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View Full Version : Has Pau Gasol surpassed Duncan in the last 3 years???



KingKumar
03-28-2011, 08:20 PM
I think this makes for a interesting debate and I say yes he has, however I take the Duncan of 03-07 over Gasol but the last 3 years? Gasol easily.

The Final Boss
03-28-2011, 08:33 PM
Easily, so why make a thread?

210Don
03-28-2011, 08:35 PM
lol so youd take gasol over duncan???
lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you can easily put a good team around duncan with scrubs
not gasol please such a stupid question

Hoopsadvocate
03-28-2011, 08:35 PM
um so have like 2-3 other pfs whats ur point.

Purple&Gold24
03-28-2011, 08:38 PM
Big time. No doubt. Tim Duncan is still a great player.

Hellcrooner
03-28-2011, 08:39 PM
What are you asking?


If you are asking if Gasol has been better than Duncan the last 3 years then YES.

If you are asking if Gasol Prime ( this three years) has been better than Duncans prime then NO, You are tripping.

nickdymez
03-28-2011, 08:41 PM
lol so youd take gasol over duncan???
lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you can easily put a good team around duncan with scrubs
not gasol please such a stupid question

Ultimate Homer post!!!!

Lakers + Giants
03-28-2011, 08:44 PM
Just because Timmy is old now. But Timmy in his prime>Gasol in his prime,easily. Duncan's D is what separated him from all the other PFs in the league. Duncan is Arguably the best PF ever (IMO it's Karl Malone) so that's the end of this.

210Don
03-28-2011, 08:45 PM
Ultimate Homer post!!!!

yeah because pickin a all time great over a good players is homer lmao:facepalm:

Jenceman
03-28-2011, 08:53 PM
yeah because pickin a all time great over a good players is homer lmao:facepalm:

It is being a homer when that all time player has declined to the point where Gasol is better than him.

kdspurman
03-28-2011, 08:54 PM
aside from being a spurs fan, with the exception of this year the offensive production have been pretty similar. i lean towards duncan simply cause he is still a better post defender than gasol is. he's the anchor of his teams defense. get gasol on a couple all defensive teams maybe my mind changes. but cause of that reason (not so much homerism) i still take timmy

The Final Boss
03-28-2011, 08:58 PM
Duncan wouldn't start in Los Angeles.

210Don
03-28-2011, 08:59 PM
It is being a homer when that all time player has declined to the point where Gasol is better than him.

lmao sure have you seen how weve played since he went down??? hes still the anchor...
45 year old duncan>gasol

Gators123
03-28-2011, 09:05 PM
lol so youd take gasol over duncan???
lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you can easily put a good team around duncan with scrubs
not gasol please such a stupid question

Yes...

John Walls Era
03-28-2011, 09:45 PM
I don't understand this thread. Duncan isn't the best PF in the regular season for a while now... Dirk has been number 1.

_KB24_
03-28-2011, 09:46 PM
Gimme Timmy in the playoffs 10/10 times. I have never seen a big man bump his game up and come up in clutch situations like Duncan. Gasol is the better regular season player, no doubt. Duncans age has caught up to him. but still remains a very dangerous player come playoff time.

JasonJohnHorn
03-28-2011, 09:52 PM
Gasol is a great player, and while many would disagree with me, I have to say that Gasol is a talent very similar to Duncan. I would take Duncan first, but their games seem to mirror each other. Both have great post moves, both have solid jumpers, both are great passers, but Duncan has been the better rebounder throughout his career and a better all-around defender, but that said, prime Duncan vs. prime Gasol would be a match-up I would love to watch, and while I believe that Duncan would come out on top, I also believe it would be a close call.


As for what Duncan does for the talent around him, I think its hard to argue any point other than the fact that Duncan is the greatest facilitator of his generation. He has helped to make so many players come into their own with his team-first approach (an approach that Gasol shares).

But many forget what Gasol did for Memphis. Gasol had to develop his game on a lottery team, where as Duncan got drafted by a legit contender who won the lottery after their franchise player missed an entire season. Gasol had garbage around him, and despite that still managed to help get Memphis to the 50 win mark by his third season (LBJ failed to do as much for the Cavs). A 50 win season in that DEEP western conference were your second option was James Posey? Mike Miller, Jason Williams and Shane Battier were all on the team, but J-Will was shooting horribly, Battier was scoring single digits and Mike Miller was the only guy on the team who was really on top of his game and even then he was only dropping 11 points a night. These guys were competing against the Minny team that finally broke into the conference finals, a Mavs and Spurs team that were contending and a Kings team that was still looking like they could win a title. And with not much more than Battier, Miller and Bonzi Wells, Gasol helped hold hte fort down for three straight playoff births, playing in the toughest division in the toughest conference. Duncan could not have done much better with the same tools.

