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View Full Version : Initially it was Harden not Jeff Green going to Boston in the Perkins trade



hgtiger32
05-23-2011, 05:35 PM
I don't know if this has been a thread already if so the mods can delete it. But I guess James Harden was the main player returning for the Celtics until Presti persuaded Ainge to take Green instead of Harden. Thoughts?

magichatnumber9
05-23-2011, 05:40 PM
Source it please

KnicksR4Real
05-23-2011, 05:41 PM
I think it would have been the same results. I'd rather have green tho

believeinNYK
05-23-2011, 05:43 PM
Wouldve been a worse deal for Boston that it already was, source?

smith&wesson
05-23-2011, 05:47 PM
Wouldve been a worse deal for Boston that it already was, source?

WORST DEAL :confused: have you been watching perkins play in these playoffs at all ??

Super.
05-23-2011, 05:49 PM
TBH Perkins and Green did not play that great in the playoffs, but Perkins was never an offensive guy, and Green didn't really seem to fit quite right.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
05-23-2011, 05:56 PM
source lol???

Testaverde16
05-23-2011, 05:57 PM
WORST DEAL :confused: have you been watching perkins play in these playoffs at all ??

Have you been watching Green?

hgtiger32
05-23-2011, 06:06 PM
as far as sources it was said by Bill Simmons on a podcast.

Here's on that might help

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/celtics/tag/_/name/james-harden


Back in March, Peter May wrote for ESPN Boston that Celtics coach Doc Rivers had vetoed a first iteration of a swap with Oklahoma City, but Rivers wouldn't discuss the players involved. The Celtics eventually sent Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson to the Thunder in exchange for Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and a future first-round draft pick.

On The B.S. Report podcast this week, Celtics play-by-play man Sean Grande and ESPN's Bill Simmons suggested James Harden was included in the two team's initial discussions (though it remains unclear if his name was still in the chats by the time Rivers vetoed that first deal). Here's the transcript of their exchange:

Simmons: You look at the Celtics, and people are looking around, 'Can I trust Jeff Green? Can I trust Krstic?' Like, down the line, we didn't know who to trust on that team. Oklahoma City has enough guys, I think, to go into a battle.

Grande: Well, I'll tell you something, maybe you knew it, maybe you didn't. I don't think it's been said publicly, but Harden was in that conversation.

Simmons: I've written it once. That was the initial trade.

Grande: It was the initial trade, and I didn't know if you had written it or not. When you write 5,000 words, who has time?

Simmons: I think I mentioned it. I don't think I came out and reported it, but yeah, that was the initial trade.

Grande: Yeah, Harden was the name. When I first heard about it, it was Harden. It wasn't Jeff Green, and it was kind of an interesting thing at the time.

The conversation shifted briefly to The Association, the documentary series that chronicled the Celtics' 2010-11 season, before returning to the Celtics-Thunder swap:

Simmons: [The Thunder] went a little bit down the road with Harden and Perkins, which surprises a lot of people in the league, because nobody thought [Thunder GM Sam] Presti would even consider trading Harden, and ultimately he didn't. But that was how it advanced, and at some point he decided Harden must have done something in some game or maybe he just decided it was a panic trade or wasn't the time yet, pulled out, and tried to substitute Green in the trade, and that's what led to Krstic getting involved, and then Nate Robinson and the Clippers pick and eventually it got to where it was. It seemed to me like Danny [Ainge] had his heart set on making a trade when that Harden thing fell through. Instead of just saying, 'Ah, it fell through,' he kind of pushed forward with it. Maybe that's what the danger was there.

Grande: Well, and [Ainge] always liked Jeff Green.

KnicksR4Real
05-23-2011, 06:07 PM
Green is better...

naps
05-23-2011, 06:09 PM
...

LTBaByyy
05-23-2011, 06:09 PM
Rather have Green

DoJoTheSlasher
05-23-2011, 06:10 PM
James Harden is better than Jeff Green. I would much rather have Harden. Either way it was a stupid trade. I was all against Boston trading this and I thought Perkins would make OKC so much better but Perk isn't that good now that I've watched him more.

