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View Full Version : Why isn't the T Wolves as good as the Thunder with all that young talent?



LTBaByyy
02-22-2011, 01:58 AM
Kevin Love
Johnny Flynn
Wes Johnson
Michael Beasley
Martell Webster
Anthony Randolph
Ricky Rubio (next year)
Darko is decent this year
Wayne Ellington
Nikola Pekovic
Kosta Koufus
Lazar Hayward

Plus the leadership veteran of Ridnour

Is the triangle offense a bad system for a team full of athletes and young talent???

I think it is coaching style bc with all that talent they are 13-43

bootleg42
02-22-2011, 01:59 AM
Because Renaldo Balkman doesn't play with them.

hugepatsfan
02-22-2011, 02:00 AM
They don't have a Kevin Durant type. In the NBA, you need a guy that can carry you. Love is a great player, but he isn't a go to scorer. He gets points in the flow of the offense.

Chacarron
02-22-2011, 02:00 AM
I don't see Durant or Westbrook in that team.

bootleg42
02-22-2011, 02:01 AM
I don't see Durant or Westbrook in that team.

Renaldo Balkman

LTBaByyy
02-22-2011, 02:03 AM
I think if they had a good coach with a Dallas/Thunder/Denver type playbook instead of the Triangle offense they could be a 6th-8th seed team in the west every year with that talent

beasted86
02-22-2011, 02:04 AM
One team learned to play defense along the way, and has a top 5 player.

LTBaByyy
02-22-2011, 02:07 AM
Plus they will have a top 3 pick in this years draft also added to that team

abe_froman
02-22-2011, 02:08 AM
better young stars.i love kevin love but kd and westbrook are better than him and beas,okc is also a more cohesive unit that plays defense

it takes more than just a collection of highly touted names to be something.it has to be molded...and they arent

Chacarron
02-22-2011, 02:10 AM
Renaldo Balkman

You've been spamming Renaldo Balkman a lot recently. It's not funny.

Sadds The Gr8
02-22-2011, 02:11 AM
because none of those players are Durant or Westbrook

LTBaByyy
02-22-2011, 02:14 AM
I meant why cant they be as good with a young talented team

We all know they dont have Durant or Westbrook,

but they do have Love and a lot of depth filled with young Talent

They should atleast be .500

bootleg42
02-22-2011, 02:14 AM
You've been spamming Renaldo Balkman a lot recently. It's not funny.

Renaldo Balkman does.

bootleg42
02-22-2011, 02:15 AM
I meant why cant they be as good with a young talented team

We all know they dont have Durant or Westbrook,

but they do have Love and a lot of depth filled with young Talent

They should atleast be .500

Young talent doesn't win you squat.

Stars and role players do.

AI4MVP
02-22-2011, 02:15 AM
they will be in about 2 years

Hellcrooner
02-22-2011, 02:17 AM
Well lets say they get the first pick this year and add rubio finally.

3 years down the line they MAY be good too.

Gritz
02-22-2011, 02:21 AM
They need to learn to play defense and need and isolation threat on the outside. I don't think teams that play them gameplan to stop anyone on their roster, Love is good, but he can get his and their team will still lose

boeknows
02-22-2011, 02:21 AM
They dont run the triangle offense first off.

They dont have a go to scorer. One that can take the final shot in the last seconds of the game. Beasley is starting to become that guy but he has been slowed at times this year because of injuries.

Even with Ridnour on their roster their average age is 24 years old. They are a very young team.

Most of the players are new to the system this year and new to each other. It takes awhile to gel together.

They cant finish a game out. They have had countless games where they are up in the second half and ones that they are up in the 4th quarter.

There are more reasons than this but these are a couple.

Hustlenomics
02-22-2011, 02:22 AM
Thunders number 1 option: Durant
T Wolves best player: Love

that's why

iggypop123
02-22-2011, 02:22 AM
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/80s/imagebrowser/view/imagecache/53000/Full

yangx620
02-22-2011, 02:23 AM
no kevin durant, duh! i bonafide superstar...i love kevin love but i dont see him as a great great top 5 superstar..you know that blake griffen thing...but imagine, if they get a guy like durant, they would win for sure, and switch their system please, kurt rambis you are cool but we need scott skiles

FutureGM
02-22-2011, 02:33 AM
After this year the Wolves got to finalize who they want to go forward with. They have too much young talent. Considering they now have Randolph, Rubio on the way, and a 1-5 draft pick this year they have to start making decisions.

