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View Full Version : Are the Thunder Legit Championship Contenders now?



Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 06:08 PM
They got exactly what they needed so badly in Kendrick Perkins. With Green gone it opens a starting slot at PF for Serge Ibaka. Is the additions of Kendrick Perkins, Nate Robinson and Nazr Mohammed enough to turn them into legit championship contenders.

SteBO
02-24-2011, 06:20 PM
Yes. They have a big frontcourt of Durant, Ibaka, and Perkins, along with Nick Collison coming off the bench. They also have a pretty good PG named Russel Westbrook and Thabo Sefolosha is a nice defensive player in their back court. They're definitely legit contenders with this trade.

Brooklyn Mets
02-24-2011, 06:28 PM
Perkins
Ibaka
Durant
Sefolosha
Westbrook

with Nate, Collison, Harden, and Nazr off the bench

thats pretty dope team right there

John Walls Era
02-24-2011, 06:30 PM
Still need a post scorer, but this trade made them better.

tangent12
02-24-2011, 06:31 PM
They are definitely a threat, not sure YET about contenders. They still have to prove themselves in playoff scenarios, so I'll wait and see if they are truly contenders.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 06:31 PM
Yesssss sir!

Even if Green were to just disappear, the Thunder would've been a better team due to the increased minutes given to Ibaka. But now we get to slide him over to be our full time PF next to another defensive minded big man. It's everything I (and the entire organization) could've wanted. Not to mention Nazr adds some great depth alongside Collison to back up the bigs.

Oh, and Nate Robinson is kinda good.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 06:34 PM
They are damn good. They still can't get any offense out of the post though. Perkins and Nazr definitely help their defense, but neither are post scorers.

They will be trouble come playoff time, it's as simple as that.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 06:35 PM
edit: double post

JordansBulls
02-24-2011, 06:36 PM
Perkins
Ibaka
Durant
Sefolosha
Westbrook

with Nate, Collison, Harden, and Nazr off the bench

thats pretty dope team right there

Durant has to play well in the playoffs this year unlike last year. If he and Westbrook play well they are legit contenders.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 06:36 PM
Still need a post scorer, but this trade made them better.

No they don't.

The Heat don't have a post scorer, The Cavs didn't have one, The Mavs didn't have one, the Pistons, The Sixers etc etc etc. They were/ all contenders.

HakeemTheDream
02-24-2011, 06:37 PM
It's true that they have the right players they need to be contenders, but their biggest criticism from what I've seen has always been their ball movement. 80% of the time Westbrook passes is to Durant, and then Durant just shoots. Look at teams like the Celtics, Spurs and the Lakers(when Kobe isn't in ball hog mode), they have great team passing and that's what helps them get so many easy baskets. Without ball movement, it's too easy for elite defenses to shut you down.

Jonathan2323
02-24-2011, 06:37 PM
Lakers should be scared.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 06:39 PM
No. THey will make noise but they still won't be able to contend with the Spurs/Lakers.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 06:40 PM
Also keep in mind that Artest LOCKSSSSS DOWNNNN!!! Durant when they play. He held him to something like 35% or lower in the playoffs last year... And had a few 25% games...

LTBaByyy
02-24-2011, 06:42 PM
Lakers should be scared!!!!! They shouldnt get comfortable in that 3rd seed

Blazers got Wallace for chump change

and

OKC got Perkins and Nate

:)

Spurs
Mavs
OKC
Blazers
Lakers
Hornets
Grizzlies
Nuggets

Will be the playoffs seeds in the west

CBCable
02-24-2011, 06:42 PM
While this makes them more dangerous, really don't think it catapults them into contention.

26 games left to integrate these new pieces, even less since Perkins is unable to play.

If he resigns and stays healthy it's a huge boon for OKC, but I think most people are putting the cart before the horse here.

This trade hurts Boston more than it helps OKC in the short term.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 06:42 PM
I honestly can't understand why people are saying the NEED a post scorer to contend. At least 4-6 teams every year are viewed as legit title contenders and at least 2 of those teams don't have legit post scorers. I mean look at NBA history. There have been tonnes of contenders who did not have a scoring big down low.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 06:46 PM
No. THey will make noise but they still won't be able to contend with the Spurs/Lakers.

It's so obvious you're nervous.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 06:47 PM
It's so obvious you're nervous.

The same Lakers that they came very close to upsetting last season with a less complete team. I think he's getting nervous.

LakeShowRaider
02-24-2011, 06:47 PM
Lakers should be scared!!!!! They shouldnt get comfortable in that 3rd seed

Blazers got Wallace for chump change

and

OKC got Perkins and Nate

:)

Spurs
Mavs
OKC
Blazers
Lakers
Hornets
Grizzlies
Nuggets

Will be the playoffs seeds in the west

I hope that's in no particular order...

The Final Boss
02-24-2011, 06:52 PM
Los Angeles only has to beat one of Spurs/Thunder. One of those teams will take eachother out.

Crackadalic
02-24-2011, 06:53 PM
They should write a book on how to build a lottery team into championship contenders. In a 4 year span their were able to make moves that just seem to make so much sense every season. If not this year most definitely next year

Baller1
02-24-2011, 06:53 PM
Los Angeles only has to beat one of Spurs/Thunder. One of those teams will take eachother out.

That's if they can get past Portland.

LongWayFromHome
02-24-2011, 06:55 PM
They are OUTSIDE CHANCE contenders now. They CAN win a championship this season, however its unlikely.

LTBaByyy
02-24-2011, 06:55 PM
After the trades (Wallace to Blazers, Perkins to OKC) this will be the West seeds:

1 Spurs
2 Mavs
3 OKC
4 Blazers
5 Lakers
6 Hornets
7 Grizzlies
8 Nuggets


Quote me!

The Jokemaker
02-24-2011, 06:58 PM
Yeah I'd have to say so. They have the key ingredients necessary to be a team that wins the championship. Only question is can they do it in the playoffs when it's a 7 game series against the experienced Lakers, Spurs.

Legitimate
02-24-2011, 06:59 PM
Didn't OKC already take the Lakers to a 7 game series? well their much improved now, westbrook is playing like a superstar, imo they were already contenders without perk. With Perk they are obviously a contender.

Punk
02-24-2011, 06:59 PM
No question about it.

PG: Westbrook. Maynor, Robinson, Ivey

SG: Sefolosha, Harden, Cook

SF: Durant, Sefolosha

PF: Ibaka, Collison

C: Perkins, Mohammad, Aldrich, Mullins.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 07:00 PM
LOL! I'm not nervous. Obviously they're better but last years series means ZILCH. Last year Kobe's knee was messed up during the playoffs and it wasn't until he got it drained that he played well..


Still can't compete with our size...

Bullsfan22
02-24-2011, 07:00 PM
OKC is championship contenders.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 07:04 PM
People get so excited when a team comes around that MAY have a chance to beat the Lakers...


good luck.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 07:04 PM
LOL! I'm not nervous. Obviously they're better but last years series means ZILCH. Last year Kobe's knee was messed up during the playoffs and it wasn't until he got it drained that he played well..


Still can't compete with our size...

Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom

Problemchild
02-24-2011, 07:04 PM
They are damn good. They still can't get any offense out of the post though. Perkins and Nazr definitely help their defense, but neither are post scorers.

They will be trouble come playoff time, it's as simple as that.

They never needed scoring, they needed someone to hit the boards & bang people around. Serge couldn't do this at the 5 but he will definatly do it at the 4 & perkins if he's heatly will bang with anyone. Between those two that will be a minimum of 20 points & 20 rebounds a night automatically. Then throw in the defense & the bench players...... wow! THIS IS A SCARY TEAM !

Baller1
02-24-2011, 07:04 PM
LOL! I'm not nervous. Obviously they're better but last years series means ZILCH. Last year Kobe's knee was messed up during the playoffs and it wasn't until he got it drained that he played well..


Still can't compete with our size...

Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom

And if not equal, very minimally in LA's favor.

Carey
02-24-2011, 07:09 PM
We shall see, we still have to improve our half court scoring but our defense was starting to improve before the trade and it will be light years better with Perk and Mohammed as well as Ibaka being able to play strictly the 4. Neither Perk or Mohammed are legit back to the basket threats but they can score around the basket a bit, you can dump it down here and there when previously we had nobody that could offer that. I'm gonna say us a contenders is still yet to be decided but we did go from a team i think could possibly win a series at the most to a team that could make some legit noise.

The BodyGuard
02-24-2011, 07:12 PM
West

1 Spurs
2 OKC
3 Lakers
4 Mavs
5 Blazers
6 Hornets
7 Grizzlies
8 Nuggets


^ Much better

Bravo95
02-24-2011, 07:20 PM
Still need a post scorer, but this trade made them better.
Yep.

Chacarron
02-24-2011, 07:24 PM
Why is that the Lakers have to be scared? If that's the case Mavs and Spurs should be scared as well. I think this is a great trade for the Thunder. Perkins is definitely better than Kristic and Green hasn't panned out to be a great player like Westy or Durant. One thing is for sure: this year's playoffs are going to be hella good.

D Roses Bulls
02-24-2011, 07:25 PM
they haven't proven **** yet. they were suppose to be SOO good this year and have been good, but not as good as people expected. perkins is injury prone and I don't see OKC spending big money this off season to keep him and if they do, i'll be shocked. this probably improves them, but they are still behind lakers, spurs, and probably dallas in the west when it's all said and done after the playoffs.

IBleedPurple
02-24-2011, 07:26 PM
On the fence, but I still think they're one guy short of being contenders. They are definitely the team that can make noise and win a series or two though.

bomber0104
02-24-2011, 07:26 PM
hahah .. nooo

Baller1
02-24-2011, 07:30 PM
they haven't proven **** yet. they were suppose to be SOO good this year and have been good, but not as good as people expected. perkins is injury prone and I don't see OKC spending big money this off season to keep him and if they do, i'll be shocked. this probably improves them, but they are still behind lakers, spurs, and probably dallas in the west when it's all said and done after the playoffs.

:laugh2:

But Chicago has proven sooo much, right?

ghettosean
02-24-2011, 07:33 PM
Wow there are some cocky lakers fans in here... No offense Laker fans but Durant is the top scorer in the league and Westbrook is one of the best point gaurds and now they got Perkins to start at centre and Nazr as a backup centre. If the lakers aren't scared they should be. Kobe is great no question but wow if OKC gave them a run for there money last year who knows whats going down this year.

If OKC vs Lakers in the playoffs I say OKC in 6 games maybe 7!

The young vs the old! I can't wait!!!

lakers4sho
02-24-2011, 07:33 PM
If Perk's knee(s) hold(s) up then yes they're are a scary team to watch out for. That's the caveat.

Bullsfan22
02-24-2011, 07:33 PM
Post scorers isn't needed when you have two players that can get to the free throw line as good as Westbrook and Durant can. They'll get there share of offensive rebounds with ibaka and big perk hanging around the glass.

My only question how good is Ibaka's post defense? Will he be able to guard pau? If perk is matched up against Bynum.

Can he play smart defense on Dirk when perk is trying to canceling out Tyson on the glass.

It all comes down to Ibaka, Nazr and collison.

flclfanman
02-24-2011, 07:34 PM
I think so. Perkins will give them the rebounds and size OKC desperately needed. My only concern is Perkin's health. He's had injury problems in the past and he's playing with a young team that likes the run ALOT.

If Perk stays Healthy, Look out LA and Dallas! :nod:

D Roses Bulls
02-24-2011, 07:35 PM
:laugh2:

But Chicago has proven sooo much, right?

chicago has dominated the west this year and have a 500. record vs the top 4 teams in the NBA and have the best defensive team in the NBA. defense wins championships. not saying the bulls will, but they have a better shot right now then OKC. OKC has no shot at coming out of the west or even making it to the western conference finals and you just love to bring up chicago, dont you? :rolleyes:

Bullsfan22
02-24-2011, 07:35 PM
:laugh2:

But Chicago has proven sooo much, right?

I don't think we're talking about chicago according to the name of the thread.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 07:37 PM
chicago has dominated the west this year and have a 500. record vs the top 4 teams in the NBA and have the best defensive team in the NBA. defense wins championships.

If only they traded for a legit SG. You guys still have some problems but that's not to say the Bulls aren't damn good. Top 3 in the east.

believeinNYK
02-24-2011, 07:37 PM
I think it does, I mean the Spurs, Lakers, and Mavs are all getting older while this young very talented Okc team is rising up

tangent12
02-24-2011, 07:38 PM
:laugh2:

But Chicago has proven sooo much, right?

Your mother has proven a lot to me though.

D Roses Bulls
02-24-2011, 07:40 PM
If only they traded for a legit SG. You guys still have some problems but that's not to say the Bulls aren't damn good. Top 3 in the east.

I know, trust me, im pretty mad about it. I think they should of gave up asik. yes, asik has the potential to be a pretty good big man, but that's whats wrong with teams, they are too damn high on potential and dont always go for the sure things, but they can still sign someone who is maybe bought out by march 1st.

AlexTmz2
02-24-2011, 07:41 PM
If Perkins stays healthy yes!!!

NYKalltheway
02-24-2011, 07:46 PM
Very solid roster there!

Lakerhead4ever
02-24-2011, 07:48 PM
Lakers should be scared!!!!! They shouldnt get comfortable in that 3rd seed

Blazers got Wallace for chump change

and

OKC got Perkins and Nate

:)

Spurs
Mavs
OKC
Blazers
Lakers
Hornets
Grizzlies
Nuggets

Will be the playoffs seeds in the west

dude are you crazy? la 5th seed? you obviously dont know basketball. blazers ahead of us? with B roy? you sound so foolish. and since when is dallas high and mighty? if anything you guys are playing your usual roll as a "great season team" u guys choke every playoff season. lol somebody come get this guy

ghettosean
02-24-2011, 07:51 PM
Your mother has proven a lot to me though.

:laugh:
I'm not even a Chicago fan but still... LOL
:laugh:

DoJoTheSlasher
02-24-2011, 07:54 PM
Puts them on the brink but they can't beat SA, DAL, LAL.

