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dnewguy
12-15-2010, 11:35 PM
After seeing what the Knicks and Bulls are capable of doing, is it time to reshuffle the top teams in the East?

Name your top 5 East teams.

Mine.

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

Chacarron
12-15-2010, 11:37 PM
1. Boston
2. Orlando
3. Miami
4. Chicago
5. New York

Gators123
12-15-2010, 11:40 PM
1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

The Dream
12-15-2010, 11:41 PM
heat
celtics
knicks
magic
bulls

DoMeFavors
12-15-2010, 11:42 PM
1. Nets
2. Celtics
3. Heat
4. Hawks
5. Magic

Duncan = Donkey
12-15-2010, 11:42 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
New York

slynxpac
12-15-2010, 11:44 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
New York

Cano4prez
12-15-2010, 11:46 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
New York

Slimsim
12-15-2010, 11:50 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
New York

Ditto

bholly
12-15-2010, 11:50 PM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Hawks

Dodgers99
12-15-2010, 11:51 PM
boston
miami
orlando
chicago
new york

+1.

Hustla23
12-15-2010, 11:52 PM
New York






Boston
Orlando
Atlanta
Indiana

sargon21
12-15-2010, 11:53 PM
So is healthy knicks better than healthy hawks? I don't think so.. not hating, but Atlanta has been a 48+ win team for a long time.

J_M_B
12-15-2010, 11:55 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
New York

bal_ravens
12-15-2010, 11:56 PM
^ But they arent healthy, so as of right now, the Knicks are better.

Celtics
Magic
Heat


Knicks
Bulls

Sixerlover
12-15-2010, 11:57 PM
Philadelphia

:yawn:


Boston
Miami
Chicago
Orlando

Knicks21
12-15-2010, 11:58 PM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

Supreme LA
12-15-2010, 11:59 PM
1. Boston
2. Orlando
3. Chicago
4. New York Knicks
5. Miami

29$JerZ
12-16-2010, 12:01 AM
It's

Boston
Orlando
Miami
Chicago
New York

Every team is dealing with injuries
Boston misses its Centers
Miami misses Miller/Haslem
NY really needs a C/backup SG but Eddy is out again as is Kelenna
Chicago will miss Noah for 2 months
I think Orlando also had Jameer/Pietrus with illnesses

EaglesJackson10
12-16-2010, 12:03 AM
Sixers obviously aren't top 5 and might not ever be this season. But look out for them. They've won 7 of their last 9. Including a 1 point loss to the Celtics and a tough loss in Atlanta where they gave the game away at the end. Easily could have been a 9 game winning streak after starting extremely poorly.

RangersMets
12-16-2010, 12:04 AM
Celts
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Hawks/Knicks

Seems to be the concensus

sargon21
12-16-2010, 12:05 AM
If healthy:

Boston
Miami
Chicago
Orlando
Hawks
Knicks

Right now:

Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
Knicks
Hawks

sargon21
12-16-2010, 12:05 AM
Sixers obviously aren't top 5 and might not ever be this season. But look out for them. They've won 7 of their last 9. Including a 1 point loss to the Celtics and a tough loss in Atlanta where they gave the game away at the end. Easily could have been a 9 game winning streak after starting extremely poorly.

Watched yesterday's game, good ****.

Sixerlover
12-16-2010, 12:07 AM
Sixers obviously aren't top 5 and might not ever be this season. But look out for them. They've won 7 of their last 9. Including a 1 point loss to the Celtics and a tough loss in Atlanta where they gave the game away at the end. Easily could have been a 9 game winning streak after starting extremely poorly.

Truth, it sucks because we should have a 9 gamer, but it's only 7-2. Doug Collins is doing an incredible job

Evolution23
12-16-2010, 12:09 AM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

LA_Raiders
12-16-2010, 12:36 AM
1-Boston
2-Orlando
3-Chicago
4-Miami
5-NY

JordansBulls
12-16-2010, 12:42 AM
1. Boston
2. Miami
3. Chicago
4. Orlando
5. Atlanta
6. NY

http://espn.go.com/nba/standings?group=2

Team*Chicago
12-16-2010, 02:04 AM
1.Bulls


2.Celtics
3.Heat
4.Magic
5.Hawks

Avenged
12-16-2010, 02:27 AM
The Knicks are at the bottom of the best teams out East for me..

Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

I really hope both the Bulls and Knicks give the Celtics, Heat, or/and Magic some major trouble in the playoffs if/when they meet.

JB0B0
12-16-2010, 02:45 AM
Celtics
Heat
Bulls (healthy)
Knicks
Magic

thekmp211
12-16-2010, 03:01 AM
bulls take a hit with noah out, ill notch them down to 5/6.

not sold, yet, that the knicks are really a better team than the hawks. they look good now, but let's see what happens.

J4KOP99
12-16-2010, 03:01 AM
1. Celtics

2a. Orlando
2b. Miami

4. Chicago: when completely healthy
5. Atlanta: if healthy
6. NY: until they get a big man to play alongside Amare. Forget Carmelo for now

NYYCowboys
12-16-2010, 03:20 AM
Right Now:

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

If Melo is traded to the Knicks:

1. Heat
2. Celtics
3. Knicks
4. Magic
5. Bulls

John Walls Era
12-16-2010, 03:21 AM
Boston Celtics
Miami Heat
Orlando Magic
Chicago Bulls


Atlanta Hawks

beasted86
12-16-2010, 03:24 AM
1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Bulls
5. Hawks

PurpleJesus28
12-16-2010, 03:25 AM
celtics
orlando
heat
bulls
knicks

Voodoo Alchemy
12-16-2010, 03:36 AM
boston
celtics
beantown
the hub
cradle of modern america

ellesmeire
12-16-2010, 03:41 AM
If healthy:

Boston
Miami
Chicago
Orlando
Hawks
Knicks

Right now:

Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago
Knicks
Hawks

this

mikedesi1004
12-16-2010, 04:04 AM
1)boston
2)miami
3)orlando
4)chicago
5)new york

Baller1
12-16-2010, 05:54 AM
Tier 1:
Boston
Miami

Tier 2:
Orlando

Tier 3:
New York
Chicago
Atlanta

Supreme LA
12-16-2010, 06:02 AM
Right Now:

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

If Melo is traded to the Knicks:

1. Heat
2. Celtics
3. Knicks
4. Magic
5. Bulls

What does Melo going to the Knicks have to do with putting the Heat over the Celtics???

If the Knicks land Melo they will be better than Miami and Orlando but the Celtics will still remain #1 in the East.

effen5
12-16-2010, 10:06 AM
1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Bulls
5. Hawks

I agree with this but my god the Knicks are ****in scary....but I still want to see more out of them against good teams....almost took out the C's which is very impressive.


Not gonna lie, I am very impressed with the Knicks this year, Knick fans should be happy again that they are finally going to make the playoffs this year!

HOZ THE KNICK
12-16-2010, 10:13 AM
boston
miami
chicago
orlando
knicks/ hawks

goose15
12-16-2010, 10:47 AM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

D Roses Bulls
12-16-2010, 10:48 AM
After seeing what the Knicks and Bulls are capable of doing, is it time to reshuffle the top teams in the East?

Name your top 5 East teams.

Mine.

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

Knicks over Bulls? :facepalm:

I mean knicks are good, but come on

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 10:51 AM
I have been reading all the posts for years now and I kind of laugh at the amount of homerism in everyones posts. The If Healthy arguement does not matter because wins are not predicated on if healthy spreads.

Realistically speaking teams are hurt right now. A lot of them are hurt and thats going to effect the standings.

TOP 5 TEAMS right now in the east

CELTICS
HEAT
KNICKS
MAGIC
HAWKS/BULLS

You cant rate Bulls in the top 5 anymore because they lost Noah for 8 weeks with hand surgery.

Magic have been on a real slide as of late with stomach viruses and such but they will get back to form so in a month I think they will reclaim the three spot. Hawks are without Joe Johnson. HAWKS = BULLS right now because of the injuries.

Miami's ceiling can only be number two because the Celtics have the sweep.

Logic is pretty simple here

CELTICS
HEAT
KNICKS
MAGIC
HAWKS/BULLS

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:00 AM
Knicks over Bulls? :facepalm:

I mean knicks are good, but come on

D Rose I have read your posts a lot and I like the posts more that you write about other teams and less about your own or Derrick Rose.

The Bulls arent better then the Knicks. The Bulls lost to them in their matchup already and the excuse was Boozer is out. They are going to play again in like a week and Noah is injured for 8 weeks. Your team is injury riddled and its going to cost the place in the standings.

Bulls are a good team but the if Healthy arguement a lot of people use for the Bulls and the Hawks are meaningless because they arent healthy!

We have already seen the Hawks ceiling. They have no more room for improvement and Johnsons contract insured that they cant get any better without trading other assets like Crawford or Smith.

Maybe if the Bulls can get healthy they can surpass the hawks but other than that I dont see them cracking the top 4 spots in the east based on Pure record. Obviously they will have a higher spot because they are in a weak division but record wise they wont crack the top 4 by seasons end.

Furymaker
12-16-2010, 11:07 AM
D Rose I have read your posts a lot and I like the posts more that you write about other teams and less about your own or Derrick Rose.

The Bulls arent better then the Knicks. The Bulls lost to them in their matchup already and the excuse was Boozer is out. They are going to play again in like a week and Noah is injured for 8 weeks. Your team is injury riddled and its going to cost the place in the standings.

Bulls are a good team but the if Healthy arguement a lot of people use for the Bulls and the Hawks are meaningless because they arent healthy!

We have already seen the Hawks ceiling. They have no more room for improvement and Johnsons contract insured that they cant get any better without trading other assets like Crawford or Smith.

Maybe if the Bulls can get healthy they can surpass the hawks but other than that I dont see them cracking the top 4 spots in the east based on Pure record. Obviously they will have a higher spot because they are in a weak division but record wise they wont crack the top 4 by seasons end.

bulls lost to knicks cuz they were without Boozer , but still they sticked with them fairly , and knicks were shooting 72% from downtown - and that my friend is happening only once in a season .
And Bulls defense is far more better than last time , you'll be surprised when bulls beat knicks later this month .

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:20 AM
D Rose I have read your posts a lot and I like the posts more that you write about other teams and less about your own or Derrick Rose.

The Bulls arent better then the Knicks. The Bulls lost to them in their matchup already and the excuse was Boozer is out. They are going to play again in like a week and Noah is injured for 8 weeks. Your team is injury riddled and its going to cost the place in the standings.

Bulls are a good team but the if Healthy arguement a lot of people use for the Bulls and the Hawks are meaningless because they arent healthy!

We have already seen the Hawks ceiling. They have no more room for improvement and Johnsons contract insured that they cant get any better without trading other assets like Crawford or Smith.

Maybe if the Bulls can get healthy they can surpass the hawks but other than that I dont see them cracking the top 4 spots in the east based on Pure record. Obviously they will have a higher spot because they are in a weak division but record wise they wont crack the top 4 by seasons end.

