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View Full Version : The myth that Rose can shoot..



Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:18 AM
Game 1 6-22

Game 2 4-18

Game 3 11-25

35% FG

The rebounding/defensive prowess of Chicago allows Rose to do this on a nightly bases while accounting for only six assists per game.

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 10:24 AM
This will not end well... but I agree with you 100%

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:25 AM
This will not end well... but I agree with you 100%

Thank you kind sir.

stawka
04-25-2011, 10:25 AM
Iverson... (but I'll continue to look like the idiot on these boards because they lose his highlight reels)

mikealike305
04-25-2011, 10:27 AM
like tarheels said. as much as i agree this will just be a 20 page thread that will have no end til a mod closes it cuz it will go around in circles

justinnum1
04-25-2011, 10:28 AM
certainly not efficient. The bulls win based on their defense.

Gators123
04-25-2011, 10:31 AM
This will not end well... but I agree with you 100%

This.

giventofly
04-25-2011, 10:31 AM
I'm sure I can pick out a stretch of 4 games in the regular season and find him shooting well over 50%. Why would you use a slumpy four games to make any kind of argument? It's pretty clear he's not playing well right now.

Procision
04-25-2011, 10:34 AM
Other than game 4 alot of those bad fgs are because the pacers are Killing him whenever he drives making him do most of his work from the FT line.

Gators123
04-25-2011, 10:35 AM
Lets be honest, if LeBron had 4 games like that in the playoffs ESPN would talk about it 24/7, and PSD would have 10 threads bashing him.

ackar
04-25-2011, 10:35 AM
AH I C what you did here. screw stats check the sig it says it all!

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:36 AM
I'm sure I can pick out a stretch of 4 games in the regular season and find him shooting well over 50%. Why would you use a slumpy four games to make any kind of argument? It's pretty clear he's not playing well right now.

44% for the season while averaging 20 plus shots a game. Never mind his only six assists. Rebounding of the offensive/defensive glass makes Rose playable.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:37 AM
Lets be honest, if LeBron had 4 games like that in the playoffs ESPN would talk about it 24/7, and PSD would have 10 threads about it.

But Rose is new....

ChiDougie19
04-25-2011, 10:45 AM
He's in NBA bout to b MVP and pleases millions of ppl or a regular...u sit at home and watch him...please get off his nutz

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:47 AM
He's in NBA bout to b MVP and pleases millions of ppl or a regular...u sit at home and watch him...please get off his nutz

LMAO way to respond to the thread:facepalm:

asandhu23
04-25-2011, 10:48 AM
I know I am going to get a lot of heat for this but Rose is pretty much at the same level as Monta. Very similar players with very similar stats. Same height, around the same weight

The only reason why Rose is considered a MVP candidates and Monta isn't is because Rose's team wins unlike the Warriors.

There is a pretty good explanation for that too. Warriors have no concept of team defense whatsoever, the bench is ******** than a gas station restroom, there is a noobie coach called Keith Smart who didn't do **** outside of one college game winner and there is no ****ing center to get rebounds / put **** back in the hoop.

nycericanguy
04-25-2011, 10:50 AM
The myth that he can shoot? I'm sorry but I think most people realize Rose is NOT a great shooter, he is however a great scorer. But as of now his outside shot and overall offense efficiency are not on an elite level.

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 10:50 AM
i love how you completely disregard any other time in his career, other than misquoting his stats for the year. fine, the shooting percentage wasn't his best at roughly 45% but he also had almost 8 assists a game. not to mention he bumped his ft% up nearly 10% from the previous year. kid definitely can't shoot huh?

How can you honestly judge a guy on a four game slump? You're probably one of the people that think if your top rookie prospect scores in double digits in his first game that he's going to be a first ballot hall of famer too, right?

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:51 AM
I know I am going to get a lot of heat for this but Rose is pretty much at the same level as Monta. Very similar players with very similar stats. Same height, around the same weight

The only reason why Rose is considered a MVP candidates and Monta isn't is because Rose's team wins unlike the Warriors.

There is a pretty good explanation for that too. Warriors have no concept of team defense whatsoever, the bench is ******** than a gas station restroom, there is a noobie coach called Keith Smart who didn't do **** outside of one college game winner and there is no ****ing center to get rebounds / put **** back in the hoop.

Most individuals don't understand how many games you can win with elite defense and rebounding.

J-Relo
04-25-2011, 10:52 AM
Yes, he is not a good shooter. These days NBA doesn't really rely on skills it relies on athleticism.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 10:52 AM
44% for the season while averaging 20 plus shots a game. Never mind his only six assists. Rebounding of the offensive/defensive glass makes Rose playable.

Before starting a thread there are a couple things I need you to learn to do. Firstly GET YOUR FACTS str8.

Second FG% is a horrible indicator of how bad a shooter a said player is especially over a 4 game span. If you want to give some facts show us film and show us how Derrick is misses open jumpers all the time or something. FG% doesn't tell half the story.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 10:53 AM
44% for the season while averaging 20 plus shots a game. Never mind his only six assists. Rebounding of the offensive/defensive glass makes Rose playable.
LOL at this thread. Rose shot a better percentage than Westbrook for the season and everyone on PSD seems to LOVE Westbrook, so this is completely hypocritical IMO. Are you honestly saying Rose shouldn't be playing??? :facepalm:

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 10:53 AM
Rose is a 1 trick pony on offence. it's just that he is arguably the best slasher in the league right now. take away his slashing ability and he has no idea what to do with himself on offence. He has a low Bball IQ imo.

