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nolin
05-12-2011, 11:02 PM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

Doogolas
05-12-2011, 11:04 PM
Lol, no.

Sixerlover
05-12-2011, 11:04 PM
Are the Hawks ever going to get tired of being that 4-6 seed that gets knocked out in one of the first two rounds? I feel like this has happened yearly for 3 years now, and they're good enough that they'll be top 4 again next year, with another early exit.

D Roses Bulls
05-12-2011, 11:05 PM
he said that? wow....... I love all the rose praise. I have not heard one bad thing about this man. even watching his interview right now, the man is just soo humble

Sixerlover
05-12-2011, 11:05 PM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

To answer your question. No. If every player is a free agent in the NBA, my first signing isn't going to be D-Rose.

D Roses Bulls
05-12-2011, 11:06 PM
To answer your question. No. If every player is a free agent in the NBA, my first signing isn't going to be D-Rose.

I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

Sadds The Gr8
05-12-2011, 11:06 PM
nope

JB0B0
05-12-2011, 11:06 PM
Top 5 but not the best

Chacarron
05-12-2011, 11:07 PM
Lebron Dwyane James Wade are better.

dnewguy
05-12-2011, 11:08 PM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

Maybe he knows something we don't know.

Baller1
05-12-2011, 11:08 PM
Seriously, why post this? You already know the reaction it's going to get.

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:09 PM
Who am I to argue with Josh Smith?

*Silver&Black*
05-12-2011, 11:10 PM
For the sake of Josh Smith and what he knows, he is the same dude who can't stop shooting bad shots even if Hawks fans boo him for it.

Master Mind
05-12-2011, 11:10 PM
And Doc Rivers called Wade and Bron monsters. It's just post game humble pie

Sixerlover
05-12-2011, 11:11 PM
I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

Nice. I doubt many others would. I know I'd take LeBron over Rose.

toovey107
05-12-2011, 11:12 PM
He's def. not the best player in the NBA. Not at all.

That being said, if everyone was a FA like a previous guy mentioned.... Rose would certainly be at the top of my list.

His humbleness and leadership skills are extremely rare in todays game. He's the kind of player you want to represent your organization.

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:17 PM
We'll see if he lives up to that title next series.

As for starting a franchise, until I see Lebron win it all, I will continue to doubt his ability because of the unconventional way he plays and the effect it has on his team surrounding him.

Hawkeye15
05-12-2011, 11:17 PM
no way. Top 10? Sure. But there is no way on earth Derrick Rose is the best player in the NBA. Sorry.

*Silver&Black*
05-12-2011, 11:18 PM
Anybody in their right mind to start a franchise with would pick Dwight Howard. Then Lebron James. Then a PG (Rose).

Gators123
05-12-2011, 11:19 PM
no way. Top 10? Sure. But there is no way on earth Derrick Rose is the best player in the NBA. Sorry.

This.

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:20 PM
Anybody in their right mind to start a franchise with would pick Dwight Howard. Then Lebron James. Then a PG (Rose).

Why Dwight over Lebron?

He hasn't proven more than Lebron...

shizzle09
05-12-2011, 11:20 PM
no

ElMarroAfamado
05-12-2011, 11:21 PM
And Doc Rivers called Wade and Bron monsters. It's just post game humble pie

your sig as just as lame as the 8 to go ****

:facepalm:

cbreezy34
05-12-2011, 11:24 PM
I see the Nets and Sixers surpassing the Hawks next year. Sixers will the the 3rd or 4th seed Nets and Knicks with fight for thr 5th and 6th.

Rego247
05-12-2011, 11:24 PM
no.

KINGBAIZE
05-12-2011, 11:24 PM
YES! Derrick Rose is pound for pound the best player in the NBA.
Sorry...but he is.

RZZZA
05-12-2011, 11:25 PM
Seriously, why post this? You already know the reaction it's going to get.

^

Avenged
05-12-2011, 11:26 PM
Obviously no, even Bulls fans know this.

The majority of players in the league call Kobe Bryant the best player in the game, is this true? No.

RZZZA
05-12-2011, 11:28 PM
this is like when frank vogel said Rose had allen iverson speed, jason kidds court vision,etc, etc...

guys that just got defeated are obviously going to praise the people who defeated them because they dont want to say "man they suck, we got beaten by a person/team that sucks"

Master Mind
05-12-2011, 11:28 PM
your sig as just as lame as the 8 to go ****

:facepalm:

You're just lame.

Meloman
05-12-2011, 11:28 PM
He's a fantastic player no doubt, but he doesn't have LeBron's physical skills yet or Kobe's insane bag of tricks. Right now I'd say he's about on par with Wade.

DaBear
05-12-2011, 11:28 PM
Rose is not the best player in the NBA, but maybe the most likeable because of his combination of skill and humbleness.

nolin
05-12-2011, 11:29 PM
We'll see if he lives up to that title next series.

As for starting a franchise, until I see Lebron win it all, I will continue to doubt his ability because of the unconventional way he plays and the effect it has on his team surrounding him.

your right this next series is going to show where rose is in the league. I have a good feeling alot more fans are going to agree with josh smith after it.

Draco
05-12-2011, 11:29 PM
Somewhere in the Top 5. Somewhere in my top 2 for someone I'd start a franchise with.

*Silver&Black*
05-12-2011, 11:30 PM
Why Dwight over Lebron?

He hasn't proven more than Lebron...

Your right, he hasn't proved anything more. That is why, when both is in the same boat, you should choose the big man. This isn't a passing up Jordan type thing. They are more even.

RZZZA
05-12-2011, 11:30 PM
I think you can easily make a case for Rose being the 5th best player in the NBA now. take it all into account. leadership, skills, athleticism, will to succeed, work ethic...etc

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:33 PM
Your right, he hasn't proved anything more. That is why, when both is in the same boat, you should choose the big man. This isn't a passing up Jordan type thing. They are more even.

Yeah, I just think it's close...

Lebron's unconventional way of playing makes me question his ability to win it all and such, but I can be proven wrong ;)

With Dwight, he could fit in anywhere under any system, while Lebron, you kind of have to build the team around him.

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:34 PM
If Rose and the Bulls were to beat Lebron/Wade and the Heat this next series, would fans view Rose as being better than them?

General question

yanksknicks
05-12-2011, 11:35 PM
Lebron Dwyane James Wade are better.

But they are monumental egos and universally hated by other players.

justinnum1
05-12-2011, 11:35 PM
Best player is between lebron and wade. sorry

Avenged
05-12-2011, 11:36 PM
Rose is not the best player in the NBA, but maybe the most likeable because of his combination of skill and humbleness.

Unfortunately, not here on PSD.

tbone2171
05-12-2011, 11:37 PM
Unfortunately, not here on PSD.

Yeah, PSD Bulls fans ruined that one

RZZZA
05-12-2011, 11:38 PM
Yeah, PSD Bulls fans ruined that one

that one never gets old. AWWW you don't like us?

we really care

Avenged
05-12-2011, 11:38 PM
If Rose and the Bulls were to beat Lebron/Wade and the Heat this next series, would fans view Rose as being better than them?

General question

Not really..

But if the Bulls somehow manage to win the championship this year, I can see a heavy jump in the rankings for Rose.

hugepatsfan
05-12-2011, 11:47 PM
Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Kobe, Durant, and CP3 are definately better players right now IMO. Rose is in the 7-10 argument right now IMO.

tbone2171
05-12-2011, 11:49 PM
that one never gets old. AWWW you don't like us?

we really care

my case and point

sargon21
05-12-2011, 11:51 PM
Lebron, Wade, Dwight, Kobe, Durant, and CP3 are definately better players right now IMO. Rose is in the 7-10 argument right now IMO.

Kobe is def not

Durant is arguable with his lack of playmaking skills

He's nearing Wade, and I don't want to get into CP3 argument.

allSUAVE
05-12-2011, 11:53 PM
Rose is top 3 in my book,

Crackadalic
05-12-2011, 11:55 PM
No but I don't understand why he has to be. He help his team get to the eastern conference finals. As long as your best players brings his A game and gets a ring then all of this top 10 nonsense really doesnt matter

yanksknicks
05-12-2011, 11:56 PM
Best player is between lebron and wade. sorry

Funny.

Just about every post you write is so over-the-top Heat homer that is makes me sick.

Both fine players, neither is the best in the NBA though I will give Wade the nod over LeBrick.

And in this series, Rose is going to make Wade look real bad.

hugepatsfan
05-12-2011, 11:57 PM
Kobe is def not

Durant is arguable with his lack of playmaking skills

He's nearing Wade, and I don't want to get into CP3 argument.

Wade was far and away better than Rose, Durant, and Kobe this year. Durant, Rose, and Kobe all had comparable seasons. Rose was probably a little better than them. But rankings, IMO, have to take into account more than 1 year. He can probably catch them next year, but for now I don't see an argument for him above those 2.

I'm not even going to touch the CP3 argument either...

meloman1592
05-13-2011, 12:01 AM
Rose is good...not the best

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 12:01 AM
my case and point

who cares is my point, this entire site will be nothing but Bulls fans soon. so we don't have to worry about offending people like you.

bosox3431
05-13-2011, 12:03 AM
Yeah, PSD Bulls fans ruined that one

The fact that you would allow people on the Internet dictate how You feel about about anything shows your a weak minded individual.

Duncan = Donkey
05-13-2011, 12:05 AM
lol, not even close.

John Walls Era
05-13-2011, 12:06 AM
Who are we to dismiss what Josh Smith says. I mean the guy has been on multiple winning teams, an allstar, a superstar, a franchise player....

In all seriousness: Rose is a damn good player.

PS: No link so close the thread. Also OP knows exactly what kind of reaction this thread will get... he won't like it, but he decided to make a thread anyways.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 12:06 AM
Wade was far and away better than Rose, Durant, and Kobe this year. Durant, Rose, and Kobe all had comparable seasons. Rose was probably a little better than them. But rankings, IMO, have to take into account more than 1 year. He can probably catch them next year, but for now I don't see an argument for him above those 2.

I'm not even going to touch the CP3 argument either...

Oh okay, I was simply talking about this year.

tbone2171
05-13-2011, 12:08 AM
The fact that you would allow people on the Internet dictate how You feel about about anything shows your a weak minded individual.

