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View Full Version : Woah... Bargnani this low in the all-star voting?!



CaptainHay
01-06-2011, 05:50 PM
Before you guys yell at me for being "A Bargnani fanboy", Look at the facts here... Yes, he isn't a great rebounder... He isn't the top defender. Hes been hurt 6 of the last 10 games. But... Hes averaging around 21 ppg and 6 rpg.

This guy is a pretty good player, and I feel sorry for him that hes on a bad team and hes underrated. I'm not saying bargs should be top 3 in eastern conf. centers, but top 5 probably...

Shaq and Hibbert this high in the voting annoys me. Hibbert doesn't have great stats, and shaq has terrible stats but people just like him because his IQ is about 56.

Shaqs to-date stats:http://www.nba.com/playerfile/shaquille_oneal/
Hibbert to-date stats:http://www.nba.com/playerfile/roy_hibbert/index.html

Now don't get me wrong, I respect Shaquille, and mildy respect Roy Hibberts growing inside game, but for shaq to have this many votes due to fame is buggy... He has less then half of bargs point input per game, and even averages less rebounds per game. Did I mention Shaq has less than 1 assist per game?

Once again I know Bargnani isn't great... but if he wasn't on the raptors, he would be in the top 5, and if he wasn't on the Raptors, they wouldn't have 10 wins yet...

I'm interested if you guys have any players you know who arn't getting enough credit on the all-star voting.

sep11ie
01-06-2011, 06:00 PM
This just in, NBA All Star Weekend SUCKS.

Flash3
01-06-2011, 06:02 PM
i think your overeating him a bit here, he just isnt an efficient player on either side of the floor.

AddiX
01-06-2011, 06:06 PM
He's a center that doesn't do anything you want a center to do. I've said countless times, I don't know any team could possibly build around this guy.

LakeShowRaider
01-06-2011, 06:06 PM
its cuz his team sux. otherwise his numbers would get him in if he say played for the mavericks. or new york

LanceUpperCut
01-06-2011, 06:11 PM
He's a center that doesn't do anything you want a center to do. I've said countless times, I don't know any team could possibly build around this guy.

Well he's really a PF just plays C. Your right a team might not build around him but that does'nt mean he's not an all-star. Really other than D12 what center could you build around. Maybe Bogat but that doesn't seem to be working.

celtsballa21
01-06-2011, 06:13 PM
He isn't that good. Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court. His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

French totem
01-06-2011, 06:21 PM
stop calling him a center, HE IS NOT A CENTER , ok he is a 7 footer but he plays like a guard rather than a forward !!

Jays Claw
01-06-2011, 06:26 PM
His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

Korman12
01-06-2011, 06:30 PM
A losing team in another country with no other popular players, he won't get casual fan votes.


Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court.

Nope.

NYsFinest
01-06-2011, 06:30 PM
What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

lol you just named the three main qualities you don't want in your big man.

Cubs Win
01-06-2011, 06:33 PM
What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

Those are pretty important when it comes to being a center.

Rego247
01-06-2011, 06:35 PM
He isn't that good. Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court. His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

this is absolute ignorant garbage.

godolphins
01-06-2011, 06:38 PM
a losing team in another country with no other popular players, he won't get casual fan votes.



Nope.

lol

French totem
01-06-2011, 06:38 PM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

Rego247
01-06-2011, 06:43 PM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

he cant play sf, but pf is where he is more suited, i get what ur saying though about his usage. he needs to be paired with a defensive C, so he can shift to pf, we actually almost got tyson chandler last year. once he plays with a legit C, watch out.

haggis
01-06-2011, 06:43 PM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

more like good luck to him trying to guard other SGs and SFs...

Cubs Win
01-06-2011, 06:45 PM
more like good luck to him trying to guard other SGs and SFs...

:nod: I could see him sliding over to PF, but he would have no chance defensively against most SGs and SFs.

Rosh
01-06-2011, 06:45 PM
Bargs isn't that great.

And Shaq is leading because what do people want to see more in a fun All-Star Game? Andreas Bargnani of all people making/missing one shot from three-point land or Shaq's antics? I know which one I'm going with. And I'm usually for talent over show, but in this case, I don't feel too bad. It's not like we're denying Hakeem from making the game. :laugh2:

AddiX
01-06-2011, 06:45 PM
Well he's really a PF just plays C. Your right a team might not build around him but that does'nt mean he's not an all-star. Really other than D12 what center could you build around. Maybe Bogat but that doesn't seem to be working.

Well, that's the problem, he doesn't have any real position. There is no position he can defend, and as a 7 footer he's soft as wet kittens.