:facepalm: The Bulls are 16-8 the Knicks are 16-10. The Bulls have played without Boozer, who by the way is a better player than Noah. The Bulls have also played a much tougher schedule than the Knicks.

jtsunami
12-16-2010, 11:20 AM
Idk how anyone can consider the Magic 2 or 3. They don't have any injuries and are playing terrible. I would honestly put them at 5. Even tempted to put them at 6.

Boston
Miami
Chicago
NYK
Orlando
Hawks

This is purely as I seem them right now standpoint. I have no doubt the Magic will pull off a trade and get better, but right now they look bad.

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:22 AM
bulls lost to knicks cuz they were without Boozer , but still they sticked with them fairly , and knicks were shooting 72% from downtown - and that my friend is happening only once in a season .
And Bulls defense is far more better than last time , you'll be surprised when bulls beat knicks later this month .

AGAIN A TON OF EXCUSES

Let me twist the facts the way I would like to see them then as well. Yes the team shot 72 percent from downtown but Stoudemire played bad. 14 points on 5 for 21 shooting and 8 turnovers and we still won the game. Hes averaging more then 20 more points then that game against you guys and has been doing it a lot more efficiently then the 5 for 21 that he shot against the Bulls. The bulls wont have their interior intimidator against us and Amare is playing way better now then he was then. What makes you think we will need to shoot 72 percent from downtown to beat you by 20 this time around?

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:25 AM
AGAIN A TON OF EXCUSES

Let me twist the facts the way I would like to see them then as well. Yes the team shot 72 percent from downtown but Stoudemire played bad. 14 points on 5 for 21 shooting and 8 turnovers and we still won the game. Hes averaging more then 20 more points then that game against you guys and has been doing it a lot more efficiently then the 5 for 21 that he shot against the Bulls. The bulls wont have their interior intimidator against us and Amare is playing way better now then he was then. What makes you think we will need to shoot 72 percent from downtown to beat you by 20 this time around?

Who has a better record even though they played tougher opponents? Don't give me excuses. Just give me an answer.

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:26 AM
:facepalm: The Bulls are 16-8 the Knicks are 16-10. The Bulls have played without Boozer, who by the way is a better player than Noah. The Bulls have also played a much tougher schedule than the Knicks.

Strength of Schedule Arguement is a moot point. We are going through our tough stretch now and we cant be penalized for other teams malfecience. In the end it all equals out which is why i said by seasons end the Bulls will not have a top 4 record in the east. All the teams are getting better who started out slow and the bulls are staying stagnant because of injuries. :facepalm:

chitownbulls
12-16-2010, 11:27 AM
AGAIN A TON OF EXCUSES

Let me twist the facts the way I would like to see them then as well. Yes the team shot 72 percent from downtown but Stoudemire played bad. 14 points on 5 for 21 shooting and 8 turnovers and we still won the game. Hes averaging more then 20 more points then that game against you guys and has been doing it a lot more efficiently then the 5 for 21 that he shot against the Bulls. The bulls wont have their interior intimidator against us and Amare is playing way better now then he was then. What makes you think we will need to shoot 72 percent from downtown to beat you by 20 this time around?

Umm...your kinda forgetting about Gibson...whos probably a better shot blocker and defender than Noah, and we will definitley be playing Kurt more. he came in pretty well for Bogut last year. So in all honesty the loss of Noah is gonna impact the offense much more than defense. And with Boozer back, it doesnt seem like that big of a deal.

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:27 AM
AGAIN A TON OF EXCUSES

Let me twist the facts the way I would like to see them then as well. Yes the team shot 72 percent from downtown but Stoudemire played bad. 14 points on 5 for 21 shooting and 8 turnovers and we still won the game. Hes averaging more then 20 more points then that game against you guys and has been doing it a lot more efficiently then the 5 for 21 that he shot against the Bulls. The bulls wont have their interior intimidator against us and Amare is playing way better now then he was then. What makes you think we will need to shoot 72 percent from downtown to beat you by 20 this time around?

Give it up man. Cleveland beat the Celtics. That doesn't mean they are a better team. The Bulls beat the Lakers, that doesn't mean they are a better team.

Stunner
12-16-2010, 11:29 AM
There is always one. lol

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:30 AM
Who has a better record even though they played tougher opponents? Don't give me excuses. Just give me an answer.

Did the Bulls go through that tough part of the schedule with Noah in the lineup? Lets see how they do without him in the lineup. Again my arguement is for seasons end. all the teams that got new pieces are getting better while the bulls are staying stagnant because of injuries.

All the PSDers constantly said the Bulls were number 2 or 3 before the season even started. So accepting anuything less based on your predictions is stagnant in my opinion.

I didnt think the Knicks would be this good start of the season but they are a pleasnt surprise. I actually like the Lakers more then any other team in the NBA but these chicago is great arguements get under my skin.

jtsunami
12-16-2010, 11:30 AM
Strength of Schedule Arguement is a moot point. We are going through our tough stretch now and we cant be penalized for other teams malfecience. In the end it all equals out which is why i said by seasons end the Bulls will not have a top 4 record in the east. All the teams are getting better who started out slow and the bulls are staying stagnant because of injuries. :facepalm:

How is it a moot point? The Bulls have a better record on a harder schedule. End of story. Yes, the Knicks beat a Boozer-less Bulls and needed a historic shooting night from 3.

The Knicks are a good team playing good basketball right now. Take off your homerglasses.

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:31 AM
Strength of Schedule Arguement is a moot point. We are going through our tough stretch now and we cant be penalized for other teams malfecience. In the end it all equals out which is why i said by seasons end the Bulls will not have a top 4 record in the east. All the teams are getting better who started out slow and the bulls are staying stagnant because of injuries. :facepalm:

My point exactly the Bulls without Boozer for a big portion of games and a harder schedule have a better record than the Knicks who have played crap teams. So where do you think the standings are going to be once you go through your tough stretch, and the Bulls have the cakewalk games?

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:32 AM
Give it up man. Cleveland beat the Celtics. That doesn't mean they are a better team. The Bulls beat the Lakers, that doesn't mean they are a better team.

So if beating the team doesnt make a team better? What is it based on? Predicted Potential?

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:33 AM
Did the Bulls go through that tough part of the schedule with Noah in the lineup? Lets see how they do without him in the lineup. Again my arguement is for seasons end. all the teams that got new pieces are getting better while the bulls are staying stagnant because of injuries.

All the PSDers constantly said the Bulls were number 2 or 3 before the season even started. So accepting anuything less based on your predictions is stagnant in my opinion.

I didnt think the Knicks would be this good start of the season but they are a pleasnt surprise. I actually like the Lakers more then any other team in the NBA but these chicago is great arguements get under my skin.

The Bulls played without Boozer who by the way is a better player than Noah.

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:34 AM
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: No games will be cakewalk games for the bulls with their injury bug.
Knicks can beat anyteam in the league so the strength of schedule arguement is meaningless. Look at philedelphia. They went on a streak over the last ten games and still have a crappy record. The strength of schedule arguement cant be used because the standings arent complete. One team goes on a hot streak and now they are a playoff contender in the east. Again which is why my arguement is seasons end bulls wont have a top 4 record in the east.


My point exactly the Bulls without Boozer for a big portion of games and a harder schedule have a better record than the Knicks who have played crap teams. So where do you think the standings are going to be once you go through your tough stretch, and the Bulls have the cakewalk games?

effen5
12-16-2010, 11:34 AM
olawd :laugh:

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:36 AM
So if beating the team doesnt make a team better? What is it based on? Predicted Potential?

Team rankings are based on:

1. Your record
2. Your potential to be good when you get your injured players back.
3. The teams you have faced and how you have beat them, how you have beat them is a controversial topic though.

The Bulls are ahead in the rankings over the Knicks because even though they have been injured they have a better record while playing tougher opponents.

Let me ask you something. How are the Knicks better than the Bulls if the Bulls have a better record while playing against tougher opponents? Please don't say they won't have Noah because Boozer is better than Noah.

Dnovakovic099
12-16-2010, 11:38 AM
:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: No games will be cakewalk games for the bulls with their injury bug.
Knicks can beat anyteam in the league so the strength of schedule arguement is meaningless. Look at philedelphia. They went on a streak over the last ten games and still have a crappy record. The strength of schedule arguement cant be used because the standings arent complete. One team goes on a hot streak and now they are a playoff contender in the east. Again which is why my arguement is seasons end bulls wont have a top 4 record in the east.

I just don't understand how you justify the Knicks being better even thought the Bulls have played a majority of games without Boozer and have played tougher opponents and still have a better record?

effen5
12-16-2010, 11:40 AM
Bulls played - Thunder Twice, Celtics twice, Lakers twice, Spurs, Dallas, Denver twice, and PHX, all very good to elite teams in the first 21 games....

Knicks played - Boston twice, Denver once, Hawks once, and the rest mediocre to awful teams

And we have a better record then you and you still think you guys are better then us right now?

I don't even know.....:laugh:

Flash3
12-16-2010, 11:41 AM
hawks >>> knicks

Flash3
12-16-2010, 11:43 AM
celtics
heat
magic
bulls
hawks

hawks and bulls are interchangeable.

ElMarroAfamado
12-16-2010, 11:43 AM
1. Boston
2. Orlando
3. Chicago
4. New York
5. Atlanta






6. Heat

Chicagofaithful
12-16-2010, 11:46 AM
anybody with the knicks over the bulls... come on.... listen the knicks have had one of the easiest schedules in the NBA to date. While the Bulls have had one of the toughest. The bulls have the most wins against western conference teams, the next closest team has half that. Plus the bull's strength of schedule has been 2nd hardest in the NBA to date. I actually really like this knicks team and definitely think they are good, but there is no logical reason to say the Knicks are better than the Bulls. And please don't use the argument that the Knicks beat the bulls... The bulls didn't have boozer, and we also beat the lakers, does that make us better than the bulls? Absolutely not. Anyways A good list would look like

Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks/Hawks..

Right now I'd give the edge to the Knicks cuz JJ is out, but when hes back I believe their a tougher team than the knicks but thats just my opinion and not necessarily true.

Super.
12-16-2010, 11:47 AM
Celtics

Everyone else


boston
celtics
beantown
the hub
cradle of modern america

I like the way you think sir


1.Bulls


2.Celtics
3.Heat
4.Magic
5.Hawks

Question...Whats the Bulls record against the Celtics? 0-2?
Who has a better regular season record? The Celtics?

Strange. You figure they'd be below the Celtics.

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 11:49 AM
Team rankings are based on:

1. Your record
2. Your potential to be good when you get your injured players back.
3. The teams you have faced and how you have beat them, how you have beat them is a controversial topic though.

The Bulls are ahead in the rankings over the Knicks because even though they have been injured they have a better record while playing tougher opponents.

Let me ask you something. How are the Knicks better than the Bulls if the Bulls have a better record while playing against tougher opponents? Please don't say they won't have Noah because Boozer is better than Noah.

I see how you get your ratings but again a lot of what your saying is what im basing the knicks record. Speculation and Opinion.

