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Detroit's Time
05-09-2011, 03:41 PM
Dirk is without a doubt a terrific player, but he's definitely not a top 10 player in NBA history. Probably just Rick patting his player on the back.

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nba/news/story?id=6514530

Jays101
05-09-2011, 03:44 PM
let him win a ring first. might get it this year

210Don
05-09-2011, 03:45 PM
LMAO!
the mavs get full of themselves so quickley you have had a easy road to the wcf....

Savage Sunday
05-09-2011, 03:46 PM
Thats ridiculous.

Dirk isnt even a Top 30 player of All-Time let alone Top 10.

Hes the best European important to the NBA, but that is where the props stop.

llemon
05-09-2011, 03:46 PM
Probably the best shooting 7-footer ever.

iggypop123
05-09-2011, 03:47 PM
lets see a random list of players. jordan, kobe, jabar, shaq, duncan, hakeem, . i havent even finished and he isnt close to the list

Supreme LA
05-09-2011, 03:47 PM
Top 10 shot makers of all-time yes. Top 10 most unguardable an offensive threats yes. Top 10 "player"? NO. He hasn't even won a title yet. Dirk is a incredible player but you could easily say Jason Kidd, Terry, Barea, and Peja had just as much to do with beating the Lakers.

P

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 03:48 PM
you meant Top 100 Rickie?

you woudl ahve a point there.

Swashcuff
05-09-2011, 03:52 PM
I can't stand when coaches say stupid stuff like this. I bet in 4 seasons when he's coaching another team with another stud player at the lead he'll be saying the very same thing about that player. SMH. Good coach. Dumb comment.

camador22
05-09-2011, 04:00 PM
I do think Dirk is the most underrated player of this era (post Jordan). If Dallas manages to win a title then I think he is a legit candidate to be a top 20 player of all time. Dallas hasn't missed the post season since longer then I could remember and he's always been the main guy. I also think he's the best shooting big man of all time so that should be worth something.

Tanakid777
05-09-2011, 04:07 PM
Top 30. Will finish top 18-20. This is obvious to people who overrate guys from the early days of the NBA

LTBaByyy
05-09-2011, 04:10 PM
He is already like #31in the top 100 all time players I think....

And he is only like 32 years old? He has 7/8 years left the way he plays

He def is not currently, but if he gets 1 or 2 titles at the end of his career he might be close to it like 10-15

twoearl
05-09-2011, 04:11 PM
lmao. This dosen't even deserve a response...

shep33
05-09-2011, 04:12 PM
I love Dirk, but there is no way he's top 10. Best European NBA player ever IMO, Sabonis pre-injury was also a stud, not top international player though, I think Hakeem is still boss there.

Jaji
05-09-2011, 04:12 PM
If he was a better defender than yes. Guy is an amazing talent. 7 footer with 25 foot range. Unbelievable. He rebounds with the best of them too. If he had established himself as a shot changer throughout his career then I would have to agree. He's a great player. An elite talent for sure. Definite HOFer. Once you reach that level, does it really matter? Everyone's top 10 is different with the exception of 2 or 3 players who are mainstays.

sep11ie
05-09-2011, 04:12 PM
A 7 foot PF that averages 8 rebs a game for his career and plays no D is not a top 10 overall player. Maybe he meant top 10 PF?

gsgs49
05-09-2011, 04:13 PM
I do think Dirk is the most underrated player of this era (post Jordan). If Dallas manages to win a title then I think he is a legit candidate to be a top 20 player of all time. Dallas hasn't missed the post season since longer then I could remember and he's always been the main guy. I also think he's the best shooting big man of all time so that should be worth something.

He's an underrated superstar I agree and maybe his team failure in the playoffs is the reason despite him being great and consistent in the playoffs.
I believe that he would end as a top 30 player but top 10 all time? no ****ing way,this is just a dumb comment by Carlise
There is 15-20 players Dirk can't pass even if he wins multiple championships,his defense liability is the main reason.

shep33
05-09-2011, 04:18 PM
He is already like #31in the top 100 all time players I think....

And he is only like 32 years old? He has 7/8 years left the way he plays

He def is not currently, but if he gets 1 or 2 titles at the end of his career he might be close to it like 10-15

I agree, I think he can finish around 15-20, but he needs titles still. 1 but probably 2 atleast to be considered in that category. Still very capable of doing so. This year is a good shot, Mavs have to take advantage.

MacFitz92
05-09-2011, 04:22 PM
LMAO!
the mavs get full of themselves so quickley you have had a easy road to the wcf....

Portland Trailblazers and the two time defending champs.

Ok.

M.Bibby2.0
05-09-2011, 04:24 PM
hmmm IMHO the whole ring argument is stupid. No one player has every won a championship by themselves, for example Kobe has had a better supporting cast every year the lakers have won a championship..

Sure dirk could've abandoned ship, signed with the spurs cavs or phx in previous years, teamed up with other big names and won championships, but i don't think that makes him any better of a player. If anything, i think his legacy is greater if he wins a ring being the only superstar on his team. I respect that more than Kobe's 5 championships backed with 90 million dollar rosters, Phil, and several all star caliber players on his team..