I just don't know what the heck you do with him.

Chronz
01-06-2011, 06:47 PM
Please dont speak about what you do not know, your statistical analysis is SEVERELY lacking

Aapox
01-06-2011, 06:47 PM
Poor man's Dirk.

YoungOne
01-06-2011, 06:47 PM
why always so high on stats?

French totem
01-06-2011, 06:51 PM
he is more like rashard lewis than dirk, his coaches seem obssesed to let him learn about being a center, but i think thats alost cause & he should play PF !! for the guy who answered about the luck thing, well if u can play him PF on the defensive side & SF on offence, i dont want to be close to his defender !!

Jamiecballer
01-06-2011, 06:51 PM
Shaq and Hibbert this high in the voting annoys me. Hibbert doesn't have great stats, and shaq has terrible stats but people just like him because his IQ is about 56.


i don't know what to say to you. Hibbert's definitely more all star worthy than Bargnani.

Bargnani is a nice talent but he is not an effective center.

bholly
01-06-2011, 06:52 PM
I would honestly vote all those guys (except maybe Shaq) ahead of Bargnani, too, in terms of how good/productive they are, and how valuable they are to their team.

But the thing is that the All Star game (or at least the starters) isn't about which players are the best, or contribute the most, it's about which are the fan favourites. That's what it's supposed to be. And you can't use stats to argue that.

jimm120
01-06-2011, 06:55 PM
He's a center that doesn't do anything you want a center to do. I've said countless times, I don't know any team could possibly build around this guy.

I'm sure D'Antoni would LOVE to have Bargnani. All D'antoni wants are guys that can shoot the 3. If you can't, you're in an impregnable doghouse...even if you can help the team out in size, scoring, assists, defense, or blocks.

BSplaya2121
01-06-2011, 06:55 PM
stop calling him a center, HE IS NOT A CENTER , ok he is a 7 footer but he plays like a guard rather than a forward !!

If I was a Toronto fan, you should consider yourselves lucky he is considered a center because if he was considered a forward he'd be behind the likes of LeBron James (Heat) 1,194,091
Kevin Garnett (Celtics) 850,687
Amar'e Stoudemire (Knicks) 826,628
Paul Pierce (Celtics) 465,270
Chris Bosh (Heat) 334,921
Josh Smith (Hawks) 225,951
Carlos Boozer (Bulls) 222,431
Danilo Gallinari (Knicks) 168,519
Danny Granger (Pacers) 158,836
Andre Iguodala (76ers) 150,840

rather than.....
Dwight Howard (Magic) 1,205,159
Shaquille O'Neal (Celtics) 506,621
Joakim Noah (Bulls) 197,407
Andrew Bogut (Bucks) 159,560
Al Horford (Hawks) 149,908
Roy Hibbert (Pacers) 133,416
Andrea Bargnani (Raptors) 126,185

so if you want him to be a forward, fine by me.

colinskik
01-06-2011, 06:58 PM
If he were moved to PF and a rugged type center was brought to the team, or if Reggie Evans could come back and learn how to score at least 8 ppg, Bargs wouldn't look as bad out there. As is, he's garbage. Not all star worthy in the least.

Flash3
01-06-2011, 07:00 PM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

imagine him tryna guard wade,lebron, he would get torched night in night out even worse than he is now.

toovey107
01-06-2011, 07:01 PM
What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

:laugh2: The only knock.

Those are 3 huge liabilities.

French totem
01-06-2011, 07:01 PM
imagine him tryna guard wade,lebron, he would get torched night in night out even worse than he is now.

imagine wade or lebron trying to guard him, they would be torched night in night out

nolin
01-06-2011, 07:02 PM
What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

is 47% above average for a center?

ChiSox219
01-06-2011, 07:03 PM
:nod: I could see him sliding over to PF, but he would have no chance defensively against most SGs and SFs.

He can't guard PF's or C's anyway, so what's the difference?

Flash3
01-06-2011, 07:03 PM
this reminded me of galinari i aslo hate his game.

Rego247
01-06-2011, 07:04 PM
If he were moved to PF and a rugged type center was brought to the team, or if Reggie Evans could come back and learn how to score at least 8 ppg, Bargs wouldn't look as bad out there. As is, he's garbage. Not all star worthy in the least.

i understand how u can say hes not all star worthy, but i dont understand how he is "garbage".

ChiSox219
01-06-2011, 07:04 PM
is 47% above average for a center?

No,

50.2% is the average FG% for Centers this year.