:laugh2: says the Nascar and Packer fan

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 12:08 AM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

Right now no, but if Rose and the Bulls beat Lebron/Wade and the Heat and go on to win the title, then yes Rose is the best player in the league. I consider any and every player that won league and finals mvp the same year the best player in the NBA. Hell winning league mvp and the title the same year makes you the best player in the league without much of an argument from me.

Stuckey#3
05-13-2011, 12:13 AM
Rose is not the most athletic or talented player in the league; he is top five for those attributes.
But overall Rose is the best "player" in the league; because being an elite player in this league means being a leader, an athlete, a spokesperson and a competitor.

Rose is the best overall when everything is taken into account.

Stuckey#3
05-13-2011, 12:17 AM
Lebron could be the best overall player in the league; so could DWade... but they play on the same team... because they couldn't do it by themselves.
Rose can lead a team to multiple championships without teaming up with another top five talent IMO.

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 12:26 AM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

ahjahahahahahahahhahahahaahhaahahahaaaaaaaaa


I never talk in caps but...

THIS IS THE **** THAT IS ALLOWED ON THE MAIN FORUM!?!?!?!?! THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLOSED BEFORE THE FIRST POST!

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 12:31 AM
This **** gets so annoying. No he is not... Why does this happen? Its always a different player being put over because they are this years new talked about player. Rose is very good but James now and has been and will continue to be the best player in the game. Just let it go. Smith and the Hawks got owned. If the Hawks would have made the finals against durant and lost he would have said the same about Durant and so on. LET IT GO.

Rego247
05-13-2011, 12:31 AM
ahjahahahahahahahhahahahaahhaahahahaaaaaaaaa


I never talk in caps but...

THIS IS THE **** THAT IS ALLOWED ON THE MAIN FORUM!?!?!?!?! THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLOSED BEFORE THE FIRST POST!

x1000000.

DeyAce
05-13-2011, 12:39 AM
Rose > Lebron

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 12:41 AM
People really take for granted how great James or even Howard actually are.

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 12:42 AM
ahjahahahahahahahhahahahaahhaahahahaaaaaaaaa


I never talk in caps but...

THIS IS THE **** THAT IS ALLOWED ON THE MAIN FORUM!?!?!?!?! THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLOSED BEFORE THE FIRST POST!

Why???

Won gold medal on his first try while it took Lebron and Wade 3 tries to get gold medal. Won MVP with no other player and allstar and the most wins in NBA History with no actual other allstar on his team tied with 1998 Bulls and Jazz in that in which MJ and Malone were the only allstars on their teams.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 12:44 AM
why the hell is your opinion better than Josh Smiths?

k.smith904
05-13-2011, 12:45 AM
1. Lebron
2. Rose
3. Howard
4. Durant
5. Wade
6. Kobe
7. Melo

etc etc

bosox3431
05-13-2011, 12:45 AM
:laugh2: says the Nascar and Packer fan

And that shows I'm weak minded how?

Sir Buckets
05-13-2011, 12:48 AM
Nice. I doubt many others would. I know I'd take LeBron over Rose.Thankfully you're nobody's GM.

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 12:49 AM
Why???

Won gold medal on his first try while it took Lebron and Wade 3 tries to get gold medal. Won MVP with no other player and allstar and the most wins in NBA History with no actual other allstar on his team tied with 1998 Bulls and Jazz in that in which MJ and Malone were the only allstars on their teams.

I'm not saying that this thread shouldn't be allowed because LeBron is > Rose (but he is), I'm saying this thread is complete garbage. I've seen too many of these stupid and childish threads in the NBA forum and it's a joke. I've seen too many good threads get tossed into the comparisons forum, while ******** ones like this get to stay here, even when MODs have clearly seen this ****. This trash should get s**tckicked into the comparisons at least.

... and that gold medal argument is trash too. come on JB

jerellh528
05-13-2011, 12:51 AM
hes not even the best pg in the nba

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 12:54 AM
why the hell is your opinion better than Josh Smiths?

sorry. end discussion.

I don't know how you can take anyone's opinion as a fact. This is the most childish argument you could have. "well Josh Smith said Rose is the best so it must be true!" plzzzzzzz

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 12:59 AM
I wonder who the best in the NBA will be next year.... Maybe we should poll it? This year its rose.. 2 years ago Durant...3 years ago cp3... Not one of them in that time frame has surpassed James but players and sites like these continue to overrate the new guy while under valuing current guys like Howard and James.

CowboysKB24
05-13-2011, 01:00 AM
Nice. I doubt many others would. I know I'd take LeBron over Rose.

LBJ can't handle being the king of a city and the main guy on a team. Some coaches don't want that even with all his ability. Some people/coaches don't like that. Rose has accomplished a lot in his short career, he's only getting better.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:02 AM
LBJ can't handle being the king of a city and the main guy on a team. Some coaches don't want that even with all his ability. Some people/coaches don't like that. Rose has accomplished a lot in his short career, he's only getting better.

:facepalm:

He did Handle being the main guy by taking a terrible team to one of the best records in the nba for several years. This argument is so flawed. EVERY COACH AND GM in the league would take James right now and would love him on their team. Stop the nonsense. You are basically handicapping him for doing what he wants when he became a free agent...SO Because he choose to go to a team with Wade his ability and on the court skills have diminished?

Kashmir13579
05-13-2011, 01:03 AM
Maybe top 10.

gotoHcarolina52
05-13-2011, 01:04 AM
I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

And that would solidify Bucher's place in the Hall of Imbeciles, right next to Skip Bayless, Jon Barry, Bill Simmons, Marc Stein and Michael Wilbon.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:04 AM
And that would solidify Bucher's place in the Hall of Imbeciles, right next to Skip Bayless, Jon Barry, Bill Simmons, Marc Stein and Michael Wilbon.

and Dan le Batard? Since he's the Miami version of Wilbon

Rego247
05-13-2011, 01:06 AM
why the hell is your opinion better than Josh Smiths?

cuz josh smith's opinion is law, and we must all live by it right?

rose is a great player no doubt, but best player? cmon man.

no worries though once he beats the heat he'll move higher up the chain. ;)

SportsFanatic10
05-13-2011, 01:07 AM
^its funny when they're on PTI together although rare its one or the other mostly.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:07 AM
is that what I said? damn, i could have sworn I said nothing like that...at all...

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:07 AM
^its funny when they're on PTI together although rare its one or the other mostly.

I love when they're on together.

jerellh528
05-13-2011, 01:10 AM
Maybe top 10.

more like top 8 or 9

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:11 AM
cuz josh smith's opinion is law, and we must all live by it right?

rose is a great player no doubt, but best player? cmon man.

no worries though once he beats the heat he'll move higher up the chain. ;)

man I can't take these PSD opinions. I need Josh Smith's opinion. Where's Josh? Somebody plzzzzzzzzzzzz I need some Josh Smith. JOSHHHHHH! I need Josh to make sense of all of thisssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo-ddYhXAZc

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:12 AM
more like top 8 or 9

:confused:

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:12 AM
I think it's ridiculous to act like your opinion is somehow more worthy and substantive than josh smith's.

Kashmir13579
05-13-2011, 01:15 AM
more like top 8 or 9

8, 9, 10, what is the difference? he's not the best player in the NBA. i don't see how anybody could even have him in their top 5. Lebron, Chris Paul, Wade, Howard, Durant, and Dirk all say hello.

210Don
05-13-2011, 01:15 AM
yes he is and he will show it in the ECF beating wade and james

Rego247
05-13-2011, 01:16 AM
man I can't take these PSD opinions. I need Josh Smith's opinion. Where's Josh? Somebody plzzzzzzzzzzzz I need some Josh Smith. JOSHHHHHH! I need Josh to make sense of all of thisssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo-ddYhXAZc

:laugh:

u beat me to it.

tredigs
05-13-2011, 01:16 AM
Lebron could be the best overall player in the league; so could DWade... but they play on the same team... because they couldn't do it by themselves.
Rose can lead a team to multiple championships without teaming up with another top five talent IMO.

And the fact that when he (D. Rose) plays with other elite players he is never the best player on the court tells us what, exactly? Not just speaking of All-Star games, but more importantly of the World Championships this summer. He had some decent games, but was on par with Westbrook throughout the entirety of the event - while they and everyone else watched what Kevin Durant did in taking the team on his back and leading them to Gold.

He was nowhere close to as good as Durant, and he is nowhere CLOSE to as good as a guy like Lebron. Saying that Rose can do it without teaming up with another top 5 talent while simultaneously ignoring the elephant in the room (that he is on a team and with a coach that is far, far better than anything Lebron has played on) is disingenuous at best.

I like Rose a lot - he's insanely exciting and has a great head for the game, but he's not touching the likes of the top 5 in the league right now. Even at the PG position, Chris Paul is far superior. That guy is a maestro - he plays the game with an ease that I've rarely seen in the games history. If he ever plays on a team that would not be lottery bound without his help then that's going to be put on blast. Easily the most underrated player in the NBA being how truly phenomenal he is.

pd1dish
05-13-2011, 01:18 AM
Who am I to argue with Josh Smith?

haha +1

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:19 AM
I think it's ridiculous to act like your opinion is somehow more worthy and substantive than josh smith's.

I think it's moronic to take 1 NBA player's opinion and take it as fact. If you got a consensus of every NBA player's unbiased opinion,then maybe it might mean something.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:20 AM
I think it's moronic to take 1 NBA player's opinion and take it as fact. If you got a consensus of every NBA player's unbiased opinion,then maybe it might mean something.

I'm not taking it as fact but it's his opinion and he said it, so why denigrate him and act like he's a huge dummy just because his opinion is not yours?

after all, Josh Smith is in the league and you're...not.

Kashmir13579
05-13-2011, 01:21 AM
I think it's ridiculous to act like your opinion is somehow more worthy and substantive than josh smith's.
Cause we all know what a high basketball I.Q Josh Smith has... He's right up there with Timmy D and Nash. What Smith says is the end-all-be-all, and no one should second-guess his ridiculous statement.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:22 AM
I think it's ridiculous to act like your opinion is somehow more worthy and substantive than josh smith's.

Why exactly? Because he plays the game? Do you know how he came to his opinion? Maybe he dislikes James or is best friends with rose... Maybe he is a bit homo for rose. Its not like he has played 50 times against rose this year so he does not follow him as much as say your average basketball fan... Numbers and the proven tract record do not lie... I like Rose but to put him as the best in the nba because he is having a great run is a slap in the face to guys like Howard and James who have been doing it and are under valued and or hated against.

