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sargon21
03-27-2011, 01:06 AM
Alright, haven't had this thread in a while...

Well, who do you guys see as the best finisher(s) in the game?

As of right now, 3 really stick out to me, in no order:

Rose -- he seems to always lead his team to victory in the last 3 minutes of a game, just willing his team to victory

Kobe -- Kobe is Kobe, and there's no one I'd rather have with the ball in his hands when the game is on the line

Melo -- Melo is a straight-up killer on those last second shots, and I've personally seen him hit aganist my team at least twice. It seems like he's just got that ice in his veins on the last second shots.

In the past, Wade/Lebron easily would've been on this list, but with their late-game struggles this year, I don't think they deserve to be. Also, I think Pierce should be given strong consideration, and he could easily be at the top of this list in terms of the last second shot.

DerekRE_3
03-27-2011, 01:24 AM
Beno Udrih surprisingly converts over 70% of his at the rim attempts. He hit 71% of them last season too.

tredigs
03-27-2011, 01:24 AM
An ancillary question I have:

How long do you have to do something before you enter and/or leave the discussion of "best in the NBA at ____"?

Lebron has been weak in the final seconds this year, as has Wade, but the two have consistently proven over many, many seasons that they can finish when it counts. Being that they're both 100% healthy and in their prime, it begs the question of how the newb to the list (D. Rose - who has very little proof of doing this in big playoff games, despite being solid at it this year) can be a main choice while they wouldn't.

Another name you're forgetting, too. D. Nowitzki. Probably the most unheralded/underrated clutch performer in the game due to his teams struggles in the playoffs. Cp3 and D. Williams, too. Both very, very clutch. B. Roy - if he's healthy - is right up there with anyone. The guy doesn't know what nerves are.

John Walls Era
03-27-2011, 01:27 AM
Needs a poll.

I think this article basically sums up what I think of Kobe: LINK (http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time). If Roy was healthy I'll go with him. But the Melo is probably the most clutch (despite everyone knowing that hes taking a J for the win).

redwhitenblue
03-27-2011, 01:27 AM
Is Wade ever 100% healthy?

DerekRE_3
03-27-2011, 01:28 AM
Ah by finish you meant game finisher. I thought you meant finishig around the basket.

sargon21
03-27-2011, 01:28 AM
An ancillary question I have:

How long do you have to do something before you enter and/or leave the discussion of "best in the NBA at ____"?

Lebron has been weak in the final seconds this year, as has Wade, but the two have consistently proven over many, many seasons that they can finish when it counts. Being that they're both 100% healthy and in their prime, it begs the question of how the newb to the list (D. Rose - who has very little proof of doing this in big playoff games, despite being solid at it this year) can be a main choice while they wouldn't.

Another name you're forgetting, too. D. Nowitzki. Probably the most unheralded/underrated clutch performer in the game due to his teams struggles in the playoffs. Cp3 and D. Williams, too. Both very, very clutch. B. Roy - if he's healthy - is right up there with anyone. The guy doesn't know what nerves are.

Good question, haha, I just think everyone will have a different opinion on that. As for my list, I was basically just taking into account this year.

Dirk, wasn't really forgetting him, but I gotta cut it to top 3 somehow.

CP3 I just don't consider that clutch, he almost always passes the ball on those last second plays, and D-Will is a bit more clutch than CP3, but I don't think he's in it with the other guys I've put on my list.

Roy for sure, he's one of my favorite players to watch and he certainly is very clutch, but his health still does remain a question. Even not being healthy, I remember him nailing a 3pt game-tying jumper this year that sent the game to overtime.

sargon21
03-27-2011, 01:29 AM
Needs a poll.

I think this article basically sums up what I think of Kobe: LINK (http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time). If Roy was healthy I'll go with him. But the Melo is probably the most clutch (despite everyone knowing that hes taking a J for the win).

Been on this site for like two years, and I still don't know how to put up a poll lol

Chronz
03-27-2011, 01:35 AM
If such a term exists, ill take dirk over anyone. I also don't agree with the exclusion of bron/wade, makes no sense if you look at their history. Anointing rose above them because he's finally had a good stretch doesn't make him a better closer, it only proves how wildly inconsistent this trait is, thus why I choose not to believe in it. Dirk is the only guy who has bucked this trend, who's teams exceed its talent, who's team consistently wins these kind of games without the reliance of elite defensive backing and he's playoff proven to boot.

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 01:38 AM
Needs a poll.

I think this article basically sums up what I think of Kobe: LINK (http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time). If Roy was healthy I'll go with him. But the Melo is probably the most clutch (despite everyone knowing that hes taking a J for the win).

By that link LeBron is more clutch than Kobe, nice. But LeBron sucks in the clutch :p

Chronz
03-27-2011, 01:44 AM
Good question, haha, I just think everyone will have a different opinion on that. As for my list, I was basically just taking into account this year.

Dirk, wasn't really forgetting him, but I gotta cut it to top 3 somehow.

CP3 I just don't consider that clutch, he almost always passes the ball on those last second plays, and D-Will is a bit more clutch than CP3, but I don't think he's in it with the other guys I've put on my list.

Roy for sure, he's one of my favorite players to watch and he certainly is very clutch, but his health still does remain a question. Even not being healthy, I remember him nailing a 3pt game-tying jumper this year that sent the game to overtime.

You don't consider cp3 clutch? The same cp3 who over his career manages to gets his subpar offensive team to sport the highest offensive marks in the league in close game situations, that cp3?

How is dirk off the top 3

nyanks79
03-27-2011, 01:44 AM
Good question, haha, I just think everyone will have a different opinion on that. As for my list, I was basically just taking into account this year.

Dirk, wasn't really forgetting him, but I gotta cut it to top 3 somehow.

CP3 I just don't consider that clutch, he almost always passes the ball on those last second plays, and D-Will is a bit more clutch than CP3, but I don't think he's in it with the other guys I've put on my list.

Roy for sure, he's one of my favorite players to watch and he certainly is very clutch, but his health still does remain a question. Even not being healthy, I remember him nailing a 3pt game-tying jumper this year that sent the game to overtime.

But why dose it make him less clutch that he passes, and most of the time that could be the right play. Im pretty sure I heard that CP3s teams offensive efficiency rises more then any other team in the final minutes.

tredigs
03-27-2011, 01:46 AM
I totally forgot to mention Melo. I'm not big on Melo as a main piece on any contending team, but that dude can flat out finish. Again, no nerves, and more than that it seems like he LIVES for that moment.