Duncan, in my book, is a clear pick over Gasol, but Gasol is right up there with Duncan among the great PF of all time. I am amazed at how many people think so little of Gasol who, even early in his career, was proving he could lead a team and play with a team first mentality that helped facilitate the players around him and win enough games to get into the post season in a deep west.

Gasol deserves some love.

Fnom11
03-28-2011, 09:59 PM
Pretty sure every starting PF in the league has surpassed Duncan.

drobe86
03-28-2011, 10:22 PM
Gasol by a landslide lol... Duncan is giving you 13 and 9 a game. He's no longer an impact player, and hasn't been for the last 2-3 seasons. He's had a stellar career, but I hadn't seen a guy drop off quite as fast as he did.... He looks like a dinosaur now... Old, slow, clumsy, well... you get my drift

210Don
03-28-2011, 10:25 PM
Gasol by a landslide lol... Duncan is giving you 13 and 9 a game. He's no longer an impact player, and hasn't been for the last 2-3 seasons. He's had a stellar career, but I hadn't seen a guy drop off quite as fast as he did.... He looks like a dinosaur now... Old, slow, clumsy, well... you get my drift

i take it that as mavs fan defense doesnt count for anything.

Hawkeye15
03-28-2011, 10:32 PM
Yes, Gasol the last three years has been better than Duncan.

drobe86
03-28-2011, 10:37 PM
i take it that as mavs fan defense doesnt count for anything.

Sure it does, but franchise players should give me a whole lot more than 13 and 9... Idk how old you are. Dirks 31 and still giving me 23 and 8, Kobes 32-33 and giving me 25 while still being one of the leagues top lock down defenders... Allen, Pierce, and Garnett are all 30+ and still playing at very high level. Even dominating and being the best player on the court some nights. Nobody has said that about Duncan in years.....

210Don
03-28-2011, 10:41 PM
Sure it does, but franchise players should give me a whole lot more than 13 and 9... Idk how old you are. Dirks 31 and still giving me 23 and 8, Kobes 32-33 and giving me 25 while still being one of the leagues top lock down defenders... Allen, Pierce, and Garnett are all 30+ and still playing at very high level. Even dominating and being the best player on the court some nights. Nobody has said that about Duncan in years.....

:moon:

jezzyman05
03-28-2011, 10:45 PM
Yes...

EPIC FAIL :punish:

Hawkeye15
03-28-2011, 10:48 PM
Nobody is taking away from how awesome Duncan has been over his career. But his decline has come at the same time as Gasol's peak. Simply put, Gasol has been the better player the last 3 years. He led the Lakers in win shares and production for both of their championships, while Duncan is in the twighlight of his career.

Why do Duncan fans read into this as some saying Gasol is better, career wise? That is insane. Pau could NEVER compare to Duncan career, or peak wise. But Pau has been better the last couple of years.

godolphins
03-28-2011, 10:51 PM
:shrug:

Giraffes Rule
03-28-2011, 11:03 PM
Pretty sure every starting PF in the league has surpassed Duncan.

No. Not at all. :facepalm:

Yeah, these past 3 years Duncan's age and health have caught up to him. Pau is in his best years. The gap isn't huge though.

CowboysKB24
03-28-2011, 11:42 PM
Yes, but what's the point?

i.got.the.nutz
03-29-2011, 12:34 AM
I'd rather have Duncan in 08-09.

AIRMAR72
03-29-2011, 12:43 AM
Gasol is a great player, and while many would disagree with me, I have to say that Gasol is a talent very similar to Duncan. I would take Duncan first, but their games seem to mirror each other. Both have great post moves, both have solid jumpers, both are great passers, but Duncan has been the better rebounder throughout his career and a better all-around defender, but that said, prime Duncan vs. prime Gasol would be a match-up I would love to watch, and while I believe that Duncan would come out on top, I also believe it would be a close call.