Its hard to figure Smiths opinion because he got wood for rose this series after they spanked them. I still say if Durant owned them he would be slobbing his knob as well.

SportsFanatic10
05-13-2011, 01:24 AM
durant called randolph the best pf in the league and then his play fell off. i hope the same thing happens with rose after this somehow haha.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:25 AM
how do you know what his criteria is, maybe he said what he said simply because Rose amazed him and for no other reason.

it's just an opinion, you can disagree with it but your opinions aren't any more meaningful and worthy than his.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:25 AM
I'm not taking it as fact but it's his opinion and he said it, so why denigrate him and act like he's a huge dummy just because his opinion is not yours?

after all, Josh Smith is in the league and you're...not.

:facepalm:

Of course. He plays in the game so if he says it then it must be true.

smiddy012
05-13-2011, 01:25 AM
Thank god the Bulls vs. Miami series is upon us, now we finally get to see what the young stud is made of.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:26 AM
how do you know what his criteria is, maybe he said what he said simply because Rose amazed him and for no other reason.

it's just an opinion, you can disagree with it but your opinions aren't any more meaningful and worthy than his.

Agreed. That is why everyone is on here though. To share our opinions while using facts to help support our opinions... Do the numbers support rose as the best in the nba? Is he better on both sides of the ball then James?

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:26 AM
:facepalm:

Of course. He plays in the game so if he says it then it must be true.

did you miss the part where I said "I'm not taking it as fact"?

It's an OPINION

Rego247
05-13-2011, 01:27 AM
I'm not taking it as fact but it's his opinion and he said it, so why denigrate him and act like he's a huge dummy just because his opinion is not yours?

after all, Josh Smith is in the league and you're...not.

is it his opinion? yes.

does it matter? no.

if he said he was a better player than rose, and rose isn't even a top 10 player, would u be as understanding? of course not.

do u really think derrick rose cares about what josh smith thinks of him?

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:29 AM
did you miss the part where I said "I'm not taking it as fact"?

It's an OPINION

Did not miss it at all. Saying that still does not take away from the fact that you were trying to add some type of weight to his opinion because he "Plays in the NBA"

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:29 AM
I'm not taking it as fact but it's his opinion and he said it, so why denigrate him and act like he's a huge dummy just because his opinion is not yours?

after all, Josh Smith is in the league and you're...not.

I'm not calling Smith a dummy. I understand that his team got whooped in the playoffs again, and he wants to make it seem that the best player in the world did it. I'm cool with that. He's just giving respect and S'ing a little bit of D.

It's the ppl who create this thread, and the ppl who think that "because Josh said it it's true", and "well he's in the NBA and you're not". I guess I have never played a game of basketball, never followed it hardcore since I was young, don't continue to read books on the history of the game, and don't try to educate myself more on the game :rolleyes:. I'm just plain stupid I guess.

The funny thing is that most coaches in the NBA have either been marginal players at best, or didn't play in the NBA at all, but I'd take their opinion on something basketball-related over a great player.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:30 AM
Did not miss it at all. Saying that still does not take away from the fact that you were trying to add some type of weight to his opinion because he "Plays in the NBA"

Yeah, well he has to face these guys on the court, maybe he was more impressed by Rose than by Lebron.

Not every opinion is influenced by stats, not every one is a stat geek like us

Rego247
05-13-2011, 01:31 AM
I'm not calling Smith a dummy. I understand that his team got whooped in the playoffs again, and he wants to make it seem that the best player in the world did it. I'm cool with that. He's just giving respect and S'ing a little bit of D.

It's the ppl who create this thread, and the ppl who think that "because Josh said it it's true", and "well he's in the NBA and you're not". I guess I have never played a game of basketball, never followed it hardcore since I was young, don't continue to read books on the history of the game, and don't try to educate myself more on the game :rolleyes:. I'm just plain stupid I guess.

The funny thing is that most coaches in the NBA have either been marginal players at best, or didn't play in the NBA at all, but I'd take their opinion on something basketball-related over a great player.

this right here.

gotoHcarolina52
05-13-2011, 01:31 AM
and Dan le Batard? Since he's the Miami version of Wilbon

Yeah, I forgot about that clown. Add him to the list. And add John Anderson and Scott Van Pelt as well. Bunch of dumbass douches.

beasted86
05-13-2011, 01:32 AM
Obviously no, even Bulls fans know this.

The majority of players in the league call Kobe Bryant the best player in the game, is this true? No.

Word is bond.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:32 AM
Yeah, well he has to face these guys on the court, maybe he was more impressed by Rose than by Lebron.

Not every opinion is influenced by stats, not every one is a stat geek like us

Yes but the numbers tell a better story then playing a guy 1 on 1 a couple of times a year. Playing a guy does not take into how the guy plays the rest of the year against other opponents. If he believed that then a better choice of words would have been he is the best I played against.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:33 AM
God damn some of you people are a joke. Extremely few people in this thread said they agreed with Josh Smith, yet they're getting attacked like they committed blasphemy and the majority of this thread is getting over taken with these "attacks." Many people have posed hypotheticals and situations in which they could interpret Rose being the best player.

Durant is not far superior than Rose. He is a better and more efficient scorer, but he's not nearly the playmaker Rose is (nor is expected to be), so when taking everything into account, it becomes very close.

And like I said, if the Bulls beat the Heat this series, and even win the NBA Finals, it's going to be hard to not say Rose isn't better than Lebron/Wade, and I think it's ludicrous for others to think it's such a landslide with no possibility under those circumstances.

But most said it was ludicrous to think of Rose as MVP before the season started, but we all saw how that turned out. So, all I can say is keep doubting.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 01:34 AM
Yes but the numbers tell a better story then playing a guy 1 on 1 a couple of times a year. Playing a guy does not take into how the guy plays the rest of the year against other opponents. If he believed that then a better choice of words would have been he is the best I played against.

Stats don't tell everything, there's intangibles that stats cannot encompass.

Maybe he meant Rose is the best in the NBA this season? Who knows what he meant or if he even really meant it.

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:35 AM
Yeah, well he has to face these guys on the court, maybe he was more impressed by Rose than by Lebron.

Not every opinion is influenced by stats, not every one is a stat geek like us

or maybe he doesn't want to give LeBron too much respect because he's used to LeBron personally whooping him. Whatever it is, it doesn't matter. Josh Smith's opinion holds about as much weight as Walmart grocery bag.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:36 AM
God damn some of you people are a joke. Extremely few people in this thread said they agreed with Josh Smith, yet they're getting attacked like they committed blasphemy and the majority of this thread is getting over taken with these "attacks." Many people have posed hypotheticals and situations in which they could interpret Rose being the best player.

Durant is not far superior then Rose. He is a better and more efficient scorer, but he's not nearly the playmaker Rose is (nor is expected to be), so when taking everything into account, it becomes very close.

And like I said, if the Bulls beat the Heat this series, and even win the NBA Finals, it's going to be hard to not say Rose isn't better than Lebron/Wade, and I think it's ludicrous for others to think it's such a landslide with no possibility under those circumstances.

But most said it was ludicrous to think of Rose as MVP before the season started, but we all saw how that turned out. So, all I can say is keep doubting.

Even if rose wins the title he will still not be the best in the nba. Its just to small a sample size. He is a monster ceiling and is very good but James is still better on both sides of the ball. Winning a series against a team will not sway that one way or another.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:36 AM
or maybe he doesn't want to give LeBron too much respect because he's used to LeBron personally whooping him. Whatever it is, it doesn't matter. Josh Smith's opinion holds about as much weight as Walmart grocery bag.

Can you not get past the fact that Smith said it, and focus on the actual content of what said?

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:38 AM
Even if rose wins the title he will still not be the best in the nba. Its just to small a sample size. He is a monster ceiling and is very good but James is still better on both sides of the ball. Winning a series against a team will not sway that one way or another.

Well, that's just your opinion...

Too small of a sample size... Lebron hasn't won in 7 years. Rose winning with a equal or inferior cast around him would be more impressive than what Lebron has done throughout his whole career, yet it doesn't make him "better." Winning's all that matters and that's what defines careers and that's how it should be.

goeatfish63
05-13-2011, 01:39 AM
no hes not the best. top 10 ok. but very best? nope

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:40 AM
Well, that's just your opinion...

Too small of a sample size... Lebron hasn't won in 7 years. Rose winning with a equal or inferior cast around him would be more impressive than what Lebron has done throughout his whole career, yet it doesn't make him "better." Winning's all that matters and that's what defines careers and that's how it should be.

Who says rose has a lesser cast? To me the bulls have a much better team because they are more balanced and deeper. Lol at your winning speech... If that is the case then nobody will be better then Bryant until he retires correct?

Also let me make a note. I believe rose has the better cast and a much deeper team but I am not sure they will be able to over take the heats big 3. The Bulls seem more Balanced with Boozer and Noah and Rose and the out side sniper threat in Korver. I dont trust anyone outside of James/Wade/Bosh but still think it might be enough to take them to the finals.

fadedmario
05-13-2011, 01:40 AM
Good luck Miami!! We'll see if D-Rose is the "best" real soon. Lebron >>> Rose - D-Wade >>> Rose - Dirk >>> Rose - Durant >>> Rose

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:41 AM
Word is bond.
The RZA has more wisdom than the RZZZA.

Stats don't tell everything, there's intangibles that stats cannot encompass.

Maybe he meant Rose is the best in the NBA this season? Who knows what he meant or if he even really meant it.

One could argue that Rose's teammates have far greater intangibles than LeBron's teammates... but let's quit this ****.

My argument with this thread is that it's stupid, childish, would lead to a Rose dicksucking event, or a Rose vs. LeBron thread. My prediction was correct. Now the fact that it's still here in the NBA news forum is beyond me.

beasted86
05-13-2011, 01:44 AM
God damn some of you people are a joke. Extremely few people in this thread said they agreed with Josh Smith, yet they're getting attacked like they committed blasphemy and the majority of this thread is getting over taken with these "attacks." Many people have posed hypotheticals and situations in which they could interpret Rose being the best player.

Durant is not far superior then Rose. He is a better and more efficient scorer, but he's not nearly the playmaker Rose is (nor is expected to be), so when taking everything into account, it becomes very close.

And like I said, if the Bulls beat the Heat this series, and even win the NBA Finals, it's going to be hard to not say Rose isn't better than Lebron/Wade, and I think it's ludicrous for others to think it's such a landslide with no possibility under those circumstances.

