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View Full Version : Who is the best Player to never win a title?



Mobsterkel
06-14-2011, 07:23 PM
Poll is up lets vote

Swashcuff
06-14-2011, 07:24 PM
Allen Iverson :D

Don't worry he's gonna return to my 76ers next season and we going all the way baby!!!

Swashcuff
06-14-2011, 07:26 PM
Seriously thought I'd go Karl Malone then Elgin Baylor.

asandhu23
06-14-2011, 07:28 PM
I don't see a poll here.

Karl Malone, John Stockton, Len Bias

Jumba
06-14-2011, 07:29 PM
Utah duo without a doubt

69centers
06-14-2011, 07:29 PM
The Iceman & The Mailman

LJEATON26
06-14-2011, 07:31 PM
1.Malone. 2.Barkley. 3.Nash. 3 of the 6 mvps to never win a championship.

Khalifa21
06-14-2011, 07:31 PM
Karl Malone

ManRam
06-14-2011, 07:32 PM
Assuming this is retired players only because guys like LeBron, Nash etc. aren't on it.

I'll go with the Mailman.

tredigs
06-14-2011, 07:37 PM
I'll assume the omission of Lebron is a bait on Heat fans, or just a reactionary living-in-the-moment statement? Non-retired players omitted, maybe?

Either way, it's Lebron or Barkley - then Malone. Sometimes people forget how truly dominant Barkley was for a full decade there - even in the playoffs despite losses to other great teams. I remember when Magic was giving his speech during the induction of the "Dream Team" to the Hall of Fame a year or two ago - he flat out said that Barkley was the teams best player.

NYMetros
06-14-2011, 07:43 PM
Malone, then Nash, then Barkley.

asandhu23
06-14-2011, 07:45 PM
I'll assume the omission of Lebron is a bait on Heat fans, or just a reactionary living-in-the-moment statement?

you are stretching it, tre.

m26555
06-14-2011, 07:45 PM
I think some of you are really underestimating Elgin Baylor here. He put up RIDICULOUS numbers.

Mobsterkel
06-14-2011, 07:45 PM
People tend to forget how good john stockton was he has the Assist Record is 15,806 next closest is J Kidd at 11,578 and steals at 3,265 Jordon is second at 2,514 , and how much he made his team better, I say he and malone and then Elgin Baylor are the best to never win a title

ManRam
06-14-2011, 07:47 PM
I think some of you are really underestimating Elgin Baylor here. He put up RIDICULOUS numbers.

If LeBron is a choke artist, what is Baylor?

Seriously...

m26555
06-14-2011, 07:49 PM
If LeBron is a choke artist, what is Baylor?

Seriously...
Never said he wasn't, but the title of this thread is "best player to never win a title."

And you complain about LeBron being brought up all the time, yet you constantly mention him. :laugh2:

desertrat218
06-14-2011, 07:50 PM
I have to go with Pat Ewing. It's a shame the Knicks never surrounded him with any decent players. I see a lot of people going with Karl Malone but I can't even mention him without mentioning John Stockton. The two of them made each other great, the most effective pick and roll I've seen. Pat had nobody.

m26555
06-14-2011, 07:51 PM
I have to go with Pat Ewing. It's a shame the Knicks never surrounded him with any decent players. I see a lot of people going with Karl Malone but I can't even mention him without mentioning John Stockton. The two of them made each other great, the most effective pick and roll I've seen. Pat had nobody.
Ewing was so damn underrated it's sad.

THE GIPPER
06-14-2011, 07:51 PM
nash and lebron deserve to atleast be on the poll

desertrat218
06-14-2011, 07:51 PM
Never said he wasn't, but the title of this thread is "best player to never win a title."

And you complain about LeBron being brought up all the time, yet you constantly mention him. :laugh2:

Lebron should be on this list until he actually does win.

m26555
06-14-2011, 07:52 PM
Lebron should be on this list until he actually does win.
I'm assuming the OP meant retired players. Either way, it still isn't LeBron.

Swashcuff
06-14-2011, 07:52 PM
I think some of you are really underestimating Elgin Baylor here. He put up RIDICULOUS numbers.

With low efficiency.

Even so there are articles that speak of how great he really was. He was a phenom and is one of the greatest players to ever do it.

