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View Full Version : Would it benefit the Knicks to become like the Heat and get Paul?



NYSpirit1
03-08-2011, 01:22 PM
Strictly a question, but I'm starting to think that the Heat combination restricts getting role players and hinders the team. On the 72-win Bulls, it was Jordan, Pippen and Rodman, but they had loads of crucial role players. Is Amare, Melo and the right role players the combination to a title?

This My9 (Part of Fox news) article made me think otherwise:

http://www.my9tv.com/dpp/my9_sports/nba/knicks/For-The-Knicks%2C-It%27s-All-About-The-Role-Players

It's a must read. It kind of shows the team chemistry the Heat don't have because it's three guys and no one. And now all their cap is taken up. With the Knicks, if it's Amare and Melo, with good role players that have team chemistry, alongside a defensive big man, they could win a title. I don't think they need Paul, Howard or Deron Williams.

cwilson21
03-08-2011, 01:24 PM
Perhaps but less threads about the Knicks would certainly help out PSD.

SteBO
03-08-2011, 01:26 PM
Perhaps but less threads about the Knicks would certainly help out PSD.

Co-sign.

danniboi168
03-08-2011, 01:27 PM
you do make a lot of threads ..

nickdymez
03-08-2011, 01:29 PM
I haven't really seen to many Knick threads...

But of course getting Paul would help them out. Thats always been my thing. If you go out and get three superstars, make sure they compliment each other. Amare, Paul, and Melo compliment each other. One guy is a strait up point guard and allows the other two to play more off the ball.. Amare eats in that situation

jrm2054
03-08-2011, 01:29 PM
depends on the role players.

Knickrocketsfan
03-08-2011, 01:29 PM
Perhaps but less threads about the Knicks would certainly help out PSD.


Co-sign.

really? the non stop repeat topic threads about the Heat are killing PSD right now.

SteBO
03-08-2011, 01:30 PM
really? the non stop repeat topic threads about the Heat are killing PSD right now.

Co-signed as well.

Pierzynski4Prez
03-08-2011, 01:43 PM
really? the non stop repeat topic threads about the Heat are killing PSD right now.

Bulls too.

Hunter48MVP
03-08-2011, 01:48 PM
Could we stop talking about the Heat and Knicks.

Hellcrooner
03-08-2011, 01:49 PM
I think they would be better of getting a good Center like Marc Gasol a better shooting guard and a better bench and have a more balanced/deep team.

Three studs and 12 Nbdl players dont really make a contender

Punk
03-08-2011, 01:50 PM
Could we stop talking about basketball? Ughhh


I
Three studs and 12 Nbdl players dont really make a contender

NBDL players? Seriously?

You don't have have ignorant. You guys wish you had good talent.

kntresistheheat
03-08-2011, 01:51 PM
really? the non stop repeat topic threads about the Heat are killing PSD right now.



THIS.!:clap:


Its getting really annoying!

blahblahyoutoo
03-08-2011, 01:55 PM
they're better off with deron.

haggis
03-08-2011, 01:57 PM
how would getting paul make them like the heat? the heat don't have a PG ;)

THE MTL
03-08-2011, 02:00 PM
As long as the THREE STARS truly compliment each other then yes.

Melo- pure scorer
Amare- beast inside man
Paul/DWill- pure PG or rather pass first

Lebron and Wade are too similar. They have the same strengths and weaknesses. And Chris Bosh's inside game disappeared on Miami! All I see him is taking those 15-18ft shots now-a-days.

Plus, MIA is weakest in the two most important positions in basketball, whereas NYC would be Elite in the PG category.

smith&wesson
03-08-2011, 02:01 PM
ya forget the heat and the knicks

LETS TALK ABOUT THE RAPTORS :p

jiggin
03-08-2011, 02:05 PM
they shouldn't try and stack the deck. First of all, it hinders movement later in the year. You end up surrounding your stars with hasbeens (aka the heat) which doesn't equate to a balance when stars are hurt or need time to rest.

Only way star stacking works is if they complement each others game. Someone who is a pass first shoot second player should be added to a player who shoots first and passes second. See how that works. In Miami, they have 2 guys and a baby who all want to shoot shoot shoot.

Its hard to get on Sportcenter when all you do is pass, but it leads to amazing numbers in the W column. If Paul fits that MO, then they should make a run at him.

Sounds like the NBA is going to be taking a major hit to its fan base outside of these handful of cities. I am sure Stern has thought of that though...LOL

Ripper Gein
03-08-2011, 02:07 PM
No MORE What if knick threads goddman ******** **** **** mother ****er piece of ****!!!!!

