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View Full Version : Can Steve Nash pass Jason Kidd on the all-time assist leaderboard?



mrblisterdundee
03-07-2011, 03:33 PM
Neither Nash or Kidd will ever pass John Stockton (15,806), although I think guys like Rajon Rondo, Chris Paul and Deron Williams have a shot at it. Kidd would have to keep his career average (9.2 apg) going for another 475 games; Nash would have to keep his average (8.4 apg) for another 802 games. I'm confident in Nash's ability to pass Mark Jackson's record (10,334) and move into third. Do you think that Nash, though, can pass Kidd, or will Kidd be playing too long at too high a level for Nash to ever catch up?

hyb152
03-07-2011, 09:04 PM
Naaah. Nash is amazing, no doubt. But Kidd blows me away. I heard Charles Barkley say a few years ago that Jason Kidd is the only player in NBA history that can take over a game without scoring a single point. I thought about it and was like, wow... Barkley's right. Kidd is amazing and I don't think Nash will catch him. He certainly won't catch Kidd in triple doubles :D

Public Enemy #1
03-07-2011, 09:12 PM
Nash is the type of player that can thrive for a long time because he doesn't depend on his athletic ability. Depends on his back though, how long does he have before it starts holding him out of games.... He won't pass Stockton though

LA_Raiders
03-07-2011, 09:32 PM
no, both have about 2yrs to go...

pastrecedes
03-07-2011, 09:34 PM
i don't think he can. don't get me wrong, i love the nashmaster, but kidd is kiddtastic too! kidd still plays at a high level and will keep his assists comfortably far ahead enough than nash's assist total.

Mane
03-07-2011, 09:41 PM
If he records a ridiculous number of assists, maybe.

But no, he won't.

Swashcuff
03-07-2011, 09:53 PM
I don't think so. J. Kidd is less than a year older than Nash and he's still going strong. His contract isn't expiring till the end of next season and it may not be far fetched to see him play until he's 40. So I'd say no to Nash passing him.

HallofFameKidd
03-07-2011, 09:56 PM
No. Kidd will be playing too much longer.

Swashcuff
03-07-2011, 10:06 PM
Neither Nash or Kidd will ever pass John Stockton (15,806), although I think guys like Rajon Rondo, Chris Paul and Deron Williams have a shot at it. Kidd would have to keep his career average (9.2 apg) going for another 475 games; Nash would have to keep his average (8.4 apg) for another 802 games. I'm confident in Nash's ability to pass Mark Jackson's record (10,334) and move into third. Do you think that Nash, though, can pass Kidd, or will Kidd be playing too long at too high a level for Nash to ever catch up?

You really think they'll be able to do that?

John Stockton is one of 3 players in NBA history to record 1000+ assists in a season. It has been done a total of 9 times. 7 times by Stockton and once each by Isiah Thomas and Kevin Porter.

Stockton's assist record may indeed be one of the hardest to ever be broken. It speaks of longevity, consistent, high peaks and most important of them all IMO an effective system to which his style of play was ideally suited.

Rondo won't have the big 3 forever and though he may very well average over 10 without them it he may not be able to consistently get to around 11-13 apg seasons that he'd need to be able to catch a player like Stockton.

Stockton has also played more games than any other PG (or guard for that matter) in league history. He has played over 160 more games than the next closest PG in Gary Payton.

It's really unlikely to see someone, especially anyone in the league right now come along and break John Stockton's mark.

More-Than-Most
03-07-2011, 10:14 PM
No... Nash took to long to bloom. Its amazing what he is doing at the age he currently is and to me I still have him as a top 5 point guard easily but his back will give out sooner than later thus preventing him from passing kid.

Superheroreject
03-07-2011, 10:41 PM
As soon as Rondo loses the big 3 his assists will drop off drastically. Derons assist will drop drastically until he either leaves the Nets or they build a team around him. The only one I see passing Stockton is Paul. He has been putting up great assist totals with almost nobody in New Orleans.

JJ_JKidd
03-07-2011, 11:16 PM
Ugh,, NO.

Kidd has 11,438 total, average of 9.2

Nash has 9,069 total, average of 8.4

If Kidd retires now, and Nash has 9.0 average for the next 3 season that he is still playing, he would have a total of 11,283 compared to Kidd's 11,438.

And that's assuming Kidd retires NEXT SEASON. Which I don't see happening.

More-Than-Most
03-07-2011, 11:21 PM
As soon as Rondo loses the big 3 his assists will drop off drastically. Derons assist will drop drastically until he either leaves the Nets or they build a team around him. The only one I see passing Stockton is Paul. He has been putting up great assist totals with almost nobody in New Orleans.

Williams seems to be doing pretty good with his assists so far. Didn't he just break a record for most assists with a new team after the first 5 games? I do agree with Rondo losing his assists but guys like Paul/Williams and Nash will have high assists with anyone and have proven so... Nash has little to no weapons with the suns this year and he is having a great year... Paul has done so for the last few years.