Mobsterkel
06-14-2011, 07:53 PM
J kidd would have to average 12.5 assists for almost 5 years to beat that record that is going to be hard to do. considering his assist average has been going down he averaged 8.2 assists a game this year. he said he plans on playing 2 more seasons 3 at max

Hawkeye15
06-14-2011, 07:54 PM
LeBron doesn't need to be on this poll, he is still active. These guys are done (sorry AI).

Malone easily

m26555
06-14-2011, 07:54 PM
LeBron doesn't need to be on this poll, he is still active. These guys are done (sorry AI).

Malone easily
I won't argue with you for picking Malone, but easily?

Mobsterkel
06-14-2011, 07:55 PM
Stockton's assist record will never be broken. Lebron and Nash are not on the list because they are still active players

ManRam
06-14-2011, 07:55 PM
Never said he wasn't, but the title of this thread is "best player to never win a title."

And you complain about LeBron being brought up all the time, yet you constantly mention him. :laugh2:

I wasn't attacking you, it's a serious question. LeBron should be brought up, unless the OP failed to mention this is not a list of active players. He's already top 3-5 on this list.

Dude got to 8 title games and lost them all. That's gotta mean something.

No way is Elgin ahead of Malone, Barkley or Stockton...

Swashcuff
06-14-2011, 07:55 PM
LeBron doesn't need to be on this poll, he is still active. These guys are done (sorry AI).

Malone easily

:mad:

He's not done he's just on a vacation.

He'll win his first NBA Finals MVP next season. BOOK IT!!!

jk

D-Will4Prez
06-14-2011, 07:58 PM
This is damn hard, I can't choose between Stockton and Malone...both players are equally great. I mean, how do you choose between the all-time best PG and the all-time best PF?

Sorry Chuck.

EDIT: I went with Stockton over Malone because he was my childhood hero, me being a skinny white kid ^^

Cano4prez
06-14-2011, 08:07 PM
This is damn hard, I can't choose between Stockton and Malone...both players are equally great. I mean, how do you choose between the all-time best PG and the all-time best PF?

Sorry Chuck.

EDIT: I went with Stockton over Malone because he was my childhood hero, me being a skinny white kid ^^

Magic Johnson played for the Lakers


Tim Duncan is currently a lifelong Spur

desertrat218
06-14-2011, 08:21 PM
LeBron doesn't need to be on this poll, he is still active. These guys are done (sorry AI).

Malone easily

The way I see it is the fact that Malone and Stockton played together and never won a title hurts them both for a claim of greatest player to never win a title compared to these other guys that had no hall of fame teammates.

BadBoyPistons
06-14-2011, 08:25 PM
Malone & Stockton are the most obvious two. But imo Barkley deserves some consideration also.

Mobsterkel
06-14-2011, 08:38 PM
Duncan I would say is more of a center that took the of position because of robinson and magic may have more titles but stockton I think is the top pg hands down magic even said it himself. He has the all time assist and steals record. Think if jordon stayed retired he might have two or three rings.

LA_Raiders
06-14-2011, 08:49 PM
My boy Baylor dang...

Bruno
06-14-2011, 08:50 PM
Assuming this is retired players only because guys like LeBron, Nash etc. aren't on it.

I'll go with the Mailman.

x2.

tredigs
06-14-2011, 09:10 PM
I see a lot of Malone here. Is the question who is the best player not to win a ship, or which player had the best career never to have won?

If it's the former, then you guys are probably underestimating just how dominant of an all around player a prime Chuck Barkley was. One of the best rebounders I've ever seen, could attack/score at will, and played surprisingly good defense before he got thicker and slower in his 30's. But those 8 years in Philly and early on in Phoenix? Guy was incredible; averaged around 26/12/4 on 58% shooting for about a decade, was the leading scorer/arguably best player on Dream Team 1 (so says Magic), and was just generally more explosive and a better player basketball player than Malone (far from a slouch, but the head to heads always highlighted Chuck as the better player, and a lot of times it wasn't close).

Doesn't hurt Charles' case that he never had a Sloan+Stockton and was doing all this at 6'4".

haggis
06-14-2011, 09:13 PM
It's a toss up between Malone and Barkley for me.

Tredigs makes a great point that Barkley never had Stockton getting him the ball, so I guess that gives him a very slight edge in my eyes. Barkley was an incredible player, considering his size. Once he lost his college weight he was as athletic a post presence as you could want (unfortunately he gained it all back before he was done playing).