As for what Duncan does for the talent around him, I think its hard to argue any point other than the fact that Duncan is the greatest facilitator of his generation. He has helped to make so many players come into their own with his team-first approach (an approach that Gasol shares).

But many forget what Gasol did for Memphis. Gasol had to develop his game on a lottery team, where as Duncan got drafted by a legit contender who won the lottery after their franchise player missed an entire season. Gasol had garbage around him, and despite that still managed to help get Memphis to the 50 win mark by his third season (LBJ failed to do as much for the Cavs). A 50 win season in that DEEP western conference were your second option was James Posey? Mike Miller, Jason Williams and Shane Battier were all on the team, but J-Will was shooting horribly, Battier was scoring single digits and Mike Miller was the only guy on the team who was really on top of his game and even then he was only dropping 11 points a night. These guys were competing against the Minny team that finally broke into the conference finals, a Mavs and Spurs team that were contending and a Kings team that was still looking like they could win a title. And with not much more than Battier, Miller and Bonzi Wells, Gasol helped hold hte fort down for three straight playoff births, playing in the toughest division in the toughest conference. Duncan could not have done much better with the same tools.

Duncan, in my book, is a clear pick over Gasol, but Gasol is right up there with Duncan among the great PF of all time. I am amazed at how many people think so little of Gasol who, even early in his career, was proving he could lead a team and play with a team first mentality that helped facilitate the players around him and win enough games to get into the post season in a deep west.

Gasol deserves some love.

AMEN i agree maybe gasol should ask for a TRADE

DODGERS&LAKERS
03-29-2011, 12:45 AM
AMEN i agree gasol should ask for TRADE

:speechless: Why would he ask for a trade? He has had his best seasons as a Laker. Individually, and team wise.

Avenged
03-29-2011, 12:46 AM
Not only has Gasol passed him but a couple of other PF's have as well. Not a bash on Duncan, it happens to every player. He was a beast and damn near untouchable in his prime though.

IDB Josh M
03-29-2011, 12:46 AM
There is alot of butt hurt in this thread.

asomen
03-29-2011, 02:20 AM
The people who are using statistics as the measurement to determine who is the better PF are very misinformed about basketball.

If we're gunna use stats to determine who is a better PF then the list will go:

1) Stoudemire
2) Dirk
3) Griffin
4) Aldridge
5) Love
6) Randolph
7) David West
8) Pau Gasol

Laker fans, would you take Randolph/West over Gasol? Doubt it.

Evolution23
03-29-2011, 02:46 AM
Thats like saying has Rose taken over as a better player than Iverson in the last 3 years? Ofcourse thats what happens when you get older.

Jewelz0376
03-29-2011, 02:49 AM
Thats like saying has Rose taken over as a better player than Iverson in the last 3 years? Ofcourse thats what happens when you get older.

There are probably some on this board who probably think Rose right now is better than AI has ever been at any point in his career

-Kobe24-TJ19-
03-29-2011, 02:59 AM
lol so youd take gasol over duncan???
lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you can easily put a good team around duncan with scrubs
not gasol please such a stupid question

wow just wow:speechless:

-Kobe24-TJ19-
03-29-2011, 03:03 AM
The people who are using statistics as the measurement to determine who is the better PF are very misinformed about basketball.

If we're gunna use stats to determine who is a better PF then the list will go:

1) Stoudemire
2) Dirk
3) Griffin
4) Aldridge
5) Love
6) Randolph
7) David West
8) Pau Gasol

Laker fans, would you take Randolph/West over Gasol? Doubt it.

What kind of stats puts Stoudamire first and gasol 8th.
Worst stat ever lmao.:facepalm:

LA_Raiders
03-29-2011, 03:11 AM
Yes, ALL DAY... Sad but true TD is done...

LA_Raiders
03-29-2011, 03:12 AM
The people who are using statistics as the measurement to determine who is the better PF are very misinformed about basketball.

If we're gunna use stats to determine who is a better PF then the list will go:

1) Stoudemire
2) Dirk
3) Griffin
4) Aldridge
5) Love
6) Randolph
7) David West
8) Pau Gasol

Laker fans, would you take Randolph/West over Gasol? Doubt it.

ok

Hellcrooner
03-29-2011, 03:28 AM
There are probably some on this board who probably think Rose right now is better than AI has ever been at any point in his career

rose right now IS better than Ai ever was.