The record is a difference of two games.
Potential is in the eye of the beholder. You look at Boozer and Noah like they are Duncan and Robinson lol. I look at the Knicks like they are the Suns with a better stoudemire.
I look at the fact that its a completely new team of players since last season. Which justifies to me their slide early and makes me excited with winning 13 out of the last 15 since their slide. Shows they are coming together. They played all their tough games very close and winning some while being a brand new team. My Potential for them is a 4 seed since they wont be able to pass the Celtics this season. The bulls will get a higher seed just because they will win their division. Overall Record I believe the Knicks will have the better record at seasons end.
If the Knicks beat the bulls again this month your still going to argue that they are better then the Knicks so why is it so unimaginable for me to argue the Knicks are better then the Bulls when they actually beat the Bulls in their lone matchup this season?

effen5
12-16-2010, 11:50 AM
Celtics

Everyone else



I like the way you think sir



Question...Whats the Bulls record against the Celtics? 0-2?
Who has a better regular season record? The Celtics?

Strange. You figure they'd be below the Celtics.

Hes just messing, the Celtics are hands down the best team in the east right now.

effen5
12-16-2010, 11:54 AM
I see how you get your ratings but again a lot of what your saying is what im basing the knicks record. Speculation and Opinion.

The record is a difference of two games.
Potential is in the eye of the beholder. You look at Boozer and Noah like they are Duncan and Robinson lol. I look at the Knicks like they are the Suns with a better stoudemire.
I look at the fact that its a completely new team of players since last season. Which justifies to me their slide early and makes me excited with winning 13 out of the last 15 since their slide. Shows they are coming together. They played all their tough games very close and winning some while being a brand new team. My Potential for them is a 4 seed since they wont be able to pass the Celtics this season. The bulls will get a higher seed just because they will win their division. Overall Record I believe the Knicks will have the better record at seasons end.
If the Knicks beat the bulls again this month your still going to argue that they are better then the Knicks so why is it so unimaginable for me to argue the Knicks are better then the Bulls when they actually beat the Bulls in their lone matchup this season?

Your reasons are still ridiculous.

First about you guys having a new team...what about the bulls?

The only players returning from last years team was Rose, Noah, Deng, Taj, and JJ. We added Boozer, Korver, Bogans, Watson, KT, Asik, and Scal.

We also have a new coach in Coach Thibs....and this team is still learning his system.

Also are you telling me just because the Knicks beat the Bulls you guys are better? Oh okay, then from your point of view, we are better then Dallas, we are as good as OKC, we are as good as the Lakers, we are as good as Denver....thats just a dumb way of looking at things.

KnicksorBust
12-16-2010, 12:00 PM
After seeing what the Knicks and Bulls are capable of doing, is it time to reshuffle the top teams in the East?

Name your top 5 East teams.

Mine.

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

I'd still be willing to put the Bulls and the Hawks ahead of us. We need more quality wins. A 2pt loss to the Celtics shouldn't move us UP the rankings.

Hawkeye15
12-16-2010, 12:07 PM
Currently, its the following for me:

Heat
Celtics
Bulls
Magic
Hawks

Chicagofaithful
12-16-2010, 12:31 PM
D Rose I have read your posts a lot and I like the posts more that you write about other teams and less about your own or Derrick Rose.

The Bulls arent better then the Knicks. The Bulls lost to them in their matchup already and the excuse was Boozer is out. They are going to play again in like a week and Noah is injured for 8 weeks. Your team is injury riddled and its going to cost the place in the standings.

Bulls are a good team but the if Healthy arguement a lot of people use for the Bulls and the Hawks are meaningless because they arent healthy!

We have already seen the Hawks ceiling. They have no more room for improvement and Johnsons contract insured that they cant get any better without trading other assets like Crawford or Smith.

Maybe if the Bulls can get healthy they can surpass the hawks but other than that I dont see them cracking the top 4 spots in the east based on Pure record. Obviously they will have a higher spot because they are in a weak division but record wise they wont crack the top 4 by seasons end.

No the bulls are better than the knicks because they have MORE wins against BETTER teams.... thats common sense not what ifs...

dnewguy
12-16-2010, 12:33 PM
Currently, its the following for me:

Heat
Celtics
Bulls
Magic
Hawks

No disrespect sir, but the Celtics are better than the Heat.

Hawkeye15
12-16-2010, 12:38 PM
No disrespect sir, but the Celtics are better than the Heat.

you can make a case either way. But the Heat are playing better right now. They have won their last 10 games by an average of 16 points. Today, they are the best team in the east.

PhillyFaninLA
12-16-2010, 01:04 PM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Hawks


I'm going with this but adding if the Celtics are healthy I believe they are the best team in the NBA, no offense to the Lakers, they are number 2 IMO. The Celtics not being healthy right now I believe the Lakers are the best the team in the league the Heat are the best in the east and Celtics 2.

Furymaker
12-16-2010, 01:21 PM
AGAIN A TON OF EXCUSES

Let me twist the facts the way I would like to see them then as well. Yes the team shot 72 percent from downtown but Stoudemire played bad. 14 points on 5 for 21 shooting and 8 turnovers and we still won the game. Hes averaging more then 20 more points then that game against you guys and has been doing it a lot more efficiently then the 5 for 21 that he shot against the Bulls. The bulls wont have their interior intimidator against us and Amare is playing way better now then he was then. What makes you think we will need to shoot 72 percent from downtown to beat you by 20 this time around?

Stoudemire didn't play bad , Bulls defense stopped him , that's freaking obvious .

Super.
12-16-2010, 01:26 PM
Currently, its the following for me:

Heat
Celtics
Bulls
Magic
Hawks

Really?

Head to head...Celtics are 2-0 without Perkins or JO.

Baller1
12-16-2010, 01:31 PM
Is it just a coincidence that every thread turns into Bulls/Rose vs. ________?

I don't think so.

D1JM
12-16-2010, 01:35 PM
Is it just a coincidence that every thread turns into Bulls/Rose vs. ________?

I don't think so.

Welcome to the NBA forum

Furymaker
12-16-2010, 01:43 PM
Is it just a coincidence that every thread turns into Bulls/Rose vs. ________?

I don't think so.

nope , everything is about the bulls :clap:

dnewguy
12-16-2010, 01:43 PM
Is it just a coincidence that every thread turns into Bulls/Rose vs. ________?

I don't think so.

The only people that talk about Rose are Bulls fans. No disrespect but most of us don't even know if he's in the NBA or not.

jkcronyn
12-16-2010, 01:46 PM
So is healthy knicks better than healthy hawks? I don't think so.. not hating, but Atlanta has been a 48+ win team for a long time.

I think so.. at least more dangerous come playoffs. NYC is determined, fresh, and playing out of their minds. Atlanta has been an average team that has been an non-threatening 3 seed. They're bored of their roster almost and that team needs a shake up to be actually competitive. NYC is on the up, ATL on the down. That being said...

Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

Baller1
12-16-2010, 01:46 PM
The only people that talk about Rose are Bulls fans. No disrespect but most of us don't even know if he's in the NBA or not.

:laugh2:

Toronto_Fan
12-16-2010, 01:48 PM
Cavaliers
Raptors
Bobcats
Bucks
Nets

Khalifa21
12-16-2010, 01:50 PM
Heat
Celtics
Magic
Knicks
Bulls

Stunner
12-16-2010, 01:52 PM
Smh

Weezy
12-16-2010, 01:59 PM
We aren't top 5 in East....yet

FadeAwayLikeMJ
12-16-2010, 02:00 PM
No disrespect sir, but the Celtics are better than the Heat.

:clap:

C's are soooo good in best of 7s, ask Kobe

CTCUBBIES
12-16-2010, 02:04 PM
I see how you get your ratings but again a lot of what your saying is what im basing the knicks record. Speculation and Opinion.

The record is a difference of two games.
Potential is in the eye of the beholder. You look at Boozer and Noah like they are Duncan and Robinson lol. I look at the Knicks like they are the Suns with a better stoudemire.
I look at the fact that its a completely new team of players since last season. Which justifies to me their slide early and makes me excited with winning 13 out of the last 15 since their slide. Shows they are coming together. They played all their tough games very close and winning some while being a brand new team. My Potential for them is a 4 seed since they wont be able to pass the Celtics this season. The bulls will get a higher seed just because they will win their division. Overall Record I believe the Knicks will have the better record at seasons end.
If the Knicks beat the bulls again this month your still going to argue that they are better then the Knicks so why is it so unimaginable for me to argue the Knicks are better then the Bulls when they actually beat the Bulls in their lone matchup this season?

Where do these bold predictions for the Knicks come from? This winning streak has been against the dregs of the league and they've still needed career performances from basically every player to beat these teams. When the Knicks schedule evens out they will have very little margin for error because they don't play a lick of defense.

I'm sure it's nice in dreamworld to imagine that Amare will continue this torrid pace but (remember this isn't a new system for him) the liklihood is that he will revert closer to his career numbers.

You're also going on the premise that Raymond Felton is now basically a legit star because of a 10-12 game run. In all liklihood he too will revert back to his career norms or slightly better. The young guys such as Gallo, Chandler and Fields - who knows what they will do? The Knicks are relying on every player to make significant jumps - that is not likely.

My point is if they get any worse offensively (which is bound to happen) their putrid defense will expose them just as it did early in the season.

SteBO
12-16-2010, 02:16 PM
Where do these bold predictions for the Knicks come from? This winning streak has been against the dregs of the league and they've still needed career performances from basically every player to beat these teams. When the Knicks schedule evens out they will have very little margin for error because they don't play a lick of defense.

I'm sure it's nice in dreamworld to imagine that Amare will continue this torrid pace but (remember this isn't a new system for him) the liklihood is that he will revert closer to his career numbers.

You're also going on the premise that Raymond Felton is now basically a legit star because of a 10-12 game run. In all liklihood he too will revert back to his career norms or slightly better. The young guys such as Gallo, Chandler and Fields - who knows what they will do? The Knicks are relying on every player to make significant jumps - that is not likely.

My point is if they get any worse offensively (which is bound to happen) their putrid defense will expose them just as it did early in the season.


I agree with the last part, but don't you think you're underrating Raymond Felton a bit. He put up 26 pts and 14 assists against an ELITE Boston defense.
Also, the fact that they're in those games against the elite tells a lot .
The Knick's players are making significant jumps. Wilson Chandler is playing well right now and Felton is playing out of his mind along with the obvious player being Amare. Landry Fields has been gr8 too, to a point where New York probably won't include him in any deal for Melo. BTW, Mike D'antoni's system in phoenix took them to the western conference finals twice, and they probably should have gone a second time if it wasn't for stern or stu jackson handing out those ridiculous suspensions, and practically giving the spurs that series.
Tim Donoghy also officiated two of those games :laugh2:

There no reason Amare can't continue to play well even if it isn't 30+ in the system he's in.

JordansBulls
12-16-2010, 02:17 PM
Heat
Celtics
Magic
Knicks
Bulls

http://espn.go.com/nba/stats/rpi/_/sort/SOS

Bulls #1 in SOS

Knicks #29 right now.

Hawkeye15
12-16-2010, 02:18 PM
Really?