KmB728
02-24-2011, 08:00 PM
I wish them the best! Would love to see Perk and Nate get revenge on the Lakers

LJEATON26
02-24-2011, 08:02 PM
Puts them on the brink but they can't beat SA, DAL, LAL.

All I have to say is bring on SA, DAL, and LAL. The best thing is we only have to go through two of them come playoff time.

blahblahyoutoo
02-24-2011, 08:04 PM
we're gonna see exactly how overrated perkins is.

Chitownhero14
02-24-2011, 08:05 PM
If the Spurs or Bulls dont win it, OKC is my pick!

Sadds The Gr8
02-24-2011, 08:08 PM
nope...no inside scoring.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 08:08 PM
chicago has dominated the west this year and have a 500. record vs the top 4 teams in the NBA and have the best defensive team in the NBA. defense wins championships. not saying the bulls will, but they have a better shot right now then OKC. OKC has no shot at coming out of the west or even making it to the western conference finals and you just love to bring up chicago, dont you? :rolleyes:

I thought we were talking about the playoffs? Because in that case, Chicago is no further along then OKC. I mean, unless "Mr. I Like to Disappear in the Playoffs" (Boozer) is supposed to put you over the top.

Chicago is so overrated on this site. If OKC is a pretender, then so is Chicago. Stop being hypocritical. At least we're dealing with the weaknesses, and now it's paying off.

RaiderLakersA's
02-24-2011, 08:10 PM
Lakers should be scared.

Don't tug on Godzilla's tail.

The Spurs and Mavs should be scared. The Lakers will still win a 7 game series, no matter who the opponent is.

FakeBlackMamba
02-24-2011, 08:17 PM
Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom

And if not equal, very minimally in LA's favor.

Thats just comical.

I think OKC just got a whole lot better. Good enough to compete for a ring for as long as Durant and Westbrook are on the team. However, in my opinion as a lakers fan, i dont think they are good enough this year to beat LA or Spurs in a 7 game series. They might be one more good player away though from seriously taking over the West. Its going to be great basketball to watch this year either way.

SteveNash
02-24-2011, 08:17 PM
Nope, too easy to shut Durant down.

icej
02-24-2011, 08:18 PM
Sure did, quite a surprise but a good one for the OKC fans, If they get another crack at Lakers I wouldn't be surprised if they beat them in 7 games now, considering they made just barely got pass this OKC last time and without a very good post defender.

Yes I think they could now contend.

Atticus Finch
02-24-2011, 08:19 PM
The Perkins hype around here is getting out of control.

finalverse
02-24-2011, 08:19 PM
I actually think it was an even move. I'm just not a fan of Perkins, sure others think he's good but I don't think he puts anyone over the top.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 08:25 PM
I thought we were talking about the playoffs? Because in that case, Chicago is no further along then OKC. I mean, unless "Mr. I Like to Disappear in the Playoffs" (Boozer) is supposed to put you over the top.

Chicago is so overrated on this site. If OKC is a pretender, then so is Chicago. Stop being hypocritical. At least we're dealing with the weaknesses, and now it's paying off.

How about this? Both of our teams are very ****ing good. Both are young and loaded with talent.


OKC has the better scorers, the Bulls play better D. Now, with this recent Perkins trade, both teams have good size. Boozer is a threat on the post, something that OKC doesn't have. However, Durant is a threat on the wing, something Chi-town doesn't really have. You both have 2 of the best pg's in the game.


Because there are more Bulls fans on this site, we all hear about them more often... that doesn't necessarily make them overrated though. They are the 3rd best team in the east IMO...

OKC is the 4th best team in the West IMO... both fan bases should be very excited for what is to come down the road.

icej
02-24-2011, 08:27 PM
Don't Underrate OKC, the only thing between them and beating LAL last year was a Gasol Stopper.

Perkins is not an NBA superstar in any sense, but ANY team (specially contenders) would love to have him as Center over 90% of the leagues current Center options.

1. Howard
2. Bogut

Maybe the only better Defensive C than him out there.

Atticus Finch
02-24-2011, 08:29 PM
Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom


This is really is comical. Pau averaged 18.6 points, 11.6 rebounds, and 2.6 blocks last year in the finals against Kendrick Perkins and Kevin Garnett, and nobody plays pau better than Garnett. Don't get me wrong, Perkins is a great one on one defensive center, but rebounding, scoring, and help defense are not his strong suits (0 blocks in the finals last year).

97NYer
02-24-2011, 08:30 PM
Absolutely

Westbrook
Thabo/Harden
Durant
Ibaka/Collison
Perkins/Nazr

97NYer
02-24-2011, 08:30 PM
Absolutely

Westbrook/Nate
Thabo/Harden
Durant
Ibaka/Collison
Perkins/Nazr

_KB24_
02-24-2011, 08:32 PM
Yes, they are. These two trades they pulled off are ridiculously great. They gave away pebbles for Nazr Mohammed who is a very good backup center and did enough to start for Pop when he was in San Antonio. Perkins is the ideal center piece they need for the team. Brings toughness and experience to a young and "learning" team. And Robinson can be explosive coming off the bench. I think they were the winners from the tradeline out of the West. They along with the Spurs pose the biggest threat to LA in the playoffs.

Avenged
02-24-2011, 08:33 PM
Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom

:confused:

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 08:34 PM
:confused:

I hope he means on defense.

Sadds The Gr8
02-24-2011, 08:50 PM
Bynum is always hurt, Pau is a ***** when it comes to banging inside, and Lamar Odom is probably the best sixth man in the league.

Perkins, Ibaka, Collison, Nazr = Bynum, Pau, Odom

:cricket:

Atticus Finch
02-24-2011, 08:55 PM
:cricket:

That quote was such a head scratcher it took 2 pages for someone to reply to it. Its almost as if people were waiting for a big "just kidding!" to come after it

shizzle09
02-24-2011, 08:59 PM
Lakers should be scared!!!!! They shouldnt get comfortable in that 3rd seed

Blazers got Wallace for chump change

and

OKC got Perkins and Nate

:)

Spurs
Mavs
OKC
Blazers
LakersHornets
Grizzlies
Nuggets

Will be the playoffs seeds in the west

that would be jacked to get the #4 seed in the west and have to play the lakers.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:12 PM
Baller has to be one of the most biased posters on here. Seriously OKC is one of the most overrated teams in the NBA. They won't make it past the 1st round of the playoffs even with Perkins.

If you seriously think Perkins, COllison, Ibaka and whoever the other guy is = Bynum, Pau and Gasol you are out of your mind..

Pau is on another level compared to all 4 of those guys. Bynum made Perk his ***** last and this year. Ibaka is no where near Odom who should have been an all star this year..


You're going to have to ride Westbrook who is the only advantage you have over us but if you don't remember Kobe Bryant locked him up in last years playoffs just like Artest did Durant.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 09:15 PM
I voted no, but I had a hard time doing so. They need another year of playoff experience out of Durant and Westbrook, their stars. You don't just go from being beat up in the first round to winning the next season with a singe addition down low, defensively. I would like to see them get to the 2nd round with dominant performances from Durant and Westbrook, and watch them grow.