Cool007
04-25-2011, 10:54 AM
Rose is a scrub. He should not even be allowed in NBDL, let alone in the NBA and on the team that has won 62 games and #1 in the league. He should have been benched for the all 4 games and Bulls would still have won coz they only win coz of their defense and rebounding.

Silly all these fans and coaches and those announcers and media. They are ALL wrong. The only people who are right are some posters from PSD forum.

LakersIn5
04-25-2011, 10:54 AM
switch rose and ellis. the bulls will be on the same position as they are now. and the warriors are still out of the playoffs. rose in not that valueble. YES HE IS TALENTED! but not that valueble!

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:54 AM
i love how you completely disregard any other time in his career, other than misquoting his stats for the year. fine, the shooting percentage wasn't his best at roughly 45% but he also had almost 8 assists a game. not to mention he bumped his ft% up nearly 10% from the previous year. kid definitely can't shoot huh?

How can you honestly judge a guy on a four game slump? You're probably one of the people that think if your top rookie prospect scores in double digits in his first game that he's going to be a first ballot hall of famer too, right?

This year Rose is taking 20 plus shots while hitting them at a 44% clip.

6.0 assists per game. No one mentioned FT shooting.

The Jokemaker
04-25-2011, 10:55 AM
Sounds fair, Rose isn't a great shooter. However it seems some fans these days have their "star players" and think they are perfect in every way and can't accept they may have faults. Rose does have this weakness in his game, can it be improved? Yes. Will it improve? If Rose is anything the gamer and winner I hear he is, you can bet your B-hind it will. However, as is, he is still able to make enough players and create the scoring opportunities to win games. He is great at driving to the paint and scoring that way but as a shooter he isn't there yet.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 10:55 AM
Someone who can't shoot but hits over 85% of their free throws? :shrug: seems like a damn good % to me.

Greet
04-25-2011, 10:56 AM
How can you even defend that shooting? No one ever said he was a good shooter. Rose is a very talented player on a team that makes him look better. Imagine switching out Rose with Lebron on the Bulls. They would win so many championships in a row.

Double_R
04-25-2011, 10:57 AM
Rose is the most overrated MVP in the last little while. ESPN is so on his dcik it's crazy. Dude is really fast and athletic, but by no means is he a good shooter.

What most people fail to realize that there is a difference between a good shooter and a volume shooter.

For example if you have 36 pts, and you go 10-29, 1-7 3pts, but you also go 15-18 from the line, that is not impressive to me, you shot 29 shots to get 36pts, hell, essentially you took 38 shots to get 36 pts since you went to the line 9 times even though it doesn't count as a fg attempt.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:57 AM
switch rose and ellis. the bulls will be on the same position as they are now. and the warriors are still out of the playoffs. rose in not that valueble. YES HE IS TALENTED! but not that valueble!

I can not believe I agree with a Laker fan:cool:

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 10:57 AM
switch rose and ellis. the bulls will be on the same position as they are now. and the warriors are still out of the playoffs. rose in not that valueble. YES HE IS TALENTED! but not that valueble!
:laugh: How is Rose not that valuable? He puts the team on his back every damn night.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 10:57 AM
This year Rose is taking 20 plus shots while hitting them at a 44% clip.

6.0 assists per game. No one mentioned FT shooting.

Again get your FACTS str8 or stop hating.

Derrick Rose averaged 7.7 assists per game and NOT 6. Did you pay attention to any basketball this past season?

FT shooting is a great indicator of how good a shooter someone is. It can't be disregarded since it has a huge part to play in shooting the basketball.

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 10:57 AM
Rose is a 1 trick pony on offence. it's just that he is arguably the best slasher in the league right now. take away his slashing ability and he has no idea what to do with himself on offence. He has a low Bball IQ imo.

Have you seen more than 2 minutes of a bulls game this year? cuz you sound like a moron. His midrange game as well as his floaters are fantastic. His three point shot is pretty damn good. The problem with his three point shooting is his shot selection. I don't think any bulls fan will deny that they want Rose to work on his shot selection because if he did that he would shoot closer to 40% on threes...and that's if he just takes out the last second half court heaves.

If you want to **** on a guys game, i think you need to watch him play first.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 10:58 AM
This year Rose is taking 20 plus shots while hitting them at a 44% clip.

6.0 assists per game. No one mentioned FT shooting.
Rose averaged 8 assists per game. If you are going to say stuff at least look it up and make it correct first.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 10:59 AM
The is the first time I quite some while I find myself defending Rose but the hate in this thread is simply ASTOUNDING. I mean I could swear its a LeBron James thread or something.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 10:59 AM
Rose is the most overrated MVP in the last little while. ESPN is so on his dcik it's crazy. Dude is really fast and athletic, but by no means is he a good shooter.

What most people fail to realize that there is a difference between a good shooter and a volume shooter.

For example if you have 36 pts, and you go 10-29, 1-7 3pts, but you also go 15-18 from the line, that is not impressive to me, you shot 29 shots to get 36pts, hell, essentially you took 38 shots to get 36 pts since you went to the line 9 times even though it doesn't count as a fg attempt.

Pure truth:clap:

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 10:59 AM
Again get your FACTS str8 or stop hating.

Derrick Rose averaged 7.7 assists per game and NOT 6. Did you pay attention to any basketball this past season?