That number rises if you limit the average to Centers that have played rotation minutes

DwayneMVPwade
01-06-2011, 07:05 PM
He isn't that good. Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court. His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

Do you watch Basketball? Bargs is 50 times better player than Brian Scalabrine.

Problemchild
01-06-2011, 07:08 PM
Ummmm if he can just get his rebounding up to 10 a game, when's he's a free agent he might also be the best power forward in the league...... LMAO (For god's sake he's on the raptors)

Mplsman
01-06-2011, 07:11 PM
I don't see how this is shocking at all. Barg is way overrated.

NastyNas
01-06-2011, 07:13 PM
stop calling him a center, HE IS NOT A CENTER , ok he is a 7 footer but he plays like a guard rather than a forward !!

okay so are you saying that any player with a skill set that doesnt pertain to their position is not that position. Soo Lebron is a point guard, Kevin Durant is a Shooting guard or any player that can post up is a center

nolin
01-06-2011, 07:13 PM
5
No,

50.2% is the average FG% for Centers this year.

That number rises if you limit the average to Centers that have played rotation minutes

thanks i thought it had to be higher then 47%

BKLYNNYRNYKNYY
01-06-2011, 07:16 PM
.. fanboy

mjt20mik
01-06-2011, 07:16 PM
He's not there yet. He's been steadily improving, but still has many facets of his game to work on.

masalex1205
01-06-2011, 07:21 PM
What is that supposed to mean? He's averaging 21.4 ppg on 47% FG, which is well above-average. The only knock on the guy is that he's inefficient, can't rebound, nor play defense.

But you can't win if your big guys don't do those things

Flash3
01-06-2011, 07:23 PM
you guys saying "he's garbage" aren't very intelligent, he has alot of deficiencies but he's far from "garbage"

Rego247
01-06-2011, 07:26 PM
you guys saying "he's garbage" aren't very intelligent, he has alot of deficiencies but he's far from "garbage"

this.

i guess if ur not all star worthy, ur automatically garbage.

PHX2daDEATH
01-06-2011, 07:33 PM
if Chris Bosh couldn't get on TV in Toronto what makes you think Bargs is going to make the friggin all-star team playing there..Shaq 4 rings, more then a dozen All-star appearances..this could be his last year of course he is going to be on that team...and Hibbert..his team is actually in playoff contention..i dont know enough about Bargs to critizice his game..he always played well against the Suns though..but 6 rebounds a game for a 7'0 footer is below average

Sadds The Gr8
01-06-2011, 07:43 PM
lol Bargnani got ****in raped in this thread

blastmasta26
01-06-2011, 07:45 PM
Bargnani's a good player, but not All-Star worthy. His PPG is good, but not enough to compensate for the other weaknesses of his game. Plus the Raptors are a losing team, which hurts his case.

Badluck33
01-06-2011, 07:52 PM
over rated (thump thump thump-thump-thump) over rated

NetsPaint
01-06-2011, 07:54 PM
If Bosh was healthy enough last year do you think the Raptors would have done a lot better with those two, or is Bargnani being their top guy now the only reason you think he's playing this well?

Flash3
01-06-2011, 07:55 PM
if Chris Bosh couldn't get on TV in Toronto what makes you think Bargs is going to make the friggin all-star team playing there..Shaq 4 rings, more then a dozen All-star appearances..this could be his last year of course he is going to be on that team...and Hibbert..his team is actually in playoff contention..i dont know enough about Bargs to critizice his game..he always played well against the Suns though..but 6 rebounds a game for a 7'0 footer is below average

what does that have to do with anything ?

and yeah he's pretty lame on the boards.

Flash3
01-06-2011, 07:57 PM
over rated (thump thump thump-thump-thump) over rated

no one is voting for him, and many guys in this thread said he isnt very good so i dont know where this is coming from.

Sadds The Gr8
01-06-2011, 07:57 PM
over rated (thump thump thump-thump-thump) over rated

how can bargnani be overrated? he's never talked about by analysts, and the PSD community rapes him everytime he's mentioned.

CaptainHay
01-06-2011, 08:36 PM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

Lol you know nothing about the Raptors... They have tried him as a SF when there was the triple big 3 years ago in Jermaine, Chris Bosh, and Andrea, they played Oneal as center, Bosh PF, bargs SF. he struggled

Jays Claw
01-06-2011, 08:38 PM
lol you just named the three main qualities you don't want in your big man.


:laugh2: The only knock.

Those are 3 huge liabilities.

I'm sorry, but since when was the All-Star game about those three qualities? Since when was the All-Star game ever important in terms of winning? Viewers want to see scoring, fancy dunks and stupid antics. Bargnani surely can score, no?