Head to head...Celtics are 2-0 without Perkins or JO.

understood. And if that were the only 2 games those teams had played, it would be an easy decision. Basically, since their early struggles, Miami has not only figured it out, but they are blowing teams away. They are currently playing the best basketball out east.

Jonathan2323
12-16-2010, 02:20 PM
The Celtic beat the HEAT twice, but thats when the HEAT were trying to find their way on both sides of the ball. They are playing much different now than they played at the beginning of the year. That being said i still think the Celtics are #1 until we play them again. Also we have aquired size since then in Dampier, which will help aganist Shaq and Co. Also we will be getting Mike Miller back.


1)Celtics
2)Heat
3)Magic
4)Hawks
5)Bulls
6)Knicks

Hoopsadvocate
12-16-2010, 02:24 PM
understood. And if that were the only 2 games those teams had played, it would be an easy decision. Basically, since their early struggles, Miami has not only figured it out, but they are blowing teams away. They are currently playing the best basketball out east.

This


The Celtic beat the HEAT twice, but thats when the HEAT were trying to find their way on both sides of the ball. They are playing much different now than they played at the beginning of the year. That being said i still think the Celtics are #1 until we play them again. Also we have aquired size since then in Dampier, which will help aganist Shaq and Co. Also we will be getting Mike Miller back.



and this

jtsunami
12-16-2010, 02:45 PM
The HEAT players like to put HEAT on their opponents by HEATing up from behind the arc. HEAT.

CTCUBBIES
12-16-2010, 04:29 PM
I agree with the last part, but don't you think you're underrating Raymond Felton a bit. He put up 26 pts and 14 assists against an ELITE Boston defense.
Also, the fact that they're in those games against the elite tells a lot .
The Knick's players are making significant jumps. Wilson Chandler is playing well right now and Felton is playing out of his mind along with the obvious player being Amare. Landry Fields has been gr8 too, to a point where New York probably won't include him in any deal for Melo. BTW, Mike D'antoni's system in phoenix took them to the western conference finals twice, and they probably should have gone a second time if it wasn't for stern or stu jackson handing out those ridiculous suspensions, and practically giving the spurs that series.
Tim Donoghy also officiated two of those games :laugh2:

There no reason Amare can't continue to play well even if it isn't 30+ in the system he's in.

Don't get me wrong, I think the Knicks are a playoff team for sure. Just think they are in the teams fighting for the 6-8 seeding and not top five. Also not knocking D'antoni - just pointing out that what Amare was in Phoenix we can expect him to be in NY because he's playing in the same system with a lesser point guard.

Bottomline if your success depends on every guy having a career year at once than you will probably be disapointed.

I also agree Amare will play well but in order to make up for their defense I think he needs to continue to play at the current level and I don't think he can do that.

SteBO
12-16-2010, 04:42 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think the Knicks are a playoff team for sure. Just think they are in the teams fighting for the 6-8 seeding and not top five. Also not knocking D'antoni - just pointing out that what Amare was in Phoenix we can expect him to be in NY because he's playing in the same system with a lesser point guard.

Bottomline if your success depends on every guy having a career year at once than you will probably be disapointed.

I also agree Amare will play well but in order to make up for their defense I think he needs to continue to play at the current level and I don't think he can do that.
Fair :)

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 05:01 PM
That is definitely an interesting point you have made. Your killing my speculation with your own speculation. I wouldnt call these performances career performances if they have been doing it every night since the beginning of this run. Felton was built for a system like this and Larry Browns system didnt cater to his skill set. We are still just scratching the surface of Felton in this new system because they are looking better and better every night.
The way the Knicks are playing right now they can compete with anyone. Thats the same thing the Pheonix Suns did. Come Playoff time its a different story and I would like to see how they respond. We have seen this system work already in Pheonix and as I do not know the total average points per game for those suns teams in the west I cant imagine them being much higher then our current PPG which is 1st in the NBA. As to the comment of Horrid Defense i would have to disagree. They lead the league in blocks and are one of the top teams in steals. The PPG doesnt really give a good gauge on their defense because they have a lot more possesions per game then any other team due to their style of play. I forgot the statistic that NBA TV was talking about with the NY Knicks but it was something like the scoring per possession and they ranked the knicks at 16th. I am not very good with all those win shares and percentages everyone likes to pull out on these threads but to me thats an interesting statistic.

I wouldnt consider it a dream world that Amare can keep this pace up. Hes taking the shots the teams in the East are giving him and as long as his teammates keep stepping up they will have a hard time justifying constantly double teaming him.

I think the problem earlier this season wasnt the defense but the chemistry down the stretch. Any BBALL player would know you can play a basketball game at any pace for the first 3 quarters but the last quarter is where the teamwork and chemistry matter most. The top teams in the league are generally closers. They know how to chip down a deficit and hold a lead when they are ahead. The Knicks were still figuring that out. Chemistry has been whats changed them in this run.


Where do these bold predictions for the Knicks come from? This winning streak has been against the dregs of the league and they've still needed career performances from basically every player to beat these teams. When the Knicks schedule evens out they will have very little margin for error because they don't play a lick of defense.

I'm sure it's nice in dreamworld to imagine that Amare will continue this torrid pace but (remember this isn't a new system for him) the liklihood is that he will revert closer to his career numbers.

You're also going on the premise that Raymond Felton is now basically a legit star because of a 10-12 game run. In all liklihood he too will revert back to his career norms or slightly better. The young guys such as Gallo, Chandler and Fields - who knows what they will do? The Knicks are relying on every player to make significant jumps - that is not likely.

My point is if they get any worse offensively (which is bound to happen) their putrid defense will expose them just as it did early in the season.

Minimal
12-16-2010, 05:06 PM
1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Orlando
4. Bulls
5. Hawks
6. Knicks
7. Milwaukee
8. Indiana

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 05:10 PM
Your reasons are still ridiculous.

First about you guys having a new team...what about the bulls?

The only players returning from last years team was Rose, Noah, Deng, Taj, and JJ. We added Boozer, Korver, Bogans, Watson, KT, Asik, and Scal.

We also have a new coach in Coach Thibs....and this team is still learning his system.

Also are you telling me just because the Knicks beat the Bulls you guys are better? Oh okay, then from your point of view, we are better then Dallas, we are as good as OKC, we are as good as the Lakers, we are as good as Denver....thats just a dumb way of looking at things.

I dont think you can compare the two teams change in personnel. You already had your lineup you just added Boozer and some role players. Noah was already playing with Rose Deng Gibson and JJ last season.

The only holdovers from last seasons Knicks team is Gallo Chandler Douglas and Curry. Curry hasnt played a significant role in the team for years. Gallo and Chandler played some serious roles last season and douglas was a rookie.

You cant compare the additions of either team that way. The Bulls remodeled their team while the Knicks completely rebuilt theirs. Their captains were free agent signings. The Center PF SG and PG positions have all been replaced with new players and the only position that stayed the same was SF.

Two completely different situations your comparing.

The new Coach thing you presented is a good point but I dont think having a new coach and learning a new system with some new role players and still having most of your starting lineup intact is equal to having a WHOLE NEW TEAM thats learning Dantoni's system as well.
NEW TEAM is equal to having a new coach because they havent played in Dantonis system and on top of that they havent played with each other! Think the Knicks take that arguement sorry.

latinofire21
12-16-2010, 05:15 PM
Clap CLap Clap couldnt agree more.


I agree with the last part, but don't you think you're underrating Raymond Felton a bit. He put up 26 pts and 14 assists against an ELITE Boston defense.
Also, the fact that they're in those games against the elite tells a lot .
The Knick's players are making significant jumps. Wilson Chandler is playing well right now and Felton is playing out of his mind along with the obvious player being Amare. Landry Fields has been gr8 too, to a point where New York probably won't include him in any deal for Melo. BTW, Mike D'antoni's system in phoenix took them to the western conference finals twice, and they probably should have gone a second time if it wasn't for stern or stu jackson handing out those ridiculous suspensions, and practically giving the spurs that series. Tim Donoghy also officiated two of those games :laugh2:

There no reason Amare can't continue to play well even if it isn't 30+ in the system he's in.

el_primo_nano
12-16-2010, 05:20 PM
After seeing what the Knicks and Bulls are capable of doing, is it time to reshuffle the top teams in the East?

Name your top 5 East teams.

Mine.

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Knicks
5. Bulls

exactly how i thought of it to be.. I would put Magic above the Heat though

effen5
12-16-2010, 05:45 PM
I dont think you can compare the two teams change in personnel. You already had your lineup you just added Boozer and some role players. Noah was already playing with Rose Deng Gibson and JJ last season.

The only holdovers from last seasons Knicks team is Gallo Chandler Douglas and Curry. Curry hasnt played a significant role in the team for years. Gallo and Chandler played some serious roles last season and douglas was a rookie.

You cant compare the additions of either team that way. The Bulls remodeled their team while the Knicks completely rebuilt theirs. Their captains were free agent signings. The Center PF SG and PG positions have all been replaced with new players and the only position that stayed the same was SF.

Two completely different situations your comparing.

The new Coach thing you presented is a good point but I dont think having a new coach and learning a new system with some new role players and still having most of your starting lineup intact is equal to having a WHOLE NEW TEAM thats learning Dantoni's system as well.
NEW TEAM is equal to having a new coach because they havent played in Dantonis system and on top of that they havent played with each other! Think the Knicks take that arguement sorry.

I don't even......

Just wow....

I don't even know where to begin or should I even bother?

SteBO
12-16-2010, 05:55 PM
My top 5 teams

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Bulls
5. Knicks

This'll change eventually, obviously

biglord
12-16-2010, 06:14 PM
how is the knicks top 5 they lost to almost all the good teams in the league.they are better than people thought,but top 5 stop it they got to beat more than 3 or 4 good teams to be top 5 the hawks are better and they dont have joe johnson right now.i have to lmao when i hear the knicks the are top 5 after 24 games they have no stayin power. 1. boston 2.orlando 3.bulls 4.miami 5.atlanta

Khalifa21
12-16-2010, 06:22 PM
how is the knicks top 5 they lost to almost all the good teams in the league.they are better than people thought,but top 5 stop it they got to beat more than 3 or 4 good teams to be top 5 the hawks are better and they dont have joe johnson right now.i have to lmao when i hear the knicks the are top 5 after 24 games they have no stayin power. 1. boston 2.orlando 3.bulls 4.miami 5.atlanta

Why have you got the Hawks above them though... They're both at 16-10 and the Hawks haven't beaten anyone of any significance.

The Knicks are above the Hawks as it stands.

Also.. Punctuation is your friend. Don't be afraid of it.

ewmania
12-16-2010, 06:33 PM
1. Boston
2. Orlando
3. Miami

4/5. Knicks / Bulls

pretty even bulls and knicks on a good night, cant really say whos better

biglord
12-16-2010, 07:00 PM
Why have you got the Hawks above them though... They're both at 16-10 and the Hawks haven't beaten anyone of any significance.

The Knicks are above the Hawks as it stands.

Also.. Punctuation is your friend. Don't be afraid of it.

it's real simple the hawks beat the knicks in the only meeting this year so they are ahead of them. as for my punctuations they cant be that bad your smart *** understood.

