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View Full Version : Players joining forces- were KG/Allen first to do it in Boston?



blahblahyoutoo
02-02-2011, 02:58 PM
obviously it was the biggest headline of summer of 2010, with Lebron and Bosh teaming up in Miami with Wade.
but I hear a lot of deflection from player/analyst interviews, saying that it was KG and Allen that started it.
KG/Allen to Boston obviously didin't make as much noise as LBJ/Bosh to Miami, but was that also premeditated?
I thought KG just wanted out of Minnesota to a place for a chance to win, whereas LBJ and Bosh basically planned this out years in advance.

so were KG/Allen to Boston really the first to form a Big 3?

Super.
02-02-2011, 03:06 PM
I don't know...Larry Bird, Robert Parish and Kevin McHale?

The Original Big 3

And they didn't "join forces" like you claim. KG and Allen were both traded to Boston

blahblahyoutoo
02-02-2011, 03:14 PM
I don't know...Larry Bird, Robert Parish and Kevin McHale?

The Original Big 3

And they didn't "join forces" like you claim. KG and Allen were both traded to Boston

i should add recently, like within the past 5 years.

ok, so that's exactly my point. they didn't join forces, but a lot of players/analysts claim that it's ok the Heat did it because Boston did it first.

Chronz
02-02-2011, 03:17 PM
What makes you think they planned it out in advance? Either way KG did the same thing except he was under contract. Remember the initial trade for KG was going to net Minny a few extra assets but KG declined because he didnt believe Pierce was enough. When they traded for Ray THEN KG wanted to come and finally agreed to be traded.

Grant Hill and Tmac talked about joining forces the year leading up to FA, before that Chuck cut his salary to make room for Scottie Pippen, way before then Wilt forced his way to LA though Im not sure thats what your implying. Its pretty hard to answer your Q because players keep these sort of things to themselves all we can really do is speculate.

Bookey
02-02-2011, 03:18 PM
I think Miami are the first ones to plan on joining up,because in Boston's case a they were traded then came together, They won a title in their first year together and made it to a second & fell short by one game. Lets see if Miami can do the same.

DJakk
02-02-2011, 03:19 PM
Boston traded, Bosh and Lebron signed. Big difference.

Storch
02-02-2011, 03:21 PM
The first people to join forces was lebron bosh and wade. Every other big three has been through trades, or built slowly.

Super.
02-02-2011, 03:21 PM
What makes you think they planned it out in advance? Either way KG did the same thing except he was under contract. Remember the initial trade for KG was going to net Minny a few extra assets but KG declined because he didnt believe Pierce was enough. When they traded for Ray THEN KG wanted to come and finally agreed to be traded.

Grant Hill and Tmac talked about joining forces the year leading up to FA, before that Chuck cut his salary to make room for Scottie Pippen, way before then Wilt forced his way to LA though Im not sure thats what your implying. Its pretty hard to answer your Q because players keep these sort of things to themselves all we can really do is speculate.

Last time I checked Miami didn't have to trade a top 5 pick, or one of the best young big men at that point in time for Bosh or LeBron

Chronz
02-02-2011, 03:27 PM
Last time I checked Miami didn't have to trade a top 5 pick, or one of the best young big men at that point in time for Bosh or LeBron
Beasley?

Either way what point are your trying to get across? Im struggling to connect the dots, last I checked Pokemon was for sissies



JK Dont get booty hurt, I just downloaded fire red rom to my Droid

FadeAwayLikeMJ
02-02-2011, 03:27 PM
what Wade LBJ/Wade/Bosh did is completly different from KG/Allen/Pierce

KG didnt call Ray up and say "Yo Shuttlesworth, lets team up in Boston and **** some **** up. if you dont, ill punch you in the balls when you go up for a J"

blahblahyoutoo
02-02-2011, 03:27 PM
Boston traded, Bosh and Lebron signed. Big difference.

ok, that's what i'm saying.
then why are so many around the league justifying what the heatles did by pointing at boston?

jr_3421
02-02-2011, 03:28 PM
Yeah it's different in the fact that Boston went through years of dismantling a playoff team with no future, to accumulating young talent, to then cashing in the young talent for veteran help for Paul Pierce. To say they simply joined forces to create a big 3 is a little insulting to the hard work Ainge put in to creating those trades.

KnicksorBust
02-02-2011, 03:28 PM
The first people to join forces was lebron bosh and wade. Every other big three has been through trades, or built slowly.