Keep your best young players who gel well and trade the odd ones out for veterans and role players. That's how you make a team work.

Keeping Love might be a good start.

AddiX
02-22-2011, 02:35 AM
The T Wolves are saving assets for players like the Thunder have.

CBCable
02-22-2011, 02:36 AM
You've been spamming Renaldo Balkman a lot recently. It's not funny.

Yes it is.

What's up with that?

yangx620
02-22-2011, 02:48 AM
draft my guy, harrison barnes, the next great being

yangx620
02-22-2011, 02:49 AM
if they get barnes, that roster is stacked with young guys

boeknows
02-22-2011, 02:51 AM
if they get barnes, that roster is stacked with young guys


No matter who they draft they are stacked with young guys. It seems like every time Kahn makes a decision the average age of the team goes down. Weither if its a trade or a draft pick.

yangx620
02-22-2011, 02:58 AM
No matter who they draft they are stacked with young guys. It seems like every time Kahn makes a decision the average age of the team goes down. Weither if its a trade or a draft pick.

idk, kahn isnt he from the spurs organization? the year he messed everything up was drafting rubio and flynn in the top ten...i mean wth? but these guys are so talented, just wishful thinking, that these guys have the maturity like LBJ and lived up to the hype

iamsteel
02-22-2011, 03:03 AM
They just need a go-to closer to seal the games. They have been right in almost all of the games, then blow it in the last 2 minutes. Better D is a must also. Rubio will help with that next year. He isn't the savior, but his D would help. Maybe he could be the last piece needed. Or maybe they contract the Heat and send Lebron to MN.

heathonater
02-22-2011, 03:17 AM
it doesnt help minny has one of the worst defenses in the entire league. they dont have a really good pg like okc, and they lack a number one scoring option like okc as well. flynn just doesnt run the team well right now, but love is a good piece to have for minny.

Chronz
02-22-2011, 03:28 AM
I dont see the talent you speak of, they have Love and a bunch of guys with potential to be good but are currently overrated.

ragee
02-22-2011, 03:28 AM
They don't have a player like KD and Westbrook...

boeknows
02-22-2011, 10:01 PM
I dont see the talent you speak of, they have Love and a bunch of guys with potential to be good but are currently overrated.

Who are you considering overrated on the Wolves team exactly?

Chronz
02-22-2011, 10:04 PM
Who are you considering overrated on the Wolves team exactly?

Beasley, Flynn and their other new rook

mrblisterdundee
02-22-2011, 10:12 PM
The Timberwolves aren't as good because they don't have a starter-quality point guard.

NBAfan4life
02-22-2011, 10:17 PM
Does anyone know why they took on Eddy Curry's salary. I like the Randolph move but I dont understand taking on Eddy Curry was it for the chance to have the unproven Randolph or what? Anyone?

I tried asking Hawkeye no response.

Evolution23
02-22-2011, 10:25 PM
ask hawkeye

AddiX
02-22-2011, 10:37 PM
I'm not the type to rip someones grammar, I know I don't even pay attention to my own.

But starting a thread with "Why isn't" is just terrible. Go back to school son.

Hiphopopotamus
02-22-2011, 10:38 PM
They don't have a player like KD and Westbrook...

yep

magichatnumber9
02-22-2011, 10:43 PM
C'mon the T-Wolves are like a D-League team. They are building talent for the elite teams in the NBA

ChiSox219
02-22-2011, 10:48 PM
Who is their second best player? He isn't better than Serge Ibaka.

WSU Tony
02-22-2011, 10:51 PM
Who is their second best player? He isn't better than Serge Ibaka.

Have you seen the average age of the wolves? We average like 24 years of age for our starters.

We have like 5 players who were top five picks but none of them are older than 25. Give them a few years, wait and see.

ChiSox219
02-22-2011, 10:55 PM
Have you seen the average age of the wolves? We average like 24 years of age for our starters.