Too early to say they can win it this season.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 09:15 PM
This is really is comical. Pau averaged 18.6 points, 11.6 rebounds, and 2.6 blocks last year in the finals against Kendrick Perkins and Kevin Garnett, and nobody plays pau better than Garnett. Don't get me wrong, Perkins is a great one on one defensive center, but rebounding, scoring, and help defense are not his strong suits (0 blocks in the finals last year).

Perkins didn't play in the Finals last year. Nice try though.

D Roses Bulls
02-24-2011, 09:16 PM
I thought we were talking about the playoffs? Because in that case, Chicago is no further along then OKC. I mean, unless "Mr. I Like to Disappear in the Playoffs" (Boozer) is supposed to put you over the top.

Chicago is so overrated on this site. If OKC is a pretender, then so is Chicago. Stop being hypocritical. At least we're dealing with the weaknesses, and now it's paying off.

hypocritical? chicago can make it to the east finals. OKC and I'll bet you will not make the west finals.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 09:16 PM
baller, chill bro. You are a year or two off, but the contention is coming. The Thunder first have to figure out how to win playoff games, and series. One acquisition isn't the answer. Maturity. Patience. It will come

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:17 PM
Perkins didn't play in the Finals last year. Nice try though.

Perkins played the entire finals what are you talking about?


He just missed game 7...

Baller1
02-24-2011, 09:17 PM
Baller has to be one of the most biased posters on here. Seriously OKC is one of the most overrated teams in the NBA. They won't make it past the 1st round of the playoffs even with Perkins.

If you seriously think Perkins, COllison, Ibaka and whoever the other guy is = Bynum, Pau and Gasol you are out of your mind..

Pau is on another level compared to all 4 of those guys. Bynum made Perk his ***** last and this year. Ibaka is no where near Odom who should have been an all star this year..


You're going to have to ride Westbrook who is the only advantage you have over us but if you don't remember Kobe Bryant locked him up in last years playoffs just like Artest did Durant.

Sorry I don't have an army of fans on the site to back me up like LA, Chicago, Boston, Miami, and NY do.

Kobe locked up Westbrook last year? Am I missing something? Oh, and how did Kobe do on Westbrook when they played a few weeks ago?

Baller1
02-24-2011, 09:19 PM
Perkins played the entire finals what are you talking about?


He just missed game 7...

The one that LA barely squeaked out? Oh yeah... Perkins wouldn't have mattered.

Baller1
02-24-2011, 09:22 PM
baller, chill bro. You are a year or two off, but the contention is coming. The Thunder first have to figure out how to win playoff games, and series. One acquisition isn't the answer. Maturity. Patience. It will come

That's where I'm confused. All season it's been "they're one piece/big man away from contention".

We acquire that piece but it's still "they're one piece away".

Makes no sense.

drobe86
02-24-2011, 09:23 PM
No doesn't make them a contender this season. I think it's a decent trade don't get me wrong, but you gotta wonder where the rest of there scoring will come from. Durant and Westbrook will give you 50-60 ppg. Where's the rest coming from? I think people will realize that Jeff Green was a lot better than people gave him credit for.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:24 PM
Sorry I don't have an army of fans on the site to back me up like LA, Chicago, Boston, Miami, and NY do.

Kobe locked up Westbrook last year? Am I missing something? Oh, and how did Kobe do on Westbrook when they played a few weeks ago?

Kobe locked him up when Fish kept getting dominated. If KObe didn't defend him we would have ended up going to a game 7 or ended up losing.


Yeah go rewatch the series. Kobe shut Westbrook down. In games 3 and 4 Fish got owned so in games 5 and 6 Kobe told Phil he wanted to guard Westbrook


Game 3 and 4 numbers for westbrook

27/8/4 11 for 21
18/6/8 6 for 11

Games 5 and 6 numbers for westbrook

5- 15 points 8 turnovers 4 for 13 shooting
6- 21 points 7 for 20 shooting

both games he had a TS% of .45


SO you tell me if Kobe didn't lock him up...

Don't even get me started on Durant...

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 09:24 PM
That's where I'm confused. All season it's been "they're one piece/big man away from contention".

We acquire that piece but it's still "they're one piece away".

Makes no sense.

that theory didn't come from me. Your two superstars need more playoff experience, period. Hopefully this is the year they bust through to the second round, maybe even the WCF, but your young guys don't have the experience to break through and win a ring at the moment.

You are not a piece away. You are in need of your stars getting past the 1st round and beyond. This is very hard to do.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:25 PM
The one that LA barely squeaked out? Oh yeah... Perkins wouldn't have mattered.

Barely squeaked out? LMAO!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:


We won the championship. You don't barely squeak out championships.


We won. End of story. Get over it.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:26 PM
No doesn't make them a contender this season. I think it's a decent trade don't get me wrong, but you gotta wonder where the rest of there scoring will come from. Durant and Westbrook will give you 50-60 ppg. Where's the rest coming from? I think people will realize that Jeff Green was a lot better than people gave him credit for.

:confused:

Where the did rest of the scoring come from with 00-01 76ers? Didn't they contend with just a single real option on offense? A guard too booth.

Serge Ibaka does have good upside on offense. The offense will come on shouldn't worry about it. It's how well will they mesh on defense and adapting a defensive philosophy is where the concern will lie.

tredigs
02-24-2011, 09:29 PM
PG: Westbrook
SG: Sefalosha (your defensive stopper) Harden (6th man + 3pt threat + offensive beast)
SF: KD (Top 3-5 player
PF: Ibaka (Absolute force defensively, and offensive game has come around hugely)
C: Kendrick Perkins (Defensive force as well - possibly best defender of elite bigs in the league)

Ibaka + Perkins are going to make them exponentially tougher from a defensive standpoint. That was their glaring hole, and now - so long as he's healthy - it's filled perfectly.

They didn't change up their lineup enough to make it so they have to make a huge continuity jump, either. This team can make SERIOUS noise from this point forward. They got their man, and if you don't think they can go toe to toe with the Lakers at this point, you are mistaken.

Last year versus the Lakers and - for KD+Westbrook, the World Championships this summer - earned them valuable playoff/championship exposure. I really think they're ready.

DwayneMVPwade
02-24-2011, 09:30 PM
Yup

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:31 PM
PG: Westbrook
SG: Sefalosha (your defensive stopper) Harden (6th man + 3pt threat + offensive beast)
SF: KD (Top 3-5 player
PF: Ibaka (Absolute force defensively, and offensive game has come around hugely)
C: Kendrick Perkins (Defensive force as well - possibly best defender of elite bigs in the league)

Ibaka + Perkins are going to make them exponentially tougher from a defensive standpoint. That was their glaring hole, and now - so long as he's healthy - it's filled perfectly.

They didn't change up their lineup enough to make it so they have to make a huge continuity jump, either. This team can make SERIOUS noise from this point forward. They got their man, and if you don't think they can go toe to toe with the Lakers at this point, you are mistaken.

Last year versus the Lakers and - for KD+Westbrook, the World Championships this summer - earned them valuable playoff/championship exposure. I really think they're ready.