FT shooting is a great indicator of how good a shooter someone is. It can't be disregarded since it has a huge part to play in shooting the basketball.
This pretty much sums it up.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:00 AM
rose averaged 8 assists per game. If you are going to say stuff at least look it up and make it correct first.

7 apg

Cool007
04-25-2011, 11:01 AM
Game 1 6-22

Game 2 4-18

Game 3 11-25

35% FG



:facepalm::rock::violin::bang::crazy::punish

It's totally fitting how the fan of Durant started this thread.

Do you know Durant last year in playoffs 6-games shot 35% from the field as well. Does that mean Durant is overrated and can't shoot??? :rolleyes:

But that didn't stop you from posting and choosing even SMALLER sample size for Rose for only 4-games to post it? Man, I am sorry but you are a JOKE.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:01 AM
.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:02 AM
7 apg
7.7, that is 8 by simple mathematics. :laugh: Do you really have to skew Rose's stats to try and prove your point.

South Sided
04-25-2011, 11:02 AM
Rose: 44.5% from the field 33% from 3point range 86% from the line.

Westbrook: 44.2% from the field 33% from 3point range 84% from the line.

Wade: 50% from the field 30% from 3point range 75% from the line.

Paul: 48% from the field 38% from 3point range 87% from the line.

Williams: 44% from the field 33% from 3point range 84% from the line.

Looks to me like he's on par w/ the so called better guards in the league.

Nuff said, CLOSE THREAD

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:02 AM
:facepalm::rock::violin::bang::crazy::punish

It's totally fitting how the fan of Durant started this thread.

Do you know Durant last year in 6-games shot 35% from the field as well. Does that mean Durant is overrated and can't shoot??? :rolleyes:


Don't compare Rose to Durant.

hugepatsfan
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
This is ridiculous. He is a great scorer. He can shoot. He had a rough stretch. He isn't a 50% type of player, but he is a gifted scorer.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
:facepalm::rock::violin::bang::crazy::punish

It's totally fitting how the fan of Durant started this thread.

Do you know Durant last year in playoffs 6-games shot 35% from the field as well. Does that mean Durant is overrated and can't shoot??? :rolleyes:

But that didn't stop you from posting and choosing even SMALLER sample size for Rose for only 4-games to post it? Man, I am sorry but you are a JOKE.

:clap:

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
7 apg

You don't know what you are talking about.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
7.7, that is 8 by simple mathematics. :laugh: Do you really have to skew Rose's stats to try and prove your point.

LMAO at rounding them off...

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
This year Rose is taking 20 plus shots while hitting them at a 44% clip.

6.0 assists per game. No one mentioned FT shooting.

can you link me to where you're looking at his stats? Rose averaged 6 apg LAST year, not this year. you're ability to look up stats is problematic.

And can you tell me how FT shooting doesn't fit into the equation here? Isn't he shooting the ball? you're telling me that if someone started out one month shooting 4-10 from the ft line, then practiced for the month, then shot 8-10 from the line that they didn't become a better shooter?

Again, Rose is a good shooter, it is his SHOT SELECTION that is suspect right now in his career.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:03 AM
This is ridiculous. He is a great scorer. He can shoot. He had a rough stretch. He isn't a 50% type of player, but he is a gifted scorer.
I completely agree with this.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:04 AM
LMAO at rounding them off...
So if a guy gets 7.9 assist, that counts as 7 and not 8? Give me a ****ing break.

Greet
04-25-2011, 11:05 AM
This is ridiculous. He is a great scorer. He can shoot. He had a rough stretch. He isn't a 50% type of player, but he is a gifted scorer.

Rose is a very inefficient scorer.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:05 AM
:clap:

Ron Artest was on Durant:clap:

asandhu23
04-25-2011, 11:05 AM
:laugh: How is Rose not that valuable? He puts the team on his back every damn night.

Ellis does this too but no... he is a ****ing cancer to his team. Look at his team's wins to judge his skills but forget about the team's roster and its defensive capability / desire to play defense ( and outside of David Lee, Dorell Wright, Curry, Williams.... offense ) because its not important.

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:06 AM
Don't compare Rose to Durant.

somebody hit a soft spot...

did you just realize you're argument sucks?

Greet
04-25-2011, 11:06 AM
:facepalm::rock::violin::bang::crazy::punish

It's totally fitting how the fan of Durant started this thread.

Do you know Durant last year in playoffs 6-games shot 35% from the field as well. Does that mean Durant is overrated and can't shoot??? :rolleyes:

But that didn't stop you from posting and choosing even SMALLER sample size for Rose for only 4-games to post it? Man, I am sorry but you are a JOKE.


Difference is you're playing the Pacers, not even a top 15 defense. The Thunder where up against the Lakers who had the best exterior defense last year and a very good interior D.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:07 AM
difference is you're playing the pacers, not even a top 15 defense. The thunder where up against the lakers who had the best exterior defense last year and a very good interior d.

ron artest

Cool007
04-25-2011, 11:08 AM
Ron Artest was on Durant:clap:

The whole pacers team is on Rose.

What's your point?

Durant shot even worse than Rose and a bit bigger sample size than Rose as well.

So Durant shot 35% from the field as well with WORSE TS% than Rose but somehow Rose can't shoot but Durant is a God in your avy???