Technically LeBron was traded too but your point is correct.

Chronz
02-02-2011, 03:28 PM
what Wade LBJ/Wade/Bosh did is completly different from KG/Allen/Pierce

KG didnt call Ray up and say "Yo Shuttlesworth, lets team up in Boston and **** some **** up. if you dont, ill punch you in the balls when you go up for a J"

I dont see the big difference, a minor difference sure

blahblahyoutoo
02-02-2011, 03:29 PM
What makes you think they planned it out in advance? Either way KG did the same thing except he was under contract. Remember the initial trade for KG was going to net Minny a few extra assets but KG declined because he didnt believe Pierce was enough. When they traded for Ray THEN KG wanted to come and finally agreed to be traded.

Grant Hill and Tmac talked about joining forces the year leading up to FA, before that Chuck cut his salary to make room for Scottie Pippen, way before then Wilt forced his way to LA though Im not sure thats what your implying. Its pretty hard to answer your Q because players keep these sort of things to themselves all we can really do is speculate.

it's speculation on my part, but i'm pretty sure it was planned well in advance, and everything leading up to the "decision" was just a charade.

NickyNick
02-02-2011, 03:38 PM
obviously it was the biggest headline of summer of 2010, with Lebron and Bosh teaming up in Miami with Wade.
but I hear a lot of deflection from player/analyst interviews, saying that it was KG and Allen that started it.
KG/Allen to Boston obviously didin't make as much noise as LBJ/Bosh to Miami, but was that also premeditated?
I thought KG just wanted out of Minnesota to a place for a chance to win, whereas LBJ and Bosh basically planned this out years in advance.

so were KG/Allen to Boston really the first to form a Big 3?

huge difference, they were traded for with pieces that boston stocked up on for years......the heat were bought

/thread

ee
02-02-2011, 03:42 PM
barkley, drextler and olajuwon...this was later in their careers though.....

FadeAwayLikeMJ
02-02-2011, 03:48 PM
I dont see the big difference, a minor difference sure

and i respect your opinion sir

but everyone knows that the 'new' 3 have been planning this since the first time they played together.

feel free to think otherwise but i will always believe that they had it planned out for years

llemon
02-02-2011, 03:51 PM
Boston traded, Bosh and Lebron signed. Big difference.

Actually, weren't both Bosh & Lebron signed and traded?

llemon
02-02-2011, 03:54 PM
Celts had to approach Garnett and come to a contract agreement before they traded for him.

Law25
02-02-2011, 04:03 PM
In this generation of ball yes the HATED celtics started the trend

Law25
02-02-2011, 04:07 PM
and i respect your opinion sir

but everyone knows that the 'new' 3 have been planning this since the first time they played together.

feel free to think otherwise but i will always believe that they had it planned out for years

How sad. You mean to tell me those three players decided to lose together :confused: Man i know ther friends but geez. Oh yeah before i forget celtics SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reversed86Curse
02-02-2011, 04:38 PM
Celts had to approach Garnett and come to a contract agreement before they traded for him.

Only reason Lebron and Bosh were traded was because they were going to leave and had to make the money work. Big difference from trading pieces and signing someone to an extension.

Klivlend
02-02-2011, 04:52 PM
Beasley?

Either way what point are your trying to get across? Im struggling to connect the dots, last I checked Pokemon was for sissies


JK Dont get booty hurt, I just downloaded fire red rom to my Droid

Ya. What's up with all the Dragon Ball Z ish too? And the WWE sigs as well. People actually like that stuff?

Chronz
02-02-2011, 05:05 PM
huge difference, they were traded for with pieces that boston stocked up on for years......the heat were bought

/thread
Minor difference, the Heat sacrificed for 3 seasons to get that window of opportunity

/open thread



Ya. What's up with all the Dragon Ball Z ish too? And the WWE sigs as well. People actually like that stuff?
RPG's will never die out

llemon
02-02-2011, 05:08 PM
Only reason Lebron and Bosh were traded was because they were going to leave and had to make the money work. Big difference from trading pieces and signing someone to an extension.

No such thing as a 6 year contract extension.

JordansBulls
02-02-2011, 05:16 PM
KG and Allen were past their primes so it is different.

Chronz
02-02-2011, 05:23 PM
KG and Allen were past their primes so it is different.

Not in this discussion, either way its a difference that only signifies just how smart the Heat trio were, they did something KG wishes he had done sooner. Besides Wade is already 30 and their contracts were up now, if they wait for the next FA class it would be too late.