Ai has been the worse swindle in league history.

Mcdoh
03-29-2011, 03:39 AM
i choose duncan over gasol if its the old school duncan pau has no match for him

-Kobe24-TJ19-
03-29-2011, 03:42 AM
rose right now IS better than Ai ever was.


Ai has been the worse swindle in league history.

this

Antipod
03-29-2011, 04:08 AM
...why 3 years?why not 5 or 10...or to make it even, entire career?

Useless thread /

_KB24_
03-29-2011, 04:40 AM
rose right now IS better than Ai ever was.


Ai has been the worse swindle in league history.

:speechless:

Tell me you did not just say that..

I have a feeling if AI's real name was Alejandro Iversonez, things would be different :laugh2:

Jewelz0376
03-29-2011, 05:35 AM
rose right now IS better than Ai ever was.


Ai has been the worse swindle in league history.


Iverson: 26.4ppg, 7.1apg, 2 spg, 45.8 fg%, 34.5 3pt%,
.567 ts% , 20.9 per, 115 ortg, 8.9 ows, 26.7 usg%

Rose: 24.9ppg, 7.9apg, 1.0stl, 43.9 fg%, 33.2 3pt%
.540 ts%, 23.4 per, 112 ortg, 7.0 ows , 32.4 usg%

I disagree

Hellcrooner
03-29-2011, 05:42 AM
:speechless:

Tell me you did not just say that..

I have a feeling if AI's real name was Alejandro Iversonez, things would be different :laugh2:

If hsi name was like that eh would be working at mcdonalds.

ballhogs get snubbed early from european teams.

Bruno
03-29-2011, 07:14 AM
Nobody is taking away from how awesome Duncan has been over his career. But his decline has come at the same time as Gasol's peak. Simply put, Gasol has been the better player the last 3 years. He led the Lakers in win shares and production for both of their championships, while Duncan is in the twighlight of his career.

Why do Duncan fans read into this as some saying Gasol is better, career wise? That is insane. Pau could NEVER compare to Duncan career, or peak wise. But Pau has been better the last couple of years.

Since Gasols arrival in LA, 2/2008.

2007-2008 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 24.2, WS: 13.8, WS/48: .208, MVP.
Pau) PER: 24.0, WS: 8.4 (TOT), WS/48: .172 (TOT).

2007-2008 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 25.0 , WS: 3.2, WS/48: .178.
Pau) PER: 18.9 , WS: 2.5, WS/48: .146.
Bryant Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)
Gasol Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gasolpa01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)
2007-2008 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2008.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)


2008-2009 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 24.2, WS: 12.7, WS/48: .206.
Pau) PER: 22.2, WS: 13.9, WS/48: .223.

2008-2009 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 26.8 , WS: 4.7 , WS/48: .238, Finals MVP.
Pau) PER: 21.9 , WS: 4.3 , WS/48: .221.
2008-2009 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2009.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

2009-2010 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 21.9 , WS: 11.0 , WS/48: .160.
Pau) PER: 22.9 , WS: 9.4, WS/48: .220.

2009-2010 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 24.7 , WS: 3.6 , WS/48: .190, Finals MVP (2x).
Pau) PER: 24.0, WS: 4.3 , WS/48: .224.
2009-2010 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2010.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

2010-2011 regular season (9 games remaining):
Kobe) PER: 24.0 , WS: 9.5 , WS/48: .184.
Pau) PER: 23.5, WS: 13.3 , WS/48: .234
2010-2011 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2011.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

Bryant led in PER, WS & WS/48 during the 2009 playoffs.
Gasol led in WS & WS/48 during the 2010 playoffs, Bryant led in PER.

As far as the regular season, Bryant has led in PER 3/4 of the years since Gasols arrival and Gasol has led in WS & WS/48 three out of the four years since his arrival.




Regarding Duncan, his playoff production dropped off during the 2009-2010 post-season. Over 10 games Duncan struggled:

PER: 19.7 (play-off career low).
WS: 0.7 (2nd lowest of post-season career).
WS/48: .091 (play-off career low).
TS%: .527 (third lowest of post-season career).
Duncan Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/duncati01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

It's no stretch calling Gasol the better player of the past three seasons; that takes nothing away from Duncans HOF career. He's still the best PF of all-time, and still one of the best PF's in the league.

kdspurman
03-29-2011, 08:23 AM
To the wise maverick fan Drobe86 who said duncan hasnt done anything the past 2 or 3 years, must not know what he's talking about.