But most said it was ludicrous to think of Rose as MVP before the season started, but we all saw how that turned out. So, all I can say is keep doubting.

The escape route. Good job leaving yourself an out, but I'd prefer you just make a stand on the subject regardless of the outcome of the series.

My opinion:
Regardless of what happens in the series, Rose is not the best player in the NBA. He's as good offensively as any player in the league right now, and he surely was the MVP of '11 because the Bulls had the best record, and would be nothing without him. But that's were it ends for Rose. He doesn't impact the defensive end at all. You put him on the Raptors and they are still the 112+ defensive rating Raptors. Howard's massive impact, LeBron & Wade's on ball ability & recover on defense, Kobe's ball denial and high defensive IQ, these are things that allow those guys to still be on a tier above Rose. They are leaders on both ends of the floor, and consistently impact both sides of the ball.

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:44 AM
Can you not get past the fact that Smith said it, and focus on the actual content of what said?

I'm talking to someone here... jeeeeeeeez

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:44 AM
Who says rose has a lesser cast? To me the bulls have a much better team because they are more balanced and deeper. Lol at your winning speech... If that is the case then nobody will be better then Bryant until he retires correct?

I said equal or inferior, no matter what way you spin it, they're close.

So, in Rose's first breakout year and having a legitimate team around him... and Lebron's first year of actually having a capable and legitimate team around him, and if Rose beats Lebron in this series and actually accomplishes something, in winning the title, why would Rose not be better if he accomplished something Lebron hasn't been able to?

Remember this is all in theory and hypothetical.

As for Bryant, very few will surpass his legacy of winning, correct. But as of now he's just not the same player. Poor comparison.

nickdymez
05-13-2011, 01:46 AM
I think so right now.. As far as skill set.. Not stats, but skills set... yes....

nickdymez
05-13-2011, 01:47 AM
I said equal or inferior, no matter what way you spin it, they're close.

So, in Rose's first breakout year and having a legitimate team around him... and Lebron's first year of actually having a capable and legitimate team around him, and if Rose beats Lebron in this series and actually accomplishes something, in winning the title, why would Rose not be better if he accomplished something Lebron hasn't been able to?

Remember this is all in theory and hypothetical.

As for Bryant, very few will surpass his legacy of winning, correct. But as of now he's just not the same player. Poor comparison.

********.. Lebron won 60 games twice.. Im sick of people saying Lebron didnt have pieces.. He had a team full of solid roll players....

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:48 AM
I said equal or inferior, no matter what way you spin it, they're close.

So, in Rose's first breakout year and having a legitimate team around him... and Lebron's first year of actually having a capable and legitimate team around him, and if Rose beats Lebron in this series and actually accomplishes something, in winning the title, why would Rose not be better if he accomplished something Lebron hasn't been able to?

Remember this is all in theory and hypothetical.

As for Bryant, very few will surpass his legacy of winning, correct. But as of now he's just not the same player. Poor comparison.

Its not a poor comparison because it was proving my point. You were putting everything on winning.. If that is all that matters Kobe takes the cake regardless of the fact his play has dropped off. The point was to show how flawed your thinking was. You were basing it all off because he wins a title. At least in that argument you were making.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:49 AM
The escape route. Good job leaving yourself an out, but I'd prefer you just make a stand on the subject regardless of the outcome of the series.

My opinion:
Regardless of what happens in the series, Rose is not the best player in the NBA. He's as good offensively as any player in the league right now, and he surely was the MVP of '11 because the Bulls had the best record, and would be nothing without him. But that's were it ends for Rose. He doesn't impact the defensive end at all. You put him on the Raptors and they are still the 112+ defensive rating Raptors. Howard's massive impact, LeBron & Wade's on ball ability & recover on defense, Kobe's ball denial and high defensive IQ, these are things that allow those guys to still be on a tier above Rose. They are leaders on both ends of the floor, and consistently impact both sides of the ball.

Rose is a good and above average defender, I expect you to see that in the upcoming series as we all already have.

The bolded is what many people disagree with, and I'm not even saying the bolded is true, actually as of right now I'd say it's not true just based on all of the efficiency and standard stats surrounding the game.

But, under my hypothetical situation, it would seem that Rose would have to overcome both Lebron and Wade, and eventually propel him to a title, it would seem to me that he's better than Lebron, because he accomplished something Lebron couldn't in their first year of having a capable team around them (and in Rose's case also being a breakout year).

Kashmir13579
05-13-2011, 01:49 AM
it's just an opinion, you can disagree with it but your opinions aren't any more meaningful and worthy than his.

Stephon Marbury once said he was the best point guard in the league.

5ass
05-13-2011, 01:50 AM
the bulls are playing great, im expecting atleast a game 6.. could go either way but i think the heat will come out on top

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 01:50 AM
... and that gold medal argument is trash too. come on JB

Well Gold Medal is the best you can get and it represents a country. Rose represented well winning on his first try while Lebron it took 3 tries.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:50 AM
********.. Lebron won 60 games twice.. Im sick of people saying Lebron didnt have pieces.. He had a team full of solid roll players....

Yeah I don't know, I was giving my debater (sp?) the benefit of the doubt, assuming he would use that thinking against my point.

CityofTreez
05-13-2011, 01:53 AM
I don't care what Josh Smith says.....

I say NO!

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:53 AM
********.. Lebron won 60 games twice.. Im sick of people saying Lebron didnt have pieces.. He had a team full of solid roll players....

Cut the head off of the snake...


The classic Kobe vs. LeBron argument: LeBron had good teammates and won tons of games... but the regular season doesn't matter FYI.

LeBron's teammates were complete garbage compared to the other big contenders and their casts. This is a fact.

Avenged
05-13-2011, 01:53 AM
Well Gold Medal is the best you can get and it represents a country. Rose represented well winning on his first try while Lebron it took 3 tries.

Kevin Durant, JB.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:55 AM
Its not a poor comparison because it was proving my point. You were putting everything on winning.. If that is all that matters Kobe takes the cake regardless of the fact his play has dropped off. The point was to show how flawed your thinking was. You were basing it all off because he wins a title. At least in that argument you were making.

Kobe is not in his prime and he did not win this year.

Lebron and Rose both have near equal supporting cases with no team having major edge.

Both in prime, who wins could be interpreted as being better, because one did what the other couldn't, win.

Either move on from this ridiculous Kobe comparison (who is completely beyond his prime and regressing as a player) and focus on the actual topic, or I'm done here.

beasted86
05-13-2011, 01:55 AM
Rose is a good and above average defender, I expect you to see that in the upcoming series as we all already have.

About as above average as Bosh is.

Playing on a great defensive team doesn't make him any better. Rose has never been known for his individual or system defense as seen by Jeff Teague having a break out party against him in one series, and Rondo averaging a triple double in another.

And I predict Bulls fans trying to tear into that comment as though it was meant to bait, but it's the truth/fact, so you won't find me responding back to any arguments about Rose's defense as there is nothing to argue.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 01:55 AM
Well Gold Medal is the best you can get and it represents a country. Rose represented well winning on his first try while Lebron it took 3 tries.

It was rose vs other countries?I thought he was on TEAM USA led by Kevin durant.
Wait. Lebron lost against other counties single handedly?
Come on.what a flawed argument.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 01:56 AM
About as above average as Bosh is.

Playing on a great defensive team doesn't make him any better. Rose has never been known for his individual or system defense as seen by Jeff Teague having a break out party against him in one series, and Rondo averaging a triple double in another.

And I predict Bulls fans trying to tear into that comment as though it was meant to bait, but it's the truth/fact, so you won't find me responding back to any arguments about Rose's defense as there is nothing to argue.

You'll change your mind on this topic in a couple days... 72 hours or so.

edit: Did you see the ridiculous shots that Teague were making?

Are you talking about the Rondo performance when Rose was in his rookie year, from which he's obviously progressed on both ends of the floor?

Not to mention, Rose getting the most votes of anyone not named to the All-Defensive Team, meaning he was right there with the great defenders of the league.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 01:57 AM
Kevin Durant, JB.

Nvm.here it is. Thanks :clap:

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 01:58 AM
Well Gold Medal is the best you can get and it represents a country. Rose represented well winning on his first try while Lebron it took 3 tries.

okay... it took Rose to his 3rd try to get to the second round. Arbitrary arguments are k3wl. I'm sure Christian Laettner is better than LeBron too cuz he was on the Dream Team!

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 01:59 AM
Kobe is not in his prime and he did not win this year.

Lebron and Rose both have near equal supporting cases with no team having major edge.

Both in prime, who wins could be interpreted as being better, because one did what the other couldn't, win.

Either move on from this ridiculous Kobe comparison (who is completely beyond his prime and regressing as a player) and focus on the actual topic, or I'm done here.

That is why I am using the Kobe Comparison because it is ridiculous and it shows how ridiculous your thought process is.

I can even go further if you want to use current skills with winning... Rondo... Rondo is worlds better as a defender and has won a title... Should we anoint him the best player as well?????

I am not a fan of rondo and would not put him in my top 10 but using your assessment he would be great correct?

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:01 AM
That is why I am using the Kobe Comparison because it is ridiculous and it shows how ridiculous your thought process is.

I can even go further if you want to use current skills with winning... Rondo... Rondo is worlds better as a defender and has won a title... Should we anoint him the best player as well?????

I am not a fan of rondo and would not put him in my top 10 but using your assessment he would be great correct?

Just because you can't comprehend my logic doesn't mean my thought process is ridiculous. Moving on...

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:02 AM
Both in prime, who wins could be interpreted as being better, because one did what the other couldn't, win.



And the point is not how you may determine who's better.all it means is that player's team is better.

Raph12
05-13-2011, 02:04 AM
1A. Lebron
1B. Dwight
1C. Wade
.
.
.
4A. Durant
4B. Kobe
4C. CP3
.
.
.
7A. Dirk
7B. Rose
7C. Pau
.
.
.
10A. Melo
10B. Stat
10C. DWill

... So no.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:06 AM
Can you prove the first point?(supporting cast point)

And the second point is not how you may determine who's better.all it means is that player's team is better.

Not when the team's supporting cast is equal or near equal, and the player's role on each same team is nearly equal.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:07 AM
1A. Lebron
1B. Dwight
1C. Wade
.
.
.
4A. Durant
4B. Kobe
4C. CP3
.
.
.
7A. Dirk
7B. Rose
7C. Pau
.
.
.
10A. Melo
10B. Stat
10C. DWill

... So no.