Overreacting FTW.

asandhu23
04-25-2011, 11:09 AM
Rose: 44.5% from the field 33% from 3point range 86% from the line.

Westbrook: 44.2% from the field 33% from 3point range 84% from the line.

Wade: 50% from the field 30% from 3point range 75% from the line.

Paul: 48% from the field 38% from 3point range 87% from the line.

Williams: 44% from the field 33% from 3point range 84% from the line.

Looks to me like he's on par w/ the so called better guards in the league.

Nuff said, CLOSE THREAD


Add Monta Ellis there. 45 percent from the field. 36 percent 3 point FG... and 78 percent FT

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:09 AM
Ron Artest was on Durant:clap:

Trevor Ariza is shooting 40% with artest on him right now...does that make ariza the better shooter?

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 11:09 AM
Have you seen more than 2 minutes of a bulls game this year? cuz you sound like a moron. His midrange game as well as his floaters are fantastic. His three point shot is pretty damn good. The problem with his three point shooting is his shot selection. I don't think any bulls fan will deny that they want Rose to work on his shot selection because if he did that he would shoot closer to 40% on threes...and that's if he just takes out the last second half court heaves.

If you want to **** on a guys game, i think you need to watch him play first.

haha i have seen more than 2 minutes. ive seen 4. JK

Rose has a midrange game? never seen it before. all i see is him trying to barrel his way past 3 defenders closing in on him in the paint. or him taking 3pt. shots off the dribble.

Floater's are a product of slashing. unless he's taking floaters in mid-range territory.

his 3pt. shot is below the league avg. of 35.6%

i don't know what to tell you besides he's a 1-trick pony dude.

sep11ie
04-25-2011, 11:09 AM
Teams play harder in the play offs. Rose is the focal point of the offense. Pacers are throwing everything at him.

asandhu23
04-25-2011, 11:10 AM
Trevor Ariza is shooting 40% with artest on him right now...does that make artest the better shooter?

you mean Ariza?

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:10 AM
Trevor Ariza is shooting 40% with artest on him right now...does that make artest the better shooter?

It all depends on how engaged Artest is.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:10 AM
From 10-15 Derrick Rose shot 42% for the season good for 12 among all PGs.
From 16-23 he shot 38.0% for the season STILL better than Westbrook, Bibby, Parker and Chauncey.
His TS% is a decent 55.0% which has him 13th among all PGs.

He can shoot. He's certainly not Elite but he can shoot. May not be the best but when compared to his peers he's up there. Just to throw it out there he is a better shooter than Westbrook

JordansBulls
04-25-2011, 11:10 AM
Ray Allen vs Cleveland in 2008

0-4
4-10
4-12
4-10
4-11
3-8
1-6

Total 20-61 = 33%

This clearly shows Ray Allen can not shoot and goes to show that Boston won because of their defense and this despite being played single coverage.

Hustlenomics
04-25-2011, 11:11 AM
This will not end well... but I agree with you 100%

This

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:11 AM
you mean Ariza?

yea, my bad

asandhu23
04-25-2011, 11:13 AM
Ray Allen vs Cleveland in 2008

0-4
4-10
4-12
4-10
4-11
3-8
1-6

Total 20-61 = 33%

This clearly shows Ray Allen can not shoot and goes to show that Boston won because of their defense and this despite being played single coverage.

Actually I have couple of conspiracies about this but I am not going to go into them ...

jp611
04-25-2011, 11:14 AM
This year Rose is taking 20 plus shots while hitting them at a 44% clip.

6.0 assists per game. No one mentioned FT shooting.

Where are you getting 6 assists per game from?

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:14 AM
haha i have seen more than 2 minutes. ive seen 4. JK

Rose has a midrange game? never seen it before. all i see is him trying to barrel his way past 3 defenders closing in on him in the paint. or him taking 3pt. shots off the dribble.

Floater's are a product of slashing. unless he's taking floaters in mid-range territory.

his 3pt. shot is below the league avg. of 35.6%

i don't know what to tell you besides he's a 1-trick pony dude.

then you really haven't watched him enough. I refuse to criticize someones game that i haven't seen enough, i suggest you do the same

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:14 AM
Ray Allen vs Cleveland in 2008

0-4
4-10
4-12
4-10
4-11
3-8
1-6

Total 20-61 = 33%

This clearly shows Ray Allen can not shoot and goes to show that Boston won because of their defense and this despite being played single coverage.

To even compare Ray's shot to Roses is a disgrace.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:14 AM
haha i have seen more than 2 minutes. ive seen 4. JK

Rose has a midrange game? never seen it before. all i see is him trying to barrel his way past 3 defenders closing in on him in the paint. or him taking 3pt. shots off the dribble.

Floater's are a product of slashing. unless he's taking floaters in mid-range territory.

his 3pt. shot is below the league avg. of 35.6%

i don't know what to tell you besides he's a 1-trick pony dude.
When you say Rose has no mid-range, you're basically saying you've never ever seen him play before because I think that is just ridiculous.

GMEN4EVER
04-25-2011, 11:15 AM
It's why he shouldn't even be in the discussion for MVP. He is still an even worse distributor than Stephon Marbury was in his prime for crying out loud. Plays about as much defense as Marbury did, and isn't as good of a shooter. Every single person propping him up as an MVP for this season isn't actually paying attention. It's all media bs and now the NBA is in on the hype to boost ratings. The Bulls win with great defense and rebounding first and foremost. Rose does carry their offense at times, but being the best offensive player on a team devoid of any elite offensive talents shouldn't make someone an MVP. It's really pathetic.