2009-2010 17ppg 10rpg 1.5bpg (31 mpg)
2008-2009 19ppg, 11rpg, 1.7bpg (33mpg)
2007-2008 19ppg 11 rpg 2bpg... (34 mpg)

Notice a trend in minutes? This year playing 28 MPG

It amazes me how some people see 13ppg and 9 rpg and say this guy is a bum now. What I am going to find funny is in the playoffs when he is playing 34-35 mpg and starts putting up 18 and 12 people will be in shock. If youre going to look at the stats that took a decline, it'd probably be wise to look at probably the main one which is Minutes Per Game. I think it's a pretty safe bet he wont be playing 28MPG in the playoffs and they will try and slow the game down a bit

Heediot
03-29-2011, 08:30 AM
Duncan wouldn't start in Los Angeles.

For this season he's still start over Bynum.

tdunk21
03-29-2011, 08:39 AM
Gimme Timmy in the playoffs 10/10 times. I have never seen a big man bump his game up and come up in clutch situations like Duncan. Gasol is the better regular season player, no doubt. Duncans age has caught up to him. but still remains a very dangerous player come playoff time.

this...

Dreamin'LA
03-29-2011, 08:42 AM
Of course since 2008-09 he's a better player than Duncan, who remain the best PF all time.

tdunk21
03-29-2011, 08:45 AM
Sure it does, but franchise players should give me a whole lot more than 13 and 9... Idk how old you are. Dirks 31 and still giving me 23 and 8, Kobes 32-33 and giving me 25 while still being one of the leagues top lock down defenders... Allen, Pierce, and Garnett are all 30+ and still playing at very high level. Even dominating and being the best player on the court some nights. Nobody has said that about Duncan in years.....

and how many shots are kobe and dirk takin to score 31 and 25?

AntiG
03-29-2011, 08:55 AM
Offensively yes. Thing is, offensive post moves aren't the only thing that makes up basketball. He's still an awful defender and gets pushed around like a rag doll. He's far from a complete player as a PF.

pebloemer
03-29-2011, 09:08 AM
yeah because pickin a all time great over a good players is homer lmao:facepalm:

Whoa. If this is your position, answer this question for me.

Present day Shaq or present day Gasol?

MacFitz92
03-29-2011, 09:19 AM
Don't understand. Dirk is still the best PF in the league, and has been for a while.

If you're implying better than Duncan right now, yes.

If you're implying better than Duncan all time, lol.

Duncan is the best PF of all time.

JasonJohnHorn
03-29-2011, 09:35 AM
Look at is this way: Gasol, with James Posey as the SECOND option on Memphis, helped pull 50 wins in a season. CP3 and David West, with Posey coming off the bench, only got 49 wins, and were the first team to lose the Melo's Nuggets! The next year that same NO team, with Okafor and West and CP3 (who was out for a while) and Posey coming off the bench MISSED THE PLAYOFFS!!! Only 37 wins.

With Posey as the second, option, Gasol got Memphis 50 wins and a playoff birth. I think that is some food for thought.

chin chukwu
03-29-2011, 09:43 AM
you have to factor in a few things. the last 3 years duncan hasn't really been relied on much to score. but trust me, even at 35 years old, if pop made T. DUNCAN the focal point of the offense---all things considered (TD's experience, knowledge, bball smarts)---there is NO REASON for anyone to think that t. duncan won't average 20-10-3.

oh, and t. duncan IS the best power forward of all time...BAR NONE.

Hellcrooner
03-29-2011, 12:42 PM
you have to factor in a few things. the last 3 years duncan hasn't really been relied on much to score. but trust me, even at 35 years old, if pop made T. DUNCAN the focal point of the offense---all things considered (TD's experience, knowledge, bball smarts)---there is NO REASON for anyone to think that t. duncan won't average 20-10-3.

oh, and t. duncan IS the best power forward of all time...BAR NONE.

funny the first few games this season when kobe was still sour with his fingers and Pj made Pau the focal point of lakers offense he was scoring 25 ppg....