Those are pretty important when it comes to being a center.

He's not a center, but a power forward. The reason why he's playing center is because Johnson, Davis, Dorsey and Solomon would do much worse on both ends of the floor, which we don't want.


But the thing is that the All Star game (or at least the starters) isn't about which players are the best, or contribute the most, it's about which are the fan favourites.

You're absolutely right and that's why I'll rest my case. Bargnani got snubbed (or atleast is getting snubbed) because he plays for the Raptors, isn't much of a star, and the fans/coaches would much rather watch the players with more personality and/or star power.


is 47% above average for a center?

Factor in his style of play, not his position. For a jump shooting big man with little to no post-up game, a 47% FGP is terrific.


But you can't win if your big guys don't do those things

Again, the All-Star game isn't about winning or losing. It's not like the MLB where the winning conference gains home court advantage.

However, I'll answer your question in relation to the Raptors. The Raptors' poor interior defense is mainly based on Bargnani's poor overall defense. He's soft and still doesn't know to rebound despite his size, length and athleticism, which is sad to say the least. However, the kid is only 25 years-old and will improve and mature in the years to come.

CaptainHay
01-06-2011, 08:46 PM
I agree with you Jays Claw. Especially the bit about him being a PF because all the other bigs are undersized even to be PF's in some cases. Im quite sure if another 7 footer came to town, Bargs would be shifted to PF.

GeekInThePink
01-06-2011, 08:58 PM
how can bargnani be overrated? he's never talked about by analysts, and the PSD community rapes him everytime he's mentioned.

This.

It seems like everyone just wants to hate him, he's a unique player who is also playing out of position at center, and yes a few aspects of his game aren't perfect, but people shouldn't crap on him so much, until they actually watch him play instead of just looking at stats and calling him garbage.

dtmagnet
01-06-2011, 09:01 PM
i think your overeating him a bit here, he just isnt an efficient player on either side of the floor.

And I think you don't know a single thing about him, so why even comment about him? You're clearly wrong.

Revolu7i9n
01-06-2011, 09:08 PM
on another note: how do you spell whoa? is it woah? whoa? woa? waho? hmm...

oh, bargnani isn't an all-star. let's get with it.

Revolu7i9n
01-06-2011, 09:09 PM
on another note: how do you spell whoa? is it woah? whoa? woa? waho? hmm...

oh, and bargnani isn't an all-star. let's get with it.

Flash3
01-06-2011, 09:20 PM
And I think you don't know a single thing about him, so why even comment about him? You're clearly wrong.

your saying for a center he's efficient on both ends ? i don't need to watch him to know and from what i've seen he takes alot of low percentage shot.

Kinglorious
01-06-2011, 10:01 PM
He isn't that good. Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court. His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

Potentially the dumbest post I have ever seen in my short time on PSD. Congratulations - well done. :clap: ( :facepalm: )

geraptor
01-06-2011, 10:03 PM
your saying for a center he's efficient on both ends ? i don't need to watch him to know and from what i've seen he takes alot of low percentage shot.

he takes the same shots bosh did last year

John Walls Era
01-06-2011, 11:38 PM
He isn't that good. Brian Scalibrine can play better on both sides of the court. His PPG do not impress me seeing as he is on the RAPTORS.

This is a terrible post.

Rosh
01-06-2011, 11:43 PM
on another note: how do you spell whoa? is it woah? whoa? woa? waho? hmm...

oh, bargnani isn't an all-star. let's get with it.


"Whoa".

goose15
01-06-2011, 11:52 PM
I like Bargnani but the guy is a 7 foot SG

Chronz
01-06-2011, 11:58 PM
I'm sorry, but since when was the All-Star game about those three qualities?
Since the beginning of time


Since when was the All-Star game ever important in terms of winning?
Its a simple rule, if your not winning you better have gaudy stats, which he doesnt.


Viewers want to see scoring, fancy dunks and stupid antics. Bargnani surely can score, no?

Viewers only choose 1 Center (2PFs), the coaches are the ones that care about value and impact.


Factor in his style of play, not his position. For a jump shooting big man with little to no post-up game, a 47% FGP is terrific.

Hes still not efficient, for a jumpshooting big to have such a high turnover% is putrid. Besides there is nothing honorable about a player revolving his game around the least efficient spots on the floor.



Again, the All-Star game isn't about winning or losing. It's not like the MLB where the winning conference gains home court advantage.