First of all, Rose played better than Kobe this year, or at the very very least, equal to. So that drops Rose down.

Why is CP3 not in the "1" category? Where are the Hornets w/o CP3... nowhere.

Pau equals Rose, give me a break.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:08 AM
Not when the team's supporting cast is equal or near equal, and the player's role on each same team is nearly equal.

But how can you say that making a case for best player?
It shouldn't have anything to do with their teams.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:11 AM
But how can you say that making a case for best player?
It shouldn't have anything to do with their teams.

When two equal teams meet,

winning and losing falls on their superstar in basketball more than nearly every other sport, that's how it goes

so why not judge them on that? because ultimately that's how their careers will be viewed

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 02:17 AM
Luv, Peace, Chicken Grease. I've had enough of this. I hope you guys enjoy the great PSD blackout that's going to occur on the eve of the Heat/Bulls series.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:18 AM
When two equal teams meet,

winning and losing falls on their superstar in basketball more than nearly every other sport, that's how it goes

so why not judge them on that? because ultimately that's how their careers will be viewed

Im sorry.i just don't see the logic.
You say two equal teams meet winning and losing falls on their superstar.
So, if bulls win, that makes rose better than lebron?

That just doesn't make sense to me.i understand you're backing up rose but if he were the best in the game and his team lost,i don't think you'd say player(insert inferior player here) would be better than rose because his team beat the bulls.

That's a flawed argument.

Raph12
05-13-2011, 02:18 AM
First of all, Rose played better than Kobe this year, or at the very very least, equal to. So that drops Rose down.

Why is CP3 not in the "1" category? Where are the Hornets w/o CP3... nowhere.

Pau equals Rose, give me a break.

Rose's numbers are similar to Kobe's, but in terms of bball IQ, skillset, strengths, weaknesses, etc all go to Kobe, edging Rose out.

CP3 had a pretty good season, but his numbers weren't near Lebron, Dwight or Wade's.

Pau's numbers were better than Rose's all year long, just because he had one bad playoffs run because he was being an emo *****, doesn't mean you just discard him.

beasted86
05-13-2011, 02:19 AM
When two equal teams meet,

winning and losing falls on their superstar in basketball more than nearly every other sport, that's how it goes

so why not judge them on that? because ultimately that's how their careers will be viewed

You are basically admitting Rose isn't as good as Wade or LeBron, but are giving yourself an out to jump and say "see I told you so" if the Bulls win.

How long can you ride the fence? Just be a man about it and say "I think Rose is better regardless" or "I think LeBron/Wade is better regardless". Because if one team wins this year, then the other comes back next year and dominates, your point of reference for who is better is a farce. You can't judge it on one series.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:22 AM
Im sorry.i just don't see the logic.
You say two equal teams meet winning and losing falls on their superstar.
So, if bulls win, that makes rose better than lebron?

That just doesn't make sense to me.i understand you're backing up rose but if he were the best in the game and his team lost,i don't think you'd say player(insert inferior player here) would be better than rose because his team beat the bulls.

That's a flawed argument.

I'm arguing that Rose wouldn't be inferior though because HE (being the clear #1 option on his team) beat Lebron (being the clear #1a option on his team), while having very similar supporting casts.

This is all hypothetical and an interesting topic, I don't think it's clear cut, just my way of looking at it.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:23 AM
All im saying is that regardless of who wins the bulls heat series, it's still the same best player.only difference is a win might separate the best or make the other gain ground but as of now I'm sure we know.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:24 AM
You are basically admitting Rose isn't as good as Wade or LeBron, but are giving yourself an out to jump and say "see I told you so" if the Bulls win.

How long can you ride the fence? Just be a man about it and say "I think Rose is better regardless" or "I think LeBron/Wade is better regardless". Because if one team wins this year, then the other comes back next year and dominates, your point of reference for who is better is a farce. You can't judge it on one series.

Right now both Wade and Lebron are better than Rose.

If the Bulls beat the Heat, along with Rose playing an obviously major role in that, I'm going to say Rose>Lebron and Wade.

That good?

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:26 AM
Rose's numbers are similar to Kobe's, but in terms of bball IQ, skillset, strengths, weaknesses, etc all go to Kobe, edging Rose out.

CP3 had a pretty good season, but his numbers weren't near Lebron, Dwight or Wade's.

Pau's numbers were better than Rose's all year long, just because he had one bad playoffs run because he was being an emo *****, doesn't mean you just discard him.

Rose was better than Kobe this year simply put in nearly every facet and his team has done more with less (most would not argue that last statement).

CP3 is an interesting topic, and I have a developed view on him, basically just him needing to do more for his team.

Pau was not better than Rose this year, just no way. His minor advantages in efficiency do not outmatch Rose's solid efficiency and tremendous efficiency all year long.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:26 AM
I'm arguing that Rose wouldn't be inferior though because HE (being the clear #1 option on his team) beat Lebron (being the clear #1a option on his team), while having very similar supporting casts.

This is all hypothetical and an interesting topic, I don't think it's clear cut, just my way of looking at it.

I get the hypothetical part.

Heres my take.
Lebron is the best.
Rose has passed people but TODAY or even after the series he still will not be the best.
Rose COULD (he has all the tools) be the best but that day is not now.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:27 AM
All im saying is that regardless of who wins the bulls heat series, it's still the same best player.only difference is a win might separate the best or make the other gain ground but as of now I'm sure we know.

I can respect that. :cool:

TheRunKiller
05-13-2011, 02:27 AM
he might not be the best player in the league but he does the most for his team

beasted86
05-13-2011, 02:30 AM
Right now both Wade and Lebron are better than Rose.

If the Bulls beat the Heat, along with Rose playing an obviously major role in that, I'm going to say Rose>Lebron and Wade.

That good?

So as I just pointed out, what happens if he loses this year, then comes back and beats them next year? Is he suddenly better next year?

Your logic makes no sense, but I digress, continue to leave yourself an out. It's a smart move.

RIPSweetness34
05-13-2011, 02:30 AM
no way. Top 10? Sure. But there is no way on earth Derrick Rose is the best player in the NBA. Sorry.

Youngest MVP ever, he's definately higher than top 10. Without a doubt top 5. He has accomplished more in 3 years than most do in a career and he is 21. If he beats Lebron and Wade YET AGAIN than I don't see how anyone on this site can argue against him.

RIPSweetness34
05-13-2011, 02:31 AM
he might not be the best player in the league but he does the most for his team

I would think that would make someone the best player, but if ur advanced stats aren't as high as they should be than you get docked points even though your winning games. Because stats are what matter, not wins.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:32 AM
So as I just pointed out, what happens if he loses this year, then comes back and beats them next year? Is he suddenly better next year?

Your logic makes no sense, but I digress, continue to leave yourself an out. It's a smart move.

Not leaving myself an out, next year is next year. That simple.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 02:33 AM
I can respect that. :cool:

:cheers:

I just can't wait for sunday. Im a rockets fan, but I appreciate what both do for their teams and respect both in their own. Sure to be a great series.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:35 AM
:cheers:

I just can't wait for sunday. Im a rockets fan, but I appreciate what both do for their teams and respect both in their own. Sure to be a great series.

Same man, should be great.

:cheers:

hawks4
05-13-2011, 02:36 AM
Are the Hawks ever going to get tired of being that 4-6 seed that gets knocked out in one of the first two rounds? I feel like this has happened yearly for 3 years now, and they're good enough that they'll be top 4 again next year, with another early exit.

Are you seriously taking shots at the Hawks being a Sixers fan?
:facepalm:

hugepatsfan
05-13-2011, 02:37 AM
Right now both Wade and Lebron are better than Rose.

If the Bulls beat the Heat, along with Rose playing an obviously major role in that, I'm going to say Rose>Lebron and Wade.

That good?

So after the 08 Finals you fealt that Pierce > Kobe, right?

I think that's a tremendously flawed way of looking at things. You can't judge individual rankings so heavily on a series outcome. Teams win series, not individuals. Obviously winning does have to play some role in individual rankings. I mean, after all, it is the primary objective of a sport (or it should be, at least). But to base individual rankings so heavily on team accomplishments is just foolish IMO.

sargon21
05-13-2011, 02:39 AM
So after the 08 Finals you fealt that Pierce > Kobe, right?

I think that's a tremendously flawed way of looking at things. You can't judge individual rankings so heavily on a series outcome. Teams win series, not individuals. Obviously winning does have to play some role in individual rankings. I mean, after all, it is the primary objective of a sport (or it should be, at least). But to base individual rankings so heavily on team accomplishments is just foolish IMO.

No, obviously production, roles, and efficiency have to be at least in the same realm as one another, and Lebron and Rose are close enough IMO to warrant that judgment.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 02:46 AM
No, obviously production, roles, and efficiency have to be at least in the same realm as one another, and Lebron and Rose are close enough IMO to warrant that judgment.

:laugh2:

Rose is as close to James as Pierce would be to Kobe. James is better on both sides of the ball... The only thing that has warranted your judgement seems to be general bias. Show me how Rose is better then Lebron?

WingZzz
05-13-2011, 02:50 AM
i'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

rofl!!!!!

Raph12
05-13-2011, 03:01 AM
Rose was better than Kobe this year simply put in nearly every facet and his team has done more with less (most would not argue that last statement).

CP3 is an interesting topic, and I have a developed view on him, basically just him needing to do more for his team.

Pau was not better than Rose this year, just no way. His minor advantages in efficiency do not outmatch Rose's solid efficiency and tremendous efficiency all year long.

Numberswise it's too close to say who is better, but Kobe is a better shooter, post player, defender, rebounder and overall scorer. Factor in that he's mentally as tough as they come, WAY smarter and doesn't rely heavily on his athleticism to do what he does; I don't see any reason to put Rose ahead of him. Btw referring to team success isn't a good way to compare players, anything could affect team success (ie: Pau and the bench sucking like *** in the playoffs)...

That's MVP, he's more deserving than Lebron and Wade for MVP, not for "best player" though. Lebron, Dwight and Wade are the best players in the league and it isn't close.

Only Rose's passing numbers are better than Pau's, that's it. He was a huge contributor for the Lakeshow in each of their last three playoffs runs, just because of one bad postseason, I'm not discarding him. He's a beast when focused, although it is a drop that his issues with his GF affect his on-court play. Rose gets a slight edge, but only slight, not enough to put him in another category.