LTBaByyy
05-23-2011, 06:11 PM
This will end up being like the Jason Kidd trade to the Mavs

Maybe not now but Boston will end up winning this trade in a couple years when the old guys are gone

Perkins pre garnett and after garnett is a bum

smith&wesson
05-23-2011, 06:14 PM
Have you been watching Green?

green doesnt start bro. and boston got green for the future. meaning he will have a much bigger impact on the celtics for years to come as the older guys fade off his role will become bigger and bigger.

perkins does not have the potential green has, he starts as it is and he has hardley helped OKC do anything. when the trade initially happened. i thought it was big for OKC, but they proved that they would have got just as far with ibaka at the 5.

green will star next year i promice you. you can quote me on this if he doesnt. green doesnt have bum knees either.

hgtiger32
05-23-2011, 06:17 PM
James Harden is better than Jeff Green. I would much rather have Harden. Either way it was a stupid trade. I was all against Boston trading this and I thought Perkins would make OKC so much better but Perk isn't that good now that I've watched him more.

Didn't they sign Perk to a 4 year extension right away? While he hasn't played good with OKC I think he needs a summer to practice with the team and really gel. Same with Green on the Celtics. Just a poorly timed trade. Do it in the offseason.

Boston could've used Perks D against Miami and I'm guessing OKC could use Green to guard (attempt to guard) Dirk.

hgtiger32
05-23-2011, 06:19 PM
green doesnt start bro. and boston got green for the future. meaning he will have a much bigger impact on the celtics for years to come as the older guys fade off his role will become bigger and bigger.

perkins does not have the potential green has, he starts as it is and he has hardley helped OKC do anything. when the trade initially happened. i thought it was big for OKC, but they proved that they would have got just as far with ibaka at the 5.

green will star next year i promice you. you can quote me on this if he doesnt. green doesnt have bum knees either.

Are you Doc Rivers?

LTBaByyy
05-23-2011, 06:25 PM
Green will be a star in 3 years when PP takes a 6th man role

smith&wesson
05-23-2011, 06:42 PM
Are you Doc Rivers?

no im not. but i am able to read.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2011/05/weei_ainge_refl.html

JB0B0
05-23-2011, 06:54 PM
Harden is a very underrated player. I would love to see him in a bulls uniform

hgtiger32
05-23-2011, 06:56 PM
no im not. but i am able to read.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2011/05/weei_ainge_refl.html

there's a difference between you PROMISING that Green starts and Ainge saying "Maybe there’s a change of roles. Maybe Paul comes off the bench, cuts down on his minutes. Maybe we find a way to get Jeff more minutes. His role will expand if he’s back here next year. There’s no question about that ... "

-Kobe24-TJ19-
05-23-2011, 07:03 PM
Harden is much better than Green.

OKC won that deal.

kozelkid
05-23-2011, 07:05 PM
Well Boston ****ed that up. Harden is definitely better than Green and made much more sense for them too.

smith&wesson
05-23-2011, 07:11 PM
there's a difference between you PROMISING that Green starts and Ainge saying "Maybe there’s a change of roles. Maybe Paul comes off the bench, cuts down on his minutes. Maybe we find a way to get Jeff more minutes. His role will expand if he’s back here next year. There’s no question about that ... "

Ya but obviously they have plans to have him start if theyre considering putting friggin paul piere on the bench ....

and if you read my post i said the move was made for the future. so ifyour only problem is me saying i promice you green is gonna start then ill rephrase that. i promice when jeff green gets a chance to start again he will start playing like he was in OKC.

perkins on the other hand still starts and he has not performed nearly as well as he was playing prior to his injuries.

back to the thread at hand. harden and green pretty much have the same potential as long as they get playing time they can both be very productive players as they have shown when theyve got time on the floor.

Gram
05-23-2011, 07:34 PM
I'd take either one lol.

Sadds The Gr8
05-23-2011, 07:46 PM
Green isn't better than Harden...

smith&wesson
05-23-2011, 07:53 PM
Green isn't better than Harden...

I agree .. but i do like green too he was nice in OKC.

Lake_Show2416
05-23-2011, 07:58 PM
Ya i heard about this. Harden is a better player with more potential but either way Boston got the better end of the deal, I always thought there was too much hype with Perkins, it hurt them this year but they weren't gonna pay him anyways. Green will be a nice player to have

B'sCeltsPatsSox
05-23-2011, 09:36 PM
Well Boston ****ed that up. Harden is definitely better than Green and made much more sense for them too.