However, I'll answer your question in relation to the Raptors. The Raptors' poor interior defense is mainly based on Bargnani's poor overall defense. He's soft and still doesn't know to rebound despite his size, length and athleticism, which is sad to say the least. However, the kid is only 25 years-old and will improve and mature in the years to come.Not likely, since when do people ever learn how to rebound? If he hasnt by now, its best to move on.

iliketurtles24
01-07-2011, 12:00 AM
on another note: how do you spell whoa? is it woah? whoa? woa? waho? hmm...

oh, bargnani isn't an all-star. let's get with it.


idk and the bulls suck and the packers suck, minny is better,

but klove is underrated and wont make the all star team either sooo, and imo is better than bargnani


jk kidding about the packers though

Phenomenonsense
01-07-2011, 12:10 AM
Well he's really a PF just plays C. Your right a team might not build around him but that does'nt mean he's not an all-star. Really other than D12 what center could you build around. Maybe Bogat but that doesn't seem to be working.

Wouldn't build around him at all. Cousins, Monroe, Jordan, all far better Centers than a Dirk wannabe is. Give me a C that puts everything into rebounding over lackluster defense and a 3pt shot. I wouldn't build around someone like Charlie V, and I wouldn't do it for Bargnani.

LanceUpperCut
01-07-2011, 12:19 AM
Wouldn't build around him at all. Cousins, Monroe, Jordan, all far better Centers than a Dirk wannabe is. Give me a C that puts everything into rebounding over lackluster defense and a 3pt shot. I wouldn't build around someone like Charlie V, and I wouldn't do it for Bargnani.

Well thank god your not a GM. You make being a Dirk wannabe sound like a bad thing. Jordan far better, I should of stopped there but unfortunately I never.

ChiSox219
01-07-2011, 12:25 AM
Well thank god your not a GM. You make being a Dirk wannabe sound like a bad thing. Jordan far better, I should of stopped there but unfortunately I never.

Not sure if you've DeAndre Jordan play but he's certainly looked good this year and has a lot more upside than Bargnani.

LanceUpperCut
01-07-2011, 12:42 AM
Not sure if you've DeAndre Jordan play but he's certainly looked good this year and has a lot more upside than Bargnani.

I have seen foot some air balls and I see there record with Gordon and Blake on there team. You put Jordan on the raptors and take away Bargnani there not a better team to me thats pretty obvious. Some guys are stuck on there opinion so to me it doesn't mean ****, Bargnani can be nearly unstoppable at times on the offence but because he needs work on rebounding he's garbage.

ChiSox219
01-07-2011, 12:47 AM
I have seen foot some air balls and I see there record with Gordon and Blake on there team. You put Jordan on the raptors and take away Bargnani there not a better team to me thats pretty obvious. Some guys are stuck on there opinion so to me it doesn't mean ****, Bargnani can be nearly unstoppable at times on the offence but because he needs work on rebounding he's garbage.

I agree, Bargnani can have explosive offensive efforts and he's fun to watch on that end of the court. However, his rebounding and more importantly, his defense, outweigh his offense.

The game is still played on both ends of the floor.

John Walls Era
01-07-2011, 12:49 AM
Not sure if you've DeAndre Jordan play but he's certainly looked good this year and has a lot more upside than Bargnani.

I can assure you that no one would rather have DeAndre than Bargnani. No one meaning GMs.

ChiSox219
01-07-2011, 12:53 AM
I can assure you that no one would rather have DeAndre than Bargnani. No one meaning GMs.

No, you cannot.

LanceUpperCut
01-07-2011, 12:54 AM
I agree, Bargnani can have explosive offensive efforts and he's fun to watch on that end of the court. However, his rebounding and more importantly, his defense, outweigh his offense.

The game is still played on both ends of the floor.

Your right it's played at both end but his D isn't near as bad as you say ,it's not great but according to people on PSD theres no middle ground a NBA player is either horrible or outstanding on D. Bargnani is average man to man and below average on help D but is getting better.

daleja424
01-07-2011, 12:54 AM
I can assure you that no one would rather have DeAndre than Bargnani. No one meaning GMs.

I would MUCH RATHER have Deandre than Bargnani.

ChiSox219
01-07-2011, 12:58 AM
Your right it's played at both end but his D isn't near as bad as you say ,it's not great but according to people on PSD theres no middle ground a NBA player is either horrible or outstanding on D. Bargnani is average man to man and below average on help D but is getting better.

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/forums/showpost.php?p=16189301&postcount=8

He's horrible.

LanceUpperCut
01-07-2011, 12:59 AM
I would MUCH RATHER have Deandre than Bargnani.