We have like 5 players who were top five picks but none of them are older than 25. Give them a few years, wait and see.

My post was in reference to the OP

The Thunder have 10 guys under the age 25, even their veterans (Thabo and Krisitic) are young (26 and 27).

knicks_champ
02-22-2011, 10:57 PM
They have no Kevin Durant type player there. Point Blank.

Hiphopopotamus
02-22-2011, 11:07 PM
Yeah Love is great but the rest of the roster is kind of....meh

LakersIn5
02-22-2011, 11:10 PM
I meant why cant they be as good with a young talented team

We all know they dont have Durant or Westbrook,

but they do have Love and a lot of depth filled with young Talent

They should atleast be .500

you dont win **** becaeuse of love and a depth filled with young talent unless you have a top 10 player. plus there are like 25 teams better than theml

Create
02-22-2011, 11:17 PM
They have no leader.

AddiX
02-22-2011, 11:25 PM
All what talent?

Did you Kevin Love in the all star game looking like he didn't belong one bit?

avrpatsfan
02-22-2011, 11:25 PM
They don't have a star. They don't have KD.
/Thread.

Kashmir13579
02-22-2011, 11:33 PM
Kevin Love
Johnny Flynn
Wes Johnson
Michael Beasley
Martell Webster
Anthony Randolph
Ricky Rubio (next year)
Darko is decent this year
Wayne Ellington
Nikola Pekovic
Kosta Koufus
Lazar Hayward

Plus the leadership veteran of Ridnour

Is the triangle offense a bad system for a team full of athletes and young talent???

I think it is coaching style bc with all that talent they are 13-43

what are your criticisms of the TWolves coaching staff? you didn't really go into detail at all.

Sixerlover
02-22-2011, 11:36 PM
because none of those players are Durant or Westbrook

Basically.

minervamob
02-22-2011, 11:47 PM
Why aren't**

iamsteel
02-22-2011, 11:51 PM
This team is brand new. 3 players on the team were there last year. Give them a chance to grow together.

boeknows
02-24-2011, 01:49 AM
Beasley, Flynn and their other new rook

I can see with Beasley. Alot of people are overrating him. But i dont think anybody here thinks Flynn is a great player and overrates him. As far as Wesley Johnson i havent even seen him being talked about anywhere on the forum so i dont know how he can be overrated.

idrinkpepsi
02-24-2011, 02:27 AM
Give them time.

daboywonder2002
02-24-2011, 02:41 AM
I meant why cant they be as good with a young talented team

We all know they dont have Durant or Westbrook,

but they do have Love and a lot of depth filled with young Talent

They should atleast be .500

not at all. they have no pg. they have no center. 2 important pieces if you wanna win in this league. they have no perimeter defense. they have no interior defense. now a franchise point guard would turn this team around quickly. not a scoring point guard like a ty lawson or stuckey. i mean a point guard who makes others better(kidd, nash, d will, cp3 type). and by the way, the wolves do have a scorer. his name is michael beasley. is he on a melo/durant level. heck no. but dude can score. its up to him to hit the weight room, to watch film, to add moves to his arsenal. but you have a 25 ppg scorer on your roster who can get buckets if need be. They also have no athleticism on their front line. darko and love are not quick. the thunder have ibaka. which helps a great deal. the nuggets had the birdman and kmart. you need quick defenders who can move their feet on that front line.

Jewelz0376
02-24-2011, 02:44 AM
All what talent?

Did you Kevin Love in the all star game looking like he didn't belong one bit?

haha I really thought I was the only one who noticed that

xbrackattackx
02-24-2011, 09:34 AM
I'm not the type to rip someones grammar, I know I don't even pay attention to my own.

But starting a thread with "Why isn't" is just terrible. Go back to school son.

I thought the same thing.

The Jokemaker
02-24-2011, 12:33 PM
Young talent doesn't always translate to wins. The wolves have young talent yes but the level of that talent I wouldn't say is on par with what the Thunder have.

JeVo7
02-24-2011, 12:39 PM
All what talent?

Did you Kevin Love in the all star game looking like he didn't belong one bit?


He's just running around like the ball is hiding from him. :laugh:

Rentzias
02-24-2011, 12:48 PM
because none of those players are Durant or Westbrook

Yep. "Young Talent" does not equal "Young Incredible And Happening Now At A High Level Talent" in the amounts that OKC has.