CTCUBBIES
12-16-2010, 07:51 PM
That is definitely an interesting point you have made. Your killing my speculation with your own speculation. I wouldnt call these performances career performances if they have been doing it every night since the beginning of this run. Felton was built for a system like this and Larry Browns system didnt cater to his skill set. We are still just scratching the surface of Felton in this new system because they are looking better and better every night.
The way the Knicks are playing right now they can compete with anyone. Thats the same thing the Pheonix Suns did. Come Playoff time its a different story and I would like to see how they respond. We have seen this system work already in Pheonix and as I do not know the total average points per game for those suns teams in the west I cant imagine them being much higher then our current PPG which is 1st in the NBA. As to the comment of Horrid Defense i would have to disagree. They lead the league in blocks and are one of the top teams in steals. The PPG doesnt really give a good gauge on their defense because they have a lot more possesions per game then any other team due to their style of play. I forgot the statistic that NBA TV was talking about with the NY Knicks but it was something like the scoring per possession and they ranked the knicks at 16th. I am not very good with all those win shares and percentages everyone likes to pull out on these threads but to me thats an interesting statistic.

I wouldnt consider it a dream world that Amare can keep this pace up. Hes taking the shots the teams in the East are giving him and as long as his teammates keep stepping up they will have a hard time justifying constantly double teaming him.

I think the problem earlier this season wasnt the defense but the chemistry down the stretch. Any BBALL player would know you can play a basketball game at any pace for the first 3 quarters but the last quarter is where the teamwork and chemistry matter most. The top teams in the league are generally closers. They know how to chip down a deficit and hold a lead when they are ahead. The Knicks were still figuring that out. Chemistry has been whats changed them in this run.

Its true we are both speculating. But I feel that you're speculating based on how you want it to be mixed with a 15 game run while I am speculating based on established career numbers and performances. If you think Amare, Chandler, Felton, Gallo and Fields will continue these performances you may be right but I think it's a lot less of a jump to think that they won't.

Jonathan2323
12-16-2010, 07:52 PM
People forget about the Hawks, they are a really good regular season team when healthy.

Furymaker
12-16-2010, 08:45 PM
1 - Celtics
2- Heat
3- Magic
4- Bulls
5- Hawks

Knicks are great , but I don't believe they will keep this level of play , they must have stoudemire scoring 30+ to win games , it's freaking obvious that amare isn't capable of scoring 30+ points for 60 or so games left to play .
Bulls will be better than Knicks , D is the reason .
I know you'll tell they are without Noah for 10 weeks , they wont be able to compete like they did before , but if you watched bulls games as much as I did , you should know how great Taj - Boozer duo is playing when together on the court .

Khalifa21
12-16-2010, 10:54 PM
it's real simple the hawks beat the knicks in the only meeting this year so they are ahead of them. as for my punctuations they cant be that bad your smart *** understood.

The Knicks beat the Bulls... So they should be above them according to your formula right?

PC
12-16-2010, 11:33 PM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

I really hope those are the playoff seeds as well, Knicks and Bulls in the first round?:jumpy:

madvillian9
12-16-2010, 11:41 PM
Bulls at the 3 seed, at least, is a lock. No homersim. Truth. Central blows this year.

PC
12-16-2010, 11:44 PM
Bulls at the 3 seed, at least, is lock. No homersim. Truth. Central blows this year.

I don't know if this is what you meant but the division leader has to be at least a 4 seed, not 3. IMO I can't see them beating out the Magic

madvillian9
12-16-2010, 11:51 PM
1.Boston vs. 8.Philly
2.Miami vs. 7.Milwaukee
3.Chicago vs. 6.Atlanta
4.Orlando vs. 5.Knicks

madvillian9
12-16-2010, 11:55 PM
I don't know if this is what you meant but the division leader has to be at least a 4 seed, not 3. IMO I can't see them beating out the Magic

You're right. So 4 is a lock. With Noah healthy, 3 was possible. Now 4 is likely. Never know though. With the amount of crap teams in the league, schedules will be inflated. It's the reason why were seeing so many streaks.

yanksrock
12-17-2010, 12:00 AM
What I love most about these kinda threads is just seeing the Knicks in the discussion of good teams. i waited a long long time for this.

biglord
12-17-2010, 12:13 AM
The Knicks beat the Bulls... So they should be above them according to your formula right?
if you look at who the bulls played so far and who the knicks played it doesn't even compare. but to answer you no, i would go into detail if you would like

Khalifa21
12-17-2010, 12:21 AM
if you look at who the bulls played so far and who the knicks played it doesn't even compare. but to answer you no, i would go into detail if you would like

No it's fine... You're logic is already flawed and I couldn't bare trying to read through another paragraph of it.

The Knicks have beaten the teams they've meant to beat... Can't knock them for that. The fact that you have the Hawks above the Knicks because they beat them but the Knicks below the Bulls even though they beat them means your logic is flawed.

What?
12-17-2010, 12:37 AM
No it's fine... You're logic is already flawed and I couldn't bare trying to read through another paragraph of it.

The Knicks have beaten the teams they've meant to beat... Can't knock them for that. The fact that you have the Hawks above the Knicks because they beat them but the Knicks below the Bulls even though they beat them means your logic is flawed.

except that the Hawks and knicks have the same record and similar schedules and point differentials so it is possible that head to head match-ups could be a tie breaker.

Bulls on the other hand have a better record, a better point differential while playing a far harder schedule while for the most part without there 2nd-3rd best player very different scenarios.

dc5jdm
12-17-2010, 12:59 AM
Im an unbiased fan from the west.
and i dont see how the Knicks are better than the Bulls.
1.Celtics.
2.Heat
3a.Bulls
3b.Magic
5.Hawks/Knicks(interchangeable)

I really think the Bulls when healthy with Noah can beat the Magic in a series.

biglord
12-17-2010, 01:07 AM
except that the Hawks and knicks have the same record and similar schedules and point differentials so it is possible that head to head match-ups could be a tie breaker.

Bulls on the other hand have a better record, a better point differential while playing a far harder schedule while for the most part without there 2nd-3rd best player very different scenarios.

Thank you couldn't have said it better myself.

D-Leethal
12-17-2010, 02:09 AM
Celtics
Heat

Magic

Bulls/Knicks/Hawks (too close to put any over the other at this point)

Shonuff
12-17-2010, 03:14 AM
Is it just a coincidence that every thread turns into Bulls/Rose vs. ________?

I don't think so.

Nobody said a damn word about Rose. Don't be a drama queen and start this crap up again. We all know you want it to go that route.

Raph12
12-17-2010, 03:28 AM
Celtics - Top dogs with no one on their level
.
Magic - Rough patch right now, but will pull it back together (they still need to make a big trade to beat Boston or LA)
Heat - Playing at a high level but the void at the point and at center hurts them
.
.
.
Bulls - Rose and Boozer makes them good, Noah will need to be healthy
Knicks - Playing well right now, but still need something (Melo) to get them into the upper-tier of contenders

Baller1
12-17-2010, 05:06 AM
Nobody said a damn word about Rose. Don't be a drama queen and start this crap up again. We all know you want it to go that route.

I was referring to all the Bulls vs. Knicks discussion in this thread. Learn to read contextually before attacking me.

chitownbulls
12-17-2010, 05:25 AM
I was referring to all the Bulls vs. Knicks discussion in this thread. Learn to read contextually before attacking me.

Ok dude idt anyone here gives a ****, that the bulls are in this convo. All bulls fans are sick of your whining, please just shutup and stick to topic rather than baiting Bulls fans. We have a right to discuss about our team, incase if you didnt notice, half the time your the one that starts the argument. so if you dont mind please stfu and mind your own business

Draco
12-17-2010, 05:58 AM
1 - Celtics
2- Heat
3- Magic
4- Bulls
5- Hawks

Knicks are great , but I don't believe they will keep this level of play , they must have stoudemire scoring 30+ to win games , it's freaking obvious that amare isn't capable of scoring 30+ points for 60 or so games left to play .
Bulls will be better than Knicks , D is the reason .
I know you'll tell they are without Noah for 10 weeks , they wont be able to compete like they did before , but if you watched bulls games as much as I did , you should know how great Taj - Boozer duo is playing when together on the court .

Yeah, I don't see how the Knicks offense is even as good as what the Suns ran with Amare, that it's sustainable throughout the regular season, or that it'll be successful in the playoffs. It'll be interesting to see how long the Knicks can red line it and whether they make a significant trade to help the team before their engine blows.

omdigga
12-17-2010, 08:34 AM
Celtics - Top dogs with no one on their level
.
Magic - Rough patch right now, but will pull it back together (they still need to make a big trade to beat Boston or LA)
Heat - Playing at a high level but the void at the point and at center hurts them
.
.
.
Bulls - Rose and Boozer makes them good, Noah will need to be healthy
Knicks - Playing well right now, but still need something (Melo) to get them into the upper-tier of contenders

x2.

i like the way u did the tier system.. very well done..

Baller1
12-17-2010, 02:33 PM
Ok dude idt anyone here gives a ****, that the bulls are in this convo. All bulls fans are sick of your whining, please just shutup and stick to topic rather than baiting Bulls fans. We have a right to discuss about our team, incase if you didnt notice, half the time your the one that starts the argument. so if you dont mind please stfu and mind your own business

Actually the Bulls fans were agreeing with me and sick of every thread turning into such a discussion whereas a lot of them are annoyed more by fans like you than me. Good try though.

SteBO
12-17-2010, 02:38 PM
Celtics - Top dogs with no one on their level
.
Magic - Rough patch right now, but will pull it back together (they still need to make a big trade to beat Boston or LA)
Heat - Playing at a high level but the void at the point and at center hurts them
.
.
.
Bulls - Rose and Boozer makes them good, Noah will need to be healthy
Knicks - Playing well right now, but still need something (Melo) to get them into the upper-tier of contenders

:clap: And i'm a heat fan

chitownbulls
12-17-2010, 03:36 PM
Actually the Bulls fans were agreeing with me and sick of every thread turning into such a discussion whereas a lot of them are annoyed more by fans like you than me. Good try though.

Well, half the time you are the one starting these discussions by turning them into hate threads, all i'm saying is that sometimes fans like you just bait bulls fans, and were not all the reasons threads turn into Bulls discussions. just the point i was trying to make, to make sure you didnt start anything...i guess i got a little off topic lol.

Anywayss....

1. Celtics(nuff said)
2.Heat(large winstreak and i'm sure they can keep it up, tons of confidence)
3.Bulls(will change depending on how the handle the Noah injury, but played very well with hardest SOS, next 22 out of 30 games are against teams below .500)
4. Magic(not really playing as well as expected with a fully healthy roster, but not a bad team by all means)
5. Knicks(only reason there 5 and not 3 is that they have played easiest schedule by far, but I am surprised by their large winstreak and great play from Stoudemire. They have a much better defense and some developing players)

Baller1
12-17-2010, 03:42 PM
Well, half the time you are the one starting these discussions by turning them into hate threads, all i'm saying is that sometimes fans like you just bait bulls fans, and were not all the reasons threads turn into Bulls discussions. just the point i was trying to make, to make sure you didnt start anything...i guess i got a little off topic lol.