Would you much rather have Deandre then Bosh?

daleja424
01-07-2011, 01:00 AM
Your right it's played at both end but his D isn't near as bad as you say ,it's not great but according to people on PSD theres no middle ground a NBA player is either horrible or outstanding on D. Bargnani is average man to man and below average on help D but is getting better.

He is a -7 per 100 possesions. That is bad!

compare that to any of the other people on the allstar list:
Garnett +19
Amare +2
Bosh +15
Smith +6
Pierce +17
Boozer +10

daleja424
01-07-2011, 01:02 AM
Would you much rather have Deandre then Bosh?

not a chance...

Bargnani is not even remotely close to Bosh's level though...

Phenomenonsense
01-07-2011, 01:02 AM
Well thank god your not a GM. You make being a Dirk wannabe sound like a bad thing. Jordan far better, I should of stopped there but unfortunately I never.

Did you even say anything there? Monroe is a rebounding machine, he's a smart player that will develop a lot, Cousins is obviously talented, Jordan has been playing very well next to Griffin, just getting rebounds and like 13 blocks in two games. Anyway, I can understand if you don't know what I meant when I said Dirk wannabe, that's an insult and says that he will never be the center version of Dirk. If it were a compliment it would be Dirk 2.0, someone with the potential of Donatas Motiejunas.

0nekhmer
01-07-2011, 01:10 AM
1. Bargs offensive stats only LOOK inefficient, but when he's the #1 option, who shoots the ball a LOT. you're FG% isn't going to be as high as a guy who lives in the paint.
2. Bargs is the leading scorer among C's in the East
3. I can admit he's not a natural rebounder, but the guy lives in the high post.

daleja424
01-07-2011, 01:17 AM
1. Bargs offensive stats only LOOK inefficient, but when he's the #1 option, who shoots the ball a LOT. you're FG% isn't going to be as high as a guy who lives in the paint.
2. Bargs is the leading scorer among C's in the East
3. I can admit he's not a natural rebounder, but the guy lives in the high post.

1. NO, he IS INEFFICIENT. Somehow Bosh managed to shoot 52% last year as number one option for the team :eyebrow: (Or look at the person everyone wants to compare him to...Dirk... Dirk is shooting 54.5% this year)

2. Again look at the efficiency. His offensive rating is 105. There are TWELVE people ON HIS TEAM that have a better offensive rating.

3. He is a TERRIBLE rebounder and defender.

Rosh
01-07-2011, 01:56 AM
I'm not sure why Bargnani not making the All-Star Game is causing all this fuss. He's not that good, and just because he's arguably the best player on a team doesn't mean anything. Unfortunately for Bargnani fans, this isn't the MLB where every team gets a rep.

Rego247
01-07-2011, 01:59 AM
I would MUCH RATHER have Deandre than Bargnani.

good for you.

different teams have different needs.

daleja424
01-07-2011, 02:01 AM
admittedly, that is coming from the perspective of a team that could use a rebounder, shot blocker, and finisher...

Chronz
01-07-2011, 02:16 AM
good for you.

different teams have different needs.

Thing is, every team needs rebounding and defense from their bigs. While Bargs has a unique scoring ability its for sure he wont be bringing the D and Rebounding. Id much rather take the chance on DeAndre developing an offensive game and live with his superior off the ball performance than take a guy who I know wont ever become a dominant defender/rebounder.

Ill admit Bargs might be better but DA has DPOY potential

daleja424
01-07-2011, 02:22 AM
Thing is, every team needs rebounding and defense from their bigs. While Bargs has a unique scoring ability its for sure he wont be bringing the D and Rebounding. Id much rather take the chance on DeAndre developing an offensive game and live with his superior off the ball performance than take a guy who I know wont ever become a dominant defender/rebounder.

Ill admit Bargs might be better but DA has DPOY potential

yup. I think most teams would agree with this.

NYYCowboys
01-07-2011, 02:23 AM
I tend to like Bargs because he's a fellow Italian, but I think he's probably somewhere in the middle of the original poster's view of him, and all of his detractors. I agree 100% that in no way should a team try to build around him, but right now he's the #1 guy in Toronto with basically no help at all. He may not do what you would want the ideal center to do, but he also brings a couple extra dimensions you wouldn't find in the typical center including his outside shot, and versatility. I think on a good team where he is the 2nd or 3rd option he would be a very good player.

TheHebrewHammer
01-07-2011, 02:52 AM
1. NO, he IS INEFFICIENT. Somehow Bosh managed to shoot 52% last year as number one option for the team :eyebrow: (Or look at the person everyone wants to compare him to...Dirk... Dirk is shooting 54.5% this year)

2. Again look at the efficiency. His offensive rating is 105. There are TWELVE people ON HIS TEAM that have a better offensive rating.