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:16 AM
Ron Artest was on Durant:clap:
Like someone else said, it's Rose vs. the whole Pacers team basically.

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:16 AM
To even compare Ray's shot to Roses is a disgrace.

you are seriously pathetic. he did the same thing that you did; take a bad stretch in a guys career and generalize about it.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:18 AM
Like someone else said, it's Rose vs. the whole Pacers team basically.

Korver isn't making shots? Deng isn't producing? The Pacers are not even a top 15 defensive team.

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 11:19 AM
Ray Allen vs Cleveland in 2008

0-4
4-10
4-12
4-10
4-11
3-8
1-6

Total 20-61 = 33%

This clearly shows Ray Allen can not shoot and goes to show that Boston won because of their defense and this despite being played single coverage.

Difference is that it took Allen 7 games to put up 61 shots. It only takes Rose 2 games...

AIMelo=KillaDUO
04-25-2011, 11:19 AM
Iverson... (but I'll continue to look like the idiot on these boards because they lose his highlight reels)

Bro who said anything about Allen Iverson. But, to respond to you ignorant post... It's not myth that Allen Iverson was a great shooter. He was streaky shooter and a prolific scorer. Which is what seperates him.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:21 AM
you are seriously pathetic. he did the same thing that you did; take a bad stretch in a guys career and generalize about it.

Rose is a career bulk scorer.

jp611
04-25-2011, 11:21 AM
:laugh2:

I guess Rose doesnt play defense now too :laugh:

You people are clueless

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:22 AM
Difference is that it took Allen 7 games to put up 61 shots. It only takes Rose 2 games...

What a ridiculous statement. Is that your reply? Really?

Cubsfan365
04-25-2011, 11:22 AM
Korver isn't making shots? Deng isn't producing? The Pacers are not even a top 15 defensive team.
Wanna know a big reason why Korver is making a lot of shots? That's because the Pacers all collapse on Rose and leave Korver wide open. Have you even been watching the games? They pretty much trap Rose every time and all try to stop him when he goes down the lane.

THE GIPPER
04-25-2011, 11:23 AM
The playoffs are exposing rose for what he truly is. They are also exposing what chris paul truly is; the best pg in the nba.

justinnum1
04-25-2011, 11:23 AM
I know I am going to get a lot of heat for this but Rose is pretty much at the same level as Monta. Very similar players with very similar stats. Same height, around the same weight

The only reason why Rose is considered a MVP candidates and Monta isn't is because Rose's team wins unlike the Warriors.

There is a pretty good explanation for that too. Warriors have no concept of team defense whatsoever, the bench is ******** than a gas station restroom, there is a noobie coach called Keith Smart who didn't do **** outside of one college game winner and there is no ****ing center to get rebounds / put **** back in the hoop.

After watching your sig for like 5 times, the guy that **** the RPG definitely dies also lol

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 11:24 AM
What a ridiculous statement. Is that your reply? Really?

You're right I forgot, Rose is God. He is clearly a much much better shooter that the best shooter in NBA history.

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 11:25 AM
The playoffs are exposing rose for what he truly is. They are also exposing what chris paul truly is; the best pg in the nba.

You sir, are a very smart man....

FYI we are all pulling for your Grizz

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:26 AM
The playoffs are exposing rose for what he truly is. They are also exposing what chris paul truly is; the best pg in the nba.

What happened in his last two postseasons then?


Season Age Tm Lg G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS FG% 3P% FT% MP PTS TRB AST
2008-09 20 CHI NBA 7 313 59 120 0 4 20 25 12 44 45 4 5 35 25 138 .492 .000 .800 44.7 19.7 6.3 6.4
2009-10 21 CHI NBA 5 212 57 125 2 6 18 22 4 17 36 4 0 13 8 134 .456 .333 .818 42.4 26.8 3.4 7.2

jp611
04-25-2011, 11:26 AM
Monta Ellis WS/48 - .089
Derrick Rose WS/48 - .208

Monta Ellis AST% - 23.4
Derrick Rose AST% - 37.8

Monta Ellis TS% - .536
Derrick Rose TS% - .550

If you people are seriously comparing Monta Ellis and Derrick Rose, you're drunk

jockrider
04-25-2011, 11:28 AM
rose hate or lebron hate i don't know what's worse, but you know the player has arrived when people are going out their way to bash him. Maybe bulls fans now can relate and not bash lebron as much maybe not.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:28 AM
What happened in his last two postseasons then?


Season Age Tm Lg G MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS FG% 3P% FT% MP PTS TRB AST
2008-09 20 CHI NBA 7 313 59 120 0 4 20 25 12 44 45 4 5 35 25 138 .492 .000 .800 44.7 19.7 6.3 6.4
2009-10 21 CHI NBA 5 212 57 125 2 6 18 22 4 17 36 4 0 13 8 134 .456 .333 .818 42.4 26.8 3.4 7.2

One where Rondo averaged a triple double against him and the other where he got swept.

ChiBulls91
04-25-2011, 11:28 AM
Rose is a career bulk scorer.

you don't even address what people say to you. you just come up with another crap *** statement. this is clearly a waste of time to argue with someone as biased and clueless towards basketball as you.

this is how i feel after reading everything you've said in this thread:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:30 AM
You're right I forgot, Rose is God. He is clearly a much much better shooter that the best shooter in NBA history.