With all that being said he's still not a top 10 all time talent, but top 15 is arguable, this guy is a playoff performer big time, and has not regressed with age, you cant say that about many other players...

redsox0717
05-09-2011, 04:25 PM
Top 10 All-time?

:laugh: :laugh2: :laugh: :laugh2: :laugh: :dance: :laugh: :laugh2: :laugh: :laugh2: :laugh:

I'm not sure why that dance is in there, guess I got carried away

Crackadalic
05-09-2011, 04:25 PM
No. Top 10 Pf? Maybe but not top 10 ever

BlueJayFanDan
05-09-2011, 04:25 PM
On the subject of Dirk being a top 10 player all time. I am a die hard Mavs fan and Dirk is my favorite player ever most likely, but he is not top 10 overall all time. I can easily think of 10 better than him. I love the guy but shut up Carlisle. Carlisle is a horrible coach and kind of a moron. Probably just trying to be nice and amp up his players.


LMAO!
the mavs get full of themselves so quickley you have had a easy road to the wcf....

This is among the most ignorant statements I have heard in a long time and it is statements like this why I avoid the pathetic NBA forum most of the time. We had to go through the Blazers who are a very strong team with good depth and have a lot of talent. A very difficult team to beat. Then, we had to face a team that made the finals 3 straight years, who has probably the best player in the world in Kobe, has 3 big men in Odom, Gasol, and Bynum who make a very difficult trio to match up against. The Lakers are a great Basketball team with a lot of talent and veteran leadership. To say we had an easy road by playing Portland and the Lakers is just completely ignorant and shows a complete lack of Basketball knowledge. Also, considering the Blazers were the "sexy" upset pick in the first round, and just about every "expert" besides Charles Barkley had the Lakers winning the series also proves your statement to be completely asinine. An easy road would have been New Orleans and then maybe like San Antonio. This was not an easy road...

sep11ie
05-09-2011, 04:30 PM
On the subject of Dirk being a top 10 player all time. I am a die hard Mavs fan and Dirk is my favorite player ever most likely, but he is not top 10 overall all time. I can easily think of 10 better than him. I love the guy but shut up Carlisle. Carlisle is a horrible coach and kind of a moron. Probably just trying to be nice and amp up his players.



This is among the most ignorant statements I have heard in a long time and it is statements like this why I avoid the pathetic NBA forum most of the time. We had to go through the Blazers who are a very strong team with good depth and have a lot of talent. A very difficult team to beat. Then, we had to face a team that made the finals 3 straight years, who has probably the best player in the world in Kobe, has 3 big men in Odom, Gasol, and Bynum who make a very difficult trio to match up against. The Lakers are a great Basketball team with a lot of talent and veteran leadership. To say we had an easy road by playing Portland and the Lakers is just completely ignorant and shows a complete lack of Basketball knowledge. Also, considering the Blazers were the "sexy" upset pick in the first round, and just about every "expert" besides Charles Barkley had the Lakers winning the series also proves your statement to be completely asinine. An easy road would have been New Orleans and then maybe like San Antonio. This was not an easy road...


Of course its an ignorant comment. Look who made it.

BlueJayFanDan
05-09-2011, 04:32 PM
Of course its an ignorant comment. Look who made it.

I have no clue who he is. Like I said, I am not in the NBA forum often.

justinnum1
05-09-2011, 04:33 PM
:facepalm:

rapjuicer06
05-09-2011, 04:34 PM
and he's wrong

smith&wesson
05-09-2011, 04:38 PM
bill russle
jordan
oscar
bird
magic
kobe
kareem
hakeem
shaq
pippen
duncan
barkley
stockton
malone


hmmm i think dirk can be in the 20-30 range.

dont tell me barkley shouldnt be up there. if you compare his stats to duncan they are almost identicle. and barkley was listed as 6'6.

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 04:43 PM
no way in the depths of hell. and i like Dirk

JordansBulls
05-09-2011, 04:46 PM
Top 20 to 25 maybe.

shep33
05-09-2011, 04:46 PM
hmmm IMHO the whole ring argument is stupid. No one player has every won a championship by themselves, for example Kobe has had a better supporting cast every year the lakers have won a championship.. Sure dirk could've abandoned ship, signed with the spurs cavs or phx in previous years, teamed up with other big names and won championships, but i don't think that makes him any better of a player. If anything, i think his legacy is greater if he wins a ring being the only superstar on his team. I respect that more than Kobe's 5 championships backed with 90 million dollar rosters, Phil, and several all star caliber players on his team..

With all that being said he's still not a top 10 all time talent, but top 15 is arguable, this guy is a playoff performer big time, and has not regressed with age, you cant say that about many other players...

Are you comparing this to Dirk's over the years? Or just in general?

First off Dirk is a great player, a spectacular player, but there is no way he is a top 10 player of all-time. Whether we like it or not, rings play a big deal and I'm a supporter of that theory.

Either way, I have to disagree here, people forget that the Mavs have had the highest salary cap over the past decade. The Mavs have had stacked teams in the past, the Lakers dynasties with Kobe have had some of the worst benches in NBA history for a championship caliber team. Let's be honest with ourselves, the Shaq-Kobe 3 peat was on them, yes they had a good supporting cast, but those guys dominated. The Mavs this year even have pretty much an identical salary cap to the Lakers. I don't think any team has spent as much money as the Mavs over the past decade, maybe outside of the Isiah's Knicks, and they've had teams with unbelievable supporting casts, but they just didn't mesh together right.

enserio
05-09-2011, 04:47 PM
greatest of all time? like foreva eva?

gsgs49
05-09-2011, 04:50 PM
A 7 foot PF that averages 8 rebs a game for his career and plays no D is not a top 10 overall player. Maybe he meant top 10 PF?