To be fair... i think alot of his offensive inefficiency in the beginning of the year had to do with adjusting to being the number one option

and having the completely useless offensive player that is Reggie Evans sharing the front court with him making double teaming him any time in the post a no brainer proposition.

He's been significantly more efficient on the offensive end paired with Amir Johnson anytime rather than with Reggie if u look at the 5-man unit stats.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10TOR16.HTM#bypos

ramansingh3
01-07-2011, 04:11 AM
Yea Bargnani doesn't deserve to get that many votes but McGrady(2007), Iverson(2010) and Yao Ming deserve to start in the all-star game. It's a fan's game so fans pick who they want to play in it. The only real players picked for their performance are the reserves.

Eagles4Lyfe
01-07-2011, 08:50 PM
Thing is, every team needs rebounding and defense from their bigs. While Bargs has a unique scoring ability its for sure he wont be bringing the D and Rebounding. Id much rather take the chance on DeAndre developing an offensive game and live with his superior off the ball performance than take a guy who I know wont ever become a dominant defender/rebounder.

Ill admit Bargs might be better but DA has DPOY potential

Not every team we dont because we have guys who come in and get boards for us..Just because our C isn't getting boards doesn't mean were a horrible rebounding team..Were 19th in the league in rebounding and before reggie evans got hurt we were dominating teams on the boards night in and night out..
Second your right bargnani in the last 2 or 3 years hasn't shown any improvements of rebounding at all absolutely no clue whatsoever...
Third when DeAndre Jordan learns how to raise his abysmal free throw percentage which affects teams from having him in down the stretch as a liability then come to us about developing. Better yet i can bet for sure he'll never establish a range that bargs has... This dude's offensive game will NEVER be around the level bargnani's around..
Lastly bargnani's defense has improved drastically from when he first came in the league this is his fifth year in the league and this is jordans third year in the league..So quit acting like bargnani still doesn't have any room to grow and improve in fact he can improve his defense more easily than jordan can get an offensive game
I agree he's not an all star yet but the stupid hate on him is a joke, he's one of the best ball handling big men in the game with unlimited range..
Edit: DeAndre Jordan isn't even a good defender man to man he gets beaten to often or that what i remember last year when he kept getting abused by bosh

Flash3
01-07-2011, 09:19 PM
ed davis > bargs by next year i always said davis was one of the biggest steals and top 3 pf in the draft.


and to some raptors fans, deandre jordan is playing really well and i would take him over bargnani

BrettFarve0
01-07-2011, 09:20 PM
Why not just trade Big B and get a prospect who is worth building around? Adrea seems to be more difficult to build around than Bosh. As such, his shot-selection isn't improving, and he doesn't insert himself as mush as the team would like. To be honest, who is the leading walk-on for that team? Bayless? Derozen? Who? Davis?

Flash3
01-07-2011, 09:22 PM
Why not just trade Big B and get a prospect who is worth building around? Adrea seems to be more difficult to build around than Bosh. As such, his shot-selection isn't improving, and he doesn't insert himself as mush as the team would like. To be honest, who is the guy on that team? Bayless? Derozen? Who? Davis?

i don't think they're building around bargnani atleast not in the same effort they were with bosh.

Eagles4Lyfe
01-07-2011, 09:38 PM
once referees stop being biased derozans the next big stud

Eagles4Lyfe
01-07-2011, 09:39 PM
ed davis > bargs by next year i always said davis was one of the biggest steals and top 3 pf in the draft.


and to some raptors fans, deandre jordan is playing really well and i would take him over bargnani

We knew all along hed be a steal i mean a consensus number 2 during the whole season then an injury made him slip now hes fine he'll be beast

LakersMaster24
01-07-2011, 09:53 PM
Not sure if fans want to see, a jumpshooting bigman...I rather have players that make the game exciting with dunks, and difficult shots (Lebron, Kobe, Durant, Dwight) but not really wide open jumpshots...

I dont even consider Bargnani a Top 5 Center...

Dwight
Noah
Bogut
Bynum
Perkins

Eagles4Lyfe
01-07-2011, 09:57 PM
Not sure if fans want to see, a jumpshooting bigman...I rather have players that make the game exciting with dunks, and difficult shots (Lebron, Kobe, Durant, Dwight) but not really wide open jumpshots...

I dont even consider Bargnani a Top 5 Center...