LionsFan..LOL
03-08-2011, 02:08 PM
IMO it would only work if they have good role players. Don't model after MIA model the Knicks after the Celtics. They had their own big three but they had great role players Ex: Perkins, Rando, Glen Davis, Posey (was good at the time).

jiggin
03-08-2011, 02:09 PM
ya forget the heat and the knicks

LETS TALK ABOUT THE RAPTORS :p

the way things are going, the NBA will be banking on a handful of teams fan bases to represent the entire NBA fan base.

NBA would be pretty ignorant to think that teams that play in these divisions that have stacked team would some how still sell tickets at an acceptable rate.

Good to see the players destroy the competitive nature of the league, division and conferences...and the NBA just sit and watch it happen.

Mark my words...if this team stacking continues, the NBA will take a major marketing hit. Its Business 101...which is why it makes it so crazy to watch happen without much fight from the commish office or the other NBA franchises (maybe it is a topic of discussion, just not something the media and fans are privy to).

knickfan371
03-08-2011, 02:09 PM
I think they would be better of getting a good Center like Marc Gasol a better shooting guard and a better bench and have a more balanced/deep team.

Three studs and 12 Nbdl players dont really make a contender

is this "stud" shooting guard going to fall in the knicks lap.?

knickfan371
03-08-2011, 02:11 PM
that nets raptors 3 overtime was the game of the year

J4KOP99
03-08-2011, 02:13 PM
I think they would be better of getting a good Center like Marc Gasol a better shooting guard and a better bench and have a more balanced/deep team.

Three studs and 12 Nbdl players dont really make a contender

I agree crooner. Honestly, forget about the poing guard... worry about getting big men.

There are plenty of serviceable point guards out there that can play on a championship caliber team. The big men are what is important.

Look at the lakers, Celtics(in '08, Rondo was not nearly what he is now and that title was won with defense and big men) Spurs (Tony Parker is great, but Duncan and the rest of the bigs, plus the defense has always been key in San Anton.)


You NEED big men. Chris Paul is great, but you do not need a superstart PG to win a title. Paul, Melo and Stat + some horseshit big men and bench players will not win a championship IMO.

THE MTL
03-08-2011, 02:14 PM
I think the Celtics worked because the guys truly complimented each other and they obtained good role players throughout the season (Posey, House, PJ Brown, Cassell).

Allen- shooter
Pierce- scorer
Garnett- inside man

Perfect compliments

J4KOP99
03-08-2011, 02:16 PM
is this "stud" shooting guard going to fall in the knicks lap.?

That's my only disagreement with crooner. Fields is perfect for the Knicks. He gets his and doesn't need the ball to be effective. He is solid on defense and very young. Smart player too. Muddy Fields.

knickfan371
03-08-2011, 02:19 PM
Marketing hit? smh no it will not the fact that 3 teams are bank rolling the Whole league should let you know how relevant any other team really is. The Celtics.knicks,lakers are the glue and money for the nba.

Hellcrooner
03-08-2011, 02:20 PM
they shouldn't try and stack the deck. First of all, it hinders movement later in the year. You end up surrounding your stars with hasbeens (aka the heat) which doesn't equate to a balance when stars are hurt or need time to rest.

Only way star stacking works is if they complement each others game. Someone who is a pass first shoot second player should be added to a player who shoots first and passes second. See how that works. In Miami, they have 2 guys and a baby who all want to shoot shoot shoot.

Its hard to get on Sportcenter when all you do is pass, but it leads to amazing numbers in the W column. If Paul fits that MO, then they should make a run at him.

Sounds like the NBA is going to be taking a major hit to its fan base outside of these handful of cities. I am sure Stern has thought of that though...LOL

mmm the 80s had just a handull of stacked teams, knicks, bulls, sixers, celtics, bucks, hawks , lakers, suns, jazz, rockets ,mavs, blazers, nuggets and it worked fine thanks

knickfan371
03-08-2011, 02:20 PM
Think people forget landry fields is only 22 he is going to be as good as Dave Debuschere he reminds me of him.

nickdymez
03-08-2011, 02:23 PM
I agree crooner. Honestly, forget about the poing guard... worry about getting big men.

There are plenty of serviceable point guards out there that can play on a championship caliber team. The big men are what is important.

Look at the lakers, Celtics(in '08, Rondo was not nearly what he is now and that title was won with defense and big men) Spurs (Tony Parker is great, but Duncan and the rest of the bigs, plus the defense has always been key in San Anton.)