They can go toe to toe with the Lakers but they'll still lose. They aren't an ELITE contender.

drobe86
02-24-2011, 09:32 PM
:confused:

Where the did rest of the scoring come from with 00-01 76ers? Didn't they contend with just a single real option on offense? A guard too booth.

Serge Ibaka does have good upside on offense. The offense will come on shouldn't worry about it. It's how well will they mesh on defense and adapting a defensive philosophy is where the concern will lie.

Problem is this ain't 2001 lol... in todays game you need at least 3 legit scorers. Or be able to go 9-10 deep in the rotation. So realistically you think the Thunder can win a title with 1 real center. And theres only 2 players on the okc that can give you more than 20. I think Durant and Westbrook are fantastic but they don't have the size or role players to beat any of the top tier teams. I think losing Jeff Green will hurt more than just adding Kendrick Perkins. Perk isn't even healthy and is a shell of himself. And it's not like he was some all star center to begin with....

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:32 PM
that theory didn't come from me. Your two superstars need more playoff experience, period. Hopefully this is the year they bust through to the second round, maybe even the WCF, but your young guys don't have the experience to break through and win a ring at the moment.

You are not a piece away. You are in need of your stars getting past the 1st round and beyond. This is very hard to do.

In your opinion Hawk are the Bulls legit contenders? I know they are a much better defensive team already but based on your logic they too should have a question mark over being considered legit contenders. While Boozer does indeed have the playoff experience that no one other than Perk on the Thunder has I don't think the same can be said for Deng, Joakim and D. Rose.

gotoHcarolina52
02-24-2011, 09:33 PM
Thunder are now the prohibitive favorites. If they don't win it all this year, they flat out choked and sucked. If Durant can't lead this team to a ring this year, he sucks buttocks. No excuses. This is the best team in the NBA bar none. No one is even close. Not Miami, not LA, not San Antonio, and definitely not Boston after those trades.

tredigs
02-24-2011, 09:34 PM
They can go toe to toe with the Lakers but they'll still lose. They aren't an ELITE contender.

I'm not so sure about that. In their FIRST playoff year - without HCA (which they may have on LA this year) and a significantly weaker defensive frontcourt, they were able to go toe to toe with LA and come up a last second tip in short of a game 7. They've gotten stronger; meanwhile the Lakers have stagnated AT BEST.

The Thunder can beat them.

@The post above me from "Carolina", absolutely not (not sure if you were being facetious or just a troll). This is the 2nd youngest team in the NBA, but they've joined that pack.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 09:35 PM
Can we wait to see how perkins does without Garnett and the rest of those guys. The Celtics had an incredible defensive SYSTEM... Perkins was a single part of that. Look at what happened when Ben Wallace went to Chicago.

Perkins knee's are already a problem... let's just see how he does first. Either way, the Thunder clearly improved at the deadline. Before we start saying that they will beat the Lakers let's just see how they play...

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 09:37 PM
In your opinion Hawk are the Bulls legit contenders? I know they are a much better defensive team already but based on your logic they too should have a question mark over being considered legit contenders. While Boozer does indeed have the playoff experience that no one other than Perk on the Thunder has I don't think the same can be said for Deng, Joakim and D. Rose.

I don't think they are capable of winning a championship this year. The Bulls need to get into the second round and ECF's as well. Experience is so important.

drobe86
02-24-2011, 09:38 PM
Can we wait to see how perkins does without Garnett and the rest of those guys. The Celtics had an incredible defensive SYSTEM... Perkins was a single part of that. Look at what happened when Ben Wallace went to Chicago.

Perkins knee's are already a problem... let's just see how he does first. Either way, the Thunder clearly improved at the deadline. Before we start saying that they will beat the Lakers let's just see how they play...

Great Post

smith&wesson
02-24-2011, 09:38 PM
Im gonna go ahead and say this.

okc needed a big man, but not at the price of theyre starting small fwd. yes perkins is a good big man, but he is extreamly injury prone and ibaka would have grew in to that big man role well for okc, they didnt need to give up green.

i think its a bad move for okc, perkins will be injured, or will have soo many techs that when you actually need him come play off time he will be suspended.

i woudld have held on to green and looked for a big man in free agency.

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 09:39 PM
I'm not so sure about that. In their FIRST playoff year - without HCA (which they may have on LA this year) and a significantly weaker defensive frontcourt, they were able to go toe to toe with LA and come up a last second tip in short of a game 7. They've gotten stronger; meanwhile the Lakers have stagnated AT BEST.

The Thunder can beat them.

@The post above me from "Carolina", absolutely not (not sure if you were being facetious or just a troll). This is the 2nd youngest team in the NBA, but they've joined that pack.

The only reason they even got BOTH of those games in OKC was because Fish was getting flat out dominated by Westbrook. We adjusted in Games 5 & 6 and came out on top both times by having Kobe guard him.

Artest shut Durant down making him a volume shooter.

And I doubt that we ever see a poor performance from Pau Gasol like we did in that ENTIRE series mainly game 6.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:40 PM
Problem is this ain't 2001 lol... in todays game you need at least 3 legit scorers. Or be able to go 9-10 deep in the rotation. So realistically you think the Thunder can win a title with 1 real center. And theres only 2 players on the okc that can give you more than 20. I think Durant and Westbrook are fantastic but they don't have the size or role players to beat any of the top tier teams. I think losing Jeff Green will hurt more than just adding Kendrick Perkins. Perk isn't even healthy and is a shell of himself. And it's not like he was some all star center to begin with....

What about 06-07 with the Cavs? Larry Hughes was their 2nd leading scorer with just 14 ppg. 3rd option was big Z with 12. What about the 05-06 Heat that beat your Mavs? As a third option Ibaka can certainly nab them 12-14 points a night with increased playing time.

With Nate and Harden coming off the bench that's quite possibly another 18-22 points per game right there. In all honesty I don't think that should be much of a concern for them. If I were the Thunder my concern would be that the defense gels and works really well together come playoff time.

HallofFameKidd
02-24-2011, 09:41 PM
No doesn't make them a contender this season. I think it's a decent trade don't get me wrong, but you gotta wonder where the rest of there scoring will come from. Durant and Westbrook will give you 50-60 ppg. Where's the rest coming from? I think people will realize that Jeff Green was a lot better than people gave him credit for.

Exactly. I was asking the same question in another OKC thread. I think they got better in rebounding, defense and size, however, they potentially lose some consistent scoring.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:42 PM
Great Post

How could you call that a great post? :confused: Ben Wallace was already a shell of his former self by the time he went to the Bulls. That post didn't make sense in relation to this discussion.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:44 PM
Im gonna go ahead and say this.

okc needed a big man, but not at the price of theyre starting small fwd. yes perkins is a good big man, but he is extreamly injury prone and ibaka would have grew in to that big man role well for okc, they didnt need to give up green.

i think its a bad move for okc, perkins will be injured, or will have soo many techs that when you actually need him come play off time he will be suspended.

i woudld have held on to green and looked for a big man in free agency.

:speechless: They traded Kevin Durant? OMFG

Jeff Green has been their starting PF who has been assaulted on the defensive end by opposing PFs all season long. They have a much better PF waiting on the wings. Serge Ibaka was an in house upgrade at PF for them.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:45 PM
I don't think they are capable of winning a championship this year. The Bulls need to get into the second round and ECF's as well. Experience is so important.