FlashMacker
05-13-2011, 03:19 AM
I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.


I would too cuz hes younger

Supreme LA
05-13-2011, 04:09 AM
To answer your question. No. If every player is a free agent in the NBA, my first signing isn't going to be D-Rose.

And if Rose and the Bulls beat MIA? Would that make you rethink your opinion? For me, if Rose can lead his team and knock out Wade/Lebron/Bosh, I would say he is the best. This series is gonna determine that for me.

Let's see what happens.

Supreme LA
05-13-2011, 04:21 AM
So after the 08 Finals you fealt that Pierce > Kobe, right?

I think that's a tremendously flawed way of looking at things. You can't judge individual rankings so heavily on a series outcome. Teams win series, not individuals. Obviously winning does have to play some role in individual rankings. I mean, after all, it is the primary objective of a sport (or it should be, at least). But to base individual rankings so heavily on team accomplishments is just foolish IMO.

It's not flawed whatsoever. It's just that you don't consider the other angle. Think about it, Rose will be competing against a better overall team on paper in most other people's opinion and even yours I'm sure. The star power on the Heat is ridiculous. Wade & Lebron 2 of the top 4 players in the league and for Rose to beat both of them says a lot IMO.

Don't make comparison with the 08' Finals. Pierce wasn't better than Kobe. The Celtics obviously had the better team on paper and it proved to be true in the Finals. The Lakers that season had no Ariza, acquired Pau midseason, and didn't even have Bynum. The Lakers were the obvious underdog just as the Bulls are this time around.

Wouldn't you agree that Rose is basically the catalyst for the Bulls. He is their engine, their heart and soul, and he is the one guy in this league that you can truly say is leading his team to success. The whole offensive system is run through him. I hardly even see him without the ball and the Bulls look lost without him. I'm just amazed that he maintains that energy at such a high level and for so long. The kid is for real. He, along with Kobe and Wade are the top 3 most competitive guys in the league.

If the Bulls beat the Heat, it will be because of Rose and we all know it. If he beats the Heat, he will do so by taking on the whole team. That's just the way he plays.

Bulls beating the Heat equals Rose > Wade & Lebron for me.

nolin
05-13-2011, 04:35 AM
All im saying is that regardless of who wins the bulls heat series, it's still the same best player.only difference is a win might separate the best or make the other gain ground but as of now I'm sure we know.

If you believe this your crazy. if wade and bron or both better then the bulls best player. no way the bulls win. this series will have a major impact on who the best player in the league is. Not many players carry there team like rose has

xxxplicit69
05-13-2011, 04:35 AM
Lebron Dwyane James Wade are better.

LeBron yes, Wade no. Rose has the Better jumpshot and is only in hiss 3rd year. Also, both players rely on speed to slash to the bucket, only Rose is faster, making him better at that too. If WAde is flash, than what is Rose? :smoking:

Supreme LA
05-13-2011, 04:44 AM
LeBron yes, Wade no. Rose has the Better jumpshot and is only in hiss 3rd year. Also, both players rely on speed to slash to the bucket, only Rose is faster, making him better at that too. If WAde is flash, than what is Rose? :smoking:

That's funny because I have Wade being better than Lebron. It's clear when you watch the Heat play that Wade is the most competitive on the whole team. Lebron does what he does very well but he still lacks a lot of skills that you would come to expect the best player in the league should have.

Rose > Lebron & Wade if the Bulls win. Anybody who won't change their mind after this series is just in denial.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 05:24 AM
Lol @ people saying this 1 series will determine the best player in the league. So what if the Bulls beat the heat or the heat beat the bulls but either team loses to durant and his team in the finals does that then determine the best player in the league as well?

What exactly is the formula here? So we say to hell with statistics and track record and just pencil in the best because of this one 4-7 game series? What if Rose plays terrible and the bulls win??? Does Noah/Boozer Korver then get crowned the best? How about if James sucks and Wade goes off the entire series and the heat win? Does Wade surpass both Rose and James?

Every year its the same thing... Like I said before 3 years ago it was cp3... Last year it was Durant and this year its rose. Everyone likes to crown the next big cheese when there are already 2 at the top that nobody can touch in Howard and Lebron. Love him or hate him Lebron is it right now and Rose/CP3/Rondo and so on have a long way to go to be next to him and a series win wont bolster them that much to rank them as the best.

More-Than-Most
05-13-2011, 05:30 AM
If you believe this your crazy. if wade and bron or both better then the bulls best player. no way the bulls win. this series will have a major impact on who the best player in the league is. Not many players carry there team like rose has

Wrong... The Heat are good but the Bulls are favorites in my opinion. The heat have the big 3 but lack depth and bench help. I think the heat will win but even if wade and Bron play better then rose they could still lose.

TO to the CHI
05-13-2011, 05:52 AM
And Doc Rivers called Wade and Bron monsters. It's just post game humble pie

I think this sums it up pretty well actually. A nice compliment by Smith, but taken in context it means very little.


I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

Well, Rose is a lot younger, so this isn't equivalent to saying that Bucher thinks Rose is better. I think is a top 7 player, but is decidedly on the rise while some above him are on the decline or soon to be declining.

Looking forward to this series. The atmosphere at the UC will be electric.

nolin
05-13-2011, 05:59 AM
Lol @ people saying this 1 series will determine the best player in the league. So what if the Bulls beat the heat or the heat beat the bulls but either team loses to durant and his team in the finals does that then determine the best player in the league as well?

What exactly is the formula here? So we say to hell with statistics and track record and just pencil in the best because of this one 4-7 game series? What if Rose plays terrible and the bulls win??? Does Noah/Boozer Korver then get crowned the best? How about if James sucks and Wade goes off the entire series and the heat win? Does Wade surpass both Rose and James?

Every year its the same thing... Like I said before 3 years ago it was cp3... Last year it was Durant and this year its rose. Everyone likes to crown the next big cheese when there are already 2 at the top that nobody can touch in Howard and Lebron. Love him or hate him Lebron is it right now and Rose/CP3/Rondo and so on have a long way to go to be next to him and a series win wont bolster them that much to rank them as the best.


ummm dirk will be in the finals this year.

TO to the CHI
05-13-2011, 06:21 AM
Lol @ people saying this 1 series will determine the best player in the league. So what if the Bulls beat the heat or the heat beat the bulls but either team loses to durant and his team in the finals does that then determine the best player in the league as well?

What exactly is the formula here? So we say to hell with statistics and track record and just pencil in the best because of this one 4-7 game series? What if Rose plays terrible and the bulls win??? Does Noah/Boozer Korver then get crowned the best? How about if James sucks and Wade goes off the entire series and the heat win? Does Wade surpass both Rose and James?

Every year its the same thing... Like I said before 3 years ago it was cp3... Last year it was Durant and this year its rose. Everyone likes to crown the next big cheese when there are already 2 at the top that nobody can touch in Howard and Lebron. Love him or hate him Lebron is it right now and Rose/CP3/Rondo and so on have a long way to go to be next to him and a series win wont bolster them that much to rank them as the best.

In your first paragraph, your hypothetical doesn't really work because it doesn't match the logic that underlies the statement. Everyone has stated on multiple occassions that the Bulls are a one trick pony on offense. So if Rose (the one trick) is able to (apparently) single handedly beat the two best players in the game (or 2 of the top 5 consensus players), then it makes a statement. Durant winning it all doesn't make the same statement because of his teammates (and also because if it is Thunder vs. Bulls than his doing so would not involve beating 2 top 5 players). I don't really agree that Rose is the best in the league if the Bulls win the series, but I do think that the case becomes much stronger considering that it is very rare for an NBA to lose a series with the best 2 players on the floor (or 3 of the best 4). The last example I can think of would be the Lakers losing to the Pistons.

As for your second paragraph, the concept is that winning is paramount, not statistics. MJ is indisputably the best ever, but that recognition was largely earned not only because of his skill, but also due to his incredible competitiveness and ability to finish games and series. So if LeBron continues to stumble in the playoffs, at some point his huge statistics and incredible athletic talents might need to be viewed as no longer making him the best player in the league in light of his seeming lack of competitive fire and killer instinct on the court. Of course, LeBron winning it all (even with sidekicks) would help to dispell such arguments. I am not saying that one series should decide who is best, and I am certainly not of the mindset that it does, but to suggest that it is crazy to think so is simply an oversell.

As for the ridiculous what if scenario regarding the Bulls winning with Rose playing badly.......... I really don't think it warrants comment. I want the Bulls to win this series big time, but there is no chance of them doing so with Rose playing badly. His supporting cast is very underrated and Deng, Noah, Boozer, and the Bench Mob (and Thibs) are all great, but they aren't winning the series without a great performance from Rose.



Wrong... The Heat are good but the Bulls are favorites in my opinion. The heat have the big 3 but lack depth and bench help. I think the heat will win but even if wade and Bron play better then rose they could still lose.

I view the Heat as the favorites and am very interested at where Vegas places the line on the series.

magichatnumber9
05-13-2011, 07:03 AM
I love how people are saying no. ?really? This came from someone who has first hand knowledge of every player in the league! Taking this year as a sample I don't think you will find to many better then D Rose.

Raidaz4Life
05-13-2011, 07:31 AM
Rose is probably the best player in the league in the same world that Zach Randolph is the best power forward in the league.


Both are definitely up there but I still think there are more clear-cut choices over them.

305sportsfan
05-13-2011, 08:03 AM
he said that? wow....... I love all the rose praise. I have not heard one bad thing about this man. even watching his interview right now, the man is just soo humble

That's one thing I really like about this young guy! He's got a great attitude and demeanor, totally professional! He's definitely ascending the ladder in the league, but I wouldn't say he's at the top just yet. If he continues to produce, as he has been, then he'll only be making his case.

See ya on Sunday, for what WILL be a great series!

Best of luck to you Bulls!

jockrider
05-13-2011, 08:03 AM
I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

i'd take rose too,lebron would leave my team the first chance he gets:(

jockrider
05-13-2011, 08:08 AM
Why Dwight over Lebron?

He hasn't proven more than Lebron...

he did win a game in the finals and dwight is really dominant.

jockrider
05-13-2011, 08:10 AM
YES! Derrick Rose is pound for pound the best player in the NBA.
Sorry...but he is.

he's not even the best player at his position.

finalverse
05-13-2011, 08:39 AM
Lebron, Wade, and Rose are the top 3 players in no specific order IMO. These guys can score at will, are still relatively young and are huge playmakers for themselves and the rest of their team. I like Dwight also but as a center it's hard for him to take over a game since the ball has to be feed into him. Guys like Dirk and Durrant come after. I'm really dissapointed in Durrant...great scorers but that's about it.

daleja424
05-13-2011, 08:41 AM
I don't know if I agree with this...

