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View Full Version : Kobe Bryant passes Oscar Robertson for number 9 all time scoring



nickdymez
01-08-2011, 03:19 PM
LOS ANGELES -- Los Angeles Lakers guard Kobe Bryant made a running jump shot with 1:11 remaining in the third quarter against the New Orleans Hornets to move him past Oscar Robertson for ninth place on the NBA's all-time scoring list.
Bryant finished with 25 points in the Lakers' 101-97 win over the Hornets on Friday and now has 26,720 points. Next on the list is Hakeem Olajuwon with 26,946 points.

"It's a huge honor," Bryant said after the game. "So much of my game is built on those that came before me, Oscar in particular. It's a huge honor to be moving up that ladder."

When Lakers coach Phil Jackson was asked before the game whom he thought Bryant was targeting in front of him on the all-time scoring list he didn't waste any time in saying, "Michael Jordan. I would imagine that would be the one."

"I don't know, we'll see what happens," Bryant said when asked how high he will go on the all-time scoring list. "The ladder I'm more focused on climbing is Bill Russell's ladder, so we'll see."

Russell, the Boston Celtics' Hall of Fame center, won 11 NBA championships during his career. Bryant currently has won five titles.


Player
1. K. Abdul-Jabbar
2. Karl Malone
3. Michael Jordan
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Shaquille O'Neal*
6. Moses Malone
7. Elvin Hayes
8. Hakeem Olajuwon
9. Kobe Bryant*
10. Oscar Robertson
Think it says something that there are only two guards on this list

Swashcuff
01-08-2011, 03:20 PM
Think it says something that there are only three guards on this list

Fixed

GodsSon
01-08-2011, 03:21 PM
:clap: Congrats to Bean

SteveNash
01-08-2011, 03:24 PM
Fixed

Where's Iverson?

SteBO
01-08-2011, 03:26 PM
Incredible feat for an incredible player no doubt. CONGRATS TO KB24!!! :clap:

Swashcuff
01-08-2011, 03:26 PM
Where's Iverson?

In Turkey.

nickdymez
01-08-2011, 03:28 PM
Oh yea, big o.. duhhh... lol

carter15
01-08-2011, 03:38 PM
Dap.

Hawkeye15
01-08-2011, 03:43 PM
congrats to Kobe. Shows how durable he has been over his career. Obviously it helped that he came in young and started scoring by year 2, but he has remained healthy, and played a lot of games and scored a lot of points. Great scorer

Hustlenomics
01-08-2011, 04:22 PM
In Turkey.

lol if he was still playing and got in the top 10 he would receive hate for it

Swashcuff
01-08-2011, 04:30 PM
lol if he was still playing and got in the top 10 he would receive hate for it


he is the biggest ball hog in the history of the game he never passed the ball unless he had no choice he is not a team player practice practice practice he never practiced he is a horrible husband he is a thug he is selfish he never played defense he is uncouachable he never one a ring etc etc etc

sound familiar? :laugh2:

we would have surely heard all those things and more from the many haters.

But hey this is Kobe's thread and lets not hijack it with Allen Iverson talk.

Great accomplishment by Kobe one of the greatest players to ever play the game. :clap:

Avenged
01-08-2011, 04:40 PM
He's needs about 226 points to pass Hakeem. :nod:

shep33
01-08-2011, 04:40 PM
Amazing when you think about it... What gets to me, is that this guy is like one of the last of his generation. Makes me feel sad in a way. We don't have many guys left like him and KG, Pierce, etc. that have that tenacity and will to win games. Gonna miss when he leaves the game.

J-Relo
01-08-2011, 04:57 PM
Amazing player, great scorer.

He may beat MJ on that list. (he will)

Malone?.. It's gonna be hard.

blastmasta26
01-08-2011, 05:01 PM
Congrats Kobe.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
01-08-2011, 06:28 PM
Oscar Robinson:laugh2:

MalZee24
01-08-2011, 06:32 PM
Think it says something that there are only two guards on this list

Well when u take as many shots as he has in his career, this is no surprise.