Dude that was the most pathetic response EVER. What are you talking about? Are you trying to say Ray was never a volume shooter?

jp611
04-25-2011, 11:32 AM
One where Rondo averaged a triple double against him and the other where he got swept.

Bulls werent swept last year, and they were an 8 seed and a 7 seed respectively, against clearly better teams

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 11:32 AM
then you really haven't watched him enough. I refuse to criticize someones game that i haven't seen enough, i suggest you do the same


When you say Rose has no mid-range, you're basically saying you've never ever seen him play before because I think that is just ridiculous.

iv'e seen him play enough, it's just that his mid-range game isn't a pillar of his offensive repertoire, thats all.

1st. slashing
2nd. 3pt.
3rd mid-range

how can you say that he has a good mid-range game when he doesn't use it as often as the 3pt. shot or slashing. if his 3pt. shot is below avg. then by transitivity his mid-range game must be below avg. as well, or else he would use it more often.

n guys, you're focusing on 1 thing i said, you have yet to argue against my other points, unless that is of course you agree with them. discounting my knowledge of rose because of 1 thing you don't agree with shows to me that you are unable to assess rose's game objectively.

even if i am wrong about his mid-range.

2/3 is still a pass.

jp611
04-25-2011, 11:34 AM
I need to rid myself of this place, people comparing Monta Ellis to Derrick Rose... its just absolutely ridiculous in here anymore

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:34 AM
One where Rondo averaged a triple double against him and the other where he got swept.

Do you know ANYTHING about the game of basketball? Anything whatsoever? Anything? Or are you just another hater?

He got swept? Rondo averaged a TRIPLE DOUBLE? What parallel universe did that happen on? Please tell me.

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 11:35 AM
Dude that was the most pathetic response EVER. What are you talking about? Are you trying to say Ray was never a volume shooter?

In 15 years he averaged more than 20 shots per game ONCE

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:37 AM
I can't believe Rose is getting all this hate. Comparing him to Monta Ellis? Really?

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:37 AM
In 15 years he averaged more than 20 shots per game ONCE

Thanks for correctly proving my point.

PS your arbitrary cut off point is just as ridiculous as your prior posts.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:38 AM
In 15 years he averaged more than 20 shots per game ONCE



These Rose fans don't like truth...

Tarheels23
04-25-2011, 11:39 AM
Thanks for answering the question.

PS your arbitrary cut off point is just as ridiculous as your prior posts.

Thank you. Man its pretty fun to mess with Bulls/Rose fans. They are so sensitive.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:40 AM
These Rose fans don't like truth...

The fact that he averaged over 20 shots in any season of his career PROVES that at some point he WAS a volume shooter. What in that don't you understand?

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 11:41 AM
These Rose fans don't like truth...

the truth is hard to handle sometimes.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:41 AM
Thank you. Man its pretty fun to mess with Bulls/Rose fans. They are so sensitive.

I am an Allen Iverson/Philadelphia 76ers fan. What are you talking about?

Is that what you spend your life doing messing with Bulls fans? You are pathetic.

ChicagoRox
04-25-2011, 11:42 AM
These Rose fans don't like truth...

These Sonic fans don't like the truth that Durant is on the OKC Thunder.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:42 AM
The fact that he averaged over 20 shots in any season of his career PROVES that at some point he WAS a volume shooter. What in that don't you understand?

One season out of 15 doesn't mean anything.

toovey107
04-25-2011, 11:43 AM
Fine- I'll try this again.

Anyone who actually compares Monta Ellis to Rose is clearly biased.

God forbid someone actually look at a stat sheet before throwing out ridiculous comparisons just because they happen to hit the same kind of shots every now and again.

rapjuicer06
04-25-2011, 11:43 AM
80 40:17 9.1 20.1 45.1 1.7 4.7 36.2 4.3 5.4 78.9 0.6 3.0 3.5 5.6 3.2 2.1 0.3 2.5 24.1

81 37:23 8.8 19.7 44.5 1.6 4.8 33.3 5.9 6.9 85.8 1.0 3.1 4.1 7.7 3.4 1.1 0.6 1.7 25.0

those are very very comparable numbers. so to say comparing rose to ellis is ridiculous it really isn't. rose is a better distrubuter and thats about it. everything else is almost mirror image

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:43 AM
One season out of 15 doesn't mean anything.

And 3 other seasons he averaged over 19. Not only to say that your prime only lasts for so long. He WAS a volume shooter. You don't become the all time leader in 3s attempted without being a volume shooter.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:44 AM
80 40:17 9.1 20.1 45.1 1.7 4.7 36.2 4.3 5.4 78.9 0.6 3.0 3.5 5.6 3.2 2.1 0.3 2.5 24.1

81 37:23 8.8 19.7 44.5 1.6 4.8 33.3 5.9 6.9 85.8 1.0 3.1 4.1 7.7 3.4 1.1 0.6 1.7 25.0

those are very very comparable numbers. so to say comparing rose to ellis is ridiculous it really isn't. rose is a better distrubuter and thats about it. everything else is almost mirror image

Ellis plays more defense.

flclfanman
04-25-2011, 11:45 AM
Rose has been shooting like a bum the last 2 games, no lie; but we've all seen him play more consistently than this this year. He'll play better in round 2, especially if they draw the Hawks :D


The only thing I HATE about Rose's game is that ****ing pull up 3. Always a tempo killer and no bigs to rebound under the basket :mad:

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:45 AM
Ellis plays more defense.