Ok can't fault you if you're being consistent.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 09:45 PM
What about 06-07 with the Cavs? Larry Hughes was their 2nd leading scorer with just 14 ppg. 3rd option was big Z with 12. What about the 05-06 Heat that beat your Mavs? As a third option Ibaka can certainly nab them 12-14 points a night with increased playing time.

With Nate and Harden coming off the bench that's quite possibly another 18-22 points per game right there. In all honesty I don't think that should be much of a concern for them. If I were the Thunder my concern would be that the defense gels and works really well together come playoff time.

If I'm not mistaken... this was about Allen iverson leading his team(of mostly role players) to the finals in 2001...


Think about the East back then, it was a joke. I'm not trying to diminish Iverson's accomplishments, but that kindof stuff will never work now. The top 3 in the East and the West are both equal IMO... back then it was the Lakers, Spurs, Kings and then everyone else... The East wasn't even close to being as good as the West was.


-You're example of the Cavs in 06-07... once again, watered down conference/competition. LeBron is just that damn good that he could carry that team.


Basically, my point is that the Western Conference is far from watered down. I still strongly believe that the Spurs, Lakers and Mavs are better than the Thunder. One of the main reason's is experience. The Thunder barely have any, while those other 3 have been playing together for years.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:48 PM
Can we wait to see how perkins does without Garnett and the rest of those guys. The Celtics had an incredible defensive SYSTEM... Perkins was a single part of that. Look at what happened when Ben Wallace went to Chicago.

Perkins knee's are already a problem... let's just see how he does first. Either way, the Thunder clearly improved at the deadline. Before we start saying that they will beat the Lakers let's just see how they play...

While I do agree has indeed benefited a great deal from the system it also worked both ways for them. Perkins is an excellent defensive player regardless. IMO he is not an anchor like a lot have been saying but he's certainly a top quality defensive C in today's NBA.

Ben Wallace relied a lot on strength, quickness and athleticism as he aged and lost some of those qualities it reflected in his production. I think we would have seen a decline in his play regardless of which system he played.

HallofFameKidd
02-24-2011, 09:49 PM
Thunder are now the prohibitive favorites. If they don't win it all this year, they flat out choked and sucked. If Durant can't lead this team to a ring this year, he sucks buttocks. No excuses. This is the best team in the NBA bar none. No one is even close. Not Miami, not LA, not San Antonio, and definitely not Boston after those trades.

:laugh2: You're funny.

JasonJohnHorn
02-24-2011, 09:50 PM
I think they are a good team that COULD contend, depending on injuries with other teams and their own squad being healthy. They have a legit chance, but if SA, Dallas and LA are all healthy, I cant see them getting through any of those teams.

Perkins a great defender, but lets face it, the Thunder NEEDED REBOUNDING as much as interior defence. Perkins has never been a double-digit rebounder. Ibak could be a double digit rebounder, as could Mullens (but lets face it, his FG% is an albatross right now), and if Cole Aldrich got the minutes, I think he could be a double digit rebounder as well, but I havent gotten to watch him play much, so I dont know what else he brings to the court.

Bottom line is, I have NEVER seen a team whose best rebounder is a SF who only gets 7 boards a game (which is GREAT for a SF) win a championship. Yeah, the Bulls had Pippen and Jordan who both usually grabbed about that much a game, but they had either Rodman or Grant grabbing 10+ a game too....

REBOUNDS!!! REBOUNDS!!!! REBOUNDS!!!!!

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 09:53 PM
How could you call that a great post? :confused: Ben Wallace was already a shell of his former self by the time he went to the Bulls. That post didn't make sense in relation to this discussion.

Wallace was a shell of his former self? The year prior to signing with the Bulls he averaged 7 pts and 11 rebounds in 82 games... Right near his normal numbers throughout that run with the Pistons... He was 31 years old... there are a lot of big men older than that right now who put up solid numbers.


How did that not have relevance? People are quickly jumping to say that Perkins is this and that, but isn't it a fair point to say that he has been playing alongside phenomenal defensive players in a great defensive system?

Ben Wallace played an almost identical role to perkins while on the Pistons. When he went to Chicago, he wasn't the same... Perkins is also suffering from knee injuries, who knows how he will hold up. As great at he could be for OKC, he could be equally as bad...

thekmp211
02-24-2011, 09:53 PM
i think they are contenders talent-wise. experience needed...but damn what a perfect pickup for them. also, FWIW, perkins can score a bit on the block. not that you want to lean on him, but he can be a 10-12 ppg scorer with the looks. decent back-to-basket game, he was just literally the last option on offense.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 09:56 PM
While I do agree has indeed benefited a great deal from the system it also worked both ways for them. Perkins is an excellent defensive player regardless. IMO he is not an anchor like a lot have been saying but he's certainly a top quality defensive C in today's NBA.

Ben Wallace relied a lot on strength, quickness and athleticism as he aged and lost some of those qualities it reflected in his production. I think we would have seen a decline in his play regardless of which system he played.

Fair enough, but at the same time, the players you play with, along with the system you are in, usually have a huge effect on how great a defensive player you are.

Put Bruce Bowen on the Suns and he wouldn't be talked about the way he is today. He would be a good defender, but not the defensive specialist we all considered him to be.

thekmp211
02-24-2011, 09:56 PM
Wallace was a shell of his former self? The year prior to signing with the Bulls he averaged 7 pts and 11 rebounds in 82 games... Right near his normal numbers throughout that run with the Pistons... He was 31 years old... there are a lot of big men older than that right now who put up solid numbers.


How did that not have relevance? People are quickly jumping to say that Perkins is this and that, but isn't it a fair point to say that he has been playing alongside phenomenal defensive players in a great defensive system?

Ben Wallace played an almost identical role to perkins while on the Pistons. When he went to Chicago, he wasn't the same... Perkins is also suffering from knee injuries, who knows how he will hold up. As great at he could be for OKC, he could be equally as bad...


no it's not, and no he didn't.

re: the first point, perkins was a huge part of why that team was so dominant defensively. he can handle any 5 on his own, allowing kg to be the DPOY-caliber quarterback on the defense. even if he gets scored on by guys like dwight, the mere fact that he can stand his ground opens up the defensive schemes everywhere.

secondly, ben wallace was a far more accomplished HELP defender than perkins. that was his main ability, he was more like a KG who played the five. perkins is a different player.

i think this puts them in the elite conversation. their roster is very well balanced. it all comes down to learning how to win playoff games.

da wood
02-24-2011, 09:56 PM
I honestly can't understand why people are saying the NEED a post scorer to contend. At least 4-6 teams every year are viewed as legit title contenders and at least 2 of those teams don't have legit post scorers. I mean look at NBA history. There have been tonnes of contenders who did not have a scoring big down low.

Name one please that actually won a championship

tredigs
02-24-2011, 09:56 PM
I think they are a good team that COULD contend, depending on injuries with other teams and their own squad being healthy. They have a legit chance, but if SA, Dallas and LA are all healthy, I cant see them getting through any of those teams.