Lakeshow86
03-29-2011, 12:51 PM
Right now yes, Gasol is better than Duncan. At this point Duncan is pretty much a role player. The only reason he was an all star this year was a lifetime acheivement award. He is old and his wheels are comming off. Gasol is a bit younger and in his prime and the best PF in the game. But Duncan in is prime I would take anyday over Pau in his prime. Duncan is possibly the best PF to ever play the game. Pau when its all said and done will probably be lucky to make the top 10

Tarheels23
03-29-2011, 12:58 PM
Yeah give me Duncan all day

king4day
03-29-2011, 01:02 PM
I think I still take Duncan. Though between the two, Gasol fits the Lakers better than Duncan would have.

Da Knicks
03-29-2011, 01:13 PM
Last three years, Gasol has being the best pf in the league. Prime years Duncan best pf of all time.

KingPosey
03-29-2011, 01:15 PM
The past 3 years? IDK, but THIS YEAR? Yes he has. I still think TD's stats this year are deceiving. He could have higher totals, he is just doing whatever helps the team win.

Double_R
03-29-2011, 01:23 PM
Tim Duncan w/o Kobe = Wins
Pau Gasol w/o Kobe = losses

chin chukwu
03-29-2011, 03:54 PM
funny the first few games this season when kobe was still sour with his fingers and Pj made Pau the focal point of lakers offense he was scoring 25 ppg....


right now, if both gasol and duncan were made the true focal point of the offense on their respective teams, i think their numbers would be comparable. so NO, i wouldn't (or should i say, I CAN'T) say pau gasol has surpassed duncan as of right now. t. duncan is very capable of putting similar numbers to what gasol is putting up...but the thing is---HE DOESN'T HAVE TO.

if pop said to t. duncan before a game "i need you to get 20 and 12." do you think t. duncan can do it?...of course, he can.

chin chukwu
03-29-2011, 03:58 PM
last three years, gasol has being the best pf in the league. prime years duncan best pf of all time.


what?!!!

leftymo
03-29-2011, 04:09 PM
Last three years, Gasol has being the best pf in the league. Prime years Duncan best pf of all time.


Exactly. Currently only one of these players is in their prime...

Duncan has had a HOF career and is the greatest PF of all time (arguably). Pau's career won't come close to Tim's.

But right now, head to head... no contest. Pau would handle Duncan easily.

asomen
03-29-2011, 08:06 PM
What kind of stats puts Stoudamire first and gasol 8th.
Worst stat ever lmao.:facepalm:

a) Yeah, points per game is the worst stat ever? Might as well not even keep track of it.

b) Thank you for proving my point. I'm making reference to the people earlier in the thread who were looking at Gasol's points per game the last 3 seasons compared to Duncan's points per game the last 3 seasons. To say Gasol is averaging better numbers; therefore, is the better PF is a clueless statement. Statistics only tell half the battle.

DenButsu
03-29-2011, 08:10 PM
What are you asking?


If you are asking if Gasol has been better than Duncan the last 3 years then YES.

If you are asking if Gasol Prime ( this three years) has been better than Duncans prime then NO, You are tripping.

Hey, what can I say, HC nailed it.

Jewelz0376
03-29-2011, 08:11 PM
right now, if both gasol and duncan were made the true focal point of the offense on their respective teams, i think their numbers would be comparable. so NO, i wouldn't (or should i say, I CAN'T) say pau gasol has surpassed duncan as of right now. t. duncan is very capable of putting similar numbers to what gasol is putting up...but the thing is---HE DOESN'T HAVE TO.

if pop said to t. duncan before a game "i need you to get 20 and 12." do you think t. duncan can do it?...of course, he can.

Sure Duncan can do it for a game...but Pau can do it for a whole season....without missing games... Pau at certain points in the season was playing around 40 mins a night... At this point in his career no way Duncans body would hold up playing 38 mins a night have to get 20 & 10 every night...

Hawkeye15
03-29-2011, 08:15 PM
Since Gasols arrival in LA, 2/2008.

2007-2008 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 24.2, WS: 13.8, WS/48: .208, MVP.
Pau) PER: 24.0, WS: 8.4 (TOT), WS/48: .172 (TOT).

2007-2008 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 25.0 , WS: 3.2, WS/48: .178.
Pau) PER: 18.9 , WS: 2.5, WS/48: .146.
Bryant Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bryanko01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)
Gasol Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/gasolpa01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)
2007-2008 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2008.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)


2008-2009 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 24.2, WS: 12.7, WS/48: .206.
Pau) PER: 22.2, WS: 13.9, WS/48: .223.