Dwight
Noah
Bogut
Bynum
Perkins

People seriously need to stop judging people without watching them play seriously its a joke, dont post unless you have visual evidence of anything..
Clearly with your statement you show you haven't watched bargs at all, he makes the most difficult shots that is hard to imagine a big man doing and hes postered guys and made nice dunks this year..

Phenomenonsense
01-07-2011, 10:12 PM
We knew all along hed be a steal i mean a consensus number 2 during the whole season then an injury made him slip now hes fine he'll be beast

Your sig is funny because it seems a lot like you.

Phenomenonsense
01-07-2011, 10:13 PM
People seriously need to stop judging people without watching them play seriously its a joke, dont post unless you have visual evidence of anything..
Clearly with your statement you show you haven't watched bargs at all, he makes the most difficult shots that is hard to imagine a big man doing and hes postered guys and made nice dunks this year..

And what the hell do you mean don't post unless you have visual evidence? You haven't seen DJ at all this year as you admitted. He's improved leaps and bounds.

Eagles4Lyfe
01-07-2011, 10:24 PM
Your sig is funny because it seems a lot like you.
very hilarious im going to guess your a butthurt giants fan..

And what the hell do you mean don't post unless you have visual evidence? You haven't seen DJ at all this year as you admitted. He's improved leaps and bounds.

Visual evidence as in watching him play, it was pretty dumb to say bargnani doesn't do any amazing plays or tough shots when he practically does every game..
Ya i have i've seen DeAndre Jordan enough to notice that he's not a starter yet and his team had no faith in his developement that they had to be in the market for big men each year..Camby, Kaman now blake but cant really blame the griffen pick a consensus number 1 cant pass that up..

aman_13
01-08-2011, 03:24 AM
lmao im not a big Bargs fan but come on, Bargs is a better player than Deandre Jordan.

aman_13
01-08-2011, 03:26 AM
Not sure if fans want to see, a jumpshooting bigman...I rather have players that make the game exciting with dunks, and difficult shots (Lebron, Kobe, Durant, Dwight) but not really wide open jumpshots...

I dont even consider Bargnani a Top 5 Center...

Dwight
Noah
Bogut
Bynum
Perkins

Bargs is not a center, thats the problem with him. He's playing out of position. His statistics look better when compared to other pfs. As a center, he is horrible.

Sadds The Gr8
01-08-2011, 03:50 AM
lmao im not a big Bargs fan but come on, Bargs is a better player than Deandre Jordan.

yea exactly....that comparison is pretty ridiculous. Deandre does things the typical center should do but he's not better than Bargnani...this is coming from a person who was never a Bargs fan either.

DetroitBadBoy
01-08-2011, 03:59 AM
thats why the raps coach is dumb to me, he should play him as a SF or a SG not as a center, good luck guarding him as a SF !! he is not a center & a smart coach would play him where he is the more efficeient & not based on his height, being a 7 footer means crap if you can run like he does !

hahaha Barg at sg, thats a new one. :facepalm:

JayW_1023
01-08-2011, 09:50 AM
He scores well, but since he gives up alot of fgs with his pourous D, it's pretty well justified he is this low.

Even a rubber ducky could outrebound him.

hugepatsfan
01-08-2011, 10:12 AM
He scores well, but since he gives up alot of fgs with his pourous D, it's pretty well justified he is this low.

Even a rubber ducky could outrebound him.

lol

gwrighter
01-08-2011, 01:45 PM
Regardless of bargnani's shortcomings he is still top 3-5 best 1 on 1 centres in the NBA. You would be hard pressed to find a C that could beat him at a game of 1 on 1. granted the NBA is not a 1 on 1 league and there are other facets of the game that he is not polished at but to be as low as he is in All-Star voting is not reflective of his overall skill level and performance. For a game that is so offensively focused such as the all-star game, you would think that people would vote in bargnani to see him cross some ppl up and cash treys but that clearly is not the case. Mix in the Homerism that is the all-star voting and you get guys like Bogut, Hibbert, and Noah that are respectable centres in there own right but probably not All-Star worthy offensive players ahead of bargs. The general lack of US exposure and analysis that the raptors receive is apparent in the all-star voting and reflective of bargnani's current position among East C's.

Bob_at_york
01-08-2011, 01:48 PM
Why not just trade Big B and get a prospect who is worth building around? Adrea seems to be more difficult to build around than Bosh.
What makes him more difficult to build around? Is it his D?


As such, his shot-selection isn't improving, and he doesn't insert himself as mush as the team would like.
I think you men "assert" and you are totally wrong. He does assert himself, the team just doesn't get him the ball. The coach has called timeouts numerous times this season to remind people to feed Andrea and not look off him.