I might actually take Melo over any other player in the game for a last second shot. I've seen the numbers, and I'm pretty sure they back me up on that.

If we're talking "last 24 seconds" in general, that's different (as it involves defense, opening up others for assists, etc.). But as a finisher? Sign me up.

kArSoN RyDaH
03-27-2011, 01:48 AM
No the list looks like this:


1. Kobe
.
..
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
2. Melo
3. Rose
4. FIsher

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 01:49 AM
No the list looks like this:


1. Kobe
.
..
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
2. Melo
3. Rose
4. FIsher

http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time

kArSoN RyDaH
03-27-2011, 01:51 AM
http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time

google search: who holds nba record for most game winning shots in nba history


and you will get


Kobe Bryant.


nice try though. that article is trash.

Chronz
03-27-2011, 01:52 AM
But why dose it make him less clutch that he passes, and most of the time that could be the right play. Im pretty sure I heard that CP3s teams offensive efficiency rises more then any other team in the final minutes.

That's what watching the game and relying solely on your eyes gets you, biased, incomplete, shallow analysis.

Watching the game is so overrated, why not study the game? Combine what you see with what you can quantify

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 01:53 AM
google search: who holds nba record for most game winning shots in nba history


and you will get


Kobe Bryant.


nice try though. that article is trash.

Trailing by one or two points, or tied, in the final 24 seconds of regular-season and playoff games since 1996-97, with a minimum of 30 shots. From Alok Pattani of ESPN Stats & Information.

on 36-115 shooting

kArSoN RyDaH
03-27-2011, 01:53 AM
everything is biased.

Chronz
03-27-2011, 01:54 AM
google search: who holds nba record for most game winning shots in nba history


and you will get


Kobe Bryant.


nice try though. that article is trash.

First sign of bias, focusing on the good (the makes), with ZERO regard for the bad (the misses). Your opinion is trash

AIRMAR72
03-27-2011, 01:54 AM
brandon roy and paul pierce

Bulls_fan90
03-27-2011, 01:55 AM
Lebron HAHAHAHAHAHA joking.

Kobe

Melo
Rose
Durant

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 01:56 AM
everything is biased.

:laugh2:

Stats don't lie

Vidball
03-27-2011, 02:08 AM
:laugh2:

Stats don't lie

Like the most game winners in the history of the game as well as being the recognized finisher for 5 championship teams? Riiiiigggghhhhht. Have you guys ever heard of the GM survey done every year? No shock the GM's pick Kobe as well.

kArSoN RyDaH
03-27-2011, 02:10 AM
First sign of bias, focusing on the good (the makes), with ZERO regard for the bad (the misses). Your opinion is trash

Your opinion is trash.


People can come up with a stat for anything they want to prove.

Everything is biased.

sargon21
03-27-2011, 02:11 AM
Please take this Kobe BS elsewhere and get back to the discussion.

Chronz, you know I just disagree with you about these clutch situations. As for your little snipe at Rose "finally" playing well in the clutch or whatever, he's been doing it all year, get over it.

And for the guy on CP3, I feel he should do more for his team, and it could translate to more wins for his team if he would finish the games himself rather than rely on lesser role players to make big-time shots, that's all.

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:12 AM
I'd take Melo, and i'd take LeBron over Kobe.

5ass
03-27-2011, 02:13 AM
everything is trash! im packing my balls and leaving this place

sargon21
03-27-2011, 02:13 AM
To clarify, I mean "finisher" as in last min-2min of a game, and ultimately a last-second shot.

Vidball
03-27-2011, 02:13 AM
Please take this Kobe BS elsewhere and get back to the discussion.

Chronz, you know I just disagree with you about these clutch situations. As for your little snipe at Rose "finally" playing well in the clutch or whatever, he's been doing it all year, get over it.

And for the guy on CP3, I feel he should do more for his team, and it could translate to more wins for his team if he would finish the games himself rather than rely on lesser role players to make big-time shots, that's all.

Rose was clutch again tonight...he and Pierce are both Big Time in the East. They definitely give their teams a huge leg up in the playoffs.

Dnovakovic099
03-27-2011, 02:14 AM
Your opinion is trash.


People can come up with a stat for anything they want to prove.

Everything is biased.

While, I don't think Kobe is as clutch as people, say I would have to agree with you. Yes, Kobe misses a lot of shots at the end of games, but that is partially due to teams knowing he is going to shoot the ball. I think Kobe needs to pass out of double teams more at the end of games. That being said, I would rather have Kobe over Wade and LeBron ANY day at the end of games. All that being said, if I need one last shot give me Melo. The dude is ****ing sick.

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:16 AM
Like the most game winners in the history of the game as well as being the recognized finisher for 5 championship teams? Riiiiigggghhhhht. Have you guys ever heard of the GM survey done every year? No shock the GM's pick Kobe as well.

Please read the whole article

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 02:23 AM
as a heat fan here is my list of who i want taking the final shot for me:

1) Kobe
2) Wade
3) Melo
4) Lebron
5) Dirk

Chronz
03-27-2011, 02:26 AM
Your opinion is trash.


People can come up with a stat for anything they want to prove.

Everything is biased.

lol, you can only come up with a stat for things that actually happen, try harder

AIRMAR72
03-27-2011, 02:27 AM
While, I don't think Kobe is as clutch as people, say I would have to agree with you. Yes, Kobe misses a lot of shots at the end of games, but that is partially due to teams knowing he is going to shoot the ball. I think Kobe needs to pass out of double teams more at the end of games. That being said, I would rather have Kobe over Wade and LeBron ANY day at the end of games. All that being said, if I need one last shot give me Melo. The dude is ****ing sick.
are sure about that kobe over wade and bron look melo and kobe are same type of players who names are always in media and they overall game DONT back it both melo and kobe hurt there teams more than any star player i can think of

Chronz
03-27-2011, 02:29 AM
Please take this Kobe BS elsewhere and get back to the discussion.

Chronz, you know I just disagree with you about these clutch situations. As for your little snipe at Rose "finally" playing well in the clutch or whatever, he's been doing it all year, get over it.

And for the guy on CP3, I feel he should do more for his team, and it could translate to more wins for his team if he would finish the games himself rather than rely on lesser role players to make big-time shots, that's all.

where did I say he hasn't done it all year, I can see your struggling with the context.

Lol at your rationale for cp3, yes because having the best offense during those critical moments isn't doing your part. Can you provide something how shall I say, less vague. The cliche of something, anything translating to more wins could be said for any player, including rose

Ollie Tabooger
03-27-2011, 02:34 AM
Who would I want taking the last shot?

