something else significant-ish. It's not like Valbuena, Phelps and O.Cabrera are really making the organization forget about this kid.

I would call the Indians and offer Thames and Reyes (maybe villanueva) for Kipnis. The Indians need OF help with Sizemore and Choo out for a while. They could also use a starter.. as sad as it is, Reyes would be their 3rd best starter

I love thames, but we already have the corners filled with Snider and Bautista so there is no room for him out there

T.O. Fan
07-19-2011, 03:05 PM
Screw not going after him because his value is at an all time high, if all it takes is dollars to get Jose Reyes in a Jays uni for the next 5 or 6 years, then I say give him the loot!!! while everyone else bids on Fielder and Pujols, concentrate all efforts on signing Jose Reyes.

Before you say he isn't worth the money, ask yourself these questions:

How many SS's have an OPS over .900? 1
How many SS's have a SLG% over .525? 1
how many SS's have a BA over .320? 1
How many SS's have an OBP over .380? 1
How many SS's walk more then they K? 1
How many SS's already have 30SB's? 1
How many players have double digit triples? 1
How many SS's have already scored over 60 runs? 1

If we ever want to win a world series, this is the kind of player we need to go after.

Would Reyes play 2B or would you move Yunel there assuming Lawrie sticks at 3B at least in the short term?

I'm a fan of Reyes. I'm just a little gun shy about the Jays giving any player $20 mil / year over 6-8 years after the Wells contract.

Jay
07-19-2011, 03:11 PM
Everyone's intent on pushing Thames out the door now that he's up with the big club (seemingly for good) and having success. It's sad, actually.

Luca68
07-19-2011, 03:13 PM
^its terrible

T.O. Fan
07-19-2011, 03:16 PM
Everyone's intent on pushing Thames out the door now that he's up with the big club (seemingly for good) and having success. It's sad, actually.


^its terrible

I don't necessarily agree that this is the case.

I think most posters on here realize that Snider and Thames are both LF long term and are looking at the Jays possibility to use one of those guys in a trade to bring back a player who could fill a long term need.

I don't think Thames gets mentioned anymore or less than Snider.

North Yorker
07-19-2011, 03:18 PM
I don't necessarily agree that this is the case.

I think most posters on here realize that Snider and Thames are both LF long term and are looking at the Jays possibility to use one of those guys in a trade to bring back a player who could fill a long term need.

I don't think Thames gets mentioned anymore or less than Snider.

This. Not to mention that Thames would be a "Sell High" candidate that AA likes to deal>> see Marcum & Wells

JaysFan87
07-19-2011, 09:21 PM
I would call the Indians and offer Thames and Reyes (maybe villanueva) for Kipnis. The Indians need OF help with Sizemore and Choo out for a while. They could also use a starter.. as sad as it is, Reyes would be their 3rd best starter

I love thames, but we already have the corners filled with Snider and Bautista so there is no room for him out there

I think they laugh at that offer and move on.

Big Hurt
07-20-2011, 08:22 AM
NO to signing an injury prone Reyes to a $17 million/year contract.
I think we can trade for a solid 2B, or have Hill come back as a low risk low salary short term contract. Hill will be in no position to demand big bucks and he is a good defensive 2nd baseman with great base running instincts. We are not happy with Hill because we know what he used to hit like. Could Hill have been boosting his power before the real testing began??? Who is to say but it looks a little suspicious from here.
Assuming Jose goes back to RF, and then some combo of Thames, Snider, Davis, and I still hold out hope for Adam Loewen will form the OF.
We will need to find a back-up catcher to JP, keep Lind and Jose healthy and perhaps add one offensive piece.
To me SP is a mess and the bullpen will need re-done.
Not convinced Drabek, Reyes, or Cecil are worthy of MLB jobs in 2012. That only leaves Ricky, Morrow, and Carlos and 2 holes to fill. That is if we are 100% healthy.
Place trust in AA and don't spend for a moody Reyes.

nithanyo
07-20-2011, 11:37 AM
Everyone's intent on pushing Thames out the door now that he's up with the big club (seemingly for good) and having success. It's sad, actually.

I think the reason people are high on Snider is because of his draft status. Snider was a first rounder while Thames was picked in the 7th round.

Thames however was supposed to go in the first round to the yankees but a knee injury set him back and fell back in the draft. IMO talent wise these two are similar now that thames is healthy. He has adjusted to the majors well. Thames seems to have a power stroke while Sniders power is MIA.