LA_Raiders
01-08-2011, 08:00 PM
by the end of the month he will be 8th, passing the great keem...

bholly
01-08-2011, 10:15 PM
Oscar Robinson:laugh2:

This. Can't believe it took 16 posts for someone to say it.

nickdymez
01-08-2011, 10:59 PM
This. Can't believe it took 16 posts for someone to say it.

Actually someone corrected me by the third post. I was looking at a list that started at Kobe when i wrote the comment but posted the 10. lol.. A lil confused.

NYKalltheway
01-09-2011, 03:31 AM
I'd say rules change (handchecking etc) helped him more than anything... It would have taken him at least 1.5 more seasons to reach this level.
Can't say I'm not surprised he reached top 10 though

kobe24>lebron23
01-09-2011, 06:28 AM
I'd say rules change (handchecking etc) helped him more than anything... It would have taken him at least 1.5 more seasons to reach this level.
Can't say I'm not surprised he reached top 10 though

So you think 3000-4000 of his points came from the charity strike when hand checking was called??

Bruno
01-09-2011, 07:16 AM
I'd say rules change (handchecking etc) helped him more than anything... It would have taken him at least 1.5 more seasons to reach this level.
Can't say I'm not surprised he reached top 10 though

No, it'd be the exact opposite. If Oscar played in this era he would have ended up with a lot less points than does. You mention hand-checking, but you don't account for pace, or averaged FGA's per game during O's era, compared to today.

In 65-66 Oscar averaged 31.3 ppg, his career high. In 65-66 the league averaged 102.4 FGA per game.

In 05-06, Bryant averaged 35.5 ppg, his career high. In 05-06 the league averaged 78.9 FGA per game.

Using their peak scoring years as a gauge, you can see how NBA teams averaged 20-25 more FGAs per game in the 60's compared with the 00's. When you take pace and FGA per game into account, it's harder to average 30 points per game today than it was back then, you have less possessions, less FGA's and less opportunities to score.

You mention hand-checking, but the stats suggest that it's not a factor. The hand-checking rule was instituted before the 1999-2000 NBA season. Using sample years, four years after (2004) and four years before (1996) the rule existed, you can see the FTA's and FGA's were hardly effected on average by teams in the league because of hand checking. If anything, more free-throws were being called before the rules existed. We're not talking about big adjustments in pace either, the pace in '96 and '04 were essentially the same by league average.

1996: League average in FTA per game, per team- 26.4 FTA's per game.
2004: League average in FTA per game, per team- 24.2 FTA's per game

1996: League average in FGA per game, per team- 80.2 FGA's per game.
2004: League average in FGA per game, per team- 79.8 FGA's per game.

Anyways, congrats to Kobe, this is the year he joins the best of the best. He could end up as high as #6 before the year is over. I think Kobe retires with 32-34 k points, good enough for 3rd, or 4th all-time. Glad I can say I've been able to watch at least 21,000 of his 26,000+ points live on TV over the past 15 years.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1966.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2006.html

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2004.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1996.html

Hellcrooner
01-09-2011, 12:55 PM
can someone find a list of top ten AVERAGES for a career? And a list of top ten careers in fg%?..

Dudes played a long time, thats it.


Ill be glad when he get his 7th ring tough ( as long as is a lakers ring)

Hellcrooner
01-09-2011, 12:58 PM
No, it'd be the exact opposite. If Oscar played in this era he would have ended up with a lot less points than does. You mention hand-checking, but you don't account for pace, or averaged FGA's per game during O's era, compared to today.

In 65-66 Oscar averaged 31.3 ppg, his career high. In 65-66 the league averaged 102.4 FGA per game.

In 05-06, Bryant averaged 35.5 ppg, his career high. In 05-06 the league averaged 78.9 FGA per game.

Using their peak scoring years as a gauge, you can see how NBA teams averaged 20-25 more FGAs per game in the 60's compared with the 00's. When you take pace and FGA per game into account, it's harder to average 30 points per game today than it was back then, you have less possessions, less FGA's and less opportunities to score.