1. Dirk
2. Melo
3. Roy
4. Kobe
5. Pierce

sargon21
03-27-2011, 02:42 AM
where did I say he hasn't done it all year, I can see your struggling with the context.

Lol at your rationale for cp3, yes because having the best offense during those critical moments isn't doing your part. Can you provide something how shall I say, less vague. The cliche of something, anything translating to more wins could be said for any player, including rose

1. "Anointing rose above them because he's finally had a good stretch doesn't make him a better closer, it only proves how wildly inconsistent this trait is,"

-- right there

2. lol at you talking in circles, and never providing an analysis behind his offense being great in those situations

I want my best player taking the last second shot or shots down the stretch unless the right pass just has to be made. Paul passes too much down the stretch and doesn't put the burden of winning the game soley on himself, which if he wants to be considered "better" than Rose he has to do IMO. Superstars should win or lose the game down the stretch, not a role player. If I'm going down, I'm going down with my best player getting a good look. Maybe CP3 just isn't capable of getting that "good look". Most will disagree with this analysis, good for them, I don't care.

Vidball
03-27-2011, 02:43 AM
are sure about that kobe over wade and bron look melo and kobe are same type of players who names are always in media and they overall game DONT back it both melo and kobe hurt there teams more than any star player i can think of

Wow...so the Lakers win despite Kobe now? Hahaha. Very nice! I wonder why the GM's select Kobe as the best finisher every year - guess they've bought into the "media hype" too, right :facepalm: It's not the fact that he's made more winning shots than ANY of the greats. It's not the fact that he's been the finisher (not just for the last 30 seconds, but for the 4th quarter) for 5 championship teams. Kobe needs to stop hurting these Lakers :D

sargon21
03-27-2011, 02:45 AM
Wow...so the Lakers win despite Kobe now? Hahaha. Very nice! I wonder why the GM's select Kobe as the best finisher every year - guess they've bought into the "media hype" too, right :facepalm: It's not the fact that he's made more winning shots than ANY of the greats. It's not the fact that he's been the finisher (not just for the last 30 seconds, but for the 4th quarter) for 5 championship teams. Kobe needs to stop hurting these Lakers :D

So, was Kobe more "clutch" than MJ because he's hit more last second shots?

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:53 AM
Wow...so the Lakers win despite Kobe now? Hahaha. Very nice! I wonder why the GM's select Kobe as the best finisher every year - guess they've bought into the "media hype" too, right :facepalm: It's not the fact that he's made more winning shots than ANY of the greats. It's not the fact that he's been the finisher (not just for the last 30 seconds, but for the 4th quarter) for 5 championship teams. Kobe needs to stop hurting these Lakers :D

Yes and on 31-115 shooting while being a ballhog. Taking shots while double teamed forgetting about the open man, causing Phil to openly complain and request a trade.

A great offensive team performing at average levels, with a star setting records for number of shots attempted. Teammates left wide open. Evidence, even, that Bryant's play puts his team into nailbiters that needn't be so close.

That, my friends, is a ball hog.

You keep bringing up the GM survey also:

In that same GM survey, for instance, John Wall was a heavy favorite to beat Blake Griffin for rookie of the year. Kevin Durant was a slam dunk to win this year's MVP.

In that player poll, Chauncey Billups got the second-most votes as the preferred go-to crunch-time scorer. Billups is 3-of-27 with the game on the line over the past five seasons. Dead last in the NBA among those who have attempted at least 15 shots.

None of that means anyone is dumb. Instead, it means that reputation is a huge factor, and it's beyond anyone to remember and catalog 7,000 or so shots in your head.

And as for Jackson, he wants the same kind of hit-the-open-man team play every coach wants. We know this because back when he was free to speak frankly on the topic, he could not have been more clear.

Just read this article and the articles in it..

nyanks79
03-27-2011, 02:53 AM
1. "Anointing rose above them because he's finally had a good stretch doesn't make him a better closer, it only proves how wildly inconsistent this trait is,"

-- right there

2. lol at you talking in circles, and never providing an analysis behind his offense being great in those situations

I want my best player taking the last second shot or shots down the stretch unless the right pass just has to be made. Paul passes too much down the stretch and doesn't put the burden of winning the game soley on himself, which if he wants to be considered "better" than Rose he has to do IMO. Superstars should win or lose the game down the stretch, not a role player. If I'm going down, I'm going down with my best player getting a good look. Maybe CP3 just isn't capable of getting that "good look". Most will disagree with this analysis, good for them, I don't care.

He probably wont get the best look, so why does is make that less valuable? Its kinda the argument with Kobe on how he has so many misses. He dosent make the best play alot of his time and his team suffers. While someone like CP3s teams has the best offensive effieciency in that time. And I doubt that anyone else on the Hornets has created plays for themselves or other unless its Paul. I can recall West hitting a couple game winners in his time but most of the offensive burden is on CP3.

To the original question, I guess I would probably go between Dirk and Melo. IMO you should run a set and try to run a P&R or another set. But if your running and Iso Id probably choose Melo or Dirk mainly because there bigger and will always get there shots off.

¿QUE?
03-27-2011, 02:54 AM
Kemba

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 03:09 AM
Who would I want taking the last shot?

1. Dirk
2. Melo
3. Roy
4. Kobe
5. Pierce

no offense but any top 5 list without wade on it is a complete joke. i forgot about pierce though so good point there. come to think about it i'd put him ahead of lebron. but roy are you kidding me? he was good when he could actually play a few minutes a game. (no hate for roy i feel really bad for how his health is ruining his career sorta like oden but at least roy had a few good years.) and kobe at # 4 is ********.

tredigs
03-27-2011, 03:15 AM
Yes and on 31-115 shooting while being a ballhog. Taking shots while double teamed forgetting about the open man, causing Phil to openly complain and request a trade.

A great offensive team performing at average levels, with a star setting records for number of shots attempted. Teammates left wide open. Evidence, even, that Bryant's play puts his team into nailbiters that needn't be so close.

That, my friends, is a ball hog.

You keep bringing up the GM survey also:

In that same GM survey, for instance, John Wall was a heavy favorite to beat Blake Griffin for rookie of the year. Kevin Durant was a slam dunk to win this year's MVP.

In that player poll, Chauncey Billups got the second-most votes as the preferred go-to crunch-time scorer. Billups is 3-of-27 with the game on the line over the past five seasons. Dead last in the NBA among those who have attempted at least 15 shots.

