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View Full Version : How is Derek Jeter an all star?



bartron_44
07-04-2011, 02:20 PM
Fans around the world need to collectively shake their heads for vboting that old man into the ASG this year. just pathetic.

Top 3 SS's in the AL are Carbrera, Peralta and Escobar.......Jeter wouldn't even make my top 6. It's amazing how many people just blindly vote players into the game every year when they haven't done squat.

Escobar is far better defensively then Peralta at SS, but Peralta is having an unbelievable first half at the dish.....I would feel pretty screwed over if I was either one of those guys this year....

thoughts?

Do you think Escobar should have been an all-star?.....at least over Jeter?

Bob_at_york
07-04-2011, 02:29 PM
Because of his name: "Derek Jeter". Probably helps that he plays for the Yankees and has won some championships. Of course some other players deserve it over him but it is what it is.

craigerlee
07-04-2011, 02:38 PM
Its essentially a lifetime achievement award for him, hopefully its not like this every year till he retires, cause its gonna get old fast.

StayOnBoard
07-04-2011, 02:39 PM
Its because the All-star voting is a joke and more a popularity contest than anything.

No, Jeter has no business being there at all.... and yes, he probably will be until he retires (and maybe even that year too - who knows) :shrug:

Dol-Fan
07-04-2011, 02:39 PM
All those other stats are meaningless. Batting stats, fielding stats, they are worthless. Derek Jeter is the league leader in intangibles by a mile, and THAT is why he is an all-star.

mkcavy
07-04-2011, 02:58 PM
It's the "Congratulations, you're going to reach 3000 hits and retire soon" nomination to the All-Star game. It's given to the "good guys" of baseball - Just look at Cal Ripkin, all-star until he retired at age 40.

Jeter is a legend. He may not be the best SS in the AL, but I'll never say he doesn't belong at an all-star game and will glad put up with him being there for the next 2-5 years.

wamco
07-04-2011, 03:45 PM
nobody who complains watches anyhow

Nick O
07-04-2011, 04:00 PM
i think its sort of the shaquille oneal effect.... hes just had such a good career plus he plays in New york.... he may not deserve to be their this year but his great career can back up why hes there

Krylian
07-04-2011, 04:28 PM
Are you new? Voting has been this way for eons.

Nick O
07-04-2011, 04:29 PM
Are you new? Voting has been this way for eons.

this.... his name is derek jeter and he is a yankee..... there shouldent be any more questions after that :P

FlakeyFool
07-04-2011, 06:47 PM
I've never seen Derek Jeter as a "legend". He plays for the yanks, therefore he is a Legend.

wamco
07-04-2011, 06:52 PM
well that and the 3k hits

scottythegreat1
07-04-2011, 07:07 PM
Derek Jeter IS the Yankees...he has been the Yankees since 1996, and he will be the Yankees until he retires. The Yankees are HIS team. He started as a Yankee and will end as a Yankee. Posada and Rivera are going to retire in a 2/3 years and Jeter will go on for another 5. He will beat practically every Yankee record by the time he retires just because he had 20 years to do it. He will be in the hall of fame and will be talked about for as long as people watch baseball.

Thats why people vote for him to go to the All-Star game....we need a symbol of the Yankees to go along with another 4 players to keep him company (they usually get 5 or 6 players going every year). I wouldnt be surprised if every ballpark he goes to has Bob Sheppard's recording of his at-bat introduction soon.

carson005
07-04-2011, 07:12 PM
His GRiT rating is an amazing 7.14

H-MYK
07-04-2011, 07:52 PM
Its because the All-star voting is a joke and more a popularity contest than anything.



This. I hate how people constantly pick Yankee and Red Sox players when there are other players that deserve it more.

Nick O
07-04-2011, 08:38 PM
This. I hate how people constantly pick Yankee and Red Sox players when there are other players that deserve it more.

true but its different in this case i think... jete is no ordinary player even for a yankee.... but dont start him.....

FlakeyFool
07-04-2011, 09:00 PM
Jeter is a good player, but the only reason hes a "legend" is because hes a yank. If he played for the Blue Jays he wouldn't have this "legendary" status

wamco
07-04-2011, 09:06 PM
I would love to see jeter playing in 5 years.

Of course, great player, nayer says he'll go down as the worst SS fielding wise in the history of baseball though. Nonetheless, easily a first ballot HOF.

Now, will damon get 3k hits is the question.

Nick O
07-04-2011, 09:06 PM
Jeter is a good player, but the only reason hes a "legend" is because hes a yank. If he played for the Blue Jays he wouldn't have this "legendary" status

well i think 3000 hits will get you that but he certainly wouldnt be the face of baseball like he has for so many years

carson005
07-04-2011, 09:07 PM
Jeter is a good player, but the only reason hes a "legend" is because hes a yank. If he played for the Blue Jays he wouldn't have this "legendary" status

I don't know about that, 3,000 hits is outstanding no matter how you look at it. He will be only the 28th player to do it, and of the 27 who have done it 24 are in the hall of fame right now, Biggio isn't eligible for the ballot until 2013 but he will get it, and the only reason Palmeiro isn't in the hall is steroids.

Nick O
07-04-2011, 09:08 PM
I would love to see jeter playing in 5 years.

Of course, great player, nayer says he'll go down as the worst SS fielding wise in the history of baseball though. Nonetheless, easily a first ballot HOF.