Dirk is really and underrated rebounder,he's an above average rebounder.
He has a career DRB% of 22.0 that's pretty good.
But the offensive rebounds hurt him,his ORB% is 3.8.
The reason of this difference is Dirk type of play,he doesn't play in the paint so he doesn't get offensive rebounds or putbacks.
DRB%/ORB%= 22/3.8= 5.79
Let's compare it to other players with similiar heights.
Duncan DRB%/ORB%=26.3/10.1= 2.6
Robinson DRB%/ORB%=23.4/10.6= 2.2
Olajuwon DRB%/ORB%=23.8/10.3= 2.31
O'neal DRB%/ORB%=23.6/11.7= 2.02

gsgs49
05-09-2011, 04:54 PM
No. Top 10 Pf? Maybe but not top 10 ever

Maybe? :laugh2:

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 05:00 PM
the sure better than Dirk List:Oscar robertson,Barkley,Mikan, MIkkelsen, Wilt, kareem, West, Baylor, Magic, Kobe, Shaq,Thurmond, Rick barry, Moses Malone, Hakeem, Clyde Drexler, Ducan, Robinson, george Gervin,Stockton, K malone, maravich, Bill Walton, MJ,Pippen, I Thomas, Wade,Petit, Wilkins,Hayes, Dr J,Earl Monrow, Frzier,Reed, Ewing,Bird, Mchale, Cowens, Russell, Havlicek , Cousy, Kg


The ones you can deffend as Arguably better and deffend your cause:Webber, Alvan Adams, Kevin Johnson, Tom Chambers, Van Arsdales brothers, goodrich,Worhty, Wilkes, Pau, Mullin, Blackman, Aguirre,Larry Johnson, Zo Mourning, Cp3, Rudy tomjanovic, Calvin Murphy, Yao Ming, Gilmore, Issel, Walter Davis, Vandewhege, david thompson,Melo, Deron, sikma, Payton, D johnson, Sabonis, Buck Williams, Mo Lucas, Bob Love, Jerry Sloan, Lanier, Dumars, Dantley, MOncrief, Sheed, Lebron, Mark Price, Reggie Miller, Dwight ,Unseld, Petrovic,Hal greer, Iverson,Berard King,Debuschere, alex groza, Parish, Pierce Ray Allen.Durant.

and this is just from the top of my head.

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 05:02 PM
top 10 pf for sure.

gsgs49
05-09-2011, 05:05 PM
the sure better than Dirk List:Oscar robertson,Barkley,Mikan, MIkkelsen, Wilt, kareem, West, Baylor, Magic, Kobe, Shaq,Thurmond, Rick barry, Moses Malone, Hakeem, Clyde Drexler, Ducan, Robinson, george Gervin,Stockton, K malone, maravich, Bill Walton, MJ,Pippen, I Thomas, Wade,Petit, Wilkins,Hayes, Dr J,Earl Monrow, Frzier,Reed, Ewing,Bird, Mchale, Cowens, Russell, Havlicek , Cousy, Kg


The ones you can deffend as Arguably better and deffend your cause:Webber, Alvan Adams, Kevin Johnson, Tom Chambers, Van Arsdales brothers, goodrich,Worhty, Wilkes, Pau, Mullin, Blackman, Aguirre,Larry Johnson, Zo Mourning, Cp3, Rudy tomjanovic, Calvin Murphy, Yao Ming, Gilmore, Issel, Walter Davis, Vandewhege, david thompson,Melo, Deron, sikma, Payton, D johnson, Sabonis, Buck Williams, Mo Lucas, Bob Love, Jerry Sloan, Lanier, Dumars, Dantley, MOncrief, Sheed, Lebron, Mark Price, Reggie Miller, Dwight ,Unseld, Petrovic,Hal greer, Iverson,Berard King,Debuschere, alex groza, Parish, Pierce Ray Allen.Durant.

and this is just from the top of my head.

haha I expected you to put him in the sure better than Dirk list.

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 05:07 PM
haha I expected you to put him in the sure better than Dirk list.

he is in the ARGUABLY better.

dirk is a better scorer.

Pau is better all around.

the book is not closed in this regard.
But im confident Gasol II or Heat close the door on Dirks Nose in some days.

Chronz
05-09-2011, 05:15 PM
TOP20 easily

Raph12
05-09-2011, 05:20 PM
Yeah all coaches try to backup their stars, I'm sure Thibideau would claim Rose is the best PG in the league and Brooks would claim KD is the best SF in the league, etc...

smith&wesson
05-09-2011, 05:22 PM
he is in the ARGUABLY better.

dirk is a better scorer.