None of that means anyone is dumb. Instead, it means that reputation is a huge factor, and it's beyond anyone to remember and catalog 7,000 or so shots in your head.

And as for Jackson, he wants the same kind of hit-the-open-man team play every coach wants. We know this because back when he was free to speak frankly on the topic, he could not have been more clear.

Just read this article and the articles in it..

Well put, and this dude's spot on.

magic0320
03-27-2011, 03:21 AM
hahaha it's funny how people think their fav player is always most clutch...:D:D:D:D:D:DD:D:D

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 03:23 AM
Like the average Laker fan.

Jewelz0376
03-27-2011, 03:24 AM
I'm obviously biased, but there is no other player I'd pick to finish a game than Kobe... Sometimes he gets in trouble playing hero ball, but more often than not he's going to come through...Just recently he came through against the Suns in the triple ot game and then next game closed out the clippers...That boy Kobe is cold blooded 4real...

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 03:27 AM
kobe has to be number 1 and i'm a heat fan with 2 of the top closers on my team even if this yr hasn't proven it. imo wade is number 2 in the league and lebron is a top 5-6 closer if you look at pierce and dirk and melo in the mix.

Jewelz0376
03-27-2011, 03:31 AM
Another guy who people sleep on in the clutch is Manu...I'm not a spurs fan at all, but I got much respect for Manu's game...

Avenged
03-27-2011, 03:33 AM
Melo, Kobe, Dirk, Wade etc.. Not in any order, just the ones at the top of my head.

Oh and Lebron James too. He hasn't looked great this year down the stretch a handful of times but he's still a very good finisher regardless.

Also, I know Derek Fisher isn't a "finisher" but the guy is pretty damn clutch.

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 03:34 AM
Another guy who people sleep on in the clutch is Manu...I'm not a spurs fan at all, but I got much respect for Manu's game...

damn good point....my list keeps getting longer. here is what i have:

Kobe
Wade
Melo
Dirk
Peirce
Lebron
Durant
Manu
Rose
Ray Ray

that's my top 10 in order...

Chronz
03-27-2011, 03:47 AM
First of all, **** you. My reading comprehension is fine, stop playing dumb.

I told you MY OPINION, and I said most would disagree. But, you present your argument as FACT, when you don't support it with anything. That is why you're talking in circles.

You being a respected poster :facepalm:

Obviously its lacking if you came to the conclusion that I implied he hadn't been doing it all year. You've also exposed your bias by comparing rose to cp3 as if he were the bar minimum for being considered clutch. The argument is if he's clutch, not if he's as clutch as rose, which by the way you can't dismiss considering his teams efficiency on the clutch.
Ps I don't present my argument as fact, I present facts to my argument, I f not pretend to know where players rank in an aspect of the game that is so wildly inconsistent, it'd just easy to spot flaws in your argument

MickeyMgl
03-27-2011, 03:53 AM
:laugh2:

Stats don't lie

There's three kinds of lies: Lies, Damned lies, and statistics.

Stats can say whatever a person wants them to say.

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 03:58 AM
that makes a bit of sense i guess...lol

Chronz
03-27-2011, 04:01 AM
There's three kinds of lies: Lies, Damned lies, and statistics.

Stats can say whatever a person wants them to say.

Show me a stat that says kwame brown is the best player in nba history

sargon21
03-27-2011, 04:02 AM
Obviously its lacking if you came to the conclusion that I implied he hadn't been doing it all year. You've also exposed your bias by comparing rose to cp3 as if he were the bar minimum for being considered clutch. The argument is if he's clutch, not if he's as clutch as rose, which by the way you can't dismiss considering his teams efficiency on the clutch.
Ps I don't present my argument as fact, I present facts to my argument, I f not pretend to know where players rank in an aspect of the game that is so wildly inconsistent, it'd just easy to spot flaws in your argument

You keep saying this, but never show it, you don't show it, then it doesn't exist to me. I'm not some naive ******* that can never be wrong like some on here. If you have a legit argument, pony up, I'd like to see the stats behind it, otherwise I'll keep to my belief since it seems it can't be proven wrong.

And telling me to kill myself when my reading comprehension was just fine and I read it correctly, I don't give a **** what you say, you can **** yourself.

sargon21
03-27-2011, 04:03 AM
Melo, Kobe, Dirk, Wade etc.. Not in any order, just the ones at the top of my head.

Oh and Lebron James too. He hasn't looked great this year down the stretch a handful of times but he's still a very good finisher regardless.

Also, I know Derek Fisher isn't a "finisher" but the guy is pretty damn clutch.

Why no Rose, if I may ask?

SportsFanatic10
03-27-2011, 04:07 AM
takes more than one good season rose homer...maybe if he can shoot more than 44% he'll be in the convo for top 5.

Chronz
03-27-2011, 04:13 AM
You keep saying this, but never show it, you don't show it, then it doesn't exist to me. I'm not some naive ******* that can never be wrong like some on here. If you have a legit argument, pony up, I'd like to see the stats behind it, otherwise I'll keep to my belief since it seems it can't be proven wrong.

And telling me to kill myself when my reading comprehension was just fine and I read it correctly, I don't give a **** what you say, you can **** yourself.

Your reading comprehension is severely lacking for all the reasons I've given, as for the evidence do your own grunt work. If you don't know how to look **** up I don't care about what you think, your free to live in the dark all you want

I'm also on my phone so sue me for bringing up rational points that were reiterated by another poster on here, why don't you ask him or the guy posting links

Evolution23
03-27-2011, 04:21 AM
I'll take Melo. I feel at ease when hes taking the last shot.

Chronz
03-27-2011, 04:23 AM
I'll take Melo. I feel at ease when hes taking the last shot.

Are you saying this as a knick fan or a melo fan?

shep33
03-27-2011, 04:40 AM
White Mamba

JiffyMix88
03-27-2011, 04:47 AM
give me okafor the guy is sick in the cluth 1 for 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiVJQ6e7Q5g

dnewguy
03-27-2011, 04:48 AM
Kobe and Wade.

bklynny67
03-27-2011, 05:04 AM
Not Rose

Omar Little
03-27-2011, 05:28 AM
I gotta go with B-Roy. My favorite player in the game, (so sad that health issues have basically knocked him outta relativity) but still he has proven to be as clutch as it gets with the game on the line. Straight ice in his veins! Hope he can get it back next year and re-become who we all know he really is.

gangis2169
03-27-2011, 08:43 AM
stats don't lie. as of right now:
Nene is the most dominant player in the league as far as field goal percentage.