You NEED big men. Chris Paul is great, but you do not need a superstart PG to win a title. Paul, Melo and Stat + some horseshit big men and bench players will not win a championship IMO.

I think thats true with what your starting your team with. In the case of the knicks, you have Amare (a big) and Melo. So as a GM, i would get a serviceable (defensive minded) big alongside amare and get a stud pg to get him the ball on offense.

Chacarron
03-08-2011, 02:26 PM
Could we stop talking about basketball? Ughhh



NBDL players? Seriously?

You don't have have ignorant. You guys wish you had good talent.

Crooner is a Lakers fan, so his team definitely has good talent.

J4KOP99
03-08-2011, 02:29 PM
I think thats true with what your starting your team with. In the case of the knicks, you have Amare (a big) and Melo. So as a GM, i would get a serviceable (defensive minded) big alongside amare and get a stud pg to get him the ball on offense.

Where are the Knicks going to get this money? Let's be realistic here. I guess we have opposing definitions for "serviceable big men" but IMO, those will cost you a lot. Leaving you with not even close to enough $ for a guy like Paul. It is a lot harder to find a serviceable big compared to finding a pg that can help you out.

The Knicks should use their money to get a big or two, rather than spending it all on Chris paul.

RZZZA
03-08-2011, 02:33 PM
how come every time someone makes a thread, you got 10 people *****ing and whining about the topic of the thread?

some people don't want to discuss anything at all. We talk about the Knicks, Heat and Bulls so much because there's a lot of fans from those teams on this forum and the teams are relevant and often controversial. You want to talk about the timberwolves, the wizards, the hornets? Start a thread about it then.

HakeemTheDream
03-08-2011, 02:35 PM
They already have 2 players who need the ball alot in their hands.

Dwight would benefit them a lot more than Paul or Deron would.

nickdymez
03-08-2011, 02:37 PM
how come every time someone makes a thread, you got 10 people *****ing and whining about the topic of the thread?

some people don't want to discuss anything at all. We talk about the Knicks, Heat and Bulls so much because there's a lot of fans from those teams on this forum and the teams are relevant and often controversial. You want to talk about the timberwolves, the wizards, the hornets? Start a thread about it then.

This. I was thinking the same thing. There is always like 10 posts of just people hatin the topic... lol

Missing56&33
03-08-2011, 02:37 PM
it would be great for the Knicks but Billups is no pushover.

sintaks12
03-08-2011, 02:37 PM
how come every time someone makes a thread, you got 10 people *****ing and whining about the topic of the thread?

some people don't want to discuss anything at all. We talk about the Knicks, Heat and Bulls so much because there's a lot of fans from those teams on this forum and the teams are relevant and often controversial. You want to talk about the timberwolves, the wizards, the hornets? Start a thread about it then.

This. If you don't like the thread, don't post then.

BK-TY
03-08-2011, 02:49 PM
how would getting paul make them like the heat? the heat don't have a PG ;)

Yes they do. The cat with the headband... number 6... can't remember his name off top... :p

Ripper Gein
03-08-2011, 03:21 PM
how come every time someone makes a thread, you got 10 people *****ing and whining about the topic of the thread?

some people don't want to discuss anything at all. We talk about the Knicks, Heat and Bulls so much because there's a lot of fans from those teams on this forum and the teams are relevant and often controversial. You want to talk about the timberwolves, the wizards, the hornets? Start a thread about it then.


This. I was thinking the same thing. There is always like 10 posts of just people hatin the topic... lol

STFU that is why there are individual team forums so stop posting this what if ******** in the NBA forum and post it in there own cuz sorry to tell you unless your a fan of these teams we really could give a **** and i wouldnt even mind if they were well thought out topics but most of them are just plain stupid!

Ripper Gein
03-08-2011, 03:22 PM
No offense.:)

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 03:32 PM
Where are the Knicks going to get this money? Let's be realistic here. I guess we have opposing definitions for "serviceable big men" but IMO, those will cost you a lot. Leaving you with not even close to enough $ for a guy like Paul. It is a lot harder to find a serviceable big compared to finding a pg that can help you out.