Looking at the series, clearly Derrick Rose destroyed the Hawks and is the reason that the Bulls won the series... and from that standpoint Derrick Rose is clearly a very talented player

But it is really hard to ignore how inefficient he has been so far in the playoffs (numbers like 41.8% FG shooting and 12% TO rate from PG). So even though his scoring and assisting has been incredible at time, a lot of it has to do with the fact that he has an outrageous usage%.

For example (and I use these players only b/c I am most familiar with their stats) a guy like Dwyane Wade is putting up a better PER (despite less usage), much better FG%, and better TO rate and did so against a far better defense. Or Lebron who also puts up a better PER (despite less usage), a much better FG%, and a far lower TO rate.

All said, Derrick Rose is a fantastic basketball player, but I think Smith is jumping the gun by making a statement like that. Derrick Rose needs to improve his efficiency before he should be mentioned as BEST on the league.

mttwlsn16
05-13-2011, 08:50 AM
I love how people are saying no. ?really? This came from someone who has first hand knowledge of every player in the league! Taking this year as a sample I don't think you will find to many better then D Rose.

lebron

ne3xchamps
05-13-2011, 08:54 AM
And Doc Rivers called Wade and Bron monsters. It's just post game humble pie

this. it happens at the end of every series. nothing new. Even though they may hate the individual they are referring to, its just respect.

Greet
05-13-2011, 08:58 AM
this. it happens at the end of every series. nothing new. Even though they may hate the individual they are referring to, its just respect.

Calling D-Rose the best player in the league is disrespect to the NBA

ne3xchamps
05-13-2011, 09:04 AM
Calling D-Rose the best player in the league is disrespect to the NBA

settle down. disrespect to the whole NBA?? that's a little overboard. So you think EVERY player in the NBA feels disrespected because of what josh smith said?? wow. just wow.

justinnum1
05-13-2011, 09:04 AM
Josh smith is one of the dumbest mother ****ers on this planet...this was just a dumb comment coming from his dumb ***

daleja424
05-13-2011, 09:06 AM
this really is common place after a series... a sign of respect to the player who just gave them a beat down...

ne3xchamps
05-13-2011, 09:06 AM
Josh smith is one of the dumbest mother ****ers on this planet...this was just a dumb comment coming from his dumb ***

Its not that big of a deal. Maybe he was buttering Drose up cause he wants to play in chicago? :shrug:

Greet
05-13-2011, 09:07 AM
settle down. disrespect to the whole NBA?? that's a little overboard. So you think EVERY player in the NBA feels disrespected because of what josh smith said?? wow. just wow.

I would feel that Lebron, Wade, Howard, Kobe, Dirk, etc. felt disrespected.

NYKSpiritBomb
05-13-2011, 09:19 AM
i would say lebron is the best player right now hands down. he finally got over his autism.

pebloemer
05-13-2011, 09:25 AM
Josh smith is one of the dumbest mother ****ers on this planet...this was just a dumb comment coming from his dumb ***

No need to get excited. Happens all the time in the NBA. As others suggested it is credit to an incredible player that just took it to his team. Artest once said Roy was the hardest player to guard in the league. It really is far less about the other quality players in the league and far more about the player that his team couldn't stop...

ttam68
05-13-2011, 09:28 AM
Josh Smith is well known for his decision making

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 09:28 AM
If you believe this your crazy. if wade and bron or both better then the bulls best player. no way the bulls win. this series will have a major impact on who the best player in the league is. Not many players carry there team like rose has

You made this thread yet you have the audacity to claim I'm the crazy one.

Let me get this straight.

miami wins-theyre supposed to cuz lebron is the best.
Chicago wins- rose is better than lebron when we know bulls have a more complete roster?

Seems like in favor of rose.
Idc that he carries his team. I feel their defense carries their team as well.

This one series won't change the best player in the league.

Its heat vs. bulls
Not james vs. rose

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 09:32 AM
Rose is better then D-Wade im sorry.......Don't let scorin be the Factor, cause outside of that Rose as jus as Eilite as Wade, Let Rose have had Shaq or h3ll Lamar, for that mattter an see how much Rose could have Flourished......

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 09:36 AM
Rose is better then D-Wade im sorry.......Don't let scorin be the Factor, cause outside of that Rose as jus as Eilite as Wade, Let Rose have had Shaq or h3ll Lamar, for that mattter an see how much Rose could have Flourished......

Its not just scoring

One scores more efficiently while playing amazing d.
One doesn't.

ne3xchamps
05-13-2011, 09:36 AM
Rose is better then D-Wade im sorry.......Don't let scorin be the Factor, cause outside of that Rose as jus as Eilite as Wade, Let Rose have had Shaq or h3ll Lamar, for that mattter an see how much Rose could have Flourished......

rose has done just fine for himself though. That is why IMO it was better for chicago that lebron didn't go there. We wouldn't have seen drose mature and elevate his game.

Tarheels23
05-13-2011, 09:40 AM
Rose is progressing better than anyone outside of Chicago could ever imagine, but he is no where near the best player in the league.

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 09:43 AM
Its not just scoring

One scores more efficiently while playing amazing d.One doesn't.

Who Plays amazin D,? not Wade?? He has okay D but defintley not Amazin as u said

justinnum1
05-13-2011, 09:50 AM
Who Plays amazin D,? not Wade?? He has okay D but defintley not Amazin as u said

He played ray allen amazing in the games, shut down allen for 4 games.

king4day
05-13-2011, 09:51 AM
Between he and Lebron.
People say things in the moment as we saw with Randolph being called the best PF in basketball right now.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 09:52 AM
Who Plays amazin D,? not Wade?? He has okay D but defintley not Amazin as u said

I'm not going to argue if wade plays amazing d or not.i feel he does so its besides the point.the point is wade is better than rose because he just"scores"

As you say.

Yet I told you that wade is better on offense AND defense.

tredigs
05-13-2011, 09:55 AM
Between he and Lebron.
People say things in the moment as we saw with Randolph being called the best PF in basketball right now.

Do you honestly believe that? Wade is better both ways, Howard is far more dominant, CP3 has skills and knowledge of the game he will likely never possess, Durant PROVED he was the far superior player when they teamed up this summer. I'd take Dirk over him as well, with 5 others being arguable. He comes in around ~8 for me at this point.

Cool007
05-13-2011, 10:01 AM
Top 5 but not the best

This.

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 10:26 AM
He played ray allen amazing in the games, shut down allen for 4 games.

Really he shut down an 35-36 yr old Ray ray, terrific, An i'm not sure he shut Ray down as u claim...

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 10:29 AM
I'm not going to argue if wade plays amazing d or not.i feel he does so its besides the point.the point is wade is better than rose because he just"scores"

As you say.

Yet I told you that wade is better on offense AND defense.

Fair Enuff, but the decesion makin IMO makes Rose better, cause he has so much more responibility outside of jus bein a high scorer, he is also the engine to his team Literally.....

Greet
05-13-2011, 10:32 AM
Between he and Lebron.
People say things in the moment as we saw with Randolph being called the best PF in basketball right now.

You think that D-Rose is the best player in the NBA...or second best?

Holy ****....this forum must be going down-hill.

miller74
05-13-2011, 10:37 AM
So does the NBA, this year anyway

Geargo Wallace
05-13-2011, 10:38 AM
Fair Enuff, but the decesion makin IMO makes Rose better, cause he has so much more responibility outside of jus bein a high scorer, he is also the engine to his team Literally.....

Derrick Rose is actually an engine? Aren't humans only allowed to play in the NBA?

Eightyfive Y'aw
05-13-2011, 10:38 AM
Josh Smith says DRose is the best player in the league

Nice compliment. Mr. Smith you too are a baller even if your midrange was slumping, you were hitting 'em last night and keep on keepin on you got a bright future.

Dstmccoy
05-13-2011, 10:41 AM
Who cares what Josh Smith says, if it were one of the top 5 saying it themselves then you have a worthy post.

ManRam
05-13-2011, 10:43 AM
I disagree pretty strongly, but he's entitled to his opinion. If the Heat knocked him out he might sing a different tune. If the Magic knocked him out he might sing a different tune. It's not totally ridiculous because he's certainly top 5-7, but I do think it's very hard to argue it being true from an objective stance.

But again, people are entitled to their opinions...and 95% of what goes on on this site is just that: opinion.

mikealike305
05-13-2011, 10:55 AM
Fair Enuff, but the decesion makin IMO makes Rose better, cause he has so much more responibility outside of jus bein a high scorer, he is also the engine to his team Literally.....

sooooo your saying wade is just a high scorer?
also. idk if u remember, but lebron and bosh havnt always been in miami.
wade did it all in miami every year other than with shaq, and even then wade still was the primary guy

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 10:57 AM
okay... it took Rose to his 3rd try to get to the second round. Arbitrary arguments are k3wl. I'm sure Christian Laettner is better than LeBron too cuz he was on the Dream Team!

Two can play that game. It took Lebron his 3rd try to make the playoffs.
And I didn't know Laettner won a league MVP or was considered an all nba team member?

Greet
05-13-2011, 11:00 AM
Two can play that game. It took Lebron his 3rd try to make the playoffs.
And I didn't know Laettner won a league MVP or was considered an all nba team member?

Oh lord............

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 11:03 AM
Rose's numbers are similar to Kobe's, but in terms of bball IQ, skillset, strengths, weaknesses, etc all go to Kobe, edging Rose out.

CP3 had a pretty good season, but his numbers weren't near Lebron, Dwight or Wade's.

Pau's numbers were better than Rose's all year long, just because he had one bad playoffs run because he was being an emo *****, doesn't mean you just discard him.

Sorry no, this is an epic fail, Kobe's numbers weren't similar to Rose's, Rose led his team in WIN SHARES, WS/PER 48 minutes and PER while Kobe led his team in PER, but was 2nd in WS by a considerable margin and 4th in WS/PER 48 minutes.

Greet
05-13-2011, 11:06 AM
Sorry no, this is an epic fail, Kobe's numbers weren't similar to Rose's, Rose led his team in WIN SHARES, WS/PER 48 minutes and PER while Kobe led his team in PER, but was 2nd in WS by a considerable margin and 4th in WS/PER 48 minutes.