Russell Westbrook, Steve Nash, Lebron James, Derrick Rose, and Rajon Rondo are amongst the worst ball handlers in the nba. (Lets make sure they NEVER get the ball!).

"Kobe gets away with anything on the court, he always gets calls!" Well as of right now Kevin Martin gets more love than Kobe as far as free throw attempts along with Lebron, Wade, Durant, and Melo by a landslide.
"Well thats because he is a perimiter player and doesnt drive to the basket and force the calls." If that were the case than Derrick Rose should be at the top of that list right? So where is he right now? Right below Kobe.....

Monte Ellis is Top 3 defensive players in the league! Which we all know thats not even close to being true. "Well he's in the top 3 in steals per game."

All in all the game is what it is and how it plays out and the situations that the refs and players deal with cannot be gaged by numbers. We all know who are the top players and what they do so why ***** and complain about it and enjoy the game.

BALLER R
03-27-2011, 08:55 AM
stats don't lie. as of right now:
Nene is the most dominant player in the league as far as field goal percentage.

Russell Westbrook, Steve Nash, Lebron James, Derrick Rose, and Rajon Rondo are amongst the worst ball handlers in the nba. (Lets make sure they NEVER get the ball!).

"Kobe gets away with anything on the court, he always gets calls!" Well as of right now Kevin Martin gets more love than Kobe as far as free throw attempts along with Lebron, Wade, Durant, and Melo by a landslide.
"Well thats because he is a perimiter player and doesnt drive to the basket and force the calls." If that were the case than Derrick Rose should be at the top of that list right? So where is he right now? Right below Kobe.....

Monte Ellis is Top 3 defensive players in the league! Which we all know thats not even close to being true. "Well he's in the top 3 in steals per game."

All in all the game is what it is and how it plays out and the situations that the refs and players deal with cannot be gaged by numbers. We all know who are the top players and what they do so why ***** and complain about it and enjoy the game.

+1 thank you

BALLER R
03-27-2011, 09:00 AM
i hate when people talk about being clutch and to prove lebrons better they have to find stats somewhere. no when someones clutch you just know any basketball fan can watch or play basketball and know ok kobes clutch, so is dirk, ray allen, and melo. By the way those stats are irrelevant because kobe has the same amount of attempts as the first 3 guys combined. and wheres a question game is on the line who gets the ball shawn marion or kobe? cause according to that list hes the 3rd most clutch player in the nba...anyone who knows anything about basketball would never have marion take it over kobe C'MON SON thats ridiculous

Hiphopopotamus
03-27-2011, 09:16 AM
stats don't lie. as of right now:
Nene is the most dominant player in the league as far as field goal percentage.

Russell Westbrook, Steve Nash, Lebron James, Derrick Rose, and Rajon Rondo are amongst the worst ball handlers in the nba. (Lets make sure they NEVER get the ball!).

"Kobe gets away with anything on the court, he always gets calls!" Well as of right now Kevin Martin gets more love than Kobe as far as free throw attempts along with Lebron, Wade, Durant, and Melo by a landslide.
"Well thats because he is a perimiter player and doesnt drive to the basket and force the calls." If that were the case than Derrick Rose should be at the top of that list right? So where is he right now? Right below Kobe.....

Monte Ellis is Top 3 defensive players in the league! Which we all know thats not even close to being true. "Well he's in the top 3 in steals per game."

All in all the game is what it is and how it plays out and the situations that the refs and players deal with cannot be gaged by numbers. We all know who are the top players and what they do so why ***** and complain about it and enjoy the game.

Boom! Love it

Hustlenomics
03-27-2011, 09:35 AM
Melo and Pierce duh

DoJoTheSlasher
03-27-2011, 10:00 AM
How in the HELL do you put Rose up there but not Dirk........

coryd238
03-27-2011, 11:35 AM
1. Melo
2. Kobe
3. Roy
4. Dirk
5. Paul Pierce

Gators123
03-27-2011, 11:46 AM
Alright, haven't had this thread in a while...

Well, who do you guys see as the best finisher(s) in the game?

As of right now, 3 really stick out to me, in no order:

Rose -- he seems to always lead his team to victory in the last 3 minutes of a game, just willing his team to victory

Kobe -- Kobe is Kobe, and there's no one I'd rather have with the ball in his hands when the game is on the line

Melo -- Melo is a straight-up killer on those last second shots, and I've personally seen him hit aganist my team at least twice. It seems like he's just got that ice in his veins on the last second shots.

In the past, Wade/Lebron easily would've been on this list, but with their late-game struggles this year, I don't think they deserve to be. Also, I think Pierce should be given strong consideration, and he could easily be at the top of this list in terms of the last second shot.

Please. Stop being a homer. I have a feeling that if Rose didn't have a good game last night you wouldn't have made this thread.

theheatles
03-27-2011, 11:50 AM
WHAT!?!?!? how in the world can anyone put rose on this list...u can't be known for a closer if u won ZERO playoff series...wow this rose hype is getting so out of hand

1. Kobe
2. Paul Pierce
3. Melo
4. Wade
5. Dirk

daleja424
03-27-2011, 11:56 AM
Rose has been fantastic this year, but he needs to show clutchness over the long haul and needs to do it in the playoffs before he crack the list. This is how the list looks IMO:

1. Kobe
2. Wade
3. Lebron
4. Pierce
5. Dirk

SteBO
03-27-2011, 11:59 AM
1. Kobe
2. Wade
3. Pierce
4. LeBron
5. Dirk

Master Mind
03-27-2011, 12:00 PM
Durant should be in the convo as well

mamba24
03-27-2011, 12:01 PM
So, was Kobe more "clutch" than MJ because he's hit more last second shots?