The Knicks should use their money to get a big or two, rather than spending it all on Chris paul.

knicks have over 45 mil in the cap when paul is a FA.... plus 15 to spend on plyers already on the team... they have the money... there's only two players making money on knicks.... and a handful of expiring contracts....

and yes they would absolutely benifit...the guy averages 9 assist a game with noone on his team.... imagine what he would do with the knicks

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 03:36 PM
Where are the Knicks going to get this money? Let's be realistic here. I guess we have opposing definitions for "serviceable big men" but IMO, those will cost you a lot. Leaving you with not even close to enough $ for a guy like Paul. It is a lot harder to find a serviceable big compared to finding a pg that can help you out.

The Knicks should use their money to get a big or two, rather than spending it all on Chris paul.

knicks are fine at that 2... there's only about 5-6 players at the 2 or 3 in this league that are far above the rest.... and were not getting any of them.. they can afford to sign a center and paul... go look at what the knicks have when he becomes FA.... ps.. the players decide what happens now, so it can easily become a sign and trade...
same thing goes for the big man.... theres only 1 dominant center in this entire league.... knicks can afford to sign a guy like samuel dalembert and paul

abe_froman
03-08-2011, 03:38 PM
sure.but i think they'd be better served spreading that money around on center,bench,ect.

J4KOP99
03-08-2011, 03:38 PM
knicks have over 45 mil in the cap when paul is a FA.... plus 15 to spend on plyers already on the team... they have the money... there's only two players making money on knicks.... and a handful of expiring contracts....

and yes they would absolutely benifit...the guy averages 9 assist a game with noone on his team.... imagine what he would do with the knicks

Where on earth did you get those numbers from? Also, take into consideration that the current salary cap is only going to decrease. No way it rises.

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 03:41 PM
only if the new cba decreases big does that number change.... and it shouldnt decrease cause nba is having a good year, and its only goin to get better now that the knicks and all the major market teams in the east are promising again

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 03:47 PM
not to mention the players union is demanding a hard cap of 70mil.... im sorry i wrote that the wrong way... the knicks are spending 45 millin 2012..leaving them with 15 mil, plus the additinal money for players who alreayd on team...

dont forget you can resign your own players and go over the cap in the nba

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 03:49 PM
sure.but i think they'd be better served spreading that money around on center,bench,ect.

thats what draft picks are for

Raph12
03-08-2011, 03:52 PM
Any team getting Paul would benefit, so I don't see the point of this thread...

abe_froman
03-08-2011, 03:56 PM
thats what draft picks are for

didnt you guys trade most picks away,besides they would be in late teens,could find gems...but shouldnt count on it

just my opinion and one that would be very unpopular(especially by knick fans)who want the excitement/flash that stars bring,solid role players help a great deal in winning but wont make any posters on the knick board cheer

bedford1829
03-08-2011, 04:02 PM
Fundamentally I think the Knick approach would be more sound than the Heat approach.

To me the heat ignored positional distribution and the challenges of floor spacing and ball distribution when assembling their core. Their big three all occupy similar roles and similar styles of play. The often find themselves occupying the same spots on the floor and as a result the flow and pace of their style suffers unless they are running the floor.

I don't like Paul and I'd rather explore other options but for the sake of the argument, the Knicks big 3 (with Paul) would be better suited for success.

Why?

1. Paul distributes, melo occupies the wing the high post and in some cases the low post, and amare is the pivot presence that can play high/low post positions. The three stars are filling different positions/roles.

2. I think the Knick big 3 would genuinely get along. I know I'm not the only one who sees the Chemistry issues that Miami has (two and a half men) and it's affecting their performance. Although it may not be best for winning, amare and melo both have loose and fun personalitites which immediately makes the chemistry a lot better than miami's.

3. The presence of a true suoerstar PG would be the most decided advantage for the Knicks group. With the big personalities and egos that come along with forming a super team, you need a big time PG with the respect and trust necessary to facilitate for such stars. Paul would give the Knicks that. The problem in Miami is the big three with their egos and track records have had trouble allowing guys named arroyo etc to handle and control the flow, tempo, and ball distribution of the game. There is no mutual respect or trust present between the PG and Miami's big three

Klivlend
03-08-2011, 04:11 PM
you do make a lot of threads ..

He has 89 posts and has started 65 threads. Ya, that is a lot.

White_Mike
03-08-2011, 04:20 PM
STFU that is why there are individual team forums so stop posting this what if ******** in the NBA forum and post it in there own cuz sorry to tell you unless your a fan of these teams we really could give a **** and i wouldnt even mind if they were well thought out topics but most of them are just plain stupid!
You're a ****ing idiot, what the hell are we supposed to post in the NBA forum then? Everything we talk about is usually related to a certain player or team that people wanna hear the opinions of other team's fans.

On topic, get CP3 if possible, worry about role players later.

