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JoeyBoy718
06-13-2011, 11:45 AM
We, as humans, have a tendency of living in the moment. Before this playoffs, and even this season, we weren't even thinking about Dirk. People probably assumed he just wasn't a winner. People probably didn't even have him in their top 10 in the league lists. He was overlooked. Now, as a champion, we are reevaluating his legacy. People are looking at him as the best power forward in the league and one of the top overall players in the league.

Well, it wasn't long ago when Wade nearly single handedly won the Miami Heat an NBA Finals over the Dallas Mavericks. I remember reading articles right after the win that Wade was going to be better than LeBron, the next Kobe, and closer to the next MJ than the self proclaimed king LeBron. A few years later, Wade seemed to fall off the map, just like Dirk fell off the map.

Well, now Dirk is back on the map, and bigger than he probably ever has been. But Wade seems to be falling even farther off the map. Even with the loss, all the talk seems to be about LeBron.

So my questions are: Was Wade's 2006 championship a fluke? Was the 2006 title more a result of a proven winner, Shaq? Was it not a fluke, and does Wade possess that rare MJ, Kobe championship gene? Does Wade possess the gene but the curse of LeBron outweighs even Wade's championship-ness? Or, was 2006 just a bad season for competition and somebody had to win?

SwaggaIke
06-13-2011, 11:51 AM
There's no suck thing as fluke championships in the NBA. Too many games have to be won to accomplish the goal.

dnewguy
06-13-2011, 11:54 AM
We, as humans, have a tendency of living in the moment. Before this playoffs, and even this season, we weren't even thinking about Dirk. People probably assumed he just wasn't a winner. People probably didn't even have him in their top 10 in the league lists. He was overlooked. Now, as a champion, we are reevaluating his legacy. People are looking at him as the best power forward in the league and one of the top overall players in the league.

Well, it wasn't long ago when Wade nearly single handedly won the Miami Heat an NBA Finals over the Dallas Mavericks. I remember reading articles right after the win that Wade was going to be better than LeBron, the next Kobe, and closer to the next MJ than the self proclaimed king LeBron. A few years later, Wade seemed to fall off the map, just like Dirk fell off the map.

Well, now Dirk is back on the map, and bigger than he probably ever has been. But Wade seems to be falling even farther off the map. Even with the loss, all the talk seems to be about LeBron.

So my questions are: Was Wade's 2006 championship a fluke? Was the 2006 title more a result of a proven winner, Shaq? Was it not a fluke, and does Wade possess that rare MJ, Kobe championship gene? Does Wade possess the gene but the curse of LeBron outweighs even Wade's championship-ness? Or, was 2006 just a bad season for competition and somebody had to win?

Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

La11
06-13-2011, 11:59 AM
Wade is still one of the top 2 SG in the game today. I highly doubt he was fallen off the map.

JoeyBoy718
06-13-2011, 12:00 PM
Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

This is more a thread about living in the moment than questioning Wade individually. I mentioned how all the eyes seem to be on 1) Dirk is a winner, and 2) LeBron not as a winner. I'm reminding people that a few short years ago, ALL the talk was about Wade. Since then, he has become irrelevant. But if Wade proved himself to be a true champion, that of the likes of Jordan and Kobe, in 2006, then what explains the loss to an inferior Mavericks? Does LeBron's non-winning-ness outweigh Wade's winning-ness, or have people overestimated Wade's winning-ness?

mttwlsn16
06-13-2011, 12:05 PM
Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

account...supposed to be closed

JoeyBoy718
06-13-2011, 12:10 PM
account...supposed to be closed

What is that supposed to mean? If this were a LeBron thread, it would be on page 15 by now. Yet everyone throws up a :facepalm: at every new LeBron thread, but they can't help to not comment.

Bob_at_york
06-13-2011, 12:19 PM
Wade is still one of the top 2 SG in the game today. I highly doubt he was fallen off the map.

I agree. He hasn't fallen off the map, at most he gets less publicity because Lebron is there but that doesn't mean that he still isn't one of the best players in the league.

artest_kobe
06-13-2011, 12:21 PM
why does everyone bust on lebron when all the blame should go on d-wade.

Bob_at_york
06-13-2011, 12:22 PM
This is more a thread about living in the moment than questioning Wade individually. I mentioned how all the eyes seem to be on 1) Dirk is a winner, and 2) LeBron not as a winner. I'm reminding people that a few short years ago, ALL the talk was about Wade. Since then, he has become irrelevant. But if Wade proved himself to be a true champion, that of the likes of Jordan and Kobe, in 2006, then what explains the loss to an inferior Mavericks? Does LeBron's non-winning-ness outweigh Wade's winning-ness, or have people overestimated Wade's winning-ness?

who says the mavs were inferior? :confused:

The Heat are still learning to play together. I know that sounds cliche but that is the part of the problem. It isn't about one guy's "winning-ness" factor.

koLohe2133
06-13-2011, 12:31 PM
I think wade is given too much credit for 2006.