Dude... Where was that even said in the post???? He never once said Jordan was less clutch... He was talking about now. Kobe only has more because he has had more opportunity.

mamba24
03-27-2011, 12:08 PM
Show me a stat that says kwame brown is the best player in nba history

Have you ever taken a statistics class in school??? i guarantee you if you look hard enough you could find a kwame brown stat that makes him great...possibly the greatest lol... you should stay in school... maybe get a lil common sense while your at it lol...

ragee
03-27-2011, 12:09 PM
Best finishers in the game: Dirk and Kobe

theheatles
03-27-2011, 12:15 PM
Have you ever taken a statistics class in school??? i guarantee you if you look hard enough you could find a kwame brown stat that makes him great...possibly the greatest lol... you should stay in school... maybe get a lil common sense while your at it lol...

i can't see 1 stat that shows kwame to be great, can u show a stat proving kwame to be great?

and statistics in school focuses primarily on probabilities and has nothing at all to do with sports statistics

gsgs49
03-27-2011, 12:46 PM
Final 5 minutes:
Kobe
Wade
Lebron
Dirk
CP3

Last second shot:
Melo
Pierce
Dirk
Kobe
Wade

FuriousJatt
03-27-2011, 01:06 PM
i gotta go with kobe and rose

Purple&Gold24
03-27-2011, 01:06 PM
:laugh2:

Stats don't lie

So you would rather pass the ball to James rather than Kobe? Cmon man
For some reason I always see you "trying" to diss something about the lakers. I wonder why. Im sure if you ask any coach in the NBA they'd choose kobe. :eyebrow:

WizFan3
03-27-2011, 01:11 PM
gilbert arenas duh

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 01:14 PM
So you would rather pass the ball to James rather than Kobe? Cmon man
For some reason I always see you "trying" to diss something about the lakers. I wonder why. Im sure if you ask any coach in the NBA they'd choose kobe. :eyebrow:

Yes I would. LeBron has struggled this year, but has been clutch throughout his career. Both are great players, i'm not trying to diss anybody..

mzgrizz
03-27-2011, 01:47 PM
Kobe stands alone IMO

Evolution23
03-27-2011, 02:11 PM
Are you saying this as a knick fan or a melo fan?

cause hes a proven clutch player... look it up, dont ask me why.

Oefarmy2005
03-27-2011, 02:20 PM
Finishing at the rim - Lebron.

Finishing the game - I would have to go with Durant. Pierce is a close second.

Bravo95
03-27-2011, 02:29 PM
1. Kobe
2. Wade
3. Dirk
4. Melo
5. Manu

BALLER R
03-27-2011, 02:33 PM
Rose has been fantastic this year, but he needs to show clutchness over the long haul and needs to do it in the playoffs before he crack the list. This is how the list looks IMO:

1. Kobe
2. Wade
3. Lebron
4. Pierce
5. Dirk

i would take lebron off that list if u wanna talk about playoffs.

ravistarr
03-27-2011, 02:33 PM
Statistically speaking, I believe I've read that Melo actually is the most clutch and that Kobe ranks below him....

BALLER R
03-27-2011, 02:34 PM
Finishing at the rim - Lebron.

Finishing the game - I would have to go with Durant. Pierce is a close second.

durant nawwww i like him but you would put durant over melo, kobe and wade

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:36 PM
Statistically speaking, I believe I've read that Melo actually is the most clutch and that Kobe ranks below him....

LeBron is the more clutch statistically as well.

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 02:38 PM
Kobe is sooo incredibly overrated in the clutch. He's an awful decision maker, he ALWAYS shoots, no matter the defense. His FG% in the last 24 seconds of a game is 31%, people forget how many shots this guy misses!(not to mention the league average is 29.7% so hes barely above average) He has attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of regular season games in his career. 115! of course hes going to have some memorable makes.

List of players who shoot better in the clutch:
FGM FGA FG%
Carmelo Anthony 21 44 47.7
Chris Paul 14 31 45.2
Shawn Marion 12 30 40
Brandon Roy 12 30 40
Hedo Turkoglu 12 30 40
Rashard Lewis 18 46 39.1
Deron Williams 14 36 38.9
Mike Bibby 15 39 38.5
Dirk Nowitzki 25 65 38.5
Tim Duncan 23 62 37.1
Ben Gordon 17 49 34.7
Chris Webber 18 52 34.6
Raymond Felton 12 36 33.3
LeBron James 23 69 33.3
Ray Allen 23 70 32.9
Gilbert Arenas 13 40 32.5
Vince Carter 31 96 32.3

Clearly melo is the guy you want shooting the ball. Rose wasn't available in these stats but this year he's been an excellent decision maker in late games

Wow that turned out hard to read look up the table here:
http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 02:38 PM
Kobe.

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 02:39 PM
Kobe is sooo incredibly overrated in the clutch. He's an awful decision maker, he ALWAYS shoots, no matter the defense. His FG% in the last 24 seconds of a game is 31%, people forget how many shots this guy misses!(not to mention the league average is 29.7% so hes barely above average) He has attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of regular season games in his career. 115! of course hes going to have some memorable makes.

List of players who shoot better in the clutch:
Carmelo Anthony 21 44 47.7
Chris Paul 14 31 45.2
Shawn Marion 12 30 40
Brandon Roy 12 30 40
Hedo Turkoglu 12 30 40
Rashard Lewis 18 46 39.1
Glenn Robinson 14 36 38.9
Deron Williams 14 36 38.9
Mike Bibby 15 39 38.5
Dirk Nowitzki 25 65 38.5
Jalen Rose 12 32 37.5
Tim Duncan 23 62 37.1
Eddie Jones 13 36 36.1
Karl Malone 11 31 35.5
Ben Gordon 17 49 34.7
Chris Webber 18 52 34.6
Raymond Felton 12 36 33.3
LeBron James 23 69 33.3
Ray Allen 23 70 32.9
Gilbert Arenas 13 40 32.5
Vince Carter 31 96 32.3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mMioJ5szc

When it matters greatness shows.

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mMioJ5szc

When it matters greatness shows.

Below is a breakdown of every playoff game throughout Kobe Bryant’s 15 year career in which he was entrusted to take a game winning or game tying shot:


Year Opponent Game Result Results
1996 Utah Jazz Game 5 Miss Bryant misses a game tying shot with 4 seconds left.
1999 San Antonio Spurs Game 2 Miss Bryant misses a game tying shot at the end of regulation
2000 Phoenix Suns Game 2 Make Bryant makes a game winning shot with 2 seconds left
2001 Philidephia 76ers Game 1 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 20 seconds left.
2002 San Antonio Spurs Game 4 Make Bryant makes a game winning shot with 5 seconds left
2002 Sacramento Kings Game 4 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 4 seconds left
2002 Sacramento Kings Game 5 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 8 seconds left
2002 Sacramento Kings Game 7 Miss Bryant misses a game winning tip shot with 8 seconds left
2003 Minnesota Timberwolves Game 3 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot in OT with 13 seconds left.
2003 Minnesota Timberwolves Game 3 Miss Bryant misses a game tying shot in OT with 2 seconds left
2003 San Antonio Spurs Game 1 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 13 seconds left.
2004 Houston Rockets Game 1 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 17 seconds left.
2004 Houston Rockets Game 4 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 3 seconds left.
2004 Detroit Pistons Game 1 Make Bryant makes a game tying shot with 2 seconds left.
2006 Phoenix Suns Game 4 Make Bryant makes a game tying shot with 4 seconds left.
2006 Phoenix Suns Game 4 Make Bryant makes a game winning shot in OT with 6 seconds left.
2006 Phoenix Suns Game 6 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 6 seconds left.
2008 San Antonio Spurs Game 5 Make Bryant makes the game winning shot with 23 seconds left.
2009 Utah Jazz Game 3 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 2 seconds left.
2009 Orlando Magic Game 2 Miss Bryant has his game winning shot blocked with 8 sec left.
2010 Oklahoma City Thunder Game 6 Miss Bryant misses game winning shot with .5 seconds left.
2010 Phoenix Suns Game 5 Miss Bryant misses a game winning shot with 3 seconds left.


http://chasing23.com/2011/02/the-myth-of-playoff-kobe/

6/22

NYKalltheway
03-27-2011, 02:44 PM
Melo, Pierce, Dirk and Kobe imo with Durant 5th

NYKalltheway
03-27-2011, 02:45 PM
below is a breakdown of every playoff game throughout kobe bryant’s 15 year career in which he was entrusted to take a game winning or game tying shot:




http://chasing23.com/2011/02/the-myth-of-playoff-kobe/

6/22 !

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 02:48 PM
Below is a breakdown of every playoff game throughout Kobe Bryant’s 15 year career in which he was entrusted to take a game winning or game tying shot:




http://chasing23.com/2011/02/the-myth-of-playoff-kobe/

6/22

I was unaware that finishing only happened in the last seconds of games. How many games did Kobe have his team so far ahead it didn't matter?

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 02:50 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45mMioJ5szc

When it matters greatness shows.

6/22 wow :clap: thats WORSE then how he shoots in regular season!
-> 27.3%
You must just watch game highlights eh :P Even laker fans know for every clutch shot he makes he misses 2-4. And the shooting over double teams, ridiculous shots that luckily bank in (on wade). C'mon poor decision maker, he should make a play and pass the ball in the late game if he wants to help his team.

Cano4prez
03-27-2011, 02:53 PM
I was unaware that finishing only happened in the last seconds of games. How many games did Kobe have his team so far ahead it didn't matter?

Not as many as you think considering he's attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of a one possesion game. He's hit 36 of those shots, and if you want to go with the "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points" clutch:

http://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM

http://arturogalletti.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/untitled47.png

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 02:54 PM
I was unaware that finishing only happened in the last seconds of games. How many games did Kobe have his team so far ahead it didn't matter?

WHAT?! if were talking about games that are won and aren't close then you must have lebron and wade in discussion. CLEARLY it's implied that the discussion is about finishing close games.

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 02:55 PM
Not as many as you think considering he's attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of a one possesion game. He's hit 36 of those shots, and if you want to go with the "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points" clutch:

http://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM

http://arturogalletti.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/untitled47.png

your second link is messed up i think

HAH if you check out FG% in 4th quarter 5 min left and overtime you see Bynum is more clutch then kobe.

Ethix11
03-27-2011, 02:57 PM
Wade. LeBron has been given the opportunity to close games out and failed multiple times. What I think makes Wade better than him is his ability to get 3 points at will. He will drive to the basket and if you foul him, he will get the and1.

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 02:59 PM
Not as many as you think considering he's attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of a one possesion game. He's hit 36 of those shots, and if you want to go with the "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points" clutch:

http://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM

http://arturogalletti.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/untitled47.png

That's a pointless stat right there given that my point was that the Lakers had already won most of their games with Kobe their best player. Stands to reason that LeBron would have had to make more shots and score more points for CLE with him being the main man and them not being close to as good as the Lakers.

You can throw any stat you want but Kobe has the rings for a reason. His allround player when it matters shines through, he's a winner, he's the man LeBron wishes he was and you know it as well as I do.

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 03:06 PM
I think the best pure scorer in the game is Melo for what it's worth but his head has to be right. LeBron is obviously the most talented overall and Wade isn't far behind. Durant could be in the mix very soon but at the moment he's just in the group below.

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 03:08 PM
That's a pointless stat right there given that my point was that the Lakers had already won most of their games with Kobe their best player. Stands to reason that LeBron would have had to make more shots and score more points for CLE with him being the main man and them not being close to as good as the Lakers.

You can throw any stat you want but Kobe has the rings for a reason. His allround player when it matters shines through, he's a winner, he's the man LeBron wishes he was and you know it as well as I do.

CLE had a better record than the Lakers in lebrons final 2 seasons... Has it crossed your mind that a billion dollar industry recognizes it would benefit from having a HUGE market win championships? If he is as good as you say why does he only have 1 MVP? and the lakers need a 90 million dollar roster and arguably the greatest coach in the nba to get kobe rings... ya youre totally right hes flawless... I'm sure lebron wishes he was charged for rape :clap: thats the kind of man he wants to be!
Kobe = overrated.
Hell ill be starting SG and win a championship with shaq, and the refs (2002 WCF) By the end of his career LBJ could be the best player to ever play his position, and he'll get his titles eventually

JonnyBrav000
03-27-2011, 03:13 PM
So the most clutch players in the league are Melo, cp3 and Rashard Lewis. Melo is by far the most clutch player in the nba. Hope the knicks sign two bigmen in the offseason (chanlder and dalembert) to give the knicks more chances to win.

WrongIslander
03-27-2011, 03:13 PM
CLE had a better record than the Lakers in lebrons final 2 seasons... Has it crossed your mind that a billion dollar industry recognizes it would benefit from having a HUGE market win championships? If he is as good as you say why does he only have 1 MVP? and the lakers need a 90 million dollar roster and arguably the greatest coach in the nba to get kobe rings... ya youre totally right hes flawless... I'm sure lebron wishes he was charged for rape :clap: thats the kind of man he wants to be!
Kobe = overrated.
Hell ill be starting SG and win a championship with shaq, and the refs (2002 WCF) By the end of his career LBJ could be the best player to ever play his position, and he'll get his titles eventually

You guys are priceless. It's a conspiracy is it? Why arn't you showing any updated stats from this season I wonder?