Anywayss....

1. Celtics(nuff said)
2.Heat(large winstreak and i'm sure they can keep it up, tons of confidence)
3.Bulls(will change depending on how the handle the Noah injury, but played very well with hardest SOS, next 22 out of 30 games are against teams below .500)
4. Magic(not really playing as well as expected with a fully healthy roster, but not a bad team by all means)
5. Knicks(only reason there 5 and not 3 is that they have played easiest schedule by far, but I am surprised by their large winstreak and great play from Stoudemire. They have a much better defense and some developing players)

I wasn't trying to start anything, I'm sick of the arguments just as much as you are. I was just making an observation.

Swift n Sil3nt
12-17-2010, 03:49 PM
Too soon to put the Knicks above top 5, they simply havent proven they can WIN. Can they compete? Sure. Theres a difference between competing and winning.

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Bulls
5. Hawks
6. Knicks

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 03:56 PM
I wasn't trying to start anything, I'm sick of the arguments just as much as you are. I was just making an observation.

Do you want to know why everything turns into a Bulls thread? It is because some people on here are Bulls haters plain and simple. The Bulls have a better record and have played against the toughest opponents while New York has a worse record and has played against **** teams. This is all while the Bulls played the majority of their games without Boozer. You will find very few if any analysts on any website that will rate the Knicks over the Bulls or even on the same level. Yet, you have people on this site putting the Knicks ahead of the Bulls.

Summary: The Bulls have played tougher opponents without their second best player and have a better record, but the Knicks are a better team. :rolleyes:

beasted86
12-17-2010, 04:00 PM
Do you want to know why everything turns into a Bulls thread? It is because some people on here are Bulls haters plain and simple. The Bulls have a better record and have played against the toughest opponents while New York has a worse record and has played against **** teams. This is all while the Bulls played the majority of their games without Boozer. You will find very few if any analysts on any website that will rate the Knicks over the Bulls or even on the same level. Yet, you have people on this site putting the Knicks ahead of the Bulls.

Summary: The Bulls have played tougher opponents without their second best player and have a better record, but the Knicks are a better team. :rolleyes:

And you have people on this same site putting the Bulls above the Heat & the Magic... You have people saying Rose is better than Wade... You have people saying Boozer is better than Amare & Bosh... You have people saying Noah is the 3rd best Center in the NBA.

Don't exclude Bulls fans from homer bias either...

That said, I mostly agreed with what you said. Bulls are more proven than the Knicks and should finish the season with a better record.

chitownbulls
12-17-2010, 04:16 PM
And you have people on this same site putting the Bulls above the Heat & the Magic... You have people saying Rose is better than Wade... You have people saying Boozer is better than Amare & Bosh... You have people saying Noah is the 3rd best Center in the NBA.

Don't exclude Bulls fans from homer bias either...

That said, I mostly agreed with what you said. Bulls are more proven than the Knicks and should finish the season with a better record.

Ok yeah, I'm not gonna lie we do have homers. LIKE A LOT. But some of there arguments arent that "overrexagerated"

Wade is better than Rose, but...this season STATISTICALLY ONLY some of Rose's stats are superior to wade's

Boozer bettter than Bosh is a case certainly made, and is by far not homerism. Bosh has been a let down so far. I can't say anything for Boozer yet though because he has played just a few games.
-saying Boozer is better than Amare is homerism.

Idk about 3rd best in the NBA but im sure a case can be made for him being second best in the East, top 10 scoring, #2 rebounds, #1 steals, top 10 blocks, #2 double doubles. 14 ppg 11.7 rpg...but now hes injured so...

ramsizzle
12-17-2010, 04:30 PM
And you have people on this same site putting the Bulls above the Heat & the Magic... You have people saying Rose is better than Wade... You have people saying Boozer is better than Amare & Bosh... You have people saying Noah is the 3rd best Center in the NBA.

Don't exclude Bulls fans from homer bias either...

That said, I mostly agreed with what you said. Bulls are more proven than the Knicks and should finish the season with a better record.

Us Bulls fans have our bias' definitely but you are stating that all these statements are outlandish...the Bulls could theoretically finish above the Heat and Magic due to how easy the schedule is for the next thirty games or so and adding to the fact that they have been extremely competitive with the hardest schedule in the league.

On to Boozer vs. Ama're/Bosh debate. He in fact is playing better than Bosh i dont see how you can have it any other way. Ama're is playing out of his mind right now so you can't say Boozer is better but time will tell due to he just coming back to the team.

Lastly, with Noah. Honestly off the top of my head id take Dwight Howard, Marc Gasol, and Bogut over him. Thats fourth in the NBA. how crazy of a statement is that the fourth best center in the nba is actually third....

justinnum1
12-17-2010, 04:33 PM
I think we might see a 4/5 bulls knicks matchup that could be really really good.

1boston
2miami
3.orlando
4.bulls
5.knicks/hawks

latinofire21
12-17-2010, 04:40 PM
Do you want to know why everything turns into a Bulls thread? It is because some people on here are Bulls haters plain and simple. The Bulls have a better record and have played against the toughest opponents while New York has a worse record and has played against **** teams. This is all while the Bulls played the majority of their games without Boozer. You will find very few if any analysts on any website that will rate the Knicks over the Bulls or even on the same level. Yet, you have people on this site putting the Knicks ahead of the Bulls.

Summary: The Bulls have played tougher opponents without their second best player and have a better record, but the Knicks are a better team. :rolleyes:

Thanjks for the quote. When Knicks finish ahead of Bulls at the end of the year in standings whats your excuse going to be then?

ramsizzle
12-17-2010, 04:44 PM
Thanjks for the quote. When Knicks finish ahead of Bulls at the end of the year in standings whats your excuse going to be then?

When? The Knicks are not ahead now and they have had the MUCH easier schedule. :confused:

beasted86
12-17-2010, 04:56 PM
Us Bulls fans have our bias' definitely but you are stating that all these statements are outlandish...the Bulls could theoretically finish above the Heat and Magic due to how easy the schedule is for the next thirty games or so and adding to the fact that they have been extremely competitive with the hardest schedule in the league.
So what difference would there be having Knicks, Hawks and possibly even Pacers fans saying they will finish better than the Bulls with Noah out with an injury for the next set of weeks?

Anyone can give their own homer tainted opinion and it be within reason.


On to Boozer vs. Ama're/Bosh debate. He in fact is playing better than Bosh i dont see how you can have it any other way. Ama're is playing out of his mind right now so you can't say Boozer is better but time will tell due to he just coming back to the team.

See above. Time will tell with Bosh jelling with team, see November splits... blah, blah Boozer is also 2nd option on the Bulls and beats Bosh in efficiency by less than 0.5, and in both PPG & RPG categories, blah blah... Time will tell with Amare continuing to start at Center, see season splits... blah, blah... see team record since, blah blah...

None of this is out of reason. As I said, it's not hard to make an argument within reason. Doesn't really mean it's not fetching.


Lastly, with Noah. Honestly off the top of my head id take Dwight Howard, Marc Gasol, and Bogut over him. Thats fourth in the NBA. how crazy of a statement is that the fourth best center in the nba is actually third....
Here are the Centers I'd take over Noah right now: Dwight Howard, Tim Duncan, Andrew Bogut, Al Horford, Amare Stoudemire. All of those guys are statistically more dominant than Noah right now, and provide more impact than Noah.

nycericanguy
12-17-2010, 04:59 PM
BOS
MIA
ORL
CHI
ATL
NY

I agree its too soon to put NY over ATL, but considering injuries to CHI & ATL, it could very well end up looking like this...

BOS
MIA
ORL
NY
CHI
ATL

Of course it won't matter because CHI will be the #4 seed even if NY has a better record because they will win their division no matter what, its probably the weakest division in the NBA.

Fukudome
12-17-2010, 05:05 PM
BOS
MIA
ORL
CHI
ATL
NY

I agree its too soon to put NY over ATL, but considering injuries to CHI & ATL, it could very well end up looking like this...

BOS
MIA
ORL
NY
CHI
ATL

Of course it won't matter because CHI will be the #4 seed even if NY has a better record because they will win their division no matter what, its probably the weakest division in the NBA.


I understand what everyone is getting at with the injuries, but if I absolutely had to pick a time for Noah to get injured, this would have been it. The Bulls have a cupcake of a schedule coming up and I cannot see them really dropping in the standings all too much.

nycericanguy
12-17-2010, 05:08 PM
I understand what everyone is getting at with the injuries, but if I absolutely had to pick a time for Noah to get injured, this would have been it. The Bulls have a cupcake of a schedule coming up and I cannot see them really dropping in the standings all too much.

who knows, i'm sure they'll lose a few extra games but at the end of the day it won't matter. CHI is virtually guaranteed the 4th seed as they are in BY FAR the worst division in the NBA.

The central is the only division with all losing teams except for the division leader. CHI can literally win 42 games and be 4th.

Kashmir13579
12-17-2010, 05:15 PM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Hawks

thats funny.. didn't the hawks just get blown out by the Pistons and then get dominated by a Rondo-less Celtics.? but yea, Hawks at 5. :rolleyes:

Kashmir13579
12-17-2010, 05:17 PM
I think we might see a 4/5 bulls knicks matchup that could be really really good.

1boston
2miami
3.orlando
4.bulls
5.knicks/hawks

that would be the ultimate playoff series for fans of both franchises. bragging rights come with 4 wins.

Kashmir13579
12-17-2010, 05:22 PM
http://espn.go.com/nba/stats/rpi/_/sort/SOS

Bulls #1 in SOS

Knicks #29 right now.

i think you may have been the the first person to notice that.

TylerSL
12-17-2010, 05:27 PM
1.Boston Celtics
2.Miami Heat
3.Orlando Magic
4.Chicago Bulls
5.Atlanta Hawks
6.New York Knicks


thats how it is right now, it can and probably will change alot by the end of the season

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 05:35 PM
So what difference would there be having Knicks, Hawks and possibly even Pacers fans saying they will finish better than the Bulls with Noah out with an injury for the next set of weeks?

I agree with you on this one regarding the Magic. I believe there is no reason the Bulls fans should claim they will have a better record than the Magic because the Magic have proven they are an elite team. As for the Heat, that is a diffrent story. Even though I think the Heat are the second best team, I don't think it is valid to say they will have a better record than the Bulls or Magic. The Heat have proven they can beat bad teams, but so have the Bulls. The Bulls have not yet lost to a non-playoff team, so what it comes down to is that the Bulls have played better against good teams than the Heat. The Heat are a team made to destroy bad teams because they can just play either Wade or Lebron along with Bosh against a team's bench and destroy them, but they can't do that against good defensive teams. So based on the season so far the Bulls should be even with the Heat because neither team has done much against good teams.

Anyone can give their own homer tainted opinion and it be within reason.

It is a homer opinion to say the Heat are better than the Bulls because the Heat haven proven they can beat a good team. They have much more talent, but they haven't proven anything, and neither have the Knicks. Both teams just destroy bad teams. That being said, the Bulls have a preatty bad record vs. good teams too but not even close to as bad as the Knicks and Heat.