Jewelz0376
06-14-2011, 09:28 PM
I see a lot of Malone here. Is the question who is the best player not to win a ship, or which player had the best career never to have won?

If it's the former, then you guys are probably underestimating just how dominant of an all around player a prime Chuck Barkley was. One of the best rebounders I've ever seen, could attack/score at will, and played surprisingly good defense before he got thicker and slower in his 30's. But those 8 years in Philly and early on in Phoenix? Guy was incredible; averaged around 26/12/4 on 58% shooting for about a decade, was the leading scorer/arguably best player on Dream Team 1 (so says Magic), and was just generally more explosive and a better player basketball player than Malone (far from a slouch, but the head to heads always highlighted Chuck as the better player, and a lot of times it wasn't close).

Doesn't hurt Charles' case that he never had a Sloan+Stockton and was doing all this at 6'4".

Barkley was great..but Malone was better... He was first team all nba 11 times compared to Barkley who was 1st team 5 times...Barkley was obviously the better rebounder but Malone was a better defender...Malone made some all defensive teams....while Barkley none...Even Barkley as admitted several times he wasn't that great of a defender...He wasn't a trash defender but not as good as Malone...

Without Stockton Malone might not have the numbers he had but we'll never know...

Arguing who is a better player as apposed to who had the better career is simply a matter of opinion...And I would imagine most people on here aren't old enough to really see either players in the prime for more than a couple yrs..so the only thing to really go off of is career numbers

tredigs
06-14-2011, 10:11 PM
Barkley was great..but Malone was better... He was first team all nba 11 times compared to Barkley who was 1st team 5 times...Barkley was obviously the better rebounder but Malone was a better defender...Malone made some all defensive teams....while Barkley none...Even Barkley as admitted several times he wasn't that great of a defender...He wasn't a trash defender but not as good as Malone...

Without Stockton Malone might not have the numbers he had but we'll never know...

Arguing who is a better player as apposed to who had the better career is simply a matter of opinion...And I would imagine most people on here aren't old enough to really see either players in the prime for more than a couple yrs..so the only thing to really go off of is career numbers

Can't just look at All-Defensive teams or All-NBA teams to conclude who a better player was, especially when I'm talking about both players in their prime (luckily, both these guys played the same position at the same time, so for once we can make solid comparisons). Malone was a player who was always in pristine shape, and it paid off in a long, highly productive career. But again, I'm looking at both players at their very best.

If anyone isn't old enough to remember these guys primes, luckily we now have YouTube - and it's still possible -

Here: Young Barkley vs. the legendary late 80's Celtics with prime Bird/McHale/Parish (the true Big Three). Barkley dominates them; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJZYTkjnDlU, final play being him versus Bird in a 1v1. Barkley plays great D, denies the potential winning shot and they take the game while putting up 28/18/6 and 3stls/4blks (plennnty of cut games out there to watch on Youtube of the 80's/90's teams. Not just highlight reels...). That Barkley - which lasted for many years - was a better player than Malone imo.

I was looking for a head to head stat comparison of them in their first ~10 years in the league, but it's tough to come by.

And to get back to your point, I actually do think "better career" and "better player" are two different questions (so long as a person had a prime of at least 4-5 years or so. Barkley's was around 10 - last 6 were a different Chuck, while Malone was still going strong). But IMO this difference is especially true if the two players in question played in the same era, at the same position and against the same defenses. We are able to see how they compared against the league in their prime (and eachother).

Mobsterkel
06-15-2011, 02:15 PM
I am 24 Grew up watching barkely, stockton, malone, ewing, jordon, miller all those guys, but Stockton and Malone to me seemed to be the most consistant, 19 straight playoffs, and almost never had a loosing season in their whole career. I think it's safe to say that they might have been the players they became if they played on different teams, I think stockton may have still been an allstar player, but malone, I think grew along stockton, and became the great we know him as today. If u look at barkely, and iverson, they played for at least three different teams trying to win a title, and fell short. Stockton and Malone played all seasons except malones one mistake of joining the lakers, and all under the same coach, I think that was pretty damn remarkable.

ChicagoJ
06-15-2011, 02:45 PM
I voted for Malone, but that is a really tough list to choose from. Barkley, Malone, Stockton, and maybe Ewing are all contenders.

dtmagnet
06-15-2011, 04:21 PM
Mailman.