WeBallin
02-24-2011, 12:54 PM
Cause the young talent on the Wolves are all BASKET CASES!!!!!!! Except for the likes of Love, an thats it although i think Rubio is the smartest....He stayed right where he was at....

IndyRealist
02-24-2011, 12:55 PM
Because a lot of players on that team are really bad, and they play a lot of minutes.

Where's KG?
02-24-2011, 01:05 PM
I think a lot of people forget we traded Garnett in 07. Its only been a little over 3 years since we were competitive. Just give it a year or 2 and I think it will change a bit.

FadeAwayLikeMJ
02-24-2011, 01:32 PM
a top 3 scorer (Durant) and a top 5 PG (Westbrook)

Baller1
02-24-2011, 02:05 PM
Because OKC is perfect.

VIKES--4--LIFE
02-24-2011, 02:15 PM
I think we have the talent but not much leadership. We need Beasley to grow up a bit and Kevin Love to commit to Minnesota long term and make a few moves including a new coach. I do not hate Kurt but it is not working and the triangle is not great without Kobe or MJ.

td0tsfinest
02-24-2011, 02:18 PM
I think a lot of people forget we traded Garnett in 07. Its only been a little over 3 years since we were competitive. Just give it a year or 2 and I think it will change a bit.

More like 6-7 years. I remember the Wolves making the west finals in 04 and then failing to make to the playoffs ever since.

They have some good young prospects. Kevin Love and Michael Beasley have been playing really well this year but it falls off after them. Wesley Johnson is having an ok year. Jonny Flynn seems to be struggling. They struggle on the defensive end (I believe they're dead last in points allowed per game). However, they do have a bright future. If they can get Rubio to come over and with another top 5 pick, they'll have a solid young core.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 02:28 PM
2 reasons:

This is technically year 1 of the complete rebuilding process going forward (started the year with 11 new players). The Thunder had 20 wins in theirs

Kevin Love is a great young player, but Kevin Durant is a once every few years type player.

The Wolves will indeed see major improvements at some point, when their maturity catches up with some of their talent. 14 double digit leads given away, 21 losses when holding the lead with under 3 minutes to play. They should have a better record than they do now. But closing out games is a learning process, apparently a slow one for the Puppies

WolvesJagsOs
02-24-2011, 02:31 PM
Its because most of the guys just got here this year. It takes time to gel, and like some1 else said, we are still looking for our KD for OKC. We could have a couple players that become big time players, but we dont know that yet. And like some1 said of Klove, we dont really run plays for him, he just scores in the flow of the offense.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 02:32 PM
Beasley, Flynn and their other new rook

who overrates these guys? I have stated numerous times Beasley is the same guy he was in Miami, Flynn SUCKS, and Wesley is an inconsistent shooter who is not showing a ton of upside.

They basically have a bunch of guys who appear to be very good role players, and Love. Wesley may get better, but how much? Flynn is a lost cause. Beasley will get better, but never be a star imo. Randolph gets his shot now, we will see if he can continue his upward trend from his 2nd season before his injury.

Add another pick, Rubio, and maturity, and they will get a lot better. No doubt.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 02:36 PM
Does anyone know why they took on Eddy Curry's salary. I like the Randolph move but I dont understand taking on Eddy Curry was it for the chance to have the unproven Randolph or what? Anyone?

I tried asking Hawkeye no response.

I didn't know there was a thread about this, I was out of town (actually in Minneapolis in 24 inches of snow waiting to get home). Here was my response so everyone can see it:


with the salary difference between Brewer and Randolph's deal, along with the $3 million in cash the Knicks gave the Wolves (Brewer is owed 3.7 million this year, 4.9 next season, and add the 3 million in, and you get 11.6 million, which effectively cancels out Curry's deal totally). The trade now equals Brewer for Randolph straight up. Curry will be waived before he can even get on a plane to Minn.