Boston didn't **** it up. OKC said no to trading Harden and instead offered Green.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
05-23-2011, 09:38 PM
Harden is much better than Green.

OKC won that deal.

How did OKC win this deal? Perk is now going to be one of the most over payed players in the NBA beginning next year.

Eagles4Lyfe
05-23-2011, 10:04 PM
The major source is from a company called BS's weekly podcast :laugh:

hgtiger32
05-24-2011, 10:56 AM
The major source is from a company called BS's weekly podcast :laugh:

it's Bill Simmons' podcast. works for espn. big boston fan. i trust him.

KnicksorBust
05-24-2011, 11:17 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=greenje02&y1=2011&p2=hardeja01&y2=2011

Harden has a better PER, TS%, AST%, STL%, WS, WS/48
Green has a better TRB%, BLK%.

Harden is 21 years old and is a natural SG.
Green is 24 years old and is a tweener SF/PF.

I don't even think it's a contest. Harden is clearly better than Green.

LongWayFromHome
05-24-2011, 11:33 AM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=greenje02&y1=2011&p2=hardeja01&y2=2011

Harden has a better PER, TS%, AST%, STL%, WS, WS/48
Green has a better TRB%, BLK%.

Harden is 21 years old and is a natural SG.
Green is 24 years old and is a tweener SF/PF.

I don't even think it's a contest. Harden is clearly better than Green.

Agreed.

This isn't an issue of who's better: Green v Perkins / Harden v Perkins
Why are people making it that?

THIS IS: Harden v Green

And Knicksorbust made the case - its plain to see Harden is better.

So, did OKC make a good trade? Maybe, maybe not. BUT they definitely made a better trade dealing Green than if the had dealt Harden

LTBaByyy
05-24-2011, 11:36 AM
Harden is not better than Green!!!!

Green is consistent!!!! And an all around player

Harden had one good game this series and everyone is praising him

Look at his stats in the losses

Baller1
05-24-2011, 11:39 AM
Next year with Harden in the starting lineup and a healthy Perk, it will be blatantly obvious who won this deal. I'm thrilled Presti refused to trade Harden. Harden is gonna be a star in this league and I have no doubt in my mind about that.

LongWayFromHome
05-24-2011, 11:40 AM
Harden is not better than Green!!!!

Green is consistent!!!! And an all around player

Harden had one good game this series and everyone is praising him

Look at his stats in the losses

This year Harden avg more points, rebounds, and assists in less minutes than Green did last year

Baller1
05-24-2011, 11:42 AM
Harden is not better than Green!!!!

Green is consistent!!!! And an all around player

Harden had one good game this series and everyone is praising him

Look at his stats in the losses

He's not used right on this team. Durant and Westy completely neglect him at times. When Harden is running the offense, or having it run through him... We're an amazing offensive team (especially when he's playing alongside Maynor who is an extremely smart PG).

If Harden became our starting PG and we slid Westrook to the 2, we'd possibly be a better team. I'm not willing to give up on Westy though, so that's debatable.

LongWayFromHome
05-24-2011, 11:52 AM
He's not used right on this team. Durant and Westy completely neglect him at times. When Harden is running the offense, or having it run through him... We're an amazing offensive team (especially when he's playing alongside Maynor who is an extremely smart PG).

If Harden became our starting PG and we slid Westrook to the 2, we'd possibly be a better team. I'm not willing to give up on Westy though, so that's debatable.

Or at least BETTER (maybe not amazing). Mostly agree.

Harden is only 21 and shows leadership and seems to have a more usable chip on his shoulder than Durant/Westbrook who seem like little kids at times.

I am constantly impressed with Harden and wouldn't be opposed to seeing Westbrook go for the right deal (if I was a Thunder fan).

Baller1
05-24-2011, 12:07 PM
Or at least BETTER (maybe not amazing). Mostly agree.

Harden is only 21 and shows leadership and seems to have a more usable chip on his shoulder than Durant/Westbrook who seem like little kids at times.

I am constantly impressed with Harden and wouldn't be opposed to seeing Westbrook go for the right deal (if I was a Thunder fan).

If we can swing a deal for CP3 or Dwight, I'd absolutely trade Westbrook.

Maynor running point while feeding the ball to Harden, Durant, and Dwight. :drool:

John Walls Era
05-24-2011, 12:08 PM
I'd want both of them :D.