Pau is better all around.

the book is not closed in this regard.
But im confident Gasol II or Heat close the door on Dirks Nose in some days.

no matter how you look at it. at the end of both theyre careers, Dirk will be known as the better player by far.

smith&wesson
05-09-2011, 05:23 PM
TOP20 easily

i think im with you on this one chronz.

shep33
05-09-2011, 05:30 PM
I don't think he's top 20 easily, right now mind you? I love Dirk, but why would he be top 20 right now? He's 23rd on the all-time scoring list, and he's not a good defensive player. I want to put him up there, but I just can't right now... I think KG and Timmy are still way ahead of him.

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 05:32 PM
TOP20 easily

Easily?

Chronz
05-09-2011, 05:32 PM
Dirk is really and underrated rebounder,he's an above average rebounder.
He has a career DRB% of 22.0 that's pretty good.
But the offensive rebounds hurt him,his ORB% is 3.8.
The reason of this difference is Dirk type of play,he doesn't play in the paint so he doesn't get offensive rebounds or putbacks.
DRB%/ORB%= 22/3.8= 5.79
Let's compare it to other players with similiar heights.
Duncan DRB%/ORB%=26.3/10.1= 2.6
Robinson DRB%/ORB%=23.4/10.6= 2.2
Olajuwon DRB%/ORB%=23.8/10.3= 2.31
O'neal DRB%/ORB%=23.6/11.7= 2.02

yup, people dont see the massive 12-14 rebound average and assume hes weak on the boards when in reality hes been a rock on the defensive glass throughout his career and his lack of offensive rebound is more than offset by the elite spacing he provides for all his teammates.

Hawkeye15
05-09-2011, 05:33 PM
If the Mavs win it all this year, I think he easily moves into the top 25-30 players ever. And by the time he is done, if he has a ring as the #1 guy on his team, and ages well (obviously I am expecting him to do this, seeing as height and shooting ability are the last things to go), he will end up in the top 20 of all time I think. In fact, I am sure of it.

Chronz
05-09-2011, 05:34 PM
Easily?

Most people have guys like Elgin Baylor in their top 20, Dirk surpasses him in every way imaginable.

Hawkeye15
05-09-2011, 05:34 PM
A 7 foot PF that averages 8 rebs a game for his career and plays no D is not a top 10 overall player. Maybe he meant top 10 PF?

but he breaks the mold of what we expect from a 7 footer. No player in history at his height played a perimeter game yet dominated so much. Its tough to get a ton of rebounds when you spend the majority of the offensive possessions 18 feet from the rim.

Chronz
05-09-2011, 05:39 PM
If the Mavs win it all this year, I think he easily moves into the top 25-30 players ever. And by the time he is done, if he has a ring as the #1 guy on his team, and ages well (obviously I am expecting him to do this, seeing as height and shooting ability are the last things to go), he will end up in the top 20 of all time I think. In fact, I am sure of it.

If he wins a ring with THIS cast it catapults him far beyond that, its a deep but flawed team that completely hinges on the threat of his shooting. Its good defensively, but so is every team left in the playoffs.

You cant name me a worse supporting cast that a star player has ever carried to a title than Dreams Rockets but these Mavs come close. Ironically I feel as if both are relying on luck to win, the hot stretch of 3pt shooting can carry a team to greater heights

Hawkeye15
05-09-2011, 05:40 PM
Most people have guys like Elgin Baylor in their top 20, Dirk surpasses him in every way imaginable.

do you think Dirk can enter the top 10 of all time if he wins a ring or two, and ages like I think he will? I think players who are tall, and can shoot, age extremely well, and have a nice steady decline versus a massive dropoff (see AI for example). I am a huge Dirk fan, and I want to think he is borderline top 20 right now, but I have a tough time getting him over that #20 area

Lakersfan2483
05-09-2011, 05:42 PM
Rick Carlisle is just still on his high after knocking off the lakers. There is no way Dirk is a top 10 player. I can name more than 20 players that were better.

Jordan, Kareem, Magic, Russell, Wilt, Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, Hakeem, Bird, Oscar, Dr. J, Moses Malone, Jerry West, Karl Malone, David Robinson, John Havlicek, Bob Petit, Isaiah Thomas, Charles Barkley, Lebron James, Kevin Garnett, Patrick Ewing, Rick Barry.

Dirk is a top 50 all time player for sure though. He may be in the top 40.

Hawkeye15
05-09-2011, 05:43 PM
If he wins a ring with THIS cast it catapults him far beyond that, its a deep but flawed team that completely hinges on the threat of his shooting. Its good defensively, but so is every team left in the playoffs.

You cant name me a worse supporting cast that a star player has ever carried to a title than Dreams Rockets but these Mavs come close. Ironically I feel as if both are relying on luck to win, the hot stretch of 3pt shooting can carry a team to greater heights

I am just so used to getting crapped on for stating his is already a top 30 player easily by a bunch here. I am with you, in regards to how great Dirk has been. He is seriously one of the more underrated superstars over the past 20 years. No doubt in my mind. I think his defensive reputation is unwarranted, and he literally carries his team many times.

I also think Dirk knows this is his chance. Right now. I don't expect to see that shot start missing.

gsgs49
05-09-2011, 06:01 PM
If the Mavs win it all this year, I think he easily moves into the top 25-30 players ever. And by the time he is done, if he has a ring as the #1 guy on his team, and ages well (obviously I am expecting him to do this, seeing as height and shooting ability are the last things to go), he will end up in the top 20 of all time I think. In fact, I am sure of it.