Hope that helps

Hawk

TO to the CHI
02-24-2011, 02:47 PM
Kevin Love
Johnny Flynn
Wes Johnson
Michael Beasley
Martell Webster
Anthony Randolph
Ricky Rubio (next year)
Darko is decent this year
Wayne Ellington
Nikola Pekovic
Kosta Koufus
Lazar Hayward

Plus the leadership veteran of Ridnour

Is the triangle offense a bad system for a team full of athletes and young talent???

I think it is coaching style bc with all that talent they are 13-43

How many games did you expect Rubio to help them win from overseas?

Were you banking on a lot of winning and leadership because Beasley was the 2nd pick? Did you forget that Miami could barely give him away this summer and that people were shocked he was playing well?

Lazar Hayward? Really? Why was he even listed.

Anthony Randolph just got there a few days ago.

This thread is pointless and ridiculous. OKC has much better talent. The gap is significant.

daboywonder2002
02-24-2011, 02:49 PM
let me say this again.

1. lack of point guard. have you seen what nash did with the suns? kidd with the nets, cassell with the clippers, cp3 with hornets, d-will with the jazz? you need a pg that is a leader. someone that WANTS to be here. that will make other players better. someone to give you 9 - 10 assists per game. i really think they dropped the ball not getting steph curry

2. a DEFENSIVE CENTER WHO IS QUICK. hopefully anthony randolph pans out. but they need interior d in the worst way. ibaka, dalembert(not the smartest guy, but the shot blocker the wolves need) and deandre jordan type players.

they are set at the forward spots. i like wes johnson at the 2. get a leader at the point and a defensive center. and the wolves will start improving.

Chronz
02-24-2011, 02:53 PM
who overrates these guys?
Are you really asking this, you cant be serious?


I have stated numerous times Beasley is the same guy he was in Miami, Flynn SUCKS, and Wesley is an inconsistent shooter who is not showing a ton of upside.
Since when do you encompass the entire population? Even then you were drinking the cool aid at one point, you were just smart enough to lose hope quickly. Remember when you compared Flynn to Brooks or when you tried to rationalize the fact that Ty Lawson wasnt the better prospect, what about when you predicted that Beasley would finish the season with an Off.Rating in the 110's.

Hawkeye15
02-24-2011, 02:53 PM
let me say this again.

1. lack of point guard. have you seen what nash did with the suns? kidd with the nets, cassell with the clippers, cp3 with hornets, d-will with the jazz? you need a pg that is a leader. someone that WANTS to be here. that will make other players better. someone to give you 9 - 10 assists per game. i really think they dropped the ball not getting steph curry

2. a DEFENSIVE CENTER WHO IS QUICK. hopefully anthony randolph pans out. but they need interior d in the worst way. ibaka, dalembert(not the smartest guy, but the shot blocker the wolves need) and deandre jordan type players.

they are set at the forward spots. i like wes johnson at the 2. get a leader at the point and a defensive center. and the wolves will start improving.


agree with your opinion. I will only add our guards defense must improve BIG TIME. Not even D12 can stop wings coming at him 100 mph all night cause the guards don't even bother to get in their way.

The Wolves also need to slow it down. They turn the ball over like they are getting paid for it, yet have the highest pace in the NBA. How does that make sense??

GonnaFlyNow
02-24-2011, 02:56 PM
Plus they will have a top 3 pick in this years draft also added to that team

Ha what good has that ever done them?

Chronz
02-24-2011, 02:56 PM
let me say this again.

1. lack of point guard. have you seen what nash did with the suns? kidd with the nets, cassell with the clippers, cp3 with hornets, d-will with the jazz? you need a pg that is a leader. someone that WANTS to be here. that will make other players better. someone to give you 9 - 10 assists per game. i really think they dropped the ball not getting steph curry

2. a DEFENSIVE CENTER WHO IS QUICK. hopefully anthony randolph pans out. but they need interior d in the worst way. ibaka, dalembert(not the smartest guy, but the shot blocker the wolves need) and deandre jordan type players.

they are set at the forward spots. i like wes johnson at the 2. get a leader at the point and a defensive center. and the wolves will start improving.

You dont NEED any of this, what they NEED is TALENT PERIOD.

Have you seen what the Lakers did with Fisher? They did so because of talent elsewhere, thats all you need. If you have superior players at the 2 or 3 then you dont need a 1 or 5, the better your core the better your team is PERIOD. There is nothing more important about the PG position or SG or SF or PF or C, you need an all around team.