Byronicle
03-08-2011, 04:22 PM
trade Chauncey Billups, some future 1st rounders if they have any or some expirings for Chris Paul and they will instantly be the best team in the East for sure, especially if they sign Marc Gasol this FA, **** be hittin the fan

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 04:23 PM
didnt you guys trade most picks away,besides they would be in late teens,could find gems...but shouldnt count on it

just my opinion and one that would be very unpopular(especially by knick fans)who want the excitement/flash that stars bring,solid role players help a great deal in winning but wont make any posters on the knick board cheer

we taded 2 second rounders that were extra from the david lee rtrade.. and a 1st rounder i belive in 2014

TheDiggler
03-08-2011, 05:27 PM
Hard to say.

They are set for the future with Stat and Melo. But they lack in D and in the paint. Plus Chauncey is getting old. I think I would more try to get someone like Joakim Noah long-term than Chris Paul. And inside threat and talented PG would be more improvement imo than a Star-PG and nothing seriou in the paint. Paul seems to get injury-prone too.

Bornknick73
03-08-2011, 05:37 PM
I dont think so. I think they should learn from the Miami mistake and use the Paul money and any future money on filling out a quality roster.

Judging by the Knicks last few games we arent that far from contention and a quality bench will put us into the top 3 teams in the NBA. I like Paul but Id rather have a complete roster.

Chicago is doing it right. They got Rose and Boozer and a complete team I think with a good SG they will overtake Boston and OKC as the most complete team in the NBA.

Thats the route we need to be going. Now if you said D12 all bets are off.

Gideon
03-08-2011, 05:38 PM
Yeah bro as a Knicks fan i have to ask you to stop making so many threads in the NBA forum about the Knicks. It is what annoys so many other NBA fans on here about Knicks fans and it's not all of us, just a certain few. To answer the question, CP3 would be great, but I would hope to go after Dwight Howard in 2012 and try and re-sign Billups cheaply if possible.

TheDiggler
03-08-2011, 05:48 PM
I dont think so. I think they should learn from the Miami mistake and use the Paul money and any future money on filling out a quality roster.

Judging by the Knicks last few games we arent that far from contention and a quality bench will put us into the top 3 teams in the NBA. I like Paul but Id rather have a complete roster.

Chicago is doing it right. They got Rose and Boozer and a complete team I think with a good SG they will overtake Boston and OKC as the most complete team in the NBA.

Thats the route we need to be going. Now if you said D12 all bets are off.

Agree. Though I would say Noah has his impact, too. Plus they have Deng. Chicago can be a good "blueprint" for the Knicks. But in comparison I think Chicago is better in the paint with Booz and Noah than the Knicks. Stoud is great. But they have a hole in the paint imo.

knickfan33
03-08-2011, 06:14 PM
noah is god, but now your just throwing names out of nowhre... who said we have a shot at noah?.....

and this miami comparison doesnt work, cuase miamis mistake was putting james and wade together.... two players,neither of which is good at catch and shoot, they both need the ball in there hands to make there own plays...thatdoesnt work....

melo and stat can play off of paul, they can both catch and shoot.... same goes for if stat gets doubled......

theres only one dominant center in this league... the knicks jsut need someone to play d and rebound, you dont pass up on ball to get an effort guy at center...that ridiculous

jsimms92
03-08-2011, 06:34 PM
how come every time someone makes a thread, you got 10 people *****ing and whining about the topic of the thread?

Some people don't want to discuss anything at all. We talk about the knicks, heat and bulls so much because there's a lot of fans from those teams on this forum and the teams are relevant and often controversial. You want to talk about the timberwolves, the wizards, the hornets? Start a thread about it then.

thank you kind sir

Ripper Gein
03-08-2011, 06:37 PM
You're a ****ing idiot, what the hell are we supposed to post in the NBA forum then? Everything we talk about is usually related to a certain player or team that people wanna hear the opinions of other team's fans.

On topic, get CP3 if possible, worry about role players later.

****ing stupid posters! Have you seen all the idiotic threads started by knick/ heat fans and of course YOU would defend it since your a knicks fan and NO most of the posters here dont want to hear about what the knicks/heat will do in 2075 or whatever other stupid *** point you TRY to make....

Khalifa21
03-08-2011, 06:42 PM
Perhaps but less threads about the Knicks would certainly help out PSD.

I would much rather see a Knicks thread than another Heat vs. Bulls thread...

Kashmir13579
03-08-2011, 07:46 PM
Stop making threads.