I really believe that he would ages better than any player in the NBA,i see him hitting that sick one leg fadeaway even at age of 37 or 38.
And he's getting smarter with age that's an important thing because his game needs intelligence.
He's more mature than ever this year,he knows when to shoot and when to pass.He's having the best TS% and eFG% of his career and shooting a career high 52% and I expect him to have some 50-40-90 seasons in the next few years.

It's gonna be hard but I think that he has a chance to finish with 30000 points add a ring being the man to that and he'll be in the top 15-20 range.

legend33
05-09-2011, 06:07 PM
hes a top 25 player yes, not top 10.

thats freakin laughable lols...

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 06:11 PM
Most people have guys like Elgin Baylor in their top 20, Dirk surpasses him in every way imaginable.

yea good point. i never knew how much better Dirk was until recently looking at Baylor's stats.

legend33
05-09-2011, 06:15 PM
^ Lmfaoz wait WHAT?

Ummm Baylor and Dirk are pretty damn comparable man, you guys DO freakin realize he played in West's shadow his ENTIRE career..............right?

He was a way better rebounder and defender than Dirk...

jets-24
05-09-2011, 06:24 PM
lol the bad part is this is just as bad as last night during the bulls game they where calling dirk a future hall of famer....wow ...dirk is pretty good but ....hall of fame...of all time...lol....hes not even on my top 100 ALL TIME.... do u kno how far back u have to go for that....i can name 25 players at his position better than him all time

Chronz
05-09-2011, 06:24 PM
^ Lmfaoz wait WHAT?

Ummm Baylor and Dirk are pretty damn comparable man, you guys DO freakin realize he played in West's shadow his ENTIRE career..............right?

He was a way better rebounder and defender than Dirk...

I get the impression you dont know much about Elgin, he didnt play behind him his entire career, he got there before him and was the main guy for many years once they teamed up. It wasnt until the injuries that West took over and even then it was of benefit to Baylors career.

I love Baylor but I cant get past the cancerous vibes I get from assessing him historically. The injuries really changed his game and he never got a chance to prove what he could do with an elite team in his prime.

Overall Elgin is profoundly overrated IMO, hes a flashy name from the infancy stage of the league so he will always have his place in history but compared to Dirk I dont see the comparison.

KnicksR4Real
05-09-2011, 06:25 PM
funny

Chronz
05-09-2011, 06:26 PM
lol the bad part is this is just as bad as last night during the bulls game they where calling dirk a future hall of famer....wow ...dirk is pretty good but ....hall of fame...of all time...lol....hes not even on my top 100 ALL TIME.... do u kno how far back u have to go for that....i can name 25 players at his position better than him all time

I will drink my own urine with a smile on my face if you could prove that

CeeDub15
05-09-2011, 06:28 PM
He is definetely up there, but top 10 right now? I dont think so.

Bruno
05-09-2011, 06:28 PM
IMO Dirk breaks into the top twenty with a ring. He has everything, stats, accolades, longevity, just no title. He's top twenty with a title, IMO. At least top 25...

GiantsSwaGG
05-09-2011, 06:31 PM
Dirk is without a doubt a terrific player, but he's definitely not a top 10 player in NBA history. Probably just Rick patting his player on the back.

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nba/news/story?id=6514530

LMAO are you kidding me

TheDiggler
05-09-2011, 06:35 PM
Top 10 shot makers of all-time yes. Top 10 most unguardable an offensive threats yes. Top 10 "player"? NO. He hasn't even won a title yet. Dirk is a incredible player but you could easily say Jason Kidd, Terry, Barea, and Peja had just as much to do with beating the Lakers.

P

In this whole thread, this is the only correct and read worthy reply. And that comes from a Lakers Fan. Glad there are still quality posters out there. :clap:

TheDiggler
05-09-2011, 06:36 PM
IMO Dirk breaks into the top twenty with a ring. He has everything, stats, accolades, longevity, just no title. He's top twenty with a title, IMO. At least top 25...

That is my opinion too.

Sportfan
05-09-2011, 06:37 PM
I don't think it's crazy to say he will be a top 10 offensive player. He's got almost 23k points in less than 1000 games and defitantly has another 3-4 seasons left at the very least. He'll be in the top 10 for points, and known for his great jumper.

eugene
05-09-2011, 06:43 PM
well, best european of the decade but not the top10 ever..

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 06:52 PM
lol the bad part is this is just as bad as last night during the bulls game they where calling dirk a future hall of famer....wow ...dirk is pretty good but ....hall of fame...of all time...lol....hes not even on my top 100 ALL TIME.... do u kno how far back u have to go for that....i can name 25 players at his position better than him all time

:facepalm:

MrfadeawayJB
05-09-2011, 06:56 PM
NO. But if he played his whole career like he did in game 4 against LA maybe. haha

FriedTofuz
05-09-2011, 07:32 PM
Dirk is no where near a top 10 player of all time. He is the best international player the nba has ever seen, and no doubt the best shooter at 7 feet tall. However, there are way too many hall of famer greats who are alot better than Dirk.

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 07:35 PM
Chronz you are a clippers fans arent you?

I coudl see why to have a bias against Baylor in that case.