See above. Time will tell with Bosh jelling with team, see November splits... blah, blah Boozer is also 2nd option on the Bulls and beats Bosh in efficiency by less than 0.5, and in both PPG & RPG categories, blah blah... Time will tell with Amare continuing to start at Center, see season splits... blah, blah... see team record since, blah blah...

None of this is out of reason. As I said, it's not hard to make an argument within reason. Doesn't really mean it's not fetching.

Amare is better than Boozer and Bosh with Boozer and Bosh being tied for second. I actually think Boozer would benefit the Heat more and Bosh would benefit the Bulls more. Boozer brings rebounding and Bosh brings shooting.


Here are the Centers I'd take over Noah right now: Dwight Howard, Tim Duncan, Andrew Bogut, Al Horford, Amare Stoudemire. All of those guys are statistically more dominant than Noah right now, and provide more impact than Noah.

I would agree with all of those besides Horford. I just think Noah plays much better defense, but if the Bulls had another big man that plays defense and can't score I would rather take Horford. Also, I think he said third best assuming Bogut is injured and Duncan and Stoudemire are forwards.

I just want to conclude by saying that the Heat, Bulls, and Knick all can't say anything about championships because they haven't proven anything. Not a single starter on any of those teams has a ring besides Wade. I would put the Heat above the Bulls just because of talent and personal opinion, but if you take opinion out of the equation the Bulls are the best out of the bunch based on what they did this season so far. Although, I do think the Heat are getting better and will be the best team at the end of the season of the three. I believe the Knicks are like the Heat just without the talent. They suck against good teams and beat up on **** teams. The only diffrence is that the Heat, IMO, will start beating good teams cause they have LeBron and Wade and the Knicks won't.

EaglePride615
12-17-2010, 05:35 PM
miami
boston
chicago
orlando
new york

DieHardCubFan
12-17-2010, 05:37 PM
celtics
heat
bulls
magic
knicks

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 05:39 PM
One question for Knicks fans that I have asked three times and have not heard the answer to yet is why do you put the Knicks ahead of the Bulls when the Bulls didn't have Boozer had the one of the hardest, if not the hardest, SOS while the Knicks have had one of the easiest SOS, and the Bulls still have a better record that the Knicks? What justification do you have that you will have more wins by the end of the season?

BSplaya2121
12-17-2010, 05:39 PM
Sixers obviously aren't top 5 and might not ever be this season. But look out for them. They've won 7 of their last 9. Including a 1 point loss to the Celtics and a tough loss in Atlanta where they gave the game away at the end. Easily could have been a 9 game winning streak after starting extremely poorly.

I agree, the Sixers might not be an elite team but they might make some noise come playoff time if they can hit the 7th or 8th seed

numba1CHANGsta
12-17-2010, 05:42 PM
Boston
Miami
Orlando
Chicago(with a healthy Noah)
Atlanta(with a healthy JJ)

BSplaya2121
12-17-2010, 05:43 PM
And to a lot of Bulls fans on this forum, please stop bashing the knicks. You have absolutely no reason to hate them as much as you do, i've seen at least 3 bulls fans come on this thread and say the Knicks are no good and do not deserve any credit. Thats fine, you are entitled to your opinion but please at least make a logical argument. If you say the Knicks are bad because of X amount of reasons than thats fine but do not just say they suck for no reason. We give the Bulls credit where it is due, please do the same.

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 05:53 PM
And to a lot of Bulls fans on this forum, please stop bashing the knicks. You have absolutely no reason to hate them as much as you do, i've seen at least 3 bulls fans come on this thread and say the Knicks are no good and do not deserve any credit. Thats fine, you are entitled to your opinion but please at least make a logical argument. If you say the Knicks are bad because of X amount of reasons than thats fine but do not just say they suck for no reason. We give the Bulls credit where it is due, please do the same.

The Knicks aren't a bad team, but I will give you some reasons they aren't a top five team:

1. The Bulls SOS is .530 while New York's is .452 and the Bulls have a better record. That is without Boozer for most of the games.

2. The Knicks have a half game lead on the Hawks, but the Hawks SOS is .490 while New York's is .452 and the Hawks are missing their best player. IMO the Knicks are better than the Hawks without JJ, but with him the Hawks are better.

3. I don't have to make a case for Orlando, Miami, and Boston.

So, the Knicks aren't a top 5 teams based on what they have done so far thus making a lot of Knick's fans delusional homers.

Cubsfan365
12-17-2010, 05:55 PM
that would be the ultimate playoff series for fans of both franchises. bragging rights come with 4 wins.
The playoffs series in the '90's will be better than a 4-5 matchup if it happens, which I don't think it will because I see the Knicks dropping off. Either way, I'm pretty sure MJ gave the Bulls eternal bragging rights.

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 05:56 PM
And to a lot of Bulls fans on this forum, please stop bashing the knicks. You have absolutely no reason to hate them as much as you do, i've seen at least 3 bulls fans come on this thread and say the Knicks are no good and do not deserve any credit. Thats fine, you are entitled to your opinion but please at least make a logical argument. If you say the Knicks are bad because of X amount of reasons than thats fine but do not just say they suck for no reason. We give the Bulls credit where it is due, please do the same.

Oh, and while I do think it is wrong to plain and simple say the Knicks are bad without any point, please tell the Knick's fans to stop saying they are better than the Bulls and have no answer when we tell them we have a better record, have played better teams, and haven't had Boozer for much of the year.

xxcubs22xx
12-17-2010, 06:05 PM
Pfft... The Knicks suck!

kidding.

Boston
Orlando
Miami
Chicago
NY Knicks (as of now)

I think in the end its a toss up between the Knicks and Atlanta, with the Knicks having the edge.

northsider
12-17-2010, 06:10 PM
I think it is kind of cool the Knicks are finally relevant again I never had much against that team. They kind of deserve some bragging rights cause allot of people pegged them as barely a 8th seed team and they are proving them wrong.

beasted86
12-17-2010, 06:30 PM
I don't feel like responding to the rest of your post, just this part


As for the Heat, that is a diffrent story. Even though I think the Heat are the second best team, I don't think it is valid to say they will have a better record than the Bulls or Magic. The Heat have proven they can beat bad teams, but so have the Bulls. The Bulls have not yet lost to a non-playoff team, so what it comes down to is that the Bulls have played better against good teams than the Heat. The Heat are a team made to destroy bad teams because they can just play either Wade or Lebron along with Bosh against a team's bench and destroy them, but they can't do that against good defensive teams. So based on the season so far the Bulls should be even with the Heat because neither team has done much against good teams.

Laughable... utterly laughable. This.... this very thing right here is what makes level headed and reasonable Bulls fans lose credit, and is what starts the bait wars between Bulls & Heat fans. Most of the level headed Heat fans try not to take anything away from the Bulls and appreciate Rose for the player he is, and then you guys take it to something else.

The Heat has already proven for the past 2 years straight if it slipped your mind, that they are already better than the Bulls. They add the 2 time reigning MVP, and a 5 time all-star PF, and STILL have a better record than the Bulls at this very second... yet somehow, magically, the Bulls are even with the Heat.

Laughable. This is exactly why I try and keep out of Bulls vs. Heat discussions in general on this forum, because there is no reasoning with most of you guys. I mean I hate to staple all Bulls fans together, but I've just seen too high of a percentage going on these crazy riffs.

northsider
12-17-2010, 06:40 PM
I don't feel like responding to the rest of your post, just this part



Laughable... utterly laughable. This.... this very thing right here is what makes level headed and reasonable Bulls fans lose credit, and is what starts the bait wars between Bulls & Heat fans. Most of the level headed Heat fans try not to take anything away from the Bulls and appreciate Rose for the player he is, and then you guys take it to something else.

The Heat has already proven for the past 2 years straight if it slipped your mind, that they are already better than the Bulls. They add the 2 time reigning MVP, and a 5 time all-star PF, and STILL have a better record than the Bulls at this very second... yet somehow, magically, the Bulls are even with the Heat.

Laughable. This is exactly why I try and keep out of Bulls vs. Heat discussions in general on this forum, because there is no reasoning with most of you guys. I mean I hate to staple all Bulls fans together, but I've just seen too high of a percentage going on these crazy riffs.

So you take offense to what one idiot says and fail to look back and see a great majority of Bulls fans have the Heat above them in there rankings. Don't act like all Heat fans are saints and are the only knowledgeable ones here there is equally as many ignorant Heat fans on here as there is Bulls.

beasted86
12-17-2010, 06:45 PM
So you take offense to what one idiot says and fail to look back and see a great majority of Bulls fans have the Heat above them in there rankings. Don't act like all Heat fans are saints and are the only knowledgeable ones here there is equally as many ignorant Heat fans on here as there is Bulls.

I've said this a million times and I'll repeat it again. Every single team on this forum has fans that are poor posters.

It's simple mathematics though that the teams with the most fans (Knicks, Lakers, Bulls) will proportionately have the most posting.

But on an honest observation note as a TM in the Heat forum, there are more baiting/banned/deleted posts of Bulls fans in there than from the Knicks or Lakers, and it isn't even close. It very well may be the same scenario vice versa with Heat fans in the Bulls forum, but I can't say since I don't post there.

northsider
12-17-2010, 06:52 PM
I've said this a million times and I'll repeat it again. Every single team on this forum has fans that are poor posters.

It's simple mathematics though that the teams with the most fans (Knicks, Lakers, Bulls) will proportionately have the most posting.

But on an honest observation note as a TM in the Heat forum, there are more baiting/banned/deleted posts of Bulls fans in there than from the Knicks or Lakers, and it isn't even close. It very well may be the same scenario vice versa with Heat fans in the Bulls forum, but I can't say since I don't post there.

We just have allot of fans and for the most part beyond the Knicks and Lakers fans there has always been animosity between Bulls posters and Heat posters on this board.

madvillian9
12-17-2010, 07:01 PM
The Heat has already proven for the past 2 years straight if it slipped your mind, that they are already better than the Bulls. They add the 2 time reigning MVP, and a 5 time all-star PF, and STILL have a better record than the Bulls at this very second... yet somehow, magically, the Bulls are even with the Heat.



This is idiotic. These teams are not the teams they were the last few seasons. You have added the big 3 but lost the interior presence that is needed to beat the elite teams. The Bulls have a blossoming superstar and have also added a allstar PF but lack a significant SG. To make an argument that Heat are better because they beat them in the recent past is ridiculous. These are not the same teams.

Khri
12-17-2010, 07:18 PM
1.Boston
2. Heat
3. Orlando
4.Knicks
5. Hawks







9000000. Bulls( a fanbase jealous of Miami, nothing new here)

northsider
12-17-2010, 07:36 PM
1.Boston
2. Heat
3. Orlando
4.Knicks
5. Hawks







9000000. Bulls( a fanbase jealous of Miami, nothing new here)

Way to help support my argument.:clap:

beasted86
12-17-2010, 07:45 PM
Way to help support my argument.:clap:

Yup. :facepalm:

RZZZA
12-17-2010, 07:47 PM
I'm jealous of Miami's weather, not much else though.