Perkins a great defender, but lets face it, the Thunder NEEDED REBOUNDING as much as interior defence. Perkins has never been a double-digit rebounder. Ibak could be a double digit rebounder, as could Mullens (but lets face it, his FG% is an albatross right now), and if Cole Aldrich got the minutes, I think he could be a double digit rebounder as well, but I havent gotten to watch him play much, so I dont know what else he brings to the court.

Bottom line is, I have NEVER seen a team whose best rebounder is a SF who only gets 7 boards a game (which is GREAT for a SF) win a championship. Yeah, the Bulls had Pippen and Jordan who both usually grabbed about that much a game, but they had either Rodman or Grant grabbing 10+ a game too....

REBOUNDS!!! REBOUNDS!!!! REBOUNDS!!!!!

Perkins played alongside an elite rebounding team - and his per-36 minute numbers still put him as a double digit rebounder. Ibaka's per-36 have him as a double digit rebounder as well; Jeff Green was essentially Rashard Lewis in the interior, only he couldn't hit the side of a barn from three. Between Ibaka/Perkins/KD, along with Westbrook at point (an elite rebounder), that's now a solid rebounding team.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 09:58 PM
If I'm not mistaken... this was about Allen iverson leading his team(of mostly role players) to the finals in 2001...


Think about the East back then, it was a joke. I'm not trying to diminish Iverson's accomplishments, but that kindof stuff will never work now. The top 3 in the East and the West are both equal IMO... back then it was the Lakers, Spurs, Kings and then everyone else... The East wasn't even close to being as good as the West was.


-You're example of the Cavs in 06-07... once again, watered down conference/competition. LeBron is just that damn good that he could carry that team.


Basically, my point is that the Western Conference is far from watered down. I still strongly believe that the Spurs, Lakers and Mavs are better than the Thunder. One of the main reason's is experience. The Thunder barely have any, while those other 3 have been playing together for years.

Fact of the matter is that though the conference was weak their were still quality teams and performed well (not amazing but respectable) against the West.

I still have the Lakers and Spurs ahead of the Thunder but this move has them neck and neck with the Mavs IMO.

I mean with all the playoff experience they've had they are notorious (with the exclusion of Dirk who has always been fantastic) for being playoff bed wetters. As much as I value experience, experience doesn't always mean success. Dwayne Wade (though he already had 27 playoff games under his belt) in just his 3rd season put on one of the most amazing finals performances in the history of the game.

History have shown us that without experience you are not likely to be successful come post season but with the team the Thunder have assembled and with both the Lakers and Mavs having question marks going forward the Thunder could certainly take them the distance and cause an upset.

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 10:00 PM
no it's not, and no he didn't.

re: the first point, perkins was a huge part of why that team was so dominant defensively. he can handle any 5 on his own, allowing kg to be the DPOY-caliber quarterback on the defense. even if he gets scored on by guys like dwight, the mere fact that he can stand his ground opens up the defensive schemes everywhere.

secondly, ben wallace was a far more accomplished HELP defender than perkins. that was his main ability, he was more like a KG who played the five. perkins is a different player.

i think this puts them in the elite conversation. their roster is very well balanced. it all comes down to learning how to win playoff games.

How is that any different than Wallace? Go back and watch the 2004 finals. Wallace guarded Shaq straight up... and he dominated shaq. Guarding shaq then isn't even comparable to guarding Dwight these past few years. Not until this year has Dwight showed a solid offensive game.

There are a ton of similarities between those Pistons teams and the current Celtics. A solid defensive center is only one of them.

I'm not going to argue this any more though, I can care less haha.

Bausman
02-24-2011, 10:03 PM
I just realized... the Sonics (thunder) traded the 4th pick to Boston for Ray Allen. The sonics (thunder) used that pick on Jeff Green. Cant **** with fate.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 10:03 PM
Name one please that actually won a championship

Are you serious?

Please tell me you are not serious, because I refuse to believe that you are being serious right now.

Pistons of the early 90s and 00s and what about the Bulls of the 90s? Would you like me to name you some more?

J4KOP99
02-24-2011, 10:06 PM
Are you serious?

Please tell me you are not serious, because I refuse to believe that you are being serious right now.

Pistons of the early 90s and 00s and what about the Bulls of the 90s? Would you like me to name you some more?

C'mon man, the Bulls of the 90's. They had ****ing Michael Jordan. Few teams can win a title without a solid post scorer... The Bulls were one of the few. And they did have guys that could get in the post and score... but anyways.

The Pistons had Rasheed, who is a very good post scorer, when he is willing.

You can't possibly argue that there have been a lot of championship teams w/o a legitimate post scorer. I can't think of many.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 10:08 PM
Fair enough, but at the same time, the players you play with, along with the system you are in, usually have a huge effect on how great a defensive player you are.

Put Bruce Bowen on the Suns and he wouldn't be talked about the way he is today. He would be a good defender, but not the defensive specialist we all considered him to be.

Agreed. Fully agreed. I don't think Perkins is as good on D as a lot are making him out to be also. He did indeed benefit from the team and the system but he's still very solid defensively. Dwight's defense is game changing on its own. Perkin's is not. That's why I say the Thunders biggest concern should be on defense more so than on offense.

IF Serge, Collison, Nazr and Perk find an effective defensive Niche together with the perimeter defenders they already have they could be really really good.

thekmp211
02-24-2011, 10:14 PM
How is that any different than Wallace? Go back and watch the 2004 finals. Wallace guarded Shaq straight up... and he dominated shaq. Guarding shaq then isn't even comparable to guarding Dwight these past few years. Not until this year has Dwight showed a solid offensive game.

There are a ton of similarities between those Pistons teams and the current Celtics. A solid defensive center is only one of them.

I'm not going to argue this any more though, I can care less haha.

ehh they were swarming shaq with both wallaces, but i'm stretching the differences. both very good players. im just saying perks biggest value is as post defender. wallace was all over the place, much more overall impact as a defender.

da wood
02-24-2011, 10:15 PM
Yes, they are. These two trades they pulled off are ridiculously great. They gave away pebbles for Nazr Mohammed who is a very good backup center and did enough to start for Pop when he was in San Antonio. Perkins is the ideal center piece they need for the team. Brings toughness and experience to a young and "learning" team. And Robinson can be explosive coming off the bench. I think they were the winners from the tradeline out of the West. They along with the Spurs pose the biggest threat to LA in the playoffs.

Basketball is about match ups. You can't teach 7'2 and 7'1 and at the end of the day perk in 6'10 and ibaka is as well so you do the math also with trading green you gave away the only big you have that matches up with odom so hum

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 10:19 PM
C'mon man, the Bulls of the 90's. They had ****ing Michael Jordan. Few teams can win a title without a solid post scorer... The Bulls were one of the few. And they did have guys that could get in the post and score... but anyways.

The Pistons had Rasheed, who is a very good post scorer, when he is willing.

You can't possibly argue that there have been a lot of championship teams w/o a legitimate post scorer. I can't think of many.

I am in no way trying to argue that bro I am just stating that it is indeed possible and it has happened. It's not impossible.

72-73 New York Knicks
74-75 Golden State Warriors
78-79 Seattle Supersonics

Just a few other teams that didn't have a consistent inside scoring presence and won the ship.