Jewelz0376
05-09-2011, 07:36 PM
What does Dirk do that would make him top 10 all time besides scoring... He's never been a great rebounder...Always been an average defender at best...

Sure some guys like Bird and Magic weren't great defenders, but there was other ways they impacted the game besides scoring...

Dirk is a great scorer but no way he's top 10 even if they win a title this year...

Kg, Duncan, Malone, Barkley, Hayes, Rodman are all pf's I'd rank ahead of Dirk

Astronaut
05-09-2011, 07:51 PM
All of you saying that Dirk isn't a top 10 player of all time, Carlisle may be stretching it a bit but he's one of the most severely underrated players in the league right now.. He's just so versatile and has a better midrange game than most guards.

Look at who he's played with other than Nash(who cannot even play defense.) and an aging Jason Kidd..

valade16
05-09-2011, 08:12 PM
All of you saying that Dirk isn't a top 10 player of all time, Carlisle may be stretching it a bit but he's one of the most severely underrated players in the league right now.. He's just so versatile and has a better midrange game than most guards.

Look at who he's played with other than Nash(who cannot even play defense.) and an aging Jason Kidd..

The 2 consensus best PGs of their generation?..

I get what your trying to say, but you didn't do a very good job of saying it...

Also, he's had very talented teams: Nash, Nowitzki, and Finley ring a bell to anyone older than 10?

Not to mention the Mavs have been consistently ranked one of, if not the deepest team in the NBA the last 3 years.

All that being said, dude is top 25. He won MVP in an era dominated by Kobe/LeBron hype and over-valuing of flashy plays. That's very impressive in and of itself...

jets-24
05-09-2011, 08:13 PM
I will drink my own urine with a smile on my face if you could prove that


what do you want proved 25 players at his position all time better than him?????


if i prove it i want a you tube video with u drinkin and smiling

ghettosean
05-09-2011, 08:23 PM
Rick also said that Phil Jackson smokes peyote but I'm starting to the Rick does that and more. I wish that when he said that someone asked him to make his top 10 list of all time players. What a stupid statement to make no rings but best top 10 of all time maybe top 10 in the NBA of active players but thats where it stops.

Dirk is an amazing player though and I'm glad he stayed with the Mavs.... I'm routing for Dallas to win it all this year because Dirk deserves a ring. Next year I hope it's Nash (both great well deserving players).

drobe86
05-09-2011, 09:25 PM
Right now no he's not a top 10 player. When we get this ring in June then yea he'll be in the conversation. Dirks an unbelievable player. People hate him more than any player in NBA history. SMH at the idiot that said because the Mavs have spent money in the past that Dirk has had capable teams to winning a title. You're not winning a title with Devin Harris, Josh Howard, Antawn Jamison and other 3rd tier players such as those. Give Dirk a top 3 C (chandler), and a top 5 pg of all time (Kidd) and see what he can do.

hyb152
05-09-2011, 09:39 PM
LMAO!
the mavs get full of themselves so quickley you have had a easy road to the wcf....

What are u talking about? They just swept the lakers and beat a portland team that NO ONE wanted to play in the 1st round. The spurs would have lost to both Portland and LA. I'm no mavs fan, but you're letting your bias against the mavs make you look dumb with that post since you're a spurs fan who obviously despises the mavs and their fans on here. No offense to the spurs, but the only team they could have beaten in a 7 game series in this year's playoffs would have been the hornets.... and even that series would have gone 6 or 7 games. I would have probably been rooting rooting for the spurs too. I'm a big fan of Duncan and Ginobili.

gatkins11
05-09-2011, 09:45 PM
That's a nice thought. I love Dirk, but he's not top 10 all time.

HAWKS.NO27
05-09-2011, 10:03 PM
Dirk isn't even a top 50 player of all time! C'mon man, seriously Carlisle??? The man has been a face of the franchise for god knows how long, probably the best shooting big man of All-Time, but lets be truthful people...Top 10?

Lakers + Giants
05-09-2011, 10:04 PM
thats ridiculous.

Dirk isnt even a top 30 player of all-time let alone top 10.

Hes the best european important to the nba, but that is where the props stop.

+1

BigCityofDreams
05-09-2011, 10:17 PM
Is he top ten in the post Jordan era?

showtym24
05-09-2011, 10:23 PM
I respect dirk prolly more than any non laker. But hell no. And he'll never be.

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 10:24 PM
it's hilarious how people are giving Dirk **** for not winning a ring, but then are on Iverson's dick :facepalm:

Jewelz0376
05-09-2011, 10:33 PM
it's hilarious how people are giving Dirk **** for not winning a ring, but then are on Iverson's dick :facepalm:

:rolleyes:

This would only make sense if people have said AI is a top 10 player of all time... I've never heard anyone say this

RCarlson85
05-09-2011, 10:40 PM
He's barely in the top 10 among current players. I can name 6-8 players who are better than him just off the top of my head: Lebron, Wade, Kobe, Durant, Rose, Dwight, Melo. Top 10 all time is just hilarious.

shep33
05-09-2011, 10:45 PM
:rolleyes:

This would only make sense if people have said AI is a top 10 player of all time... I've never heard anyone say this

haha yeah I agree, how did AI get brought up into this convo?

pd1dish
05-09-2011, 10:46 PM
Dirk is without a doubt a terrific player, but he's definitely not a top 10 player in NBA history. Probably just Rick patting his player on the back.

http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nba/news/story?id=6514530

lol, thats funny

Hellcrooner
05-09-2011, 10:46 PM
lol ive been folowing for 26 years and this stupidity cracks me up.