You mention hand-checking, but the stats suggest that it's not a factor. The hand-checking rule was instituted before the 1999-2000 NBA season. Using sample years, four years after (2004) and four years before (1996) the rule existed, you can see the FTA's and FGA's were hardly effected on average by teams in the league because of hand checking. If anything, more free-throws were being called before the rules existed. We're not talking about big adjustments in pace either, the pace in '96 and '04 were essentially the same by league average.

1996: League average in FTA per game, per team- 26.4 FTA's per game.
2004: League average in FTA per game, per team- 24.2 FTA's per game

1996: League average in FGA per game, per team- 80.2 FGA's per game.
2004: League average in FGA per game, per team- 79.8 FGA's per game.

Anyways, congrats to Kobe, this is the year he joins the best of the best. He could end up as high as #6 before the year is over. I think Kobe retires with 32-34 k points, good enough for 3rd, or 4th all-time. Glad I can say I've been able to watch at least 21,000 of his 26,000+ points live on TV over the past 15 years.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1966.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2006.html

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2004.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1996.html

now you are forgetting something.

in teh 60s 70s it was usual that the star had 25+ ppg the second man a very usimilar numbe

the third player 18+ the fourth player 15+ the 5th player 15 + and have two or thre emore players over 10 ppg-.


nowdays its , star 30 + second one 18-20 third 12-14 and from ther on there be dragons and barely no one gets more than 8 or 9.

basicaly , modern franchise players take a higher % of shots fromt eh total of the team than old franchise players did.

NBAfan4life
01-09-2011, 02:16 PM
now you are forgetting something.

in teh 60s 70s it was usual that the star had 25+ ppg the second man a very usimilar numbe

the third player 18+ the fourth player 15+ the 5th player 15 + and have two or thre emore players over 10 ppg-.


nowdays its , star 30 + second one 18-20 third 12-14 and from ther on there be dragons and barely no one gets more than 8 or 9.

basicaly , modern franchise players take a higher % of shots fromt eh total of the team than old franchise players did.

That is your opinion. If you want to make it a fact bring in the numbers.

whitemamba33
01-09-2011, 04:01 PM
now you are forgetting something.

in teh 60s 70s it was usual that the star had 25+ ppg the second man a very usimilar numbe

the third player 18+ the fourth player 15+ the 5th player 15 + and have two or thre emore players over 10 ppg-.


nowdays its , star 30 + second one 18-20 third 12-14 and from ther on there be dragons and barely no one gets more than 8 or 9.

basicaly , modern franchise players take a higher % of shots fromt eh total of the team than old franchise players did.

You can't post something like that without offering any proof at all.

Actually you can...but you'll just sound like an idiot.

hard_candy
01-09-2011, 05:20 PM
I wonder when Kobe will catch up to Big O's triple double total? :p

dhopisthename
01-09-2011, 05:21 PM
very impressive isn't he about to move up some more spots this year?
and someone asked for for the highest career ppg http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/pts_per_g_career.html kobe comes in at number 10, although for most nba players their average drops as they play the last few years

Hustlenomics
01-09-2011, 05:25 PM
can someone find a list of top ten AVERAGES for a career? And a list of top ten careers in fg%?..

Dudes played a long time, thats it.


Ill be glad when he get his 7th ring tough ( as long as is a lakers ring)


1. Michael Jordan 30.1
1. Wilt Chamberlain 30.1
3. LeBron James 27.6
4. Elgin Baylor 27.4
5. Jerry West 27.0
6. Allen Iverson 26.7
7. Bob Pettit 26.4
8. George Gervin 26.2
9. Oscar Robertson 25.7
10. Dwyane Wade 25.4

:D

Bruno
01-09-2011, 06:42 PM
now you are forgetting something.

in teh 60s 70s it was usual that the star had 25+ ppg the second man a very usimilar numbe

the third player 18+ the fourth player 15+ the 5th player 15 + and have two or thre emore players over 10 ppg-.


nowdays its , star 30 + second one 18-20 third 12-14 and from ther on there be dragons and barely no one gets more than 8 or 9.

basicaly , modern franchise players take a higher % of shots fromt eh total of the team than old franchise players did.