At no point did I ever say Kobe was flawless and bringing his personal life into it is stupid as well. He wasn't found guilty of anything and unlike a certain Mr R from Pitts he didn't have a clean up crew on the scene.

As for your last OPINION it is also worthless as you stated it as fact. For all you know LeBron may never win a title.

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 03:17 PM
You guys are priceless. It's a conspiracy is it? Why arn't you showing any updated stats from this season I wonder?

At no point did I ever say Kobe was flawless and bringing his personal life into it is stupid as well. He wasn't found guilty of anything and unlike a certain Mr R from Pitts he didn't have a clean up crew on the scene.

As for your last OPINION it is also worthless as you stated it as fact. For all you know LeBron may never win a title.

Ok fine youre right on the last one, what i wanted to get at is whether or not lebron wins a title, he could go down as the best player at his position. Without Shaq, Phil or a 90 million dollar roster, Kobe goes down in history just as an all star SG like McGrady (minus the regressions and injuries)

M.Bibby2.0
03-27-2011, 03:20 PM
You guys are priceless. It's a conspiracy is it? Why arn't you showing any updated stats from this season I wonder?

At no point did I ever say Kobe was flawless and bringing his personal life into it is stupid as well. He wasn't found guilty of anything and unlike a certain Mr R from Pitts he didn't have a clean up crew on the scene.

As for your last OPINION it is also worthless as you stated it as fact. For all you know LeBron may never win a title.

"he's the man LeBron wishes he was "

last i checked, personal life is an aspect of being a man.

Tarheels23
03-27-2011, 04:33 PM
1. Kobe
2. Pierce

Oefarmy2005
03-27-2011, 05:13 PM
I think it would make more sense to see what players make the shot to put their team ahead for good - call it a game winning basket, not in the last minutes sense. That's what clutch is to me, it doesn't have to be the last basket.

AIRMAR72
03-27-2011, 05:15 PM
Kobe is sooo incredibly overrated in the clutch. He's an awful decision maker, he ALWAYS shoots, no matter the defense. His FG% in the last 24 seconds of a game is 31%, people forget how many shots this guy misses!(not to mention the league average is 29.7% so hes barely above average) He has attempted 115 shots in the last 24 seconds of regular season games in his career. 115! of course hes going to have some memorable makes.

List of players who shoot better in the clutch:
FGM FGA FG%
Carmelo Anthony 21 44 47.7
Chris Paul 14 31 45.2
Shawn Marion 12 30 40
Brandon Roy 12 30 40
Hedo Turkoglu 12 30 40
Rashard Lewis 18 46 39.1
Deron Williams 14 36 38.9
Mike Bibby 15 39 38.5
Dirk Nowitzki 25 65 38.5
Tim Duncan 23 62 37.1
Ben Gordon 17 49 34.7
Chris Webber 18 52 34.6
Raymond Felton 12 36 33.3
LeBron James 23 69 33.3
Ray Allen 23 70 32.9
Gilbert Arenas 13 40 32.5
Vince Carter 31 96 32.3

Clearly melo is the guy you want shooting the ball. Rose wasn't available in these stats but this year he's been an excellent decision maker in late games

Wow that turned out hard to read look up the table here:
http://espn.go.com/blog/TrueHoop/post/_/id/24200/the-truth-about-kobe-bryant-in-crunch-time

WOW i never knew they track stats on players clutch plays, stats(numbers) dont LIE its same formula the IRS use(numbers) but ive seen games with a younger kobe missin so many shots in the 4qtr during HIS career i used to call him 1st halfman cause all of kobe point came the 1st half of games i still DONT UNDERSTAND why they call him the closer and black mamba NOW he did have a good season in 09 season closing out some TUFF games but than the media starting hyping kobe up as if he was doing this stuff thru out his career BUT I GIVE credit he has been playing better over da last 6years but this year kobe is showing signs that hes almost FINISH

gangis2169
03-27-2011, 09:39 PM
your second link is messed up i think

HAH if you check out FG% in 4th quarter 5 min left and overtime you see Bynum is more clutch then kobe.

Lol someone is real sour at the Lakers! I understand the Queens have every right to bash the Lakers and Kobe. Well done!

NYM1989
03-27-2011, 11:33 PM
gotta be Derrick Rose and Kobe Bryant easilyyyy

MickeyMgl
03-28-2011, 05:29 AM
Below is a breakdown of every playoff game throughout Kobe Bryant’s 15 year career in which he was entrusted to take a game winning or game tying shot:

That list has so many ommitted makes and shady "misses" that it's rendered completely worthless.

rapjuicer06
03-28-2011, 08:34 AM
jenna jamison

MickeyMgl
03-28-2011, 11:34 AM
6/22 wow :clap: thats WORSE then how he shoots in regular season!

For sure, if it were true that'd be terrible. I can count more than six tying or go-ahead makes just off the top of my head.



You must just watch game highlights eh :P Even laker fans know for every clutch shot he makes he misses 2-4. And the shooting over double teams, ridiculous shots that luckily bank in (on wade). C'mon poor decision maker, he should make a play and pass the ball in the late game if he wants to help his team.

For several years, his teammates were Kwame and Smush. You don't help your team by passing the ball to Kwame.

asandhu23
03-28-2011, 01:23 PM
Hi! 1 vote for Monta Ellis.

AIMelo=KillaDUO
03-28-2011, 01:35 PM
Kobe
Melo
Amare
Boozer
Wade
Rose

leftymo
03-28-2011, 04:34 PM
This simple. Common sense says Kobe Bryant.

Ask any GM in the NBA, and they'll say Kobe.

Then ask a stat geek who doesn't follow the NBA or John Hollinger who is always wrong, and they'll find someone else.

Oh, and just watch the games... Nobody does it better and more often especially on the road than Kobe Bryant.

Ask Blazer fans... ask Phoenix Suns fans... ask Jazz fans... ask Nugget fans... they'll tell you b/c they've seen it.

Chronz
03-29-2011, 11:46 AM
Have you ever taken a statistics class in school??? i guarantee you if you look hard enough you could find a kwame brown stat that makes him great...possibly the greatest lol... you should stay in school... maybe get a lil common sense while your at it lol...
Ignoring your blatant disrespect, I stand by my initial statement. Feel free to provide something tangible, I would think that would come as common sense. Again, show me a stat that names Kwame as the GOAT and Ill show you just how much I know about stats. BASKETBALL STATS

danniboi168
03-29-2011, 12:09 PM
Kobe/Melo/Rose

COOLbeans
03-29-2011, 12:10 PM
hello. Monta Ellis.