I cant keep but wonder how hard will be laughin 60 year older fans who ahve seen basically EVERy player out there.l

valade16
05-09-2011, 10:50 PM
Right now no he's not a top 10 player. When we get this ring in June then yea he'll be in the conversation. Dirks an unbelievable player. People hate him more than any player in NBA history. SMH at the idiot that said because the Mavs have spent money in the past that Dirk has had capable teams to winning a title. You're not winning a title with Devin Harris, Josh Howard, Antawn Jamison and other 3rd tier players such as those. Give Dirk a top 3 C (chandler), and a top 5 pg of all time (Kidd) and see what he can do.

What are you talking about? Cuban has been known for shelling out money.
And those guys you named would form a better team in their primes than most in the NBA now:

Antawn Jamison: 19.7 ppg; 8.0 rpg; 18.5 PER
Josh Howard: 19.9 ppg; 7.0 rpg; 16.4 PER
Devin Harris: 21.3 ppg; 6.9 apg; 15.1 PER

I know he didn't have Harris in his prime, nor did his coach use Jamison properly but come on.

While Dirk may be the most underrated superstar in the league let's not overlook the fact he's had very talented teams and has only been to the finals once, without winning it...

Did Wade have a better cast with shaq and?..

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 10:51 PM
:rolleyes:

This would only make sense if people have said AI is a top 10 player of all time... I've never heard anyone say this

and did u see the posts saying Dirk isn't even top 40, 50, or 100? People say Iverson is top 30-40...

Wade>You
05-09-2011, 10:52 PM
Now Nowitzki has to go out there and play like it.

CityofChaos
05-09-2011, 11:10 PM
Carlisle is an idiot for saying that but then again of course hes going to say that since he is the HC...not to mention that they swept the Lakers.

Credit should go to Cuban, Nellie Jr, or whoever was in charge of surrounding Dirk with players like Shawn Marion, Tyson Chandler, Caron Butler, Kidd, Peja etc...Those were once ALL Allstars caliber players. The Mavs are at the top when it comes to depth in the Westeren Conference so its not like Dirk single-handedly brought them success.

Al Hughes
05-09-2011, 11:18 PM
Maybe he meant top ten white players of all time? Not very smart carlisle

Swashcuff
05-09-2011, 11:27 PM
and did u see the posts saying Dirk isn't even top 40, 50, or 100? People say Iverson is top 30-40...

WTF does any of this have to do with anything? Both A.I. and Dirk are top 50 with Dirk being much higher in that top 50 than A.I. and Iverson being borderline at that. Because people say he should be top 30-40 has nothing to do with Dirk's place.

Sadds The Gr8
05-09-2011, 11:42 PM
WTF does any of this have to do with anything? Both A.I. and Dirk are top 50 with Dirk being much higher in that top 50 than A.I. and Iverson being borderline at that. Because people say he should be top 30-40 has nothing to do with Dirk's place.

don't say this to me. say that to the people in this thread who said Dirk isn't top 40, 50, or 100.

Swashcuff
05-09-2011, 11:46 PM
don't say this to me. say that to the people in this thread who said Dirk isn't top 40, 50, or 100.

Outside of the stubborn Dirk hater Hellcrooner I don't value the opinion of any of those posters because quite frankly there is no way they could even realistically attempt to make a case for him not being top 40.

John Walls Era
05-09-2011, 11:52 PM
Hes not even close to being the best Euro yet. Hes most likely a top 50 player of all time though. Maybe even top 40 if a list is made.

Swashcuff
05-09-2011, 11:54 PM
Hes not even close to being the best Euro yet.

Which EURO player has had a better career than Dirk Nowitzki?

valade16
05-09-2011, 11:54 PM
Hes not even close to being the best Euro yet.

But he's absolutely the European with the best NBA career...

central2003
05-09-2011, 11:56 PM
He can be a top 50 or top 100 but he's no top 10. Faaaaaaaar from it Ricky my friend.

Hellcrooner
05-10-2011, 12:05 AM
Which EURO player has had a better career than Dirk Nowitzki?

its still 2-0 and we better not get in international resume.

jzero
05-10-2011, 12:06 AM
id say top 30

Young2Kinsler
05-10-2011, 12:26 AM
10 is a stretch, but 15-20 is not. Dirk is so under appreciated, and probably always will be. Those saying not top 30 50 or 100 are on drugs.

Young2Kinsler
05-10-2011, 12:27 AM
Now Nowitzki has to go out there and play like it.

When does he not?

M.Bibby2.0
05-10-2011, 12:28 AM
Are you comparing this to Dirk's over the years? Or just in general?

First off Dirk is a great player, a spectacular player, but there is no way he is a top 10 player of all-time. Whether we like it or not, rings play a big deal and I'm a supporter of that theory.