2008-2009 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 26.8 , WS: 4.7 , WS/48: .238, Finals MVP.
Pau) PER: 21.9 , WS: 4.3 , WS/48: .221.
2008-2009 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2009.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

2009-2010 regular season:
Kobe) PER: 21.9 , WS: 11.0 , WS/48: .160.
Pau) PER: 22.9 , WS: 9.4, WS/48: .220.

2009-2010 post-season:
Kobe) PER: 24.7 , WS: 3.6 , WS/48: .190, Finals MVP (2x).
Pau) PER: 24.0, WS: 4.3 , WS/48: .224.
2009-2010 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2010.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

2010-2011 regular season (9 games remaining):
Kobe) PER: 24.0 , WS: 9.5 , WS/48: .184.
Pau) PER: 23.5, WS: 13.3 , WS/48: .234
2010-2011 L.A. Lakers Team Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2011.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

Bryant led in PER, WS & WS/48 during the 2009 playoffs.
Gasol led in WS & WS/48 during the 2010 playoffs, Bryant led in PER.

As far as the regular season, Bryant has led in PER 3/4 of the years since Gasols arrival and Gasol has led in WS & WS/48 three out of the four years since his arrival.




Regarding Duncan, his playoff production dropped off during the 2009-2010 post-season. Over 10 games Duncan struggled:

PER: 19.7 (play-off career low).
WS: 0.7 (2nd lowest of post-season career).
WS/48: .091 (play-off career low).
TS%: .527 (third lowest of post-season career).
Duncan Career Stats. (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/duncati01.html?ls=gt2hp0021001053)

It's no stretch calling Gasol the better player of the past three seasons; that takes nothing away from Duncans HOF career. He's still the best PF of all-time, and still one of the best PF's in the league.


Its not a stretch at all. I hope someone wouldn't take away that we have an opinion that Gasol's prime (which he is in now) can even touch Duncan's, but the fact is, Duncan has fallen off the last few years. Its just what happens to players as they enter game 1400. There are currently good number of PF's I would take ahead of Duncan for 82 games, but Tim is still Tim come playoff time I would imagine.

DoJoTheSlasher
03-29-2011, 09:24 PM
Considering Dirk has been better than both of them the past 3 years...

kdspurman
03-29-2011, 11:00 PM
Considering Dirk has been better than both of them the past 3 years...

maybe at being a jump shooter... not the defender or rebounder those guys are. and that says alot considering pau is not the greatest post defender

danniboi168
03-29-2011, 11:09 PM
duncan is a beast at his prime

magic0320
03-29-2011, 11:39 PM
Tim Duncan w/o Kobe = Wins
Pau Gasol w/o Kobe = losses

Duncan w/o popovich = nothing

Gasol w/o popovich = two championships

...man I look dump for doing this, but you are RETAR!

keep hiding your face with your green mask dump **** :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Tarheels23
03-30-2011, 02:48 PM
Duncan w/o popovich = nothing

Gasol w/o popovich = two championships

...man I look dump for doing this, but you are RETAR!

keep hiding your face with your green mask dump **** :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

I'll play....

Duncan w/o Phil... 4 Rings, 3 Finals MVPs

Gasol w/o Phil... 1st round exit

asomen
03-30-2011, 03:02 PM
Duncan w/o popovich = nothing

Gasol w/o popovich = two championships

...man I look dump for doing this, but you are RETAR!

keep hiding your face with your green mask dump **** :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

:laugh2: Yes, you do look dump.

DoJoTheSlasher
03-30-2011, 03:03 PM
maybe at being a jump shooter... not the defender or rebounder those guys are. and that says alot considering pau is not the greatest post defender

What do you mean MAYBE as a jump shooter.....

Dirk is a better player than both of them today. All time, Duncan is the best PF in the game while Gasol is maybe a HOF. Dirk is a surefire 1st ballod hall of famer.

asomen
03-30-2011, 03:06 PM
What do you mean MAYBE as a jump shooter.....

Dirk is a better player than both of them today. All time, Duncan is the best PF in the game while Gasol is maybe a HOF. Dirk is a surefire 1st ballod hall of famer.

Without a doubt Dirk is the better offensive player out of those 3...don't know how to argue against that. However, if you look at the big picture (offense, defense, rebounding, championships, making players around you better,etc.) you gotta put Duncan ahead and Gasol on the same level as Dirk.