We dont have enough of a sample on either of these guys to make them guraranteed full time major leaguers but this is Sniders 3rd year in the majors. He better get his act together quick if he plans on sticking around. He has however been hitting well since his call up but when he was comming through the system his power was his biggest asset.

nithanyo
07-20-2011, 11:38 AM
This. Not to mention that Thames would be a "Sell High" candidate that AA likes to deal>> see Marcum & Wells

he doesnt even have 3 months in the majors, i dont understand how a rookie can have sell high value. if anything snider would be a sell high candidate since he is hitting fairly well since his callup

leafswin2011
07-24-2011, 11:46 PM
Screw not going after him because his value is at an all time high, if all it takes is dollars to get Jose Reyes in a Jays uni for the next 5 or 6 years, then I say give him the loot!!! while everyone else bids on Fielder and Pujols, concentrate all efforts on signing Jose Reyes.

Before you say he isn't worth the money, ask yourself these questions:

How many SS's have an OPS over .900? 1
How many SS's have a SLG% over .525? 1
how many SS's have a BA over .320? 1
How many SS's have an OBP over .380? 1
How many SS's walk more then they K? 1
How many SS's already have 30SB's? 1
How many players have double digit triples? 1
How many SS's have already scored over 60 runs? 1
If we ever want to win a world series, this is the kind of player we need to go after.

i agree 200 percent....i think if you get reyes and a great closer on this team we could content for a playoff spot next year if our young players get better.
an infield of lind,lawrie,JPa reyes and escobar is just sick,especially if lawrie can bat around 290 with a bit of power.an upgrade from hill to reyes isnt even that expensive considering all the contract weve dumped over the past few years

Rugger
07-25-2011, 12:34 AM
Reyes may not be that great a fit for Toronto simply for the type of contract he's going to draw. Is he really worth Carl Crawford type money?

ghost dog
07-25-2011, 04:39 AM
Yesssssssss

DVS
07-25-2011, 05:36 AM
I didn't read the entire thread, so correct me if I am wrong, but I though the plan was to let Hill go, move Escobar to second, and bring up Adeiny Hechavarria too play SS. I know Hechavarria's bat isn't great right now, but is he worth bringing up next year rather then committing long term to Reyes?

DiPasquale7
07-25-2011, 06:38 AM
I didn't read the entire thread, so correct me if I am wrong, but I though the plan was to let Hill go, move Escobar to second, and bring up Adeiny Hechavarria too play SS. I know Hechavarria's bat isn't great right now, but is he worth bringing up next year rather then committing long term to Reyes?

Maybe the best option would be to back-load a Reyes contract. That way we get him at a reasonable price for now while Hech develops a bit more - no need to rush him. And then in 2-3 years when Hech is ready, Reyes will have a lot left on his deal but hopefully will still be playing at a high level so we can get some nice assets for him in a trade. I think that may be the best case scenario for our team.

wamco
07-25-2011, 07:34 AM
Im wondering how wells was a sell high move

JaysFan87
07-25-2011, 10:29 AM
^huh?

Dol-Fan
07-25-2011, 10:38 AM
Im wondering how wells was a sell high move

Because he was coming off of his best year since 2006? You think the Angels would have made that move if he was coming off of his sexy 0.2 WAR season in 2009?

T.O. Fan
07-25-2011, 10:47 AM
Im wondering how wells was a sell high move

Wells was 3rd in OPS last year for CF in MLB.

The year previous he was 19th for CF. This year he's playing LF (less valuable position) with a line of .219/.250/.414

I would call that selling high.

leafswin2011
07-26-2011, 12:39 AM
I didn't read the entire thread, so correct me if I am wrong, but I though the plan was to let Hill go, move Escobar to second, and bring up Adeiny Hechavarria too play SS. I know Hechavarria's bat isn't great right now, but is he worth bringing up next year rather then committing long term to Reyes?

if your just picking up reyes and not losing hill contract its a lot more expensive but its only like 10 mil a year more then what hill is making and reyes will make a huge difference in my opinion.maybe not quite as much as a solid closer but i think besides pitching second base and our leadoff spot are definatly one of our weakest positions next year assuming lawrie works out

Jay
07-26-2011, 03:44 AM
Reyes may not be that great a fit for Toronto simply for the type of contract he's going to draw. Is he really worth Carl Crawford type money?

I may be biased because I've been a Reyes fan since his sophomore year (I think it was), but absolutely. They talk about Bautista having a season for the ages this year, well so is Reyes. Crawford really doesn't have an identity as a hitter, while Reyes does, and that's constantly been somewhat of an issue for him throughout his career.

With the league slowly moving towards small ball, this could work out especially well for the Jays in a division where defense can sometimes be a subject of concern. Now pitching, and I'm not just referring to our bullpen here, would still be our achilles heal in any case. It's not as if Reyes would be the last piece to our "puzzle', so to speak. However, we'd be that much closer to where we ultimately want to get to, though.