DJakk
03-07-2011, 11:23 PM
Will Rondo pass both of them? Yes.

JLynn943
03-07-2011, 11:41 PM
Will Rondo pass both of them? Yes.

He won't have Boston's big three to pass to forever. I'm curious to see what happens with Rondo when they're out of the picture.

Anyway, on topic: The only way Nash will pass Kidd imo is if he plays for 3 or 4 years after Kidd retires.

Gibby
03-07-2011, 11:56 PM
no. i cant see nash playing much longer after Kidd retires.

tredigs
03-08-2011, 12:12 AM
As soon as Rondo loses the big 3 his assists will drop off drastically. Derons assist will drop drastically until he either leaves the Nets or they build a team around him. The only one I see passing Stockton is Paul. He has been putting up great assist totals with almost nobody in New Orleans.

Eh, I think that to a large extent, that's a myth. Elite PG's find a way to distribute, there's not that large of a correlation between their casts and their assist numbers. Small sample size, but D. Will is averaging 15 assists a game on the Nets - in an offense he's never played in with players he's never played with.

Can Nash pass Kidd? Doubtful. But if Kidd retires after this next season while Nash signs another three-year contract (tho' I think he'd be in a more limited role minute wise the final year or two), then he'd have a chance. Very slight though. If that retire for Kidd / contract-extension for Nash scenario doesn't happen, then no, no chance. Nash is down about 2500 assists right now, and gets about 800-900 a year at this point.

mrblisterdundee
03-08-2011, 01:15 AM
You really think they'll be able to do that?

John Stockton is one of 3 players in NBA history to record 1000+ assists in a season. It has been done a total of 9 times. 7 times by Stockton and once each by Isiah Thomas and Kevin Porter.

Stockton's assist record may indeed be one of the hardest to ever be broken. It speaks of longevity, consistent, high peaks and most important of them all IMO an effective system to which his style of play was ideally suited.

Rondo won't have the big 3 forever and though he may very well average over 10 without them it he may not be able to consistently get to around 11-13 apg seasons that he'd need to be able to catch a player like Stockton.

Stockton has also played more games than any other PG (or guard for that matter) in league history. He has player over 1600 more games than the next closest PG in Gary Payton.

It's really unlikely to see someone, especially anyone in the league right now come along and break John Stockton's mark.

Rondo would have to keep his pace from the last two years up for the next 14 and a half seasons. It's unlikely, but possible. I think Deron has as good a chance as Rondo, too. He will have to keep his pace up for another 1,057 games. If they stay healthy, they'd both be under 40 by the time they did that. Let's not forget that all factors are pointing to longer NBA careers.

Lim
03-08-2011, 09:22 AM
andre miller is 15 on that list? guy is seriously underrated.

Swashcuff
03-08-2011, 10:07 AM
Rondo would have to keep his pace from the last two years up for the next 14 and a half seasons. It's unlikely, but possible. I think Deron has as good a chance as Rondo, too. He will have to keep his pace up for another 1,057 games. If they stay healthy, they'd both be under 40 by the time they did that. Let's not forget that all factors are pointing to longer NBA careers.

Dude no PG in NBA history has been able to keep up such a pace for such a long period of time. Rondo is NOT going to pass John Stockton. This is Rondo's first season of averaging of 10 apg. Who says that there won't be seasons in the not too distant future where that number could drastically fall?

Even IF Rondo was to play every single game of the next 14 and a half season's at his pace of his last two season combined (10.7 apg) he will fall short of Stockton's mark. By close to 400 assists. Do you really think Rondo is solely based on Rondo's output this season and last that you could accurately predict that he's going to have over average over 10 assists for 14 straight seasons?

Look at Isiah Thomas who Steve Nash just recently passed on the all time list. He had 4 season's of 10 or more at all before he turned 27, all these seasons occurred in his scoring prime as well, but after that his numbers dived.

I am going to say that it is impossible to have a grid of a player's career time-line in any category based on just one or two season's.

It is extremely unlikely that Deron Williams is going to play 1,057 more games in the NBA. Because of his style of play coupled with the fact that he has already had an his of injuries in the prime of his youth there are no factors that could conclusively say that he'll be able to play that much longer.

Even at that rate Deron would almost 1000 assists short of Stockton's mark. You are asking for too much. History tells us no one is ever going to be able to sustain such good play for such an extended period of time.

Dude your arguments are borderline impossible. To your point about evidence pointing to longer careers I would love for you to show me some facts on that. What is evident is that players who work hard to take care of their body's and preserve health will have prolonged careers and that is nothing new in any sport. I don't know much about players having longer careers. All the medical advances and yet still players careers aren't following the time-line of some of the best iron men of the past.