The best things to ever come out of Miami are Dexter and Tony Montana

bbcmillionaire
12-17-2010, 07:54 PM
I got
Boston
Orlando
Heat
Bulls
(I don't know if the knicks are going to do their famOus disappearing act, but as of now.....drumroll)
Atlanta/Knicks

biglord
12-17-2010, 08:12 PM
miami fans are the funniest

zambo4president
12-17-2010, 08:19 PM
:laugh2: The Knicks over the Bulls is pretty ridiculous.

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 08:25 PM
I don't feel like responding to the rest of your post, just this part



Laughable... utterly laughable. This.... this very thing right here is what makes level headed and reasonable Bulls fans lose credit, and is what starts the bait wars between Bulls & Heat fans. Most of the level headed Heat fans try not to take anything away from the Bulls and appreciate Rose for the player he is, and then you guys take it to something else.

The Heat has already proven for the past 2 years straight if it slipped your mind, that they are already better than the Bulls. They add the 2 time reigning MVP, and a 5 time all-star PF, and STILL have a better record than the Bulls at this very second... yet somehow, magically, the Bulls are even with the Heat.

Laughable. This is exactly why I try and keep out of Bulls vs. Heat discussions in general on this forum, because there is no reasoning with most of you guys. I mean I hate to staple all Bulls fans together, but I've just seen too high of a percentage going on these crazy riffs.

They have proven they can lose in the first round of their playoffs? Everyone the Heat got the fifth seed, and they lost in the first round!!!!!!! They are sooooooo much better then the Bulls who oh wait also lost in the first round of the playoffs. :facepalm: Yea they have had better records, but they also lost a lot of players. Dude, Carlos Arroy is your point guard. You are NEVER going to win a title with Carlos Arroy as your pg.

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 08:26 PM
Originally Posted by beasted86
I don't feel like responding to the rest of your post, just this part



Laughable... utterly laughable. This.... this very thing right here is what makes level headed and reasonable Bulls fans lose credit, and is what starts the bait wars between Bulls & Heat fans. Most of the level headed Heat fans try not to take anything away from the Bulls and appreciate Rose for the player he is, and then you guys take it to something else.

The Heat has already proven for the past 2 years straight if it slipped your mind, that they are already better than the Bulls. They add the 2 time reigning MVP, and a 5 time all-star PF, and STILL have a better record than the Bulls at this very second... yet somehow, magically, the Bulls are even with the Heat.

Laughable. This is exactly why I try and keep out of Bulls vs. Heat discussions in general on this forum, because there is no reasoning with most of you guys. I mean I hate to staple all Bulls fans together, but I've just seen too high of a percentage going on these crazy riffs.

Also later in the post I did say that I thought the Heat are better. I am just saying they have proven nothing this year that they are better than the Bulls.

northsider
12-17-2010, 08:39 PM
Yup. :facepalm:

HAHAHAH I don't even think he read a single post he just seen Heat and Bulls in the same argument and chimed in.

beasted86
12-17-2010, 11:30 PM
They have proven they can lose in the first round of their playoffs? Everyone the Heat got the fifth seed, and they lost in the first round!!!!!!! They are sooooooo much better then the Bulls who oh wait also lost in the first round of the playoffs. :facepalm: Yea they have had better records, but they also lost a lot of players. Dude, Carlos Arroy is your point guard. You are NEVER going to win a title with Carlos Arroy as your pg.

Or maybe it's because aside from finishing with a better record 2 years in a row, they also won the season series 2 years in a row. :facepalm:

What do I know... call me crazy. A team that was already better got way better free agents and somehow regressed to equal or maybe below the Bulls. How does that work again?

Dnovakovic099
12-17-2010, 11:57 PM
Or maybe it's because aside from finishing with a better record 2 years in a row, they also won the season series 2 years in a row. :facepalm:

What do I know... call me crazy. A team that was already better got way better free agents and somehow regressed to equal or maybe below the Bulls. How does that work again?

I don't know you tell me why the Heat have a worse record than the Bulls against teams with a winning record. I am not saying I think the Bulls are better, but I don't think the Heat have proven so far this year that they are better than the Bulls. The Bulls have faired better against winning teams. Don't give me excuses like they are a new team and need to learn how to play together blah blah blah.... because I do think the Heat will end up with a better record at the end of the season, BUT so far they have not proven they are better than the Bulls because they have struggled against good opponents. That dosen't mean that I think the Bulls are better, but this season the Heat haven't proven anything besides that they can rack up points against crap teams. The reason I am arguing this is because some Heat fans think the Heat are better than the Celtics and way better than the Magic, but they haven't proven they can beat good teams something the Magic and Celtics have proven year after year.

Dnovakovic099
12-18-2010, 12:02 AM
There is a reason games are played. Based on talent we can just crown the Heat or the Celtics the East, but there is a reason games are played. So you can't rank the Heat based on what you think they will do. Until that group of players can prove to us that they can go like 5-1 or 4-2 against a schedule of the Celtics, Magic, Thunder, Dallas, Spurs, and Lakers (Just an example) you cannot put them in the ranks of Magic and Celtics. Same reason Blake Griffin can't be compared to Pau. While, Griffin's stats are ridiculous, he hasn't proven he can do it on a good team in the playoffs. Same scenerio with Zach Randolph. Amazing stats, but hasn't proven anything in playoffs. Same with Heat beat up **** teams, but haven't proven they can beat elite opponents on a consistent basis.

footballer2369
12-18-2010, 12:22 AM
Your arbitrary ideals and quantifiers for rankings are irrelevant. I/most don't care.

Heat have the #1 defense, #5 off efficiency, #4 rebrate as a team... They are on an 11 game winning streak (12 after Wash tomorrow) and they have beaten the last 4 +.500 teams they've played.

They are 6-6 vs +.500 teams on the year including the rough start so the argument is mad old.

They have the 2nd best record in the East as well and are continuing to trend upward so to doubt them is simply ignorance or delusion...

Dnovakovic099
12-18-2010, 12:28 AM
Your arbitrary ideals and quantifiers for rankings are irrelevant. I/most don't care.

Heat have the #1 defense, #5 off efficiency, #4 rebrate as a team... They are on an 11 game winning streak (12 after Wash tomorrow) and they have beaten the last 4 +.500 teams they've played.

Those stats are easy to put up when you play against a SOS of .489.

They are 6-6 vs +.500 teams on the year including the rough start so the argument is mad old.

What is their record against Mavs, Spurs, Lakers, Utah, Hornets, Thunder, Bulls, Celtics, and Magic? Nowhere near .500.

They have the 2nd best record in the East as well and are continuing to trend upward so to doubt them is simply ignorance or delusion...

The Bulls have won seven in a row and still have not lost to a team with a record of less than .500. The Bulls are also trending upward. So what is your point?

daleja424
12-18-2010, 12:30 AM
1. Boston
2. Miami




3. Orlando
4. Chicago

5. New York
6. Atlanta

ChI_ShIzzLe
12-18-2010, 12:30 AM
My god some of you have no lives seriously, I mean both the Bulls and Heat are rolling right now, they've won 11 straight, we've won 7 and it should be up to 10 leading up to the Christmas day game at NY. I see no point in arguing about who is better or worse since the teams don't meet until January 15th. So just be happy and enjoy watching your teams win. Dnovakovic or w/e your name is dude, stop with your worthless arguments and making the rest of us Bulls fans look bad, our biggest concern right now is how we're gonna do without Noah and who we can trade for/acquire to improve the team. Not the Heat.

footballer2369
12-18-2010, 01:03 AM
The Bulls have won seven in a row and still have not lost to a team with a record of less than .500. The Bulls are also trending upward. So what is your point?

What's your point? That they can't beat the elite teams? Sure sounds like it.

JB0B0
12-18-2010, 01:08 AM
Boston
Miami
Orlando (with Arenas)
Chicago

The Bulls and Heat each have suffered significant injuries, otherwise we may be looking at

Miami
Boston
Chicago
Orlando

JB0B0
12-18-2010, 01:10 AM
What's your point? That they can't beat the elite teams? Sure sounds like it.

We beat Dallas, the Lakers (without Bynum but still an elite team), Denver, and OKC. Sure we haven't beaten Boston, Miami, or San Antonio, but when healthy I believe the Bulls can play with the big boys.

SF25
12-18-2010, 01:13 AM
1. Boston
2. Miami
3. Orlando
4. Chicago
5. New York

Dnovakovic099
12-18-2010, 03:10 AM
What's your point? That they can't beat the elite teams? Sure sounds like it.

My point is that the Bulls can beat bad teams too, and that the only reason the Heat have a better record is because they have played more bad teams than the Bulls have.

Dnovakovic099
12-18-2010, 03:15 AM
My god some of you have no lives seriously, I mean both the Bulls and Heat are rolling right now, they've won 11 straight, we've won 7 and it should be up to 10 leading up to the Christmas day game at NY. I see no point in arguing about who is better or worse since the teams don't meet until January 15th. So just be happy and enjoy watching your teams win. Dnovakovic or w/e your name is dude, stop with your worthless arguments and making the rest of us Bulls fans look bad, our biggest concern right now is how we're gonna do without Noah and who we can trade for/acquire to improve the team. Not the Heat.

Dude your a moron. The game on January 15th doesn't mean ****. They can beat us by 40 or we can beat them by 40 and that still wouldn't tell us who is a better team. There is a reason 82 games are played and not 31. Also, people are suppose to argue. That is what this site is for. To share opinions. I guarantee you that every single person on here that posts often has been wrong at least once. I could be completely wrong, and the Knicks could just go on a tear and roll over the Bulls in the playoffs, or the Miami Heat could just destroy the whole league and win the championship, but that is the point of this site to argue and share opinions. Also, you should never bash anyone's opinion if you aren't willing to have your own.

dnewguy
12-18-2010, 03:31 AM
I changed my mind on the top 5, Bulls and Hawks defense will give the Heat a tougher time than the Knicks, the Knicks team is horrible defensively plus if you shut down Amare, the NY Knicks are just like the Cavs.

new top 5

1. Celtics
2. Heat
3. Magic
4. Bulls
5. Hawks.

RulerSlick
12-19-2010, 03:04 AM
1. Boston
2. Orlando
3. Chicago
4. New York
5. Atlanta






6. Heat

^^clown:facepalm::pity:

Chi StateOfMind
12-19-2010, 03:25 AM
Celtics
Heat
Magic
Bulls
Knicks

sargon21
12-19-2010, 03:28 AM
i still have the hawks over the knicks

shep33
12-19-2010, 03:29 AM
I like what the Knicks got going on, but they have a serious problem... they rely on Amare so much that he might get worn down. Next year though , i think they can get Melo... its better if they don't trade for him. They need a player like Melo to take the scoring onus off of Amare at times.

Mudvayne91
12-19-2010, 04:04 AM
I still am not completely sold on the Knicks either. Teams can get on hot streaks, it doesn't mean they can sustain their success. Great teams need to beat teams like the Cavs. I am not saying the are horrible, but I certainly am not sold on them yet.