Either way, I have to disagree here, people forget that the Mavs have had the highest salary cap over the past decade. The Mavs have had stacked teams in the past, the Lakers dynasties with Kobe have had some of the worst benches in NBA history for a championship caliber team. Let's be honest with ourselves, the Shaq-Kobe 3 peat was on them, yes they had a good supporting cast, but those guys dominated. The Mavs this year even have pretty much an identical salary cap to the Lakers. I don't think any team has spent as much money as the Mavs over the past decade, maybe outside of the Isiah's Knicks, and they've had teams with unbelievable supporting casts, but they just didn't mesh together right.

Even though Dallas has spent the money, it still doesn't mean Dirk has had as good of a supporting cast. I'm drawing a blank as to whether he has even had one of his teammates on the all star team since the Nash era?

But regardless, my problem with the ring criteria is that Kobe could've played out his career in a small market team, been perfectly content, and enjoyed the city as a home, still performed spectacularly, but not playing with all stars or a roster that compliments him. He wouldn't have won a championship, but would still be the same player that he is now. Yet you would rank him differently, and say he is worse?

If you were to end artests and Gerald Wallace's careers right now, is Artest higher up all time because of his ring? Is Artest > Lebron if he doesn't get a ring?

tescu
05-10-2011, 12:30 AM
IMO Dirk can be on my team... In any era. 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's, 00's.

He's got IT.

CityofChaos
05-10-2011, 12:50 AM
Even though Dallas has spent the money, it still doesn't mean Dirk has had as good of a supporting cast. I'm drawing a blank as to whether he has even had one of his teammates on the all star team since the Nash era?

But regardless, my problem with the ring criteria is that Kobe could've played out his career in a small market team, been perfectly content, and enjoyed the city as a home, still performed spectacularly, but not playing with all stars or a roster that compliments him. He wouldn't have won a championship, but would still be the same player that he is now. Yet you would rank him differently, and say he is worse?

If you were to end artests and Gerald Wallace's careers right now, is Artest higher up all time because of his ring? Is Artest > Lebron if he doesn't get a ring?

So are you implying that Jason Kidd, Shawn Marion, Peja, Tyson Chandler, Jason Terry, and Caron Butler are scrubs that absolutely have no impact on their success? Theres no way Dirk and the Mavs would have swept the Lakers if they had the same roster they did back in 2006-07 when they won 60+ games and got their ***** kicked by the Warriors.

Dirk is NOT a top 10 player by all means. Top 50? Sure why not. But to say he's better than hmmm... lets say a guy like Rick Barry (who I think is one of the most underrated Legends of all time) is ignorant.

Tanakid777
05-10-2011, 12:52 AM
Even though Dallas has spent the money, it still doesn't mean Dirk has had as good of a supporting cast. I'm drawing a blank as to whether he has even had one of his teammates on the all star team since the Nash era?

But regardless, my problem with the ring criteria is that Kobe could've played out his career in a small market team, been perfectly content, and enjoyed the city as a home, still performed spectacularly, but not playing with all stars or a roster that compliments him. He wouldn't have won a championship, but would still be the same player that he is now. Yet you would rank him differently, and say he is worse?

If you were to end artests and Gerald Wallace's careers right now, is Artest higher up all time because of his ring? Is Artest > Lebron if he doesn't get a ring?



Yea. By his logic, the Knicks should have been perennial contenders throughout the last 6 or 7 years

valade16
05-10-2011, 12:55 AM
its still 2-0 and we better not get in international resume.

NBA resume Dirk is better (though it is funny your main excuse for Pau never winning a playoff game on the Grizz is how bad the team was and then use their international resumes when Spain > Germany x10).

And it's:

Titles as the main man: 0 to 0.

Dirk 1 MVP; Pau none.

I mean, if it's just rings Fisher is better than Pau (5-2) and it's not even close...

Tanakid777
05-10-2011, 12:57 AM
When does he not?

Dirk is a choker in the postseason. Duh. You didn't know that??? For God's sake, he only averages 26 ppg and 10.5 rpg in the playoffs. Come on Y2K, get it together. -End Sarcasm-

M.Bibby2.0
05-10-2011, 01:07 AM
So are you implying that Jason Kidd, Shawn Marion, Peja, Tyson Chandler, Jason Terry, and Caron Butler are scrubs that absolutely have no impact on their success? Theres no way Dirk and the Mavs would have swept the Lakers if they had the same roster they did back in 2006-07 when they won 60+ games and got their ***** kicked by the Warriors.

Dirk is NOT a top 10 player by all means. Top 50? Sure why not. But to say he's better than hmmm... lets say a guy like Rick Barry (who I think is one of the most underrated Legends of all time) is ignorant.

No no, you misunderstood me I think, I'm not saying Dirk doesn't have help, the kobe on a bad team thing was to argue the winning a ring standard for rating a player. Also you can't definitively say that the 06-07 Mavs couldn't beat the lakers, Nba playoffs is about match ups. The players you mentioned are not scrubs at all, but they are for the most part aged, and are not the same caliber as the current kobe help (Odom, Bynum, Gasol, Artest) - anymore that is.
Dirk certainly isnt top ten, I was just posting about the winning a ring standard for rating a players skills.

Lil Half Dead
05-10-2011, 01:12 AM
I'm not seeing what's so funny. Do they not realize Dirk is already a Top 30 player? It's not really that far off that he could land a spot in the top 15 range when it's all said and done.