WolvesJagsOs
02-24-2011, 03:02 PM
^dude, i dont think you understand that having 6-8 new players in a new offense that is the youngest team in the league takes time to gel. You can come back with this comeback that says different, but it takes time to make chemistry.

jrm2054
02-24-2011, 03:08 PM
becausethr thunder talent is better

Rivera
02-24-2011, 03:12 PM
ima say wait till rubio comes

thunder didnt start winning until russell westbrook stepped up his game to where now hes a top 10 pg in the game to help out a top 5 talent in durant....

so if rubio comes and can transition and develop his game and become...something like a jason kidd (best case scenario) these guys will start winning trust me on that

NYMetros
02-24-2011, 03:12 PM
OKC plays defense and Minnesota doesn't. That's pretty much all there is to it.

VikesTwinsWolve
02-24-2011, 03:17 PM
It's our 1st year of a rebuild. We need to bring rubio over and add a top 3 draft pick to our young core for next year. At this point it's better to be rebuilding in the west then the east!

AddiX
02-24-2011, 03:23 PM
Rubio will make them worse.

No one wanted to listen to me when I said Flynn sucked and would never run the offense. Rubio will be just as bad if not worse. Nothing about him is NBA caliber.

Night in and night out, Rubio will always be the least athletic and worst outside shooter on the court. I can't possibly fathom how this guy expects to last.

VikesTwinsWolve
02-24-2011, 03:30 PM
Rubio will make them worse.

No one wanted to listen to me when I said Flynn sucked and would never run the offense. Rubio will be just as bad if not worse. Nothing about him is NBA caliber.

Night in and night out, Rubio will always be the least athletic and worst outside shooter on the court. I can't possibly fathom how this guy expects to last.

It's impossible for our pg position to be worse. If rubio can distribute the ball efficiently and play defense then he's a definite upgrade to anyone on your roster pal.

daboywonder2002
02-24-2011, 03:31 PM
You dont NEED any of this, what they NEED is TALENT PERIOD.

Have you seen what the Lakers did with Fisher? They did so because of talent elsewhere, thats all you need. If you have superior players at the 2 or 3 then you dont need a 1 or 5, the better your core the better your team is PERIOD. There is nothing more important about the PG position or SG or SF or PF or C, you need an all around team.

are you serious? you're kidding right? the lakers and bulls had the best players in the league so of course a point guard didnt matter. the triangle offense was based on ball movement. but please dont underestimate the power and influence of a franchise point guard.

Chronz
02-24-2011, 03:44 PM
^dude, i dont think you understand that having 6-8 new players in a new offense that is the youngest team in the league takes time to gel. You can come back with this comeback that says different, but it takes time to make chemistry.

You can have this core for the next decade, unless they improve, no amount of cohesion will make them good.

The simple truth is, chemistry doesnt matter more than talent. You guys are losing because you have none, not because they havent been together long. In time this core may become something special, it really hinges on Beasley and Wes but even then I dont see a OKC type team, you need an influx of talent in a bad way.

Chronz
02-24-2011, 03:47 PM
are you serious? you're kidding right? the lakers and bulls had the best players in the league so of course a point guard didnt matter.
Thats the point, you dont NEED anything if you have it elsewhere. This idea that if you add a great PG you'll be a great team is so half assed. If you have a PG and Defensive center, but you have bums at spots 2-4 your not going to offset that deficit by some magical voodoo theory of importance.

If your saying thats where they have weaknesses then your right (they have weaknesses all over), I was just saying you dont NEED it. If they were able to add a SF that had a star impact then they would win. Its all Im saying, I dont like cliches, and saying that a good PG magically transforms a team is one of them. A good PG still needs teammates.


the triangle offense was based on ball movement. but please dont underestimate the power and influence of a franchise point guard.

There is nothing magical about a franchise PG, if his teammates suck his team will suck. Your underestimating the importance of balance/talent. The Lakers had the best player in the game (by your logic) and couldnt make the playoffs or past the first round a few years, thats because they lacked talent elsewhere. Same thing applies for ANY position you want to bring up.

You need talent to win, you need cohesion+talent to win it all.