Um...no. Again Crooner, where are the facts that would support your argument? If you're going to call out my post filled with facts and even the sources to back them up, you need to at least rebuttal with some facts and details, not blind unsupported opinions.

Nowadays the star averages 30+ppg? I'll give it to you that it happens in this era. But this season? There isn't a single player in the entire league who is averaging more than 28 ppg during this 2010-2011 campaign. Durant is leading the league with 28.2 ppg through the first 38 games of the season. In the case of OKC Durant averages 28 to RWs 22 ppg.

In your post you said "in the 60's the star usually averaged 25 ppg...". Which classic NBA scorers are you using as example to gauge you assessment regarding the main guy only averaging 25 ppg? Wilt? Oscar? West? KAJ? Baylor?

Through 1966 Chamberlain never averaged less than 25 FGAs per game (peaking at 39 FGA per game in 1962), and he never averaged any less than 33.5 ppg through 1966 (the end of his physical prime). Wilt peaked with a scoring average of 50.4 ppg in 1962, his second best year was in '63 when he averaged 44.8 ppg. In 1962 The Warriors had the best offense in the league. Wilt single-handedly attempted 3,159 FGAs that year. The rest of the team (11 other players) combined for 5,770 FGAs for the year, not even double what Wilt attempted, combined. Using Wilt as an example, the notion you propose is wrong, statistically.

West? From 61-62 through 69-70 West averaged over 30 ppg on four separate occasions, and that doesn't include two years when he averaged 28, what Durant is averaging today.

Baylor? From 1960-1963 Baylor averaged between 29.6- 38 ppg. He did this while team with West, who was averaging great scoring numbers, as mentioned above.

KAJ? Oscar? The same applies to them when they were in their physical primes. When you look at the stats of the great scorers of the 60's and early 70's, it seems like they were taking a higher % of their teams FGAs than players do today, especially in Wilts case. All the stats suggest the opposite of what you propose. Am I missing something? Show me the stats and the facts. Seems like todays OKC stars are averaging what you propose, not the players of the 60's.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/chambwi01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/westje01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bayloel01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/abdulka01.html

joeboow90
01-09-2011, 07:06 PM
Kobe is truly a legend. I really dont like him as a person but you gotta respect his game and accomplishments. He might end up having more championships as Michael Jordan but I'll never consider him better than Jordan.

tangent12
01-09-2011, 07:08 PM
Can't say anything negative about Kobe because they guy is truly a living legend. Sadly he won't be truly appreciated and recognized as one until a few years after he retires.

Kobe is a winner and he plays and competes like one so it's good to see him accomplish things like this that cement his legacy as one of the greatest players ever. My respect.

thekmp211
01-09-2011, 07:14 PM
props kobester. the guy could probably pour it in with one arm.

aerion123
01-09-2011, 07:33 PM
Kobe is the man that's for sure, and any fan of the game deep down knows it even Denver and Boston fans. His breec is a dying one, and even though he is slowing down I would like to see how Wade, Lebron, Carmelo, Durant are doing after their 14th season. So Laker fans appreciate and stop making those Why is Kobe struggling threads.

KnicksorBust
01-09-2011, 07:42 PM
Keep building that legacy Kobe. Top 3 of all-time is in your grasp.