UnWantedTheory
02-02-2011, 05:27 PM
Not in this discussion, either way its a difference that only signifies just how smart the Heat trio were, they did something KG wishes he had done sooner. Besides Wade is already 30 and their contracts were up now, if they wait for the next FA class it would be too late.

He just turned 29....

UnWantedTheory
02-02-2011, 05:28 PM
Just saying.

UnWantedTheory
02-02-2011, 05:38 PM
obviously it was the biggest headline of summer of 2010, with Lebron and Bosh teaming up in Miami with Wade.
but I hear a lot of deflection from player/analyst interviews, saying that it was KG and Allen that started it.
KG/Allen to Boston obviously didn't make as much noise as LBJ/Bosh to Miami, but was that also premeditated?
I thought KG just wanted out of Minnesota to a place for a chance to win, whereas LBJ and Bosh basically planned this out years in advance.

so were KG/Allen to Boston really the first to form a Big 3?

^^^You said it already. Deflection. You have to flip the script on that huge of a marketing opportunity. No one wants us to hate them.

As others have stated, Boston built that team through trades & the draft. Once KG & Ray were traded to the C's, their "Big 3" were all in their 30's. It isn't as if they all went to lunch & tried to land on the same team like Wade,Bosh,& Bron.

HiphopRelated
02-02-2011, 05:42 PM
Actually, weren't both Bosh & Lebron signed and traded?
4 1st round picks

TO to the CHI
02-02-2011, 05:58 PM
What makes you think they planned it out in advance? Either way KG did the same thing except he was under contract. Remember the initial trade for KG was going to net Minny a few extra assets but KG declined because he didnt believe Pierce was enough. When they traded for Ray THEN KG wanted to come and finally agreed to be traded.

Grant Hill and Tmac talked about joining forces the year leading up to FA, before that Chuck cut his salary to make room for Scottie Pippen, way before then Wilt forced his way to LA though Im not sure thats what your implying. Its pretty hard to answer your Q because players keep these sort of things to themselves all we can really do is speculate.


These example aren't at all the same. The difference is that the Heat's Big 3 conceived a plan to come together as free agents at the same time and all join up on one team. It was premeditated. In all of the examples that you cited, the players chose to join up (by leveraging trade scenarios or taking paycuts), but it was not a preconceived plan (mind you, if you don't believe that it was preconceived in Miami that is fair too).

Hill and TMac were not rumored to be joining each other in Orlando. Rather the hot rumor was that Duncan would go there with Hill. TMac was almost a fall back option for them when Duncan resigned in San Antonio. In fact, Toronto fans felt particularly snubbed because after TMac said he wanted to be a lead dog, he then went and followed Hill.

Chuck, Kareem and Pip were all well beyond their prime and taking a pay cut without more is not at all the same as this summer (the pay cuts were never the problem, in fact that was the most commendable aspect of the Big 3 coming together).

godolphins
02-02-2011, 06:04 PM
LeBron and Bosh had other options but they decide to team up unlike Allen/Garnett we're traded

godolphins
02-02-2011, 06:05 PM
4 1st round picks Ouch, better hope the MLE stays

arkanian215
02-02-2011, 06:12 PM
huge difference, they were traded for with pieces that boston stocked up on for years......the heat were bought

/thread

Much like the other teams that maneuvered for FA 2010 in advance, Miami sacrificed picks and players to get in a position where they could sign (and trade for) two max contracts. Miami traded away that pick like the Nets traded Yi w/ cash or the Knicks traded their pick with Jeffries. They traded for the pieces so they had a shot at obtaining those players.

TO to the CHI
02-02-2011, 06:16 PM
Minor difference, the Heat sacrificed for 3 seasons to get that window of opportunity

/open thread



I am not sure that I buy that. The Heat were still a playoff team and only truly dumped remaining salary over the last year and a bit. Moreover, to the extent that anyone in the organization knew of James, Bosh, and Wade's plans then it was collusion.

There is no comparable situation in the history of the NBA (assuming that those 3 truly schemed to play together). To argue otherwise is ridiculous. On the other hand, if there was no scheme and they just ended up together that would be different (but I don't buy that for a second).

UnWantedTheory
02-02-2011, 06:23 PM
I am not sure that I buy that. The Heat were still a playoff team and only truly dumped remaining salary over the last year and a bit. Moreover, to the extent that anyone in the organization knew of James, Bosh, and Wade's plans then it was collusion.