This is also not a thread for teams who have won the title but a thread for teams which contend. My point is that we are talking about being a contender.

You consider the Mavs contenders don't you?

Lakers + Giants
02-24-2011, 10:24 PM
Teams always get excited with trades, then when lakers eliminate those teams in the playoffs a new weakness is revealed. . .talk to me about the OKC thunder being better than Lakers after the playoffs. then we will judge and see who's right.

da wood
02-24-2011, 10:26 PM
:confused:

Where the did rest of the scoring come from with 00-01 76ers? Didn't they contend with just a single real option on offense? A guard too booth.

Serge Ibaka does have good upside on offense. The offense will come on shouldn't worry about it. It's how well will they mesh on defense and adapting a defensive philosophy is where the concern will lie.

That was the era of one super star teams in the east and everyone ofbthem got stomped by the lakers or the spurs

JPHX
02-24-2011, 10:28 PM
if they mesh well and click on all cylinders then yeah, ill give them the "Contenders" label.

Swashcuff
02-24-2011, 10:35 PM
That was the era of one super star teams in the east and everyone ofbthem got stomped by the lakers or the spurs

The Heat had two. Come playoffs time the Mavericks usually has had one. The Cavs had one. They were all viewed as contenders.

Wrigheyes4MVP
02-24-2011, 11:02 PM
I rank the top 4 teams in the West like this (based on this season):

1) Spurs
2) Mavs
3) Thunder
4) Lakers

But we all know the Lakers will wake up in the playoffs...so even if they are the 4th seed...they are still probably a top 2 favorite in the West next to the Spurs.

If the seedings in the West end up this way, then any of those teams has a chance to make it to the finals because the Spurs can legitimately beat LA (with HFA), and while I am not sure if the Mavs or Thunder can beat LA...I think they can possibly beat the Spurs in the WCF.

So, yes this could make things much harder for LA and the Thunder should be considered contenders now, even if it just impacts the playoff seeding by swapping LA and OKC.

Wrigheyes4MVP
02-24-2011, 11:12 PM
Teams always get excited with trades, then when lakers eliminate those teams in the playoffs a new weakness is revealed. . .talk to me about the OKC thunder being better than Lakers after the playoffs. then we will judge and see who's right.

But if the Lakers slip to the 4th seed in the regular season, then they will have to face San Antonio in the 2nd round, and even you must admit that the Spurs have a legit chance to beat LA.

LA being knocked out in the second round makes everyone in the West a contender.

For the record, I feel that LA is the best team in the West, but I also feel that the Spurs have the chemistry and experience to beat them in a 7 game series with home court advantage on their side.

I think its actually pretty realistic that LA finishes with the 4th seed too. They won't catch the Mavs IMO, because the Mavs have a pretty easy schedule over the next month or so and have always been a great regular season team. Also, if the Thunder improve by just 3 or 4 games because of this trade, that could be enough for them to surpass LA in the standings.

I won't deny LA as being the top favorite come playoff time, but they could be 4th in the regular season, and that would match them up with the Spurs (their only legit threat) in the 2nd round.

I don't think LA fans should be so arrogant right now.

THE Vernon
02-24-2011, 11:20 PM
I think they are 1 more piece away; But if Harden gets more playing time and plays to his potential they won't need another piece.

LJEATON26
02-24-2011, 11:24 PM
I think they are 1 more piece away; But if Harden gets more playing time and plays to his potential they won't need another piece.

Isn't that what was said when we didn't have a Center?

kArSoN RyDaH
02-24-2011, 11:34 PM
This reminds me of last year when the Cavs got Jamison and I forget who Dallas picked up I think Caron Butler and everyone said the Lakers have no chance but it ended up being the Lakers in the ship against Boston and winning AGAIN!


Haters, hate on...

Chronz
02-24-2011, 11:35 PM
I honestly can't understand why people are saying the NEED a post scorer to contend. At least 4-6 teams every year are viewed as legit title contenders and at least 2 of those teams don't have legit post scorers. I mean look at NBA history. There have been tonnes of contenders who did not have a scoring big down low.

Its become the popular thing to say since its all people have heard growing up.

heathonater
02-24-2011, 11:35 PM
not ready to annoint them the best team in the west right now, although okc should improve at low post d and rebounding. the lakers still have a better team, and unlike okc, the lakers have a good low post scorer in gasol.

Chronz
02-24-2011, 11:41 PM
This reminds me of last year when the Cavs got Jamison and I forget who Dallas picked up I think Caron Butler and everyone said the Lakers have no chance but it ended up being the Lakers in the ship against Boston and winning AGAIN!


Haters, hate on...

Spoken like a short sighted fan, of course they have hope. New players brings different results, you could look at NBA history and find situations where trades propel teams to championship status. The Lakers are not as invincible as we once thought they were.

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Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 11:47 PM
Name one please that actually won a championship

Bulls won 6 chips with no low post scorer.

Chi StateOfMind
02-24-2011, 11:48 PM
yes awesome pickup get em thunder

_KB24_
02-25-2011, 12:14 AM
Basketball is about match ups. You can't teach 7'2 and 7'1 and at the end of the day perk in 6'10 and ibaka is as well so you do the math also with trading green you gave away the only big you have that matches up with odom so hum

True, but they have a physical edge over us now. I get when some of the OKC posters here are saying that the Thunder front court may present problems for LA. As tall and lengthy as we are, we can crumble and huddle up when faced against aggressive bigs. I still think we obviously have the edge over them in terms of our front court and our overall team in general. The one place way where they may handicap us with is the PG position, where Kobe will undoubtedly have to guard Westbrook instead of Fish.

Red Hot Rolllin
02-25-2011, 12:17 AM
Go Sonics.. sorry Seattle fan but damn they got good fast and the I-5 rivalry is missed!

If Perkins is healthy.. they are in the mix.

sargon21
02-25-2011, 01:00 AM
great ****ing trade for them, I'm not completely sold on them being a contender, but we'll see :)

blastmasta26
02-25-2011, 01:32 AM
I thought of them as fringe contenders before this, so yes they are contenders now. Ibaka and Perkins down low is a good combo defensively and I didn't like Green on the team all that much anyway.

hard_candy
02-25-2011, 03:05 AM
Probably why he shot so poorly against LA in postseason.

Let's face it, the top guys are so good, they can still give you great production even though every other team knows exactly what you're going to do.

Look at Jordan: it seemed reasonably clear that he'd get the ball at the end of the game to make a big play. No one could stop him anyway.


It's true that they have the right players they need to be contenders, but their biggest criticism from what I've seen has always been their ball movement. 80% of the time Westbrook passes is to Durant, and then Durant just shoots. Look at teams like the Celtics, Spurs and the Lakers(when Kobe isn't in ball hog mode), they have great team passing and that's what helps them get so many easy baskets. Without ball movement, it's too easy for elite defenses to shut you down.

iggypop123
02-25-2011, 04:08 AM
spacing will be an issue. with perkins and sefolosha and westbrook durant will face almost a 3 player zone against him. if they use harden their defense suffers alot, guys have no problem burning him up.