Now, will damon get 3k hits is the question.

worst ....fielding shortstop in history?? hes won some gold gloves ya know :P ... they may not have been deserved to be honest cause those were given to him cause of his name.... but hes far from a bad fielder.... not as good as hes made out to be but far from bad

wamco
07-04-2011, 09:56 PM
i'm gonna go with rob neyer every single time over you, sorry. Not even close

Nick O
07-04-2011, 09:58 PM
i'm gonna go with rob neyer every single time over you, sorry. Not even close

so you agree hes the worst fielding shortstop ever? ... lol thats insane sorry

wamco
07-04-2011, 09:59 PM
70. Pyrite Glove, part 1 - Among AL shortstops who qualified, Jeter ranked dead last in Range Factor (putouts + assists divided by innings) in 2001, 2002 AND 2003.

71. Pyrite Glove, part 2 - Among AL shortstops who qualified, Jeter ranked dead last in Zone Rating in 2001, 2002 and 2003

wamco
07-04-2011, 10:00 PM
he was taking into account the time spent at the position of course. Was there a worse SS for a season? Absolutely. You do know who nayer is, right? Kinda big on the research.

Nick O
07-04-2011, 10:00 PM
70. Pyrite Glove, part 1 - Among AL shortstops who qualified, Jeter ranked dead last in Range Factor (putouts + assists divided by innings) in 2001, 2002 AND 2003.

71. Pyrite Glove, part 2 - Among AL shortstops who qualified, Jeter ranked dead last in Zone Rating in 2001, 2002 and 2003



still doesnt make him the worst ever.... plus i think errors is the more important factor

wamco
07-04-2011, 10:04 PM
Gold Glove results mixed, as usual


November, 9, 2010 11/09/103:30PM ETEmail Print Comments By Rob Neyer


I have to get this out of the way ... Yes, Derek Jeter has just won another Gold Glove.

It's his fifth, which means he's now won at least four more Gold Gloves than he's deserved. By any stretch of the fever-crazed imagination.

Just to give you an idea ... Every year, John Dewan and Baseball Info Solutions conduct their own process, the Fielding Bible Awards. There are 10 "voters" (with two of the individual voters actually amalgams, of video scouts and fans). Some of the voters are looking at the same Baseball Info Solutions numbers; I do, and I suspect that John Dewan does. But Peter Gammons votes, and he's got his own sources. Bill James votes, and he's got his own universe. Hal Richman votes, and he's got his own institution. Et cetera.

[+] EnlargeAnthony J. Causi/Icon SMI
Derek Jeter won another Gold Glove, but it doesn't appear to be based on his defensive play.The voting doesn't differentiate the leagues. Each voter is required to rank 10 shortstops. This year, 20 shortstops received at least one point in the voting.

Jeter wasn't one of them. Not a single voter thought that Jeter was even the 10th-best shortstop in the major leagues.

Of course, it's not just us. Nobody who really follows baseball believes that Jeter is an outstanding defensive player. The Yankees, who see him every day, don't believe that. The writers who cover the Yankees every day don't believe that. Frankly, I'm not sure the managers and the coaches who actually voted for Jeter believe that.

I think they keep giving him the award as a gesture of respect. In a different sort of society, they might simply bow in his presence, then kiss one of his World Series rings. Or cross themselves whenever Game 3 of the Yankees' 2001 Division Series is mentioned. Instead they somewhat mindlessly give him their Gold Glove support every year, even as everyone who's actually paying attention knows the Yankees would prevent more runs if almost anyone else were playing shortstop.

At best, it's an idiosyncratic choice. At worst, it's just another reminder that the men tasked with this award -- which many people consider serious business -- don't take it seriously. But then, we already knew, didn't we?

wamco
07-04-2011, 10:04 PM
listen man, argue it with the guy who did all the research, not me.

wamco
07-04-2011, 10:08 PM
Derek JeterIn February 2001, Neyer infuriated many New York Yankees fans when he cited metrics such as win shares and Clay Davenport's Fielding Translations to argue that Yankees shortstop Derek Jeter's defense consistently rated among the worst fielders at his position.[15] Subsequent studies and the development of advanced metrics for evaluating fielding capabilities, continued to support Neyer's evaluation and showed Jeter to be consistently among the lower ranking American League shortstops in fielding prowess.[16][17] On the other hand, managers and coachers votes continue to support the fans as Jeter has won five Gold Glove awards from 2004 to 2006 and 2009 to 2010.[18]

Neyer addressed this controversy in a recent article entitled Derek Jeter Retooling His Swing After Down Season; Let's Hope It Works. Neyer justifies his previous articles saying that "everybody was saying Jeter was perfect, and if there's one thing I know too well it's that nobody's perfect" but then added "Derek Jeter is one of the five or six greatest shortstops ever, and I'm really going to miss him when he's gone. I don't mean gone, physically. I mean gone, as an outstanding player."[19]

Nick O
07-04-2011, 10:12 PM
oh i dont think he deserved any gold gloves.... but worst fielder ever at SS... i have a problem with him sayin that

mkcavy
07-05-2011, 04:47 PM
Jeter is a good player, but the only reason hes a "legend" is because hes a yank. If he played for the Blue Jays he wouldn't have this "legendary" status

I'm pretty sure becoming only the 28th player in the history of the game to collect 3000 hits classifies him as a legend... I don't care what team he played for.