He had a hell of a good squad then: Payton, shaq, zo, haslem, Antoine walker, payton, posey....yes I know most of them were role players at that point in their careers but I remember Payton hitting some nice running layups, posey playing great defense on dirk, walker hitting some shots.....shoot even kapono and Jason Williams had good playoff series'!

I just think wade was given so much credit because the media is always hungry for that NEXT BIG STAR! the next Jordan!

Remember everyone had Kevin durant pegged as the MVP this year after what he did on the national team.

Wade hasn't done anything without all stars next to him (Lebron, bosh, shaq). Dallas, even with only one all star has a superb supporting cast around dirk.

Hopefully the media sees and recognizes that basketball is a TEAM GAME AND you can have the best BIG 3 in the game but if you don't have the best TEAM, chemistry and coaching you won't win the ship.


And I bet on the heat in 2006. To win in 6.

ManRam
06-13-2011, 12:37 PM
Now is not the time to blame Wade. Must. Only. Blame. LeBron!!!


I'm beginning to find it hard to see how they can coexist. Both are on-the-ball players. When Wade has it and is chosen to run the play, Bron just stands in the corner and doesn't do anything. Same when the roles are switched. They just don't compliment each other perfectly. Wade can't get going to the point where he can score 40 in a game because LeBron is there and needs to be involved too. Same works the other way.

That's why, if I'm building a super team, I go PG/Wing/Big...not Wing/Wing/quasi-big.

WadeCounty
06-13-2011, 12:39 PM
in my honest opinion not trying to come up with excuses but I have to put as much blame on the coach as lebron. They have to stop taking turns and have a set number 1 player as the go to guy and spoelstra doesnt have the balls to confront them about it. Lebron's confidence was obviously shaken either give him a reason to be motivated besides saying the same stupid speeches about mental toughness/mental stability/holding on to the rope or bench him and put someone who will actually contribute and motivate him as he's sitting in the bench. There were possessions after a timeout all they were doing was just passing the ball with nobody wanting to take an open shot, the heat can't respond against a zone defense to save their life. This all points back to coaching, even as we're getting our behinds handed to us you still see spoelstra with a smile on his face what the **** is up with that? show your ****ing angry at their lack of effort or show some other type of emotion.

I continuously saw the coaches/ players giving speeches but all I saw lebron doing was staring blankly as if nothing enters his head, he kept giving speeches about playing as if your backs were against the back yet he didnt even follow his own advice.

Sly Guy
06-13-2011, 12:45 PM
people are questioning lebron and not wade because lebron was the one who didn't put up his hand when they took attendance in game 1.

Personally, I think Wade is the better player. LeBron based on his physical ability has a higher ceiling than Wade, but that hasn't changed in years. Eventually you've gotta turn potential into greatness, and LeBron hasn't taken that step to develop his game to that final level.

WadeCounty
06-13-2011, 12:47 PM
and to add to my previous post, 2006 was not a fluke and the mavs winning this year and the heat lossing is not a fluke at all as well. The mavs team completely dominated the heat, in all honesty if i was lbj I would be shaken as well. My jump shot isn't dropping and I can't drive to the lain when having chandler/dirk/marion clogging up the lane all athletic big guys that can match his athleticism. A lot of credit is due to shawn marion

JordansBulls
06-13-2011, 12:47 PM
who says the mavs were inferior? :confused:

The Heat are still learning to play together. I know that sounds cliche but that is the part of the problem. It isn't about one guy's "winning-ness" factor.

Dallas

57-25,
Coach: Rick Carlisle (57-25)

PTS/G: 100.2 (11th of 30) ? Opp PTS/G: 96.0 (10th of 30)
SRS: 4.41 (8th of 30) ? Pace: 91.3 (18th of 30)
Off Rtg: 109.7 (8th of 30) ? Def Rtg: 105.0 (8th of 30)
Expected W-L: 53-29 (8th of 30)



Miami

58-24, 1st in NBA Southeast Division (Schedule and Results)
Coach: Erik Spoelstra (58-24)

PTS/G: 102.1 (8th of 30) ? Opp PTS/G: 94.6 (6th of 30)
SRS: 6.76 (1st of 30) ? Pace: 90.9 (20th of 30)
Off Rtg: 111.7 (3rd of 30) ? Def Rtg: 103.5 (5th of 30)
Expected W-L: 61-21 (2nd of 30)