Hellcrooner
01-09-2011, 08:26 PM
1. Michael Jordan 30.1
1. Wilt Chamberlain 30.1
3. LeBron James 27.6
4. Elgin Baylor 27.4
5. Jerry West 27.0
6. Allen Iverson 26.7
7. Bob Pettit 26.4
8. George Gervin 26.2
9. Oscar Robertson 25.7
10. Dwyane Wade 25.4

:D

let me guess Ai i has the worst fg percentage of the players listed ( maybe not since gervin wasnt efficient at all too)

kArSoN RyDaH
01-09-2011, 08:30 PM
imagine if Kobe started his first 2 years? :drool:

kArSoN RyDaH
01-09-2011, 08:33 PM
kobes averages for his career are all screwed up because his first 2 years he didnt start so its not really fair to compare imo.

lakers4sho
01-09-2011, 08:55 PM
kobes averages for his career are all screwed up because his first 2 years he didnt start so its not really fair to compare imo.

By the same token if he started early then his decline might have accelerated.

LakersMaster24
01-09-2011, 09:45 PM
Kobe is the man that's for sure, and any fan of the game deep down knows it even Denver and Boston fans. His breec is a dying one, and even though he is slowing down I would like to see how Wade, Lebron, Carmelo, Durant are doing after their 14th season. So Laker fans appreciate and stop making those Why is Kobe struggling threads.

This.

DwayneMVPwade
01-09-2011, 09:46 PM
Congrats Kobe

jasonbird
01-09-2011, 11:00 PM
congratulation to Kobe Bryant...and good luck to him...


Be careful,LBJ will be the next one.he is only 26 yrs old

SteveNash
01-09-2011, 11:15 PM
1. Michael Jordan 30.1 49.7%
1. Wilt Chamberlain 30.1 54.0%
3. LeBron James 27.6 47.5%
4. Elgin Baylor 27.4 43.1%
5. Jerry West 27.0 47.4%
6. Allen Iverson 26.7 42.5%
7. Bob Pettit 26.4 43.6%
8. George Gervin 26.2 51.1%
9. Oscar Robertson 25.7 48.5%
10. Dwyane Wade 25.4 48.2%

Not that career PPG matters very much. When you're comparing some you tanked their PPG by taking a reduced role to AI who never wanted to stop shooting and got kicked out of the league before he could do further damage to his PPG.

Bruno
01-09-2011, 11:24 PM
congratulation to Kobe Bryant...and good luck to him...


Be careful,LBJ will be the next one.he is only 26 yrs old

Good point. For years I've known LeBron would challenge Kobe on the all-time scoring list when it's all said and done. But does that change now that he shares the ball with Wade? He'll probably never averaged more than 27 per game while sharing the ball with prime Wade.

Does LBJ top Kobe on the all-time list by the time he retires now that he's in Miami?
IMO Kevin Durant could if healthy for the next decade.

Rego247
01-09-2011, 11:38 PM
think about what he accomplished. its pretty incredible. 9th in scoring all time, wow, and passing the big O, respect.

HeatVsHate
01-10-2011, 01:21 AM
Congrats to kobe, he's definitely one of the basketball greats.

Sactown
01-10-2011, 01:47 AM
Kobe is 14 games away from equaling that of MJs. and is still behind 5000 some odd points.

nickdymez
01-10-2011, 02:05 AM
Kobe is 14 games away from equaling that of MJs. and is still behind 5000 some odd points.

I don't know if this is a diss or not. If it is you do realize he played with the guy thats like number 5 on this list.... Jordan didn't have a scorer the caliber of shaq on his team.. Sad that everyone wants to diminish a good accomplishment

C-Style
01-10-2011, 02:06 AM
Kobe is 14 games away from equaling that of MJs. and is still behind 5000 some odd points.

That's why MJ is goat. even though he shot 5 shots per more than Kobe did...

Sactown
01-10-2011, 02:09 AM
I don't know if this is a diss or not. If it is you do realize he played with the guy thats like number 5 on this list.... Jordan didn't have a scorer the caliber of shaq on his team.. Sad that everyone wants to diminish a good accomplishment

Just noticing a fact.. amazing how far up he got with limited games. also MJ has taken 3000 more shots.. which would mean that Kobe would have to shoot a great percentage to take 3000 shots and turn it into 5000 points.. also Kobe has shot more freethrows

ko8e24
01-10-2011, 02:39 AM
Just noticing a fact.. amazing how far up he got with limited games. also MJ has taken 3000 more shots.. which would mean that Kobe would have to shoot a great percentage to take 3000 shots and turn it into 5000 points.. also Kobe has shot more freethrows

interesting

blueplanet
01-10-2011, 03:05 AM
Congrats Kobe. I like Kobe's game a lot but only some blind Kobe fans' comments makes me dislike him sometimes. I guess there are many other PSD members who have the same experience.