This is sig worthy right here. Did you just say Monta Ellis plays more defense that Derrick Rose. You ma'am DESERVE a :facepalm:

rapjuicer06
04-25-2011, 11:46 AM
Ellis plays more defense.

no one on GS plays more defense than anyone but the knicks

kilgore2345
04-25-2011, 11:46 AM
Thank you. Man its pretty fun to mess with Bulls/Rose fans. They are so sensitive.

I hate to tell you, nearly everyone on here is sensitive.

However, if someone is going to make an argument are other's not allowed to argue and point out inconsistencies or are we suppose to just accept what some random 14 year old posts as fact?

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:46 AM
And 3 other seasons he averaged over 19. Not only to say that your prime only lasts for so long. He WAS a volume shooter. You don't become the all time leader in 3s attempted without being a volume shooter.

He is a career 40% 3 point shooter. 20 plus shots is volume scoring.

flclfanman
04-25-2011, 11:47 AM
Ellis plays more defense.

:laugh:

Please. Monta couldn't guard ME. You know that word's forbidden in Golden State :censored:

toovey107
04-25-2011, 11:47 AM
80 40:17 9.1 20.1 45.1 1.7 4.7 36.2 4.3 5.4 78.9 0.6 3.0 3.5 5.6 3.2 2.1 0.3 2.5 24.1

81 37:23 8.8 19.7 44.5 1.6 4.8 33.3 5.9 6.9 85.8 1.0 3.1 4.1 7.7 3.4 1.1 0.6 1.7 25.0

those are very very comparable numbers. so to say comparing rose to ellis is ridiculous it really isn't. rose is a better distrubuter and thats about it. everything else is almost mirror image
:laugh2: Like anybody is going to try and comprehend that cluttered mess.

But, it's fairly clear that you obviously don't know what statistics to look at.


And, Monta Ellis a better defender? Ellis is one of the worst defenders in the league.

minervamob
04-25-2011, 11:48 AM
switch rose and ellis. the bulls will be on the same position as they are now. and the warriors are still out of the playoffs. rose in not that valueble. YES HE IS TALENTED! but not that valueble!

You idiot. Rose is a proven winner. He wont let his team lose. Bulls have been in the playoffs 3 years straight with Rose. 2 years with a sub par team and mediocre roster. Warriors have a talented squad but cant even reach .500. Switch Rose with Ellis and the Warriors become winners.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:49 AM
He is a career 40% 3 point shooter. 20 plus shots is volume scoring.

Again. Do you know anything about basketball? So then what is Derrick Rose doing? He scored more points this season than Ray has scored at anytime in his career.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:49 AM
:laugh:

Please. Monta couldn't guard ME. You know that word's forbidden in Golden State :censored:

Fast don't lie. Ellis is third in steals.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:51 AM
Fast don't lie. Ellis is third in steals.

Child steals don't mean you play good defense. Learn about basketball before ever saying anything on this forum ever again.

redwhitenblue
04-25-2011, 11:51 AM
Are we ignoring that his first two games combined for 21/48 for 75 points?

His 6-22 game, I feel completely confident saying, was mostly about his ankle being injured. He was 3-6 when the injury happened and his jumper was flat and short all game trying to lift off that ankle.


Regardless, saying "the myth that Rose can shoot" based off of one series is one of the more ignorant ways to start a thread.

John Walls Era
04-25-2011, 11:51 AM
Yeah Rose is shooting a lot. Thats all I'm gonna say, this is turning into a hate fest.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:52 AM
Again. Do you know anything about basketball? So then what is Derrick Rose doing? He scored more points this season than Ray has scored at anytime in his career.

And he as taken way more shots to do it while shooting a far less percentage.

haggis
04-25-2011, 11:52 AM
Are we ignoring that his first two games combined for 21/48 for 75 points?

obviously yes RWB...

it doesn't fit the agenda, duh :rolleyes:

flclfanman
04-25-2011, 11:53 AM
Fast don't lie. Ellis is third in steals.

Ranking high in the league in steals makes you a good defender? Allen Iverson should have been lockdown in def. if this was the case. The only exceptions to this is CP3

Monta's good at playing the passing lanes, not staying in front of his man.

toovey107
04-25-2011, 11:53 AM
Fast don't lie. Ellis is third in steals.
:laugh2: Proving your worth as a poster by every post.

He gets his steals because he constantly gambles throughout the game. Using steals as a measure of how good someone is defensively is flawed logic at its finest.

GS is a terrible defensive team, and Monta is an awful defender. Deal with it.

Swashcuff
04-25-2011, 11:54 AM
And he as taken way more shots to do it while shooting a far less percentage.

Far less %?

In the one season Allen shot took more than 21 FGA/G he shot 43.8 % from the field. WTF is your point. By your basis he shot WORST than Derrick Rose.

ChicagoJ
04-25-2011, 11:54 AM
Using stats from this playoff series to judge whether or not he can shoot (in relation to the original post) is kind of disrespecting the Pacers defense. You are assuming it's all on Rose as if the pacers D has done nothing to slow him down. All one has to do is watch these playoff games and it is obvious the pacers defense is the main reason his numbers are down.