Miami had a higher SRS rating, Allowed Fewer PPG, Averaged more PPG, had a higher Expected W-L, had a higher Offensive and Defensive Rating and the Mavs were missing 3 players in Caron Butler, Rodrigue Beaubois and Brendan Haywood in the Finals.

http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2011/matchup/_/teams/mavericks-heat

8kobe24
06-13-2011, 12:52 PM
Now people understand that the "1A 1B" is not gonna work. It has to be a 1-2 punch. Questions is who's 1 who's 2?

mttwlsn16
06-13-2011, 12:58 PM
What is that supposed to mean? If this were a LeBron thread, it would be on page 15 by now. Yet everyone throws up a :facepalm: at every new LeBron thread, but they can't help to not comment.

the poster i quoted, dnewguy, had previously said if dallas wins he will delete his account. i wasnt saying to close the thread lol

Bob_at_york
06-13-2011, 01:06 PM
Dallas

57-25,
Coach: Rick Carlisle (57-25)

PTS/G: 100.2 (11th of 30) ? Opp PTS/G: 96.0 (10th of 30)
SRS: 4.41 (8th of 30) ? Pace: 91.3 (18th of 30)
Off Rtg: 109.7 (8th of 30) ? Def Rtg: 105.0 (8th of 30)
Expected W-L: 53-29 (8th of 30)



Miami

58-24, 1st in NBA Southeast Division (Schedule and Results)
Coach: Erik Spoelstra (58-24)

PTS/G: 102.1 (8th of 30) ? Opp PTS/G: 94.6 (6th of 30)
SRS: 6.76 (1st of 30) ? Pace: 90.9 (20th of 30)
Off Rtg: 111.7 (3rd of 30) ? Def Rtg: 103.5 (5th of 30)
Expected W-L: 61-21 (2nd of 30)


Miami had a higher SRS rating, Allowed Fewer PPG, Averaged more PPG, had a higher Expected W-L, had a higher Offensive and Defensive Rating and the Mavs were missing 3 players in Caron Butler, Rodrigue Beaubois and Brendan Haywood in the Finals.

http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2011/matchup/_/teams/mavericks-heat

one win separated them over the regular season. The Mavs were playing great in the playoffs heading into the finals. I did not consider them inferior. I considered them equals.

Fnom11
06-13-2011, 01:17 PM
Didn't Wade DOMINATE the Mavs defensively and offensively? Is this thread serious?

ChitownSports16
06-13-2011, 01:20 PM
Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

Then don't read! Your acount should not even be around anymore...

Fnom11
06-13-2011, 01:24 PM
why does everyone bust on lebron when all the blame should go on d-wade.

Wade played his *** off 5 game in a row, with a sub par game 6. Lebron played 1 good game, the rest were complete shlt.

Shlumpledink
06-13-2011, 01:25 PM
Wade is and always has been a stud, but that 2006 series had terrible officiating. Breathing on wade was a foul, the heat weren't getting those calls at all this series (or really ever since the 2006 finals, the officiating was THAT bad)

GiantsSwaGG
06-13-2011, 01:37 PM
Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

Your talking and you was suppose to delete your account when you lost the bet. Your looking more worse then LeBrick!

AddiX
06-13-2011, 01:43 PM
Ever since wade made that comment about give me the ball I've been here before Miami fell apart.

You could tell no one had a clear idea of what to do and who to give the ball to. it also seemed brn was all to happy to let wade take over.

But in the process co pletely forget he's suppose to be one of the best players in the NBA.

Brons game on many levels got exposed.

GoferKing_
06-13-2011, 02:36 PM
Seriously guys you're starting to get annoying, you're still questioning 2006 championship?

Well, we still are questioning 2002 championship. ;]

gaughan333
06-13-2011, 03:55 PM
The refs gave wade too many free throws in 2006. I have always thought of Dirk as being a great player and the best power forward.

gaughan333
06-13-2011, 03:57 PM
Now people understand that the "1A 1B" is not gonna work. It has to be a 1-2 punch. Questions is who's 1 who's 2?

I don't know if you guys watch south park, but Bono is not number 2 haha. Until his knees give out, I think wade should be 1.

marlinsfan24
06-13-2011, 04:45 PM
Didn't Wade DOMINATE the Mavs defensively and offensively? Is this thread serious?


Wade played his *** off 5 game in a row, with a sub par game 6. Lebron played 1 good game, the rest were complete shlt.

Seriously. Here's a look at the final numbers...
http://www.nba.com/statistics/player/Efficiency.jsp?league=00&season=42010&conf=OVERALL&position=0&splitType=444&splitScope=GAME&qualified=N&yearsExp=-1&splitDD=NBA%20Finals