Niro
03-30-2011, 03:09 PM
lmao sure have you seen how weve played since he went down??? hes still the anchor...
45 year old duncan>gasol

so you would take shaq over howard TODAY?

210Don
03-30-2011, 03:38 PM
so you would take shaq over howard TODAY?

lmao timmy hasnt fallen off that bad he can still get it done id choose td over any pf in the game today.

Hellcrooner
03-30-2011, 03:51 PM
I'll play....

Duncan w/o Phil... 4 Rings, 3 Finals MVPs

Gasol w/o Phil... 1st round exit

ill play too.

Parker, Jackson, Ginobili, Bowie, Robinson, Mcdyess etc

vs....

Chocolate williams, Stromile swift, Battier, mike miller........


Game, set , Match.

Hellcrooner
03-30-2011, 03:54 PM
lmao timmy hasnt fallen off that bad he can still get it done id choose td over any pf in the game today.

thats pure homerism.

I can GUARANTEE you that as much as i root for Pau in two or three years i will prefer several PF before him, and some of them wont be better at that moment than Pau is TODAY but they will be better than 3 years in the future Pau.

Tarheels23
03-30-2011, 04:08 PM
ill play too.

Parker, Jackson, Ginobili, Bowie, Robinson, Mcdyess etc

vs....

Chocolate williams, Stromile swift, Battier, mike miller........


Game, set , Match.


Didnt Memphis hit 50 wins twice?

And Gasol led his team to 3 solid first round sweeps. Back to back to back

Hellcrooner
03-30-2011, 04:14 PM
Didnt Memphis hit 50 wins twice?

And Gasol led his team to 3 solid first round sweeps. Back to back to back

yes he indeed led that CRAP teams to 50 wins then faced MUCH better teams with MUCH better players so its only logical they were swept.



him being able to lead tht CRAP to the playoffs is a proof hof how good he is.

tell me, how many allstars do the players pau had in memphis add up between all of them ?.


how many allstars do the mavs, spurs, suns he played against those playoffs add up?
ho wmany mvps and finals mvps?

I thought so...

magic0320
03-30-2011, 04:14 PM
Didnt Memphis hit 50 wins twice?

And Gasol led his team to 3 solid first round sweeps. Back to back to back

due we are not saying Gasol was better player those days.

so don't taking everything so personally.

I don't really think Gasol was better past 3 years, because they both have been great players and played well for their teams, but Gasol have been up there with Tim past 3 years for sure.

daboywonder2002
03-30-2011, 04:31 PM
i think so. i hate to be a stats guy but the numbers dont lie. gasol is giving you better production in points and rebounds. averaging 1.7 blocks. yes duncan is a better man to man defender. hell he's a better defender period. but the all star offensive production of gasol + average defense effort. yes we can say duncan is not declining. he is saving himself for the playoffs. but i dont see it. i do see a decline in duncan and its obvious.

daboywonder2002
03-30-2011, 04:32 PM
and please dont use the teammates excuse or coaching. both players have been with great teammates in the spurs or lakers. and dont bring up memphis gasol. the question was gasol in the last 3 years. so this is lakers gasol vs spurs duncan. end of story.

Double_R
03-30-2011, 05:01 PM
Duncan w/o popovich = nothing

Gasol w/o popovich = two championships

...man I look dump for doing this, but you are RETAR!

keep hiding your face with your green mask dump **** :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Did you just call me dumpling?

I would take Gasol during the reg season over Duncan, but not in the playoffs and I think it is funny that this is being discussed because Gasol will never be close to Duncan's prime level. This is like saying has Andrew Bogut surpassed Shaq.

PS the point I was making with the 1st post was that Gasol without second best 2 guard ever was a loser.

THE MTL
03-30-2011, 05:39 PM
The thing about Duncan is that he is REALLY UNSELFISH and he could care less about his stats. If Duncan wanted to, im sure he could give u almost 18-10. He is getting about 3 less shots per game this season.

Hellcrooner
03-30-2011, 07:53 PM
The thing about Duncan is that he is REALLY UNSELFISH and he could care less about his stats. If Duncan wanted to, im sure he could give u almost 18-10. He is getting about 3 less shots per game this season.

funny Pau is uneslfish too.