In addition to that, he started to really develop his outside shot this year. It's not a full product yet. He can be dominating at times, while inconsistent at times too. Given the progress he made this year I expect him to be a good outside shooter soon to go along with his exceptional skills when he goes to the basket.

kilgore2345
04-25-2011, 11:55 AM
LMAO at rounding them off...

I don't know about you, but in third grade we learned that .5 or above you round to the next integer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integer). Rounding 7.7 to 8 is much more acceptable than rounding to 7, since over course of a season it would be more likely that Rose would have 8 assists than 7 assists.

Tell me what does 0.7 assist looks like?

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 11:55 AM
:laugh2: Like anybody is going to try and comprehend that cluttered mess.

But, it's fairly clear that you obviously don't know what statistics to look at.


And, Monta Ellis a better defender? Ellis is one of the worst defenders in the league.

this comment pretty much sums up what an extreme Drose supporter is fundamentally all about. Unwilling to objectively read between the lines.

Ecko72jc
04-25-2011, 11:56 AM
:laugh2: Proving your worth as a poster by every post.

He gets his steals because he constantly gambles throughout the game. Using steals as a measure of how good someone is defensively is flawed logic at its finest.

GS is a terrible defensive team, and Monta is an awful defender. Deal with it.

Then call him Monte Carlo because he can't be beat.

flclfanman
04-25-2011, 11:56 AM
:laugh2: Proving your worth as a poster by every post.

He gets his steals because he constantly gambles throughout the game. Using steals as a measure of how good someone is defensively is flawed logic at its finest.

GS is a terrible defensive team, and Monta is an awful defender. Deal with it.

:hi5:

Whenever your professional basketball organization has to play A ZONE 90% of the time to give your D a chance, you're in trouble.

allSUAVE
04-25-2011, 11:59 AM
At the End of the day they play great team defense that's what WINS.

toovey107
04-25-2011, 11:59 AM
this comment pretty much sums up what an extreme Drose supporter is fundamentally all about. Unwilling to objectively read between the lines.
Bc I don't want to read a cluttered mess of numbers, all while knowing those numbers aren't the ones you should be using to prove an argument?

Yeah, you're right haha.

ho_va2006
04-25-2011, 11:59 AM
HATE HATE HATE!!! Tell this to his MVP trophy. Is he the best shooter in the world? No. Who cares? The kid can play, you can't argue that.

MVP.

beardown78
04-25-2011, 12:00 PM
LMAO at posters doing whatever it takes to point out any small flaw or slump to discredit Rose's MVP season. Yeah his shot selection needs to improve and I would like him to shoot at A higher fg% clip but he's only 22 years old am im pretty sure he's not finished learning different facets of the game of basketball. The Pacers are focusing thier entire defensive scheme to stop him. Rose doesnt have the luxury of playing next to another scorer that defenses have to focus on. As good as Deng has been this year he disappers for long streches in games, Noahs no threat offensively Indiana sags off of him when he has the ball, Keith Bogans need I say more and Boozer has been awful.

kilgore2345
04-25-2011, 12:01 PM
this comment pretty much sums up what an extreme Drose supporter is fundamentally all about. Unwilling to objectively read between the lines.

But it is a cluttered mess - how about organize the data in a format that is easier to read?

beardown78
04-25-2011, 12:01 PM
Are we ignoring that his first two games combined for 21/48 for 75 points?

His 6-22 game, I feel completely confident saying, was mostly about his ankle being injured. He was 3-6 when the injury happened and his jumper was flat and short all game trying to lift off that ankle.


Regardless, saying "the myth that Rose can shoot" based off of one series is one of the more ignorant ways to start a thread.

this

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 12:04 PM
Bc I don't want to read a cluttered mess of numbers, all while knowing those numbers aren't the ones you should be using to prove an argument?

Yeah, you're right haha.

it's a mentality. a cognitive bias if you will.

confirmation bias: people are looking for information that will confirm their own beliefs, n will discount or ignore information that opposes their views.

minervamob
04-25-2011, 12:04 PM
[QUOTE=gwrighter;17642271]iv'e seen him play enough, it's just that his mid-range game isn't a pillar of his offensive repertoire, thats all.

1st. slashing
2nd. 3pt.
3rd mid-range

Another Idiot! Rose's mid-range game is what made players have to respect his jumper in his rookie season. Obviously you have not seen enough of him at all. Tell your parent to purchase league pass for you. At least the $40 iphonw version so you can watch his games. People are basing their opinions on what they've seen thus far in these playoffs. Pacers are playing tremendous defense on Rose, putting 2 guards to guard him and doubling up on him. He hardly ever has an open shot. Even Lebron has to guard him when Bulls played the heat or cavs in years prior. Give respect where respect is due young punks.

Baller1
04-25-2011, 12:05 PM
Well this got ugly quick.

oak2455
04-25-2011, 12:05 PM
I'll take him on my team:clap::clap:

gwrighter
04-25-2011, 12:07 PM
But it is a cluttered mess - how about organize the data in a format that is easier to read?

it is a cluttered mess, but that doesn't mean that one can't search it themselves, or attempt to decipher it. thats all i'm trying to say.

because it isn't in congruency with the extreme DRose supporter's views, they might choose not to put in the extra effort to objectively assess Rose.

Sergio1984
04-25-2011, 12:08 PM
:yawn:, next thread.

SteBO
04-25-2011, 12:11 PM
I honestly wanted to give this thread a chance, but based on the immaturity in here, it's safe to say this thread is to be closed........it's spinning in circles