MJ-BULLS
01-10-2011, 03:11 AM
congrats to the great Kobe Bryant.
gotta give the man his props, he has had a terrific career.

anjoe29
01-10-2011, 10:58 AM
eat that HATERS.. HISTORY AT THE MAKING:):clap:

xbrackattackx
01-10-2011, 11:42 AM
Congrats Kobe!

todu82
01-10-2011, 12:26 PM
Congrats to Kobe. Terrific player, will retire as a top-5-8 player in NBA history.

AIRMAR72
01-10-2011, 02:29 PM
That's why MJ is goat. even though he shot 5 shots per more than Kobe did...
Yea but jordan shot 50% for the most part of his career playing in a tougher era were kobe wouldnt even average 15points TRUST ME on that

younggunn113
01-10-2011, 02:53 PM
Yea but jordan shot 50% for the most part of his career playing in a tougher era were kobe wouldnt even average 15points TRUST ME on that

TRUST YOU? Are you kidding me. Kobe wouldn't average 15 PPG? You must be outside of your mind. He's already the second best SG of all time. You realize, much like MJ, he can score from anywhere on the court? You have 0 credibility.

-Kobe24-TJ19-
01-10-2011, 03:01 PM
Yea but jordan shot 50% for the most part of his career playing in a tougher era were kobe wouldnt even average 15points TRUST ME on that

troll

8kobe24
01-10-2011, 03:06 PM
CONGRATS TO THE BLACK MAMBA! Must be a surreal feeling passing all of the greats you grew up watching and learning from.

Klivlend
01-10-2011, 03:16 PM
Where's Iverson?

Number 17

http://www.nba.com/statistics/default_all_time_leaders/AllTimeLeadersPTSQuery.html?topic=4&stat=1

Swashcuff
01-10-2011, 03:23 PM
troll

x2

AIRMAR72
01-10-2011, 03:52 PM
CONGRATS TO THE BLACK MAMBA! Must be a surreal feeling passing all of the greats you grew up watching and learning from.
he earn it with all those shots he took over(he never took shot he didnt like) the yrs his career fg% will be AT 43% or 42% when he retires congrats kobe bryant

whitemamba33
01-10-2011, 04:11 PM
Just noticing a fact.. amazing how far up he got with limited games. also MJ has taken 3000 more shots.. which would mean that Kobe would have to shoot a great percentage to take 3000 shots and turn it into 5000 points.. also Kobe has shot more freethrows

Keep in mind that Kobe started in the league when he was 18. He was very much still a project and hadn't tasted any action above the high school level.

Jordan came in older, more prepared, and had competed at the college level.

Of course this is just my opinion, but if Jordan had entered the league at 18, his first couple years in the league wouldn't have been nearly as productive as they actually were.

Bruno
01-10-2011, 06:17 PM
Yea but jordan shot 50% for the most part of his career playing in a tougher era were kobe wouldnt even average 15points TRUST ME on that

Don't worry AIRMAR, I'm embarrassed for you on your behalf.

boozilla
01-10-2011, 06:23 PM
just passed oscar huh.....SO!

Sactown
01-10-2011, 08:20 PM
Keep in mind that Kobe started in the league when he was 18. He was very much still a project and hadn't tasted any action above the high school level.

Jordan came in older, more prepared, and had competed at the college level.

Of course this is just my opinion, but if Jordan had entered the league at 18, his first couple years in the league wouldn't have been nearly as productive as they actually were.

I don't think it matters when you entered.. if you come in at 18 you won't play as many minutes early on meaning your taking less damage to your body.