There is no comparable situation in the history of the NBA (assuming that those 3 truly schemed to play together). To argue otherwise is ridiculous. On the other hand, if there was no scheme and they just ended up together that would be different (but I don't buy that for a second).

^^^

hugepatsfan
02-02-2011, 06:23 PM
Bosh did accidently admit at the pep rally that they had been talking for "months." If that is taken literally, then that means that they were discussing it w/ each other while still playing. I do take it literally because Bosh was quick to correct himself and say weeks - suspicious IMO.

There is nothing wrong w/ that in a tampering sense, but I think all would agree that talking about what team you're going to sign w/ while your team is still playing is not cool. That's my only issue w/ the MIA situation - other than that, they did nothing wrong in my mind.

Ray_R
02-02-2011, 06:36 PM
Beasley?

Either way what point are your trying to get across? Im struggling to connect the dots, last I checked Pokemon was for sissies



JK Dont get booty hurt, I just downloaded fire red rom to my Droid

How?

lvlheaded
02-02-2011, 06:37 PM
I think the first "planned" big 3 was supposed to be in Orlando. The thought was that T-Mac, Hill, and Duncan would all go to Orlando and take the league by storm. Of course Duncan decided to stay in SA and that went to ****.

But Bosh, Bron, and Wade were the first 3 to execute a planned big 3

TO to the CHI
02-02-2011, 06:58 PM
I think the first "planned" big 3 was supposed to be in Orlando. The thought was that T-Mac, Hill, and Duncan would all go to Orlando and take the league by storm. Of course Duncan decided to stay in SA and that went to ****.

But Bosh, Bron, and Wade were the first 3 to execute a planned big 3

TMac was not part of that plan. He was rumpored to want to be a lead dog and to prefer to go to Chicago. Moreover, even the Duncan and Hill rumors were just Orlando's free agency plan. There is no indication that they were colluding or working together on arranging a free agency destination. Moreover, history shows Duncan never really wanted to leave. Orlando didn't even have dollars for all three and settled on TMac as a fall back.

jimm120
02-02-2011, 07:11 PM
Beasley?

Either way what point are your trying to get across? Im struggling to connect the dots, last I checked Pokemon was for sissies



JK Dont get booty hurt, I just downloaded fire red rom to my Droid

uhhhh...no.

Beasley was traded because the team wanted Mike MIller.

Reversed86Curse
02-02-2011, 07:11 PM
No such thing as a 6 year contract extension.

Was KG a free agent. If not, it's an extension

FadeAwayLikeMJ
02-02-2011, 07:14 PM
How sad. You mean to tell me those three players decided to lose together :confused: Man i know ther friends but geez. Oh yeah before i forget celtics SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you that upset the C's whooped y'all up Sunday. It was just a regular season game holmes. Lol

And you gotta come up with some thing better than the "celtics sucks" cause they have a better record AND beat you at home. I know you were kiddin but be creative!!

Super.
02-02-2011, 07:23 PM
Beasley?

Either way what point are your trying to get across? Im struggling to connect the dots, last I checked Pokemon was for sissies



JK Dont get booty hurt, I just downloaded fire red rom to my Droid

Al Jefferson was better than Beasley when he was traded (To the same team :laugh2:)

The point im trying to make is that Miami had to give up Beasley (Not to Cleveland or Toronto and they got 2 2nds for him) and a **** ton of future 1sts.

KG was traded for Jefferson (a potential franchise player), Ryan Gomes (an intangibles guy who's useless on a bad team), Bassy Telfair (a year away from signing in Italy), Gerald Green (a homeless man's J.R. Smith), Theo Ratliff's expiring deal, a 2009 lottery-protected No. 1 pick (congrats on picking in the mid-20s) and the return of Minny's future No. 1 that was stupidly included in the Ricky Davis/Mark Blount-Wally Szczerbiak trade.

Ray Allen was traded for he Boston Celtics acquired guard Ray Allen from the Seattle Supersonics on Thursday night for Delonte West, Wally Szczerbiak and the rights to the 2007 NBA Draft's No. 5 overall pick -- Georgetown forward Jeff Green. Boston also gets the rights to the Sonics' 35th pick -- LSU's Glen Davis (Who has turned into a great role player)

That's the point I'm attempting to make. The Celtics actually had to make moves to aquire these players, while Miami just S&T them for draft picks.

Pokemon is the ****