They play similar styles though. They're both not very good passers, both of them jack up dumb shots, both of them are average rebounders, but Kobe plays D while Rose is under-average defender.

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 11:11 AM
Fair Enuff, but the decesion makin IMO makes Rose better, cause he has so much more responibility outside of jus bein a high scorer, he is also the engine to his team Literally.....

If hes the engine.

Defense is their brakes. That's what stops people.
Their defense is just as important to their success if not more.

And to say his decision making is better...I'm not sure. Look at the turnover rating of the two, granted that's not all decision making involves.

KingPosey
05-13-2011, 11:21 AM
The best player in the NBA. Is he right?

lol of course he isnt right. Wht even ask the question?

Oh, i see your avatar now. Im shocked.....

KingPosey
05-13-2011, 11:23 AM
I'm not saying he is right, but bucher the other day said he would take rose over lebron to start a franchise.

Then Bucher is an idiot.

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 11:25 AM
sooooo your saying wade is just a high scorer?
also. idk if u remember, but lebron and bosh havnt always been in miami.
wade did it all in miami every year other than with shaq, and even then wade still was the primary guy

Right! which is my point, the only Tiltle Wade had was with another Elite player in shaq, After Shaq bounced Miami was Bad at best, didn't sniff the Playoffs for a minute, Same with DRose, minus the title of course but the bulls team haven't advanced this far since the Jordan Era, An Rose is doin this w/out havin aquired the likes of Bron, Wade or bosh, which they tried, yet got a 2nd tier elite player in Boozer.. Rose is better then Wade but not Lebron yet! an the only thng that Lebron really an truly have on DRose, is Size an the athletic ability at that size, If Lebron was DRose Height....He'd be better.....I'm sure u heard the Isiah quote a time or two....

WeBallin
05-13-2011, 11:29 AM
Then Bucher is an idiot.

Why? Cause he wants to start his team with the Most Athletic PG in the League....U know there's a Dozen or so, Who are dyin to get an Elite PG... Some teams who had an elite PG may have still been in today's playoff race had they had one...

Da Knicks
05-13-2011, 11:29 AM
I see the Nets and Sixers surpassing the Hawks next year. Sixers will the the 3rd or 4th seed Nets and Knicks with fight for thr 5th and 6th.

wtf lmao:facepalm:

northsider
05-13-2011, 11:30 AM
They play similar styles though. They're both not very good passers, both of them jack up dumb shots, both of them are average rebounders, but Kobe plays D while Rose is under-average defender.

Rose will def. jack up shots but, to go with the rest of what you say it truly shows that you did 0 research or I doubt you really care to pay attention to Rose cause 1. He isn't a below avg. defender he is def. an avg. defender at least and 2. Rose is also a decent passer. I don't even know how you came up with those 2 unless you were just thinking you could spew something out too support your argument.

And no I am not a Rose fanboy but, I feel like if your going to just make stuff up you deserve to be called out on it.

ChiSoxJuan
05-13-2011, 11:30 AM
I'll put this real simple. Right now LBJ is likely to be remembered in the light of Wilt Chamberlain:a Legendary player who couldn't compel his team to championships. Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ: a Legendary playmaker who did compel his team to championships. Who will be remembered more?

mikealike305
05-13-2011, 11:33 AM
Right! which is my point, the only Tiltle Wade had was with another Elite player in shaq, After Shaq bounced Miami was Bad at best, didn't sniff the Playoffs for a minute, Same with DRose, minus the title of course but the bulls team haven't advanced this far since the Jordan Era, An Rose is doin this w/out havin aquired the likes of Bron, Wade or bosh, which they tried, yet got a 2nd tier elite player in Boozer.. Rose is better then Wade but not Lebron yet! an the only thng that Lebron really an truly have on DRose, is Size an the athletic ability at that size, If Lebron was DRose Height....He'd be better.....I'm sure u heard the Isiah quote a time or two....

u cant compare thye cast rose has now to any cast wade has had pre lebron. wade was forc to do so much more. hell, rose doesnt even have to play D and the bulls are still the best defensive team in the leauge. wade HAD to play amazing D everynight. plus that terrible year, wade had that injury that kept him out most of the season. so kind of a bad argument as to rose is better than wade.
rose isnt better than wade. rose is a top 5 player but not better than wade.
wade scores much more efficiently and plays much better D than rose

mikealike305
05-13-2011, 11:37 AM
I'll put this real simple. Right now LBJ is likely to be remembered in the light of Wilt Chamberlain:a Legendary player who couldn't compel his team to championships. Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ: a Legendary playmaker who did compel his team to championships. Who will be remembered more?

oh rose has led his team to chamionships?? i didnt realize?? so he not only already won one, he has multiple rings?? i see, yea rose will be remembered more :facepalm:

Htownballa1622
05-13-2011, 11:39 AM
Right! which is my point, the only Tiltle Wade had was with another Elite player in shaq, After Shaq bounced Miami was Bad at best, didn't sniff the Playoffs for a minute, Same with DRose, minus the title of course but the bulls team haven't advanced this far since the Jordan Era, An Rose is doin this w/out havin aquired the likes of Bron, Wade or bosh, which they tried, yet got a 2nd tier elite player in Boozer.. Rose is better then Wade but not Lebron yet! an the only thng that Lebron really an truly have on DRose, is Size an the athletic ability at that size, If Lebron was DRose Height....He'd be better.....I'm sure u heard the Isiah quote a time or two....

I disagree with this entire post.(i sure have been defending a team that's not even mine alot lately) I'll tell you what.

Lebron isn't just bigger and more athletic.
His numbers are pretty much better across the board.

Isiah = :facepalm:

This isn't boxing.there's no weight class. Theres no pound for pound, inch for inch best player.theres just the best imo.we can't judge what ifs.

Check this out. Chuck hayes would be a better defender than dwight if he was dwights height.i would love for this to be true but I can't just make an assumption about that.

JordansBulls
05-13-2011, 11:41 AM
They play similar styles though. They're both not very good passers, both of them jack up dumb shots, both of them are average rebounders, but Kobe plays D while Rose is under-average defender.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Do you even watch basketball man? This post is terrible.

RZZZA
05-13-2011, 11:41 AM
I'll put this real simple. Right now LBJ is likely to be remembered in the light of Wilt Chamberlain:a Legendary player who couldn't compel his team to championships. Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ: a Legendary playmaker who did compel his team to championships. Who will be remembered more?

propel, not compel.

the power of Christ compels you!

SteBO
05-13-2011, 11:45 AM
They play similar styles though. They're both not very good passers, both of them jack up dumb shots, both of them are average rebounders, but Kobe plays D while Rose is under-average defender.

:confused:

I'm a Heat fan, and you couldn't be more wrong here. When your other offensive options are inconsistent on the offensive side, Rose has no choice but to jack up shots. Boozer never realized it was the playoffs until last night, Noah isn't a scorer to begin with, Deng has been consistent but he can be contained by most teams, and Kyle Korver has been ice cold these days. That leaves you with Taj Gibson, Keith Bogans, Ronnie Brewer, and Omer Asik, and asking them to score points really makes me laugh. That's why everyone bashing Kobe all those years, really have little knowledge about the game of basketball. Rose is in a tough pickle in this series if the Bulls can't find ways to generate enough offense. Saying Rose is a chucker without exploring the source of the prroblem isn't a smart thing to do my friend.

ManRam
05-13-2011, 11:47 AM
I'll put this real simple. Right now LBJ is likely to be remembered in the light of Wilt Chamberlain:a Legendary player who couldn't compel his team to championships. Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ: a Legendary playmaker who did compel his team to championships. Who will be remembered more?

This post is utterly hilarious.

How has Rose carried a team further than LeBron? LeBron has gotten to the Finals with way less than what Rose has now. He's been a leader on far more successful teams. Rose hasn't had 1/2 as good of a career as LeBron has at this point.

This is a joke...right?

Let's let Rose win something first before we start comparing him to Michael Jordan for Christ's sake. Wow...

ChiSoxJuan
05-13-2011, 11:49 AM
The championships will come for Rose. Mark my words. MJ himself gave that forecast.

SteBO
05-13-2011, 11:49 AM
I'll put this real simple. Right now LBJ is likely to be remembered in the light of Wilt Chamberlain:a Legendary player who couldn't compel his team to championships. Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ: a Legendary playmaker who did compel his team to championships. Who will be remembered more?


The championships will come for Rose. Mark my words. MJ himself gave that forecast.


:laugh: Stop it, you're killing me. :laugh:

Tarheels23
05-13-2011, 11:50 AM
The championships will come for Rose. Mark my words. MJ himself gave that forecast.

MJ also thought that Kwame Brown was a franchise player

ManRam
05-13-2011, 11:51 AM
The championships will come for Rose. Mark my words. MJ himself gave that forecast.

Wow. MJ (the guy running the mighty Bobcats) said he thinks Rose (a player on the team he played for) will win some championships.

What an amazing statement.

ChiSoxJuan
05-13-2011, 11:51 AM
I guess it wasn't simple minded enough for some. It's obviously a PROGNISTICATION. What part of "likely to be remembered" do you not understand?

SteBO
05-13-2011, 11:53 AM
I guess it wasn't simple minded enough for some. It's obviously a PROGNISTICATION. What part of "likely to be remembered" do you not understand?

And the fact that you're saying LeBron won't be remembered is what's funny.

mikealike305
05-13-2011, 11:54 AM
The championships will come for Rose. Mark my words. MJ himself gave that forecast.

oh MJ said it??? ohn that case lets just hand him the ring now. why even keep playing??? MJ said he would right? i thought MJ played basketball but apperently hes miss cleo.

:facepalm:

stop posting dude

ManRam
05-13-2011, 11:54 AM
I guess it wasn't simple minded enough for some. It's obviously a PROGNISTICATION. What part of "likely to be remembered" do you not understand?

Oh wait. I get it. You must be from S. Beach, Miami where English is your 2nd language.

You said, "right now Rose will be remembered in the light of MJ".


You're really gonna defend that? LeBron is a helluva a lot closer to being remember like MJ than Rose is at this point in their careers (neither should be, period).

And save the jabs and baiting. Just back your argument up.

ChiSoxJuan
05-13-2011, 11:57 AM
LBJ reminds me of Shawn Kemp. He won't even be remembered as much as Joe Dumars when it comes down to championship caliber shots.